[04:49] <caravena> Hello, the pc ->http://pastebin.com/777634 support edubuntu 64?
[04:51] <sbalneav> caravena: No, you're not running a 64 bit kernel there.
[04:52] <caravena> sbalneav: ok.
[04:52] <caravena> sbalneav: See info of x86info... I install edubuntu 64?
[04:53] <sbalneav> Are you saying you DID install it, or are you asking if you NEED to install it?
[04:54] <caravena> sbalneav: Need
[04:54] <caravena> sbalneav: need to intall edubuntu 64 bits.
[04:55] <sbalneav> Yes, you would need to do so.
[04:55] <caravena> Ok, diferences in information of /proc/cpuinfo and x86info
[04:56] <caravena> I read -> http://gentoo-wiki.com/Safe_Cflags#Sempron.2FSempron64_.28AMD.29 and confuse.
[04:59] <caravena> sbalneav: I delete edubuntu 32 bits and install edubuntu 64?
[05:00] <sbalneav> http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/6.06.1/
[05:01] <sbalneav> you want the one that says:
[05:01] <sbalneav> edubuntu-6.06.1-install-amd64.iso
[05:02] <caravena> Yes, I dude in install edubuntu 64. I now work with edubuntu 32
[05:03] <sbalneav> I'm not understanding you.
[05:03] <sbalneav> Did you install edubuntu-6.06.1-install-amd64.iso?
[05:03] <caravena> I question in install edubuntu 64. I now work with edubuntu 32. (Now you uderstand?)
[05:03] <sbalneav> No, sorry, I dont understand.
[05:04] <caravena> Not, you not install edubuntu 64. I install edubuntu 32.
[05:04] <caravena> Arght, sorry.
[05:04] <sbalneav> what cd did you install? 64 bit cd?
[05:04] <caravena> Not, I not install edubuntu 64. I install edubuntu 32.
[05:04] <sbalneav> ok, wel you need to install 64 bit.
[05:05] <sbalneav> so download that iso, and install that one.
[05:05] <sbalneav> download edubuntu-6.06.1-install-amd64.iso
[05:05] <sbalneav> install
[05:05] <caravena> ok, wel you need to install 64 bit.:::: YES
[05:05] <sbalneav> then it will work
[05:08] <caravena> sbalneav: ok, My cpu support 64? I revise info in /proc/cpuinfo and not 64.... I read information in -> http://gentoo-wiki.com/Safe_Cflags#Sempron.2FSempron64_.28AMD.29 and not understand.
[05:09] <sbalneav> Why are you reading a GENTOO site about EDUBUNTU
[05:09] <sbalneav> two different things
[05:11] <caravena> sbalneav: I want to know if I can install edubuntu 64. Already this working in 32. 
[05:13] <sbalneav> Are you asking me if your processor is a 64 bit cpu?  According you what you pasted, it looks like it.  But I don't know for sure, because I haven't seen your machine.
[05:14] <sbalneav> Why don't you try booting with the live 64 bit cd, and see if it works.
[05:14] <sbalneav> if the 64 bit cd boots, then it should work.
[05:15] <caravena> sbalneav: Ok, thanks. I now download edubuntu 64 and test.
[07:27] <sbartleylinux> Can anyone tell me how to remove the hibernate button from the quit screen from a thin client connection?
[07:54] <sbartleylinux> I understand that Ubuntu LTSP implementation uses ldm instead of gdm.  This sets the quit screen to not have shutdown and restart but to still have Hibernate.  Anyone know how to turn this off so a thin client user will not be able to hibernate the ltsp server?
[09:13] <toosa> Hi, RichEd 
[09:13] <RichEd> hi toosa ... 
[09:14] <RichEd> toosa: apologies if you've been neglected ... majorly busy at the moment with planning
[09:15] <toosa> ok
[09:16] <toosa> btw, what is the URL that contain any presentation material for Edubuntu ?
[09:16] <toosa> (I lost it :( )
[09:20] <RichEd> let me look for you ...
[09:24] <RichEd> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuSchoolAdvocacy <- school
[09:26] <RichEd> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/Presentations ... there you go
[09:36] <toosa> thankyou v'much
[09:39] <scythe> hi
[09:40] <scythe> is it possible to lock the desktop, so that a user can't change icons, wallpaper, menu, ... ? I heard this is called "Kiosk-Mode" in german.
[09:45] <RichEd> hi scythe : Edubuntu or Kubuntu ? i.e. GNOME or KDE
[09:45] <scythe> RichEd: edubuntu, also GNOME
[09:47] <scythe> RichEd: sorry, the "also" was german ;)
[09:48] <RichEd> start here: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=158917
[09:49] <RichEd> you'll need to check it out properly for yourself ... i'm quite busy ... but that will point you in the right direction
[09:49] <scythe> RichEd: thx. but this is for KDE, should it work for GNOME? I'm not sure.
[09:50] <RichEd> look at the middle response link: See http://www.gnome.org/learn/admin-guide/latest/ch10.html
[09:50] <scythe> RichEd: but good to know that its called "kiosk mode" in english too ;)
[09:50] <RichEd> Ubuntu 6.06 "Dapper Drake" uses GNOME 2.14 and Pessulus (see http://www.gnome.org/start/2.14/notes/en/rnadmins.html) is included in universe for this purpose.
[09:50] <RichEd> okay now ?
[09:51] <scythe> RichEd: yes, thx :)
[09:51] <RichEd> :)
[09:52] <Burgundavia> scythe: if you want to make more complex profiles, you need sabayon. If you need to make keys mandatory, you need to run pessulus with suod (which the menu item does not)
[09:53] <scythe> Burgundavia: ah, will have a look at these programs. thx
[09:53] <Burgundavia> no worries
[10:01] <sir_hc> hi anyone around? i'm gettong no help in the ubuntu channel
[10:01] <sir_hc> how do i 'log in' to the rescue prompt?
[10:08] <scythe> bye
[10:10] <RichEd> sir_hc: open a google page ... input this: [+ubuntu how do i 'log in' to the rescue prompt?]  it gives some reasonable looking results
[10:11] <sir_hc> hmm i tried that, but phrased a little differently
[10:11] <sir_hc> kk
[10:11] <sir_hc> btw
[10:11] <sir_hc> do u knwo of this problem?
[10:11] <sir_hc> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=223265&page=1
[10:11] <sir_hc> i know it's technically not edubuntu
[10:11] <sir_hc> but still...
[11:20] <spiekey> hello!
[11:21] <spiekey> i there some german spelling software, too?
[11:21] <RichEd> gun tag spiekey
[11:21] <RichEd> have you checked the language packs ?
[11:22] <spiekey> i did install the language pack when it asked for it.
[11:23] <RichEd> brb
[11:23] <spiekey> ok
[11:24] <RichEd> spiekey: this one : http://packages.ubuntu.com/edgy/translations/language-pack-de
[11:25] <RichEd> That's all I know about ...
[11:49] <RichEd> hey there ogra :)
[02:15] <nrdb> I have installed edubutu on a Virtual Machine I have another ready to boot how do I setup edubuntu to allow the client to boot?
[02:16] <ogra_> nrdb, see the channel topic :)
[03:44] <sbalneav> rodarvus, ogra: back from Wiesbaden?
[03:44] <ogra> yep
[03:44] <rodarvus> yup
[03:44] <sbalneav> Cool!
[03:45] <rodarvus> finally :)
[03:45] <rodarvus> (long travel, etc)
[03:45] <sbalneav> rodarvus: Probably what, around 22 hours?
[03:46] <rodarvus> yes, not counting going from the hotel to airport, and from airport to my house
[03:46] <sbalneav> Yeah, it's a long haul.
[03:49] <bddebian> Hello
[03:51] <sbalneav> hello bddebian 
[03:51] <bddebian> Heya sbalneav
[04:42] <gruntu> Hello
[04:50] <gruntu> hello
[04:50] <pygi> highvoltage, may I grab you for a sec?
[04:50] <pygi> hey gruntu 
[04:50] <gruntu> I have a couple of questions
[04:53] <gruntu> I was trying to configure the server with 1 network card. I modified dhcpd.conf but it fails. Are there other files I should be modifying?
[05:35] <Kaeles> anyone know where i can find the minimim reqs for edubuntu?
[05:36] <Kaeles> ooooh
[05:36] <Kaeles> edubuntu is like ltsp?
[05:37] <Kaeles> niiice
[05:37] <pygi> Kaeles, "like ltsp"?
[05:37] <Kaeles> but not quite what i was looking for, can you install it as a stand alone?
[05:37] <Kaeles> well, i noticed that it IS ltsp
[05:37] <Kaeles> :P
[05:37] <Kaeles> or uses
[05:37] <Kaeles> whatever the correct terminology is.
[05:38] <pygi> yes, it can be standalone
[05:39] <Kaeles> via the workstation installation?
[05:40] <pygi> Kaeles, yup
[05:40] <Kaeles> cool :D
[05:41] <Kaeles> any clue what the minimum requirements of a system to run it stand-alone are?
[05:41] <pygi> Kaeles, sec pls :)
[05:41] <Kaeles> kk thanks
[05:42] <pygi> Kaeles, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/HowToCookEdubuntu/Chapters/StandAloneHardware
[05:42] <Kaeles> ouch
[05:42] <Kaeles> i might try xubuntu
[05:42] <pygi> Kaeles, is it that bad? :P
[05:43] <Kaeles> i am wanting to give away some computers with linux
[05:43] <Kaeles> they are 233mhz 64mb ram
[05:43] <Kaeles> so, i'll try xubuntu
[05:44] <pygi> oki, if you wish
[05:44] <Kaeles> do you think that edubuntu would work if i replaced the gnome/kde with xfce?
[05:44] <Kaeles> I would prefer the edubuntu stuff on xubuntu, i'm trying to target families with kids, who can't afford computers.
[05:45] <pygi> Kaeles, install xubuntu, then themes and games for edubuntu
[05:45] <Kaeles> oh ok
[05:45] <Kaeles> thanks :)
[05:46] <Kaeles> i have about 25 extra comps that i've come across, so :P
[05:46] <pygi> :P
[05:46] <Kaeles> i'm keeping the faster ones for my cluster though
[05:47] <Kaeles> Thanks for the help though
[05:47] <Kaeles> :)
[05:47] <Kaeles> have a good one
[05:48] <bengoodger> if anyone in here is interested in doing an APT-based application for networked edubuntu application synching then please join me in #fles
[05:49] <bengoodger> Seveas: can you program?
[05:50] <pygi> bengoodger, don't poke random people :P
[05:51] <bengoodger> pygi: he hadn't seen my notice
[05:51] <sbalneav> bengoodger: I don't understand what it is you're wanting to do?
[05:52] <sbalneav> Are you wanting to simply make sure the same app is installed on all machines?
[05:52] <bengoodger> sbalneav: I amd a colleage have designed a program that will allow a single system administrator to control the applications and configurations that are present per computer group, in a large school (enterprise) setting
[05:53] <jryer> Quick question: Why cannot I change my screen resolution? It is stuck at 640x480! Please help
[05:53] <bengoodger> jryer: find your monitor's horizontal sync and vertical refresh rates
[05:53] <bengoodger> jryer: then edit /etc/X11/xorg.conf to match.
[05:54] <bengoodger> then press CTRL-ALT-BACKSPACE
[05:54] <jryer> bengoodger, Where would I find hsync and v refresh rates?
[05:54] <bengoodger> jryer: monitor manual, google, etc
[05:55] <bengoodger> sbalneav: a PDF of the system's structure will shortly be on my site..
[05:55] <sbalneav> bengoodger: Well, if you've already got the application, why not just package it up?
[05:55] <bengoodger> sbalneav: it's been designed, not written
[05:55] <jryer> bengoodger, And this will allow me to select more resolution options when I enter in System-Preferences-ScreenResolution?
[05:56] <bengoodger> http://dev.shaunevans.co.uk/ben/network-diagram.pdf
[05:56] <bengoodger> jryer: yes, it should select the best one for you as well
[05:57] <bengoodger> jryer: good luck finding the values
[05:57] <jryer> bengoodger, I will check into it today...thanks for the help!
[05:57] <bengoodger> jryer: that's fine
[05:57] <sbalneav> bengoodger: Ummm, little short on details, yes? :)
[05:58] <bengoodger> sbalneav, well, it's rough
[06:00] <sbalneav> You still haven't answered my question: are you talking about syncing apps?  Or are you trying to sync user profiles across machines?  If it's the second, why not simply set up an NFS server, and mount users home directories from there, so that no matter what machine they log onto, they have the same homedir?
[06:01] <bengoodger> NFS is part of the network design
[06:01] <sbalneav> Nope, don
[06:01] <sbalneav> don't see nfs anywhere on there :)
[06:01] <bengoodger> that document is for the program, not the network design.
[06:02] <bengoodger> the program deals with ensuring that all computers get the proper packages and configuration files
[06:02] <bengoodger> yay proxy.
[06:03] <sbalneav> Um, well that's easy: on your "master" machine, do a "dpkg --get-selections > selections.file"....
[06:04] <sbalneav> Then, on all the rest of the machines: "dpkg --set-selections selections.file && aptitude dist-upgrade"
[06:04] <sbalneav> that will ensure that all machines have the same apps.
[06:05] <sbalneav> If you're wanting to make config files sync, just use rsync.
[06:05] <sbalneav> I don't think you need a whole new program for that, just a couple of shell scripts.
[06:05] <bengoodger> hmm
[06:06] <bengoodger> what about the shiny MCSE-compatible gui that writes the profiles?
[06:06] <sbalneav> writes WHAT profiles?
[06:06] <sbalneav> user profiles?
[06:07] <bengoodger> the profiles that define each computer group's packages
[06:08] <sbalneav> So you're talking about what MENU items/icons each class of users see?
[06:09] <bengoodger> no, what apt PACKAGE items each class of computers have
[06:09] <ogra_> that sounds very much like a fai ripoff 
[06:10] <bengoodger> what the hell is fai?
[06:10] <sbalneav> bengoodger: https://features.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/edubuntu-dynamic-menus
[06:10] <sbalneav> This might be of interest to you.
[06:10] <bengoodger> sbalneav: that's great.
[06:11] <bengoodger> sbalneav: but I want to choose what software to actually install on different classes of machine
[06:11] <bengoodger> so we don't want pcmcia on desktops, nor wireless drivers
[06:11] <ogra_> bengoodger, fai is an ugly set of scripts thats used for mass deployment of workstations/servers whatever that also enables you to do maintenance afterwards through it
[06:12] <bengoodger> and we might want a certain wireless driver on $TYPE_OF_LAPTOP but not on $OTHER_TYPE_OF_LAPTOP
[06:12] <ogra_> its used in most bigger datacenters where they use debian based systems but its very ugly
[06:12] <bengoodger> ogra_: I doubt from that description that it does what I want
[06:12] <sbalneav> bengoodger: OK, so you're back to my other suggestion: simply coming up with a few standardized packaged selection lists, and then doing a --set-selections on them.  Theres no shiny gui for that, so If you want to write one, that'd be great.
[06:12] <ogra_> well, the aintenance part sounds like what you describe ...
[06:13] <ogra_> *maintenance
[06:13] <bengoodger> sbalneav: is there a URL for this --set-selections feature?
[06:14] <sbalneav> sure, "man dpkg" :)
[06:14] <ogra_>  man dpkg ;)
[06:14] <sbalneav> lol
[06:14] <bengoodger> hrrrrm
[06:14] <ogra_> snap
[06:14] <pygi> ogra_, I talked libburn into producing usable dvd's, whee :)
[06:14] <bengoodger> I wanted something comprehensible, but ok
[06:14] <ogra_> pygi, congrats !
[06:14] <sbalneav> or, google for "dpkg --get-selections"
[06:14] <ogra_> bengoodger, usualy manpages are found via googel as well ;)
[06:14] <pygi> ogra_, with cheating, and MD5 not matching, but all works :)
[06:15] <pygi> thanks ^_^
[06:15] <ogra_> so now make it network aware and sbalneav and i wil implement cd writing in ltsp ;)
[06:15] <pygi> !!!!
[06:15] <sbalneav> bengoodger: Here's one to get you started:
[06:15] <pygi> network aware library!!!
[06:15] <sbalneav> http://www.debian.org/doc/FAQ/ch-pkgtools.en.html
[06:15] <bengoodger> ok, Get list of package selections, and write it to stdout. isn't helpful
[06:16] <ogra_> if i ever go that localdev stuff going ... sigh ...
[06:16] <pygi> ogra_, I never done anything like that, so if you have pointers on how can I do that :)
[06:16] <sbalneav> bengoodger: How isn't it helpful?
[06:16] <ogra_> bengoodger, together with --set-selections it is ;)
[06:16] <bengoodger> I meant the actual description
[06:16] <bengoodger> how does the thing work?
[06:16] <ogra_> it drops a list of all packages installed to stdout ...
[06:17] <ogra_> yu can pipe that into a file
[06:17] <sbalneav> and that's your "package profile"
[06:17] <ogra_> --set-selections reads a list in thats format 
[06:17] <ogra_> *that
[06:17] <sbalneav> that's "loading" a package profile on another machine.
[06:17] <bengoodger> ok
[06:17] <ogra_> so you can: dpkg --get-selectios > /tmp/tmpfile
[06:17] <bengoodger> hmm
[06:18] <ogra_>  dpkg --set-selectios < /tmp/tmpfile
[06:18] <bengoodger> so this solves about half of the problem
[06:18] <ogra_> apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade 
[06:18] <ogra_> and you are done
[06:18] <bengoodger> great
[06:18] <ogra_> you only need a script with these three lines ;)
[06:18] <bengoodger> ya
[06:19] <sbalneav> Then, just use rsync to sync up any config file changes you want between machines.  Or, for that matter, just scp.
[06:19] <bengoodger> so, what happens with the dist-upgrade?
[06:19] <ogra_> the packages get installed
[06:19] <sbalneav> --set-selections simply marks that you WANT those packages
[06:19] <ogra_> right
[06:19] <sbalneav> the dist-upgrade actually installs them
[06:19] <bengoodger> the computer needs to automatically (sans-user) set itself to be identical to what I will still call the profile
[06:20] <bengoodger> this means removing packages as well as installing them
[06:20] <bengoodger> presumably apt can make it do that?
[06:21] <ogra_> yes, with the above you can also remove stuff
[06:21] <sbalneav> by "sans user", are you meaning "end user doesn't need to be involved", or "administrator doesn't need to be involved"
[06:21] <bengoodger> sbalneav: "nobody needs to be involved"
[06:21] <ogra_> i guess he wants a cron script or something
[06:21] <sbalneav> because totally automating package management with no admin input is a really, REALLY bad idea.
[06:21] <ogra_> right
[06:21] <bengoodger> sbalneav, the admin writes the file
[06:22] <bengoodger> but the clients need to be able to match themselves to it by themselves
[06:22] <sbalneav> You can do it, but if something goes wrong for some reason, you can end up with a bunch of broken machines.
[06:22] <ogra_> at least one human should be involved and check whats coming down the pipe
[06:22] <bengoodger> without hand-holding
[06:22] <gruntu> ogra I have a couple of questions when you have a minute
[06:23] <bengoodger> if the system was going to use humans monitoring the whole thing, it defeats the entire object of having automated software-pushing
[06:23] <bengoodger> it's meant to be so that the admin can write the file, tests it, publishes it, and the computer matches itself to it
[06:23] <ogra_> gruntu, i never have time, so now is as good as any other moment ;) just ask away
[06:24] <sbalneav> bengoodger: Well, you can certainly do it, if you want.
[06:24] <bengoodger> sbalneav: good, because windows can do it
[06:25] <sbalneav> bengoodger: heh, yeah sure.  My wife just spent a week 3 weeks ago fixing up a failed push that left 120 machines unbootable.  It's a bad idea there, and it's a bad idea in Linux too.  But, if you're willing to take the risk... you can do it.
[06:26] <bengoodger> the plan is that the admin tests it extensively before pushing
[06:26] <gruntu> thanks - I want to run the edubuntu server with one nic. I modified the dhcpd.conf but it's not working. I don't have any other dhcp running and this server was operating with 2 nics prior. I did run ltsp-update-sshkeys
[06:27] <sbalneav> Admins tested it extensively on my wife's network as well.  Still failed on 5% of the machines.  But like I say, it's certainly doable.
[06:27] <bengoodger> well, windows is a bit crap anyway..
[06:28] <bengoodger> thanks for your help, now we just need someone to write the app that writes the profile and distributes the right one to each client
[06:28] <ogra_> gruntu, can you paste the output of ifconfig -a  and the content of the dhcpd.conf file to a pastebot ? 
[06:30] <ogra_> (/etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf indeed)
[06:32] <gruntu> eth0      Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:0E:A6:BB:1E:B6
[06:32] <gruntu>           inet addr:10.9.8.188  Bcast:10.9.8.255  Mask:255.255.255.0
[06:32] <gruntu>           inet6 addr: fe80::20e:a6ff:febb:1eb6/64 Scope:Link
[06:32] <gruntu>           UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST  MTU:1500  Metric:1
[06:32] <gruntu>           RX packets:41764 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
[06:32] <gruntu>           TX packets:30405 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
[06:32] <gruntu>           collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000
[06:32] <gruntu>           RX bytes:44733943 (42.6 MiB)  TX bytes:12772161 (12.1 MiB)
[06:32] <gruntu>           Interrupt:201 Base address:0xac00
[06:32] <gruntu> lo        Link encap:Local Loopback
[06:32] <gruntu>           inet addr:127.0.0.1  Mask:255.0.0.0
[06:32] <gruntu>           inet6 addr: ::1/128 Scope:Host
[06:32] <gruntu>           UP LOOPBACK RUNNING  MTU:16436  Metric:1
[06:32] <gruntu>           RX packets:73 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
[06:32] <gruntu>           TX packets:73 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
[06:32] <gruntu>           collisions:0 txqueuelen:0
[06:32] <gruntu>           RX bytes:5528 (5.3 KiB)  TX bytes:5528 (5.3 KiB)
[06:32] <gruntu> Did i do that right before I post the other file?
[06:32] <bengoodger> gruntu: PASTEBOT, dammit!
[06:33] <gruntu> sorry
[06:34] <bengoodger> that's ok
[06:34] <ogra_> bengoodger, dont curse, the first one is for free 
[06:34] <ogra_> ;)
[06:35] <bengoodger> ogra_: "damn" is hardly a curse
[06:35] <ogra_> gruntu, so now your dhcod.conf at pastebot will suffice ;)
[06:35] <bengoodger> but meh
[06:35] <ogra_> *dhcpd.conf
[06:35] <sbalneav> !pastebot
[06:35] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about pastebot - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[06:35] <ogra_> i think its pastebin ...
[06:35] <ogra_> !pastebin
[06:35] <ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (you can always find it in the channel topic, among other useful things)
[06:35] <ogra_> ;)
[06:36] <sbalneav> ubotu: pastebot is  a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (you can always find it in the channel topic, among other useful things)
[06:36] <sbalneav> There, now we'll have it with both descriptions
[06:36] <sbalneav> !pastebot
[06:36] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about pastebot - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[06:36] <sbalneav> hmm, must take a bit to add.
[06:37] <ogra_> rodarvus, i have a weird phenmenon here ... if i enable local devices in ltsp (so ldm gets some different ssh paramters) i suddenly have no proper keyboard input in X ... i have to switch to tty1 and back to make it work
[06:38] <ogra_> there is nothing in the ldm parameters that could cause it ... do you know of any bug in xkb that sounds like that ? 
[06:38] <bengoodger> edubuntu-dynamic-menus has zero chance of being actually implemented in edgy
[06:38] <bengoodger> featurefreeze is next week
[06:39] <ogra_> bengoodger, lets see, LaserJock promised me patches this week
[06:39] <rodarvus> ogra_, this is, hmm,.... unexpected
[06:39] <rodarvus> do you pass different xorg.conf for both X sessions? (just curious)
[06:40] <ogra_> ltsp generates the xorg.conf on boot
[06:40] <ogra_> its already there if ldm starts
[06:40] <ogra_> i first thought its because i have an usb keyboard and a usb disk attached ... but i see the same behavior on a ps2 keyboard
[06:40] <highvoltage> pygi: i am here now
[06:41] <sbalneav> ogra_: Oh, btw, I've been seeing some behavior where the text login is what pops up on the screen first, as opposed to the X in tty7
[06:41] <ogra_> sbalneav, enable sound, that fixes it ;)
[06:41] <sbalneav> I'm thinking we may want to do a "sleep 3 ; chvt 7" somewhere, to make sure we end up on the X screen
[06:41] <Petaris> sbalneav: me too
[06:41] <ogra_> there is a race condition somewhere 
[06:41] <Petaris> Why would sound fix that?
[06:41] <ogra_> i'll dig for it after feature freeze
[06:42] <sbalneav> ah, ok, I'll try to pin it down as well.
[06:42] <ogra_> because starting sound delays certain parts of the boot, that avoids the race
[06:42] <Petaris> ogra_: just do a SOUND = Y in lts.conf?
[06:42] <ogra_> sbalneav, have a look the the ltsp-client initscript ...
[06:42] <ogra_> Petaris, SOUND=True
[06:42] <sbalneav> ok
[06:42] <ogra_> but yes
[06:43] <ogra_> sbalneav, especially at the usplash stuff there
[06:43] <LaserJock> morning Edubuntu people
[06:43] <sbalneav> Ah, usplashy :)
[06:43] <sbalneav> LaserJock!!!!!!!!!!!
[06:43] <ogra_> usplash is responsible for switching to tty1 if it doesnt get killed early enough or doesnt detect GDM
[06:43] <Petaris> ogra_: ok
[06:43] <ogra_> hey LaserJock 
[06:44] <sbalneav> edubuntu-dynamic-menus?  Need any help?
[06:44] <Petaris> Hi LaserJock 
[06:44] <bengoodger_> I hate this power supply
[06:44] <bengoodger_> the whole house goes off for no reason
[06:45] <gruntu> ogra Bear with me here. I hope this is right: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/21891
[06:45] <LaserJock> sbalneav: I'll need some testing
[06:46] <sbalneav> LaserJock: sbalneav@ltsp.org, mail me some goodies, and I'll hack with it tonight.
[06:46] <ogra_> gruntu, looks fine to me 
[06:47] <ogra_> what do you see in /var/log/daemon.log if you try to start the dhcp server ?
[06:48] <cr3> highvoltage: got a minute, I'm trying to setup a fat client
[06:50] <ogra_> rodarvus, got it ! "(WW) Couldn't load XKB keymap, falling back to pre-XKB keymap"
[06:50] <ogra_> rodarvus, is there a certain package holding the keymaps nowadays ? 
[06:50] <ogra_> thats not pulled in by the xorg metapackage ? 
[06:51] <bengoodger_> incidentally, edgy has a new set of them
[06:51] <gruntu> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/21894
[06:52] <ogra_> gruntu, the server is running fine ...
[06:53] <ogra_> what exactly is the problem now ? 
[06:53] <ogra_> apparetnly even a client recieved a kernel ...
[06:54] <rodarvus> yes, xkb-data, I think
[06:55] <rodarvus> it was something else, but got renamed (I think even before dapper was released, btw)
[06:55] <ogra_> well
[06:55] <ogra_> xorg is in its rdepends 
[06:55] <ogra_> so it should be pulled in by ltsp-build-client
[06:56] <ogra_> (which pulls in xorg)
[06:57] <ogra> hmm
[06:58] <ogra> rodarvus, did the location in teh filesystem change somehow in a recent package ? even if i use the defaults i get that error ...
[06:58] <bengoodger_> bring back the underscore
[06:58] <bengoodger_> ooh, I have one now
[06:58] <ogra> i suspect it has a new location that needs to be mounted rw or something
[06:58] <rodarvus> ogra, I would need to check
[07:00] <ogra> ah, tollef maintains it ...
[07:00] <gruntu> The client start to load the graphic comes up then falls back to an error "Mount: RPC: Timeout" There is a lot more data. Do you want me to get it?
[07:00] <ogra> gruntu, sounds like either your nfs server isnt running or the client mounts fro the wrong place
[07:01] <ogra> try: grep ltsp /etc/exports
[07:01] <ogra> that should return one line
[07:01] <ogra> then check if nfs is running: ps ax|grep nfs
[07:01] <ogra> that should return several lines
[07:02] <cberlo> Hi folks.  Just popping in to find out how local devices and local printing in Edubuntu LTSP is coming along, and if I can set up a local printer yet....
[07:02] <ogra> cberlo, local devices should be done today ... 
[07:03] <ogra> i havent looked at printing at all 
[07:03] <ogra> (and just ran into a very strange bug with localdev)
[07:04] <gruntu> /opt/ltsp       *(ro,no_root_squash,async)
[07:04] <cberlo> ogra: Excellent, for the local devices.  Printing, okay, I'll see what I can work with.  apt-get upgrade to get local devs?
[07:04] <ogra> gruntu, right 
[07:04] <ogra> now check if the ps command bove shows nfsd running
[07:04] <ogra> (dont paste it here, yes or no suffices)
[07:05] <ogra> cberlo, i'll post instructions to the edubuntu lists once its safe for testing
[07:05] <cberlo> Alright.  I'll watch for it.  Thanks.
[07:06] <ogra> (you need an lts.conf and enable it there and its onyl installed on the client through ltsp-build-client, upgrading from edgy will need some amnual work)
[07:06] <ogra> *manual
[07:06] <gruntu> ogra yes it is running
[07:07] <ogra> is there a line saying rootpath: in the error on the client ? and rootserver: ?
[07:08] <ogra> find that one and check it oints to your server and the /opt/ltsp/i386 path
[07:08] <ogra> *points
[07:09] <gruntu> right before the error it says: "rootserver: 0.0.0.0 rootpath:
[07:10] <ogra> rootpath has nothing ? 
[07:10] <ogra> there should be a path behind the colon
[07:11] <ogra> preferably /opt/ltsp/i386 :)
[07:11] <gruntu> nothing, I'm reading the output from the client
[07:11] <ogra> ok
[07:11] <ogra> you pretty sure have a dhcp server running in your network 
[07:11] <ogra> (a second one)
[07:12] <gruntu> I have it connected to a edge firewall and I turned off the dhcp. I will check again
[07:13] <cr3> I installed ubuntu, ltsp-server and ran ltsp-build-client --arch i386. Then, I configured dhcp and added this to the pxelinux.cf/default file: initrd=initrd.img root=/dev/nfs nfsroot=192.168.1.210:/opt/ltsp/i386 ip=dhcp rw. Finally, I added /opt/ltsp/i386 to /etc/exports and my thin client boots as a fat client! The only problem is that I can login to the console but not gdm, suggestions?
[07:14] <ogra> if you see such a thing like "rootserver: 0.0.0.0 rootpath:" you can be quite certain you didnt get an ip from a edubuntu dhcp server 
[07:14] <ogra> cr3, thats the problem why we didnt implement it yet :) 
[07:14] <ogra> cr3, GDM needs a fully setup pam environment and local users
[07:15] <ogra> (in the client root)
[07:15] <cr3> ogra: I did create a local user though, after chrooting on the host machine
[07:15] <ogra> right, but / is a readonly filesystem on thin clients
[07:15] <ogra> GDM surely needs some writeable files that are not covered by our tmpfs 
[07:15] <ogra> and i can imagine pam as well ...
[07:16] <gruntu> I am such a knucklehead. I turned it off last night and somehow it reverted back to default
[07:16] <ogra> heh
[07:16] <gruntu> It works now - sorry
[07:16] <ogra> shit happens :)
[07:16] <ogra> ext time you see rootserver: 0.0.0.0 you know what it is ;)
[07:17] <cr3> ogra: is there anything reasonable I could do to get it working or can I expect it to require quite a bit of work?
[07:18] <gruntu> k12ltsp allows for client side usb connections (like usb keys na usb cd-roms). Can I do this with the edubuntu clients
[07:18] <ogra> cr3, it will surely require a bit of work ... and doing it with a passwd file in the chroot will get you in maintenance hell ... but if you want to go on and find out which dirs need to be writeable etc, have a look at /etc/default/ltsp-client-setup in the chroot 
[07:19] <LaserJock> quick python question, I have a function that returns a 4-element tuple. I only want the 4th element (which is a list). what is the easiest way to get that 4th element?
[07:19] <ogra> gruntu, not in dapper ... edgy (the currebt development version) has a half way working implementation
[07:20] <ogra> LaserJock, something like function()[-1]  ?
[07:20] <LaserJock> ah stink, I was just using the wrong index
[07:20] <LaserJock> feel free to ignore me
[07:21] <cbx33> ping ogra 
[07:24] <cbx33> hey highvoltage 
[07:24] <cbx33> howz you
[07:24] <cberlo> Is there a simple way to integrate openMOSIX with Edubuntu, by any chance?
[07:25] <cberlo> (or any parallel processing clustering solution)?
[07:28] <highvoltage> hey cbx33
[07:29] <highvoltage> sorry my connection keeps droping
[07:29] <highvoltage> *dropping
[07:29] <cbx33> hehe
[07:29] <cbx33> that's ok
[07:29] <cbx33> just thought I'd say hey
[07:29] <cbx33> cberlo, I don;t know of a way
[07:29] <cbx33> highvoltage, mind if I pm you?
[07:30] <highvoltage> cbx33: not at all
[07:30] <cr3> highvoltage: cheers, I added /var/lib/gdm to rw_dirs
[07:31] <gruntu> ogra I will have to try that. thanks. I noticed that the downloads have been incredibly slow lately. Ubuntu must be getting very popular. Do you have any recommended mirrors?
[07:31] <ogra> the nearest :)
[07:31] <highvoltage> cr3: also make sure that's  it's owned by root:gdm
[07:31] <ogra> cbx33, pong 
[07:32] <cbx33> ogra, d'ya get my mail?
[07:32] <ogra> yes
[07:32] <cberlo> Wonder how hard it would be to build torrent support into apt....
[07:32] <cbx33> ogra, :D
[07:32] <cbx33> did you understand what I meant about the plugins?>
[07:33] <cr3> highvoltage: weird, there's no gdm group in my chrooted /etc/group :(
[07:33] <ogra> cbx33, yes, but lets keep such stuff for edgy+1
[07:33] <cbx33> np
[07:33] <ogra> we'Re running out of time 
[07:33] <cbx33> so the implementation I have done is fine for now?
[07:33] <ogra> yes, totally, i havent looked at the recent one yet 
[07:34] <cbx33> oh you should
[07:34] <cbx33> :p
[07:34] <LaserJock> cbx33!
[07:34] <cbx33> lots of new stuff
[07:34] <cbx33> HEY LaserJock 
[07:34] <ogra> (and wont have time today)
[07:34] <LaserJock> I have a python question for you
[07:34] <cbx33> ogra, that's cool
[07:34] <cbx33> LaserJock, shoot
[07:34] <cbx33> or in pm if you want
[07:34] <ogra> probably later, but i have to go in 30 min and will be away most of the evening
[07:34] <LaserJock> or anybody for that matter, is there an efficient way of doing a uniq on a list?
[07:35] <ogra> and somehow cant find out why X is broken in ltsp
[07:35] <cbx33> LaserJock, hmmm
[07:36] <cbx33> lemme check something
[07:36] <cbx33> LaserJock, there is a module called pstat
[07:36] <cbx33> which you can download
[07:37] <cbx33> it has a unique function in it
[07:37] <cbx33> but I suppose the only real way is to build a list from that list
[07:37] <cbx33> that's probably what that function does
[07:38] <cbx33> might be quicker to rebuild the list as an associative array
[07:38] <LaserJock> hmm, I see the python cookbook has one
[07:38] <cbx33> then step through that, seeing as the keys should be unique
[07:38] <RichEd> !seen mhz
[07:38] <cbx33> LaserJock, got a link ?
[07:38] <ubotu> I last saw mhz (n=mhz@moinmoin/fan/mhz) 3d 16h 21m 6s ago, quiting: "Leaving"
[07:38] <LaserJock> http://aspn.activestate.com/ASPN/Cookbook/Python/Recipe/52560/
[07:38] <cr3> crap, and now my client is hanging on: Starting NBD client process: [4294685.695000]  nbd: registered device at major 43
[07:39] <gruntu> One last thing; I have "sound = true" in my lts.conf but I still get no sound. With k12 I add soundblaster parameters. can I use these?
[07:39] <cbx33> LaserJock, the last way I mentioned could be quicker than that
[07:39] <ogra> rodarvus, the keyboard thing is not caused by localdev it seems ... i got it as well if i switch off everything localdev related
[07:39] <cbx33> you wouldn't need to sort
[07:39] <cbx33> which can take a while
[07:39] <ogra> so i suspect its a general X thing rather
[07:40] <LaserJock> cbx33: well, these are small lists
[07:40] <cbx33> it'll still be the fastest way to do it I would think
[07:40] <LaserJock> cbx33: basically I'm trying to get a list of users who are using the dynamic menus
[07:41] <rodarvus> ogra, oh, now it makes more sense
[07:41] <cbx33> LaserJock, wanna move to pm?
[07:41] <LaserJock> sure
[07:41] <ogra> rodarvus, well ...
[07:41] <highvoltage> 4
[07:42] <ogra> rodarvus, if it would work that would be cooler ... its very weird that i can trigger it by console switching
[07:42] <ogra> its also not usplash caused ... i just booted without it
[07:43] <ogra> hmm
[07:44] <ogra> i'll take that back 
[07:44] <ogra> it apparently is usplash
[07:44] <gruntu> ogra One last thing; I have "sound = true" in my lts.conf but I still get no sound. With k12 I add soundblaster parameters. can I use these?
[07:50] <gruntu> for example: SMODULE_01 = sb io=0x220 irq=5 dma=1
[07:51] <cr3> how can I get diagnosis from gdm which keeps returning me the username prompt after login? I tried creating /var/lib/gdm, 1770, root:gdm, and mounting it rw, but it still doesn't work
[07:52] <rodarvus> ogra, do you have current usplash?
[07:52] <rodarvus> I believe using vesa for usplash broke configuration for many people
[07:53] <ogra> rodarvus, yes, i built the chroot some hours ago
[07:54] <ogra> its the most recent stuff 
[07:54] <rodarvus> hmm, I thought the current usplash (from a few days ago) had dropped vesa
[07:54] <ogra> gruntu, try MODULE_01 instead 
[07:54] <rodarvus> (it was added a few weeks ago)
[07:54] <ogra> and put it in quotes
[07:55] <ogra> gruntu, oh, and thats for a oss module ...
[07:55] <ogra> you will need rather something like snd-sb (if that exists) instead of just sb
[07:56] <ogra> rodarvus, well, i'd have expected video output to break, but certainly not the keyboard :)
[07:58] <cbx33> ogra, did I tell you how I'd imlpemented pessulus
[07:58] <ogra> nope
[07:58] <ogra> at least not in the mail
[07:59] <cbx33> pessulus, isn't great for what we want
[07:59] <cbx33> but I've come up with a solution
[07:59] <cbx33> I'll send you a mail to explain
[08:00] <ogra> pessulus is perfect for what we want 
[08:00] <ogra> did you read the howtos ? 
[08:00] <cbx33> where ?
[08:00] <ogra> you need to copy aroung a lot of stuff though
[08:00] <cbx33> nah
[08:00] <cbx33> I fixed it a different way
[08:00] <cbx33> pessulus does global settings
[08:00] <cbx33> unless the user doesn't have access right
[08:00] <ogra> jdub pointed me to some howto, but i lost the url
[08:00] <ogra> no
[08:01] <cbx33> that's what the manual said
[08:01] <ogra> pessulus does settings you copy over to the user
[08:01] <cbx33> so I setup SCP to use sux as a wrapper to run it as the user you have selected
[08:01] <cbx33> no copying involved
[08:01] <ogra> and sux is in main ?
[08:01] <cbx33> no :(
[08:02] <ogra> is it safe and likely to get to main in an easy way ? 
[08:02] <ogra> (without hacking it)
[08:02] <cbx33> I'm not sure
[08:02] <cbx33> I've not hacked it in anyway
[08:02] <ogra> ok
[08:02] <cbx33> but I'm not sure as to it's security
[08:02] <cbx33> it just handles the X authority
[08:02] <ogra> keep that for edgy+1 as well
[08:02] <cbx33> so I can run anotehr users graphical app
[08:02] <cbx33> in my own session
[08:02] <ogra> wont work wih ssh
[08:03] <ogra> *with
[08:03] <cbx33> no?
[08:03] <cbx33> shute
[08:03] <ogra> no
[08:03] <cbx33> sorry ogra 
[08:03] <cbx33> I havn't done too well here have I
[08:03] <cbx33> I'll find another solution
[08:03] <cbx33> well it will work
[08:03] <cbx33> if the admin user is logged into the machine properly
[08:03] <cbx33> as in not a client
[08:03] <ogra> no, the idea is great but that should be part of the next enhancement spes and be discussed in a BOF
[08:04] <cbx33> ok
[08:04] <ogra> we can do that on the next conf ;)
[08:04] <cbx33> ok
[08:04] <cbx33> did you want to drop that from the current spec
[08:04] <cbx33> ?
[08:04] <cbx33> I was goign to setup another spec
[08:04] <highvoltage> 4
[08:04] <ogra> no, lest use pessulus for now ... i'll try to catch vuntz in -devel if i have time he will know where that howto is
[08:05] <cbx33> I can do that if you want
[08:05] <cbx33> I tried to catch him the other day
[08:05] <ogra> he's not easy to get 
[08:05] <ogra> :)
[08:05] <cbx33> I know
[08:05] <ogra> i know that
[08:05] <cbx33> pygi told me
[08:05] <ogra> jdub should know about it as well 
[08:05] <cbx33> ok
[08:06] <ogra> pessulus can write to a temp file that you copy over the users settings afaik 
[08:06] <cbx33> hmmm
[08:06] <ogra> or something along that lines
[08:06] <cbx33> I didn't see anything like that in the command line help
[08:06] <cbx33> or the docs
[08:06] <cbx33> I'll take a closer look
[08:06] <cbx33> as I say, I got round it by running it as the user it was supposed to be editing
[08:09] <Burgwork> you can make pessulus do mandatory keys
[08:09] <Burgwork> for full profiles you need to pull in sabayon
[08:09] <Burgwork> which I recommend you do anyway
[08:09] <ogra> we'll ship it ...
[08:09] <ogra> but i somehow have no good feeling installing it by default
[08:10] <ogra> it still feels very immature
[08:10] <ogra> and we need to add all users to a default profile
[08:10] <Burgwork> the issue is that there is no full time person working on either sabayon or pessulus
[08:10] <ogra> right
[08:11] <ogra> but pessulus is small 
[08:11] <cbx33> hmm
[08:11] <ogra> sabayon is a huge beast
[08:11] <ogra> with many points of potential failure
[08:11] <LaserJock> and probably has less development
[08:11] <cbx33> is there a way to get my way to work ogra ?
[08:11] <Burgwork> ogra, talk with whiprush. He uses it extensively
[08:12] <ogra> cbx33, i have ot look at the code to tell that ...
[08:12] <LaserJock> sabayon is done by red hat basically and when red hat says "We don't want any more people working on sabayon" it kinda puts a damper on things
[08:12] <ogra> but i have to go now ... i'm already 12 mins late ...
[08:12] <ogra> bbl
[08:12] <cbx33> sorry ogra 
[08:12] <cbx33> see ya tomorrow
[08:12] <highvoltage> 
[08:12] <highvoltage> 
[08:13] <Burgwork> LaserJock, afaik, nobody has ever said that about sabayon
[08:13] <Burgwork> they have merely not had anyone work on it
[08:13] <LaserJock> well
[08:13] <LaserJock> they pulled all the devs off it
[08:13] <Burgwork> because it is 0.1 feature complete
[08:13] <Burgwork> and rh is just as strapped for devs as we are
[08:14] <LaserJock> sure, but what I'm saying is, unless people pick it up...
[08:14] <Burgwork> yes
[08:14] <Burgwork> but you said that RH didn't want people working on it
[08:14] <Burgwork> which is not true
[08:14] <cbx33> ahhh.....
[08:14] <LaserJock> well, semantics I guess
[08:15] <cbx33> sabayon does exactly what I was doing really
[08:15] <LaserJock> I meant they pulled the devs off of it
[08:15] <LaserJock> I should have been clearer
[08:16] <bengoodger> red hat doesn't help anyone, really
[08:17] <bengoodger> they make their money from selling free software
[08:17] <LaserJock> well, they put a lot of dev time into sabayon for which I'm grateful
[08:17] <LaserJock> but they can't sustain that obviously
[08:17] <bengoodger> yup
[08:17] <cbx33> LaserJock, are you using sabayon?
[08:18] <LaserJock> well, with the dynamic-menus I looked into it a fair bit
[08:18] <LaserJock> but I have no need for it professionally
[08:18] <LaserJock> it is quite nice
[08:18] <LaserJock> from what I've seen
[08:18] <LaserJock> it just needs a development community to show up
[08:18] <LaserJock> and continue the work
[08:18] <bengoodger> sorry, but dynamic-menus has no chance of being included in edgy
[08:19] <LaserJock> hehe
[08:19] <LaserJock> ok
[08:19] <bengoodger> if launchpad is accurate, then it is only about 30% complete and going slowly
[08:19] <bengoodger> and feature freeze is next week
[08:19] <LaserJock> I should have an initial implementation today
[08:19] <cbx33> LaserJock, has been working hard
[08:19] <LaserJock> but it will look a little different than what the spec says
[08:19] <bengoodger> laserjock, can you get it finished for next week?
[08:19] <LaserJock> sure
[08:20] <cbx33> I hope scp will make it too
[08:20] <bengoodger> great
[08:20] <bengoodger> scp?
[08:20] <LaserJock> it'll be rough (dare I say, edgy) but it'll work
[08:20] <cbx33> Student Control Panel
[08:20] <bengoodger> I thought that was in dapper
[08:20] <bengoodger> laserjock, great.
[08:20] <LaserJock> the edgy menus won't be quite so nice, but it's a first step
[08:20] <cbx33> bengoodger, it's being updated a lot for edgy
[08:20] <bengoodger> aha.
[08:21] <bengoodger> goood..
[08:21] <bengoodger> I and a colleague are looking to contribute to edgy+1
[08:21] <cbx33> ahh excellent
[08:21] <cbx33> bengoodger, what's your background?
[08:22] <bengoodger> cbx33, do you know RM?
[08:22] <cbx33> RM?
[08:22] <cbx33> as in Research MAchines?
[08:22] <bengoodger> yeah.
[08:22] <cbx33> where are you based?
[08:22] <bengoodger> my background is hating them a lot.
[08:22] <cbx33> bengoodger, hahahah
[08:22] <bengoodger> cornwall
[08:22] <cbx33> me too
[08:22] <cbx33> I'm in hampshire
[08:23] <bengoodger> so yeah, we've got this system designed that pushes software to all clients
[08:23] <cbx33> cool
[08:23] <cbx33> linux based?
[08:23] <bengoodger> APT based.
[08:23] <bengoodger> we are hoping to get someone to write it for edgy
[08:23] <cr3> in order to get a quick and dirty fat client working, I tried setting nfsroot=/ pointing to another system running ubuntu, but I get a bunch of errors about: INIT: cannot execute "/sbin/getty"
[08:24] <bengoodger> and then obviously if it's good enough we shall contribute it to edgy+1
[08:24] <cbx33> bengoodger, good good
[08:24] <cbx33> would be good for the fat client stuff
[08:24] <bengoodger> but the company is based on providing preconfigured edubuntu-based school computers and edubuntu configuration
[08:25] <cbx33> bengoodger, what company is this
[08:25] <cbx33> if you don't mind my asking?
[08:25] <bengoodger> it's not technically in existance at this point
[08:25] <cbx33> ahh heheh
[08:25] <bengoodger> FLES, Free/Libre Educational Services..
[08:25] <cbx33> bengoodger, nice
[08:25] <cbx33> well
[08:25] <cbx33> you'll be interested in some of the work going on soon
[08:26] <bengoodger> so yeah, we'll be selling edubuntu-running computers with dumbed-down RM-style network management systems
[08:26] <cbx33> there are people....myself included.....working on literature
[08:26] <cbx33> leaflets booklets etc
[08:26] <bengoodger> well, I can write doco for eight-year-olds..
[08:26] <bengoodger> unfortunately we've nobody to write it for us
[08:26] <bengoodger> (the program)
[08:27] <cbx33> bengoodger, what would it do?
[08:27] <cbx33> I mean what do you have so far?
[08:27] <bengoodger> we've a design for how it'd work, so far.
[08:28] <bengoodger> and a couple of UI mockups
[08:28] <cbx33> what do you mean for the network management system
[08:28] <cbx33> ah cvool
[08:28] <bengoodger> well, the first thing it'd do would be the deb-pushing
[08:28] <cbx33> bengoodger, are you planning to install LTSP server?
[08:28] <bengoodger> nope, NFS/LDAP fat clients
[08:29] <bengoodger> the admin uses his nice GTK+ interface to choose an application to install on a group of machines
[08:29] <cbx33> easy :p
[08:29] <cbx33> you could write that in a few days :p
[08:29] <bengoodger> I couldn't..
[08:29] <bengoodger> this interface then writes a file of some sort whose name I've forgotten
[08:30] <cbx33> well, 
[08:30] <bengoodger> the client requests a file, the server sends it the appropriate file ("profile") based on what group the machine is a member of
[08:30] <cbx33> i see
[08:30] <bengoodger> the client then dpkg --app-list or somethings the file and apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade is run
[08:31] <cbx33> yeh
[08:31] <bengoodger> all transparently to the user and easily for the MSCE running it
[08:31] <cbx33> fairly simple system
[08:31] <bengoodger> fairly simple, yes.
[08:31] <cbx33> have you looked aroudn to mke sure no one has already done it?
[08:31] <bengoodger> yeah, we did find one thing
[08:31] <bengoodger> it was about ten years old, extremely dirty and didn't do what we wanted it to
[08:32] <Burgwork> bengoodger, you should see the implementation of NWU that the brazillian guy is working for
[08:32] <cbx33> oh
[08:32] <Burgwork> s/for/on
[08:32] <bengoodger> 80% of the original code was going to be the thing that invokes APT to resolve any differences between the client and its profile, but it turns out that's done by APT anyway
[08:33] <bengoodger> so it should be nice and easy
[08:33] <Burgwork> you could do it fairly easily with meta packages
[08:33] <Burgwork> just push something new into the meta package, update and bam
[08:33] <bengoodger> burgwork, it wouldn't work
[08:33] <cbx33> bengoodger, why?
[08:33] <bengoodger> if you remove something from a meta package it won't remove it from the system
[08:33] <Burgwork> right
[08:33] <cbx33> ah yes
[08:34] <bengoodger> besides which, we wanted to use the real ubuntu
[08:34] <bengoodger> proxy is there for speed, but that's it as far as fiddling with the APT server goes
[08:34] <cbx33> yeh
[08:34] <bengoodger> now, the frontend handles the following:
[08:35] <Burgwork> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NetworkWideUpdates
[08:35] <Burgwork> http://cetico.org/nwu
[08:35] <Burgwork> doesn't do what you want, but is very similar
[08:35] <bengoodger> warnings from the system, group management, news from us, update notification, help
[08:35] <Burgwork> be nice to combine your idea and that into a general "network software manager"
[08:35] <cbx33> Burgwork, ++
[08:35] <bengoodger> hmm
[08:35] <cbx33> bengoodger, might be worth contacting them
[08:36] <bengoodger> it might
[08:36] <Burgwork> they are also working on authenticating the communication, which is also key
[08:36] <cbx33> definitely
[08:36] <Burgwork> ie: the client only takes software from an authenticated server
[08:36] <bengoodger> burgwork, authentication is integral to this system
[08:36] <bengoodger> as we simply use APT as normal.
[08:36] <cbx33> it can't really work without it
[08:37] <bengoodger> our plan was to have each computer as a member of a group
[08:38] <bengoodger> the laptop in room A24, for instance, would be a member of Laptops/Art
[08:38] <bengoodger> and so each group has a profile of packages and configuration files installed on it
[08:39] <cbx33> sounds like a good idea
[08:39] <bengoodger> ya
[08:39] <cbx33> I'd talk to NWU they may be interested in putting that into practice
[08:40] <bengoodger> true
[08:40] <Burgwork> you guys overlap about 75%
[08:40] <cbx33> yeh
[08:41] <bengoodger> can we also combine LDAP with dynamic menus, that'd be cool
[08:41] <bengoodger> we could add to this frontend to do that too
[08:41] <cbx33> tal to LaserJock 
[08:41] <cbx33> maybe an edgy+1 idea
[08:41] <bengoodger> I was hoping he/she'd still be here
[08:41] <bengoodger> he is
[08:42] <LaserJock> who?
[08:42] <bengoodger> you
[08:42] <LaserJock> wha?
[08:42] <Burgwork> bengoodger, sabayon can talk to ldap
[08:42] <LaserJock> ;-)
[08:42] <mhz> hi all
[08:42] <bengoodger> LaserJock: I want to link dynamic-menus and LDAP
[08:42] <LaserJock> sorry, trying to finish up the menu updater :-)
[08:42] <mhz> ping RichEd 
[08:43] <cbx33> mhz, RichEd was looking for you earlier
[08:43] <LaserJock> bengoodger: interesting
[08:43] <LaserJock> I really don't know much about LDAP, what would that look like?
[08:43] <bengoodger> I dunno
[08:43] <mhz> cbx33: hi
[08:43] <mhz> cbx33: meaning he left?
[08:44] <cbx33> well, i dunno
[08:44] <bengoodger> just linking LDAP to dynamic-menus as well as etc/passwd
[08:44] <LaserJock> well, I would think it would be surely doable
[08:45] <Burgwork> sabayon does it by having a full .zip with their profile and an ldap key pointing at that .zip file
[08:45] <bengoodger> hm
[08:45] <LaserJock> but probably edgy+1 unless somebody has some time
[08:45] <Burgwork> bengoodger, LaserJock; you lot really need to talk to whiprush (Jorge Castro), becuase he manages Ubuntu using LDAP, etc.
[08:45] <bengoodger> well, if you can get it done so it works on edgy after edgy is released we can incorporate it into the fles repos
[08:46] <bengoodger> along with this frontend program
[08:46] <LaserJock> well, sabayon won't work for dynamic-menus unless Jorge has done some amazing hacking to sabayon
[08:46] <Burgwork> no, I realize that
[08:46] <cbx33> oh I foudn a strange bug in login
[08:46] <cbx33> hang on I'll try to replicate again
[08:46] <Burgwork> but rather than talk endlessly, we shoudl talk with someone who is already using this in real life
[08:46] <LaserJock> oh yeah, sure
[08:47] <LaserJock> I wish I had had a chance at Ubucon
[08:47] <Burgwork> yep
[08:47] <pygi> highvoltage, poke?
[08:48] <bengoodger> LaserJock: hm
[08:48] <bengoodger> please join me on #fles
[08:59] <cbx33> bbl
[10:21] <mhz> Burgwork: still there?
[10:21] <Burgwork> mhz, always and forever
[10:21] <mhz> Burgwork: hehehehe, cool
[10:22] <mhz> Burgwork: I chated a few mins ago with mruiz (aka Miguel A. Ruiz) from Chile
[10:22] <Burgwork> cool
[10:22] <mhz> about UWN being issued in spanish
[10:22] <Burgwork> right
[10:22] <mhz> however, despite I really agree with him
[10:23] <mhz> I feel -CL people are still not mature enough on taking responsibilities
[10:23] <mhz> there are lots of good intentions
[10:23] <mhz> but we are the same old 5 to 7 guys doing as much as we can
[10:24] <mhz> and from the rest of spanish speakers...
[10:24] <mhz> well, mybe
[10:24] <Burgwork> yep
[10:24] <bengoodger> hooray for spain.
[10:24] <Burgwork> the issue mostly is that I need to finish the UWN before saturday night
[10:24] <bengoodger> hotter than england, but seems less hot.
[10:24] <mhz> bengoodger: :)
[10:24] <mhz> Burgwork: yup
[10:24] <bengoodger> Burgwork: well, if you can do so that'll be bonega, as esperantists say
[10:25] <mhz> Burgwork: so, once we are 100% sure we'll have enough mature and responsible, reliable hands, we could say we are ready tojump in and make it happen in 20 hours or less
[10:27] <bengoodger> hooray
[10:27] <Burgwork> right
[10:27] <bengoodger> is november a reasonable deadline for 150 hours' programming by a volunteer?
[10:27] <Burgwork> so when should I aim to finish UWN this week for this week to happen?
[10:27] <Burgwork> yes
[10:27] <bengoodger> okie-doke
[10:28] <bengoodger> apparently chris works better on a deadline, so that should be ok
[10:28] <mhz> Burgwork: talking ot me?
[10:28] <Burgwork> yes
[10:29] <mhz> Burgwork: I'll chat with mruiz again today or tomorrow this time. If he really is sure he, at least himself, can take it all and translate it, then we're ok. Me knows there are 5 people translating stuff for Edubuntu into spanish right now
[10:30] <Burgwork> right
[10:30] <mhz> Burgwork: so, I can say, you'll get an email or IRC confirmation tomorrow this time
[10:30] <Burgwork> sounds good
[10:51] <mhz> Burgwork: if a Moin version/macro  could actually count and sum every single page a user has contributed to, would that mean Karma will consider wiki contribs?
[10:52] <Burgwork> mhz, suggest it to the LP guys
[10:53] <mhz> Burgwork: but will he get a newer version of Moin? (current available is 1.5.4)
[10:53] <mhz> and we are using 1.3.5
[10:54] <sbartleylinux> Do I understand correctly that Ubuntu LTSP uses ldm for the client?  If so, is there a way to disable the Hibernate button from appearing when the client clicks System/Quit?
[10:54] <Burgwork> sbalneav, no idea
[10:54] <mhz> sbartleylinux: yup, instead of GDM
[10:54] <Burgwork> mhz, would love to. Ask mkde
[10:55] <sbalneav> sbartleylinux: uninstall the gnome-power-manager
[10:55] <pygi> sbalneav, there is
[10:55] <pygi> sbartleylinux, there is a way
[10:55] <pygi> sbartleylinux, use upstream logout dialog
[10:56] <sbartleylinux> sbalneav: wont I lose ups monitoring then?
[10:56] <sbartleylinux> pygi: is there document on where to get and how to do so?
[10:56] <sbalneav> sbartleylinux: I'd use apcd or something for that myself.  You could also set a gconf variable for all your users.
[10:57] <sbalneav> I know that ogra's got a fix for it in edgy.
[10:57] <pygi> sbartleylinux, gconf, I forgot exact location of key
[10:58] <sbalneav> I think, in gconf-editor, you'd go to apps->gnome-power-manager-> can_hibernate, and click it off.
[10:58] <sbalneav> yes, that fixes it.
[10:59] <sbartleylinux> did that but it is still appearing.  
[10:59] <sbalneav> Not for me it isn't.
[10:59] <sbartleylinux> thought it was due to ldm vs. gdm and maybe ldm was ignoring that conf.
[10:59] <sbartleylinux> hm.
[10:59] <sbalneav> That turned it off for me.
[11:00] <sbalneav> !pastebot
[11:00] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about pastebot - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[11:14] <sbalneav> Heading home for the day.  Be on tonight.
[11:16] <sbartleylinux> pygi: is it /schemas/apps/panel/global/upstream_session?
[11:17] <pygi> sbartleylinux, might be
[11:20] <sbartleylinux> pygi: yep. /apps/panel/global/upstream_session did it.  thx.
[11:22] <pygi> sbartleylinux, yw :)
[11:46] <cbx33> ping rodarvus 
[11:47] <cbx33> ping ogra_ 
[11:48] <crimsun> cbx33: Rodrigo is out with his wife & daughter presently.
[11:48] <cbx33> ah...ok
[11:50] <mhz_off> bytes yoall
[11:50] <cbx33> crimsun, I just sent you a pm
[11:51] <cbx33> would appreciate your input
[11:53] <LaserJock> cbx33: hehe
[11:53] <LaserJock> you better watch out, people are going to start calling you "closed-source pete" 'cause you do everything in a PM ;-)
[11:54] <cbx33> oh no
[11:54] <cbx33> really?
[11:54] <cbx33> who who?
[11:54] <cbx33> I just don't wanna flood everyone else with my mindless prattle
[11:54] <LaserJock> hehe