/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2006/08/08/#edubuntu.txt

mhzDo we have any 'ideal' url to submit artwrok to?12:20
mhzartwork ;)12:20
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bddebianHello04:18
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cbx33hey highvoltage 07:33
cbx33howz it going07:33
highvoltagehey cbx33 07:34
highvoltagegreat and you?07:34
highvoltageyou're up early!07:34
cbx33yup07:34
cbx33sorint out my ubuntu studio for some recording this afternoon07:34
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cbx33hopefully got two new themes to record :D07:38
cbx33and I may possibly conceive some new ones at work today07:38
jsgotangcoheh07:42
cbx33i think my colleague thinks I'm strange when I run back to my desk, pick up my pocket pc and start singing to it07:43
crimsunthat goes without saying.07:43
cbx33heheh07:43
bimberi_cbx33: how about the sound of fingernails on blackboard (to go with the background)? ;p07:43
crimsunthe good news, of course, is that everyone is bizarre. :)07:43
cbx33thanks for the help crimsun 07:43
crimsunnp07:43
cbx33bimberi_, I just don't think it would gel07:44
cbx33imho07:44
bimberi_awww07:44
bimberi_cbx33: more seriously, when i ride to my sons' school there is this 'cacophony of the playground' to be heard.  Perhaps something like that (faded in/out)?07:48
cbx33bimberi_, if you have a mic07:49
cbx33please record it :p07:49
cbx33seing as school is out for summer here, and you'd probably more likely to hear...you*%*&$ $**^* from this age of kids07:50
bimberi_lol07:50
bimberi_hm i don't have any good quality recording gear but i'll see what i can do07:51
cbx33:D07:52
cbx33rihgt I'm off for breakie07:54
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RichEdhello ... popping in for a sec :)08:28
jsgotangcohey RichEd08:29
RichEdhi jsgotangco :)08:30
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nixternalthere was a link to a package, "school tools" or similar i had ran across in the past...anyone know what i am talking about?  it seems i have either confused myself, or i can't find it08:51
nixternali did a wiki page on some package a month or so ago, and i cannot remember the name08:51
nixternalfound it...CanDo08:54
Burgundavianixternal: and schooltool08:55
nixternalnot tools08:55
nixternalthat was my mistake ;)08:55
nixternalBurgundavia: im chatting with jbrouhard and he has something similar but proprietary that he can't switch from that he uses in his taekwondo academy08:56
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chris449hi09:02
chris449when installing edubuntu it gets up to building ltsp chroot09:03
chris449then the screen goes black with 2 dots on it09:03
chris449what's wrong?09:03
chris449i thought it was the cd09:04
chris449so i used a new cd the same problem09:05
RichEdchris449: at around 50% 60% ?09:06
RichEdi had the same thing ... also thought the install was broken ... but it was a graphics display issue09:07
chris44950% exactly09:09
RichEdah ... same symptoms09:10
chris4493 times i've tried09:10
chris449u fix it?09:10
RichEdmy install is continued in the background, and after 20-30 mins, the CD drive popped open, requesting a reboot09:10
chris449ah ok09:10
chris449so just ignore it?09:10
RichEdyou need to be patient ... i hard booted twice :)09:10
chris449lol09:10
RichEdyep, looks like the graphics driver does not like the text mode install load, and cannot display properly09:11
chris449out of interest can the workstation install still run server type programs eg http etc09:11
RichEdwhen it rebots, it goes into graphics mode, and all is okay09:11
chris449kool09:11
RichEdchris449:  you'll need to check on the site for exact info, my understanding is still a bit limited. main difference is that the server has LTSP hosting09:12
RichEdand the server has a non-graphical web server loaded09:13
chris449do u know if edubuntu has all the same features as ubuntu - but more09:13
chris449sorry09:13
RichEdbut there should be no reason why you cannot install something like say Apache on Edubntu "w/s"09:13
chris449let me rephrase09:13
chris449ah ok09:13
chris449that was what i meant09:13
RichEdopen to correction :) my early opinion09:13
chris449anything that works on ubuntu works on edubuntu?09:14
RichEdubuntu is the engine of edubuntu09:14
chris449so yes?09:14
RichEdedubuntu is ubuntu with educational applications packaged09:14
chris449coz i used shipit to get the edubuntu cds and can't be stuffed waiting for my ubuntu cds09:14
chris449ah ok09:14
chris449thanks09:14
RichEdedubuntu server has LTSP packaged09:14
chris449actually, that probably suits my purposes more09:14
chris449this could be interesting - playing with this distro09:14
RichEdany native LINUX functionality is done at a Ubuntu level09:15
chris449kool09:15
chris449that's what i wanted to hear09:15
RichEdedubuntu is the next layer above09:15
chris449kk09:15
RichEdnot to be taken as 100% gospel ... but that's the high level view09:16
chris449eh ok09:16
chris449now i just gotta wait another 45 mins to let it install omg :(09:16
chris449u wouldn't know anything about grub would u?09:17
RichEdcrack open a frostie and pop another shrimp etc .... while you wait09:17
RichEdchris449: you looking to edit mutiple boots ?09:18
chris449u aussie too?09:18
chris449well09:18
chris449the reason i'm installing edubuntu09:18
chris449is coz i installed ubuntu dual boot with win xp09:18
chris449it worked for a couple of days09:19
chris449then i started it up one day09:19
RichEdspringbok supporter, still living in home country09:19
chris449and it perpetually rebooted09:19
chris449springbok?09:19
chris449so i reinstall grub from my live cd09:19
chris449then boot to windows09:19
RichEdza - south africa09:19
chris449ah ok09:19
chris449i poke around in windows for a bit, and decide to make sure ubuntu is ok09:20
chris449reboot09:20
chris449it perpetually restarts the computer09:20
chris449so idk what to do09:20
chris449it keeps happening09:20
chris449i went through all that twice09:20
chris449gave up09:20
chris449and thought i'll just install a new distro09:20
chris449it always gets to grub loading stage 1.509:21
RichEdbrb09:21
chris449stage 1.5 is one after the MBR, when it's reading from the grub part on the rest of the harddrisk09:21
RichEdpop into #ubuntu ... there are more people there ... regarding our thread above, your question is then an ubuntu question, not an edubuntu question09:22
RichEddoes that now make sense ?09:22
chris449lol yeh09:24
chris449i asked it there09:24
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pygicbx33, weee ^_^12:07
cbx33hi pygi 12:08
cbx33you sound....um....happy :p12:08
cbx33anyone here every install phpmyadmin fro mthe repos?12:09
lucasvocbx33: yes12:10
cbx33from what I've seen in tutorals it should just be accessible via localhost/phpmyadmin12:10
cbx33but it doesnt work12:10
lucasvoyou have apache working?12:10
cbx33yes12:10
lucasvois there a phpmyadmin vhost in sites-enabled/?12:10
cbx33no12:11
pygicbx33, I ain't happy :) I was supposed to go fishing, rain ruined it :(12:11
cbx33awww sorry pygi 12:11
pygicbx33, it's not your fault, lol :)12:11
cbx33heheh12:11
lucasvocbx33: is there one in the other sites- folder?12:11
cbx33hang on12:11
lucasvoI don't remember the name12:11
cbx33no12:11
lucasvowhere is the phpmyadmin directory?12:12
cbx33 /usr/share I think12:12
cbx33i normally install from source12:12
cbx33thought I'd give the repos a try12:12
cbx33:S12:12
lucasvojust create a vhost to it12:12
cbx33thanks lucasvo 12:24
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highvoltagewhat's the username/password for schooltool again?01:34
ogramaster/schooltool ?01:37
ogranot sure 01:37
highvoltagei thought it was administrator/schooltool, but that's not working on this machine (with default install :/ )01:40
ograhmm ...01:41
ogralocaldev is working so far ... but how do i work around the moment where a user unplugs all devices at the same time ...01:42
pygiogra, queue?01:43
ogrameh, that makes my little script so bloated01:43
ogracurrently i have a 18 lines udev rule for mounting, 10 lines for unmounting and 40 lines in the user session ...01:44
ograthats all that was needed ...01:44
ograwith a queue i think the lenght would at least double ... and make the code more complicated01:44
pygiperhaps, but it will work ^_^01:45
ograhmm 01:45
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pygisemaphor ^_^01:45
ograbut i guess i have to queue ... if the user removes an usb hub with 10 devices attached only one will be removed from the desktop01:46
ograabart from that it works wonderful :)01:46
ogra*apart01:46
pygi:)01:47
pygiqueue is not that "lots of lines" :)01:47
ograand wasnt hard to implement ... we could have had it in dapper already01:47
ograif i only had had that idea :)01:47
ograhmm, and my camera is detected as floppy ... to sad 01:50
ograbut thats a kernel thing i cant fix :/ 01:50
ograso we'll have no nifty camera icon :(01:50
lucasvoogra: it's only with your model or in general?01:51
ograi guess its in general ...01:51
ograthe ernel detects the SD card, nit the camera01:51
ogra*not01:51
lucasvooh01:51
pygiogra, patch the kernel ^_^01:51
ograpygi, how ? the kernel can ony detect the device the cam provides01:52
ograall non PTP cameras will expose a floppy device (sd card)01:53
ograits an HW issue with the cam01:53
ograi could build a huge database and make udev check for the camera model and name ... but that would slow down everything significantly01:54
lucasvoogra: doesn't something like this already exist?01:54
ogranope01:54
ograyou mean libgphoto ...01:54
ograthats only for PTP01:55
ograwhich we cant support at all01:55
ogra(yet)01:57
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pygiogra, or make the device give you it's manufacturer and model string ^_^02:09
ograi have that 02:09
ograthats not the prob02:09
RichEdhi ogra02:13
ograpygi, that would still require a DB, to match against02:15
ograhey RichEd 02:15
RichEdany sign of rodarvus today ?02:15
RichEdand b.t.w. did the calendar meeting update work ? the move from wed to tue ?02:15
ogranope :)02:16
ograbut you asked before if we'd be fine with a meeting today :)02:16
RichEdokay ... we'll see if he turns up in tne next 15 mins.02:17
pygiogra, DB right. but we get much better performance as we don't search accross entire database02:17
RichEdogra: i'm just wrapping up with the background email for our discussion. will send in 5 mins. no need to read through, we'll all go through it together.02:18
pygiogra, especially if we use something light as sqlite02:19
ograRichEd, ok, fine with me :)02:19
ograpygi, sqlite ??? on a thin client ? 02:19
pygiogra, eh, thin client can auth devices against server02:21
ograwhat for ? 02:23
ograoh, you mean running the db on the server ... 02:23
ogranah02:23
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pygiogra, what's the problem with it?02:24
ograi'm just getting rid of all the server client communication madness :)02:24
pygieh :)02:24
ograi want everything thats related to mounting to be run by udev scripts02:24
ograkeep it as small and tiny as possible 02:24
ograthen i do a fuse export of the dir i mount the devs to ...02:24
pygiright :)02:25
RichEdhi rodarvus :) was wondering if the calendar update move from wed to tue had confused arrangements02:25
ograin the session there runs a simple script  that monitors the mounted dir locally on the server02:25
rodarvusRichEd: sorry, I'm having problems with my computer02:25
ograif a dev is added it links it to the desktop and puts an entry into the gtk-boomarks file02:25
rodarvusactually, right now I'm only able to boot my wifes desktop02:25
ograas siple as it can be02:26
rodarvusand  it is... yeah, a Windows machine02:26
rodarvus*shame*02:26
=== RichEd puts on protection
ograrodarvus, do you happen to know if Xorg has a --nolog option or something like that ? my clients eat up memory through constant writing to the log02:27
rodarvusogra: I'd have to research02:27
ograwell, then leave it, i can research it myself02:27
rodarvusbut yeah, quite likely02:27
ogramuch worse is that my dmesg ringbuffer grows in ugly ways with every device i add/remove02:28
lucasvoogra: but missing eject buttons buggers me02:30
ogralucasvo, ??02:31
ograyou just pull out the device02:31
lucasvoogra: about not being able to eject the device correctly02:31
ograno need for eject buttons02:31
ograits sync mounted02:31
lucasvoogra: but in this case, you can't know if someone was writing to it02:31
ograsure, you have a copy dialog from nautius or no command prompt on the console while copying02:32
lucasvoogra: well, if I copy a 100mb file to a flashcard and I remove it.02:32
RichEdogra & rodarvus : 5 mins. then i'll come across to ask you to join #canonical meeting02:32
ograif you pull it during that time it will indeed be corrupted02:32
rodarvus'k02:32
lucasvoogra: you can't count on every app showing that it's writing to disk02:32
lucasvofor example openoffice autosave02:32
ograbut there was a clear indicator that it was copying02:33
ograooo indicates it02:33
lucasvoogra: well, and you think a normal user knows that it means do not remove device?02:33
ograyes02:33
lucasvoogra: what if you open the gnome photo application begin to copy photos from device to desktop forget about it and remove02:34
lucasvoyou will end up having only half of the data on the disk and with an already reformatted flash card02:34
ograas he knows it on windows 02:34
lucasvoogra: in windows there is an eject button02:34
ogranot for my floppy02:35
lucasvoogra: I am talking about flashcards02:35
lucasvoI don't even have a floppydrive02:35
ograi'm talking about block devices in general02:35
ograand all win users i have seen just ignored the eject button in the notification area02:35
lucasvoyes, and windows has an eject button for block devices02:35
lucasvoogra: well, if you have critical data you normally don't02:36
ograwhich is totally fine02:36
ograas long as its sync mounted it will write through and not buffer anything ...02:36
ogranautilus has a copy bar that indicates its busy 02:36
lucasvoogra: but writing takes time.02:36
ogramost other apps as well02:37
ograi dont see any issue here, neither did the people that discussed the spec02:37
lucasvowhy don't you do it?02:37
ograwhy dont i do what ?02:37
lucasvoogra: add an eject button02:37
lucasvoI showed you several cases where this feauture might be critical02:37
lucasvoogra: even if there is one, noone has to use it02:38
ograbecause that would need communication, raise the mem requirements by some MB for the client, would need patches to nautilus and other gnome stuff etc02:38
lucasvobut at least you can tell the people who lost their data that they should eject it.02:38
ograi didnt see any cases where i would see that as valid02:38
ograif the user unplugs while a copy dialog is in progress, its his own fault02:39
lucasvoogra: you not only have to protect the user from the machine but also from himself02:39
ograyes, thats why we have copy progressbars02:39
lucasvoogra: I don't know of any policy that a programm has to clearly indicate r/w operations in debian/ubuntu02:40
ograme neither ...02:40
lucasvoto get included02:40
lucasvoogra: so you can't count on the progressbar.02:40
ograsure i can02:40
ogralucasvo, if you prefer the way you outlined here, feel free to implement it02:41
lucasvono, I'll file a bug. which you can't reject but mark as low priority...02:41
lucasvothat's fine with me02:41
ograi will reject it anyway02:41
lucasvoare there any guidelines on how to treat bugs?02:42
ograthere surely are 02:42
Petarislucasvo: Only if they are on the endangered speices list ;)02:43
lucasvo:P02:43
RichEdogra & rodarvus : move across to #canonical-meeting when you are ready please02:43
ogralucasvo, the way it gets implemented is the way ltsp.org uses it since half a year ... it didnt cause any probs there ... it will be implemented according to the spec we worked out in paris ... if you want something different, feel free to file a bug which i then mark whishlist and which will not get fixed until you send the 100s of patches for all the desktop apps02:44
ogra(and implement a network transparent hal and udev)02:45
ograRichEd, 5mins please02:46
ogra(phone)02:46
RichEdogra okay :)02:46
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PetarisAnyone familiar with sadms?02:53
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bddebianHello03:50
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sunnzy13Hi04:02
sunnzy13I have compiled a hello world program.04:02
sunnzy13But ./hello says: "bash: ./hello: Permission denied"04:03
ogramake it executable ;)04:03
sunnzy13Is the execution of programs disabled in edubuntu on terminals?04:03
sunnzy13I did.04:03
ograchmod +x ./hello04:03
sunnzy13-rwxr-xr-x 1 z z 17701 2006-08-08 23:59 hello04:03
sunnzy13Compiled binaries are by default, executable anyway.04:04
ograright 04:04
sunnzy13So, what's going on?04:04
sunnzy13How do I fix this?04:04
rodarvussunnzy13: apparently you did something unusual to your system (or when you compiled this program)04:06
sunnzy13It is a fresh install.04:06
rodarvussunnzy13: "or when you compiled this program"04:06
sunnzy13Not really.04:06
rodarvussunnzy13: what 'ldd hello' returns/04:06
sunnzy13I tried to execute other binaries before, that I downloaded from the web04:07
sunnzy13        not a dynamic executable04:07
sunnzy13What does this mean?04:07
sunnzy13Umm04:08
sunnzy13The other binaries that I downloaded has this too.04:09
rodarvussunnzy13: "file ./hello" returns what?04:18
sunnzy13rodarvus, hello: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, version 1 (SYSV), for GNU/Linux 2.2.0, dynamically linked (uses shared libs), for GNU/Linux 2.2.0, not stripped04:24
rodarvussunnzy13: so, yeah, I told you there is something wrong with your file04:28
rodarvusit is not static "dynamically linked (uses shared libs)"04:28
sunnzy13So...04:28
sunnzy13What do I do?04:28
rodarvusthough "ldd" says it is "not a dynamic executable"04:29
sunnzy13Ok04:31
sunnzy13So how do I fix it?04:31
rodarvuswell, please keep in mind that this is surely not related to Edubuntu, so it makes very little sense to discuss it further on this irc channel :)04:33
rodarvusbut I'd suggest you to redo the steps you followed to compile this problem04:33
rodarvusquite carefully04:33
rodarvusand see if the problem persists04:33
sunnzy13I think this is indeed related to Edubuntu.04:34
sunnzy13I have done this at school this morning.04:34
sunnzy13And I had trouble running other binaries that I downloaded from the net.04:34
sunnzy13It worked at school.04:35
Petarisogra: just got AD authentication working on LTSP  :D04:38
ograyay04:39
PetarisI used sadms04:39
Petarishttp://sadms.sourceforge.net/04:39
Petarisnow I just need to get mapped home folders04:39
Petarisand some how setup a default profile for the users the first time they login04:40
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sbalneavMorning all04:45
bddebianHello sbalneav04:46
sbalneavMorning bddebian!04:46
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highvoltagehi bddebian and sbalneav 04:56
bddebianHeya highvoltage04:57
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sunnzy13Ok.05:20
sunnzy13It is definately Edubuntu's problem.05:21
sunnzy13I have just done the exactly the same thing to a different box05:21
sunnzy13And it worked perfectly fine.05:21
sunnzy13Maybe it has something to do with gcc on Edubuntu?05:22
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d2kHiya, is edubuntu available with a LTSP setup?05:27
pygid2k, I mean what? :)05:28
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d2kok.. so I just read the install notes on Edubuntu, so it by default creates an LTSP server05:30
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sbalneavogra: ping05:31
ograsbalneav, pong (in meeting ... bb asap)05:32
sbalneavping me 05:32
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RichEdNote: Women's Day public holiday in South Africa tomorrow05:59
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ograsbalneav, ping :)06:17
sbalneavogra: pong, in /msg06:18
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scribe63greeting checking to see if anyone knows if moodle will be updated to version 1.6 any time soon06:28
ograis it updated in debian ? 06:28
ograthen we can easily ask for it to be synced 06:29
scribe63can it added to synaptics repositories06:32
ograif its in debian we can sync it to edgy 06:34
scribe63there is a moodle 1.6-2 in debian testing06:34
scribe63i'm using dapper which i upgraded from breezy06:36
ograogra@edubuntu:~$ apt-cache madison moodle06:37
ogra    moodle | 1.6-2ubuntu1 | http://archive.ubuntu.com edgy/universe Packages06:37
ograseems we already have it06:37
scribe63i'm using dapper can i safely use the 1.6-2 version in debian testing06:41
ograno06:41
ogradont use debian packages in ubuntu06:41
ograyou can ask the backports team for a backport ... file a bug that asks for it and subscribe (dont assign) the ubuntu-backports team06:42
scribe63will try that, i'm interested in exploring the LAMS module, what getting the tarball from moodle .org, is that workable06:45
ograno idea, i never tried that 06:46
ograbut LAMS is on our feature goal list ... so i'll likely have to at some point :)06:47
scribe63thanks for your assistance06:48
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kai__Hello from liverpool, am I reaching anyone?08:27
rodarvuskai__, yes08:27
rodarvushello, btw08:27
kai__What have you been discussing?08:28
kai__btw?08:29
kai__I'm looking at edubuntu as a possible home/flexischooling tool.08:34
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kai__good luck to you all and thankyou for your hard work, I'm of to cook.08:41
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Yagisan!mhz08:53
ubotuI know nothing about mhz - try searching http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi?db=ubuntu08:53
Yagisan!seen mhz08:53
ubotuI last saw mhz (n=mhz@moinmoin/fan/mhz) 19h 30m 25s ago, quiting: "Leaving"08:54
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jryerWhen I try to save as docbook in Writer, it hangs. Anyone know how to fix this?09:53
Burgworkjryer, use a better docbook editor?09:54
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Burgworkjryer, seriously, what are you working on>09:57
Burgwork?09:57
pygihey Burgwork :)09:57
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jryerburgwork, sorry went away for a while. I am working to create a manual or curriculum for our adolescent program at Save the Children here in La Paz10:13
SpecHeya - how do I make ltsp clients (in edubuntu) boot text-mode only? Do I set RUNLEVEL in lts.conf or do I do something like SCREEN_01 = something?10:13
jryerburgwork, what can you recommend?10:14
Burgworkjryer, I recommend you write docbook with an actual editor, such as bluefish10:14
jryeris it free?10:15
jryerBurgwork, will check it out.10:16
Burgworkbluefish is10:17
Burgworkpackage: bluefish10:17
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UbuntugamerIs there any education program to learn the musical notes for Ubuntu ???? 10:21
UbuntugamerIs there any education program to learn the musical notes for Ubuntu ???? 10:22
Burgworkyes10:22
Ubuntugamerwhere can i get it ?10:22
Burgworkin the repos10:23
Burgworksearch add/remove for something, the same is escaping me right now10:23
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Ubuntugamerdo u remember the program's name ?10:23
Burgworkno, sorry10:24
BurgworkUbuntugamer, dig around here: http://gnomefiles.org/category.php?cat_id=110:24
crimsunscore-reading-trainer is Qt-based, I think10:25
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Amaranthogra: I got a Fedex notification from google today. :)11:01
BurgworkAmaranth, you must be a happy man11:01
AmaranthIndeed, although it's two days late. Cable guy came and took my modem yesterday.11:02
Burgworkno money?11:02
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AmaranthNope, I'm flat broke.11:02
ograAmaranth, ouch11:02
Burgworkgeez, you should have told us, some of us could have fronted you some to cover the gap11:03
AmaranthI've been staying at my grandparents so it hasn't been that much of an issue.11:03
AmaranthNow that I'm getting the money I can pay my credit card and cable, those are the only things I'm behind on.11:04
AmaranthGoing to have to put a lot on the credit card, my $2400 laptop has turned into a $3000 laptop already.11:04
crimsunyeah, no kidding. Just yell already when such a situation arises.11:10
crimsun(heck, we [some]  did the same for \sh)11:11
Burgworkcrimsun, you guys bailed him out?11:11
crimsunat least several people contributed, yes.11:11
Burgworkthat is what the community is for11:12
crimsunindeed.11:13
Burgworkfunny how we are willing to give money/stuff to people we have barely met11:13
Burgworkthere are literally hundreds of studies on the uniqueness of human altruism11:13
crimsunI agree it's unique, but FLOSS is in and of itself a study in altruism.11:14
Burgworkyes, it is11:15
Amaranthyeah, i was planning on giving money when \sh was having problems then i ended up not getting my check from the school that month because i turned in my timesheet too late :P11:16
Amaranthso i went from offering to having to borrow :/11:16
Amaranthanyway, back later, have to charge my battery11:17
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lucasvowhere can I find that link for bigger orders on shipit: https://shipit.ubuntu.com/myrequest?12:02
lucasvoI'd like to order about 150 cds(ubuntu)12:02
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