[12:15] <Hobbsee> morning all
[12:16] <allee> Hobbsee: morning
[12:16] <Riddell> good morning Hobbsee 
[12:16] <Hobbsee> hey allee, Riddell :)
[12:16] <Hobbsee> (wow, Riddell is still up? i must be online early!)
[12:18] <Riddell> it's only past 11
[12:19] <Hobbsee> Riddell: good point.  i never think of UK timezones while up this early.  i usually think that my start of day is when all the UK people are asleep.
[12:21] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: you are up too early
[12:22] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: yeah, i know.  at least i wont get lectured for a few hours today, which means i wont lose my sanity quite so quickly...
[12:24] <Riddell> superstoned: do you have  /usr/share/hwdb-client/sound.wav ?
[12:24] <Riddell> superstoned: and does `artsplay /usr/share/hwdb-client/sound.wav` do anything?  that's all the hwdb client does
[12:25] <Hobbsee> oh yeah, that's what i was going to test...
[12:27] <Hobbsee> 95% [16 Sources 38396/265kB 14%]  [15 Sources 142537/265kB 53%]                                   429B/s 13m33s
[12:27] <Hobbsee> yay.....
[12:28] <Hobbsee> oh cool!!!
[12:36] <allee> Riddell: sound.wav is here and artsplay plays it happily but hwdb-client sound check -> no sound
[12:37] <Riddell> allee: you get the animated speaker?
[12:37] <allee> Riddell: no
[12:39] <Riddell> allee: what version are you using? from kubuntu.org?
[12:40] <allee> Riddell: URL you posted 0.6-0ubuntu11
[12:40] <Hobbsee> hmm.  are we supposed to hear sound?
[12:41] <Hobbsee> and an option to replay the sound would be cool, in case we've got systems muted the first time around, etc - especially as there's no back button
[12:42] <Hobbsee> interesting, my sound has gone awol.
[12:42] <Riddell> ok, new version uploaded http://kubuntu.org/~jriddell/hwdb/
[12:42] <Riddell> Hobbsee: if you don't get an animated speaker you have a broken version
[12:43] <Riddell> it's got a Test Again button, I'll add a Back button and I'll look at getting to set the volume to something sane
[12:43] <Hobbsee> hey cool, it didtn last version
[12:44] <Hobbsee> pcm was muted.  curse it.
[12:44] <Hobbsee> even aplay screwed up with that.
[12:48] <Hobbsee> Riddell: you know what else that thing needs?  a "add this page to my LP account" or something - an option to type in your LP ID, so that we can get a users system specs if they've run the database.
[12:49] <Hobbsee> bah.  not much of use there.
[12:49] <allee> heh, guidance p-m claims I have a 50 % loaded battery in my desktop
[12:49] <Riddell> allee: I've not worked out the best way to decide whether to show the applet or not.  maybe I should just use laptop-detect
[12:50] <imbrandon> lol @ allee
[12:50] <Riddell> Hobbsee: people would get nervous if it wasn't anonymous
[12:50] <Hobbsee> Riddell: true that.  isnt that why it would be an option?
[12:50] <Riddell> Hobbsee: but that's playing with the database which I'm not doing for edgy, might well for edgy+1 though
[12:50] <imbrandon> Hobbsee: you could probably poke the guys in LP to add a field to the profile of LP users just as the jabber field and such for the whdb link
[12:51] <Hobbsee> Riddell: right, yep
[12:51] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: true that.  first i want a tickbox for "this is a wishlist" for the bugs.
[12:51] <imbrandon> lol
[12:51] <allee> Riddell: fwiw laptop-detect return the right thing for my laptop and desktop system
[12:52] <imbrandon> Riddell: mine too, just checked ( the laptop-detect thing )
[12:52] <Riddell> allee: question is, if the applet doesn't show itself how do I get the user to be able to hibernate
[12:53] <allee> Riddell: but display brightness (never tried) suspend and hypernate are interesting for a desktop sys too
[12:53] <allee> Riddell: yeah
[12:53] <Riddell> we need to patch ksmserver
[12:53] <imbrandon> Riddell: more key bindings maybe ?
[12:53] <Riddell> I looked at the suse patch but it needs re-written to work with HAL, and on the night I looked at it I wasn't feeling up to it :)
[12:53] <imbrandon> heheh
[12:54] <allee> Riddell: if ! laptop-detect then set icon 'Powercable' instead of 'Battery+Powercable'?
[12:55] <allee> Riddell: grep. 0ubuntu12 plays the test sound now
[12:55] <Hobbsee> while i remember, we probably should check out kcfmclient, or whatever it is - whatever is setting the default browser, so that we can actually *have* a default browser for all apps over the entire system.
[12:56] <allee> Riddell: there's a dot after the soundcard name missing
[12:56] <Riddell> Hobbsee: default browser in KDE is konqueror, Debian's www-browser might not match KDE's browser however
[12:56] <Hobbsee> Riddell: true that.  i'm meaning that if you change it in system settings, it doesnt actually reflect across the whole system - just most of it.
[12:57] <Hobbsee> the stuff that still uses kfcmclient, or whatever it is, all still use konq.
[12:57] <Hobbsee> which would be "a bug", i suspect
[12:57] <Riddell> allee: agreed, add it to the Feedback page and I'll not forget it
[12:57] <allee> k
[12:59] <Hobbsee> class time
[01:04] <allee> Cool. Most of the 'special keys' of my usb keyboard work!
[01:04] <Riddell> yay
[01:05] <Riddell> allee: which keys do you have?
[01:05] <Riddell> allee: edgy?
[01:05] <allee> edgy yes ...
[01:06] <nixternal> http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/?xml=32f91fc9a56f28e86cadc0d209fec794
[01:06] <imbrandon> wow , actualy so do mine , cool
[01:06] <nixternal> Riddell: sweet job on that hardware database stuff!!
[01:06] <imbrandon> the only ones that dont are my browerser back/forward/stop buttons
[01:06] <allee> forward backwork stop reload [House icons - does not work]  email [TFT icon -does not work]  [calculator - does not work]  mute stop prev next audiostart/pause [note - does not work] , [volume key - does notwork] 
[01:07] <imbrandon> ohh yea and calculator dosent work
[01:08] <Riddell> calculator doesn't have a standard keycode, we can't set that by default
[01:08] <Riddell> volume keys should work
[01:08] <allee> imbrandon: calcumtor has keycode ... ?  here it's oh,  it had Keysym 'F12
[01:08] <Riddell> allee: presumably you have two volume keys?
[01:08] <imbrandon> allee: http://www.buntudot.org/people/~imbrandon/misc/workzone.jpg  <--- is that the keyboard you have ?
[01:09] <allee> Riddell: no, one 'key' you can turn to left and right .. wait picture ..
[01:10] <imbrandon> Riddell: calc isnt the same on all keyboards with it ?
[01:10] <Riddell> allee: what keycode does xev report it to be?
[01:10] <Riddell> imbrandon: not as far as I can tell
[01:10] <allee> http://www.mpe.mpg.de/~ach/tmp/dell-black-multimedia-keyboard-with-usb-hub.jpg
[01:11] <Riddell> weird
[01:11] <imbrandon> hrm dinner brb
[01:11] <allee> Riddell: xev shows nothing.  AFAIR when I looked into it, I found nothing at all, when using kern module evdebug
[01:12] <Riddell> ah well, not much can be done about it then :(
[01:12] <allee> not sure it it's name was evbug
[01:12] <allee> yes
[01:14] <allee> Is XF86Mail really expected to open 'e-mail composer' window?  At least me expected kmail/kontact coming up
[01:17] <allee> #$%^@: special keys stoped working :(  ...
[01:18] <allee> When one sets keyboard layout in 'regional and languae'  XF86* settings are lost (as I almost expected ;)
[01:19] <allee> Riddell: are the XF86* defs loaded via setxbkmap  not via #inculdes in the xdb/symbols/ files?
[01:21] <mornfall> aaaaa
[01:22] <mornfall> *wasted(*
[01:22] <mornfall> -(
[01:22] <allee> mornfall: ?
[01:22] <mornfall> absinth + tequilla + beer = evil
[01:22] <allee> lol
[01:22] <mornfall> world is spinning freely, regardless of what i want
[01:23] <mornfall> fiancee broke up with me last thursday... hurts
[01:23] <mornfall> but now... world is spinning
[01:23] <mornfall> like, totally
[01:23] <imbrandon> heh
[01:42] <superstoned> riddell: /usr/share/hwdb-client/sound.wav is there. and artsplay works. but no sound.
[01:45] <seaLne> Riddell: bug #55501 shoud sec policy be part of system-settings, i don't think it should appear as a standalone item in the menu
[01:45] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 55501 in kdeadmin "secpolicy ships no .desktop" [Unknown,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/55501
[02:59] <bddebian> Hello
[03:15] <Hobbsee> hi again all
[03:16] <bddebian> Hello again Ms. Kubuntu :-)
[03:17] <freeflying> morning all
[03:17] <bddebian> Hi freeflying
[03:17] <Hobbsee> bddebian: hah.  so i'm married to Mr Kubuntu now?
[03:17] <bddebian> No, that would be Mrs. Kubuntu :-)
[03:18] <Hobbsee> oh, guess Ms can refer to either Miss.  or Mrs
[03:30] <Hobbsee> drat.  i uploaded something this morning, and now, 2 hours later, there's an update from debian about it.
[03:30] <bddebian> I hate that
[03:41] <Hobbsee> it looks to be a straight sync, but they've done the rules file differently
[03:41] <Hobbsee> looks like fabo/toma/etc maintain it
[03:51] <glick> excuse me, is there a reason why reiserfs isnt available as an option in the kubuntu desktop install?
[03:51] <Hobbsee> glick: alternate or desktop cd install?
[03:51] <glick> desktop
[03:52] <Hobbsee> glick: because it hasnt been written yet.
[03:52] <Hobbsee> actually, i'm not sure if it's now on the edgy install cds
[03:52] <glick> cause its like 50 times faster then ext3 you would think it would be the default instead of crappy ext3
[03:54] <imbrandon> glick: becouse qtparted thats used dosent support reiserfs, you can use the alternate if you want it
[03:54] <imbrandon> it will be avaible in the future
[03:54] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: good point.  i didnt know that.
[03:55] <glick> cool
[03:58] <Hobbsee> hi jjesse 
[03:58] <jjesse> hiya Hobbsee
[03:59] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: i only worked with qtparted a little bit.  for dh_iconcache.  anything else looked far too scary
[03:59] <imbrandon> lol
[03:59] <imbrandon> heya jjesse
[03:59] <Hobbsee> that was a fair few months ago though
[04:02] <jjesse> hiya imbrandon
[04:03] <jjesse> sorry for the delay :)
[04:06] <jjesse> @timechicago
[04:06] <jjesse> @ time chicago
[04:06] <Ubugtu> Current time in America/Chicago: August 16 2006, 21:06:56
[04:28] <nixternal> jjesse: you forget the time?
[04:28] <nixternal> plus you aren't in the chicago time zone, you are one up ;)
[04:28] <jjesse> nixternal: grin i'm in nebraska same time zone :)
[04:28] <nixternal> oh
[04:28] <nixternal> corn huskers!!!
[04:29] <nixternal> while you are there, make us a Kubuntu crop circle
[04:37] <bddebian> heh
[04:37] <jjesse> mmmm crop circles
[04:39] <Hobbsee> crop circles?
[04:43] <ajmitch> firefox-using aliens?
[04:43] <nixternal> oh ya Hobbsee, they are the talk of the land..it seems what ever firefox does, the ubuntu marketing teams wants to do
[04:43] <nixternal> ajmitch: you hit it right on the head
[04:43] <Hobbsee> ahhh...right...
[04:43] <ajmitch> nixternal: such imagination
[04:43] <nixternal> hehe
[04:44] <nixternal> i told them that it was done in firefox..they didn't believe me until i showed them all the "crop circle" tutorials out there
[04:44] <nixternal> s/firefox/photoshop ;)
[04:44] <nixternal> you know since firefox and photoshop are so close to being the same ;)
[04:44] <nixternal> ok, that was a bad knee jerker, i apologize
[04:44] <ajmitch> who knows, the firefox crop circle may actually be true :)
[04:45] <nixternal> i wouldn't doubt it..i remember when mozilla was here in chicago..they used to do all kinds of whacky things
[05:02] <imbrandon> http://lug.oregonstate.edu/gallery/firefox-crop-circle/mg_5560
[06:53] <Hobbsee> yay.  i hate fixing packages that i've botched.
[07:09] <Hobbsee> but, my menus do recreate correctly now, which fixes another problem.
[08:29] <seaLne> did anything get done about Bug #50387
[08:29] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 50387 in kdenetwork "Default "privacy" settings don't respect privacy" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/50387
[10:22] <imbrandon> nixternal: ping
[10:23] <nixternal> pong
[11:26] <Riddell> seaLne: as far as I can tell secpolicy doesn't do anything
[11:28] <seaLne> does that mean there isn't a way to set it?
[11:32] <Riddell> http://websvn.kde.org/branches/KDE/3.5/kdeadmin/secpolicy/Makefile.am?rev=438982&view=log
[11:33] <Riddell> it was made 6 years ago but never worked on, the program should be deleted
[12:50] <Riddell> abattoir: ping
[12:50] <Riddell> abattoir: what news?
[02:07] <Riddell> "I correct the last bug" some optimism there from my SoC student :)
[02:07] <Riddell> freeflying: damn, I need to look at your scim change, don't let me forget
[02:08] <freeflying> Riddell: :)
[02:08] <freeflying> Riddell: also the scim-qtimm  :)
[03:11] <seaLne> anyone know whats going on with libssp0? it keeps getting removed and then installed on my machine
[03:11] <Hobbsee> hi seaLne 
[03:11] <Hobbsee> er, no?  as in, each upgrade that happens, or it never fully installs, or what?
[03:12] <seaLne> well starting yesterday it got removed this morning it got installed and then just there it got uninstalled
[03:12] <Hobbsee> ah
[03:12] <Hobbsee> sudo dpkg --configure -a?
[03:13] <seaLne> i don't think its related to ff themes being broken
[03:14] <seaLne> ah its just  due to dependancies on specific versions of gcc
[03:14] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[03:50] <Tm_T> hi kids
[03:51] <Tm_T> "Kopete 0.12 has been moved in the KDE 3.5 branch and will be included in KDE 3.5.5"
[03:51] <Tm_T> just so you know ;)
[03:51] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: do you have a changelog for it?
[03:51] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: humm, no
[03:51] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: apachelogger made some packages, which i redid so that they were correct - but we have no changelog for it
[03:51] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: can you find one please?  we cant get a UVF exception without it
[03:52] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: gof just did mv between branches
[03:52] <Tm_T> humm, I'll look at it
[03:52] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: changelog from 0.11.x ?
[03:52] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: changelog from 0.12.1 to 0.12.2, really
[03:53] <Tm_T> ok
[03:59] <Riddell> Hobbsee: we need to ask on the kopete-devel mailing lsit
[03:59] <Riddell> list
[03:59] <Hobbsee> Riddell: right.  can you do it, mailing lists *hate* me...
[04:00] <Riddell> ok
[04:01] <Hobbsee> Riddell: for some reason, my ISP wont let me send email from thunderbird to any @l.u.c address.  go figure.
[04:01] <Hobbsee> Riddell: good morning, btw
[04:04] <Riddell> morning
[04:37] <bddebian> Heya
[04:50] <Hobbsee> allee: ping?
[04:58] <allee> Hobbsee: pong
[04:58] <allee> Hobbsee: you know by addident why for kppp 'call kppp-options' was removed as default option in 'pppd arguments'? ;)
[04:59] <Hobbsee> no, but i doubt that anything was done with it
[04:59] <allee> Hobbsee: heh, had a long fight to get it into debian.
[05:00] <allee> Hobbsee: but I see a can't scare  you away...  So why did you ping me?
[05:00] <Hobbsee> allee: digikam*-docs got rejected for a sync - no upstream licence file.
[05:00] <Hobbsee> wasnt sure who was going to want to fix it
[05:01] <allee> eh??  URL?   you mean no LGPL file in the tarball?
[05:01] <Hobbsee> allee: dont panic about it, i'm not going to eat you :)
[05:01] <Hobbsee> allee: you're not in #ubuntu-devel?
[05:01] <Hobbsee> hmmm
[05:02] <allee> No
[05:02] <Hobbsee> allee: http://rafb.net/paste/results/9sxHmi57.html
[05:02] <Hobbsee> ah
[05:02] <Hobbsee> no, not this late at night - and my head hurts :(
[05:02] <Hobbsee> so i cant take in much info atm anyway
[05:04] <Hobbsee> allee: keybuk's the one you need to speak to - he's the one that checks such things.
[05:04] <Hobbsee> apparently there are bugs in debian about it already
[05:05] <allee> Hobbsee: oh, okay.  checking all this stuff
[05:05] <Hobbsee> cool :)
[05:07] <hunt0r> Does anyone have a solution for this bug? https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/35760
[05:07] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 35760 in Ubuntu "dapper f5: konsole transparency" [Medium,Confirmed]  
[05:09] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: does that happen as a new user?
[05:09] <Hobbsee> and does it happen on kde 3.5.4?
[05:09] <Hobbsee> it goes all pretty like my desktop :)
[05:09] <hunt0r> Hobbsee: well it happens as root and on kde 3.5.4
[05:10] <hunt0r> i deleted .kde/share/apps/konsole and .kde/share/config/konsolerc
[05:10] <hunt0r> and it still there and I really HATE this
[05:11] <hunt0r> and only a few people seem to have this bug so i think there might be a workaround
[05:12] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: what happens if you mv .kde .kdeold and restart x?
[05:12] <Hobbsee> does the problem go away then?
[05:12] <hunt0r> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/kdebase/+bug/52999 <-is a duplicate of this bug ^^
[05:12] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 52999 in kdebase "Konsole Transparency" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  
[05:12] <Hobbsee> oh hello...
[05:13] <hunt0r> just for another dicription maybe you understand then better :)
[05:13] <hunt0r> Hobbsee: hmm... well I have to try that
[05:13] <Hobbsee> setting an option as the default seems to be broken.
[05:14] <Hobbsee> oh, wait, pebkac error
[05:16] <hunt0r> Hobbsee: can you try to select a scheme switch on tranysparancy click on applay then select another scheme and switch back to the one you enabled transparency? On my machine the Transparency setting is then gone
[05:18] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: via settings, schema?  works as expected,
[05:18] <Lure> hunt0r: also here...
[05:18] <hunt0r> hmm... this sux :(
[05:18] <Lure> hunt0r: did you use "Save as Defaults"
[05:19] <hunt0r> Lure: yes I don't have this bug only on kubuntu on other ditros it works
[05:19] <hunt0r> *distros
[05:19] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: i'd try moving your .kde out of the way, and seeing if it still happens
[05:19] <hunt0r> But I don't understand why not everyone has this bug
[05:20] <Hobbsee> if it doesnt, then your config files are to blame
[05:20] <hunt0r> i will do that now brb
[05:20] <Hobbsee> yay for removing all but the most cruicial bits of my config :)
[05:24] <Hobbsee> hi fritsch 
[05:24] <Hobbsee> ohhhh...
[05:24] <Hobbsee> fritsch: i built dapper kopete i386 debs, btw.  i should publish them.  did you get yours to build?
[05:25] <fritsch> Hobbsee: yes they build without problem, with your updated patch
[05:25] <Hobbsee> fritsch: yay :)
[05:25] <fritsch> Hobbsee: did you get my mail with the amarok patch?
[05:25] <Hobbsee> eh.  cant get at them, machine is down for maintenance
[05:25] <Hobbsee> fritsch: yep.  only glanced at it though
[05:26] <fritsch> Hobbsee: i only came to this patch, because, i went from amarok (debian unstable) to ubuntu amarok and wow! doubled the artists in my collection :-)+
[05:27] <Hobbsee> hum.  i might look for the full debdiff for that...
[05:27] <Hobbsee> fritsch: heh.  useful.  any other debian patches that we want?
[05:27] <Hobbsee> *hasnt checked their changelogs*
[05:27] <hunt0r> hi again
[05:27] <Hobbsee> heya
[05:27] <hunt0r> it didn't work :(
[05:27] <hunt0r> same problem with fresh .kde dir
[05:27] <Hobbsee> right
[05:28] <fritsch> Hobbsee: none so far, did not find anything disturbing me amarok
[05:28] <fritsch> Hobbsee: using current edgy on dapper (but did not realize any changes?)
[05:28] <fritsch> Hobbsee: used riddels 1.4.1 before
[05:29] <Hobbsee> right, yep
[05:30] <Hobbsee> no, wait, i only do for -0ubuntu3, not -0ubuntu4, seeing as i didnt do the last change
[05:30] <Hobbsee> or was that kopete...
[05:30] <fritsch> Hobbsee: me runs ubunt3
[05:30] <Hobbsee> fritsch: 1.4.2 will have some nice bugfixes in it - worth updating to it
[05:30] <fritsch> Hobbsee: when was it released?
[05:30] <fritsch> Hobbsee: ah "will have"
[05:30] <Hobbsee> fritsch: it's *not* yet
[05:31] <Hobbsee> 20th, supposedly.  they delayed it.
[05:31] <seaLne> changelog for cdr-tools looks promising
[05:31] <fritsch> Hobbsee: they are still at beta1?
[05:31] <Hobbsee> fritsch: yeah
[05:31] <fritsch> Hobbsee: 20th is damn fast?
[05:31] <fritsch> Hobbsee: is one beta enough?
[05:31] <hunt0r> Hobbsee: do you have another idea why my konsole transperancy does not work the way it should?
[05:31] <Hobbsee> didnt find many/any problems with the beta
[05:32] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: nope.  apart from possible fancy graphics card botch ups, or something
[05:32] <fritsch> Hobbsee: cool, last time i saw you searching 1.4-beta1 builds, did you find something?
[05:32] <hunt0r> Hobbsee: you can not transfer playlist to an Ipod with the current amaroK beta 
[05:33] <Hobbsee> fritsch: yeah.  i've got i386 debs of that, which i'm just using locally here
[05:33] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: ah great.  fixed with 1.4.2 final?
[05:33] <fritsch> Hobbsee: build for edgy, i think, are the sources online?
[05:33] <Hobbsee> ahh...htey might be
[05:34] <fritsch> Hobbsee: I just wait for you ;-) and test you packages
[05:34] <Hobbsee> nope
[05:34] <hunt0r> Hobbsee: I don't know sry
[05:34] <Hobbsee> they arent
[05:34] <Hobbsee> fritsch: they do exist.  they're just on a machine that is currently down for maintenence, on another continent.
[05:35] <Hobbsee> fritsch: sounds good to me
[05:35] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: hmm ok
[05:35] <fritsch> Hobbsee: i am still using dapper... but could upgrade my laptop ... if it would be helpfull
[05:35] <Hobbsee> fritsch: it still likes breaking - i wouldnt upgrade yet
[05:35] <fritsch> Hobbsee: used debian unstable over 5 years ;-)
[05:36] <hunt0r> kdeui (KRootPixmap): [/tmp/buildd/kdelibs-3.5.4/./kdeui/krootpixmap.cpp:271]  activating background exports. Does anyone now what that means? (Message from konsole)
[05:37] <fritsch> Hobbsee: dapper was "partly" a cool release
[05:37] <fritsch> Hobbsee: with kde 3.5.4, amarok 1.4.1, wpasupplicant bakcport, network-manager backport quiet usable
[05:37] <insanekane> hi hunt0r
[05:37] <hunt0r> hi ...
[05:37] <hunt0r> :)
[05:38] <Hobbsee> hi insanekane 
[05:38] <insanekane> hi Hobbsee
[05:38] <fritsch> Hobbsee: i build my own, + network-manager 0.6.4
[05:39] <insanekane> Hobbsee: have you heard anything regarding any networking configuration tool for Kubuntu ?
[05:39] <fritsch> Hobbsee: the standard dapper one, did not realize, when i unloaded wireless modul
[05:39] <fritsch> insanekane: knetworkmanager?
[05:39] <insanekane> Hobbsee: as in, dialup, pppoe, the works ?
[05:39] <Hobbsee> fritsch: scary.  there are a fair few ubuntu patches
[05:39] <insanekane> fritsch: uh ...
[05:39] <Hobbsee> ack, whatever happened to my konversation?
[05:40] <fritsch> Hobbsee: yes, the problem was, even the "original sources" > ubuntu sources version, did not have a go an many computers i saw
[05:40] <fritsch> Hobbsee: wpa troubel, wep trouble, etc.
[05:40] <Hobbsee> true that
[05:41] <Hobbsee> insanekane: network config...ah, _Sime did some nice work with the section in system settings, there were a fair few bugfixes of kubuntu bugs in kde 3.5.4 of it
[05:41] <fritsch> Hobbsee: very cool for dapper are the suspend2 enabled kernels from Bernard Blackham, totally cool, suspend2disk in 20 seconds
[05:41] <Hobbsee> insanekane: i'm assuming knm will be installed/working by default
[05:41] <Hobbsee> fritsch: already discussed on the ubuntu-devel mailing list
[05:41] <insanekane> Hobbsee: knm seems to be very much wireless centric
[05:42] <fritsch> Hobbsee: i was able to enable suspend2 on 3 Computers (athlon, pentium, tv card, nvidia) no matter, totally cool
[05:42] <fritsch> me says "Hello Pavel" :-)+
[05:42] <insanekane> Hobbsee: and pppoeconf doesnt work with the widely used adsl connections available in kerala (india)
[05:43] <Hobbsee> insanekane: it's never worked, iirc
[05:43] <Hobbsee> insanekane: true that....you were asking about dial up?
[05:43] <insanekane> Hobbsee: wierd ... yes
[05:43] <insanekane> Hobbsee: i am looking out for an integrated solution for networking configuration
[05:44] <Hobbsee> besides, suspend2, etc, is not technically a kubuntu (ie, kde dm) issue
[05:44] <fritsch> Hobbsee: yes, of course
[05:44] <Hobbsee> insanekane: i think it's supposed to get it, eventually.  but do tell, if you find one :)
[05:44] <fritsch> Hobbsee: following the kernel lkml discussion since about 2 years
[05:45] <Hobbsee> insanekane: it's not really been looked at, as we dont have the testers for it.  Riddell might know mroe
[05:45] <fritsch> Hobbsee: have to leave, if there are amarok packages, whatever, kopete for dapper, i should test ... just respond to my email
[05:46] <Hobbsee> fritsch: cool :)
[05:46] <Hobbsee> fritsch: there wont be tonight, anyway :)
[05:46] <fritsch> Hobbsee: will sleep tonight ;-)
[05:46] <hunt0r> Are there newer precompiled kernels available for kubuntu?
[05:46] <Hobbsee> hmmm...sleep...
[05:46] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: what version were you after?  packages.ubuntu.com also answers your question
[05:46] <fritsch> Hobbsee: hehe, me thinks of yesterday ... (mate rocks)
[05:47] <insanekane> Hobbsee: whats not been looked at ?
[05:47] <Hobbsee> insanekane: the whole issue of kppp/dialup/etc
[05:47] <insanekane> Hobbsee: actually, from looking around, it seems I would have to write my own app for it
[05:47] <Hobbsee> insanekane: could be more useful to contribute to knm if possible, perhaps?
[05:47] <hunt0r> Hobbsee: Well the 2.16.* bacouse of the better suspend function and so on
[05:48] <insanekane> Hobbsee: riddell told me the network config in kcontrol is extremely buggy
[05:48] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: no, we've only got 2.6.15 on edgy and 2.6.17 on dapper
[05:48] <Hobbsee> insanekane: indeed.
[05:48] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: er...swap the releases there
[05:48] <hunt0r> Hobbsee: well I think 2.6.17.* will do it also xD
[05:49] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: true that.  if you're going to do painful things like that, you may as well upgrade to edgy, and deal with the consequences
[05:49] <Hobbsee> seeing as if you can compile your own kernel, you should be able to manipulate apt.
[05:49] <insanekane> Hobbsee: thats what I said ... it seems to me that knetworkmanager (or its gnome equivalent) is very much wireless oriented
[05:49] <insanekane> Hobbsee: what do you think about it ?
[05:49] <Hobbsee> insanekane: true that.  well, it also works with standard eth0 connections.
[05:49] <Hobbsee> insanekane: dialup stuff, etc, i thought i read was on their to-do list
[05:50] <Hobbsee> actually, i want a patch for knm.
[05:50] <Hobbsee> well, apparently there's one upstream, but i havent been able to find it
[05:50] <insanekane> patch for what ?
[05:50] <Hobbsee> to fix the darned "oh no, i broke, i cant access kwallet, type in your passphrase again" bug.
[05:50] <insanekane> Hobbsee: upstream ? isn't it an Ubuntu project ?
[05:50] <Hobbsee> insanekane: no, knetworkmanager is mostly by kde/opensuse people, iirc
[05:51] <Hobbsee> it's certainly not kubutnu specific
[05:51] <hunt0r> Hobbsee: well I don't want to bouild my own kernel I would like precompiled kernels :)
[05:51] <Hobbsee> insanekane: perhaps you were thinking of katapult?
[05:51] <insanekane> Hobbsee: isn't knetworkmanager a frontend to a mostly gnome project ?
[05:51] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: doubt it will happen
[05:51] <Hobbsee> insanekane: yes.
[05:51] <insanekane> Hobbsee: hence, I thought it was an Ubuntu project :)
[05:52] <Hobbsee> insanekane: ahhh...no, knetworkmanager is upstream kde, with a whole lot of stuff from opensuse (well, that's where the main page is), networkmanager stuff is on the gnome.org ftp site.  which actually doestn matter that much, as the changes under the hood of the app arent gnome-specific
[05:52] <Hobbsee> s/gnome-/dm-/
[05:53] <Hobbsee> knm seems to be surprisingly hard to find, actually
[05:54] <insanekane> Hobbsee: well, i dont know how far kde and gnome are cooperating on this ... i guess the sick feeling I get in my stomach that one fine day network manager will cause me to download the whole gnome libs, is just plain unfounded :) 
[05:55] <hunt0r> AHHHHHHHHH SKIM I HATE YOU
[05:56] <hunt0r> sry for that i found out why I have this konsole bug -.-
[05:56] <Hobbsee> insanekane: no, nm != n-m-g
[05:56] <Riddell> hunt0r: hmm?
[05:56] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: haha, what was it?
[05:57] <hunt0r> I just deinstalled skim and now it works just fine
[05:57] <insanekane> Hobbsee: http://www.gnome.org/projects/NetworkManager/ <- this what you talkin about ?
[05:57] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: right.  document it :P
[05:58] <insanekane> hunt0r: thats bad :/
[05:58] <Hobbsee> insanekane: yeah.  there's the backend, which are all the other debs apart from network-manager-gnome, pretty much.  network-manager will never need network-manager-gnome to run
[05:58] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: once you write that in the bug report, can you change the package name to skim please?
[05:59] <hunt0r> Hobbsee: aehm package name wich package name?
[05:59] <Hobbsee> skim?
[05:59] <Hobbsee> or scim?
[05:59] <insanekane> Hobbsee: probably both
[06:00] <hunt0r> scim with c sry my foult ^^
[06:00] <Hobbsee> insanekane: true that.  freeflying will see them thouhg.
[06:00] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: not a problem, you'd be suprised how many bugs are pebkac/config errors.
[06:00] <Hobbsee> hunt0r: besides, we've found the solution now, to point people there :)
[06:02] <insanekane> Hobbsee: pebkac ?
[06:02] <insanekane> Hobbsee: dialup support requires Yast :/
[06:02] <Hobbsee> insanekane: problem exists between keyboard and chair
[06:02] <Hobbsee> insanekane: yeah, feel free to fix it upstream :)
[06:02] <Hobbsee> insanekane: that's why we dont exactly support it
[06:03] <Hobbsee> we usually have kppp for such things
[06:03] <insanekane> Hobbsee: having multiple tools for this seems bad ... now, i would have to implement some software to handle pppoe ... and then there would be 3 networking config apps :/
[06:05] <Hobbsee> insanekane: i'd fix kppp first, in a way that wouldnt be painful for security, until knm gets a little more stable.  and help knm get more stable, if you feel like it.
[06:05] <Hobbsee> true though
[06:05] <Hobbsee> that's almost as bad as having 3 versions of the same piece of software in 2 distros.  that drove me nuts.
[06:13] <Hobbsee> night all
[06:13] <Hobbsee> hey toma 
[06:13] <toma> hi Hobbsee
[06:13] <toma> good night ;-)
[06:14] <Hobbsee> insanekane: feel free to add it to the agenda - the dialup stuff - we need someone to look at it and make some decisions on what should be done with it - how to make it work ootb, etc
[06:14] <toma> bye
[06:14] <insanekane> Hobbsee: the agenda ?
[06:15] <toma> insanekane: see last item in the topic
[06:17] <insanekane> toma: ah ok ... yeah well, im not in the kubuntu team ... so how can i add stuff ?
[06:18] <toma> insanekane: go to the agenda and edit the page
[06:18] <toma> if you have an account, that is sufficient
[06:18] <toma> and come to the irc meeting to talk about it
[06:25] <yuriy> _Sime: now how to store some default schemes..
[06:27] <toma> allee: ping
[06:32] <seaLne> anyone else tried todays daily desktop?
[06:32] <seaLne> bug #56721
[06:32] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 56721 in ubiquity "ubiquity (kde) crash at welcome screen" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56721
[06:48] <allee> uhm, no COPYRIGHT or LGPL file in d*-doc tarball :(
[06:48] <allee> toma: ^^ Hobbsee told me :(
[06:49] <toma> allee: see discussion in #ubuntu-devel
[06:49] <allee> toma: I check if there's new stuff ...
[06:50] <allee> toma: the release_digikam-doc.rb does not copy LICENSE files :(  I'll fix it
[06:58] <raphink> !seen kwwii
[06:58] <ubotu> kwwii is on IRC right now!
[06:58] <seaLne> thats usefull
[06:59] <Riddell> he is?
[07:02] <seaLne> apparently he is according to /whois
[07:04] <Riddell> idle for 7 days but
[07:22] <Riddell> mornfall: what's a good branch of adept to work on if I want to look at adding support for ubuntu's commercial repositories?
[07:24] <mornfall> dunnow
[07:24] <mornfall> depends where you want to include it
[07:24] <mornfall> i... don't know what will happen to adept
[07:24] <mornfall> i am completely screwed up... sorry
[07:25] <Riddell> tick box in adept-installer
[07:25] <mornfall> where as in which ubuntu release
[07:25] <mornfall> well
[07:25] <mornfall> i don't know
[07:25] <mornfall> i don't have strength to work on anything now
[07:26] <mornfall> so... do as you can
[07:26] <Riddell> mornfall: ok, will do
[07:27] <mornfall> am really sorry about that... but i am alone, broken and weary... with little hope of getting better soon
[07:27] <mornfall> and i'll go for a walk... see you later
[07:27] <Riddell> take care
[07:31] <Riddell> testers needed http://www.micoulou.info/kformat/KMFormat0.1beta.tar.gz
[07:34] <Hawkwind> What's KMformat ?
[07:42] <el> Riddell, hm, hwdb requires edgy... i won't be able to have a look today then. is monday/tuesday ok? (since i'll go canoing during the weekend) 
[07:57] <Riddell> el: yeah sorry, I forgot about that when I e-mailed you
[07:57] <Riddell> el: you can create a chroot if you don't want to do the full upgrade
[07:57] <Riddell> el: canoeing sounds nice
[07:58] <el> Riddell, i'll try the full update tomorrow during work hours. if it doesn't work, i'll ask you what a chroot is ;-)
[08:13] <Riddell> Hawkwind: it's a summer of code project to make a programme that can format floppy and usb disks
[08:29] <Riddell> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+topcontributors  go hobbsee
[08:30] <Hawkwind> Hah.  She's moving up the list quickly
[08:30] <toma> Riddell: where is your name?
[08:31] <Riddell> toma: I have lots of karma but not in any of those lists for some reason, I think it doesn't count spec tracking
[08:35] <sebas> Riddell: Do you have Jane's phone number?
[08:35] <sebas> Not the private one, though :>
[08:37] <Riddell> sebas: Jane Silbs?
[08:37] <sebas> From the Canonical MT, the one Aaron and me talked with in Paris, is that J. Silbs?
[08:38] <Riddell> yes
[08:38] <sebas> Yeah, that one then :>
[09:00] <seaLne> todays alternate install works
[09:06] <seaLne> Riddell: you in edinburgh on saturday?
[09:07] <Riddell> seaLne: only very briefly
[09:07] <Riddell> seaLne: I could come to the next scotlug
[09:09] <seaLne> ok, i suppose i could just take the sun through then get my parents to drop it off at yours some point during the week?
[09:12] <Riddell> seaLne: I'm in Germany next week
[09:12] <Riddell> although my flatmates will probably be in, but I can't guarantee when
[09:15] <seaLne> well the week after, save you coming through
[09:15] <Riddell> sure
[09:16] <seaLne> my parents never cease to amaze me with the interesting ways they manage to break kubuntu
[09:16] <nixternal> lol
[09:17] <seaLne> currently they can't mount/format floppies or print
[09:17] <Riddell> users do that
[09:17] <Riddell> floppies are known broken
[09:17] <seaLne> ah
[09:17] <Riddell> and printing is flakey too, dapper-updates may or may not fix it
[09:18] <seaLne> apparently print manager thing icon appears but you can't click on it and printing never come out
[09:19] <seaLne> any idea what the bugs are?
[09:52] <yuriy> _Sime: is it ok to supply a default wineconfigrc? what would be the proper way to include it?
[10:05] <Riddell> yuriy: why would you need to?  just set the defaults in the code
[10:06] <yuriy> Riddell: I want to have a couple default choices of color schemes
[10:07] <yuriy> Riddell: though i just wrote a thing to try to copy the current KDE colors, so i could forgo that, but i think it would be nice to have
[10:23] <_Sime> yuriy: Riddell is right. It is a better idea to just detect in code if the user has a wineconfigrc. If not, then use some defaults. That is how it is usually done.
[10:26] <yuriy> _Sime: ok so i should store the defaults right in wineconfig.py?  even if i make a couple different presets?
[10:26] <_Sime> yuriy: yeah. If there is no rc file, then you use your defaults.
[11:07] <Lure> allee: ping
[11:10] <allee> Lure: pong
[11:11] <Lure> allee: seen your comment on KubuntuLaptopButtons
[11:11] <Lure> allee: Ctrl-Alt-K does not break it here, but you are right that changing layout breaks it until next login
[11:12] <Lure> allee: what did you mean with "
[11:12] <Lure> #
[11:12] <Lure> One solution may be to use XDB options to include the 'laptop keys' settings.
[11:12] <Lure> #
[11:12] <allee> Lure: really I thought I've tested the c-a-k case.  Once more ...
[11:13] <Lure> allee: it works for my US/SI case...
[11:13] <allee> Lure: 'laptop' is not a good term. I test it with an external USB keyboard at a desktop and it works there too
[11:14] <Lure> allee: right, ubuntu laptop hotkey mapping just uses common keycodes also used by most multuimedia keyboards - I tested it on my Genius MM keyboard and now on laptop
[11:15] <allee> Lure: nope. I've enalbed US and DE layout.  Press 'e-mail' button -> good.  alt-ctrl-k to which to german, 'e-mail' again. Nothing happens :(
[11:15] <Lure> allee: interesting... US and SI switch does not break it... strange
[11:16] <Lure> it looks to me that it would be better if we just use HAL events instead... :-(
[11:17] <Lure> need to check with Riddell....
[11:17] <allee> Lure: oh 1st US, 2nd SI and c-a-k breaks after US -> SI switch
[11:18] <Lure> now I do not get it at all :-(
[11:18] <Lure> maybe this depends on Keyboard model selection which is probably re-applied on c-a-k
[11:19] <allee> you have a .xmodmaprc file or something like that in $HOME?
[11:19] <Lure> allee: no
[11:19] <Lure> I had Generic 105-key as model...
[11:20] <Lure> if I change the model, then mappings are lost
[11:22] <allee> I've Generic 104-key PC as model
[11:24] <allee> mhmm, laptop-button defs also clears for US->SI with generic 104 keys (intl) PC
[11:24] <Riddell> Lure: yes, using HAL events probably would be better for the keys they are available for
[11:24] <Riddell> but I don't know how easy HAL is to use with KDE 3
[11:25] <Lure> Riddell: or xevent loop and catching keycodes...
[11:25] <Lure> (like gnome-settings-daemon does)
[11:25] <allee> doesn't kmilo support keycodes?
[11:26] <allee> btw where does one configure kmilo?  didn't found it last night?
[11:26] <Lure> allee: no, only xkeysym and proprietary stuff
[11:26] <Lure> allee: no config...
[11:27] <LeeJunFan> Riddell: can you think of any reason upgrading dapper to 3.5.4 would cause problems with k3b? It seems since upgrading k3b is prematurely claiming mkisofs is done writing, and ejects the DVD before 100%. Although k3b wasn't in the 3.5.4 update.
[11:27] <allee> Lure: uh, and where does one set if 'proprietary stuff' is loaded or not??? Or is kmilo just behind assign shortcut in kmenu editor?
[11:28] <Riddell> allee: it doesn't have GUI configuration
[11:28] <Lure> allee: proprietary stuff is thinkpad, asus, sony (laptop models, typically reading nvram and similar)
[11:28] <Riddell> allee: /usr/share/apps/kmilo/ubuntu.xmodmap
[11:28] <allee> Riddell: I reload this file everytime ;)
[11:29] <Lure> allee: we just added xkeysym mapping with xmodmap + default actions to generic kmilo module (which already supported volume upd/down/mute xkeysyms)
[11:34] <Riddell> Lure: nope, kde update shouldn't have any effect on k3b
[11:34] <Lure> LeeJunFan: ^^^ ;-)
[11:35] <Riddell> yes, LeeJunFan 
[11:42] <allee> Lure: So one would have to hack the generic module to teach it, e.g, that codeine when active like to get AudioNext/Prev keys events?
[11:43] <Lure> allee: in theory yes, but hard to doin practice - this is why alll hotkeys are proposed as global shortcuts
[11:46] <allee> Lure: does kmilo implement something like a 'fallback' definition, like if no app accepted the keycode, forward it to app xx?
[11:47] <Lure> allee: no, kmilo generic just sets global accelerators and cannot know who else got the key press
[11:47] <Lure> allee: code is really not much... 
[11:48] <allee> k.  mhmm ...
[11:54] <omeow> Riddell, konversation's been updated quite a bit now. Did you see Sho's commit of doom? :)
[11:55] <omeow> http://www.eikehein.com/commitofdoom.txt
[11:57] <omeow> Eventhough I can't code, I helped out by reporting bugs and I even wrote a few patches. (Bugs listed there are reported by me. :))
[11:57] <omeow> The patches did some stuff with the DCC messages and DCC button labels.
[11:59] <allee> Lure: alternate shortcut setting of 'XF86Back,Forward' is from upstream or kubuntu-default-settings ?
[12:00] <Lure> allee: most are upstream, some were done by Tonio_ in k-d-s (tab navigation afair)
[12:01] <allee> Lure: ah, right. found the extra keys for konsole.  Nice [default]  in 'configure shortcut' dialog removes the setting from k-d-s :( :(
[12:02] <Lure> allee: yes, k-d-s is just a fallback if user does not set it, but all this flexibility can be confusing sometimes... ;-)
[12:04] <allee> Lure: :)
[12:05] <allee> Lure: You know if ubuntu has some infratructure to determine keyboard?  E.g. to redefine keycode to the standard one?
[12:06] <Lure> allee: yes, this is what hotkey-setup/kernel are supposed to do (+hal events)
[12:06] <Lure> allee: run lshal -m and press laptop keys - it will return nice text description of the key pressed