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| LaserJock | mdke__: awake? | 02:45 |
|---|---|---|
| mvirkkil | Seems like I need to do some datamining. I've been playing around with the xslt to do docbook->moinmoin | 02:47 |
| mvirkkil | The version I have now, handles most of what the moin->docbook generates, with the single huge omission of graphics. | 02:47 |
| mvirkkil | (because it's a bit complicated) | 02:47 |
| mvirkkil | Any suggestions on how to accomplish, where to start? | 02:47 |
| LaserJock | I'm a simple docbook user so I'm afraid I'm no help :( | 02:52 |
| mvirkkil | LaserJock: What's a "simple docbook user" | 03:09 |
| LaserJock | meaning, I can write docs with it | 03:09 |
| LaserJock | but I don't know much about doing stylesheets, etc. | 03:10 |
| mvirkkil | LaserJock: Ahh.. I was asking more like "what are the most important docbook elements", maybe. | 03:11 |
| LaserJock | mvirkkil: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DocBookReference has most of what I use | 03:13 |
| mvirkkil | LaserJock: Cool! Since I already handle almost all of that :) | 03:17 |
| LaserJock | yep | 03:17 |
| LaserJock | I actually don't have a graphics in the doc I maintain so I don't have a lot to offer there | 03:17 |
| LaserJock | s/a/any/ | 03:17 |
| mvirkkil | Hmm.. I don't think all those examples are valid. | 03:18 |
| mvirkkil | yup. the list examples are invalid. | 03:19 |
| LaserJock | could be, that page is a work in progress I believe | 03:19 |
| mvirkkil | you must have <listitem><para>text</para></listitem> | 03:19 |
| Laser_away | right, I believe so | 03:19 |
| Laser_away | gotta get home now, bbl | 03:20 |
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| mvirkkil | ok | 03:21 |
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| nixternal | Burgwork: was that you that wanted someone to go through one of the encryption pages on the wiki and see if it works? | 04:21 |
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| robotgeek | somneone pinged me, but my away log was full | 05:06 |
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| robotgeek | so, i dont know what/who pinged me | 05:20 |
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| mvirkkil | jeffsch: I've been hacking on the xslt. | 08:40 |
| mvirkkil | jeffsch: you mentioned you might be interested in further developing it. | 08:41 |
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| Madpilot | hi jsgotangco | 08:42 |
| jsgotangco | Madpilot: hello brian =) | 08:42 |
| mvirkkil | jeffsch: the docbook->moin xslt, that is. I split it in to smaller chunks, and added support for table attributes (align, valign, morerows, colspan), glosslist support, unlimited depth for lists, and the <section> tag. | 08:42 |
| mvirkkil | Seems like I need to do some datamining. I've been playing around with the xslt to do docbook->moinmoin. Now I need to know what to concentrate on. Any suggestions? | 08:43 |
| mvirkkil | I can't realistically support over 400 elements, so out of necessity, it's going to be a subset. | 08:44 |
| mdke__ | Laser_away: now | 08:45 |
| mdke__ | morning all | 08:45 |
| jsgotangco | hello mdke =) | 08:46 |
| Madpilot | morning mdke | 08:46 |
| mdke | how are things in docland today? | 08:52 |
| jsgotangco | hmmm | 08:53 |
| jsgotangco | i sure did some docs today but for the UNDP and published in LP | 08:53 |
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| mvirkkil | mdke: Well, I'm thinking about how to accomplish assessing what docbook stuff I need to support. | 09:06 |
| mdke | mvirkkil: uhuh | 09:06 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: I've basically added support for everything the moin->docbook (article, not book) generates, with the exception of images. | 09:09 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: I think I'll do the "chunking" of a book in to separate smaller parts in python and not xsl. | 09:10 |
| mvirkkil | and for now I'm concentrating on the xsl part. | 09:10 |
| mdke | mvirkkil: sounds very cool. | 09:14 |
| mdke | mvirkkil: if you want to patch what we have in the repository, and for us to test it, give us a shout | 09:15 |
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| mvirkkil | mdke: I'll still add support for images, but after that it would be nice to have you test it. | 09:56 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: Or maybe even before that. What are you planning on using it for? | 09:58 |
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| === jsgotangco wonders why tables in yelp have no borders..or is it my tags | ||
| jsgotangco | it seems to have very faint row colors | 10:17 |
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| mvirkkil | jsgotangco: I noticed that bug too. You need to specify borders for each cell separately iirc. | 10:29 |
| jsgotangco | ouchhh | 10:29 |
| jsgotangco | and docbook tables arent the most beautiful in markup out there | 10:30 |
| mvirkkil | jsgotangco: That's why I prefer writing wikimarkup and converting ;) | 10:30 |
| jsgotangco | hehe yeah i hear ya | 10:30 |
| jsgotangco | its just that i have to finish up my contract with the UN with this small conversion job | 10:31 |
| mvirkkil | "#Bug in yelp, the two lines below don't affect rendering: self.tgroup.setAttribute('rowsep', '1'); self.tgroup.setAttribute('colsep', '1')" | 10:33 |
| mvirkkil | Instead I do both of those separately for each single entry element. | 10:34 |
| mvirkkil | jsgotangco: What conversion? | 10:34 |
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| mdke | mvirkkil: putting our guides into the wiki | 10:59 |
| rob | hmm, I guess I should file a bug on the packaging guide | 11:10 |
| rob | https://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/appendix-chroot.html | 11:10 |
| jsgotangco | rob: do it | 11:10 |
| jsgotangco | yeah | 11:10 |
| rob | the configure locales part doesn't configure locales | 11:10 |
| rob | one needs to also do something like: apt-get install language-pack-en | 11:11 |
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| rob | ok done | 11:15 |
| rob | #52070 | 11:15 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: So like install-guide could be an example? https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/trunk/generic/installguide/C/installation-guide.xml | 11:24 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: Because that contains almost exclusibely procedures and variablelists, it would seem. And neither is supported or has a clean conversion to wiki. | 11:26 |
| mdke | mvirkkil: well not that one specifically. But certainly guides which contain LOTS of procedures and some variablelists | 11:27 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: hmm.. That's a problem. Any suggestions on how to map those to the wikisyntax? | 11:29 |
| mdke | mvirkkil: well, I don't know how it works technically, but I would have thought that procedures can just be turned into a numbered list, if more than 1 step, and a bulleted list if a single step. Or is that too simplistic | 11:31 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: Actually, most of the other examples I'm seeing in your repo, don't contain procedures or variablelists. | 11:32 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: The problem is, that the wikisyntax doesn't handle anything that isn't a single paragraph with some markup very gracefully. Most steps contains screenshots and several paragraphs of text. | 11:33 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: But it would seem that the installation-guide is just about the only one with many procedures and variablelists. Other docbooks seem to look a lot simpler. | 11:34 |
| mdke | mvirkkil: we hardly have any screenshots. But if you want to see lots of procedures, see trunk/ubuntu/desktopguide/C | 11:34 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: Ahh crap ;) But those aren't as complex steps. Those could be mapped to orderedlists. | 11:37 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: I'll see what I can do :) | 11:37 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: Thanks for the feedback. | 11:38 |
| mdke | thank you | 11:40 |
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| apokryphos | mdke: ping | 11:49 |
| mdke | apokryphos: hello | 11:57 |
| apokryphos | mdke: hi. I see you changed some things on CommonQuestions (nice stuff), just wondering what you think the advantages are of the new contents page | 11:58 |
| apokryphos | seems a lot more troublesome to me. You have to go to a section, then keep scrolling down the page to see if you find the answer | 11:58 |
| mdke | apokryphos: which contents page? | 11:58 |
| apokryphos | (instead of having all the questions in a small list, then clicking on the one you want). That method would work if there were very few questions only, I think. | 11:58 |
| apokryphos | mdke: on CommonQuestions | 11:58 |
| mdke | ah, the table of contents on that page? | 11:59 |
| mdke | I think the previous table was very ugly and unwieldy | 11:59 |
| mdke | i think keeping it simple is easier | 11:59 |
| apokryphos | not when there are many questions, though. A user has to go that section, then keep scrolling down the page until he finds the question | 12:00 |
| apokryphos | seeing all the questions as bullet points (and as numbers) would be a lot easier, I think | 12:00 |
| mdke | as long as the sections are appropriately structured, it should be obvious where the answers are | 12:00 |
| mdke | but I'd rather discuss it on the list, I don't have much time now | 12:00 |
| apokryphos | a large table isn't bad as long as it's properly organised (and I think your organisation of it might be better ,indeed ) | 12:00 |
| mdke | I opened a thread specifically about this | 12:00 |
| apokryphos | I'm not the subscribed to the list, so I would've missed it. Also I wasn't getting emails about changes to the page (perhaps because of the move) | 12:01 |
| apokryphos | but I'll post on the list, sure | 12:01 |
| mdke | thanks | 12:02 |
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| enrico | Is there some free LPI ubuntu training material available? | 02:41 |
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| jeffsch | mvirkkil: hello | 03:53 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: i only have a couple of minutes, then i have to go for a day, but here is what I'm thinking... | 03:56 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: I have been thinking about the article->moin stuff | 03:56 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: Now I remember why I stopped working on it | 03:56 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: It's because I realized that the best way to do it is to first do docbook->xhtml with xslt, then do xhtml->moin with xslt | 03:57 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: also, the problem with moin->docbook is that there is a certain minimum level of complexity that is involved due to the nature of mvirkkil: docbook structure and document structure | 03:58 |
| jeffsch | oops... that should be... | 03:59 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: also, the problem with moin->docbook is that there is a certain minimum level of complexity that is involved due to the nature of docbook structure and document structure | 04:00 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: moin is supposed to be simple, but to make it handle the complexities of a document, you need to make moin not simple | 04:00 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: for example, the admonition macro in moin: how is it more simple and easy to remember than <tip><title></title><para></para></tip>? | 04:01 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: the admonition macro is something like [[admonition,tip, title, text] ] , iirc. It might be easier to type, but same difficulty to remember | 04:01 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: you will need many macros to handle the many docbook tags | 04:02 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: it's probably easier to remember a hundred docbook tags than it is to remember a hundred moin macros | 04:02 |
| mvirkkil | jeffsch: I'm not striving for 100%, only the 90% that counts :) | 04:03 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: I think that it might be easier to have a single docbook macro in moin | 04:03 |
| jeffsch | [[docbook] ] , or something | 04:03 |
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| jeffsch | then the moin formatter can turn the docbook processing over to xslt (or whatever) to produce the html | 04:04 |
| mvirkkil | jeffsch: And I've basically finished my work on moin->docbook. I needed to add Admonition and Insert(into="chapter") macros. | 04:04 |
| jeffsch | ah cool | 04:04 |
| mvirkkil | jeffsch: That would be too radical a change at this point. People seem to be happy with what the moin->docbook formatter can do at the moment. It's not perfect, but it's good enough. | 04:04 |
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| jeffsch | yeah... after we use it for awhile we will have a good idea of where to go | 04:05 |
| mvirkkil | jeffsch: yeah. The idea people seem to have is to write most of the text in collaboration on a wiki. Then the "official guys" take it, clean it up, and make it ready for primetime. | 04:06 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: have you tested it on random wiki pages yet? | 04:07 |
| mvirkkil | jeffsch: And this docbook->moin would probably be used for importing half finished projects or projects which need extensive work. | 04:07 |
| mvirkkil | jeffsch: Yeah. Moins SyntaxReference produces a valid docbook (!) | 04:07 |
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| mvirkkil | jeffsch: Check out http://docbook.wikiwikiweb.de/ | 04:08 |
| mvirkkil | jeffsch: Hmm.. Well, except for the fact that one section contains no data. I used to have a workaround which would put an empty para, but it was ugly, so I removed it. | 04:08 |
| joachim-n | ah, the eternal wiki->docbook question... :) | 04:10 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: :) | 04:10 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: Any thoughts about the subject? | 04:10 |
| joachim-n | I think there's a gnome summer of coder looking at it too | 04:10 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: That would be me :P | 04:10 |
| joachim-n | ah :) | 04:10 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: No wait. | 04:10 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: Sorry. | 04:10 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: I'm the fedora summer coder. | 04:11 |
| jeffsch | mvirkkil: ok, i have to go to work... talk to you later, and good work! | 04:11 |
| joachim-n | Goran Raki is the gnome summer coder | 04:11 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: I've talked to the gnome one, but he just wants to make pretty pages from existing docbooks, not edit them much. | 04:11 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: Yup. | 04:11 |
| joachim-n | right. that's the core focus of his project | 04:11 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: I tried brainstorming with him on how we could collaborate, but it didn't seem to work out really... | 04:12 |
| joachim-n | the thought I had about it was that there's a lot of clues in the text a parser can use | 04:13 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: There's also a php summer of coder working on php-docs<->docbook | 04:13 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: Yeah. I've been thinking about adding support for a heading row in a table, if the first row's text is bolded. | 04:14 |
| joachim-n | yeah | 04:14 |
| joachim-n | I was thinking of things like "choose File->Open... " | 04:14 |
| joachim-n | which the parser can guess is a menu command, and wrap it up in the dozens of tags you need for those | 04:14 |
| mvirkkil | joachim-n: will only work for one language.. | 04:21 |
| joachim-n | ah, the "choose" you mean | 04:22 |
| joachim-n | just the -> between words then | 04:23 |
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| jsgotangco | ciao | 04:39 |
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| nixternal | moins | 05:37 |
| CarlFK | the ubuntu-user mail list is a bit overwhelming - Where can I suggest some sub-topics like -sound, networking, apps... | 05:38 |
| enrico | Is there some free LPI training material for Ubuntu? | 05:44 |
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| mdke_ | hi newz2000. Do you have any view yet on bug 51571? I can walk you through fixing it if you agree | 05:58 |
| Ubugtu | Malone bug 51571 in ubuntu-website "Create a bug contact for the ubuntu-website product" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] http://launchpad.net/bugs/51571 | 05:58 |
| newz2000 | ooh, that's a cool feature | 05:59 |
| newz2000 | let me look | 05:59 |
| newz2000 | ok, I saw that come through, yes | 06:00 |
| newz2000 | I'd appreciate any info on this subject | 06:00 |
| mdke_ | newz2000: for example? | 06:00 |
| mdke_ | you need clarity on what the bug is about? | 06:01 |
| newz2000 | mdke_ yes, that would be helpful. | 06:01 |
| mdke_ | ok | 06:01 |
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| LaserJock | mdke_: still? | 07:49 |
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| nixternal | jjesse_: thank you for the email bud!! | 09:03 |
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| jjesse_ | nixternal: np | 09:12 |
| jjesse_ | when does the mtg start? | 09:13 |
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| nixternal | i dont' think it is scheduled yet | 09:15 |
| jjesse_ | ah | 09:16 |
| nixternal | actually..according to -meeting, it is tuesday | 09:17 |
| nixternal | however that wasn't on the wiki earlier nor the fridge | 09:17 |
| === nixternal investigates ;) | ||
| nixternal | amarok transfer to ipod is really slow...i dont' know if it is amarok and ipod issue, or the fact i use rockbox..but i don't think rockbox is the issue there | 09:17 |
| jjesse_ | agreed really slow | 09:18 |
| nixternal | ahh..it is on the wiki now | 09:18 |
| nixternal | 11 July 2006, 20:00 UTC | 09:18 |
| nixternal | 15:00 for me, 16:00 for you | 09:18 |
| jjesse_ | grin | 09:18 |
| nixternal | it is now set in kontact | 09:21 |
| nixternal | i might sit in and listen to the Edubuntu Cookbook meeting...the work they do over there is neat..and i have been playing with Edubuntu, trying to get my church to use it in the childrens lab | 09:22 |
| LaserJock | way cool | 09:24 |
| nixternal | rofl..on the fridge, the "i want a pony" pic, you click it and it has a little girl upset and it says no!! | 09:24 |
| nixternal | gahaahaha | 09:24 |
| nixternal | omlord my stomach hurts from that one | 09:24 |
| LaserJock | mdke_: ping? | 09:42 |
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| mdke_ | LaserJock: email... I can't stick around now | 09:59 |
| LaserJock | mdke_: I just wondered if anybody from -doc was going to the dev meeting | 10:01 |
| LaserJock | that is going on now | 10:01 |
| mdke_ | not me... | 10:02 |
| pygi | me :) | 10:02 |
| mvirkkil | mdke_: seems I can't browse the docteam trunk | 10:05 |
| jjesse_ | i know we talked once before about setting up bzr for ubuntu-docs and iahve access to store it on the doc.ubuntu.com server but i forget how to check it | 10:05 |
| LaserJock | heh | 10:06 |
| LaserJock | jjesse_: what do you want to do exactly? | 10:06 |
| LaserJock | grab the bzr? or push? | 10:06 |
| jjesse_ | yeah grab the bzr | 10:06 |
| jjesse_ | just to play a little w/ it | 10:06 |
| LaserJock | bzr branch http://doc.ubuntu.com/bzr/ or you can do checkout instead of branch if you want it svn-like | 10:07 |
| jjesse_ | THANKS LaserJock | 10:08 |
| jjesse_ | sorry bout the caps | 10:08 |
| LaserJock | be forwarned though, it is quite old | 10:13 |
| LaserJock | I'll try to freshen it up soon | 10:13 |
| jjesse_ | i noticed | 10:13 |
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| mdke_ | mvirkkil: https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos | 11:02 |
| mvirkkil | mdke: Yah. That was the one I had trouble connecting to... No problems now. Probably a local network glitch. | 11:24 |
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| LaserJock | mdke: ok, apparently I'll try to get a brief doc team report at the next distro meeting :/ | 11:42 |
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