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ddaaMeeting in two minutes11:57
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ddaaLuckily there's no .it in this meeting.12:00
ddaa* roll call12:00
ddaa* SFTP and knit advertising12:00
ddaa* vcs-import knits12:00
ddaa* branch scanner latency12:00
ddaa* cscvs/bzr-native12:00
ddaa* supermirror branch browser12:00
ddaa* private branches12:00
ddaa* critical bugs12:00
ddaa* pending sysadmin tasks12:00
ddaa* any other business12:00
ddaaThat is the Bazaar meeting, for all things Launchpad and Bazaar, of course.12:00
ddaa* Roll call!12:01
ddaajamesh: lifeless: spiv: ping12:01
ddaampool: #launchpad-meeting12:01
ddaaSorry, the infra guys are late.12:02
SteveAwe're almost done with the infrastructure meeting12:02
SteveAso don't wait12:02
jameshI'm here12:03
ddaaOkay, so 'vrybuddy's here except mpool.12:03
ddaa* SFTP and knit advertising12:03
ddaaAfter the initial blog entry, I planned to blog about12:03
ddaa- team shared  branches12:03
ddaa- using checkouts (aka bound branches)12:03
ddaaI have no time for that, I'd like somebody to write a blog about that, and I'll link from ddaa.net.12:03
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mpoolhi there12:04
ddaaAnybody volunteers for blogging about team-shared branches on launchpad.net and using heavy checkouts on them?12:04
SteveAddaa: did you tell jdub about your initial blog entry?12:05
ddaaNot personally, I think. But I posted to the warthogs@ mailing list.12:05
SteveAddaa: do contact jdub personally12:05
jameshI mentioned your first blog entry in my blog12:05
SteveAalthough it is good that you also mailed warthogs12:06
mpoolddaa: is there a plan to do anything else about it beyond blogging?12:06
ddaaACTION: ddaa to tell jdub12:06
ddaampool: mh... that's a good question. Probably, when we have something good we could put that on launchpad.net/bazaar12:07
ddaabut ATM blogging seems like a good way to get the stuff written in the first place12:08
jameshI could write an article about team shared branches if no one else is12:08
SteveAjamesh: that would be most cool12:08
ddaajamesh: I think you win that one :)12:09
jameshI'll send a draft through to the list before hand12:09
mpoolwe should make sure to get at least something small and more formal onto the site12:09
mpooleven if it's just "branches can be hosted here, see <a>ddaa's blog"12:09
lifelessI dont think formal matters12:09
ddaampool: https://launchpad.net/bazaar12:09
lifelessI think discoverable matters12:09
lifelesswhereever there is a 'branch' there should be a emblem for help or something, which if followed will educate12:10
mpoolddaa, that looks good12:10
ddaaThere is work to link to that branch from interesting bug pages in one of my bazaar-ui branches.12:11
lifelessddaa: just land it!12:12
ddaaBut it's part of the "controversial" stuff that I never got around comitting. And that frankly I'd rather not dust off right now (largely because of context switching).12:12
SteveAthen give it to someone else to land12:12
SteveAdon't just sit on it12:12
SteveAit is wasted work in that case12:12
SteveAwhy do you say "controversial" ?12:12
ddaampt had comments, I thought they were good comments, but you asked me to postpone acting on it for two weeks, about two months ago12:13
ddaagood UI takes time12:13
ddaathat we lack12:13
lifelesswe had a meeting12:14
SteveAwe also agreed that with UI stuff, just fucking land it12:14
lifelessof review team12:14
lifelessand then lp team12:14
lifelesswhere we said 'ui stuff LAND first, review SECOND'12:14
lifelessas in, code review only, not ui review.12:15
SteveAif it doesn't land, it has wasted your time in doing the code, and the reviewers' time in reviewing UI and code12:16
ddaait's conflicted, some of mpt comments still need addressing, it's unfinished work dangit12:16
SteveAmpt's comments can be addressed later, and lifeless and I have just said12:16
SteveAlifeless more eloquently than I12:16
SteveAbut I win the award for the most creative use of the word "fuck" in a serious launchpad meeting12:16
lifelessfuck you12:16
ddaaSo, somebody please merge david/launchpad/bazaar-ui12:17
SteveAspiv: do you have time to do this?12:18
spivI think so.12:18
spivIt doesn't look outrageously large...12:18
spivI'll let you know if I don't :)12:18
mpoolddaa: add mpt's comments to a todo list12:19
ddaampool: you mean a bug?12:19
mpooleither a bug, or just your personal list of things to do12:19
SteveAspiv: ta12:19
ddaaACTION: spiv to try landing david/launchpad/bazaar-ui/12:20
ddaaACTION: ddaa to file a bug with mpt comments about ui12:20
ddaacat comments > /dev/null :(12:20
ddaaMoving on.12:20
ddaa* vcs-imports knits12:20
ddaaRolled out new bzrlib to importd. Will process some outstanding VCS import request12:20
ddaathat will hopefully allow me to check that new importd branches are indeed published in knits.12:20
ddaaI think conversion of existing branches could be done by importd, before pushing to escudero. Plan to do sometimes after finishing bzr-native.12:20
ddaaACTION: ddaa to file bug about converting existing vcs-import branches to knits.12:20
ddaaIf you think that converting vcs-imports to knits is very important and urgent, please scream now.12:21
jameshI sent you a summary of which vcs-imports branches were being used, to give an idea of which ones would be a priority12:21
ddaajamesh: AFAICT, that means the use of system is near-zero12:22
ddaaexcept for Kamion and a couple other ubuntu guys12:22
jameshwell, we don't exactly advertise it12:22
ddaawhich is find, since it is not exactly painless12:22
jameshthe idea was just to put the branches people are using at the head of the conversion queue12:23
ddaajamesh: considering the level of use the system is seeing, I think having a separate conversion process is too much work.12:24
ddaabetter to get the thing churn conversions for one week and be done with it12:24
jameshddaa: I wasn't suggesting a separate process -- the suggestion was to tweak the ordering12:25
ddaathat infra will also be useful for future conversions, hopefully at that point we'll have better system and we'll be able to just plug in more slave for this sort of load peaks.12:25
lifelessfocus please12:26
lifelessconversions are not the most important thing to do12:26
lifeless(given the usage stats)12:26
ddaaright, so let's move on12:26
lifelessnew branches are knits already. So lets move on.12:26
ddaa* branch scanner latency12:26
ddaaJamesh has merged out a patch to let the branch puller record more information, and let the branch scanner use it to save uncessary work. However, it broke the branch scanner on rollout.12:26
ddaaJamesh has a branch in review to fix the breakage, and move the bzrsync code and tests out of lib/importd. So it will use the normal test runner and get proper Zope utility setup.12:26
ddaaNo other comment there, jamesh appears to be on top of the situation. Thanks.12:26
ddaa* cscvs/bzr-native12:27
ddaaddaa will put a branch for review that uses bzr in all CVS-based tests. Still need one (subversion tests) or two (shell tests?) more iterations of test refactoring after that.12:27
ddaaNo other comment there, either.12:27
ddaa* supermirror branch browser [spiv] 12:27
ddaaHi spiv. How is that going? Anything blocking you?12:27
lifelessI think the shell tests can be nuked now12:27
ddaalifeless: okay, I'll check whether they do something more than the unittests (which have less than complete coverage for some cvs stuff)12:28
spivddaa: no progress at all, I've got a note to talk to Steve about it, but until today he was at EP.12:28
ddaacool, hopefully you'll get some of SteveA's time soon :)12:29
SteveAspiv: what do you need from me?12:29
spivSteveA: I can't recall what I had in mind originally, to be honest.  Basically a pre-impl call, though.12:30
SteveAspiv: okay.  today or tomorrow is good for me.12:31
ddaa* private branches12:31
ddaaIn an unexpected move, lifeless specced out private branches12:31
ddaaI am still supposed to review that. Will try to do Tuesday or Wednesday.12:31
ddaaACTION: ddaa ro reviews spec/private-branches12:31
spivSteveA: I may ping you after review team meeting, depending on when I make dinner, otherwise tomorrow.12:31
ddaaeverybody else here more than welcome to review it too12:31
SteveAspiv: ok12:31
spivIs it acceptable to put feedback on the end of the wiki page, or is there a facility in the spec system I should use?12:32
SteveAprivate branches are important so that we can get launchpad and other internal projects using "The Bazaar" features in launchpad12:32
lifelesswiki page - reviewer questions area12:32
SteveAspiv: put it in the wiki page at the end12:32
SteveAit should be "reviewer comments"12:33
ddaaAnybody else interested in reviewing and not having a review request already?12:33
ddaaokay, moving on12:33
SteveAi'll read it12:33
ddaa* critical bugs12:33
ddaaFour critical bugs on launcpad-bazaar:12:33
ddaa- bug 31308: Cannot set branch associated to a product series. https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad-bazaar/+bug/3130812:33
ddaaTalked about that in Vilnius. Three states for a productseries: nothing, vcs import, native branch. That requires a spec to define the behaviour for all the possible transitions. Lifeless said he would do it.12:33
ddaalifeless are you still hot?12:33
SteveAbut i was present during its conception12:33
SteveA<spiv> It doesn't look outrageously large...12:34
=== ddaa pokes lifeless with a stick
ddaait looks lifeless...12:35
ddaaThere's nobody else I think is familiar enough with the corner cases of that issue.12:36
lifelessyes, Iw ill be doing the spec for that12:36
ddaaACTION: lifeless to spec for bug 3789712:37
ddaa- bug 37897: renaming project, product or series breaks vcs imports https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad-bazaar/+bug/3789712:37
ddaaTalked about that in Vilnius. Will add importd_slave column in ProductSeries to record which importd system currently own the persistent data. Existing records will be inited using the current job-name-hashing logic. New records will be given to slave with the least jobs. Simple interim measure.12:37
ddaaACTION: ddaa to spec short term and long term fix for that bug in excruciating detail12:37
ddaaI still need hands to implement that in the short term.12:37
ddaaWant to do it since it's overlaps with the bzr-native and importd-ng roadmaps.12:38
ddaa(which I reckon are only in my head, and somewhat fuzzy)12:38
ddaaThought lifeless certainly has some very strong opinions on that too :)12:38
ddaa- bug 51130: cannot use +admin on a branch I own https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad-bazaar/+bug/5113012:39
ddaaI suggest:12:39
ddaa+ edit Branch.name and Branch.product on branch/+edit12:39
ddaa+ edit Branch.owner on branch/+reassign (like product), call the action link "Change Owner" or something, but _not_ "Change Maintainer" as it is currently on the product page. 12:39
ddaaIf you like that, I'll comment on the bug and try to get somebody to do it. That should be fairly easy.12:39
ddaaDoes everybody like that plan?12:40
ddaaThe rational for +reassign, is that it's something the user cannot undo, and that it is a very rare operation. It should be hard to do by mistake.12:40
ddaaShould be a good place to make team-shared branches discoverable, too.12:41
mpoolddaa: that sounds reasonable12:42
mpoolis there any decision on changing the url, or is that a different bug?12:42
ddaachanging what url?12:42
mpoolor does that remain under +admin12:42
mpoolchanging the real url of the branch12:43
ddaathat's currently under +edit AFAIK12:43
lifelessI think all the fields the user can edit should be in +edit12:43
ddaano bug here that I'm aware of12:43
lifelessand admin only fields in +admin12:43
ddaalifeless: sure, branch/+admin will go away too.12:43
lifelessbut this is nikeshedding12:43
ddaa* pending sysadmin tasks?12:44
spivlifeless: not reebokshedding? ;)12:44
lifelesswhat matters is letting users change fields they should be able to.12:44
ddaalifeless: the way we present that functionality matters a lot too.12:44
ddaaNobody is blocked on sysadmining?12:45
lifelessI have a new item for end of meeting12:45
ddaa* Any other business?12:45
jameshI've got the cscvs support for Subversion symlinks up for review12:45
jameshso that should fix some imports once landed12:46
ddaaI'm on vacation from tuesday to monday12:46
ddaaSo I'll likely look at it and roll it out next week.12:46
jameshIt hasn't been reviewed yet, but I can delay landing it til you look over it if you'd prefer.12:47
ddaajamesh: please get it reviewed12:47
ddaaI just want to sanity check the code for logic holes12:47
ddaabut I trust that I will find nothing to complain about.12:47
jameshddaa: I wasn't planning on taking it off the queue.  Just asking if you wanted me to delay landing it after review12:47
mpooli'm planning to write some braindump specs for 12:48
ddaajamesh: nope please land it ASAP12:48
mpoolbranch viewing, review on launchpad and so on12:48
ddaajamesh: thank you for asking12:48
jameshddaa: okay.12:48
mpooljust to start making plans for future features and so we can prioritise them12:48
mpoolshould have something for folks to read in the next week or two 12:49
mpooljust an advance warning12:49
ddaasounds useful, along with private branches that will make a useful roadmap12:49
ddaampool: if you feel like it, I'd love a spec about email subscription to branches12:50
ddaathat's a cool feature we've been promising forever12:51
lifelessok guys.12:51
lifelessthis meeting is now late. and I have another in 9 minutes12:51
ddaalifeless: you said you had something to add12:51
lifelessI'm going to jump in now with my new item12:51
lifelesswhich is, these meetings should be about decisions not planning12:52
mpoolddaa: that'd be good12:52
lifelessI'd really like to see us move discussion about solutions, about whether things are right or wrong, to the usual channels: specs, the lp mailing list, bugs.12:53
mpoollifeless: ok - and do what here?12:53
lifelessmpool: Status of tasks; assignment of tasks; 12:54
lifelesschanges in policy; changes in priority that needs dispersement ot the team.12:54
ddaaACTION: mpool to braindump specs for branch viewing, reviews, email subscription, and so on12:54
ddaaACTION: jamesh get svn-symlinks reviewed and landed12:55
ddaaACTION: ddaa to sanity check svn-symlinks and roll out12:55
lifelessthe reason being that we can literally spend 2 hours talking over a feature, holding 6 people here, when in fact, its fine grained ui tweaks best discussed in a small group with mpt. Or best mocked up and tested.12:55
lifelessetc etc12:56
SteveAACTION: ddaa, to set up a wiki page for this meeting's agenda12:56
SteveAand write the agenda on it12:56
SteveAthat gives other an opportunity to comment whether the agenda is actually appropriate for everyone12:56
ddaalifeless: okay, I'll refrain from "does everybody agree" sort of question in the future12:56
lifelessddaa: if it needs consensus, then perhaps do this:12:57
lifeless1) assign everyone a task to review the 'thing'12:57
ddaaSteveA: well, the agenda is usually carried over from one week to the next with only minor changes12:57
lifeless2) the next week, the thing is reviewed, or not and it continues on.12:57
SteveAddaa: good.  then the wiki page will require little maintenance12:57
ddaaSteveA: okay, I see what you mean.12:58
ddaalifeless: okay12:58
spivddaa: A wiki page also gives a place to register apologies, e.g. if someone is on leave.12:58
ddaathank you everybody, sorry for being late12:59
ddaayou can now run to the reviewers meeting12:59
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SteveAhi danilos 05:32
=== carlos_ [n=carlos@222.Red-88-9-27.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #launchpad-meeting
daniloshi SteveA, carlos_05:33
SteveAhi carlos05:34
SteveAokay, let's go05:34
SteveAI was away at a conference last week05:34
SteveAso I'm a little behind the times05:34
SteveAso, first of all, carlos, please say a few things about what you've been working on this past week or so05:34
SteveAand what's coming up next05:35
SteveAdanilos: how long do you have here?05:35
danilosSteveA: well, 20 minutes or so: don't want to be late since it takes me at least 30 minutes to get to the embassy05:35
carlosLast week I did some work on translation migrations from breezy to dapper and edgy opening to be translated05:36
SteveA(I'm going to play a little dumb... will explain why shortly)05:38
SteveAcarlos: so, what's the benefit of that?05:38
carloswell, that will make us to have all translations from breezy applied to dapper05:39
carlosand also, get edgy open to translate with exactly the same status we have in dapper05:39
danilos(a guess: to help me get a feel for what is it I am actually going to be working on? :)05:39
SteveAis that done on a string-by-string basis?05:39
SteveAokay, cool05:39
SteveAso, what happens to the new messages in a POT?05:40
SteveA(that's one reason.  another is that we should all be always ready to explain *why* we're doing a particular piece of work.  and to explain it clearly.)05:40
carlosif we got a new translation for dapper, we don't change that translation, we only change the ones that are still using the translations from upstream05:40
carlosor empty ones05:40
SteveA(and carlos is doing a pretty good job at that here.)05:41
carlosthat's a workaround until we implement the TranslationReviews and MulticastTranslations specs05:41
SteveAis the migration all done?05:42
SteveAor is there still more work to do on it?05:42
danilos(ok, sounds perfectly reasonable)05:42
carlosas Andrew already stated with the preimplementation call report05:42
SteveAi'm behind on reading that email05:42
carlosSteveA: I did most of the migration already. I had a small problem with duplicate rows, but that's already fixed (talking about edgy opening)05:43
carlosSteveA: the breezy -> dapper path is only started atm05:43
carlosSteveA: yeah.05:43
SteveAare you continuing with this migration work?05:44
SteveAso, for stuff that danilo can do, I can think of three options05:44
daniloscan I chip in with some questions, or should I hold them for later?05:44
SteveA1. danilo can help you out with this05:44
SteveA2. danilo can work on some other feature05:44
SteveA3. danilo can choose some outstanding rosetta bugs to work on05:44
danilosah, ok, there you go in involving me as well05:44
SteveAI propose 3 for now05:44
carlosI think 3. is also a good start05:45
danilossounds fine to me as well05:45
SteveAdo we have time to pick off some bugs now?05:45
SteveAlike, to choose them from the list05:45
carloswe have a lot of small bugs/features to implement that could help you to understand a bit better how launchpad/rosetta works05:45
danilosI think so05:45
carlosthat's the list of bugs on Rosetta05:46
daniloswas just heading there; though, my request for account hasn't been responded to yet05:46
SteveAwhat kind of account?05:46
SteveAwhat's the RT number?05:47
danilosand email alias (not that it's that important)05:47
daniloshum, haven't received anything: maybe my email setup is broken05:47
SteveAdid you mail RT?05:47
carlosyou should get a confirmation email05:47
danilosyup, as outlined on https://wiki.canonical.com/NewStaffTasks05:48
SteveAbut, no need for chinstrap access to get started05:48
SteveAall you need is the bzr branch data05:48
carlosI could provide you a copy05:48
danilosalso, none of my mailing list subscriptions got approved yet05:48
SteveAfor example, carlos could tar up rocketfuel-built05:48
danilosah, ok, great05:48
SteveAand stick it on chinstrap's public_html05:49
danilosyeah, and I've already installed launchpad-dependencies05:49
SteveAfor you to download05:49
danilossure, that's no problem then05:49
SteveAbut do check out your email configuration05:49
carlosI think this bug would be a good start. It's quite trivial: https://launchpad.net/products/rosetta/+bug/178805:49
SteveAyou can put bug fix diffs into a pastebing05:50
SteveAon chinstrap05:50
SteveAand add that to the pending reviews page05:50
SteveAuntil you have a chinstrap accoiunt05:50
carlosdanilos: do you know the pastebin url on chinstrap?05:50
carlosdanilos: https://chinstrap.ubuntu.com/~dsilvers/paste/05:50
daniloshum, I am not yet sure what "pastebin" is?05:51
carlosdanilos: it's a kind of clipboard using the web05:51
danilosyeah, already looking at the link05:52
carlosso you can 'paste' something there and will get a URL to paste on IRC so other people can see the information you want to share05:52
carlosthat one on chinstrap is protected with a password so we can use it for confidential data05:52
SteveAI think we're sorted.  Danilo, ask on irc about anything you need in the code.05:54
danilosyeah, ok, so "pastebin" it is05:54
SteveAWe'll talk tomorrow and see how things are going.05:54
SteveAcheck that you have an RT request in for the chinstrap account05:54
danilosno problem, I'll work with carlos and #launchpad05:54
carlosdanilos: I will prepare now a tarball of rocketfuel and send you the URL to download it05:54
SteveAwhen I have the RT number, I can check how that's going with the admins05:54
danilosbtw, #launchpad-dev seems to be empty even if it's mentioned in the wiki?05:54
SteveAthat is out of date05:54
SteveAplease update the wiki page you found that on05:54
carlosdanilos: we just use #launchpad05:55
danilosRT ID #13702 (just resent it now)05:55
SteveAdanilos: you mean you send a new request05:55
SteveAand got back that RT number?05:56
danilosthe previous ones ended up without response05:56
danilosbut I changed my mail set-up, maybe that caused the problem05:56
danilosok, I'll be updating https://wiki.canonical.com/MessagingSystems and removing references to #launchpad-dev; I'll also remove the "users" bit describing "#launchpad" if that's correct?05:58
daniloswoops, I guess #launchpad is actually for users as well, and no password?05:58
SteveAand carlos, please recommend 8 bugs for danilo to do 05:58
carlosdanilos: #launchpad is for users and developers, yes05:58
carlosSteveA: ok05:59
daniloscarlos: can you also prepare a tarball for me to download once I get back from embassy?05:59
danilosor in the morning at the latest05:59
SteveAkarl said your account will be sorted pretty soon.  i expect in the next day or so.06:00
danilosSteveA: ok, thanks06:00
carlosdanilos: I'm doing it atm06:00
SteveAcool.  let's talk tomorrow and see how things are going.06:01
SteveAgood luck at the embassy, danilo06:01
danilosok, great; I am off to the embassy now, just email me to danilo@kvota.net whatever needs emailing for the time being :)06:01
carlosyeah, good luck!06:01
danilosthanks SteveA06:01
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SteveAso, I read the spec06:06
SteveAand these are good thoughts of refactoring06:07
flacostekiko and you spoke of caveats?06:07
SteveAI would point out that IDistribution shouldn't extend ITicketTarget06:07
SteveAbut, according to our current conventions, Distribution should implement both ITicketTarget and IDistribution06:08
SteveAthat's a minor point06:09
SteveAon to the other general issues06:09
SteveAlaunchpad started off using lots of components, like this06:10
SteveAand until recently, we were using this pattern in rosetta for IRosettaStats06:10
flacosteyou're talking about adapters?06:10
SteveAto experienced zope people such as you and me, using a bunch of components like this is easy to understand06:11
SteveAyes, an adapter is a kind of component06:11
SteveAbut to some of the more junior developers, and to Mark, it was confusing -- the functionality for a particular thing was split across many files, many places to look, much to understand to maintain things06:12
SteveAso, Mark refactored the code into much larger classes / units of functionality06:12
SteveAthis had a good effect, and a bad effect06:12
flacosteinteresting, this is exactly the problems I mentioned in my spec...06:13
SteveAthe good effect was that more of the developers on launchpad got to understand more of the code, so better shared ownership of all the code06:13
SteveAright -- see, complexity and amount of things to look at can be seen in different ways06:13
SteveAnumber of components / amount of responsibility per component / amount of "glue" binding the components / amount of explicit vs implicit glue06:14
SteveAso, this brings us to the situation today06:14
SteveAI think we went too far in the "big clumps of things" direction06:14
SteveAso I want us to go back in the other direction a bit06:14
SteveAbut before we do so, I want to fix a number of things about how we use Zope and the component architecture06:15
SteveAto do with defining interfaces and adapters, and hooking these things up06:15
SteveAthis is consistent with the direction of zope306:15
SteveAbut I want us to get there earlier than zope3 will06:15
flacostewhat are those number of things?06:15
SteveAwhen we have less overhead in the "glue" and in registering adapters, and defining interfaces, and doing security06:16
SteveAthen there will be less cost in dividing things into smaller units06:16
SteveAso we'll be able to afford slightly smaller units06:16
SteveAand so get some of those benefits, without the costs we'd pay today06:16
flacostei'm not familiar with the way security is hooked in launchpad, so I guess i'm not yet able to evaluate the cost of this glue06:17
SteveAthings like, for making a change in distribution:06:19
SteveA - edit interface06:19
SteveA - edit tests06:19
SteveA - edit zcml perhaps06:19
SteveA - edit security adapters perhaps06:19
SteveAor, to write a new content object06:20
SteveA - write interface06:20
SteveA  - write tests06:20
SteveA - write implementation06:20
SteveA - write zcml06:20
SteveA - write security06:20
SteveAthese things don't sound like much, but they use up too many of the "working memory slots" a person has06:21
SteveAsome people have more than others -- some people are accustomed to keeping many things on the go at once06:21
SteveAothers work much better with fewer things to keep in mind06:21
flacostehow could this list be really shortened?06:21
SteveA - write tests06:22
SteveA - write implementation06:22
SteveAand the security, interface and zcml is done unobtrusively and elegantly in the implementation06:22
flacostewith a kind of declarative API?06:23
SteveAnow, we don't need to get all the way there to make better use of adapters or better patterns for xxxxTarget stuff06:23
SteveAwe have spec targets, bug targets, support targets06:23
SteveAit is a common pattern06:23
SteveAas you point out in that spec06:24
SteveAand I think we will refactor launchpad like that06:25
SteveAbut not today. 06:25
flacosteok, message received :-)06:25
SteveAI'd like you to help me with experiments in this direction in about two weeks06:25
SteveAI have a mgt meeting in 1 week06:25
flacostethat would be my pleasure!06:25
SteveAthen the week after that a rosetta/bzr sprint06:25
SteveAthen a week in vilnius06:25
SteveAthen the lazr sprint06:25
SteveAin the week in vilnius, if there's time, we should look at this issue again06:26
SteveAand work it into the lazr plans... if I have time06:26
SteveAif not, it'l lhave to wait until after the lazr sprint06:26
flacostegreat! I'll refresh your memory on the 24th :-)06:26
SteveAok, cool06:26
SteveAit's been a learning experience for me. on launchpad, seeing the different ways people think about components06:27
SteveAand what different people find easier to maintain and understand06:27
flacosteyes, I'm quite aware that simplicity and complexity is really a function of one's background06:28
flacostethanks for the background perspective06:29
=== flacoste [n=francis@modemcable207.210-200-24.mc.videotron.ca] has left #launchpad-meeting ["Bye"]
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