[12:11] <mezcalero> pitti: i am not a fried of opt-in for avahi
[12:11] <mezcalero> s/fried/friend/
[12:12] <Keybuk> mezcalero: right, but the implementation is new ... our current policy is to prevent attack by bugs in software with an open port
[12:12] <pitti> mezcalero: I'm fully aware that it is not ideal
[12:12] <pitti> mezcalero: and I do see the advantages of having it on by default
[12:12] <mezcalero> Keybuk: i know your policy. but i don't like it. ;-)
[12:13] <pitti> but people need to get used to that feature, and we have to develop and review the applications that use it, too
[12:13] <pitti> mezcalero: ok, sorry for the misunderstanding then
[12:14] <Riddell> pitti: does this apply to CUPS discovery too?
[12:14] <mezcalero> i guess it is an undeniable truth that avahi has been around for a year only
[12:14] <pitti> so, I'd propose an edgy+1 spec to clean up our service discovery stuff (avahi, dhcp, cups) and make a consistent policy out of it, with considering the apps that make use of these features
[12:15] <pitti> the latter part does not seem easy at all to me
[12:15] <mdz> my feeling is that the functionality is compelling enough to justify a thorough review of the security model and software, but not that we should change the policy out of hand
[12:15] <pitti> (especially with regard to cups browsing and such)
[12:15] <pitti> Riddell: I don't see why not
[12:15] <mdz> pitti: it would go well in hand with a new initiative to use this system for automatic integration of standard local network services ;-)
[12:16] <ogra> ltsp could majorly benefit from avahi in many areas ...
[12:17] <pitti> ok, so it seems that the ubuntu devs basically all agree, and mezcalero at least won't kill us instantly (and I'm not denying his concerns either, but we have to look at our release schedule)
[12:17] <mdz> at this point, I'm not prepared to take an explicit decision on changing our security policy to accomodate avahi
[12:17] <mdz> so if that's the issue on the table, there's little to discuss from my part
[12:17] <pitti> mdz: I didn't propose to
[12:18] <pitti> mdz: the current edgy way is to provide an easy way to turn it on and decorate it with a reasonable warning
[12:18] <Keybuk> pitti: what is the concern for having avahi opt-in?
[12:18] <Keybuk> I haven't actually seen one
[12:18] <pitti> Keybuk: I didn't see such a concern
[12:18] <pitti> Keybuk: i. e. you mean someone argued that even providing an opt-in is too much?
[12:18] <pitti> (IOW, that we shouldn't use it at all?)
[12:18] <Keybuk> you spoke of mezcalero's concerns about having it opt-in
[12:18] <Keybuk> no, concerns that it's opt-in not enabled-by-default
[12:19] <pitti> Keybuk: well, it defeats the 'zero'conf idea a bit
[12:19] <mezcalero> pitti: i wonder how this "opt-in" will look like? a checkbox during installation? a checkbox in some obscure configuration menu well hidden? what will be the text on the checkbox?
[12:19] <pitti> seb128: ^ that's one for you, I think
[12:19] <seb128> atm we have a checkbox to network-admin
[12:20] <mezcalero> seb128: what does that checkbox do?
[12:20] <seb128> but I admit it's not easily discoverable
[12:20] <pitti> TBH I think that having such an user-educated opt-in is not bad at all, as long as it's discoverable
[12:20] <mdz> it's "a bit"conf rather than "zero"conf
[12:20] <Riddell> mezcalero: I added a tickbox to the KDE zeroconf KControl module
[12:20] <seb128> mezcalero: enable avahi 
[12:20] <mezcalero> seb128: and what does the checkbox text say? i am just wondering how you explain what it enables near the checkbox.
[12:20] <Riddell> mezcalero: it shows a scary warning message and sets avahi to run
[12:20] <seb128> mezcalero: the idea is to have it installed by default but not started, it starts when the box is checked
[12:20] <pitti> seb128: hm, 'avahi' is a bit too abstract
[12:21] <mezcalero> but who on earth knows what avahi is?
[12:21] <Riddell> I have "Enable Zeroconf network browsing"
[12:21] <mezcalero> "avahi" is a term that only very people know what it is
[12:21] <gnomefreak> server installed by default with kubuntu?
[12:21] <pitti> but so is zeroconf
[12:21] <Riddell> gnomefreak: yes, but off
[12:21] <mezcalero> and what is "zeroconf"?
[12:21] <gnomefreak> yes
[12:21] <seb128> the box is "Scan for available services and advertise local services on the network"
[12:21] <mezcalero> especially since there is this irritating debian package "zeroconf" which complicates everything further
[12:22] <mdz> seb128: accurate, if verbose
[12:22] <mezcalero> seb128: and you expect people now what a "service" is?
[12:22] <seb128> mezcalero: better suggestions are welcome :)
[12:22] <Keybuk> can we take the UI discussion out of the meeting, please
[12:22] <mdz> Keybuk: I'm inclined to back pitti's proposal and consider this in depth for a future release
[12:22] <mezcalero> my point is that zeroconf/avahi ist just too complicated to explain. so in the end nooone will ever enable it becvause noone knows what it is
[12:22] <Keybuk> unless there's something you would like the TB to decide on, this would be more suitable for #ubuntu-devel
[12:23] <mezcalero> such a checkbox is pretty much worthless, it's like not making it available at all
[12:23] <Keybuk> mdz: myself also, I fully back pitti's proposal
[12:23] <seb128> mezcalero: I'm sure the documentation team will find a way to advertise it to the user guide 
[12:23] <mdz> Keybuk: then we have a consensus
[12:23] <mezcalero> seb128: who reads users guides? ;-)
[12:23] <seb128> and make clear what effects it has on some applications like rhythmbox
[12:23] <Keybuk> ok, that was the last agenda item
[12:23] <Keybuk> do we have any other business for the TB?
[12:23] <seb128> mezcalero: users?
[12:23] <mdz> mezcalero: I acknowledge that the model requires a change in our thinking, but it's something we need to consider more thoroughly and target for a release
[12:24] <ogra> mezcalero, at least a checkbox is easier to check than installing a package ...
[12:24] <pitti> TBH, my mother wouldn't find it, but then again, my mother isn't interested/capable in avahi services either
[12:24] <mezcalero> ogra: i doubt that
[12:24] <mdz> I don't think that enabling it by default for edgy is practical
[12:24] <pitti> if we enable it in 3 months for edgy+1, that should be good
[12:24] <mezcalero> ogra: think of a normal user. he wants to use that shiny new "zeroconf" tech. would would you do in his case. look for a package or look in the network config tool?
[12:24] <mdz> I think that concludes the agenda
[12:25] <mdz> is there any other business to be raised?
[12:25] <pitti> and collect some experience in the meantime
[12:25] <mezcalero> s/would/what/
[12:25] <seb128> mezcalero: read the user guide section about it :p
[12:25] <seb128> mezcalero: which explains what box to click on
[12:25] <Keybuk> mdz: it appears not
[12:25] <mdz> ok, adjourned then
[12:26] <mdz> thanks to all for the endurance ;-)
[12:26] <seb128> 'night pitti
[12:27] <ogra> mezcalero, being silly and install the debian zeroconf package which is the wrong one as you said :) i guess ... or remembering that he saw this little checkbox when he set up his modem for his 14k dialup and just chekc it without having to download the package
[12:27] <seb128> ogra: too slow :p
[12:27] <ogra> gah
[12:27] <ogra> the meeting was just to quick :P
[12:28] <Hobbsee> ogra: hehe
[12:30] <seb128> Hobbsee: I thought you had to run to university? ;)
[12:30] <Hobbsee> seb128: i do.  i'm very late.
[12:30] <Hobbsee> seb128: well, drive there
[12:30] <Hobbsee> oh shoot!  i needed petrol too!
[12:30] <ogra> go go go !
[12:31] <Hobbsee> all mornings should be banned.
[12:32] <ogra> ++
[12:32] <Hobbsee> hehe
[12:32] <Hobbsee> especially all meetings that start at 6am.
[12:32] <ogra> well, it started at 10pm here 
[12:32] <Hobbsee> ogra: lucky
[12:39] <tritium> Hobbsee: /mode +b *!*mornings ;)
[12:44] <Hobbsee> tritium: hehe!
[01:04] <viper550> Did I miss any meeting?
[01:04] <tseng> yes.
[01:04] <tseng> the whole thing.
[01:04] <viper550> Whoops...
[01:04] <viper550> At least it had nothing to do with Artwork, right?
[01:04] <tseng> no.
[01:04] <viper550> Bye
[08:43] <rodarvus> @now
[08:43] <Ubugtu> Current time in Etc/UTC: August 02 2006, 18:43:32 - Next meeting: Edubuntu in 1 hour 16 minutes
[08:44] <flint> @now
[08:44] <Ubugtu> Current time in Etc/UTC: August 02 2006, 18:44:49 - Next meeting: Edubuntu in 1 hour 15 minutes
[08:44] <Amaranth> flint: uh
[08:45] <flint> I am in bondage in DC...  will likely miss the 20:00 meeting... better next week...
[08:48] <ogra_thin> sad
[08:48] <ailean> bondage?
[09:26] <juliux> @schedule
[09:26] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Etc/UTC: 02 Aug 20:00: Edubuntu | 03 Aug 07:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 09 Aug 12:00: Edubuntu | 09 Aug 21:00: Kubuntu | 10 Aug 15:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 15 Aug 20:00: Technical Board
[09:59] <ailean> and erm had some problems . . .
[10:00] <highvoltage> heh
[10:00] <Amaranth> meeting time
[10:00] <cbx33> indeed
[10:00] <ogra_thin> meep
[10:00] <highvoltage> *bong*
[10:00] <Seveas> /nick Wile E. Coyote
[10:00] <Seveas> ogra, beware!
[10:01] <ogra_thin> a small prefix in case you didnt see it: http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/articles/linux_terminal_server
[10:01] <ogra_thin> we're getting good press ;)
[10:01] <LaserJock> hmm, I see elmo is an inactive edubuntu member ;-)
[10:02] <ogra_thin> he's member of all official teams i think
[10:02] <highvoltage> hi AliasVegas 
[10:02] <ogra_thin> hey AliasVegas 
[10:02] <AliasVegas> highvoltage hi :)
[10:02] <ailean> I'd like to speak to someone at the end of this meeting about how to contribute to Ubuntu
[10:02] <pygi> morning Lisa
[10:02] <AliasVegas> hi guys!
[10:03] <ailean> if that can be arranged
[10:03] <pygi> ailean, just poke me /pm, and I'll answer whatever you want
[10:03] <ogra_thin> so, there is nothing from my side this week, i just set up my ltsp lab in the new office and was busy with moving houses 
[10:03] <cbx33> nice ogra_thin 
[10:03] <cbx33> have you started on scp
[10:03] <LaserJock> ogra_thin: cool
[10:03] <ailean> k pygi, I'll send you a PM in an hour or so :)
[10:03] <ogra_thin> and it seems edgy ltsp is horribly broken :/
[10:03] <pygi> ailean, in an hour or so I'll be eating :P
[10:03] <cbx33> :(
[10:04] <cbx33> pygi, still?
[10:04] <ogra_thin> but i have fanally an opportunity to look into it, now that the lab is back :)
[10:04] <pygi> cbx33, none, other things on my mind right now :-/
[10:04] <ogra_thin> Amaranths SoC project is going forward in huge steps
[10:04] <cbx33> yeh well done Amaranth 
[10:05] <ogra_thin> (i just uploaded another willowng package to NEW)
[10:05] <Amaranth> :D
[10:05] <ogra_thin> if thats approved, please test it and file bugs (i hope Amaranth already registered a product in LP)
[10:05] <Amaranth> i didn't
[10:05] <ogra_thin> if not, Amaranth please do so
[10:05] <Amaranth> i wanted a new name first
[10:05] <LaserJock> tsk tsk
[10:05] <Amaranth> but i kind of like willowng as a name now
[10:06] <ogra_thin> yup
[10:06] <ogra_thin> and if i see the mailing lists, you will be the hero of our users once we ship it ;)
[10:06] <ogra_thin> content filtering is a high demand there
[10:06] <highvoltage> fo' shure
[10:06] <cbx33> indeed
[10:06] <lucasvo> let's call ubuntu also linux-ng, then it would be perfect, willowng, bazaar-ng, linux-ng ;)
[10:06] <ogra_thin> (and willowng is sooo beautiful)
[10:07] <ogra_thin> AliasVegas, we'll need an icon !
[10:07] <cbx33> it's already been requested ogra_thin 
[10:07] <cbx33> :p
[10:07] <ogra_thin> (its a content filter/blocker app)
[10:07] <Amaranth> ogra_thin: cbx33 gave her a sticky note :)
[10:07] <ogra_thin> oh, great !
[10:08] <LaserJock> will this be a replacement for danguardian et al. ? (I'm not up on the content filter field)
[10:08] <ogra_thin> rodarvus, any other tech news ?
[10:08] <ogra_thin> LaserJock, dansguardian is something i'd run on a separate machine 
[10:08] <cbx33> yeh
[10:08] <cbx33> like in censornet
[10:08] <ogra_thin> willowng is dbus driven and integrates in the teachers desktop 
[10:08] <rodarvus> ogra, no, not really
[10:08] <rodarvus> we'll probably have something for next week
[10:09] <rodarvus> but its [secret]  for now :D
[10:09] <ogra_thin> it runs locally on the ltsp server
[10:09] <ogra_thin> hehe
[10:09] <ogra_thin> secrets are good ... 
[10:09] <highvoltage> they are!?
[10:09] <ogra_thin> they keep up the suspense 
[10:09] <ogra_thin> well, if you unleash them at some point indeed ;)
[10:09] <highvoltage> ok, then i won't tell everyone in the channel about that thing...
[10:09] <highvoltage> (for a while)
[10:10] <LaserJock> I'm not sure where edubuntu-dynamic-menus is at. I can't see any good clean solutions ATM. I'm looking into how menu files are merged though
[10:11] <LaserJock> I think at least we could make a tool that would merge individual menu files and place them into all the user's ~/
[10:11] <ogra_thin> well, there is an option to merge them through the paths they are stored iirc
[10:11] <ogra_thin> s/stored/stored in/
[10:11] <LaserJock> but as Amaranth has pointed out before, you can quickly make an editing case that would cause problems
[10:11] <Amaranth> ogra_thin: https://launchpad.net/products/willowng
[10:11] <ogra_thin> yay+
[10:12] <Amaranth> "This is where the magic happens."
[10:12] <ogra_thin> no open bugs yet ... 
[10:12] <LaserJock> I think as long as admins are doing things really wild you should be able to use xdg's built in merging
[10:12] <ogra_thin> good sign :)
[10:12] <LaserJock> s/are/aren't/
[10:12] <ogra_thin> yep
[10:12] <ogra_thin> thats what i thought 
[10:13] <ogra_thin> and we shouldnt expect them to do wild things :)
[10:13] <ailean> will edubuntu incorporate this slab menu system?
[10:13] <ogra_thin> slab ?
[10:13] <LaserJock> no
[10:13] <Amaranth> LaserJock: I still think hooking into group adding and creating /etc/xdg/<group>-menus/ with a copy of applications.menu and such is best
[10:13] <LaserJock> Amaranth: and setting XDG_DATA_DIR?
[10:14] <Amaranth> LaserJock: with /etc/xdg/<group>-menus/applications-merged/ being a symlink to /etc/xdg/menus/applications-merged/
[10:14] <Amaranth> LaserJock: yeah
[10:14] <LaserJock> Amaranth: how would that get set?
[10:14] <Amaranth> LaserJock: but you can't merge different group menus together
[10:14] <ailean> Slab: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-slab
[10:15] <ogra_thin> ailean, that spec is in review ...
[10:15] <ogra_thin> spec deadline is long passed
[10:15] <Amaranth> LaserJock: some sort of config file in $HOME unless you want to hack gnome-session
[10:15] <rodarvus> I'm not sure the meeting is the right place for us to discuss the details of the implementatio, buuuuut :)
[10:15] <Amaranth> hehe
[10:15] <ogra_thin> right
[10:15] <LaserJock> rodarvus: I was just trying to kill time ;-)
[10:15] <ogra_thin> lets move on 
[10:15] <highvoltage> heh
[10:15] <rodarvus> LaserJock, I'd like to propose one thing to you, regarding your spec
[10:15] <ogra_thin> anything else for the tech side from anyone ?
[10:15] <rodarvus> but we can talk about this later, after meeting
[10:16] <LaserJock> rodarvus: ok, great
 ogra: willowng done
[10:16] <Amaranth> w00tage
[10:16] <ogra_thin> YAY
[10:16] <rodarvus> trs cool
[10:16] <lucasvo> Amaranth: you mean I can test willowng?
[10:16] <lucasvo> rodarvus: vous etes francais? 
[10:16] <rodarvus> lucasvo, probably in a bunch of hours (deppending on size of build queue)
[10:16] <ogra_thin> lucasvo, after the next buildd run
[10:16] <Amaranth> lucasvo: should be in the repos soon
[10:16] <rodarvus> lucasvo, nope, I'm brazilian
[10:17] <IvanCherevko> hello everybody!
[10:17] <ogra_thin> yeah, the point release is keeping them busy
[10:17] <rodarvus> I was just pretending I speak french :D
[10:17] <cbx33> Amaranth, lucky ! - I'm still waiting for gisomount to get into universe
[10:17] <cbx33> :p
[10:17] <highvoltage> rodarvus: you did a good job of it a few weeks ago ;)
[10:17] <rodarvus> ogra, yea, so in this case - likely tomorrow (or even the day after tomorrow, if openoffice.org is on the queue)
[10:17] <IvanCherevko> Can somebody tell me, when next Community Council meeting will commence?
[10:17] <rodarvus> highvoltage, haha, thanks
[10:17] <Amaranth> IvanCherevko: No one knows yet.
[10:18] <rodarvus> IvanCherevko, likely in 6 days from now
[10:18] <lucasvo> bah, openoffice, after all that trouble I removed it
[10:18] <Amaranth> IvanCherevko: We're in a meeting right now.
[10:18] <lucasvo> is it installable at the moment?
[10:18] <Amaranth> lucasvo: it is for me
[10:18] <rodarvus> its installable
[10:18] <rodarvus> yes
[10:18] <ogra_thin> it was this morning (edgy)
[10:18] <rodarvus> lucasvo, the openoffice.org being currently built is for amd64 on edgy and (I believe) for dapper-updates
[10:18] <rodarvus> i386 on edgy is settle down, I think
[10:19] <Amaranth> Alrighty then, next? :)
[10:19] <ogra_thin> but likely its simply not built yet
[10:19] <ogra_thin> yeah, seems we're done with tech
[10:19] <rodarvus> ogra_thin, you can try to talk with the X.Org mantainer, to see if he can help you
[10:20] <ogra_thin> hehe
[10:20] <rodarvus> :)
[10:20] <Amaranth> short meeting
[10:20] <ogra_thin> rodarvus, it looked like an archive issue ... i'll track it tomorrow
[10:20] <Amaranth> we all need to do lots of cool things so we can fill up an hour :)
[10:20] <rodarvus> ogra_thin, yes, indeed looked like some transient problem
[10:20] <ogra_thin> i apparently also mertged a lot of debian mess into ltsp i need to clean up
[10:21] <Amaranth> ooh, is usplash uses 800x600 by default now?
[10:21] <ogra_thin> migth or might not be related
[10:21] <ogra_thin> yes ... but artwork is lateer on the agenda ;)
[10:21] <ogra_thin> documentation !
[10:21] <rodarvus> also, ogra, vagrantc and I had a nice discussion on usage of Zeroconf for LTSP services on Edgy+1
[10:21] <ogra_thin> cool
[10:21] <rodarvus> I believe a rather nice spec may rise in the future
[10:21] <rodarvus> (no promises here, though)
[10:22] <ogra_thin> i'll likely be at a ltps hackfest in michigan in september btw
[10:22] <LaserJock> cool
[10:22] <rodarvus> oh really?
[10:22] <ogra_thin> yep
[10:22] <rodarvus> do you expect RichEd to want one of us to go there?
[10:22] <lucasvo> earning money as a student is real hard. :(
[10:22] <highvoltage> anyone up to date with cookbook happenings?
[10:23] <highvoltage> i'm still getting more and more confused about the cookbook
[10:23] <ogra_thin> rodarvus, its an invitation from sbalneav and jammcq to teach a bit bzr and to look over the convergence stuff
[10:23] <pygi> highvoltage, whats wrong? :)
[10:23] <ogra_thin> i dont think RichEd would fit there+
[10:23] <rodarvus> ogra_thin, nice
[10:23] <pygi> highvoltage, if you have any cookbook questions...
[10:23] <pygi> please do ask..
[10:23] <highvoltage> pygi: i don't know what's wrong, i just don't know what's happening. there seems to be a few different branches of it :)
[10:23] <lucasvo> ogra_thin: ltsp wants to learn bzr?
[10:23] <rodarvus> ogra_thin, but who would pay for your tickets and accomodation?
[10:23] <ogra_thin> yeah, tell us about docs :)
[10:24] <rodarvus> (you?)
[10:24] <cbx33> RichEd should know by now
[10:24] <ogra_thin> rodarvus, me worst case ...
[10:24] <highvoltage> pygi: what i mean is, i don't know *if* somethings wrong, i'm not implying that there is :)
[10:24] <pygi> highvoltage, the one me and hedge have is the right one :P
[10:24] <ogra_thin> rodarvus, but we're trying to get sabdfl approval
[10:24] <pygi> ignore all that LP mess
[10:24] <highvoltage> pygi: ok, there was some mention of a name change at some point?
[10:24] <pygi> highvoltage, Edubuntu Handbook (it's a new name)
[10:25] <highvoltage> pygi: i think it's the LP mess, and flint sending me a new version of his 'cookbook', that caused my confusion
[10:25] <rodarvus> lucasvo, ltsp will move to bzr.
[10:25] <rodarvus> its part of the ltsp-convergence spec
[10:25] <lucasvo> cool. and LP?
[10:25] <ogra_thin> lucasvo, ltsp will merge with us
[10:25] <lucasvo> wow.
[10:25] <ogra_thin> qand use LP and malone
[10:25] <lucasvo> cool news.
[10:25] <pygi> highvoltage, flint? who would he be? lol :P
[10:25] <highvoltage> heh
[10:25] <ogra_thin> but thats a far target, we need to get the code in shape first so we can merge easily
[10:26] <ogra_thin> highvoltage, flints book is a 1:1 ripoff of the tuxlabs book
[10:26] <ogra_thin> the ltsp bits are totally unappropriate
[10:27] <pygi> ogra_thin, !!!
[10:27] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: i've gathered that. i told him that too, and he said he's not concerned about the technical bits
[10:27] <ogra_thin> its a nice book ontheless
[10:27] <ogra_thin> *nontheless
[10:28] <rodarvus> not concerned about the technical bits?
[10:28] <ogra_thin> any more words from our doc team ?
[10:28] <rodarvus> what does that means?
[10:28] <ogra_thin> rodarvus, thats flint ... you need to meet him to understand him ;)
[10:29] <highvoltage> rodarvus: he has put more focus on the 'soft' issues, such as lab management, training, et
[10:29] <ogra_thin> he's unique
[10:29] <juliux> hi all
[10:29] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: i think that needs to be arranged!
[10:29] <juliux> sorry for the delay
[10:29] <ogra_thin> highvoltage, absolutely
[10:29] <rodarvus> ahem.
[10:29] <pygi> ogra_thin, yes, I have words :P
[10:29] <pygi> We'll have the handbook ready :)
[10:29] <ogra_thin> lets lock them in a room together and see who comes out in the end *g*
[10:30] <flint> are you guys talking about me?  hangon...
[10:30] <ogra_thin> haha
[10:30] <flint> @user
[10:30] <ogra_thin> you are here :)
[10:30] <highvoltage> flint: of course
[10:30] <flint> I am honored!
[10:30] <ogra_thin> pygi, really ? 
[10:30] <LaserJock> pygi: what has been done so far?
[10:30] <ogra_thin> thats great news
[10:30] <LaserJock> pygi: as far as content
[10:31] <pygi> ogra, well, ofcourse, I promised same last time, and it was done, wasn't it? :)
[10:31] <ogra_thin> flint, make sure to set up an edgy box and try out willowng/willowng-config ;)
[10:31] <pygi> LaserJock, not much sadly :-/
[10:31] <pygi> mostly me, hedge and mhz will be working /are working
[10:32] <ogra_thin> flint, its the content filter of the future :)
[10:32] <highvoltage> strange not to see hedgy on irc
[10:32] <cbx33> highvoltage, I was thinking that
[10:32] <ogra_thin> especially at this time
[10:32] <LaserJock> pygi: when date are you shooting to get it done by?
[10:32] <LaserJock> must be the Army called
[10:32] <lucasvo> Amaranth: where can one find out whihc packages are still in the build queue?
[10:33] <pygi> LaserJock, I forgot the dates :), but I think we adjusted the freeze and stuff with doc team
[10:33] <LaserJock> pygi: ok, cool
[10:33] <ogra_thin> lucasvo, https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/+builds
[10:33] <Amaranth> lucasvo: I'd guess somewhere on http://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/+builds
[10:33] <Amaranth> heh
[10:33] <ogra_thin> :)
[10:33] <flint> ogra_thin, ya zimmerman said to set up an eft... now i know why.
[10:34] <ogra_thin> flint, also the student-control-panel will be worth a look ;)
[10:34] <ogra_thin> (no work done yet, but son)
[10:34] <ogra_thin> *soon
[10:34] <flint> highvoltage, Jonathan, my book is in fact a page-by-page rip off of the original tuxlab book... I intend to put it in the DC LOCO BAR this week (with a little rewriting :^)
[10:35] <ogra_thin> any other doc news ?
[10:35] <flint> replace BAR with BZR
[10:36] <highvoltage> flint: no problemo! i'll still give it a read through :)
[10:36] <ogra_thin> its a great book but it really should honor edubuntu specifics
[10:36] <flint> btw sorry I was late, gotta slave for a client.
[10:36] <highvoltage> especially if it's going to have the edubuntu name on it :)
[10:37] <ogra_thin> heh, yes
[10:37] <ogra_thin> flint, a thin one ?
[10:37] <flint> ogra_thin, nothing I do is thin!
[10:37] <ogra_thin> heh, true
[10:37] <flint> :^)
[10:37] <ogra_thin> ok, lest move on ...
[10:38] <ogra_thin> AliasVegas ! got something to tell us ?
[10:38] <ogra_thin> :)
[10:38] <cbx33> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuArtwork/Worksheet
[10:38] <AliasVegas> yes...
[10:38] <ogra_thin> i know your hubby throws around sounds like a berzerk
[10:38] <cbx33> I had it to hand :p
[10:38] <rodarvus> Jane had to leave irc (minutes after she logged on irc.freenode.net, she found it it was prohibited to do so from her workplace)
[10:39] <cbx33> rodarvus, darn
[10:39] <highvoltage> :/
[10:39] <lucasvo> AliasVegas: you are the G/f of cbx33 ?
[10:39] <AliasVegas> wife lol
[10:39] <lucasvo> ah, ok.
[10:39] <cbx33> hehe
[10:39] <flint> rodarvus, that is terrible! I miss your lady friend Jane.
[10:39] <highvoltage> lucasvo: his better half ;)
[10:39] <lucasvo> sry, I wasn't sure about your relation.
[10:39] <AliasVegas> :)
[10:40] <AliasVegas> We've been working on getting together ideas and suggestions
[10:40] <ogra_thin> AliasVegas, we should have a usplash that shows our inheritance ... the current one is similar to the ubuntu one ...
[10:41] <AliasVegas> and I'm hoping to have an artwork meeting sometime soon
[10:41] <AliasVegas> yes
[10:41] <AliasVegas> its on the list
[10:41] <ogra_thin> and the login screen should be higer priorized, we still have the breezy one with edubuntu logo
[10:41] <AliasVegas> ok
[10:41] <ogra_thin> alsdo please ping me if thats done sionce i need to adjust the ltsp login screen to look similar
[10:42] <flint> ogra_thin, I actually like the non-cyclops login screen that is currently working.
[10:42] <AliasVegas> will do
[10:42] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: will login screen suggestions be accepted by the community this round?
[10:42] <ogra_thin> flint, it should look similar to the one thats on the server
[10:42] <cbx33> highvoltage, ??
[10:42] <flint> ogra_thin, that is exactly what I saw, and liked!
[10:42] <ogra_thin> highvoltage, AliasVegas will make the final decision ... but i guess based on community input
[10:43] <flint> AliasVegas, you go girl!
[10:43] <highvoltage> cbx33: for dapper, it was decided that only a professionally hired-person to canonical would do that design
[10:43] <AliasVegas> :)
[10:43] <cbx33> ah yes
[10:43] <cbx33> sorry highvoltage I got confused
[10:43] <highvoltage> np
[10:43] <lucasvo> we/canonical could hire AliasVegas :P
[10:43] <ogra_thin> highvoltage, for egdy we have the art teams
[10:44] <highvoltage> great
[10:44] <ogra_thin> lucasvo, no art people get hired this cycle
[10:44] <AliasVegas> does any one have any questions?
[10:44] <highvoltage> AliasVegas: do you have a prefered format for artwork?
[10:44] <lucasvo> AliasVegas: I do, -> query
[10:44] <ogra_thin> but probably in a later one, who knows ... i'm not HR :)
[10:44] <juliux> highvoltage, now it is a "community version" not the buisness one ;)
[10:44] <flint> ogra_thin, why not see if we can offer a comission to artists?
[10:44] <AliasVegas> or does anyone have any particular expertise in any of those areas of priority?
[10:45] <AliasVegas> highvoltage: .jpg or .png would be fine
[10:45] <lucasvo> best is vector! :)
[10:45] <cbx33> of course, but sometimes not possible
[10:45] <highvoltage> i like playing with the login screens, but i'm not a real artist
[10:45] <ogra_thin> well, we probably should contact the upstream guy for gartoon (the icon theme)
[10:45] <lucasvo> cbx33: true
[10:46] <AliasVegas> highvoltage: go for it
[10:46] <ogra_thin> there are many icons missing ...
[10:46] <highvoltage> i wish we could have gartoon OOo
[10:46] <cbx33> ogra_thin, are we using gartoon this release?
[10:46] <ogra_thin> i'm fine doing some, but having upstream aboard would be cooler
[10:46] <Amaranth> ogra_thin: that'd be jimmac, right?
[10:46] <cbx33> or redesigning?
[10:46] <ogra_thin> Amaranth, noppe
[10:47] <ogra_thin> cbx33, redesigning ?
[10:47] <cbx33> redoing
[10:47] <cbx33> ?
[10:47] <highvoltage> as in, new icon theme?
[10:47] <ogra_thin> cbx33, where would we get the 100 ppl doing that ?
[10:47] <ogra_thin> there are some 100s of them
[10:47] <ogra_thin> you cant make one icon theme in one dev cycle
[10:48] <Amaranth> yeah, look at human :P
[10:48] <ogra_thin> i'd propose to go on with gartoon for this time ... if there is real demand to do a new theme, lets start one now
[10:48] <lucasvo> not only this, I think there is no reason for redesigning
[10:48] <cbx33> how long did human take?
[10:48] <highvoltage> gartoon is a great theme
[10:48] <ogra_thin> but dont expect it to be finished before edgy+2
[10:48] <cbx33> hehe
[10:48] <highvoltage> and people have really come to assosiate it with edubuntu
[10:49] <lucasvo> cbx33: it's not finished afaik
[10:49] <ogra_thin> highvoltage++
[10:49] <ogra_thin> buit there are plenty new areas that gartoon doesnt cover
[10:49] <rodarvus> well, you can do an icon theme in two months
[10:49] <ogra_thin> evolution 
[10:49] <ogra_thin> firefox
[10:49] <rodarvus> but its a *lot* of work
[10:49] <rodarvus> really a lot
[10:49] <ogra_thin> gnome-power-manager
[10:49] <cbx33> ogra_thin, yes that was my thought
[10:49] <cbx33> is there somewhere we can get a list of the missing icons
[10:50] <cbx33> to make it easier for the artwork team
[10:50] <ogra_thin> everything gets themeable and falls back to human
[10:50] <lucasvo> well, one could do them in the gartoon style
[10:50] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: gartoon does have icons for firefox and evolution?
[10:50] <ogra_thin> exactly
[10:50] <ogra_thin> highvoltage, nope
[10:50] <ogra_thin> not for the evo toolbar
[10:50] <highvoltage> aaah
[10:51] <ogra_thin> using existing gartoon icons for ff shouldnt be a prob though
[10:51] <ogra_thin> '(again i'm talking about the toolbar)
[10:51] <cbx33> what about all the system/admin menus ?
[10:51] <ogra_thin> (which is human themed now, iwj sent a mail to ubuntu-devel)
[10:51] <highvoltage> *sigh*
[10:52] <ogra_thin> they are either in the app packages or fit well
[10:52] <cbx33> ok
[10:52] <lucasvo> ogra_thin: will FF be in edgy? isn't evince replacing it?
[10:52] <ogra_thin> evince ?
[10:52] <ogra_thin> thats a pdf viewer
[10:52] <cbx33> epiphany
[10:52] <ogra_thin> i think you mean ephy
[10:53] <ogra_thin> we havent decided that yet ...
[10:53] <Amaranth> epiphany doesn't use xulrunner yet?
[10:53] <ogra_thin> i'd like to see how much space we have left 
[10:53] <ogra_thin> nope
[10:53] <Amaranth> which confuses me, isn't it using xulrunner in debian?
[10:53] <ogra_thin> thats the prob
[10:53] <ogra_thin> it is
[10:53] <ogra_thin> but in ubuntu xulrunner isnt in main
[10:53] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: could this be of any use? http://www.deviantart.com/view/8657000/
[10:54] <ogra_thin> code duplication ...
[10:54] <rodarvus> and quite likely won't be in Edgy timeframe
[10:54] <ogra_thin> yup
[10:54] <ogra_thin> highvoltage, COOL !!!!
[10:54] <ogra_thin> thanks for pointing
[10:54] <rodarvus> we are looking for a Firefox developer to work fulltime on this kind of issue, but I seriously doubt it will happen for Edgy
[10:55] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: :)
[10:55] <ogra_thin> i'll talk to iwj how to get that in ...
[10:55] <ogra_thin> but we still might jumpo over to ephy
[10:55] <highvoltage> great! now for evo :)
[10:55] <ogra_thin> since its lockable by pessulus
[10:55] <cbx33> which helps us out a lot
[10:56] <ogra_thin> well, not in terms of CD space
[10:56] <ogra_thin> i'm very cautious
[10:56] <cbx33> I know
[10:56] <Amaranth> that reminds me, i had an idea
[10:56] <ogra_thin> another question would be if we do the mono switch ubuntu does
[10:56] <cbx33> be careful Amaranth 
[10:56] <ogra_thin> that will cost us 10MB
[10:56] <cbx33> ideas can be dangerous
[10:57] <ogra_thin> i trus Amaranth 
[10:57] <ogra_thin> *trust
[10:57] <ogra_thin> speak up :)
[10:57] <Amaranth> i'm going to expose public isGood/isBad methods in my dbus interface, was thinking if you used epiphany you could check those instead of trying to connect and being rejected by willowng
[10:57] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: just looking at the evo icons, they seem pretty standard. i think evo is simply looking for icon names that don't exist, something that can be fixed with symlinks?
[10:57] <Amaranth> then you could put custom blockage things in your epiphany
[10:57] <Amaranth> custom messages
[10:58] <rodarvus> ogra, also keep in mind that language packs exploded in size recently
[10:58] <ogra_thin> apparently :(
[10:58] <rodarvus> if we chose do include them, we are already screwed :)
[10:58] <Amaranth> like if (running on thin-client) show student error else show admin error and link to unblock
[10:58] <ogra_thin> we only have english atm
[10:58] <rodarvus> (I mean, those 10mb are long gone)
[10:59] <cbx33> ogra_thin, are we still tied to kde for edgy?
[10:59] <cbx33>  /kde/kdelibas
[10:59] <rodarvus> yes
[10:59] <ogra_thin> currently we are, yes
[10:59] <rodarvus> and will be for some time, it seems
[10:59] <ogra_thin> i'd like to hear RichEd about that part
[10:59] <rodarvus> unless someone steps up and create gnome "versions" of all these apps
[11:00] <ogra_thin> well, most of them have replacements we could use
[11:00] <highvoltage> also more work than one release cycle :)
[11:00] <ogra_thin> but one hasnt
[11:00] <ogra_thin> kalzium isnt replaceable ....
[11:00] <ogra_thin> its a well noticed app 
[11:00] <rodarvus> yes, kalzium is really really good
[11:00] <highvoltage> ktuberling also doens't have a very nice gnome replacement
[11:00] <ogra_thin> that'd be cool, but wont happen for edgy :)
[11:00] <pygi> LaserJock, you could, just get contributors
[11:00] <Amaranth> would it save any space putting in those replacements?
[11:01] <highvoltage> and it's a killer with the real small kids
[11:01] <Amaranth> or are the apps basically free once you have the libs and translations?
[11:01] <ogra_thin> highvoltage, i'll write you one in 90min
[11:01] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: great! thanks!
[11:01] <ogra_thin> highvoltage, if its needed :P
[11:01] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: yep, it is. thanks for volunteering!
[11:01] <ogra_thin> as long as we have to ship KDE stuff i wont think about it
[11:01] <rodarvus> Amaranth, it would save a good space
[11:01] <rodarvus> *and*
[11:01] <highvoltage> :p
[11:02] <cbx33> LaserJock, and I talked about the gperiodic thing
[11:02] <rodarvus> these new applications would have the same look'n feel as the rest of the desktop
[11:02] <rodarvus> which is also desirable
[11:02] <ogra_thin> we loose 80-100MB to KDE stuff
[11:02] <Amaranth> rodarvus: _and_ we could drop kalzium and tell people to download it if they need it? :)
[11:02] <ogra_thin> mnost libs and langpacks
[11:02] <rodarvus> Amaranth, unfortunately, no
[11:02] <Amaranth> :/
[11:02] <ogra_thin> kalzium is a killer app
[11:02] <ogra_thin> people demand it
[11:02] <rodarvus> kalzium would only be dropped if we had something *very* good on GNOME
[11:02] <rodarvus> which we don't.
[11:03] <highvoltage> i still say that, if kde needs to be dropped, it needs to happen as soon as possible
[11:03] <Amaranth> have you tried to get the guy to make it only use Qt stuff?
[11:03] <rodarvus> I don't think we have any other application on the level Kalzium currently is, education-wise
[11:03] <ogra_thin> i think its rather a edgy+1 goal 
[11:03] <LaserJock> I just don't see how we can possible have gnome replacements for edgy
[11:03] <ogra_thin> i know i know i'm saying that since breezy
[11:03] <lucasvo> cbx33: in which programming language is it written?
[11:03] <rodarvus> LaserJock, we won't have] 
[11:03] <pygi> lamont, we can't :P
[11:04] <pygi> LaserJock, *
[11:04] <ogra_thin> lucasvo, c++
[11:04] <Amaranth> i imagine you could persuade him to make a Qt only version as he does the Qt4/KDE4 porting
[11:04] <rodarvus> we are just using having some chit-chat here
[11:04] <cbx33> LaserJock, ++
[11:04] <ogra_thin> yeah
[11:04] <cbx33> we can't
[11:04] <ogra_thin> lets move on
[11:04] <lucasvo> ogra_thin: even though it's an edgy+1 goal I think we could begin to begin in edgy
[11:04] <LaserJock> isn't there SoC project or 2 for Gnome edu apps?
[11:04] <ogra_thin> yep
[11:04] <pygi> LaserJock, one I think
[11:04] <pygi> it's going great
[11:04] <ogra_thin> but they rather cover LAMS
[11:05] <ogra_thin> its a question answer game
[11:05] <rodarvus> the thing is: replacing kde apps with gnome counterparts is only going to happen if someone steps up, and do the job - until then, we are tied to what we currently have
[11:05] <ogra_thin> ++
[11:05] <rodarvus> and its very unlikely ogra or I will take this task in the near future (think at least one year from now)
[11:05] <LaserJock> rodarvus: yeah, but they need motivation to write the apps too
[11:06] <cbx33> LaserJock, ++
[11:06] <LaserJock> I'm not sure how to motivate people to do it
[11:06] <cbx33> $$$$
[11:06] <cbx33> hehe
[11:06] <cbx33> I'm j/k
[11:06] <lucasvo> sponsor a bounty :)
[11:06] <cbx33> well....
[11:06] <Amaranth> oh damn, kalzium is a part of the kdeedu source package
[11:06] <rodarvus> it is also very important to note this could be an immenselly good opportunity for a community member to participate actively, both in GNOME and Edubuntu communities
[11:06] <LaserJock> but I agree that we can't just drop KDE edu if we don't have a decent replacment
[11:06] <ogra_thin> i'll write a mail the next days to edubuntu-devel with some changes i'd like to make in the app selection ... but my big hope is to have another edubuntu summit with educators that give us fiorst hand input
[11:07] <ogra_thin> and indeed RichEd :)
[11:07] <rodarvus> so, if any of you is looking for a good project to work on, this is your chance! :)
[11:07] <cbx33> rodarvus, already in mind
[11:07] <ogra_thin> Amaranth, sadly ... and i have to maintain it
[11:07] <ogra_thin> its a beast
[11:07] <rodarvus> and, oh, yes. bounty is a possibility
[11:07] <cbx33> rodarvus, I have a few ideas for projects....I'll chat to you later and you can tell me priorities
[11:07] <rodarvus> just make sure to have a well defined plan
[11:08] <rodarvus> (features, timeline, milestones, etc)
[11:08] <Amaranth> i'll look into what it would take to make kalzium not depend on libkdeedu and kdelibs
[11:08] <ogra_thin> haha
[11:08] <Amaranth> ogra_thin: hack and slash :D
[11:08] <ogra_thin> thats unlikely to work
[11:08] <rodarvus> cbx33, sure, I'll be available most days, when you need/want to talk
[11:08] <ogra_thin> but try it :)
[11:08] <highvoltage> Amaranth: perhaps it's something stupid, like the help files or something :)
[11:08] <LaserJock> I think it would be easier to write a pygtk frontend for the data
[11:08] <lucasvo> Amaranth: to bad there is no element Galzium
[11:09] <lucasvo> ah, one could make it to Germanium
[11:09] <LaserJock> Germanium
[11:09] <rodarvus> LaserJock, yes, this is something I believe could work too.
[11:09] <lucasvo> even though it's not as common as Kalzium
[11:09] <ogra_thin> Amaranth, we'll still have to ship KDE langpacks
[11:09] <LaserJock> the important part of Kalzium is the data, IMO
[11:09] <rodarvus> exactly
[11:09] <ogra_thin> Amaranth, which include *all* KDE translations
[11:09] <lucasvo> Is the learning curve for pygtk steep?
[11:09] <highvoltage> in what form is the data stored?
[11:09] <Amaranth> ogra_thin: whatever happened to split langpacks?
[11:10] <LaserJock> highvoltage: xml
[11:10] <highvoltage> nice
[11:10] <LaserJock> it is nice
[11:10] <LaserJock> I had a look at the data
[11:10] <LaserJock> in Paris
[11:10] <ogra_thin> Amaranth, we could do that ... but its a big effort
[11:10] <cbx33> lucasvo, no
[11:10] <Amaranth> LaserJock: Let's setup a team?
[11:10] <LaserJock> waaaay better than gperiodic (data stored in .h)
[11:10] <cbx33> lucasvo, PTGTK is nice and easy to learn
[11:10] <rodarvus> lucasvo, not really
[11:10] <lucasvo> what about making gperiodic use the kalzium data?
[11:10] <rodarvus> python is extremely easy
[11:11] <rodarvus> prototyping is very fast
[11:11] <ogra_thin> ++
[11:11] <rodarvus> and pygtk is ok
[11:11] <lucasvo> rodarvus: I know python but no gtk
[11:11] <Amaranth> LaserJock: We can always lift code from kalzium and port it
[11:11] <cbx33> lucasvo, it's nice and easy
[11:11] <cbx33> I looked at it
[11:11] <LaserJock> ok, who's for making a pygtk Germanium? ;-)
[11:11] <cbx33> it was pretty straight forward
[11:11] <Amaranth> i imagine the actually rendering part is fairly desktop agnostic (it might use Qt)
[11:11] <ogra_thin> lucasvo, cbx33 can teach you, he has the youngest edxperience jumping into pygtk here
[11:11] <cbx33> my knowledge of pygtk and the like jeust meant I didn 't know how to do the popups with images on them
[11:11] <rodarvus> Amaranth, I don't think it is desktop agnostic
[11:12] <lucasvo> I can try.
[11:12] <cbx33> lucasvo, I'll givey oua ll the help I can
[11:12] <Amaranth> rodarvus: How can you possibly depend on kdeedu or kdelibs for the renderer? :P
[11:12] <cbx33> but seriously the pygtk and python sites are invaluable
[11:12] <rodarvus> but it should be rather easy to substitute Qt Canvas calls for PyCairo calls.
[11:12] <Amaranth> yeah
[11:12] <ogra_thin> guys, we're out of t5ime
[11:12] <Amaranth> oops
[11:12] <rodarvus> indeed
[11:12] <Amaranth> anything else to go over?
[11:13] <cbx33> SOUNDS
[11:13] <cbx33> hehe
[11:13] <cbx33> nah we can chat in #edubuntu...oh wait I alreayd did :p
[11:13] <ogra_thin> i dont think we have anything community/management tasks today RichEd is in london ...
[11:13] <juliux> yeaht the great song from cbx33 ;)
[11:13] <rodarvus> sorry for all the noise - it just seemed too good of an opportunity to raise awareness and interest on a rather nice project for the community :)
[11:13] <ogra_thin> so lets move over
[11:13] <cbx33> juliux, heard the latest one :p?
[11:13] <juliux> ogra_thin, i wasnt able to change the meeting agenda ;)
[11:13] <ogra_thin> rodarvus, no, it was fine ... 
[11:13] <juliux> cbx33, not yet
[11:14] <ogra_thin> juliux, huh ?
[11:14] <ogra_thin> its a wiki page ...
[11:14] <juliux> ogra_thin, but a locked page
[11:14] <ogra_thin> so youre going for membership ?
[11:15] <juliux> yes i want to try it
[11:15] <lucasvo> juliux: no, butyou need to login
[11:15] <juliux> ;)
[11:15] <juliux> lucasvo, i am loged in
[11:15] <ogra_thin> did you apply fot the LP team ?
[11:15] <lucasvo> ?
[11:15] <juliux> ogra_thin, yes
[11:16] <ogra_thin> oh, right
[11:16] <ogra_thin> erm, you are already ubuntu member
[11:17] <juliux> and?? i thought edubuntu is extra
[11:17] <highvoltage> lol
[11:17] <ogra_thin> so that shouldnt be a problem
[11:17] <juliux> highvoltage, hehe
[11:17] <ogra_thin> any objections from the EC that i make our biggest german promoter (who already is ubuntu member) an edubuntu member ?
[11:18] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: not at all from my side
[11:18] <ogra_thin> juliux promotes edubuntu at fairs and pressed the breezy edubuntu DVDs 
[11:18] <ogra_thin> and is planning edubuntu t-shirts btw
[11:18] <ogra_thin> LaserJock, ?
[11:19] <juliux> ogra_thin, thanks for the work ;)
[11:19] <LaserJock> ogra_thin: yeah?
[11:19] <ogra_thin> see above 
[11:19] <highvoltage> LaserJock: 23:13 < ogra_thin> any objections from the EC that i make our biggest german promoter (who already is ubuntu
[11:19] <highvoltage> member) an edubuntu member ?
[11:20] <ogra_thin> highvoltage, either your or my clock is very wrong :)
[11:20] <LaserJock> doh, sorry
[11:20] <LaserJock> juliux?
[11:20] <ogra_thin> yes
[11:20] <juliux> highvoltage, its ogra clock
[11:20] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: as far as i can tell my clock is set correctly
[11:21] <LaserJock> +1 from me
[11:21] <ogra_thin> ok
[11:21] <ogra_thin> +1 from me as well
[11:21] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: sorry, you're right, i'm ssh'ed into another box which time is incorrect :)
[11:21] <ogra_thin> highvoltage, only 4 mins :) ... do you vote officially =
[11:22] <ogra_thin> ?
[11:22] <highvoltage> ogra_thin: yes
[11:22] <highvoltage> i replied first :  < highvoltage> ogra_thin: not at all from my side
[11:22] <ogra_thin> can we see a + or - 1 ? *g*
[11:22] <highvoltage> +1
[11:22] <ogra_thin> yay
[11:22] <juliux> ogra_thin, that is typical german ;)
[11:22] <ogra_thin> welcome aboard juliux 
[11:22] <highvoltage> sorry, a bit tired here, not as allert as usual
[11:23] <juliux> thank you very much ogra_thin highvoltage LaserJock 
[11:23] <ogra_thin> juliux, yes, i live in kassel now 
[11:23] <juliux> ogra_thin, hehe
[11:23] <ogra_thin> (that three out of 5 )
[11:23] <ogra_thin> *thats
[11:23] <highvoltage> juliux: i considered you a member all along, it's just official now :)
[11:23] <cbx33> congrats juliux 
[11:23] <Amaranth> highvoltage: your clock is about 4 minutes off?
[11:23] <juliux> now i can start with the real projects ;)
[11:23] <ogra_thin> there we grow :)
[11:23] <juliux> thxs cbx33 
[11:24] <highvoltage> Amaranth: yes, well, at least the box i'm ssh'ed into ;) (i don't have root)
[11:24] <ogra_thin> ok, any other business ?
[11:24] <ogra_thin> going once
[11:24] <ogra_thin> going twice
[11:24] <pygi> sold :)
[11:24] <ogra_thin> adjourned
[11:24] <Amaranth> $1!
[11:24] <ogra_thin> :)
[11:24] <highvoltage> goodnight everyone, keep well!
[11:24] <juliux> gn8 highvoltage 
[11:25] <ogra_thin> general chatter goes on in #edubuntu :)
[11:25] <pygi> Amaranth, $2. don't lower the price now :P