[01:33] <Fujitsu> lamont, are you around?
[01:33] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: you're looking to take a merge?
[01:33] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee, I'm looking to have apt-watch rebuilt on ia64.
[01:34] <Fujitsu> And lamont is the only buildd-admin around.
[01:34] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: ah
[01:42] <infinity> Fujitsu: No he's not.
[01:42] <Fujitsu> Ah.
[01:42] <Fujitsu> I would have asked you, infinity, but you're apparently away...
[01:43] <infinity> Yes, well.  I spend most of the day at my keyboard wiht my IRC client claiming I'm away.  Lamont spends mods of the day AFK with his IRC client claiming he's around. :)
[01:43] <infinity> Anyhow, not sure what you want done about apt-build.  It's built on all arches...
[01:44] <infinity> Err, apt-watch, not apt-build.  I need to learn to read.
[01:44] <infinity> Morning.
[01:44] <zul> well...the sarcasm is dripping
[01:44] <Fujitsu> infinity, good.
[01:50] <infinity> Fujitsu: built.
[01:51] <Fujitsu> Thanks.
[01:51] <Fujitsu> And then there's the fact that hwinfo hasn't ever built on sparc... But that's due to missing kernel headers, and is long-standing.
[01:59] <Riddell> Kamion: any ideas on this welcome https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/53400
[01:59] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 53400 in ubiquity "kubuntu ubiquity crashes on hw-detect" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  
[07:18] <solid_liq> anyone know where I can get a textfile list of ubuntu/kubuntu mirrors?
[07:27] <fabbione> toma: pong
[08:13] <solid_liq> anyone know where I can get a textfile list of ubuntu/kubuntu mirrors?
[08:16] <crimsun> solid_liq: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Archive
[08:44] <solid_liq> crimsun: thank you
[08:47] <solid_liq> crimsun: no, I meant a textfile list
[08:48] <solid_liq> crimsun: I'm writing a script to automatically install all desirable software for a well configured desktop system, and I'd like it to use apt-spy to setup the sources.list as well.  I want it to be painless for someone who's never used linux before
[08:48] <solid_liq> anyone know where I can get a textfile list of ubuntu/kubuntu mirrors?
[08:49] <Kamion> I think the wiki page is the best there is, to be honest. In the installer we just use $COUNTRYCODE.archive.ubuntu.com
[08:49] <pitti> Good morning
[08:49] <Kamion> (so we haven't had the strong need to have a machine-readable list)
[08:50] <pitti> Kamion: good mornign
[08:50] <Kamion> I believe our sysadmin who handles mirror issues has some kind of machine-readable list but I don't know if he's ever exported it anywhere
[08:50] <Kamion> morning
[08:50] <pitti> Kamion: can I remind you of NEWing the vmware-kernel modules for dapper?
[08:50] <solid_liq> Kamion: do you know if there's any way I could get ahold of it?
[08:50] <Kamion> pitti: thank you, I was just about to ask you to remind me of whatever it was I'd asked you to remind me of. :-)
[08:50] <Kamion> solid_liq: ask Znarl when he's around
[08:51] <pitti> Kamion: heh :)
[08:51] <solid_liq> Kamion: or that he could be talked into exportin
[08:51] <solid_liq> k
[08:51] <solid_liq> thaks
[08:51] <solid_liq> s/thaks/thanks/
[08:51] <dholbach> good morning - HAPPY HUGDAY to everybody!
[08:52] <solid_liq> pitti: that reminds me, is there any way we could get vmware-tools apt-get installable?
[08:52] <pitti> solid_liq: no idea, I have never ever used vmware, what's the problem with that package?
[08:53] <solid_liq> pitti: you need to install vmware-tools in an OS that's running in a virtual machine, or you get severly degraded video performance and network performance isn't so great
[08:54] <Kamion> pitti: hmph, somebody newed stuff incautiously last time
[08:54] <Kamion> vmware-player-kernel-modules-2.6.15-25 | 2.6.15.10-7 | dapper-security/restricted | amd64, i386
[08:54] <Kamion> (should be multiverse)
[08:54] <Kamion> fixed, I think
[08:54] <pitti> thanks
[08:55] <solid_liq> vmware-tools is located in a .iso in the vmware-server package, so you have to d/l that, extract the gzip'd tarball, then loopback mount the iso, copy the .tar.gz off, extract that, and finally install.  It's a pain
[08:55] <solid_liq> d/l it into the vmware client that is
[08:58] <Kamion> pitti: done
[09:20] <sivang> morning
[09:20] <Burgundavia> morning sivang
[09:20] <sivang> hey Burgundavia 
[09:25] <infinity> Yes, booting is nice.
[09:25] <sivang> infinity: my thought exactly :-D
[09:25] <infinity> I'd been running a dapper kernel until yesterday.
[09:26] <sivang> hehe
[09:26] <sivang> was same here :)
[09:29] <Fujitsu> sivang, which bug is that?
[09:30] <infinity> The "BenC hates Thinkpad T43s" bug.
[09:30] <infinity> (And other SATA-PATA bridged machines)
[09:32] <infinity> pitti: Who do I whine at about hal/g-p-m bugs?  You, or dholbach?
[09:32] <dholbach> infinity: not me
[09:32] <pitti> infinity: I have zero knowledge about gpm, hal should be fine
[09:32] <infinity> dholbach: So, you then? :)
[09:32] <dholbach> infinity: mjg59, Kinnison, ogra and pitti worked on it, afaik.
[09:32] <pitti> grrr@ my ISP, I'm a thin modem wire away from being offline
[09:32] <infinity> dholbach: Kinnison's a non-option.
[09:33] <infinity> pitti: g-p-m gets battery info from hal, yes?
[09:33] <ogra> infinity, whine at me 
[09:33] <ogra> :)
[09:33] <pitti> infinity: yes
[09:33] <fabbione> hey guys
[09:33] <dholbach> infinity: i'm quite sure it's fixed in the merge/update that ogra has been preparing
[09:33] <fabbione> i found something fantastic
[09:33] <fabbione> http://www.openpegasus.org/
[09:34] <fabbione> is there anybody that would like to package it for me?
[09:34] <infinity> ogra: Oh, if this is a known bug (that g-p-m is COMPLETELY LYING about both my battery's charge level, and the state of my AC plug), then I'll just shut up.  I couldn't find the bug.
[09:34] <ogra> yes it works on 2.15 ... but thats waiting for new hal which is waitng for the knot lock 
[09:38] <simira> fabbione: sure, if you can teach me how ;p
[09:39] <fabbione> simira: that's the whole point :)
[09:41] <Kamion> fabbione: that web site is distressingly unclear about "so what the hell is it?"
[09:41] <Kamion> to somebody who does not know the acronyms
[09:41] <ogra> heh, i thought the same 
[09:41] <fabbione> Kamion: sssshhhh!!!! 
[09:41] <infinity> Kamion: It's a solution for leveraging open synergy.
[09:41] <fabbione> Kamion: don't tell everybody! that's the whole point.. somebody might need it as much as i do!
[09:42] <fabbione> Kamion: since conga B-D on it for about 2 headers
[09:42] <fabbione> Kamion: conga being another package i want to outsource.. i know exactly what it does, but it has C++, zope, python, dbus, rpm and snmp stsuff all in one...
[09:43] <Kamion> fully buzzword-compliant
[09:43] <fabbione> Kamion: conga is the new redhat cluster *web* management system
[09:43] <fabbione> you install ricci on the clients and luci on the server
[09:43] <fabbione> and you can automatically make coffee across all cluster nodes
[09:44] <Kamion> and a katie-style naming scheme to boot! bonus
[09:44] <infinity> Clustered coffee sounds like a bad idea.
[09:45] <infinity> s/bad/very bad/, no less.
[09:46] <infinity> Also, not knowing how much battery you have left is very disconcerting...
[09:46] <infinity> Oh, spiff, the battstat applet works just fine.  I'll just add one of those while I wait for g-p-m to stop sucking.
[09:48] <pitti> infinity: erm, you mean there was no battery inside? :)
[09:49] <infinity> pitti: s/how much battery/how much battery life/ ... Also, ":P"
[09:50] <seb128> infinity: what about fixing g-p-m? :)
[09:50] <fabbione> seb128: iz gtk bugz
[09:50] <infinity> seb128: Apparently, ogra's working on a big merge that covers this bug, not about to duplicate the effort.
[09:51] <seb128> infinity: not sure if that covers the bug, but new g-p-m is likely to take some time since apparently it requires policekit from hal CVS which is not packaged yet and doesn't make pitti that happy
[09:51] <ogra> infinity, seb128 i havent seen new g-p-m with the new hal yet (due to lack of new hal in ubuntu) 
[09:51] <seb128> infinity: it would be nice to get the bug fixed with current version if it takes weeks to do that
[09:52] <seb128> especially that some GNOME upstream people complain to me several times about it
[09:52] <seb128> and we would like to keep those people using Ubuntu :p
[09:52] <infinity> seb128: Sure, now you're just trying to sucker me into fixing GNOME bugs.  I see how it is.
[09:52] <seb128> hum
[09:52] <seb128> I'm not subtle enough apparently ;) 
[09:53] <infinity> I'll need to dig a bit and figure out where the heck it's getting this info FROM.
[09:53] <ogra> Kamion, Mithrandir, powerpc live is ok so far, but usplash dies half way in the shutdown process and the machine doesnt shut down after pressing enter
[09:53] <infinity> Cause it doesn't match /proc/acpi... And it doesn't match hal (which matches /proc)
[09:53] <ogra> apart from that its a go
[09:53] <infinity> It's a complete fabrication.  Woo.
[09:53] <seb128> infinity: afaik gnome-power-manager didn't change since dapper ... so something in the stack changed
[09:54] <seb128> infinity: I think it get the info from hal
[09:54] <infinity> seb128: I thought that too, but lshal has the correct info, and g-p-m is on crack.
[09:54] <infinity> seb128: Anyhow, I'll poke later if bored.
[09:54] <dholbach> i think the gnome-applets battery applet gets sane info
[09:54] <ogra> infinity, let me upload the 2.15 source for you to rookery
[09:54] <infinity> dholbach: Yes, the applet is correct.
[09:54] <infinity> dholbach: I added one as a stop-gap for now. :)
[09:55] <seb128> maybe we could lazily ping the g-p-m upstream about the issue, he might now about it and what to do to get it fixed :)
[09:55] <dholbach> he'll say it's fixed with new hal and new gpm
[09:55] <dholbach> :-p
[09:56] <infinity> Probably, yes.  Pinging people about bugs in old releases of their software tends to make them cringe.
[09:56] <ogra> sure, thats his standard answer :)
[09:56] <Kamion> ogra: ok, just make sure a bug is filed; I think we can tolerate that for knot-1
[09:56] <seb128> dholbach: you basically say upstream would not be happy to give some help, sucker
[09:56] <ogra> you will have probs pinging him anyway
[09:56] <ogra> he'
[09:56] <ogra> s moving houses
[09:56] <dholbach> seb128: no, that's not what I said
[09:56] <pitti> infinity: 'old releases'? they are talking about cvs head of hal, with a not-yet decided policy backend
[09:56] <ogra> and is on mobile dialup
[09:57] <pitti> infinity: 0.5.7 is still the latest release :(
[09:57] <infinity> pitti: If you're not living in HEAD, you're not l33t.  You've been in the free software world long enough to know THAT.
[09:57] <seb128> dholbach: it looked like upstream made some effort to include Ubuntu patches and accomodate it to work fine for dapper by example ... no reason he would not reply to that if he knows what is breaking it
[09:57] <seb128> pitti: that's not edgy enough :p
[09:58] <pitti> infinity: :) (it's not the HEADness that worries me, but the crackfulness of this PolicyShit^H^H^H^HKit
[09:58] <ogra> seb128, you are both right :) hughsie includes what he can but his standard answer is actually "that needs new hal" ;)
[09:58] <infinity> HEADness.  Heh.  Not HEADitude?  Or maybe HEADosity.
[09:58] <dholbach> seb128: ok ok ok - i  hughsie - better now? ;)
[09:58] <seb128> is that going an another "we don't like upstream and are going to make it differently and rewriting half of the world"? :)
[09:59] <pitti> seb128: I hope not
[09:59] <seb128> dholbach: if he still refuses to reply to a simple question, not really :p
[09:59] <seb128> pitti: it looks like your opinion is "policykit is crap", which basically means "I would prefer not use it" ... where everybody else is going for it apparently
[09:59] <pitti> seb128: however, the Sun people (Artem Kachitchkin) want to replace this system policy daemon with something less crackful, I hope that they'll come up with something
[10:00] <seb128> ah, you are not alone ranting on that one, good :)
[10:00] <pitti> seb128: anyway, I'll take a look and play with it, before I cannot really have a definitive yes or no
[10:00] <pitti> seb128: I just need some time for this
[10:00] <seb128> yeah, I totally understand that
[10:01] <seb128> anyway, enough discussions, better to get work done :)
[10:01] <seb128> today is bug day :)
[10:02] <Kamion> speaking of ...
[10:02] <ogra> infinity, http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/ltsp-tarballs/
[10:02] <ogra> err
[10:03] <ogra> sorry, wrong paste
[10:03] <ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/
[10:03] <ogra> has the 2.15 g-p-m
[10:03] <infinity> ogra: spiffy.
[10:04] <ogra> it wont suspend or hibernate
[10:06] <infinity> Who needs those features anyway?
[10:07] <simira> infinity: the ones of us that doesn't work 24/7
[10:08] <ogra> tell that to mdz :) i'd have uploaded it already but he wants it *working* ...
[10:08] <infinity> simira: People who don't work 24/7 are stealing from the company.  If they're not employees, then they're mocking the ideal of free software by not giving their all to make the world a better place.
[10:10] <simira> infinity: oh. I'm sorry then. My mistake.
[10:22] <simira> ^_^
[10:29] <Kamion> urgh. where's mvo when you need him? python-apt's InstallProgress is fundamentally misdesigned ...
[10:30] <dholbach> Kamion: he'll be back tomorrow afaik
[10:30] <Kamion> ah, thanks
[10:31] <Kamion> basically it's trying to throw exceptions in a subprocess
[10:31] <simira> I'd like to have a word with mvo as well, yes...
[10:31] <Kamion> which is obviously not very useful because (a) they have a nasty tendency to fire exception handlers in a process that wasn't expecting its control flow to suddenly pop out to the exception handler, (b) how do you propagate the exception to the main process?
[10:33] <Mithrandir> Kamion: does this mean we need Yet Another Rebuild or should ubiquity which is hopefully published about now be ok?
[10:34] <Kamion> no no, this bug's in dapper too, don't worry about it
[10:35] <Kamion> it's just next on my list, that's all
[10:36] <Mithrandir> oh, ok.
[10:37] <ogra> Kamion, btw, have you been serious when you said you'd jump on dexconf to get it fixed in edgy ? or did i misunderstand that ?
[10:39] <Kamion> ogra: no
[10:39] <Kamion> (I don't have time for serious dexconf hacking in edgy)
[10:39] <ogra> ok
[10:40] <ogra> (it thought so, thats why i'm asking)
[10:41] <ogra> i'd really love to add a dummy mode for ltsp that only copies an empty xorg.conf in place ... this screen probing is annoying and useless during chroot creation ...
[10:42] <Mithrandir> ogra: make ltsp put an xorg.conf there before X is installed?
[10:42] <ogra> hmm, good idea !
[10:43] <Mithrandir> iirc, xorg will then just say "whatever" and go on its merry way.
[10:43] <ogra> yep, it will
[10:43] <ogra> even touching the file should be enough ... Mithrandir you made my day ! :)
[11:10] <doko> Kamion: are promotions to main handled during the freeze?
[11:15] <Kamion> doko: sometimes
[11:16] <Kamion> preferably only if they don't touch the CD
[11:17] <doko> Kamion: libuninameslist, b-d of fontforge
[11:18] <Kamion> doko: will do after this publisher run
[11:18] <doko> thanks
[11:39] <Riddell> Kamion: should your upload this morning fix the hw-detect problem I was having?
[11:39] <Kamion> Riddell: yes
[11:39] <dholbach> happy hug day, Riddell!
[11:40] <Kamion> hw-detect plus the ubiquity upload that includes it
[11:41] <Riddell> Kamion: great, are we ready to roll some more candidate knot CDs?
[11:42] <Kamion> Riddell: Mithrandir's on it
[11:42] <Kamion> needs the publisher run that is currently in progress
[11:42] <Riddell> cool
[11:42] <Riddell> dholbach: hug day already?
[11:43] <dholbach> yeah!
[11:43] <pitti> infinity: is the publisher in manual mode? the kernel security updates should have been on the mirrors for 75 minutes now, but still aren't
[11:44] <ogra> Kamion, Mithrandir, did either of you get i386 install running ? i'm left with a black screen after gfxboot
[11:44] <Kamion> ogra: worked for me but that was in vmware
[11:44] <ogra> hmm
[11:44] <infinity> pitti: It's running right now...
[11:44] <Mithrandir> I'm rolling new livefs-es with ubiquity 1.1.2 now.
[11:45] <infinity> pitti: Though I don't recall seeing kernel stuff in the output.
[11:45] <Kamion> ogra: hold down shift to try the failsafe mode
[11:45] <ogra> hum, it hunng completely ... not even capslock ...
[11:45] <pitti> infinity: I got the security lp_archive mail > 2 hours ago, and it didn't indicate any problem; strange...
[11:46] <ogra> ah, ok, in vga moide i get an apic error ... its the i386 kernel not liking my turion
[11:47] <Kamion> oh, you mean gfxboot displays fine?
[11:47] <Kamion> but after it the kernel falls over?
[11:47] <Mithrandir> Kamion: did we need new alternate CDs?
[11:47] <Kamion> Mithrandir: yes, for apt-setup
[11:47] <Mithrandir> Kamion: I'll go make those, then
[11:47] <Kamion> sounds good
[11:47] <infinity> pitti: Random package name and version?
[11:48] <infinity> pitti: 2.6.15-26.45?
[11:48] <pitti> infinity: linux-source-2.6.10_2.6.10-34.22.dsc and linux-source-2.6.12_2.6.12-10.36.dsc
[11:48] <pitti> infinity: no, I released the dapper update yesterday already
[11:48] <infinity> Oh, hoary and breezy..
[11:48] <pitti> infinity: (since this is an 'OMG, the sky is falling' hole)
[11:51] <Kamion> doko: please file sync and removal requests separately
[11:52] <infinity> pitti: Upload failed.  Unsure why.
[11:52] <Kamion> doko: because sync requests can be processed at any time but removal requests can only (AFAIK) be safely processed while the publisher is not running
[11:52] <Kamion> so it's not convenient to have both glommed together in one bug
[11:52] <infinity> pitti: I'll poke it back through and see...
[11:52] <pitti> infinity: hm; I uploaded them manually since my network connection crashed while running amber
[11:52] <pitti> infinity: thanks
[11:53] <pitti> infinity: (and yes, most often I use screen, but I forgot it this morning...)
[11:55] <pitti> infinity: hm, I'm also missing  openoffice.org2_1.9.129-0.1ubuntu4.1.dsc (and this was ambered normally)
[11:55] <doko> Kamion: done
[11:57] <infinity> pitti: You forgot to upload the udebs.
[11:58] <infinity> pitti: As for OOo, it's in this publisher run.
[11:58] <pitti> infinity: oh, I see; thank you
[11:58] <Mithrandir> ok, new (20060719) alternate images built.  Now test!
[11:59] <ogra_> Kamion, Mithrandir, all fine, i had to boot with nolapic, now it works fine 
[12:00] <Mithrandir> Kamion: is {k,edu}buntu also affected by the apt-setup problem?
[12:01] <Riddell> Mithrandir: yes
[12:01] <ogra_> apt-setup problem ? 
[12:01] <ogra_> is that ubiquity ? 
[12:01] <Mithrandir> Riddell: I'll build you new ISOs unless you already have done that, then.
[12:01] <Riddell> Mithrandir: please do
[12:01] <Mithrandir> ogra_: no.
[12:02] <ogra_> hmm, what are the symptoms ? all my installs seems to be fine 
[12:02] <Mithrandir> ogra_: apparently, apt-setup wrote botched (or half) sources.list files.
[12:02] <ogra_> oh, ok 
[12:02] <ogra_> i didnt check that :)
[12:03] <ogra_> wow, portmap with a borked network config takes more than 10 mins to install ...
[12:03] <ogra_> when was that netstat stuff added to the postinst ? seems thats holding it up ...
[12:05] <ogra_> ah, now it moved on ...
[12:07] <Kamion> ogra_: both d-i and ubiquity
[12:07] <Kamion> it's not the fault of ubiquity, but it happens in ubiquity
[12:22] <Mithrandir> ogra: so, you need a rebuild or not?
[12:23] <ogra> Mithrandir, still installing, but if it affects all installs i assume yes ...
[12:24] <ogra> even though i'm not sure we should delay knot 1 for another build for this
[12:24] <ogra> its something we could note under known issues
[12:24] <ogra> i mean, heya, its the first *beta* release ... doesnt need to be perfect ...
[12:25] <Mithrandir> ogra: well, ubuntu and kubuntu are rebuilt, but if you'd want to just put it under known issues for edubuntu, that's your choice.
[12:25] <ogra> nah, if you already rebuilt the others i wannt to stay in sync 
[12:25] <Mithrandir> ok, edubuntu building, then.
[12:25] <ogra> i'll care for the isos ... 
[12:25] <Mithrandir> ogra: too late.
[12:25] <ogra> heh
[12:25] <ogra> ok
[12:26] <Mithrandir> I had the command ready already. :-P
[12:26] <ogra> i dont want to cause more work than needed for you :)
[12:26] <Mithrandir> Riddell: kubuntu alternate rebuild finished, please test.
[12:26] <Mithrandir> ogra: rebuilding cds is trivial, it was just s/k/edu/ in my previous command
[12:27] <ogra> i know, thats why i dont want to bnother you with such trivial tasks ;)
[12:29] <tuck3r> I'm building a ubuntu server CD for ipbxs, i can't get the md5sum.txt file to generate right any idea on how to do it right? sorry if i bothered you, just not sure if this falls under "support"
[12:30] <Mithrandir> tuck3r: find -print0 | xargs -0 md5sum > md5sum.txt doesn't give you the right output?
[12:31] <tuck3r> thats not exactly what i was doing but close, let me try it
[12:33] <Riddell> Mithrandir: thanks, are live CDs also coming?
[12:34] <Mithrandir> Riddell: yeah, building ubuntu livefs-es now.  I'll do kubuntu ones when they're finished.
[12:34] <Kamion> ogra: although I'm generally for not putting too much effort into the first milestone, I think generating a sources.list for everyone that doesn't even have archive.ubuntu.com edgy in it is pretty crap and should be avoided.
[12:34] <ogra> bah ... the installer didnt take my nolapic over to grup ...
[12:34] <Kamion> Mithrandir: will you do xubuntu too?
[12:35] <ogra> *grub
[12:35] <Kamion> ogra: did you put it after -- on the boot line?
[12:35] <ogra> yes
[12:35] <Mithrandir> Kamion: yeah, Jani mailed me and asked me to.
[12:35] <ogra> after quiet even ...
[12:35] <Kamion> ogra: after -- too?
[12:35] <ogra> yes, isnt that before splash quiet ? 
[12:35] <Kamion> (-- is after quiet already)
[12:35] <Kamion> ogra: no!
[12:35] <ogra> i've put it at the end of the line
[12:35] <ogra> so i assume it was after --
[12:36] <Kamion> any parameters you want to have carried over to grub must come after --
[12:36] <ogra> hmm
[12:36] <ogra> i'll check that with the next install
[12:36] <Kamion> you seem unclear, but if you can ensure that you really put nolapic after --, please file a grub-installer bug
[12:36] <Kamion> APPEND $KERNEL_PARAMS $DEFAULT_PRESEED boot=casper initrd=/casper/initrd.gz ramdisk_size=1048576 root=/dev/ram rw quiet splash --
[12:36] <ogra> yup, if i've verfied it ... 
[12:36] <Kamion> ^-- default boot line
[12:37] <Kamion> hmm, if only I had a brain; we could drop a bunch of *-installer modifications just by putting 'quiet splash' after --, I suspect
[12:37] <ogra> i *think* ive put it at the end ... but i'm not sure anymore ... luckily we have to do another install :)
[12:37] <siretart> sry
[12:39] <tuck3r> Mithrandir: using your command i still get an error at ./isoboot/boot.cat when i run a check for defects 
[12:39] <Mithrandir> ogra: edubuntu install cds done
[12:39] <Mithrandir> tuck3r: rm boot.cat, it's written by mkisofs.
[12:56] <tuck3r> Mithrandir: that fixed it thanks, now it fails on md5sum.txt, do i have to change it by hand with the new md5sum of itself?
[12:57] <Mithrandir> tuck3r: or just do find -not -name md5sum.txt -print0 | xargs -0 md5sum > md5sum.txt
[01:02] <Mithrandir> new ubuntu -desktop up, please test.
[01:02] <Mithrandir> at least once cdimage is done rsync-ing
[01:08] <pitti> Mithrandir:  20060719?
[01:10] <Mithrandir> pitti: yes, both -desktop and -alternate is 20060719
[01:10] <pitti> ok, thanks for confirming
[01:13] <Mithrandir> ogra: do you need new livefs-es?
[01:13] <ogra> Mithrandir, if there are none with the ubiquity fix, then yes
[01:14] <Mithrandir> ogra: building, then
[01:14] <ogra> thanks
[01:15] <tuck3r> Mithrandir: well all the md5 checks are fixed but when i go to install it i get "Warning: file://cdrom/dists/dapper/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz" i'm think this has to do with my apt-ftparchive conf files
[01:16] <Kamion> you need to update /dists/dapper/Release
[01:17] <tuck3r> oh forget that command :( thanks
[01:24] <pitti> hello mdz
[01:24] <mdz> morning
[01:25] <ogra_> hey mdz 
[01:25] <ogra_> not melted yet ?
[01:25] <mdz> mjg59: if S05vbesave runs, my system hangs during gdm startup.  if I disable it, all is well.  if I run it after X has started, all is also well
[01:25] <mdz> no, it is not as hot here as it was in LA
[01:26] <ogra_> well, its hot as hell in germany atm ...
[01:29] <mdz> it was 43C when I left LA
[01:30] <ogra_> woah
[01:30] <ogra_> ok, thats warmer than the 35 i have here atm
[01:31] <thom> 42 is just excessive
[01:31] <ogra_> yeah
[01:31] <ogra_> 35 is still nice if you have a cool place to sit outside 
[01:32] <tuck3r> well after regenerating /dists/dapper/Release it says "Failed to copy file from CD-ROM. Retry?" at load installer components from cd
[01:32] <zul> hi
[01:33] <mdz> 35 != hot as hell
[01:35] <ogra_> mdz, well, depends on your definition of hell :P
[01:35] <mdz> depends on the relative humidity actually ;-)
[01:35] <ogra_> more than 30 in germany is *hot*
[01:36] <ogra_> heh, right, you're on the seaside additionally ... :)
[01:37] <mdz> it has cooled off some since I left
[01:37] <mdz> will be back up to 39 or so by friday though, according to forecasts
[01:38] <ogra_> so you dont stay in europe until wiesbaden ? 
[01:39] <Mithrandir> ogra: I think mdz is trying to find out. :-P
[01:39] <ogra_> heh
[01:40] <rodarvus> Wiesbaden is one month from now - quite bearable :)
[01:41] <tseng> ogra_: ask Nat Friedman
[01:41] <ogra_> heh
[01:41] <ogra_> well, he lives in planes, doesnt he ? 
[01:41] <tseng> yes
[01:43] <Arbiter> uhm... i have a question: what are default CFLAGS used by buildd for x86?
[01:43] <Kamion> mdz: the problem with UK summers is not their heat but our complete national lack of preparedness for them (i.e. no widespread aircon)
[01:44] <Arbiter> (and LDFLAGS, CXXFLAGS, if possible)
[01:44] <Kamion> pretty much corresponds to our total lack of preparedness for UK winters, in fact (more than an inch or two of snow)
[01:44] <tseng> Kamion: there was a widespread *lack* of aircondition in Spain
[01:44] <Kamion> Arbiter: the buildd doesn't force anything; it's just whatever the package uses, and then gcc's defaults
[01:44] <Kamion> which you can find in the gcc specs file on your own system
[01:44] <Arbiter> so, 486 optimizations?
[01:45] <Arbiter> o.O
[01:45] <tuck3r> do you have a 486?
[01:45] <tseng> -march=486 -mcpu=pentium4 atm.
[01:45] <mjg59> mdz: Have you recently changed hardware?
[01:45] <Arbiter> mh...
[01:45] <tseng> but dont get caught up in it.
[01:45] <Kamion> Arbiter: I see you have not checked gcc's default
[01:45] <Kamion> s
[01:46] <Arbiter> Kamion, nope :D
[01:46] <Kamion> gcc -dumpspecs
[01:46] <tseng> dumpspecs is pretty opaque
[01:47] <Kamion> mm, true
[01:47] <Arbiter> heh
[01:47] <tseng> not that there is any better way of looking at it..
[01:48] <Arbiter> thanks anyway :)
[01:49] <Kamion> Arbiter: anyway, failing the above, apt-get source gcc-4.1 and look at debian/rules2
[01:50] <Arbiter> sure
[01:50] <Kamion> which is pretty much where the default optimisation configure arguments live
[01:55] <Kamion> doko: promoted libuninameslist
[01:55] <Mithrandir> ogra: nothing in particular
[01:55] <Kamion> ogra_: it probably has the squashfs sorting now
[01:55] <ogra_> aha
[01:55] <Mithrandir> Kamion: it's a null sortfile, though..
[01:55] <Kamion> unless I'm mistaken and that was in earlier
[01:55] <Kamion> Mithrandir: oh, ok
[02:01] <stub> Launchpad will be going down in 15 minutes for some brief unscheduled maintenance. Downtime will be approx five minutes.
[02:14] <ogra_> bah, now i know why its so slow 
[02:16] <ogra_> yep, driven with USB 2.0 this disk is a lot faster :)
[02:18] <Mithrandir> Riddell: kubuntu -desktop ready to test
[02:19] <Riddell> thanks
[02:20] <pitti> argh, cdrecord was merged from Debian, now it doesn't work as user any more
[02:20] <ogra_> oh fun
[02:20] <pitti> did anyone else notice that? 'Operation not permitted. Cannot send SCSI cmd via ioctl'
[02:21] <ogra_> i just burned from a knot 1 test install ... worked fine with n-c-b
[02:21] <ogra_> but i have an ide writer
[02:22] <pitti> ogra_: doesn't matter, ATAPI is SCSI protocol over IDE bus
[02:22] <ogra_> yep
[02:23] <pitti> carlos: what's the status of edgy langpacks?
[02:35] <ogra_> pitti, burning is working flawless here with 4:2.01+01a03-5ubuntu1
[02:35] <ogra_> i'm just running another one 
[02:35] <pitti> ogra_: which arch?
[02:35] <Viper550> Good news for those people watching over the Slab specification...
[02:36] <ogra_> pitti, i386 running on y turion laptop
[02:36] <ogra_> s/y/a
[02:36] <pitti> ogra_: ok, I'm on amd64
[02:36] <ogra_> the test install i talked about before was amd64
[02:37] <maswan> pitti: Am I supposed to find a difference between the two mails for USN-319-1? They seem to be talking about the same version for dapper, etc, etc.
[02:37] <Viper550> I've got an APT repository now!
[02:38] <pitti> maswan: two mails for USN-319-1?
[02:38] <pitti> maswan: sure that you don't mean USN-319-2?
[02:38] <maswan> pitti: I just got a USN-319-1 Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2006 11:13:52 +0200
[02:39] <pitti> ok, that's the dapper update from yesterday
[02:39] <pitti> maswan: and some minutes ago I released USN-319-2 for the breezy/hoary fixes
[02:39] <maswan> huh.
[02:39] <zul> hey
[02:39] <pitti> maswan: I didn't want to wait for dapper since this was somewhat critical
[02:39] <ogra_> Viper550, thats better suited for #ubuntu-motu than here :)
[02:39] <pitti> maswan: s/for/with/
[02:39] <maswan> pitti: Yes, I was just surprised, since I got that yesterday too.,
[02:40] <maswan> Oh, well. Now I got -2 too. So never mind, I'll try to look at the mails to see if I find where the duplicate spent a day in hiding. :)
[02:40] <Mithrandir> ogra: edubuntu -desktop done too
[02:40] <pitti> seb128, Mithrandir: on current ppc/live, I get half a thousand error dialogs about 'The panel encountered a problem while loading $someapplet'
[02:40] <Mithrandir> pitti: hmm, does dmesg show read errors?
[02:40] <ogra_> Mithrandir, ta !
[02:41] <ogra_> pitti, hmm, i didnt have that with the last live test here 
[02:41] <pitti> Mithrandir, seb128: and a single additional one about nautilus not being able to start
[02:42] <pitti> Mithrandir: yes, some familiar-looking buffer i/o errors on the cd-rom
[02:42] <pitti> Mithrandir: ok, I'll check CD integrity first (would be a strange coincidence, but let's be sure)
[02:42] <Fujitsu> maswan, I've got two USN-319-1s as well. One signed, the other not.
[02:42] <maswan> Huh, looks like securityfocus.com resent it, or something.
[02:43] <pitti> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-security-announce/2006-July/thread.html only has one
[02:43] <pitti> and I'm quite sure I only approved one mail
[02:43] <Mithrandir> pitti: fwiw, I can't see it on amd64 or i386 so I'm tempted to blame dodgy media or such as a first approximation.
[02:43] <pitti> yes, may be a bounce from bugtraq or full-disclosure
[02:43] <pitti> Mithrandir: I'll find out
[02:44] <ogra_> i'll do a ppc live test once the currently running install is done
[02:44] <maswan> pitti: Yes, bugtraq, just found a Delivered-To: mailing list bugtraq@securityfocus.com
[02:44] <ogra_> pitti, did your suspend lamp also turn into a HDD indicator on the ibook ?
[02:45] <pitti> ogra_: oh, I didn't pay attention to that; probably
[02:45] <pitti> ogra_: that's what MacOS uses it for (but I prefered the glowing effect while suspending)
[02:45] <ogra_> pretty annoying (says my GF who cant sleep with it in the bedroom anymore because its flashing all the time)
[02:46] <ogra_> i personally like the idea of having a HDD indicator though ... but i'd prefer it being a panel applet or something like that :)
[02:46] <seb128> pitti: weird your applets issue, let's blame the CD for now :)
[02:48] <seb128> too much heat
[02:48] <seb128> I want the winter and some snow :p
[02:48] <ogra_> bah
[02:48] <ogra_> whiners
[02:49] <pitti> meh, CD integrity check succeeded
[02:49] <seb128> pitti: the usual issue when applet don't start is gnome-applets not being installed :)
[02:50] <pitti> seb128: it was, I checked
[02:50] <ogra_> icon issues ?
[02:50] <seb128> pitti: try running /usr/lib/gnome-applets/mixer_applet2 from the command line and add it then to the panel
[02:50] <pitti> ogra_: the desktop issues are most likely a consequence of the read errors
[02:50] <seb128> pitti: you mioht get some errors on the command line ...
[02:50] <pitti> right
[02:50] <ogra_> pitti, yeah
[02:51] <tfheen_live> \o/
[02:51] <ogra_> gah, this portmap postinst is evil ...
[02:51] <Robot101> <o/
[02:51] <tfheen_live> i386 and amd64 -desktop are good to go.
[02:52] <tfheen_live> now I just need to test the alternate ones.. but that's quicker.
[02:52] <pitti> odd, alternate installs take much longer here
[02:52] <ogra_> for me as well
[02:53] <ogra_> but thats because i install 300 MB ltsp-client :)
[02:53] <pitti> copying a live system is just so much faster than copying .debs to the hd and unpacking/installing them...
[02:53] <ogra_> yeah
[02:53] <ogra_> i whish i could use the liveCD for edubuntu installs
[02:54] <Zomb> pitti: not much faster, depends on the harddisk
[02:54] <Mithrandir> pitti: depends on your hardware.
[02:54] <Zomb> and filesystem and ram, of course
[02:54] <Mithrandir> and cpu
[02:55] <Kamion> the live CD method's faster on reasonably modern systems with adequate RAM so that it doesn't swap all the time, and not-hideously-slow disks
[02:55] <pitti> seb128: ok, if I run mixer_applet2 in a shell, it just sits there and nothing happens (no icon etc.)
[02:55] <Kamion> on more constrained systems, traditional installation can certainly be faster
[02:55] <seb128> pitti: that's expected, you need to add it to the panel then
[02:56] <seb128> pitti: that's sort of the server part waiting for a client :)
[02:56] <pitti> argh, what happened to middle/right mouse button emulation?
[02:56] <ogra_> whoops, why did i get the http proxy question now ?
[02:56] <Kamion> ogra_: changes in choose-mirror
[02:56] <Kamion> ignore it for now, may or may not stay there
[02:56] <ogra_> ah, k
[02:57] <Kamion> also your other installs were before my apt-setup fix, right?
[02:57] <ogra_> yep
[02:57] <Kamion> there you go then
[02:57] <ogra_> :)
[02:57] <Kamion> the apt-setup bug prevented choose-mirror from running
[02:57] <seb128> pitti: shift-f10 with focus on the panel?
[02:57] <ogra_> ah
[02:57] <pitti> seb128: ok, that works, but that's not mouse emulation :) (thanks, though)
[02:58] <seb128> dunno about the mouse, looks like xorg material to me :)
[02:58] <ogra_> pitti, thats broken since 2.6.17
[02:58] <pitti> ok, somebody dropped the emulation stuff from /etc/sysctl.conf
[02:58] <pitti> not a big deal to fix
[02:58] <ogra_> ah
[02:58] <ogra_> i was digging at the kernel before and didnt find anything :)
[02:59] <pitti> seb128: meh, shift-F10 on the panel gives me the gnome-terminal menu
[02:59] <Kamion> hmm, I wonder where my middle/right-click mappings are coming from
[02:59] <seb128> pitti: because the focus is on the g-t launcher :)
[03:00] <Kamion> oh, perhaps I haven't rebooted since the last procps upgrade
[03:00] <pitti> seb128: and if I minimize g-t, s-f10 doesn't do anything
[03:00] <pitti> Kamion: my /etc/sysctl.conf has no emulation on the live system, how about your's?
[03:00] <seb128> pitti: ctrl-alt-tab
[03:00] <Kamion> pitti: you assume my system can manage to read CDs
[03:00] <seb128> pitti: go on the panel with that and do shift-f10 then
[03:01] <ogra_> Kamion, dont you have a usb drive ? 
[03:01] <Kamion> ogra_: no
[03:01] <pitti> seb128: I did, that only selects the 'exit' icon
[03:01] <pitti> darn
[03:01] <ogra_> sad then ...
[03:01] <seb128> pitti: try with the bottom panel maybe :)
[03:02] <pitti> ok, here we are - proper 3-button mouse :)
[03:02] <seb128> pitti: ups, ctrl-f10 rather
[03:02] <seb128> too late :p
[03:02] <seb128> pitti: ctrl-f10 should work (for next time)
[03:02] <pitti> seb128: no mixer applet in the 'add to panel' dialog; and surprisingly few apps in total there (well, related to the initial failure, I guess)
[03:02] <seb128> pitti: are you sure gnome-applets-data is installed?
[03:03] <pitti> seb128: affirmative
[03:03] <Kamion> pitti: alt-f1, start terminal, 'sudo sysctl dev/mac_hid/mouse_button_emulation=1', 'sudo sysctl dev/mac_hid/mouse_button2_keycode=87', 'sudo sysctl dev/mac_hid/mouse_button3_keycode=88'
[03:03] <seb128> pitti: you have a /usr/lib/bonobo/servers/GNOME_MixerApplet.server ?
[03:03] <Kamion> er sysctl -w for all of those
[03:03] <pitti> seb128: I do, and it looks sane
[03:04] <seb128> pitti: weird then ... nothing to .xsession-errors about bonobo or the panel?
[03:04] <seb128> pitti: does bonobo-browser works fine?
[03:04] <pitti> seb128: failed to load applet OAFIID:GNOME_MixerApplet: Moniker has an unknown moniker prefix
[03:05] <pitti> ah, I knew that Monica was to blame
[03:05] <seb128> hehe
[03:05] <ogra_> mjg59, ping
[03:05] <mjg59> ogra_: Hi
[03:05] <ogra_> mjg59, would you mind commenting on http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=347855
[03:05] <pitti> seb128: where is bonobo-browser?
[03:05] <seb128> pitti: what version of libbonobo-0 do you have on that CD?
[03:05] <Ubugtu> Gnome bug 347855 in general "Pressing brightness keys on laptops wakes up the screensaver" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  
[03:05] <ogra_> i attached your patch to it ...
[03:06] <seb128> pitti: libbonobo2-0 rather
[03:06] <pitti> seb128: 2.15.0-0ubuntu2
[03:06] <seb128> libbonoboui2-dev: /usr/bin/bonobo-browser
[03:06] <pitti> (to install the -dev)
[03:08] <pitti> seb128: aarrgh, that wants to pull a million packages
[03:08] <pitti> seb128: any easier way of debugging this than with libbonoboui2-dev? (if not, I'll install it)
[03:08] <mjg59> ogra_: Done
[03:09] <seb128> pitti: you just the binary, dpkg-deb -x the .deb if required
[03:09] <ogra_> mjg59, thanks a lot 
[03:09] <seb128> you just need the binary
[03:09] <mjg59> ogra_: At least, it would be if bugzilla were responding
[03:09] <mjg59> It seems to have gone very slow
[03:09] <seb128> pitti: it's to the -dev to no ship a binary with the lib and not create a -bin
[03:09] <ogra_> mjg59, i'm trying to work towards a patch free g-s-s in edgy :)
[03:09] <ogra_> mjg59, yeah, i think they are just moving to a new machine ...
[03:10] <pitti> seb128: oooh, wait
[03:10] <seb128> ?
[03:10] <pitti> seb128: 'date' says 1 Jan 1904
[03:10] <seb128> ah
[03:10] <ogra_> heh
[03:10] <seb128> bonobo hates that
[03:10] <pitti> seb128: my laptop ran out of power during the last days
[03:10] <seb128> that is a known issue
[03:10] <pitti> ok
[03:11] <pitti> seb128: sorry for the noise then
[03:11] <pitti> seb128: I had no clock applet to notice ;)
[03:11] <seb128> np ;)
[03:11] <ogra_> heh, we're so addicted to our desktop :)
[03:12] <pitti> so, bonobo says 'hey, in 1904 computers weren't invented yet, therefore I fell into the hands of some evil alien time travellers and so I refuse cooperation'
[03:12] <Mithrandir> Kamion: uh, alternate i386 fails here.  base-installer complains about dmsetup not found [: crypt: unknown operand, etc.
[03:12] <Mithrandir> Kamion: (nuke disk + LVM install)
[03:13] <carlos> pitti: I just found a way a small problem with tests that delayed me a bit the code that will open edgy will be ready to be reviewed today
[03:14] <seb128> pitti: something like that ;)
[03:17] <Kamion> Mithrandir: will be LVM-specific
[03:18] <Mithrandir> Kamion: ok, retrying with regular now.
[03:19] <Kamion> wonder why dmsetup-udeb isn't installed
[03:19] <pitti_live> Mithrandir, seb128: ok, works fine now
[03:20] <seb128> pitti_live: good
[03:22] <pitti_live> doko: OO.o doesn't start on ppc live; 'javadlx: relocation error: /usr/lib/libstlport_gcc.so.4.6: symbol logl, version GLIBCXX_3.4, not defined in file libstdc++.so.6 with link time reference'
[03:22] <pitti_live> doko: any idea?
[03:24] <pitti_live> Mithrandir, Kamion: my locale is en_US.UTF-8, although I chose German in gfxboot; know issue or do you want a bug?
[03:24] <Mithrandir> pitti_live: not known issue, please file a bug (on casper)
[03:24] <Kamion> pitti_live: what's in /proc/cmdline?
[03:24] <Kamion> oh, I bet I know
[03:24] <Kamion> Mithrandir: gfxboot-theme-ubuntu changed to use locale= instead of debian-installer/locale=, which is the new preferred syntax for d-i - but I forgot that casper would need to be changed too
[03:25] <Kamion> sorry about that
[03:25] <Mithrandir> Kamion: np; just file a bug.
[03:26] <pitti_live> Kamion: right, 'locale=de'
[03:26] <doko> pitti_live: no build on edgy yet. and it currently FTBFS
[03:26] <pitti_live> doko: ok, that sounds as if it would sort itself out then after it's built
[03:26] <Kamion> filed
[03:30] <ogra_> pitti_live, can you check if your CD shuts down properly ? i had problems with it ...
[03:30] <Kamion> Mithrandir: base-installer fix committed upstream; do you want to rebuild with it?
[03:30] <pitti_live> ogra_: ok, after the ubiquity installs finish
[03:30] <Kamion> or just errata it?
[03:30] <Mithrandir> Kamion: nah, I'll put it in as a known problem.
[03:30] <Mithrandir> Kamion: I want to get this CD out now.  Bored.
[03:30] <Mithrandir> ogra_: usplash quits and you're sent to the wrong terminal so casper reads from the wrong tty.
[03:31] <Kamion> Mithrandir: nod
[03:31] <pitti_live> Mithrandir: do you want to wait for my ppc ubiquity test or just push it out now?
[03:31] <ogra_> Mithrandir, ah, so thats a known one ... great
[03:31] <Kamion> Mithrandir: workaround is to boot with anna/choose_modules=dmsetup-udeb if you want to do an LVM install
[03:31] <pitti_live> (I am doing an amd64 ubiquity test ATM, too)
[03:31] <Kamion> (I'm guessing, anyway)
[03:31] <Mithrandir> pitti_live: I'm doing i386 alternate test and then I'll do amd64 alternate and then we'll release, if nobody complains.
[03:31] <Mithrandir> ogra_: how's edubuntu looking?
[03:32] <Mithrandir> Riddell: how's kubuntu looking wrt knot-1?
[03:32] <Mithrandir> Kamion: it's probably not important.  Better to get this out.
[03:32] <Mithrandir> pitti_live: so I'll wait for your.
[03:32] <Mithrandir> -r
[03:32] <ogra_> Mithrandir, last run was all fine ... i'm just statring pc live ... and have all intel/amd64 ones ahead ...
[03:32] <ogra_> *ppc
[03:32] <ogra_> i dot expect regressions, so it should be fine to go
[03:35] <Riddell> Mithrandir: i386/powerpc alternate good, i386 desktop good, others progressing
[03:36] <pitti_live> Kamion: ppc/ubiquity complains about not finding a bootstrap partition, although there is one; I'll try to continue
[03:36] <Mithrandir> Riddell: thanks.  Do you have anybody testing amd64?
[03:36] <Mithrandir> Riddell: and do you have an ETA on when you'll give me thumbs up or down?
[03:36] <Kamion> pitti_live: yeah, known from dapper too
[03:36] <Kamion> see DapperReleaseNotes/UbiquityKnownIssues for a discussion of that
[03:36] <Kamion> I'll try to get it fixed soon
[03:37] <pitti_live> ok, thank you
[03:37] <pitti_live> (just making sure we have recorded all bugs)
[03:39] <pitti_live> G0SUB: ping
[03:42] <Mithrandir> pitti_live: ooo keeps crashing on i386 here too
[03:42] <pitti_live> Mithrandir: hm, works fine on amd64/live here
[03:43] <Riddell> Mithrandir: I'm doing amd64, but it has my CD burner on it so it gets done last
[03:43] <Mithrandir> pitti_live: amd64 rocks, you know. :-)
[03:43] <Mithrandir> Riddell: ah, ok.
[03:43] <Riddell> Mithrandir: kubuntu live amd64 and powerpc also good
[03:44] <Mithrandir> Riddell: so amd64 alternate is the only one left?
[03:44] <pitti_live> moin Keybuk
[03:44] <Riddell> Mithrandir: yes, doing now
[03:44] <Keybuk> pitti_live: afternoon
[03:45] <ogra> Mithrandir, edubuntu ppc all good ... going for amd64 now
[03:45] <ogra> err, intresting 
[03:46] <ogra> this time shutdown worked fine
[03:46] <ogra> (on ppc live)
[03:54] <pitti> Mithrandir: amd64/live hangs after ejecting the CD (Enter doesn't reboot), but apart from that and the already discussed locale issue live system and ubiquity worked fine for me
[03:55] <Mithrandir> pitti: it reboots if you press alt-f8 and then press enter
[03:57] <pitti> ah
[03:58] <Hobbsee> hi pitti, Mithrandir 
[03:59] <pitti> hey Hobbsee 
[04:00] <Mithrandir> hiya Hobbsee
[04:00] <ogra> hey Hobbsee 
[04:01] <Hobbsee> hi ogra 
[04:01] <Hobbsee> what did i do with my kopete and amarok stuff?
[04:01] <Hobbsee> oh, they're on revu, that's all right.
[04:01] <ogra> no idea ... one starts with K the other ends with K :) 
[04:01] <Hobbsee> ogra: heh, how useful :P
[04:02] <Hobbsee> ogra: for that, i'll poke you to upload them when the freeze ends
[04:02] <Hobbsee> and then we have less buggered armarok and kopete packages :)
[04:02] <ogra> hehe, good ...
[04:02] <ogra> (even i never used either) 
[04:02] <ogra> but feel free to bug me for uploadng 
[04:02] <Hobbsee> ogra: true.  do you trust my upload though?
[04:02] <ogra> sure 
[04:03] <Hobbsee> :)
[04:05] <pitti> ogra: ppc CD shut down fine here
[04:05] <ogra> yes, intrestingly for me too this time 
[04:05] <gnomefreak> Hobbsee: good luck ive been wondering that for a while now
[04:05] <Hobbsee> gnomefreak: seems they're different.
[04:06] <gnomefreak> im sure its something like super can do things the other one cant
[04:07] <Hobbsee> ogra_ibook: 1build1 goes to 1ubuntu1, doesnt it?
[04:07] <pitti> Mithrandir: ppc live and ubiquity worked fine (apart from discussed issues)
[04:10] <Mithrandir> pitti: thanks.
[04:20] <Kamion> Hobbsee: yes
[04:20] <Hobbsee> Kamion: cool, thanks.
[04:20] <Hobbsee> well, i know why, but it's still annoying.
[04:24] <Kamion> Hobbsee: why is it annoying?
[04:24] <Hobbsee> Kamion: because it requires me to remember how it changes?
[04:27] <Kamion> damn, installation in languages whose default country's name contains a comma will fail
[04:28] <Kamion> due to a bashism in the localechooser build (echo -n, whee)
[04:35] <fooforyou> hi
[04:36] <infinity> Kamion: Countries with commas in the name don't deserve free software, just by virtue of their silly naming scheme.
[04:36] <chrisjr> pfft
[04:36] <chrisjr> what country has a comma in its name?
[04:36] <Riddell> Mithrandir: all Kubuntu CDs good to go
[04:37] <infinity> chrisjr: Several, actually.
[04:37] <chrisjr> why should this conflict for their getting free software?
[04:37] <chrisjr> s/for/with/g
[04:37] <infinity> chrisjr: It was a joke, you're lacking context. :)
[04:37] <infinity> 08:27 < Kamion> damn, installation in languages whose default country's name contains a comma will 
[04:37] <chrisjr> figure as much :)
[04:37] <infinity>                 fail
[04:37] <infinity> 08:28 < Kamion> due to a bashism in the localechooser build (echo -n, whee)
[04:38] <chrisjr> heh
[04:38] <Kamion> chrisjr: "Iran, Islamic Republic of"
[04:38] <Kamion> chrisjr: "Moldova, Republic of"
[04:38] <Kamion> etc.
[04:39] <chrisjr> gotcha
[04:39] <chrisjr> just cant think of where that would come up
[04:39] <Kamion> localechooser due to a bashism
[04:39] <Kamion> commas need to be \-escaped in debconf choices lists
[04:39] <chrisjr> ive done a lot of preseeding, etc and never had problems that would break with that
[04:39] <chrisjr> yeah
[04:39] <Kamion> I'm one of the debconf maintainers and I've had lots of problems due to that. :-)
[04:39] <chrisjr> i see
[04:39] <ogra> hmm, so $(echo blah|grep blupp) isnt a bashism, but if i add .n it is ?
[04:39] <ogra> errr
[04:39] <chrisjr> i sure do use lots of debconf
[04:39] <ogra> -n
[04:40] <Kamion> ogra: http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/009695399/utilities/echo.html
[04:40] <ogra> yes yes ..
[04:40] <Kamion> "If the first operand is -n, or if any of the operands contain a backslash ( '\' ) character, the results are implementation-defined."
[04:40] <chrisjr> i have been working on an easy to set up server type install, http://suriyan.org
[04:40] <infinity> Technically, I believe "echo -n" is a "undefined XSIism"...
[04:40] <chrisjr> okay
[04:40] <ogra> Kamion, oh, i didnt expect a quote, thanks :)
[04:40] <Kamion> infinity: actually XSI requires that -n must not be treated as an option
[04:40] <infinity> But yes, its use in most Linux distributions is very bash-centric.
[04:41] <infinity> Kamion: Oh, really?... I need to re-read my specs.  I'm clearly rusty.
[04:41] <Kamion> so echo -n isn't even XSI, it's pure pot luck whether it works or not
[04:41] <Mithrandir> Riddell: yay. :-)
[04:41] <Kamion> "printf '%s' "$foo"' is better
[04:41] <Kamion> er
[04:41] <Kamion> printf '%s' "$foo"
[04:41] <infinity> Kamion: Well, note the "undefined".. That seems to match with your "pot luck".
[04:41] <Kamion> infinity: right, but I mean you can't even appeal to a standard as dodgy as XSI
[04:42] <infinity> printf irritates me, only because printf in every language is subtly different and I always hurt my brain remembering how.  As a result, I tend to reserve it for C only and find other similar mechanisms in other languages.
[04:42] <Kamion> anyway, ripping all that code out now; any code that requires eight consecutive backslashes in a sed expression deserves to die anyway
[04:42] <chrisjr> hah
[04:42] <ogra> -n is a pretty new enhancement anyway, no ? i remember being able to use things like \n \t without -n before 
[04:43] <Kamion> ogra: -n has nothing to do with \n \t
[04:43] <infinity> ogra: You're thinking of -e
[04:43] <ogra> yeah, muddled it, sorry
[04:43] <ogra> just saw it in the manpage
[04:43] <infinity> ogra: -n means "no trailing newline"... When it works.
[04:43] <Hobbsee> dinner?
[04:43] <Kamion> -e is also non-POSIX, of course. On some systems you can use \n or \t in echo and it'll be expanded, and on others you can't. (That's an XSIism.)
[04:43] <Mithrandir> Kamion: any chance you could kick off xubuntu livefs + isos for me?  Jani was fine with them being released untested..
[04:43] <chrisjr> dinner happens.
[04:44] <Hobbsee> where the the heck is it dinner time?
[04:44] <Kamion> The only portable way to use echo is with plain strings containing no backslashes and not beginning with "-", and with no options.
[04:44] <infinity> Hobbsee: Anywhere where people are hungry.
[04:44] <ogra> Hobbsee, 1-2h ahead of europe ...
[04:44] <Hobbsee> infinity: hmmm...so i can have dinner at 1am..nice...
[04:44] <ogra> israel would be a bet i guess
[04:44] <Hobbsee> ogra: ah
[04:45] <Kamion> Mithrandir: ok, building
[04:45] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: CET; I have to make the dinner too, which takes an hour today.
[04:45] <infinity> Hobbsee: I'm going to guess Thailand, just based on the IP.  Or because I'm psychic.
[04:45] <Mithrandir> so dinner'll happen at aroud 1800
[04:45] <chrisjr> thailand here
[04:45] <ogra> gah, now i'm hungry
[04:46] <Hobbsee> infinity: hehe, true
[04:46] <Hobbsee> ogra: :P
[04:46] <tmccrary> Has anyone in here tried building Xorg 7.1?
[04:46] <ogra> and that with a nonexistent kitchen and the next possibility to buy food 20km away
[04:46] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: ah...right.  CET means close to nothing to me
[04:46] <ogra> yummy
[04:46] <ogra> wine !
[04:46] <Hobbsee> heh
[04:47] <Hobbsee> wine != dinner
[04:47] <ogra> i have at least 3 bottles left ...
[04:47] <ogra> but no food at all ... and the kitchen is packed in boxes already
[04:47] <infinity> A rather imposing looking bottle, with the only words on the label being "black label"... I'm not sure if I should be frightened.
[04:47] <mjg59> ogra: Empirical evidence suggests that it's broadly possible to live on alcohol alone
[04:47] <mjg59> For certain values of "live"
[04:48] <ogra> infinity, sure thats wine ? 
[04:48] <infinity> mjg59: You're Irish; your opinion doesn't count here.
[04:48] <infinity> ogra: I just pulled the cork.  It smells vaguely like wine.
[04:48] <ogra> mjg59, heh, right, but i doubt the police would like it if i drive after only having wine :)
[04:48] <mjg59> infinity: Daniel ought to be awake by now, you could ask him
[04:49] <infinity> mjg59: If I know Daniel, he bought it purely due to the label, and would have no advice to offer on its drinkability.  I'll just have to take the plunge myself.
[04:49] <infinity> Hobbsee: There's a reason I'm not logged into any canonical/ubuntu hosts right now.
[04:49] <alephant> I think I know the answer, but is anybody interested in a bug report here before I hit the bugzilla?
[04:50] <Hobbsee> infinity: hehe :)
[04:50] <infinity> alephant: We tend to prefer bug reports in Malone, unless you actually want to discuss the solution a bit with someone.
[04:51] <infinity> alephant: If it's just a bug report, or a simple patch, file it and we'll get to it.
[04:51] <ogra> gah, muddled my vocabulary ... s/sore/sober/
[04:51] <alephant> I'm actually rather curious why the installer fubared my grub/menu.lst so badly
[04:51] <infinity> ogra: I dunno.  I had to argue at length with both katie AND soyuz earlier today.  I suspect that would not have gone well if I had been drunk.
[04:51] <Kamion> alephant: what version?
[04:52] <Kamion> and fubared how?
[04:52] <ogra> infinity, you could have offered them wine :)
[04:52] <alephant> 6.06 / alternate_install
[04:52] <mjg59> ogra: Despite the naming, I don't think offering Katie wine gets you very far
[04:52] <infinity> Okay, wow.  Daniel MUST have purchased this based on the label.  If he bought it based on experience, the man has no taste buds.  None.
[04:53] <infinity> mjg59: If you run into the boy, smack him for me.  This is godawful.
[04:53] <alephant> partitioning /dev/sd{a,b} 1GB swap, remaining raid
[04:53] <infinity> (And I'm drinking it anyway... Go me)
[04:53] <alephant> /dev/md0 == /dev/sd{a,b}2, ext3, /
[04:53] <Kamion> oh, wouldn't surprise me at all if there was raid breakage
[04:53] <sharms> can anyone send me in the direction of where to get started if I want to make sure when using just a usb joystick that the screensaver doesn't go on?
[04:53] <Kamion> file a bug and attach /var/log/installer/syslog please
[04:53] <sharms> is there some activity monitor that needs to be updated?
[04:54] <ogra> Hobbsee, whats wrong with katie, she sends you friendly mails for every upload :)
[04:54] <alephant> then grub/menu.lst has an incorrect root() stanza and totally missing initrd stanza
[04:54] <alephant> I'll file th ebug
[04:54] <alephant> if I can ever get the dang thing to pass fsck
[04:54] <Hobbsee> ogra: because it would send my nick highlighting psycho.  ah, is that katie.  it usually ends up telling me i screwed up.
[04:55] <infinity> Hobbsee: well, no.  katie is the old archive software (or the software Debian runs)... You get angry mails from soyuz these days.
[04:55] <Hobbsee> ah right
[04:55] <Hobbsee> heh
[04:55] <infinity> Hobbsee: I will petition to rename soyuz to sarah, just for you.
[04:55] <Hobbsee> like "you've tried to upload to main, you stupid moron"
[04:55] <ogra> Hobbsee, heh, ask Spec how it feels in here short before ubuntu conferences
[04:55] <Hobbsee> ogra: haha, yeah.
[04:56] <Hobbsee> infinity: heh.
[04:56] <infinity> #slug... Sydney?
[04:56] <jdub> THE SUN IS SO HOT THAT EVERYTHING ON IT IS A GAS
[04:57] <Spads> a gigantic nuclear furnace
[04:57] <Hobbsee> infinity: yes
[04:58] <thom> Hobbsee: too late.
[04:58] <jdub> thomarse!
[04:58] <Hobbsee> infinity: why so?
[04:58] <thom> jeffurry
[04:58] <jdub> infinity: noofie.
[04:58] <Hobbsee> thom: yeah, quite possibly.
[04:59] <infinity> jdub: Nonsense.  I've been in Melbourne almost 1.5 years now, I claim it as my home.
[04:59] <infinity> jdub: I also, uhh... Love footy and such.  Or something.
[04:59] <jdub> infinity: fake mexicans can't diss.
[04:59] <infinity> jdub: But most importantly, I have an unbridled and unfounded hatred for Sydney.  Just cause.
[04:59] <chrisjr> fake mexicans?
[04:59] <thom> infinity: your accent gives the game away, sonny
[04:59] <infinity> thom: Shh. :)
[05:02] <Kamion> Keybuk: well, switching to dash as /bin/sh is certainly uncovering a lot of bashisms
[05:03] <Kamion> Keybuk: some of them are pretty worrying though, because they aren't at all visible
[05:04] <Kamion> Keybuk: I could easily not have noticed that localechooser one for weeks
[05:05] <ogra> Kamion, Mithrandir, edubuntu amd64 all good
[05:05] <Kamion> is there anything we can do to search for this automatically? like grepping the archive for 'echo *-' or something
[05:05] <Kamion> ogra: thanks
[05:06] <Keybuk> Kamion: heh, interesting
[05:06] <Keybuk> I guess if we knew the bashisms we had to look for, we could grep the archive, yeah
[05:06] <Keybuk> doesn't the installer already use dash/busybox anyway?
[05:06] <ogra> apparently not
[05:07] <ogra> else ltsp would have failed since breezy
[05:08] <Kamion> Keybuk: not in its build proces
[05:08] <Kamion> s
[05:08] <Kamion> ogra: the installer most certainly does use busybox sh
[05:08] <Kamion> ogra: however stuff run in /target used bash up to dapper
[05:08] <Keybuk> ahh
[05:08] <Kamion> this was a misbuilt templates file in the udeb
[05:08] <ogra> ah, ok
[05:09] <lucas> maybe it would be possible to write a bash/dash script parser and find bashisms we want to find like this
[05:10] <ogra_> thats a mean one: $(echo ${1:2} | tr "-" "_") 
[05:10] <tmccrary> Are there any packages for Xorg 7.1 available anywhere yet?
[05:10] <ogra_> tmccrary, no
[05:25] <ogra_> Keybuk, is there a way that you could revert the order ohci_hcd and ehci_hcd are loaded in udev ?
[05:26] <ogra_> i'm slowly going mad here because i always forget to unload them and reload them in the right order before trying to burn off my usb disk ...
[05:27] <ogra_> and burning a 700MB CD with usb 1.1 takes 30 min or more at full speed
[05:27] <Keybuk> ogra_: no.
[05:28] <ogra_> so thats a kernel thing ? 
[05:28] <Keybuk> yup
[05:28] <ogra_> meh
[05:28] <ogra_> BenC, ^^^^
[05:31] <Keybuk> the order of loading shouldn't matter
[05:31] <Keybuk> do you have a buggy driver?
[05:31] <ogra_> seems like
[05:31] <ogra_> if i unload both and load ehci first, all is fine 
[05:31] <ogra_> but directly after boot all devices are recognized as 1.1
[05:32] <ogra_> so it seems to me that ohci grabs all ressources ...
[05:32] <Keybuk> definitely a kernel problem
[05:32] <Keybuk> as the same bug would exhibit if udev forced the order for that device, but you did have a 1.1 only bus with an earlier PCI id
[05:33] <Keybuk> ehci should be able to take the devices off ohci
[05:33] <ogra_> hmm, ok, so its an ehci_hcd bug then ...
[05:33] <Keybuk> I wouldn't begin to place the area of blame for the bug yet
[05:51] <coided> Where can I obtain a copy of the NDA/preamble required for ubuntu-kernel devs?
[05:52] <ogra_> NDA ?
[05:52] <coided> non-disclosure agreement
[05:53] <BenC> ogra: dapper or edgy?
[05:53] <BenC> coided: what NDA would ubuntu-kernel devs have to agree to?
[05:53] <ogra_> BenC, edgy
[05:53] <ogra_> coided, i now what NDA means
[05:54] <BenC> ogra: works in dapper I assume?
[05:54] <coided> sorry, I can't be sure all the time
[05:54] <ogra_> BenC, no idea i have that laptop since a week and dapper didnt stay longer than 10 mins on it ...
[05:54] <BenC> coided: technically, an NDA agreement by nature is not publicly available :)
[05:55] <Keybuk> I thought our kernel was public? :p
[05:55] <coided> well you have restricted modules by non-os vendors, so
[05:55] <BenC> ogra: If you could boot to 2.6.15 and retest, I'd appreciate it
[05:55] <coided> now im just wondering if there is one
[05:55] <BenC> if it's different, then dmesg's to compare would be nice
[05:56] <BenC> coided: restricted means we have restrictions on how we distribute them
[05:56] <coided> so there is no NDA?
[05:56] <BenC> coided: we have no special access to source code
[05:56] <BenC> it's the same restrictions most other ppl have...mainly just the LICENSE that comes with it
[05:56] <coided> yeah I see now
[05:57] <coided> thanks for clarifying that
[05:57] <ogra_> BenC, its a HP pavillon ze2000 (turion) runnign edgy i386 ...
[05:57] <ogra_> i'll boot 2.6.15 asap (have to do some work on the machine atm)
[05:58] <ogra_> BenC, i also have to boot i386 with nolapic, amd64 seems fine though
[06:04] <LaserJock> iwj: ping?
[06:05] <seb128> LaserJock: he's away (probably for the evening)
[06:05] <LaserJock> seb128: ok, thanks
[06:05] <seb128> np
[06:06] <LaserJock> it seems he and I have opposite hours
[06:34] <Petaris> ajmitch: ping
[06:35] <Petaris> ajmitch: I hear you have been working on AD integration, had any luck?
[06:43] <glatzor> elmo: ok.
[06:44] <elmo> glatzor: as in http://<mirror>/ubuntu dapper-security ?
[06:44] <glatzor> elmo: yes.
[06:46] <elmo> glatzor: ugh
[06:46] <glatzor> elmo: but it is not such an evil issue to use the dapper-security repo of the mirrors that I should revert them to security.ubuntu.com automatically?
[06:46] <elmo> glatzor: oh, heck no
[06:46] <elmo> glatzor: but don't go making it easy for people ;-)
[06:53] <glatzor> elmo: onther question: there are mirrors for every iso 3166 country code?
[06:53] <elmo> glatzor: there's a wildcard in place
[06:53] <elmo> (so: yes ;-)
[06:53] <sladen> http://pr0n.archive.ubuntu.com/  rocking
[06:54] <glatzor> :)
[06:57] <glatzor> elmo: there is currently no connection speed testing program to detect the best mirror? at the moment I provide a 'fake' option "Server for COUNTRY" extracted from the locale
[06:58] <elmo> glatzor: unfortunately not really, no
[06:59] <elmo> server for country based on locale is a pretty good start though
[06:59] <elmo> the launchpad guys are working on automated mirror testing, once that's a bit more involved you could hook into that to refine your list of choices for the user
[07:00] <elmo> s/involved/evovled/
[07:01] <glatzor> elmo: ok. Is there a way to identify "official" Debian repos not using the URL of the repo?
[07:01] <elmo> ... Ubuntu ? :P
[07:02] <glatzor> elmo: I want to reuse the code for Debian :)
[07:03] <elmo> ok - so I don't quite understand the question?
[07:04] <glatzor> elmo: oh, perhaps I should point you to the user interface mockups. I plan to abstract the source.list:
[07:04] <glatzor> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UpdateManagerEdgyRepo
[07:06] <glatzor> To abstract the sources I need to know the corresponding repositories of the used distribution
[07:06] <elmo> glatzor: (random nitpick, main should come first in any listing of components)
[07:06] <elmo> (specifically in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UpdateManagerEdgyRepo?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=better_desc.png)
[07:07] <glatzor> elmo: For Ubuntu we base the decision on the hostname of the server and the dist part of the repo
[07:07] <glatzor> *archive.ubuntu.com
[07:09] <glatzor> elmo: Right.
[07:09] <elmo> glatzor: ok, well debian, does have a ftp.$cc.debian.org system, but it's not desperately well maintained, and I'm not sure they have the same level of URL facism we do (i.e. requiring debian/ to work)
[07:10] <toma> '
[07:10] <elmo> glatzor: so I'm not sure you could do that for debian, I'm afraid
[07:11] <glatzor> the mirror list at http://www.us.debian.org/mirror/list is maintained regularly?
[07:12] <glatzor> I will add an option to add a custom server, so that you can also use your local mirror
[07:12] <elmo> err, kind of.  the people doing mirror stuff in debian are pretty MIA, so I'm not sure if that list is kept up to date
[07:12] <elmo> but it's the best Debian has
[07:16] <hungerW> no new debs all day long:-(
[07:17] <ogra_> Kamion, Mithrandir, edubuntu is good to go ...
[07:17] <tmccrary> xorg sucks 
[07:24] <infinity> elmo: IME, debian/ always works for CC mirrors.  Just not for other random mirrors.
[07:32] <tmccrary> anyone here familiar with git
[07:32] <tmccrary> ?
[07:32] <tmccrary> defaulting to local storage area
[07:32] <tmccrary> fatal: unexpected EOF
[07:32] <tmccrary> clone-pack from 'git://anongit.freedesktop.org/git/util-makedepend' failed.
[07:42] <tmccrary> defaulting to local storage area
[07:42] <tmccrary> fatal: unexpected EOF
[07:42] <tmccrary> clone-pack from 'git://anongit.freedesktop.org/git/util/makedepend' failed.
[08:20] <dholbach> hum, could it be that wesnoth's binary packages on AMD64 still sit in NEW? or something?
[08:21] <Keybuk> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=wesnoth
[08:21] <Keybuk> ^ no
[08:21] <Keybuk> the i386 ones do though
[08:24] <dholbach> ok
[08:24] <bSON> hi
[08:24] <bSON> is somebody thinking about integration of tracker into ubuntu and development of it, maybe for edgy+1?
[08:24] <sladen> Keybuk: are xaralx binaries sitting in NEW too?
[08:27] <Keybuk> sladen: yes
[08:27] <Keybuk> bSON: what's tracker?
[08:28] <HiddenWolf> Keybuk: beagle and more, but fast and memory-efficient
[08:29] <sladen> Keybuk: could you give um a kick pleaes
[08:29] <bSON> Keybuk: a freedesktop alternative to beagle written in c, currently in early stage of development: http://freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/Tracker
[08:29] <Keybuk> sladen: I'd rather not during knot freeze, in case they break something
[08:30] <Keybuk> bSON: if it's in an early stage of deveopment, it's almost certainly not ready for "integration into ubuntu"
[08:30] <bSON> Keybuk: that's why i said edgy+1 and also upstream development
[08:30] <sladen> Keybuk: it's multiverse with nothing depending on it
[08:30] <dholbach> bSON: but if you want to get it packaged to be able to showcase it or expose it to users, you might want to ask for followers in #ubuntu-motu
[08:30] <dholbach> bSON: or add it to http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseCandidates
[08:31] <Keybuk> bSON: we're not thinking about edgy+1 yet
[08:31] <bSON> dholbach: ok, thanks
[08:33] <bSON> i just meant, it's just the tool the ubuntu folks were looking for as summer of code project, "A complete beagle-like desktop search app that doesn't use mono, but any of C, Ruby, Python or Perl as a programming language"...
[08:33] <bSON> and it's a freedesktop project
[08:34] <Keybuk> what's wrong with Mono?
[08:34] <fabbione> and why should we trust a freedesktop project more than others?
[08:35] <ogra> doesnt tracker need some intrusive changes to nautilus and needs to be compiled in ?
[08:36] <bSON> fabbione: maybe becaus freedesktop is about desktop standards, and ubuntu is about standards too
[08:36] <Riddell> bSON: just being on freedesktop doesn't make it a standard
[08:36] <bSON> fabbione: and there's already tracker integration in nautilus upstream
[08:37] <bSON> as far as i heard, you can enable it through a configure switch
[08:37] <fabbione> bSON: what Riddell said
[08:37] <bSON> and gnome is also hosting tracker, so maybe they are thinking about heading that direction too
[08:38] <bSON> what would make it a deal for ubuntu developers
[08:38] <fabbione> bSON: prepare a demo package and find somebody in #ubuntu-motu to upload it for you
[08:39] <bSON> the tracker page has a nautilus 2.14 version with tracker integration enabled, but i couldn't get my hands on it because freesesktop.org is down
[08:39] <bSON> i'll do what i can
[08:39] <crimsun> bSON: coordinate w/ bluefoxicy, who has looked into it
[08:40] <bSON> crimsun: ok, thanks
[08:40] <bluefoxicy> ogra:  tracker appears to need nautilus to build-depend and depend on libtracker
[08:40] <ogra> crimsun, bluefoxicy has looked into it ? does that mean we'll see a hardened tracker ? 
[08:40] <bluefoxicy> apparently libtracker is a thin wrapper around dbus
[08:40] <ogra> bluefoxicy, yes, thats how i understood it :)
[08:41] <bluefoxicy> however I would consider that it does take a little time to load an extra lib
[08:41] <bluefoxicy> (dynamic linking)
[08:41] <bSON> it's way better than beagle with a whole run-time system
[08:41] <bluefoxicy> ogra:  I thought it would be a plug-in but the ABI for search extensions is volatile so the nautilus maintainer has yet to export it, for fear that suddenly plug-ins would be made for it and then find they were incompatible due to sudden changes.
[08:42] <ogra> well, they will come one day :)
[08:42] <bluefoxicy> nods.  OH!
[08:42] <bSON> bluefoxicy: that means the tracker stuff is in nautilus directly now and not in a plugin
[08:42] <bSON> ?
[08:44] <bluefoxicy> bSON:  if you build nautilus with tracker installed it will automatically depend on tracker.
[08:44] <bluefoxicy> Jamie says:
[08:44] <bSON> i understand
[08:44] <bluefoxicy> I guessed that - I could provide a patch to Nautilus to make it runtime 
[08:44] <bluefoxicy> selectable (with Nautilus depending on both libtracker and libBeagle) 
[08:44] <bluefoxicy> but this would not make it into the main nautilus source and so it would 
[08:44] <bluefoxicy> have to be maintained externally.
[08:45] <bluefoxicy> bSON:  as I understand, Nautilus has both beagle and tracker code in mainline nautilus' source tree; but they can't work at the same time and they're not plug-ins, nor are they runtime selectable.  Anyhow the tracker maintainer says if you want he can patch nautilus to be runtime-selectable but you'll probably wind up maintaining that patch down here.
[08:46] <bSON> so the problem is that somebody got to do and maintain it
[08:48] <bluefoxicy> yeah, or more directly that there's no exported search API yet
[08:53] <fabbione> Keybuk: could you be so kind to NEW libopenais2 & co.?
[08:55] <fabbione> Keybuk: and please promote libvolumeid* to main (it shouldn't need any MIR since udev source it's already in main) thanks.
[08:55] <fabbione> Keybuk: they are both B-D for redhat-cluster-suite already in main
[08:57] <ogra> gnomefreak, did you read mdz's comments in the "update-manager vs apt-get" thread before you answered ?
[08:57] <sharms> I just addressed it on the mailing list and tried to tell him via irc
[09:04] <gnomefreak> ogra: no 
[09:04] <gnomefreak> ill look now
[09:05] <ogra> yep...
[09:08] <gnomefreak> ah ok got it sorry bout that missed it
[09:08] <sharms> thats one cool thing about gmail is that I can see all the messages in a thread
[09:09] <gnomefreak> i use thunderbird for gmail it might have showed it but i guess i over looked it
[09:39] <LaserJock> mjg59: ping?
[09:39] <mjg59> LaserJock: Hi
[09:41] <LaserJock> mjg59: pm'd you
[10:19] <Viper550> Are any of you good at GTK coding?
[10:19] <Treenaks> GTK? what's that
[10:19] <Viper550> Gimp Toolkit?
[10:19] <Viper550> Aren't you developers?
[10:20] <Viper550> Or, is that just a joke?
[10:20] <HiddenWolf> Viper550: no, really!
[10:21] <toma> we like qt ;-)
[10:21] <Viper550> You don't know GTK? You know GTK 2?
[11:41] <Riddell> Mithrandir: what happened to the Knot release?
[11:42] <Burgwork> Riddell, tomorrow, due to wine (the beverage)
[11:42] <Mithrandir> Riddell: happening tomorrow morning.  I've drunk more wine than advisable for releasing cd's with.  Such things happens when parents visit.
[11:42] <Riddell> they're a bad infuence on you :)
[11:43] <ogra> heh
[11:54] <Riddell> Mithrandir: should we be ok to upload stuff now?