[12:13] <cbx33> and I wanted to install ubuntu
[12:13] <HedgeMage> that is a big problem.
[12:13] <HedgeMage> hehe :)
[12:13] <cbx33> previously I had windows
[12:13] <HedgeMage> that's a good solution
[12:13] <mhz> yeah, Windows rocks!
[12:13] <cbx33> meh
[12:13] <cbx33> well I have a root partition that was setup
[12:14] <HedgeMage> mhz: I meant ubuntu is a good solution :P
[12:14] <cbx33> when I installed
[12:14] <cbx33> basically I overwrote an ntfs partition
[12:14] <cbx33> and that was fine
[12:14] <cbx33> I also did the same with a logical partition that used to be ntfs
[12:14] <mhz> HedgeMage: yeah, i just could not resist the temptation :)
[12:14] <cbx33> and this is uspposed to be mouned at /home/
[12:15] <mhz> cbx33: so, what is the issue?
[12:15] <mhz> jmolmos: holas
[12:15] <cbx33> the problem is
[12:15] <cbx33> it refuses to mount it at boot
[12:15] <cbx33> even though I can mount it from a knoppix live
[12:15] <mhz> cbx33: is it in /etc/fstab?
[12:15] <cbx33> and ubuntu obviously mounted it at some point because it creaed the default user there
[12:15] <cbx33> yes it is in fstab
[12:16] <mhz> cbx33: do you have data in there?
[12:16] <cbx33> if I try to mount manually I get mount: /dev/hdc7 already mounted or /home busy
[12:16] <crimsun> are you saying / doesn't mount (i.e., the kernel panics), or are you saying that second [logical]  partition isn't automounted?
[12:16] <cbx33> the second logical drive will not mount
[12:16] <cbx33> not even manually
[12:16] <cbx33> I know it's not already mounted 
[12:16] <mhz> oh, i see
[12:16] <jmolmos> holas mhz 
[12:16] <cbx33> and I know the directory isn't busy
[12:16] <crimsun> what's the output from ``sudo fdisk -l /dev/hdc'' ?
[12:17] <cbx33> it's there
[12:17] <mhz> jmolmos: en tu lugar de ingresar texto, escribe esto:   /join #edubuntu-es  (y presiona enter)
[12:17] <cbx33> /dev/hdc7 2295 6118 30716248+ 83 Linux
[12:17] <mhz> hmmm
[12:17] <crimsun> and ``mount |grep hdc7'' ?
[12:17] <mhz> and the output of  mount?
[12:18] <cbx33> it is not mounted
[12:18] <crimsun> and its fstab line?
[12:18] <cbx33> /dev/hdc7   /home   ext2   defaults   0    1
[12:18] <cbx33> whoops 
[12:19] <cbx33> 2 for the last number
[12:19] <pygi> why not 0?
[12:20] <crimsun> so I presume you're intending to have a separate /home?
[12:20] <cbx33> yes
[12:21] <mhz> cbx33: and you say that only 'mount' output gives no mounted point for /home?
[12:21] <crimsun> hmm, you /should/ be able to mount over another mountpoint
[12:22] <cbx33> the extended partion has a tag of W95 Ext'd (LBA)
[12:22] <cbx33> i think it was original extended with windows fdisk utility
[12:22] <crimsun> on the off chance that it's your user being logged in, trying enabling root, logging in as root, making sure nothing is accessing /home (using lsof), and then mounting /dev/hdc7
[12:23] <cbx33> ok
[12:23] <cbx33> good idea
[12:23] <cbx33> how do i enable root again :p
[12:23] <cbx33> never had to do it
[12:23] <cbx33> passwd -l root
[12:24] <crimsun> no
[12:24] <crimsun> sudo -s
[12:24] <crimsun> then passwd
[12:24] <mhz> or...
[12:24] <mhz> sudo passwd
[12:24] <crimsun> I'm pretty sure you don't want to do what -l does semantically
[12:24] <cbx33> ok
[12:27] <cbx33> crimsun, same message exactly
[12:27] <cbx33> and I confirmed nothing is accessing /home
[12:28] <cbx33> as I said the funny thing is knoppix will mount it
[12:28] <cbx33> and ubuntu obviously did mount it in the past because it wrote my user directory to it
[12:28] <crimsun> does ``dmesg|tail'' offer any clues?
[12:29] <cbx33> nope
[12:29] <cbx33> nothing
[12:29] <crimsun> how about strace -fF, then?
[12:30] <cbx33> what does that do|
[12:30] <cbx33> follow forks
[12:30] <cbx33> so 
[12:30] <cbx33> strace -f mount ....... etc
[12:31] <cbx33> ok lots of output
[12:31] <cbx33> I'm gonna pipe to a file and pastebin
[12:34] <mhz> cbx33: my best tip woul be to boot from LiveCD (gentoo livecd is great and faster) and mount/umount the partition you have issues with
[12:34] <cbx33> already done that
[12:34] <mhz> and once everything is ok, you edit fstab accordingly
[12:34] <cbx33> it works fine on live cd
[12:34] <cbx33> but not in ubuntu
[12:35] <mhz> cbx33: yeah, but ubuntu live cd 'automount' stuff
[12:35] <cbx33> it was the knopix live cd
[12:35] <cbx33> i manually mounted it
[12:35] <mhz> same :)
[12:35] <cbx33> and was able to read off of it
[12:35] <mhz> automounting usally works so magically that we never see issues
[12:36] <cbx33> crimsun, http://pastebin.ca/79972
[12:36] <cbx33> mhz, it wasn't auto mounted
[12:36] <cbx33> i manually mounted it with a simpke mount command
[12:37] <mhz> oh, and what if you edit your current fstab, comment the line about /hdc7
[12:37] <mhz> and mount it manually again
[12:37] <cbx33> same thing
[12:37] <cbx33> I have manually pointed it to a diferent path
[12:37] <cbx33> #
[12:37] <cbx33> 4751  mount("/dev/hdc7", "/home", "ext2", MS_POSIXACL|MS_ACTIVE|MS_NOUSER|0xec0000, 0x8077b50) = -1 EBUSY (Device or resource busy)
[12:38] <cbx33> line 164 in the pastebin
[12:38] <mhz> cbx33: and what is you format it again?
[12:38] <mhz> is = if
[12:38] <cbx33> I have already done that
[12:38] <cbx33> removed the partition and recreated it
[12:40] <cbx33> it's the Device or resource busy that' bothering me
[12:40] <cbx33> how can I check that
[12:40] <cbx33> someone on a forum said something about libdevmapper doing something sometimes
[12:40] <cbx33> i dunno
[12:40] <crimsun> more troubling is the /sbin/mount.ext2
[12:40] <crimsun> we, um, don't have that.
[12:40] <cbx33> y?
[12:41] <cbx33> it does the same even if it's ext3
[12:41] <cbx33> it was that originally
[12:41] <crimsun> it shouldn't even be looking for /sbin/mount.ext2
[12:41] <cbx33> but i recreated the partition in knoppix
[12:41] <cbx33> which doesn't do ext3
[12:41] <crimsun> that's fine.
[12:42] <cbx33> so any further things to check
[12:42] <cbx33> it says it's busy
[12:42] <cbx33> y?
[12:43] <cbx33> hmmm
[12:43] <crimsun> sec, let me try something.
[12:43] <cbx33> it was formatted by ubuntu install and had data on it
[12:43] <mhz> i had similar issues with CF cards
[12:44] <cbx33> I have since re formatted with knoppix
[12:44] <cbx33> thanks crimsun 
[12:45] <crimsun> ok, red herring (whew)
[12:46] <cbx33> :(
[12:46] <crimsun> it's supposed to look for /sbin/mount* first
[12:46] <cbx33> ah ok
[12:47] <crimsun> can you pastebin dmesg, too?
[12:47] <cbx33> sure
[12:48] <cbx33> http://pastebin.ca/79982
[12:49] <cbx33> [4294675.066000]   hdc: hdc1 hdc2 < hdc5 hdc6 hdc7 > hdc3
[12:50] <cbx33> #
[12:50] <cbx33> [4294688.836000]  Adding 3068372k swap on /dev/hdc5.  Priority:-1 extents:1 across:3068372k
[12:50] <cbx33> pics up swap ok too
[12:51] <crimsun> is hdc1 your / ?
[12:51] <cbx33> yes
[12:51] <cbx33> i can try removing and recreating the partition again if you want
[12:51] <crimsun> please
[12:52] <cbx33> oh and I can quite happily mount hdc6
[12:52] <cbx33> it is the boot parition for the fedora install
[12:52] <crimsun> if it's not a geometry issue, the only thing I can think of is some sort of attribute{,s} that prevent it being mounted?
[12:53] <cbx33> just rebooting then I'll check flags etc
[12:54] <cbx33> can someone give me a quick line for mke2fs to create the filesystem
[12:56] <crimsun> mkfs.ext3 /dev/hdc7
[12:56] <cbx33> ok
[12:56] <cbx33> something interesting here
[12:57] <crimsun> it /should/ error
[12:57] <cbx33> /dev/hdc7 is apprently in use by the system; will not make a filesystem here
[12:57] <crimsun> right.
[12:57] <cbx33> good/bad ?
[12:57] <cbx33> consistent
[12:57] <crimsun> well, it's bad, but at least it's consistent.
[12:57] <crimsun> can you ``umount /dev/hdc7''?
[12:58] <cbx33> not mounted
[12:59] <crimsun> with -f ?
[12:59] <crimsun> will probably complain about mtab
[12:59] <cbx33> umount2: Invalid argument
[12:59] <cbx33> umount: /dev/hdc7: not mounted
[12:59] <crimsun> umount2 ?
[12:59] <cbx33> i dunno
[12:59] <cbx33> tha'ts what it says
[12:59] <crimsun> um...
[01:00] <crimsun> are you /positive/ the mount package is from Ubuntu?
[01:00] <cbx33> yes
[01:00] <cbx33> as positive as I can be
[01:01] <cbx33> has mount changed since dapper was released
[01:01] <cbx33> md5sum /bin/mount
[01:01] <cbx33> what do you get?
[01:01] <crimsun> 8a9e7dc69cea9add96b314449fcc03f2  /bin/mount
[01:01] <cbx33> identical
[01:02] <cbx33> is that enough proof?
[01:02] <crimsun> should be fine.
[01:04] <crimsun> Google reveals only corner cases
[01:04] <crimsun> rather unhelpful
[01:04] <cbx33> i know
[01:05] <crimsun> that's just odd, colour me puzzled
[01:05] <crimsun> how about ``mount -o remount,rw /home'' ?
[01:06] <crimsun> there's some strange kernel<->mount interaction here.
[01:07] <crimsun> "EBUSY: Source is already mounted. Or, it cannot be remounted read-only, because it still holds files open for writing. Or, it cannot be mounted on target because target is still busy (it is the working directory of some task, the mount point of another device, has open files, etc.). Or, it could not be unmounted because it is busy."
[01:07] <cbx33> crimsun, on trying the mount -o line
[01:08] <cbx33> mount: /home not mounted already, or bad option
[01:08] <crimsun> ok, try replacing "defaults" with "noauto" in /etc/fstab for /home
[01:09] <crimsun> reboot, log in as root, then mount /home
[01:09] <cbx33> ok
[01:13] <cbx33> crimsun, same message
[01:14] <crimsun> and nothing's open on /home ?
[01:14] <crimsun> that's odd, I'm stumped
[01:14] <cbx33> nope
[01:14] <cbx33> ok
[01:14] <bimberi> #kubuntu
[01:14] <cbx33> i just tried mounting with the -f option
[01:15] <cbx33> and it mounted
[01:15] <bimberi> argh, there was supposed to be a /j before that
[01:15] <cbx33> but on closer inspection it didn't mount
[01:15] <cbx33> mtab said it was mounted
[01:15] <cbx33> but i created a dir
[01:16] <cbx33> unmounted, which it complainedabout anyway
[01:16] <cbx33> and the dir was still there
[01:18] <cbx33> well I'm stumped too
[01:18] <cbx33> my plan is to do the following
[01:18] <cbx33> move the fedora boot partition out of the extended partition and to a nother parition on the disk with dd
[01:18] <cbx33> then remove that extended partition altogether
[01:18] <cbx33> and recreate as necessary
[01:18] <cbx33> make sense?
[01:19] <crimsun> yep
[01:20] <cbx33> it's just difficult cos the fedora parition is lvm
[01:21] <cbx33> and so I have to modify the fstab cos the boot partition will have moved
[01:21] <cbx33> but
[01:21] <cbx33> oooh
[01:21] <cbx33> no that's ok because
[01:21] <cbx33> ah yes
[01:23] <cbx33> gah
[01:23] <cbx33> no free sectors
[04:24] <bddebian> Heya
[05:20] <jsgotangco> good morning
[05:48] <jsgotangco> hey guys i accidentally activated AliasVegas' membership without noticing she hasn't singed the CoC so I deactivated it first but left a message that will activate it again once the CoC is signed and just ping us in case to turn it on again, sorry for the CoC-up job =)
[05:51] <bimberi> lol
[05:51] <bimberi> @ the last bit
[05:51] <jsgotangco> =)
[06:26] <LaserJock> yeah, I thought cbx33 was going to do that
[06:55] <jsgotangco> LaserJock: http://photos.jonathancarter.co.za/udsparis2006/800_PICT0325
[06:55] <jsgotangco> nice!
[06:55] <LaserJock> yeah
[06:57] <LaserJock> who says nerds don't have fun :-)
[07:04] <Laser_away> hehe, good night cbx33 ;-)
[07:04] <cbx33> nn Laser_away 
[09:04] <jsgotangco> hey highvoltage
[09:40] <highvoltage> hey jsgotangco 
[10:13] <jsgotangco> highvoltage: hey, thanks for the pics
[10:13] <jsgotangco> ive taken the liberty to add them in the wiki page
[10:19] <cbx33> mornin all
[10:24] <highvoltage> jsgotangco: thanks, i've been meaning to do that
[10:24] <highvoltage> morning cbx33 
[10:24] <jsgotangco> those are nice pics you got a nice camera
[10:24] <cbx33> hi highvoltage 
[10:24] <cbx33> hi jsgotangco 
[10:24] <jsgotangco> cbx33: hey
[10:25] <highvoltage> cbx33
[10:25] <jsgotangco> cbx33: sorry i had to deactivate lisa's account...i just noticed that the CoC hasn't been signed yet, i kknow you understand
[10:25] <cbx33> jsgotangco: fine
[10:25] <highvoltage> it was a good call, thanks for that jsgotangco 
[10:26] <RobinShepheard> hello all
[10:26] <cbx33> hey RobinShepheard 
[10:26] <jsgotangco> hey RobinShepheard
[10:27] <RobinShepheard> how is everybody??
[10:27] <cbx33> yeh good
[10:28] <RobinShepheard> sweet, any news on BETT??
[10:28] <cbx33> not yet
[10:28] <cbx33> have to really wait for richardW to start
[10:29] <jsgotangco> highvoltage: you busy or can i pm you?
[10:29] <RobinShepheard> richardw??
[10:29] <jsgotangco> the program manager
[10:29] <highvoltage> jsgotangco: sure
[10:29] <highvoltage> (you can pm me)
[10:29] <RobinShepheard> ahh ok I got you
[11:04] <pygi> cbx33, poke? :)
[11:29] <cbx33> hi pygi 
[11:29] <cbx33> I can create two different gpg kleys on the same machine can't I?
[11:30] <pygi> yup
[11:30] <jsgotangco> yes
[11:30] <cbx33> so you can have like two secret keys on one machine
[11:30] <cbx33> ok cool
[11:30] <jsgotangco> yeah
[11:30] <pygi> cbx33, why shall I respond your questions after that what happened yesterday? :P
[11:30] <jsgotangco> you can just move one of the keys in the future in another box if you want to
[11:32] <cbx33> ok
[11:32] <cbx33> pygi: I apologise
[11:32] <pygi> cbx33, lol :)
[11:32] <cbx33> I'll make a public apology at the next meeting
[11:32] <pygi> cbx33, no need really :)
[11:32] <cbx33> :p
[11:32] <cbx33> i know
[11:32] <cbx33> you poked?
[11:32] <pygi> yup :)
[11:32] <pygi> http://static.flickr.com/67/183203477_919e9a6c56_o.png
[11:32] <pygi> :)
[11:33] <pygi> (there is new one, with spelling error fixed :P)
[11:33] <pygi> sec
[11:33] <cbx33> photo unavailable
[11:33] <pygi> http://static.flickr.com/55/183210781_c6344e968e_o.png
[11:33] <pygi> now?
[11:33] <cbx33> wow me likey
[11:33] <cbx33> inkscape?
[11:34] <pygi> Xara this is I think
[11:34] <ogra> whats that for ? a route planner app ?
[11:34] <pygi> for my homepage :P
[11:34] <cbx33> someone did it for you?
[11:34] <pygi> yup, one of the artists I told you and Lisa about yesterday
[11:34] <cbx33> ah cool
[11:35] <cbx33> one thing I'd mention
[11:35] <jsgotangco> wow that is nice
[11:35] <cbx33> would be nice if the enlarged view had dotted lines
[11:36] <pygi> cbx33, right, but this is good as well :P
[11:36] <pygi> No need to bother people :P
[11:36] <cbx33> true
[11:36] <cbx33> looks great
[11:37] <pygi> :)
[11:38] <pygi> http://globaly.org/wordpress/
[11:38] <pygi> find the search function :P
[11:38] <Zaire> anyone in here know anything about the repositories having to do with unrar
[11:38] <pygi> Zaire, uh, what do you mean by that?
[11:39] <crimsun> the non-free unrar (more fully featured) is called unrar in multiverse.
[11:39] <Zaire> I have unrar but there are repositories that need to be added
[11:39] <Zaire> I have unrar-free
[11:39] <pygi> like what?
[11:39] <crimsun> pick one of unrar-free or unrar.
[11:40] <Zaire> but it doesn't work when I go to unrar a file it says bash command not found
[11:40] <crimsun> not found? methink you have larger issues.
[11:40] <Zaire> dunno but its irritating
[11:41] <pygi> crimsun, try to do complete removal
[11:41] <Zaire> well one other odd thing is I got vlc through apt and its not showing in media either
[11:42] <Zaire> I can still run it though
[11:43] <Zaire> is there any other program that can be used with rar files?
[11:45] <Zaire> healot and a few other basically said to me if Im not ready to switch to linux to go back to windows and theres no way in hell Im doing that now
[11:48] <Zaire> well either way its starting to look like Im on my own now 
[11:49] <cbx33> ooh nice splash
[11:52] <cbx33> well I'm setting up lisas pgp key
[11:52] <cbx33> but I can't get it to submit to a keyserver because I'm behind a firewall here
[11:52] <ogra> sure you can
[11:53] <cbx33> how?
[11:53] <cbx33> http fomrs just seem to timeout
[11:53] <ogra> all keyservers have a webinterface where you can copy/paste the app armored key
[11:53] <cbx33> yeh it never completes
[11:53] <cbx33> and the searches don;'t complete either
[11:53] <cbx33> can you see if you can find her
[11:53] <cbx33> lisa savage
[11:54] <ogra> try http://keyserver.mine.nu/
[11:54] <ogra> see at the bottom ...
[11:54] <cbx33> h ok 
[11:54] <cbx33> looks faster
[11:54] <ogra> and make sure to really have an app amored export
[11:54] <cbx33> will this be ok for LP?
[11:54] <ogra> sure
[11:54] <jsgotangco> pub  1024D/AA913353 2000-02-10 Lisa Savage <lsavage@kmg.com>
[11:54] <jsgotangco> ?
[11:54] <cbx33> ogra: I ran gpg --armour --export <key>
[11:54] <cbx33> is that ok
[11:54] <cbx33> jsgotangco: that's not it
[11:54] <jsgotangco> yeah
[11:54] <ogra> once its on the keyerver it should be fine ...
[11:55] <jsgotangco> 2000
[11:55] <jsgotangco> heh
[11:55] <cbx33> ok
[11:55] <ogra> cbx33, --armor, not french love :)
[11:55] <jsgotangco> hmm
[11:55] <cbx33> ok
[11:55] <jsgotangco> i have an abandoned key
[11:56] <RobinShepheard> cbx33, other option is to install gpa and try that, seemed to work for me
[11:56] <cbx33> ogra: ok i ran it again with armor and it gave me back the same key
[11:56] <cbx33> is that ok?
[11:56] <cbx33> lloks like they catered for spelling mistakes
[11:57] <cbx33> I just ram it without armour and got garbage
[11:57] <RobinShepheard> cbx33, what is the key id??
[11:57] <jsgotangco> http://www.cryptnet.net/fdp/crypto/gpg-party.html
[11:57] <cbx33> woot works
[11:58] <ogra> http://keyserver.mine.nu/pks/lookup?op=vindex&fingerprint=on&search=0xCEEC46F0DB66AD77
[11:58] <ogra> right ? 
[11:58] <jsgotangco> pub  1024D/DB66AD77 2006-07-06 Lisa Savage (Work Key) <lisa@couzensfamily.co.uk>
[11:58] <cbx33> up
[11:58] <cbx33> yup
[11:58] <cbx33> :D
[11:58] <ogra> good 
[11:59] <cbx33> ok I'll have to sort that out when I get home
[12:00] <cbx33> unfortunately she uses a windows system most of the time as she needs fireworks/dreamweaver
[12:00] <cbx33> and she currently uses outlook express
[12:00] <cbx33> I plan to install thunderbird tonight
[12:00] <cbx33> and setup gpg
[12:00] <ogra> great :)
[12:00] <cbx33> cos otherwise LP won't be able to verify the key
[12:01] <cbx33> and hence can't sign the CoC
[12:01] <ogra> LP will verify the key against the keyserver
[12:01] <cbx33> yes
[12:01] <cbx33> but they send you an encrypted email
[12:01] <ogra> oh, thats new :)
[12:02] <cbx33> if now I wanted to transfer her secret key to another computer
[12:02] <cbx33> what would I do?
[12:02] <cbx33> heh
[12:02] <highvoltage> ogra: by fax? ;)
[12:03] <ogra> highvoltage, nah, by mail sent to mako :)
[12:03] <cbx33> heh
[12:03] <cbx33> how do I move her key?
[12:03] <jsgotangco> i sent it via fax before hahaha
[12:04] <jsgotangco> cbx33: move? you mean move to another machine export it
[12:04] <cbx33> yes
[12:04] <cbx33> does export export the secrect key
[12:04] <jsgotangco> if you indicate so
[12:05] <cbx33> ok i think i found it here
[12:05] <cbx33>   gpg --export-key (thekey) > mykeyfile.gpg  gpg --export-secret-key (thekey) >> mykeyfile.gpg
[12:05] <cbx33> then import 
[12:05] <cbx33> gpg --import mykeyfile.gpg
[12:05] <jsgotangco> profit
[12:06] <cbx33> profit?
[12:06] <highvoltage> i think i sent it by fax to mako too, but not sure if he received it, i didn't get a response back. that was like, just before LP though.
[12:06] <ogra> its also helpful to burn it to a CD and lock that somewhere
[12:06] <cbx33> ok
[12:06] <cbx33> from that you can generate revokes yes ?
[12:06] <ogra> so if your machine crashes you have a backup ... 
[12:07] <RobinShepheard> daft question, has anyone seen the madduck blog about the tension between debian and ubuntu http://blog.madduck.net/debian/2006.05.24-ubuntu-and-debian
[12:08] <RobinShepheard> A bit of an eye opener I thought
[12:10] <RobinShepheard> Next question, has anyone got any suggestions as to where I would look as to how I can run an app remotely via ssh with python and then use the output locally, would it be part of the twisted framework
[12:10] <RobinShepheard> app = ipcs, ls or whatever
[12:18] <ogra> jsgotangco, are you still helping with writing of the ubuntu newsletter ?
[12:19] <jsgotangco> i haven't done so lately, but i have free time for this weekend's edition
[12:19] <ogra> or did that become a 100% mgalvin thing ?
[12:19] <ogra> would be nice to have a word about lisa in there this time ...
[12:19] <jsgotangco> alright
[12:19] <jsgotangco> and rodrigo as well
[12:19] <ogra> and probably how good we're doing with our specs ;)
[12:20] <jsgotangco> heh YOUR specs mostly
[12:20] <ogra> (we're far better than kubuntu atm i think)
[12:20] <ogra> nah, i only have three
[12:20] <jsgotangco> really
[12:20] <ogra> rdrigo as well 
[12:20] <jsgotangco> ok i'll draft it later on the wiki
[12:20] <pygi> I have  none ^_^
[12:20] <jsgotangco> should be sent this sunday
[12:20] <ogra> the rest is unassigned and free for adoption :)
[12:21] <RobinShepheard> pygi, any suggestions as to where I should look as to how I can run an app remotely via ssh with python and then use the output locally, would it be part of the twisted framework
[12:21] <ogra> (ltsp-manager didnt get reviewed or approved, but will be finished for edgy in any case for example, not all specs on my list are valid)
[12:21] <RobinShepheard> app = ls, ipcs or whatever
[12:22] <jsgotangco> ive just finished some deadlines with the UN so i'll be able to do more edubuntu stuff starting saturday
[12:30] <jsgotangco> im going for some food shopping
[12:30] <jsgotangco> bbl
[01:16] <bimberi> !away
[01:16] <ubotu> Please don't use public away messages or change your nick to 'someone|away'.  We know you're away when you don't respond to messages. Also see !guidelines
[01:25] <Electryfier> OK
[01:26] <Electryfier> Where does alien save the converted installers_
[01:26] <Electryfier> ?
[01:28] <Electryfier> Anybody?
[01:29] <Electryfier> Does anyone know where alien saves converted installers?
[01:30] <Electryfier> or how to compile Qt?
[01:32] <Electryfier> Does anyone know where alien saves converted installers?
[01:33] <ogra> Electryfier, please stop repeating yourself
[01:33] <Electryfier> OK
[01:33] <Electryfier> I just need hlep
[01:33] <Electryfier> help
[01:34] <ogra> what are you converting (and why, there are over 17000 packages in the archive, its very unlikely that the one you need is missing)
[01:35] <Electryfier> well it is an rpm which i need to install
[01:35] <Electryfier> and nothing in synaptic to find
[01:36] <ogra> and there is surely no package for ubuntu ?
[01:36] <ogra> what is it ?
[01:36] <Electryfier> an rpm type package
[01:36] <Electryfier> that is, it should've been
[01:36] <Electryfier> until the server broke down
[01:36] <ogra> *what* package ?
[01:36] <ogra> i know its an rpm, you said that several times
[01:37] <Electryfier> ok
[01:37] <Electryfier> be with in 10
[01:37] <Electryfier> be with you in 10 min
[01:46] <Electryfier> ogra, i'm back
[01:47] <ogra> so whats the package name ?
[01:47] <Electryfier> it's a driver
[01:47] <ogra> ugh
[01:47] <ogra> you really dont want aliened packages for such essential things
[01:48] <ogra> tell me the package name 
[01:48] <Electryfier> ok, but wait a sec
[01:48] <ogra> and which edubuntu is that ?
[01:48] <Electryfier> how do you mean
[01:48] <Electryfier> Dapper Drake
[01:48] <jsgotangco> hmmm we seem to have a typhoon coming
[01:49] <ogra> well, thats the edubuntu support channel :) we have more than one release ...
[01:49] <Electryfier> Breezy Badger was the predecessor
[01:49] <ogra> yep
[01:52] <Electryfier> It was the "SiS graphics Display Driver for Red Hat Linux"
[01:53] <Electryfier> ogra, you with me?
[01:54] <Electryfier> Earth to ogra, please answer
[01:54] <ogra> we have that driver in ubuntu
[01:54] <Electryfier> well I didn't find it in synaptic
[01:54] <pygi> Electryfier, please calm down, thank you
[01:54] <Electryfier> sorry, just on a tight schedule
[01:54] <ogra> http://packages.ubuntu.com/dapper/x11/xserver-xorg-driver-sis
[01:55] <ogra> and very very sure you will completely break your system by adding a driver from redhat that depends on completely other libraries and is built with a different build system
[01:56] <Electryfier> thx
[01:56] <ogra> dont use alien for essential stuff
[01:56] <Electryfier> I know, but it was a desperate cause
[01:56] <Electryfier> well anyway, where DOES alien save its converted installers?
[01:57] <pygi> ogra, we have to "fix" the SCP draft
[01:58] <pygi> spec/draft*
[01:58] <Electryfier> ogra, which of these files do I download?
[01:58] <ogra> pygi, yes, i'm working on it with iwj
[01:59] <pygi> oki
[01:59] <ogra> Electryfier, xserver-xorg-driver-sis
[01:59] <ogra> just install it from synaptic
[01:59] <Electryfier> i'll try
[02:01] <jsgotangco> thank you for using edubuntu customer support
[02:01] <DanielC> :)
[02:01] <jsgotangco> have a nice day
[02:01] <DanielC> What just happened?
[02:02] <jsgotangco> dinner brb
[02:04] <DanielC> Hmm... I need to remount /. Is there a way I can do that without rebooting?
[02:05] <DanielC>  sudo mount -o rw,remount /
[02:05] <DanielC> I hope that does what I wanted... :)
[02:09] <DanielC> Is Ubuntu supposed to have a quotacheck command?
[02:13] <DanielC> ogra: Edubuntu doesn't come with quota support. Is that a bug?
[02:13] <ogra> just install the quota package
[02:13] <ogra> and no its not a bug
[02:13] <DanielC> yeah, I'm installing it.
[02:13] <DanielC> Just wondering if it's supposed to by default.
[02:14] <ogra> nope
[02:14] <DanielC> ok
[02:14] <mhz> morning you all, Edubunteros
[02:14] <jsgotangco> ogra: what's rodrigo's designation?
[02:15] <ogra> but feel free to write a spec for edgy+1 to get it in by default (if you think it makes sense it should be discussed)
[02:15] <jsgotangco> not xorg overlord
[02:15] <jsgotangco> :)
[02:15] <DanielC> ogra: Seems like a good idea, but not terribly important (since it's so easy to install...).
[02:15] <ogra> jsgotangco, technical lead edubuntu 
[02:15] <jsgotangco> thanks
[02:19] <DanielC> Hmm... is there a reason why I shouldn't have quotas on / ?
[02:19] <DanielC> I was thinking that /tmp is in / so I should have quotas...
[02:23] <jsgotangco> ogra: are these all edubutnu specs? https://launchpad.net/people/ogra/+specs
[02:24] <ogra> nope
[02:24] <ogra> but most of them
[02:25] <jsgotangco> im trying to find all edubuntu-related specs but lp doesn't have such filters
[02:25] <jsgotangco> or does it?
[02:25] <ogra> nope
[02:25] <ogra> my list is the best we have atm
[02:25] <jsgotangco> argghh
[02:25] <jsgotangco> ok thanks
[02:26] <jsgotangco> there's a lot of asignees already
[02:26] <jsgotangco> is this the one you want to be shown in the newsletter?
[02:27] <ogra>  3d-direct-rendering-detection..., package-version-conflicts and extend-hw-db are not edubuntu related on my list
[02:27] <jsgotangco> i'll just filter it then
[02:27] <jsgotangco> thanks
[02:28] <ogra>   	xulrunner-gecko,   	network-authentication and ltsp-convergence are only remotely related
[02:28] <ogra> ltsp-tour was originally only a request for a talk at ubz
[02:28] <jsgotangco> are you sure the rest are workable for edgy?
[02:28] <ogra> nope
[02:28] <ogra> we'll only do the ones that are approved today ...
[02:29] <jsgotangco> i only see 3
[02:29] <ogra> (and i personally will do ltsp-manager, regardless if the spec is approved or not, help appreciated)
[02:29] <ogra> SCP will get approved 
[02:30] <ogra> for the others i expect the assignees to care, since they are the ones supposed to implement then (theoretically)
[02:31] <pygi> so*
[02:35] <jsgotangco> hahaha my wife is teaching my wife about okra and my kid said ogra
[02:35] <jsgotangco> how surreal
[02:36] <pygi> jsgotangco, your wife is teaching your wife? o.O
[02:36] <jsgotangco> ouch
[02:36] <jsgotangco> sorry
[02:36] <jsgotangco> haha
[02:36] <jsgotangco> i just can't help myself laughing inside hahaa
[02:37] <jsgotangco> okra ogra
[02:37] <jsgotangco> bahaha
[02:37] <ogra> hehe
[02:39] <highvoltage> jsgotangco: how many wifes do you have? :P
[02:39] <jsgotangco> haha
[02:40] <jsgotangco> i cannot say i would like to have more or else my wife will use her switchblade skills tonight
[02:53] <DanielC> Damm thing keeps crashing just as soon as it starts.
[03:02] <ogra> soo, it seems SCP wont get approved ... unless i kill iwj
[03:03] <jsgotangco> yeah
[03:03] <ogra> grumble
[03:03] <ogra> i'm so angry
[03:04] <jsgotangco> ive been doing scrollback the discussion is going in circles
[03:04] <ogra> he killed off local devices in dapper ... now i asked him to review the section fabbione complained about ... but apparently he reviwed the already approved sections as well
[03:04] <ogra> AAAAAARRRRRGGGGHHH
[03:10] <highvoltage> :(
[03:10] <DanielC> What happened? I walked in just a minute ago...
[03:48] <bddebian> Hello
[04:02] <ogra> sbalneav, scottie !!!!!
[04:02] <sbalneav> hey hey hey there Ogra!!!
[04:05] <jsgotangco> hey
[04:06] <sbalneav> Here's a good one.
[04:06] <sbalneav> I've got a kvm at home.
[04:07] <sbalneav> if I'm not on the screen when I boot an ubuntu box (either vanilla or edu-) the mouse wont work.  Even if I rmmod psmouse and reload.
[04:07] <ogra> rather replug it so the kernel gets the even ;)
[04:07] <ogra> *event
[04:08] <sbalneav> Really? does replugging a ps2 mouse generate an event?
[04:08] <sbalneav> huh!  Learn something new every day.
[04:08] <ogra> hmm, not sure ...
[04:08] <ogra> but worth a try in any case :)
[04:08] <sbalneav> absolutely.
[04:09] <sbalneav> Or, I could just not switch off of the console for the minute it takes ubuntu to boot, I suppose. :)
[04:09] <ogra> hmm ...
[04:10] <sbalneav> Did I tell you, BTW, that I'm gonna switch over to running Edu at home, as opposed to stock ubu?  I REALLY like the garnome icon set.  
[04:10] <lucasvo> how can I open a document as utf-8 in vim?
[04:11] <sbalneav> lol
[04:12] <sbalneav> How's the weather down there in Manilla!
[04:12] <sbalneav> It's gonna be swealtering here today: 34 C
[04:12] <sbalneav> No rain for two weeks!
[04:13] <sbalneav> My wife keeps bugging me to water the lawn, but I want to hold off as long as possible.  It keeps threatening to rain, so, we'll see.
[04:14] <sbalneav> lucasvo: I think you can do:
[04:14] <sbalneav> :set encoding=utf-8
[04:14] <ogra> ususally thats the default in ubuntu anyway
[04:15] <sbalneav> Ah!  I was wondering.
[04:15] <ogra> as all locales are set to utf8
[04:15] <ogra> (i dont think we even generate iso locales at all)
[04:15] <lucasvo> sbalneav: ok, thanks
[04:15] <jsgotangco> sbalneav: 27C with a typhoon coming this weekend
[04:15] <jsgotangco> hehe
[04:15] <sbalneav> ogra: I also need to sort out what I need to do to ltpsfs to get utf-8 support.
[04:16] <ogra> sbalneav, we talked about it :)
[04:16] <ogra> add these little thongs ...
[04:16] <ogra> err
[04:16] <ogra> g_strings
[04:16] <jsgotangco> haha
[04:16] <sbalneav> gahh!
[04:16] <jsgotangco> for a german you make good puns
[04:16] <jsgotangco> heh
[04:17] <ogra> jsgotangco, well, i'm fighting with my guts ... i'm not calmed down yet ...
[04:17] <jsgotangco> i hear ya
[04:17] <sbalneav> jsgotangco: You didn't hear the joke he told jammcq and me while we were sitting in Cinncinati airport talking to him on irc
[04:17] <jsgotangco> oh?
[04:17] <jsgotangco> sbalneav: jonathan posted some pictures of you guys in the wiki
[04:18] <sbalneav> We asked him if he was bringing his porche.  He said "No, it brings me".
[04:18] <jsgotangco> nice!
[04:18] <sbalneav> jammcq and I were literally loling.
[04:18] <ogra> lol
[04:18] <ogra> http://photos.jonathancarter.co.za/udsparis2006/800_PICT0136
[04:19] <ogra> the title is funny 
[04:19] <jsgotangco> with seb
[04:19] <jsgotangco> heh
[04:19] <ogra> seb wont like it :)
[04:19] <ogra> jsgotangco, it *can* do 220km/h
[04:19] <jsgotangco> crap
[04:19] <ogra> i never had the balls to go over 200
[04:19] <jsgotangco> i can barely go 160km/h
[04:20] <jsgotangco> well the roads here are crap for starters
[04:21] <jsgotangco> and the law only allows 100km/h on tollways
[04:21] <sbalneav> My old Ford Festiva could go 195km/h.
[04:21] <sbalneav> If I dripped it off a cliff
[04:22] <jsgotangco> sbalneav: i currently drive a picanto: www.kia-picanto.com
[04:24] <sbalneav> nice.  I'm driving a Toyota Matrix atm.
[04:25] <jsgotangco> sbalneav: it only costs 7,000 brand new =)
[04:27] <sbalneav> You guys use pounds down there?
[04:28] <jsgotangco> no im using a UK keyboard hehehe i had to convert it
[04:39] <jsgotangco> i gotta sleep early
[04:39] <jsgotangco> ciao
[04:39] <pygi_> night jsgotangco 
[04:45] <RobinShepheard> ogra,  very descriptive and informative titles on most of the pictures from your link
[04:46] <ogra> RobinShepheard, thats from highvoltage 
[04:46] <ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperSummitParis/Photos
[04:46] <RobinShepheard> ahh, I can see he used some imagination for some of the names ;)
[04:48] <RobinShepheard> I wish I could have made it, maybe next year
[04:49] <RobinShepheard> ogra, if I want to run a command over ssh eg 'ssh serveradd top' can I run it and grab the output in python, and if so where would I find it??
[04:49] <RobinShepheard> would it be part of the twisted framework??
[04:49] <ogra> no idea, i never used twisted
[04:49] <RobinShepheard> s/serveradd/server address/
[04:49] <ogra> but the output of ssh should generally go to stdout
[04:51] <RobinShepheard> ahh ok, as I am trying to learn python I am trying to re-write stuff I did in perl, and a utility for finding process id's on a remote server is the latest routine needed
[04:51] <RobinShepheard> then it will kill said pid
[04:52] <RobinShepheard> I would put python on the server but you can only install python if you have installed x on sco and we don't want x on our server
[04:52] <ogra> what a strange policy
[04:53] <RobinShepheard> the server runs our accounting database and it is an unnecessary load and makes it a bit easier for a user to fiddle if they got access to the server room
[04:54] <RobinShepheard> so we have no X system, problem is the default vol package for python has a dependancy on one of the x libraries for some reason
[05:29] <highvoltage> seb isn't german? oops :)
[05:29] <highvoltage> sbalneav: dude, admitting that you owened a ford fiesta is not cool!
[05:29] <ogra> highvoltage, he's french ...
[05:30] <highvoltage> in that case, he should take it as a compliment :)
[05:30] <ogra> highvoltage, dont say he's german at the dawn of a french football world championship ;)
[05:30] <highvoltage> :)
[05:31] <sbalneav> Hey, that festiva was an awesome car.  So long as you didn't want to go fast.  But man, could it corner.
[05:31] <ogra> hehe
[05:31] <paolob-parroquia> ogra, is it normal a symlynk I have /lib/udev/devices/fd -> /proc/self/fd ?
[05:32] <sbalneav> I bought it for 500 bucks and drove it for 4 years.  Great little car.
[05:32] <paolob-parroquia> and I have  /lib/udev/devices/stdin -> /proc/self/fd/0 and /lib/udev/devices/stdout -> /proc/self/fd/1 and /lib/udev/devices/stderr -> /proc/self/fd/2 and /lib/udev/devices/core -> /proc/kcore
[05:33] <ogra> what do you think is wrong about that ?
[05:33] <paolob-parroquia> ogra, it seems weird....
[05:34] <ogra> +why ? 
[05:34] <paolob-parroquia> ok, no problem, thank you
[05:34] <ogra> filedescriptor 0 is always been stdin ...
[05:34] <ogra> 1 always stdout and 2 always stderr
[05:35] <ogra> you will see that the mapping of /dev/std{in,out,err} is similar
[05:36] <paolob-parroquia> ogra, ok
[05:37] <highvoltage> does ian hate children
[05:37] <ogra> highvoltage, why ? 
[05:37] <highvoltage> the edubuntu specs... geez!
[05:37] <ogra> because he doesnt eat them ? 
[05:37] <ogra> ah
[05:37] <highvoltage> sorry, shouldn't have said that in the first place. nm.
[05:38] <ogra> what other specs did he touch ? 
[05:44] <highvoltage> i don't know, i just saw the scp spec mail again
[05:44] <ogra> yep
[05:45] <ogra> we dont fit well if it comes to specs it seems ... somehow there is always a point where we clash and just upset each other ... 
[05:45] <ogra> but i need to find a solution for the SCP spec now 
[05:46] <ogra> but i refuse to write up every single step how to implement a standard dbus servise ... ian mailed mdz, so we'll see what happens ...
[05:47] <ogra> (i'd just ask another reviewer, but i dont want to upset ian even more ...)
[05:48] <ogra> what makes me angry is that he agreed to just review the part that was required, but then dissed the whole spec ...
[05:49] <highvoltage> *sigh*
[05:53] <highvoltage> gtg, hope it gets sorted out soon.
[05:53] <highvoltage> bye.
[05:54] <pygi> ogra, when does it have to be review & approved? approval deadline is soon, isn't it?
[05:54] <ogra> tonight 20:00 UTC
[05:55] <pygi> uh, that's really really soon
[05:55] <ogra> yes
[05:55] <sbalneav> ogra: is there anything I can do to help with any of the specs?
[05:56] <ogra> and all parts apart from the remote desktop stuff were signed off already ...
[05:56] <pygi> indeed :-/
[05:56] <ogra> i simply didnt expect to have to change everything we worked out ..
[05:57] <RobinShepheard> hey all, another daft question coming up
[05:57] <sbalneav> anything I can do on the fullyautomaticswapserver one?
[05:58] <RobinShepheard> does anyone know what port ltsp uses off the top of their head?? if not I shall go a hunting for the info
[05:58] <sbalneav> what do you mean, "what port ltsp uses"?
[05:58] <RobinShepheard> that is the port the clients connect to, is it 22
[05:58] <sbalneav> LTSP uses a bunch of ports.  22 for ssh, NFS ports for the filesystem, etc.
[05:59] <sbalneav> Are you trying to do some firewall stuff?
[05:59] <RobinShepheard> I knew about the nfs ports, I was wondering if ldm used the standard ssh port really
[05:59] <sbalneav> yes,  22's the one, in that case.
[05:59] <RobinShepheard> sbalneav, well sort of, I am working on producing a full load balanced ha-cluster
[06:00] <ogra> heh
[06:00] <ogra> have fun with that :)
[06:00] <RobinShepheard> and so I need to use netfilter and iptables to route all the traffic
[06:00] <ogra> neuralis has written some stuff about it ... i dont have the url anymore, but he's in #ubuntu-devel
[06:00] <sbalneav> RobinShepheard: that and #ltsp
[06:00] <RobinShepheard> ogra, I am sort of cheating, I have the no starch press book 'linux enterprise clusters'
[06:01] <sbalneav> Since when did getting info out of a book become cheating? :)
[06:01] <RobinShepheard> the clustering doesn't look TOO difficult at first glance,
[06:01] <sbalneav> If THATs the case, I've been cheating my whole career!
[06:01] <sbalneav> :)
[06:02] <RobinShepheard> sbalneav, well if I was a hardened hacker ;) i would just use the source and man pages
[06:02] <sbalneav> Meh, we all read books.
[06:02] <sbalneav> reading is a GOOD thing.
[06:02] <RobinShepheard> the book is aimed at redhat so I am having to adapt it a little
[06:03] <ogra> mdz, any hint what i should do with the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StudentControlPanelCompletion spec ? it wont work if i go on with iwj but i dont want to upset him more by getting it approved by another reviewer who already approved the section ian complains about 
[06:03] <RobinShepheard> sbalneav, I love reading and I love books, a bit too much really having spent about 150 in the last 2 months on books
[06:04] <mdz> ogra: I have an email in my inbox about it which I will read and reply to
[06:04] <ogra> mdz, you should have two :) thanks 
[06:06] <ogra> sbalneav, the swap server spec is rodarvus' i dont know if there is still changes needed ...
[06:08] <ogra> there are only two comments that are easily adressed ...
[06:10] <sbalneav> I just clarified them slightly right now.
[06:10] <RobinShepheard> pygi, the cook book meeting, is that in 2 hours??
[06:10] <ogra> sbalneav, hmm
[06:10] <ogra> "The nbd-server needs to be modified to automatically create a swapfile on the fly if a client connects to it, and requests swap space in the form of a file."
[06:11] <ogra> doesnt it get exported as a *device* to the client 
[06:11] <pygi> RobinShepheard, probably
[06:11] <ogra> i think the *file* is only used locally on the server, but through nbd it becomes a bolck device 
[06:11] <ogra> or am i wrong ?
[06:12] <sbalneav> Errm, maybe I've muddled it more. :) Let me check.
[06:12] <sbalneav> gimme a minute or two
[06:12] <rodarvus> ogra, you're right
[06:12] <RobinShepheard> pygi, well the fridge say 2 hours but it is quite a bit earlier than usual so I thought I would check
[06:12] <rodarvus> ogra, /dev/nbd*
[06:12] <pygi> RobinShepheard, yes, its in two hours
[06:12] <ogra> rodarvus, yep
[06:13] <ogra> thats what the sentence should describe :)
[06:13] <RobinShepheard> ok, well I got to go, I will see you in about 2 hours then
[06:13] <RobinShepheard> bye bye all
[06:19] <ogra> rodarvus, what about the other specs ? 
[06:19] <rodarvus> I was abou to write :)
[06:19] <rodarvus> heh, big coincidence
[06:20] <rodarvus> I was looking for the log of our talk with mdz yesterda (context: edubuntu-xfce-desktop spec)
[06:20] <rodarvus> i'm updating the wiki page before I put it up for review again, but don't have the points you and highvoltage added here
[06:21] <rodarvus> (somehow I lost the logs)
[06:21] <ogra> me neither, i still know what we discussed about the ldm spec
[06:21] <ogra> p.u.c/~fabionne/irclogs has it
[06:25] <rodarvus> found it, thanks!
[06:39] <ogra> rodarvus, updated https://wiki.edubuntu.org/LTSPLoginAndSessionHandling if you think thats sufficient send it to a new review loop :)
[06:40] <rodarvus> I've also just updated https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuXfceDesktop, and put it to review
[06:40] <rodarvus> (as per our discussion of yesterday)
[06:41] <ogra> yep
[06:42] <rodarvus> ogra, seems ok to me
[06:42] <ogra> fine, its yours :)
[06:43] <rodarvus> ogra, I'm putting LTSPLoginAndSessionHandling for review, then
[06:43] <ogra> yup
[06:43] <rodarvus> ogra, thanks
[06:43] <ogra> well, lets see what the reviewers say :)
[06:44] <ogra> mdz had some valid points, dunno if i adressed them right :)
[06:44] <rodarvus> I'm editing FullyAutomaticSwapServer - cleaning up comments
[06:44] <rodarvus> before I put it for review once again
[06:44] <ogra> yep
[06:46] <ogra> err, wait, swapserver isnt right yet
[06:47] <ogra> the difference between swapfiles and devices isnt cearified yet
[06:47] <ogra> *clearified
[06:47] <ogra> and we should mention somewhere that the minimum to boot without network swap is currently 48MB
[06:48] <rodarvus> ogra, do you want to update it?
[06:48] <ogra> as you like ... i can do it
[06:48] <sbalneav> I added in the 32 meg target in the rationale
[06:48] <ogra> sbalneav, yes, but it doesnt talk about the minimum without swap (which justifies why we want to do it at all)
[06:49] <cbx33> anyone know any lvm gurus?
[06:49] <sbalneav> correct.  That should be added.
[06:50] <ogra> so who edits ? 
[06:50] <sbalneav> back in a bit.  Lunchtime :)
[06:50] <ogra> ah, rodrigo already has :)
[06:51] <ogra> rodarvus, hmm, but you only deleted the comments, right ?
[06:52] <rodarvus> ogra, right, I only deleted the comments (as asked by keybuk)
[06:53] <rodarvus> ogra, thanks
[07:01] <ogra> rodarvus, have a look at the changes of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FullyAutomaticSwapServer
[07:02] <ogra> if you are fine with that, send it to review
[07:03] <rodarvus> ogra, its nice - I'll put it for review
[07:03] <rodarvus> thanks again
[07:03] <ogra> :)
[07:55] <LaserJock> lots of specing going on in my inbox :-0
[07:57] <RobinShepheard> hiya all
[07:57] <bddebian> Hello RobinShepheard
[07:57] <RobinShepheard> hiya bddebian 
[07:57] <rodarvus> right now all my specs are just waiting for a reviewer
[07:58] <rodarvus> everyone is either offline, or too busy :/
[07:59] <RobinShepheard> nctcp %s TIME %t
[08:01] <LaserJock> rodarvus: yeah, seemed like there was some lag after the Paris summit ended, probably due to guadec
[08:02] <rodarvus> LaserJock, the problem is that all of them are already overburdened
[08:02] <rodarvus> reviewing/approving specs is only one of their duties
[08:02] <rodarvus> surely important, but not the only one
[08:03] <LaserJock> sure
[08:05] <juliux> hi all
[08:05] <RobinShepheard> hiya juliux 
[08:08] <sbalneav> rodarvus: What city are you in again?
[08:08] <sbalneav> And, more importantly, will you be able to make it to Porto Alegre next year for FISL 8.0?
[08:09] <rodarvus> sbalneav, Curitiba, PR
[08:09] <rodarvus> sbalneav, sure, Curitiba is rather close to Porto Alegre
[08:10] <rodarvus> (and I even have a brother living there)
[08:10] <ogra> close means less than 2000 miles in your country, right ? :)
[08:11] <sbalneav> Brazil is a big, BIG beautiful country.
[08:11] <sbalneav> I've been there once, and once only, and I've already fallen in love with Brazil.
[08:12] <rodarvus> ogra, yeah :)
[08:12] <rodarvus> about 900km, actually
[08:12] <ogra> woah
[08:12] <rodarvus> which is very little distance in brazil
[08:13] <ogra> thats the whole N/S lenght of germany
[08:13] <RobinShepheard> and about the length of the UK
[08:13] <rodarvus> brazil is 7000+ km distance from north to south, and from east to west
[08:15] <sbalneav> ogra, after I got back from paris, I landed in Minneapolis and DROVE 850 k's back to my house :)
[08:15] <ogra> phew ...
[08:15] <pygi> RobinShepheard, the meeting is in 45 mins
[08:16] <RobinShepheard> pygi, yeah, I got that from the fridge, but I have a few things to look into as far as my cluster project is concerned so here I am
[08:17] <LaserJock> sbalneav: Minneapolis? no direct flights from Winnipeg to Paris? ;-)
[08:17] <RobinShepheard> pygi, just having a quick look, not many suggestions for the cookbook name is there
[08:18] <rodarvus> sbalneav, if/when you come for FISL 8.0, I'll make sure to drive you around
[08:18] <rodarvus> to know some beautiful places
[08:18] <rodarvus> I used to live in Porto Alegre
[08:18] <rodarvus> and actually, I was born on a smaller city, 240 km south from there
[08:19] <LaserJock> pygi: where is the meeting going to be? and is there an agenda?
[08:20] <pygi> LaserJock,1) #ubuntu-meeting, 2)Not sure, probably there is ^_^
[08:22] <sbalneav> LaserJock: I got invited to speak at a teachers conference about LTSP, which I had agreed to almost a year ago.  Then Ubuntu Paris came along. :)  It was just easier to organize the Paris trip from minneapolis.  The conference was Friday, and the trip was saturday, so it just made sense.
[08:24] <LaserJock> ah
[08:25] <LaserJock> I just thought maybe you Canuks just liked the US so much ;-) 
[08:34] <sbalneav> The vast majority of us like America, and Americans a lot.
[08:34] <sbalneav> It's just your gorvernments we sometimes take issue with :)
[08:34] <sbalneav> However, OT for the channel :)
[08:34] <mdz> rodarvus: is it not possible to take the decision on xubuntu-desktop/edubuntu-xfce-desktop in advance?
[08:35] <rodarvus> mdz, not really - we talked with janimo on the subject, and he was not assured whether it would be needed or not
[08:37] <rodarvus> the general consensus, though, is that it will very likely be necessary to create the new meta-package
[08:38] <mdz> rodarvus: if it will be separate, then there needs to be some contingency for keeping them in sync, since it will basically be a derivative of the xubuntu desktop seed
[08:38] <rodarvus> mdz, indeed, you're right
[08:38] <mdz> rodarvus: my suggestion would be to create a new xubuntu seed with the basic desktop, and have the xubuntu desktop seed and edubuntu xfce desktop seed depend on it
[08:39] <rodarvus> I like the idea
[08:39] <rodarvus> ogra?
[08:39] <rodarvus> (are you there?)
[08:40] <rodarvus> mdz, though we'd probably need to hear from ogra and janimo if its ok for the two of them
[08:41] <ogra> rodarvus, now i am
[08:41] <ogra> (sorry, had to care for my girl)
[08:41] <rodarvus> np
[08:43] <ogra> sounds good i dont think there is a problem with a regular seed i merge from xubuntu 
[08:45] <ogra> the xubuntu one would only need -desktop ... not the other stuff so thats only one additional file to maintain
[08:46] <ogra> (and one additional package indeed)
[08:47] <ogra> rodarvus, so we'd do the following: branch the xubuntu seed and modify the desktop part of it, grab the xubuntu-meta source package and disable the generation of everything but xubuntu-desktop and name it edubuntu-xfce-desktop ... 
[08:48] <rodarvus> ogra, I believe mdz proposed for us to not have duplicated work, in this case (which is a good idea)
[08:48] <ogra> we regulary merge the seed with xubuntu
[08:48] <rodarvus> so, cooperation with xubuntu would be beneficial
[08:49] <ogra> i'm a bit worried about space ...
[08:49] <ogra> the basic desktop for xubuntu will include more than just xfce i guess
[08:50] <ogra> in fact we can only get details about it from janimo ... who is MIA since paris
[08:50] <ogra> grmpf
[08:54] <RobinShepheard> pygi, you still there
[08:55] <RobinShepheard> pygi, do you want me to take the notes for tonights meet??
[08:56] <pygi> you can
[08:56] <RobinShepheard> well I don't mind if nobody else wants to do it
[09:01] <mdz> ogra: there is no need to create a  branch
[09:01] <cbx33> ogra, can you get the gpg program for windows?
[09:01] <mdz> we only need one set of xubuntu seeds
[09:01] <mdz> with an extra seed
[09:01] <ogra> ah, k
[09:02] <cbx33> I'm curious
[09:02] <cbx33> what are seeds
[09:02] <mdz> I'm proposing to split it up within the xubuntu seeds
[09:02] <ogra> so nothing to maintain for me then, but janimo must agree
[09:02] <mdz> cbx33: wiki.ubuntu.com/SeedManagement
[09:02] <cbx33> ahhh
[09:02] <cbx33> very simple
[09:02] <ogra> (or are the xubuntu seeds on LP now ? )
[09:02] <ogra> they werent in dapper
[09:03] <mdz> ogra: LP doesn't know about any seeds whatsoever
[09:03] <mdz> ogra: or do you mean the supermirror?
[09:03] <ogra> janimo maintains them on his private server ...
[09:03] <mdz> they are on the supermirror now
[09:03] <ogra> ah, k
[09:03] <ogra> then there should be no problem at all 
[09:04] <ogra> he just needs to merge my changes 
[09:04] <ogra> s/my/our/ ... i shouldnt be the only one to maintain edubuntu seeds anymore ;)
[09:04] <rodarvus> :)
[09:05] <ogra> rodarvus, do you add it to the spec ? 
[09:05] <rodarvus> I was about to say that :)
[09:05] <ogra> or shall i ?
[09:05] <ogra> ok :)
[09:05] <rodarvus> ogra, please do
[09:05] <rodarvus> you are (much) more comfortable than me with supermirror and seeds, right now
[09:07] <ogra> (let alone the build taking >2h)
[09:17] <bddebian> ogra: Aye, I think Riddell is some type of Deity or something :-)
[09:22] <ogra> heh
[09:22] <ogra> i bet he has just a cluster of 500 ipaqs in the cellar and a 10TB solid state disk raid array attached to them ;)
[09:23] <ogra> so he compiles his kdeedu package i 5 mins with distcc :P
[09:23] <RobinShepheard> cbx33, you for the cookbook meet??
[09:25] <ogra> but this kddedu run looks good, seems to compile and all megred patches have applied fine :D
[09:25] <bddebian> hehe
[09:43] <ogra> rodarvus, mdz, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuXfceDesktop updated 
[09:45] <rodarvus> ogra, good to go for me
[09:45] <rodarvus> thanks!
[09:46] <ogra> please look over it before putting it into, my grammar isnt always perfect 
[09:46] <ogra> s/into/into review/
[09:55] <LaserJock> are you guys interested in using the doc team repo?
[09:56] <HedgeMage> Hey folks
[09:56] <RobinShepheard> HedgeMage, I was just thinking it would possibly be useful to see how it would look
[09:56] <LaserJock> I'll try that again, are you guys interested in using the doc team repo?
[09:57] <HedgeMage> LaserJock: I was already talking to jsgotango (sp?) about it
[09:57] <LaserJock> ok
[09:57] <HedgeMage> in the mean time I think I'll set up a temp repo on my server just so we don't have to do this all b;y email
[09:57] <LaserJock> either one of us can help with getting things set up if you need
[09:58] <LaserJock> HedgeMage, pygi: are you interested in becoming doc team members?
[09:58] <LaserJock> or do you want to keep it more seperated?
[09:58] <pygi> LaserJock, ofcourse, we talked about that already ^_^
[09:59] <HedgeMage> I thought that was in the works... or am I totally lost?
[09:59] <LaserJock> it could be I'm totally lost
[09:59] <LaserJock> what did jerome say?
[09:59] <HedgeMage> He said he'd get together with me on it after Paris, then we both got busy
[09:59] <HedgeMage> I've had a tough time getting ahold of him
[09:59] <pygi> LaserJock, we already agreed me and Susan will become members, and get SVN access
[09:59] <RobinShepheard> LaserJock, would that be ubuntu doc team or edubuntu doc team??
[09:59] <HedgeMage> (not his fault we both have busy schedules lately)
[10:00] <pygi> RobinShepheard, ubuntu one
[10:00] <RobinShepheard> ahh, will it be a requirement to join that one as well then??
[10:00] <pygi> RobinShepheard, no, don't worry
[10:00] <LaserJock> well, I was going to say that usually doc team membership usually comes after working in the repo for a while
[10:00] <RobinShepheard> ok, thought i would just check
[10:00] <LaserJock> so it might be nice to get things in the doc team repo
[10:01] <pygi> LaserJock, right, but we already worked on cookbook, so we can commit that :P
[10:01] <LaserJock> yes, but that isn't sufficent, IMO, to grant membership
[10:01] <pygi> indeed :)
[10:01] <pygi> Ah, well :)
[10:01] <RobinShepheard> LaserJock, what would be a requirement for joining??
[10:02] <pygi> oki, so we work in repo first ^_^
[10:02] <ogra> but SCP isnt done ...
[10:02] <ogra> :(
[10:02] <LaserJock> pygi: but maybe you should send patches to the doc team repo every once in a while to get used to it
[10:02] <pygi> ogra, Student control panel?
[10:02] <HedgeMage> LaserJock: Other than waiting to get ahold of jsgotango, how do we get at least pygi and i commit access so we can move stuff to the official repo?
[10:02] <LaserJock> HedgeMage: you work in the repo and send patches
[10:03] <pygi> ogra, isn't it still approved???
[10:03] <HedgeMage> I'll brb I need my glasses this is killing my head
[10:03] <ogra> pygi, yes, i didnt know what to do after my argument with iwj about it ... waiting for a sign
[10:04] <pygi> ogra, lemme try to talk with him if you allow? ^_^
[10:04] <LaserJock> so what I'm saying is this, perhaps you should set up your repo but also start it out in the doc team repo so that you can send patches every once in a while to the -doc list so that the doc team can evaluate your abilities of becomeing a team member
[10:04] <pygi> oki, that's fine LaserJock :)
[10:04] <ogra> pygi, he wants that we *exactly* describe how to implement a dbus listener that only reacts on a namespace and uses default auth 
[10:04] <pygi> ogra, why would we want to do that? :-/
[10:05] <pygi> waste of time
[10:05] <ogra> i found a link to the dbus-spec and a description what we want to do suffices
[10:05] <pygi> yup, I saw that
[10:06] <ogra> so i'm a bit in the air now ... waiting for a word from mdz, who is way to busy to deal with such stuff
[10:06] <pygi> yup, I know
[10:06] <pygi> I'll bug iwj, no worries
[10:06] <ogra> you wont change his mind here
[10:06] <ogra> dont get himm upset again 
[10:06] <pygi> perhaps, but no harm in trying
[10:06] <mdz> ogra: I'll get to it
[10:06] <pygi> no worries :)
[10:06] <ogra> mdz, yes, thats what i thought, i didnt want to nag, sorry
[10:07] <RobinShepheard> I got to scoot HedgeMage, pygi do you want me to do a write up of the couple of points we discussed??
[10:07] <pygi> RobinShepheard, sure, go ahead pls
[10:07] <RobinShepheard> ok, it wont be emailed for about 12 hours though, is that alright??
[10:08] <HedgeMage> before you go, anyone who needs/wants commit access to the temp repo please /msg me you name, email address, and desired username
[10:08] <RobinShepheard> HedgeMage, will I need commit access? and if I do how do I use it??
[10:09] <HedgeMage> RobinShepheard: if you don't have commit access you'll have to keep emailing me works in progress for me to commit... if you do want commit access... I'll email you good instructions :)
[10:09] <RobinShepheard> sounds like I want commit then doesn't it :)
[10:12] <HedgeMage> hehe
[10:12] <RobinShepheard> see everyone later
[10:12] <HedgeMage> pygi: please /msg me your info even though I probably already have it somewhere
[10:12] <HedgeMage> joycejjj: I'll get your info from you and have your live-in geek walk you through what you need to know :)
[10:13] <pygi> HedgeMage, can't do it now, sorry :(
[10:13] <joycejjj> Thank you, ma'am!
[10:13] <HedgeMage> ok np
[10:13] <HedgeMage> joycejjj: Thanks so much for showing up!  I'm sorry we were so disorganized this week.
[10:14] <joycejjj> No problem - meetings are like that - organic.
[10:14] <HedgeMage> hehe :)
[10:21] <Amaranth> that was more like a BOF session that started randomly then got kicked out by a real talk :P
[10:22] <pygi> Amaranth, :P
[10:26] <HedgeMage> lol
[10:26] <HedgeMage> Amaranth: Just proof that they really need me. :P
[10:45] <Amaranth> ogra: packaging next week? eek
[10:46] <ogra> Amaranth, i have done 60% already ...
[10:46] <ogra> you can merge it and finish the missing bits ;)
[10:46] <Amaranth> but i don't even have an installer :P
[10:46] <mhz> ogra: is there a doc (howto or alike) explaining how you do what you do for Edubuntu?
[10:47] <ogra> dont worry :)
[10:47] <ogra> mhz, after the distro meeting ...
[10:48] <mhz> ogra: oooh, got it...you are in a meeting :)
[11:08] <Amaranth> ogra: so how do you have 60% of a package done when i have no build scripts? :)
[11:09] <ogra> who needs build scripts :P
[11:09] <ogra> there are .install files dpkg uses very fine :)
[11:10] <LaserJock> heck yeah :-)
[11:10] <ogra> we can add build scripts any time ... but what do you want to build ? its all plain python 
[11:10] <Amaranth> heh
[11:11] <Amaranth> well, mainly translations and a config.py or something for paths
[11:11] <ogra> well, thats easily added :)
[11:11] <Amaranth> btw, i can't make transparent proxying work, my iptables-fu is weak
[11:11] <ogra> the point is to get as much testing as we can ...
[11:11] <Amaranth> yeah
[11:11] <ogra> i'll help you with that
[11:12] <Amaranth> well, the commands to use would be nice, so i could see if it works :)
[11:12] <LaserJock> ogra: how should I handle this hacking of sabayon? should I just make a branch a https://launchpad.net/products/sabayon ?
[11:12] <ogra> so to get testing of the bayesian filter and the white/blacklisting we can already throw it into the wild :)
[11:12] <Amaranth> i was figuring we can have the proxy running all the time and have the little checkbox just turn on/off the iptables rules
[11:13] <ogra> yep, something like that was the initial idea
[11:13] <Amaranth> so, any idea what the magic incantations are to make that work? :)
[11:14] <ogra> LaserJock, woah, cool there is a branch  ! ...
[11:14] <ogra> LaserJock, sure, branch off ;)
[11:14] <LaserJock> ogra: yeah, a CVS import aparently
[11:15] <ogra> Amaranth, not from the top of my head ... i'll need to look up some PREROUTING POSTROUTING rules and try them out first ... give me a week... 
[11:15] <Amaranth> ok
[11:15] <ogra> LaserJock, well, but its bzr now so that should be perfect 
[11:15] <LaserJock> k
[11:26] <LaserJock> ogra: when did you last try sabayon over LTSP?
[11:27] <ogra> a while ago ... mid dapper or so
[11:28] <LaserJock> hmm, cause I was just reading an email on the sabayon list that says it should have been fixed with 2.12.1
[11:28] <LaserJock> but that was in like Janurary or something
[11:29] <ogra> might have been january when i checked it ...
[11:30] <LaserJock> the email was in response to someone running LTSP on ubuntu who couldn't get it to work so ... maybe we should try it again :-)
[11:30] <ogra> yep
[11:30] <ogra> i currently have my HW not around ... i'm bound to my ibook atm, the rest is still in boxes 
[11:31] <ogra> else i'd test immediately ...
[11:32] <LaserJock> k, I don't have a LTSP setup so I'll wait for you or somebody else :-)
[11:32] <LaserJock> not a big rush though
[11:55] <mhz> jmolmos: digita esto:      /join #edubuntu-es
[11:55] <mhz> ogra: is there a doc (howto or alike) explaining how you do what you do for Edubuntu?
[11:56] <pygi> mhz, like a edubuntu cookbook? :)
[11:57] <mhz> pygi: nope ;)
[11:57] <mhz> as in "To make Edubuntu flavor, 1st do this, 2nd do that, etc"
[11:58] <pygi> ah :P
[11:59] <ogra> mhz, to make edubuntu, first become main developer and get access to the cd build infrastructure ...
[12:00] <Amaranth> heh
[12:00] <ogra> mhz, thats really very tightly integrated into the ubuntu development ...
[12:00] <Amaranth> it's mostly just packaging and seeds
[12:01] <ogra> i cant really distinguish between edubuntu and ubuntu apart from doing the edubuntu seeds (as documented in the SeedManagement wikipage), building the edubuntu-meta package from it, triggering the CD buildd and caring for edubuntu-artwork
[12:02] <mhz> ogra: okis..
[12:03] <mhz> I'll read SeedManagement first then..
[12:03] <mhz> I gotta make an interview
[12:03] <mhz> and you are my #1 candidate :D
[12:04] <bluekuja__> hello guys
[12:04] <bluekuja__> hi mhz
[12:04] <bluekuja__> hi ogra, Amaranth 
[12:04] <Amaranth> hey
[12:04] <bluekuja__> pygi: you there?
[12:04] <pygi> bluekuja__, partly
[12:04] <mhz> bluekuja: hey
[12:05] <pygi> how may I help?
[12:05] <bluekuja__> pygi: :)
[12:06] <Amaranth> ok, i think the 2nd and 3rd tabs of my config tool work good now
[12:06] <Amaranth> except for some UI-freeze issues
[12:06] <bluekuja__> pygi, I just went home, how are you man?
[12:06] <Amaranth> now to make the first tab work
[12:06] <pygi> bluekuja__, tired :P
[12:06] <bluekuja__> LaserJock: ping
[12:07] <bluekuja__> pygi, hehe, your package?
[12:07] <pygi> what one?
[12:07] <bluekuja__> rpm one
[12:07] <pygi> eh, theres a new version already
[12:07] <pygi> doesnt matter really
[12:07] <bluekuja__> oh great, ok
[12:08] <bluekuja__> pygi, website?
[12:08] <pygi> bluekuja__, what one?
[12:08] <pygi> pykix.net,blog.pykix.net, pygi.pykix.net
[12:08] <pygi> all in works
[12:08] <pygi> a lot more to come
[12:08] <bluekuja__> oh great
[12:08] <bluekuja__> I'll take a look
[12:12] <pygi> I run now