[12:11] <Riddell> Tonio_: what's the status of openwengo?
[12:12] <Riddell> imbrandon: he said you need libbeagle-dev
[12:12] <imbrandon> ahhh that could be my problem
[12:17] <kwwii> I like the engage menu in amarok...nice touch, something new for a change. A bit too star trek for my tastes though
[12:18] <Riddell> it does seem tacky
[12:20] <imbrandon> woot the upstart overloards are hitting edgy today
[12:20] <Riddell> imbrandon: hmm?
[12:20] <imbrandon> >  ubuntu-meta (1.19) edgy; urgency=low
[12:21] <imbrandon> >  .
[12:21] <imbrandon> >    * Refreshed dependencies
[12:21] <imbrandon> >    * Added upstart-compat-sysv to minimal-i386, minimal-amd64, minimal-
[12:21] <imbrandon> >      powerpc, minimal-ia64, minimal-sparc
[12:21] <imbrandon> >    * Added upstart to minimal-i386, minimal-amd64, minimal-powerpc,
[12:21] <imbrandon> >      minimal-ia64, minimal-sparc
[12:21] <imbrandon> >    * Removed sysvinit from minimal-i386, minimal-amd64, minimal-powerpc,
[12:21] <imbrandon> >      minimal-ia64, minimal-sparc, minimal-hppa
[12:22] <Riddell> scary
[12:22] <Riddell> guess I should merge the kubuntu seed then
[12:22] <imbrandon> bout an hour ago
[12:22] <imbrandon> maybe 2, i'm still not awake , LOL
[12:23] <imbrandon> hehe i'm already running it for the last 2 days, seems the same to me tbh
[12:23] <imbrandon> but thats becouse i havent made any upstart events
[12:23] <imbrandon> its still all the old sysv stuff
[12:23] <imbrandon> but shutdown is hella quick
[12:24] <imbrandon> Riddell: are you on the sounder ML ?
[12:24] <Riddell> imbrandon: sure, although I don't often read it
[12:25] <imbrandon> Seveas and jdub chimed in with some cool comments about it the last few minutes
[12:25] <Riddell> - * sysvinit
[12:25] <imbrandon> hehe thats how i noticed
[12:25] <Riddell> + * upstart
[12:25] <Riddell> here we go
[12:25] <imbrandon> whoa
[12:25] <imbrandon> wait
[12:25] <imbrandon> you need upstart-compat-sysv
[12:25] <imbrandon> too
[12:25] <imbrandon> or you wont be able to boot
[12:25] <imbrandon> i made that mistake once heh
[12:26] <Riddell> that's in there too
[12:26] <Riddell> bzr is clever like that
[12:26] <imbrandon> hehe cool
[12:26] <ryanakca> imbrandon: +u?
[12:26] <imbrandon> i dident install it the first time
[12:26] <imbrandon> and had to boot from a livecd and chroot in and recover
[12:26] <imbrandon> lol
[12:27] <Riddell> I think upstart is worth it if only because of the buzz it generates
[12:27] <imbrandon> yea thats what jdub said basicly
[12:27] <imbrandon> Now *that's* EDGY.
[12:27] <imbrandon> - Jeff
[12:27] <imbrandon> and seveas 
[12:27] <imbrandon> It means that Ubuntu is doing what no major distribution has done
[12:27] <imbrandon> before. Replacing init with aomething shiny, new and event driven. IT
[12:27] <imbrandon> ROCKS!
[12:27] <imbrandon> -- 
[12:27] <imbrandon> Dennis K.
[12:28] <imbrandon> ;)
[12:28] <Riddell> and it didn't even take that long for Scott to write it
[12:28] <imbrandon> ryanakca: +u freenode staff will give you if you make a case to them why you need more than the 20 channels
[12:28] <imbrandon> ryanakca: +u lifts the 20 chn limmit
[12:28] <ryanakca> lol
[12:29] <Riddell> hmm, I could do with that
[12:29] <imbrandon> Riddell: yea thats what is suprising 
[12:29] <imbrandon> Riddell: all -core-dev get it on request, no need to "make a case"
[12:29] <ryanakca> quote: "User mode u, allowing users to join to up to 100 channels at once." http://bloggage.org/archives/32-Test-Net-and-Changes.html
[12:29] <imbrandon> just ask rob or naloith
[12:29] <kwwii> hehe
[12:29] <imbrandon> ryanakca: 130 to be exact
[12:30] <imbrandon> ;)
[12:30] <kwwii> so which file do I have to erase to be able to start the hwdb thing again?
[12:30] <Riddell> kwwii: ~/.hwdb
[12:30] <kwwii> Riddell: thnx
[12:30] <imbrandon> yea Riddell -core-dev gets +u automagicly , all they have to do is ask
[12:31] <imbrandon> anyone here ever used bip for irc, man it rocks
[12:32] <Riddell> what is it?
[12:32] <kwwii> is it like irrsi?
[12:32] <imbrandon> a irc "proxie" kida like irssi + screen for any client
[12:32] <Riddell> that's what kwwii uses
[12:32] <Riddell> ryanakca: I'm not sure what other case you could make
[12:33] <imbrandon> like i run bip on my file server and it connects to all my chans etc, then i connect to the the file server with my fav client and can close my client at will and bip still runs
[12:33] <imbrandon> change computers and use a new client
[12:33] <imbrandon> its still connected
[12:33] <mornfall> it's called a bouncer :)
[12:33] <imbrandon> ryanakca: yea thats about it, mostly its to keep spammers from "all" chans at once
[12:34] <mornfall> there are several :)
[12:34] <imbrandon> mornfall: yea
[12:34] <mornfall> (dircproxy comes to mind... or irssi-proxy)
[12:34] <imbrandon> mornfall: i just discoverd it though, its all the love of irssi + screen but i get to keep my gui client ;)
[12:35] <mornfall> i dunno, i used irssi-proxy for a while and then reverted back to irssi+screen only
[12:35] <imbrandon> heh i tried to get used to irssi but i like konversation too much ( and xirssi on osx )
[12:36] <Tonio_> Riddell: new major version is still beta version
[12:36] <Tonio_> Riddell: concerning openwengo of course :)
[12:36] <imbrandon> hehehe mornfall
[12:36] <Riddell> Tonio_: right
[12:36] <Lure> imbrandon: bip sounds nice - I just need to compile it for my OpenWRT
[12:36] <Tonio_> Riddell: but we can look at packaging it now we have qt4 packages
[12:37] <Riddell> Tonio_: still, might be better than nothing
[12:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: sure, I'll look at that this week
[12:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: I have time now :)
[12:38] <imbrandon> btw mornfall long time no see/chat , take a little break ? or just from irc ;)
[12:38] <Riddell> too much wesnoth I recon
[12:38] <imbrandon> heh
[12:38] <mornfall> c'mon
[12:39] <mornfall> http://web.mornfall.net/blog/account_of_recent_events.html
[12:39] <imbrandon> ahh i havent read you blog in a few weeks , guess i could have done that
[12:39] <imbrandon> heh
[12:41] <kwwii> Riddell: why do icons appear for some of the radio boxes and not for the others?
[12:41] <kwwii> in the hwdb-kde client, I mean
[12:41] <kwwii> it is like magic...or karma
[12:41] <kwwii> I did not click hard enough?
[12:42] <imbrandon> heh
[12:42] <kwwii> imbrandon: shut up and fix amarok!
[12:42] <kwwii> :p
[12:43] <kwwii> I know, I know, "I already fixed it!"
[12:43] <Riddell> kwwii: it's a bug, I've not looked into it
[12:43] <kwwii> think of me as the crabby old man, bitching about everything
[12:44] <kwwii> i seem to draw bugs to me
[12:45] <Riddell> mornfall: that's quite a lovely blog entry, or at least it's better than I could have written after splitting up from my first long term girlfriend
[12:46] <imbrandon> heh well its fixed in edgy as i said BUT
[12:46] <imbrandon> its not made it back to dapper
[12:46] <imbrandon> becouse of the soyuz mess
[12:47] <mornfall> Riddell: it's a second for me :|
[12:47] <kwwii> Riddell: you split up with your girlfriend?
[12:47] <mornfall> not that it helps
[12:47] <mornfall> the first time was a rosegarden walk compared to this one
[12:48] <mornfall> but thanks, i appreciate it...
[12:49] <kwwii> next week I will be married for 9 years
[12:49] <kwwii> freaky fucking shit
[12:49] <imbrandon> heh
[12:51] <kwwii> trust me when I say that staying together with someone is hard
[12:51] <mornfall> imbrandon: s/for/in/?
[12:51] <DaSkreech> But worth it?
[12:51] <mornfall> oh
[12:51] <imbrandon> ;)
[12:52] <kwwii> definitely worth it, if you can learn to accept anything
[12:52] <imbrandon> DaSkreech: it is worth it i think, but like kwwii sometimes its hard, like right now my wife is in Reno NV ( 1100+ miles away ) becosue its hard at times 
[12:52] <DaSkreech> Hmm Wonder if there could be a KDM theme for Kubuntu with a user list for Edgy?
[12:52] <imbrandon> face browser ;)
[12:53] <DaSkreech> Uhh yeah 
[12:53] <kwwii> DaSkreech: I looked into that
[12:53] <DaSkreech> imbrandon: That would probably make it hard..
[12:53] <kwwii> the biggest problem, artistically is that the user list cannot be half transparent
[12:53] <kwwii> so it ends  up with a white bg
[12:54] <imbrandon> Riddell: who is Celso Providelo, are they on irc ?
[12:54] <DaSkreech> kwwii: Who's fault is that?
[12:54] <DaSkreech> KDM's?
[12:54] <kwwii> imbrandon: no, they are the people who are giving out 1 million in cash, if you'd only send them 5$ and your credit card number
[12:55] <kwwii> DaSkreech: KDM
[12:55] <imbrandon> kwwii: haha thats the person that can fix your amark if i can catch them ;)
[12:55] <imbrandon> amarok*
[12:55] <kwwii> damn the bastards
[12:55] <DaSkreech> Can't you have toned down colour of the KDM background to solve it?
[12:56] <imbrandon> ryanakca: type "/stats p" and see what freenode staff is online
[12:56] <kwwii> +u ???
[12:56] <kwwii> DaSkreech: toned down as in pure white?
[12:56] <kwwii> nope
[12:57] <ryanakca> [18:52]  [249]  p nalioth (i=nalioth@freenode/staff/ubuntu.member.nalioth)
[12:57] <ryanakca> [18:52]  [249]  p 1 staff member
[12:57] <ryanakca> [18:52]  [219]  p End of /STATS report
[12:57] <DaSkreech> kwwii: Soooo does KDM have to be rewritten?
[12:57] <ryanakca> lol
[12:57] <ryanakca> that makes it complicated :)
[12:57] <Riddell> imbrandon: he's a soyuz developer, he is often on irc
[12:58] <imbrandon> Riddell: do you know his nick ? hehe
[12:58] <DaSkreech> He's running #ubuntu-libre along with ompaul 
[12:58] <Riddell> imbrandon: but not just now
[12:58] <imbrandon> darn
[12:58] <Riddell> what's that about?
[12:58] <kwwii> DaSkreech: yes, please start :p
[12:58] <imbrandon> Riddell:  its about bug 58144 assigned to him ( to fix amarok among other things in dapper )
[12:58] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 58144 in soyuz "Backport is rejected if an older backport is already there" [Critical,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58144
[12:58] <ryanakca> what happened to #ubuntu-libre anywais?
[12:59] <ryanakca> is it still being worked on?
[12:59] <DaSkreech> kwwii: Well I'd need to at least know more about the technical limitations anyway Who do I talk to?
[12:59] <DaSkreech> Yes
[12:59] <imbrandon> yes
[12:59] <DaSkreech> THey changed the name... again
[12:59] <DaSkreech> to gnewsense
[12:59] <DaSkreech> And it has a Wiki :)
[01:00] <ryanakca> DaSkreech: what? ubntu-libre or something else?
[01:00] <kwwii> DaSkreech: erm, me, I guess...I know more about the problem then anyone, since it is suse that made it (coolo and lunas) after I wanted it there
[01:00] <Riddell> imbrandon: he's cprov
[01:00] <DaSkreech> ryanakca: Ubuntu-libre was renamed
[01:00] <kwwii> DaSkreech: the problem is that the user window bg will be a solid color, and not transparent
[01:00] <DaSkreech> kwwii: Ha I always thought that was Mandrake :)
[01:01] <DaSkreech> kwwii: Right. And it can't use real transparency?
[01:01] <kwwii> DaSkreech: nope, it was my fault
[01:01] <kwwii> if worse comes to worse, I found a version of the old theme, which I can edit to fit to kubuntu
[01:03] <DaSkreech> kwwii: Hmm Sooo no one has engineered a good fix yet?
[01:04] <kwwii> DaSkreech: nope...I kinda thought that if lunas cannot do it, nobody can
[01:04] <DaSkreech> Good point :) 
[01:04] <DaSkreech> Wonder if I can track him down
[01:04] <DaSkreech> Does he hang out on IRC I've not seen him
[01:05] <kwwii> hehe, I spelt his name wrong
[01:05] <kwwii> :p
[01:05] <kwwii> lubos
[01:06] <DaSkreech> Lunak :)
[01:06] <kwwii> lubos lunak
[01:06] <kwwii> exactl
[01:06] <kwwii> y
[01:07] <DaSkreech> Yeah I know him he added XGL/AIGLX support to kwin like 5 weeks back
[01:07] <kwwii> time for me to go to bed soon
[01:07] <DaSkreech> Bless his heart :)
[01:07] <kwwii> ;-)
[01:07] <mornfall> Seli on irc
[01:07] <mornfall> and yeah, bedtime
[01:07] <mornfall> goodnight :)
[01:07] <kwwii> night mornfall
[01:07] <kwwii> see you
[01:08] <kwwii> night all
[01:08] <kwwii> one more week of my son's summer vacation!
[01:08] <DaSkreech> Night
[01:31] <ryanakca> imbrandon: I need to "rethink" my case :)
[02:04] <imbrandon> Riddell: looks like amarok 1.4.3 will be released in favor of another 1.4.2 patchset
[02:05] <Riddell> joy
[02:07] <imbrandon> quote :
[02:07] <imbrandon> instead of creating another patchset for 1.4.2, we have decided to quickly 
[02:07] <imbrandon> release 1.4.3, which will provide many more bugfixes and also substantially 
[02:07] <imbrandon> increased performance. We're currently preparing the tarball and will inform 
[02:07] <imbrandon> you when the release is ready.
[02:07] <imbrandon> </end snip>
[02:16] <nixternal> http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=45215   interesting
[02:16] <nixternal> man, there are naked dudes and chicks on kde-look
[02:21] <imbrandon> wow who ripped kwwii's unfinished theme and put it on kde-look
[02:21] <imbrandon> thats sad
[02:21] <nixternal> haha ya
[02:21] <nixternal> and they like the color of the desktop as well
[02:22] <imbrandon> i hate when people do that, but i guess its a good thing actualy
[02:23] <imbrandon> generates more buzz
[02:24] <imbrandon> holy shiznit, i think i got kickoff to finaly compile 
[02:25] <nixternal> yup
[02:25] <nixternal> hey shiznit sniffah...bip and bitlbee?
[02:25] <nixternal> you got the phone and left me hangin' ;)
[02:25] <nixternal> i like kopete, and bitlbee was cool..but not the cool for me to loose the kopete
[02:25] <imbrandon> hehe join ##offtopic i'll explain
[04:06] <Jucato> _Sime: I verified what you were saying the other day. Unpatched Edgy opens CD's in /media rather than media:/. After the updates, the dialog box no longer appears when inserting CDs. but I also doesn't open a window in Konqueror
[05:01] <imbrandon> Riddell, they just gave me the 1.4.3 tarbal, i should have it ready by morning
[05:03] <Hawkwind> Chop chop, get to work you must!
[05:03] <Hawkwind> Hah
[05:03] <imbrandon> hahah ok yoda
[05:10] <Jucato> err... I updated Edgy a while ago, don't know since when the updates were made available. but now the Storage Media applet points to "/media" and no longer "media:/". was this change intended?
[05:11] <imbrandon> yes Jucato
[05:11] <Jucato> ah ok.. I was about to panic (or file a bug report) lol
[05:11] <imbrandon> that was the latest patch me/riddell/sime uploaded
[05:11] <imbrandon> no media:/ should not be used anywhere, if it is let me or sime know
[05:12] <Jucato> and inserting a CD no longer pops up the KDE Media Manager dialog box? but also doesn't open a new window
[05:12] <imbrandon> thats a diffrent issue altogather 
[05:12] <imbrandon> heh
[05:12] <Jucato> eheh so that one is a bug?
[05:12] <imbrandon> lemme finish up this new amarok then i'll look at it
[05:12] <Jucato> sure no hurries
[05:13] <Jucato> I'm compiling the bugs/issues/changes I'm finding so I can ask/file them later
[05:13] <Jucato> I've got a few ones in my head and in Kate
[05:13] <Hawkwind> He's trying to build his karma!
[05:13] <Jucato> lol I already have 7000+....
[05:13] <imbrandon> heh i dunno what mine even is, i never look at it
[05:14] <imbrandon> was like 15k last i looked
[05:14] <imbrandon> a few weeks ago
[05:14] <Jucato> Karma: 194838
[05:14] <Jucato> that's yours
[05:14] <imbrandon> 194k ;)
[05:15] <imbrandon> wow that jumped
[05:15] <imbrandon> lol
[05:15] <Jucato> I got 7k for filing a poorly done bug report and just following it up with similarly poorly done questions/logs
[05:26] <Jucato> um.. excuse me for disturbing (again), but what's the proper procedure/process when filing bug reports? Ask them first in -devel, then file the bug? and how do I know whether to file it in LP or in KDE?
[05:36] <imbrandon> Jucato, you make sure you can reliably reporduce it on the latest version of whatever your bug reporting on, and then possibly ( not required ) try to debug it with someone in irc seeing if they can reporduce it , if that is rtue file a bug report in LP ( and search the upstream bugs too )
[05:37] <Jucato> ok thanks!
[05:37] <Jucato> I was confused whether to file in LP or in KDE (upstream?) because they said I should file the Adept bug in KDE instead of LP
[05:38] <Jucato> so I guess part of the "debug it with someone in irc" is asking in here :D
[05:40] <Hawkwind> Jucato: Do I need to fire up vmware :P
[05:40] <Jucato> Hawkwind: not unless you're willing to install some updates :D
[05:40] <Jucato> when you wake up tomorrow/later maybe :D
[05:40] <Jucato> thanks for the offer
[05:40] <Hawkwind> Jucato: I'll install anything, it's vmware
[05:40] <Hawkwind> Hah
[05:41] <Jucato> Hawkwind: yeah but it takes some time... but of course ymmv
[05:42] <Hawkwind> Booting it up now
[05:42] <Jucato> ehehe thanks!
[05:42] <Jucato> I don't think you'll be able to confirm 1 or 2 of the bugs though :D
[05:43] <Hawkwind> Ok, do I need to be in KDE ?
[05:43] <Jucato> well, one of them I've only noticed happens with ext3 partitions :D
[05:44] <Hawkwind> Jucato: KDE is running now
[05:44] <Jucato> err.. Edgy?
[05:44] <Hawkwind> Jucato: For some stupid reason, I actually installed the vmware session as ext3 instead of Reiser, so you're in luck
[05:44] <Hawkwind> Yes, Edgy is in vmware
[05:44] <Jucato> Hawkwind: but do you have another ext3 partition in VMWare, besides the / partition?
[05:45] <Hawkwind> Jucato: Yes, my /home
[05:45] <Jucato> .... other than that? ehehe
[05:45] <Jucato> because this is the "bug" that I noticed
[05:45] <Jucato> "Ext3 partitions that are mounted at boot are unmounted upon logging out (End Current Session). VFAT and NTFS remain mounted"
[05:45] <Hawkwind> Nope, just / and /home is all I created
[05:46] <Jucato> ah...
[05:46] <Jucato> well, this one you don't have to update to confirm
[05:47] <Jucato> K Menu > System Settings > Advance options (at the top) > Login Manager > Background tab
[05:47] <Hawkwind> Hmmm, seems I only created a / in this vmware session.  What kind of drugs was I on I wonder
[05:47] <Hawkwind> Hah
[05:48] <Hawkwind> Ok, I am looking at the background tab
[05:49] <Jucato> The Picture option is enabled, right? what is it using? "kubuntu-wallpaper" or "Kubuntu Wallpaper"?
[05:49] <Hawkwind> imbrandon: You're familiar with vmware....any way to make it so I don't have to hit ctrl-alt to release the mouse....that it does it automatically when I get to the edge of the screen or something ?
[05:49] <Hawkwind> Jucato: It's selected as Picture, though it's greyed out...and it has kubuntu-wallpaper
[05:49] <Jucato> ah check! thanks for confirming that :D
[05:49] <Hawkwind> Jucato: It's greyed out because I haven't clicked on Admin Mode
[05:50] <Jucato> something I'm going to file
[05:50] <Hawkwind> What should it be ?
[05:50] <Jucato> - KDM/Login Manager points/uses a background called "kubuntu-wallpaper" but should be "Kubuntu Wallpaper"
[05:50] <Jucato> Hawkwind: before you change that, would it be possible if you could pastebin something for me?
[05:50] <Jucato>  /etc/kde3/kdm/backgroundrc of that Edgy system
[05:51] <Jucato> I foolishly changed my settings before I could check that config file :D
[05:52] <Jucato> I really appreciate it! thanks!
[05:52] <imbrandon> Hawkwind, if you have vmware tools installed yes ( not avaible with player )
[05:52] <Jucato> now I just have 3 bugs to confirm
[05:52] <Hawkwind> Jucato: http://pastebin.ulteo.us/88
[05:53] <Hawkwind> imbrandon: That's what I thought.  I click on 'Install vmware-tools' and it goes to do it then in the VM tab just says Cancel Install for ages and doesn't seem to actually install it :(
[05:54] <Jucato> Hawkwind: great! thanks!
[05:54] <imbrandon> Hawkwind, it dosent install "automagicly" all that does is mount the psudo cdrom
[05:54] <imbrandon> you have to untar the file it moutns and install it in the vm ;)
[05:54] <Jucato> this line is the culprit: "Wallpaper=/usr/share/apps/kdm/themes/kubuntu/kubuntu-wallpaper.png"
[05:54] <Hawkwind> imbrandon: So cd /mnt/cdrom ?
[05:55] <imbrandon> Hawkwind, /media/cdrom probably ( in ubuntu )
[05:55] <Hawkwind> imbrandon: I did an ls when in /media/cdrom and there is nothing there :(
[05:56] <imbrandon> after you hit install vmware tools ?
[05:56] <imbrandon> before you said cancle
[05:56] <Hawkwind> Yep
[05:56] <Hawkwind> I haven't canceled it.  It just says in the menu Cancel VMware tools install
[05:56] <imbrandon> look at your mouonts, it mouts the image somewhere
[05:56] <imbrandon> type mount and see whats mounted
[05:57] <Jucato> Hawkwind: this might help: http://www.vmware.com/support/esx25/doc/admin/esx25admin_tools_vms.html#999629
[05:57] <Hawkwind> imbrandon: I wonder if it matters that I installed vmware-server from the website, and not vmware via apt-get
[05:57] <imbrandon> no it dosent matter
[05:57] <imbrandon> afk
[05:58] <Jucato> Hawkwind: really appreciate your help
[05:58] <Jucato> are you using VMWare server or just player?
[05:59] <Hawkwind> Jucato: Ahhh, thanks.  That seems to do the trick
[05:59] <Hawkwind> Jucato: Server
[06:00] <Jucato> aah, you can also see this, practically the same guide: http://pubs.vmware.com/server1/vm/wwhelp/wwhimpl/common/html/wwhelp.htm?context=vm&file=tools_server.4.5.html
[06:00] <Jucato> anyway, I've gotta take my lunch
[06:00] <Jucato> I'm famished :D
[06:00] <Jucato> thanks for your help
[06:00] <Jucato> I owe you (a lot) :D
[06:00] <Jucato> afk no
[06:03] <Hawkwind> No problem.  You owe me nothing, except some karma :P
[06:10] <Hawkwind> Bahhh this is driving me nuts
[06:10] <Hawkwind> I have installed vmware-tools yet the mouse still isn't doing what I want it.  Though it seems vmware-tools isn't running and yet it's not a command
[06:23] <Hawkwind> Hmmm, sysvinit is being removed and upstart is being installed.  This could be fun
[06:23] <imbrandon> ;)
[06:23] <imbrandon> zero, i did it a few days ago
[06:24] <Hawkwind> Wasn't you who had some issues with upstart a couple days back ?
[06:24] <imbrandon> yea but it was my own bad
[06:24] <imbrandon> i dident install the compat libs
[06:24] <Hawkwind> Ah ok
[06:24] <Hawkwind> Well I just did a dist-upgrade on the vmware install so no big deal if it breaks
[06:25] <Hawkwind> I just wish I could get my mouse cursor to let go of the screen when it gets to the edge.  I hate having to press ctrl-alt every time
[06:25] <imbrandon> you know that only works in X and when the tools are running ;)
[06:25] <imbrandon> i like having to hit the keys imo
[06:25] <Hawkwind> I'm in X, and I don't have any clue how to start vmware-tools
[06:26] <imbrandon> that way you dont make mistakes as easy
[06:26] <Hawkwind> I have a vmware-toolbox command, but that doesn't do much good it seems
[06:26] <Hawkwind> Oh heck, so it does work
[06:31] <Hawkwind> imbrandon: So does upstart change any commands such as /etc/init.d/network restart   is that stuff still the same or what's the point/benefit to upstart ?
[06:32] <imbrandon> ugh, ok sorry but tired of answering this hehehe , look here
[06:32] <imbrandon> Upstart was referenced in the latest newsletter
[06:32] <imbrandon> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue12
[06:32] <imbrandon> "'upstart', by Ubuntu Developer Scott James Remnant, designed to change the
[06:32] <imbrandon> way that a Unix/Linux boots for the first time in 30 years."
[06:32] <imbrandon> see also:
[06:32] <imbrandon> http://www.netsplit.com/blog/work/canonical/upstart2.html
[06:32] <imbrandon> http://www.netsplit.com/blog/work/canonical/upstart.html
[06:33] <Hawkwind> Heh thanks.  Reading now
[06:33] <imbrandon> "From the start of development of edgy+2, no new packages will be accepted
[06:33] <imbrandon> unless they provide upstart jobs instead of init scripts and init scripts
[06:33] <imbrandon> will be considered deprecated."
[06:37] <Hawkwind> Wow, very interesting indeed
[06:37] <imbrandon> yea Hawkwind nothing against you but that can explain it better than i can and you might catch scott ( aka keybuk ) in ubuntu-devel durring his hours if you neeed more
[06:37] <imbrandon> brb afk for a few
[06:38] <Hawkwind> imbrandon: Thanks.  That explains it greatly.  I appreciate you giving me those links rather than trying to explain it.  Very detailed and would be tiring explaining it over and over on IRC
[06:38] <imbrandon> hehe
[06:41] <Hawkwind> abattoir: Good evening
[06:42] <abattoir> hi Hawkwind :)
[06:43] <Jucato> hi abattoir, Hawkwind, imbrandon
[06:43] <abattoir> hello Jucato :)
[06:43] <Jucato> abattoir: are you running Edgy?
[06:43] <abattoir> Jucato: yes
[06:44] <Jucato> nice :D
[06:44] <Jucato> kidding
[06:44] <abattoir> heh... its not fully up to date though.. ;)
[06:44] <Jucato> ah yes, there were some updates available this morning (here) when I logged in.
[06:45] <Jucato> but I'm having a problem that was present before and after the update
[06:45] <Hawkwind> Jucato: I just did a huge update.  sysvinit is now gone and upstart is installed on the Edgy install
[06:45] <Jucato> how do I check if upstart is now installed? I updated a while ago.. didn't notice it :D
[06:46] <imbrandon> dpkg -l|grep ii|grep upstart
[06:46] <Jucato> ah yes, installed :D
[06:47] <Jucato> so it's now the init system that I'm using, right?
[06:47] <crimsun> if you've since rebooted, yes
[06:47] <imbrandon> if you rebooted aafter it installed yet
[06:47] <Jucato> yep I did :D
[06:47] <imbrandon> s/yet/yes
[06:47] <crimsun> I still haven't rebooted.
[06:47] <imbrandon> hehe
[06:48] <crimsun> (up 16 days, 52 min)  -> suspend-to-{disk,ram} => resume
[06:48] <imbrandon> nice
[06:48] <Jucato> whoa :D
[06:48] <Jucato> my mom's gonna kill me if I kept the pc up that long
[06:48] <imbrandon> brandon@enterprise:~$ uptime
[06:48] <imbrandon>  23:48:20 up 15 days, 17:02,  1 user,  load average: 0.04, 0.05, 0.16
[06:48] <imbrandon> brandon@enterprise:~$                
[06:48] <imbrandon> almost , but no susspend, just runn all the time
[06:50] <Jucato> hmm...
[06:51] <Jucato> my ext3 partitions, except for /, get unmounted whenever I log out. but they are automounted during boot. VFAT and NTFS stay mounted. anyone else experiencing this?
[06:52] <nixternal> imbrandon: 
[06:52] <nixternal> nice
[06:52] <Jucato> hi nixternal
[06:52] <nixternal> ok...bip isn't "indifying" with the server
[06:52] <imbrandon> got bip workign ?
[06:52] <nixternal> wow
[06:53] <nixternal> identifying
[06:53] <nixternal> there he is
[06:53] <imbrandon> it does eventualy if you set it to, its just slow, it connects to the changs first
[06:53] <Jucato> heh
[06:53] <nixternal> well..i need it to identify first
[06:53] <nixternal> i have 20+ chans i have to connect to
[06:54] <imbrandon> it wont
[06:54] <abattoir> Jucato: yes, i think i may have noticed something similar
[06:54] <abattoir> Jucato: but mine being ReiserFS and XFS
[06:54] <Jucato> heh. 
[06:54] <imbrandon> nixternal i just have it auto connect to 5 or so and do the rest from a client , if bip runs constantly it will keep them
[06:54] <Jucato> abattoir: do you have VFAT/NTFS partitions? do they stay mounted?
[06:55] <abattoir> Jucato: i have neither... so have no idea.
[06:55] <Jucato> ah.
[07:16] <Jucato> abattoir: would you let me know if/when you have updated and restarted KDE?
[07:17] <abattoir> Jucato: do you really want me too? :P
[07:17] <abattoir> ndiswrapper is broken w/ the latest kernels
[07:17] <Jucato> er.. not if you don't have plans of updating Edgy. it's ok
[07:17] <abattoir> so i'd have to compile it everytime i update the kernel
[07:17] <Jucato> er.. not the kernel
[07:18] <abattoir> Jucato: i'll tell you if i dist-upgrade anytime soon
[07:18] <Jucato> ah ok. I thought you were running on Edgy already. nvm :D
[07:18] <Jucato> just looking for people to confirm things before I submit a bug report :D
[07:18] <abattoir> Jucato: yes, i am, but then, i'd have to modify menu.lst... and i'm a bit apprehensive about things getting broke, while i'm working on something :P
[07:19] <abattoir> and i'm lazy :P
[07:19] <Jucato> abattoir: heh
[07:19] <Jucato> but why would you have to modify menu.lst?
[07:19] <Jucato> well nvm. don't want to bother. thanks anyway :D
[08:42] <danimo> moin!
[08:42] <danimo> imbrandon: still awake?
[08:44] <imbrandon> danimo, sorta ;)
[08:45] <imbrandon> dude i cant get that to compile for the life of me
[08:46] <danimo> imbrandon: it just worked for me :)
[08:46] <danimo> imbrandon: looks awesome btw :))
[08:47] <imbrandon> in a package or just plain compiled ?
[08:47] <danimo> imbrandon: note that I did not create a package
[08:47] <danimo> imbrandon: no, I just installed it to /opt/kickoff
[08:47] <danimo> and then used the kde directory overlay feature
[08:47] <imbrandon> ohh you ONLY copiled kickoff ?
[08:47] <danimo> imbrandon: sorta
[08:47] <imbrandon> i've been trying to do the whole kdebase
[08:48] <danimo> imbrandon: kicker+libkonq+kdmlib
[08:48] <imbrandon> one sec lemme finish this amarok compile then i can talk more
[08:48] <Jucato> kickoff...
[08:48] <danimo> imbrandon: and a kcontrol module, but i left that out
[08:50] <danimo> especially since there won't be _any_ conflicting packages
[08:55] <danimo> *pray*
[09:41] <toma_flep> Riddell: pingo
[09:41] <imbrandon> moins toma_flep
[09:41] <toma_flep> hi imbrandon
[09:42] <Jucato> hi imbrandon!
[09:42] <imbrandon> lo Jucato
[09:42] <Jucato> how's the fix for Amarok coming along?
[09:43] <imbrandon> compiling on amd64 now
[09:43] <imbrandon> then ppc
[09:43] <Jucato> nice
[09:43] <toma_flep> imbrandon: i don't get any valid backtraces even though i've installed the -dbg package. Do I need to do more?
[09:43] <imbrandon> not afaik
[09:43] <imbrandon> that should do it i think
[09:43] <Jucato> yeah, I get a lot of No debugging symbols, too
[09:44] <toma_flep> imbrandon: how does the debug get removed while bilding the package?
[09:45] <imbrandon> tbh i dunno
[09:48] <toma_flep> Hobbsee: hi! 
[09:49] <Jucato> Hobbsee!!!
[09:49] <toma_flep> Hobbsee: any idea how the -dbg package is created for kdepim ?
[09:50] <Hobbsee> hey toma_flep, Jucato 
[09:50] <Hobbsee> toma_flep: ah, in the kdepim source?
[09:50] <toma_flep> Hobbsee: ;-) I totally don't understand the debian folder
[09:51] <Hobbsee> toma_flep: ahh.  true that.  what in particular were you wanting to know?
[09:51] <Hobbsee> *doesnt touch kdepim*
[09:51] <toma_flep> Hobbsee: my backtraces aren't valid
[09:52] <Hobbsee> toma_flep: ahh.  installed gdb, i take it?
[09:52] <toma_flep> Hobbsee: so, i wanted to see how -dbg is created
[09:52] <toma_flep> Hobbsee: yep ;-)
[09:52] <Hobbsee> toma_flep: i'm guessing you'll have to check out debian/rules for such a thing
[09:52] <Hobbsee> i'm not sure, offhand
[09:52] <toma_flep> i'll stick around for Tha Master then
[09:53] <Jucato> you don't want The Mistress, then? ehehe
[09:53] <toma_flep> Jucato: ;-)
[09:53] <Hobbsee> toma_flep: smart
[09:53] <Jucato> ouch
[09:53] <Jucato> lol
[09:53] <Jucato> oops.. forgot my promise about that...
[09:53] <Hobbsee> wasnt meaning that specifically
[09:54] <Jucato> 5 possible Edgy/KDE bugs waiting for confirmation to be filed :D
[09:55] <Hobbsee> gah!
[09:55] <Hobbsee> we've got another version of amarok to get.
[09:55] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: *poke*
[09:55] <Jucato> he's compiling right now
[09:55] <Jucato> AMD64, then PPC
[09:55] <Hobbsee> ah cool :D
[09:56] <Hobbsee> nice
[09:56] <Hobbsee> no you dont
[09:57] <Hobbsee> it requires you knowing everything.
[09:57] <Jucato> ok...
[09:57] <Hobbsee> Jucato: did you guys end up getting bot access?
[09:57] <Jucato> nah
[09:58] <Hobbsee> ROFL!!!
[09:59] <Hobbsee> http://rafb.net/paste/results/R1XemI81.html
[10:00] <Jucato> hehe yay!
[10:00] <Jucato> btw, you're using ubuntu-minimal?
[10:00] <Hobbsee> no
[10:00] <Hobbsee> i'm usnig kubuntu-desktop
[10:00] <Jucato> ah
[10:00] <Hobbsee> smart, that
[10:03] <imbrandon> Hobbsee, if you have my repo still enabled you should be able to apt-get update ;)
[10:03] <imbrandon> Hobbsee, i'm on top of it hehe
[10:03] <imbrandon> already file a uvf and all
[10:03] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: ahhh...nice.
[10:03] <Hobbsee> woo :)
[10:03] <imbrandon> ...
[10:03] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: how does init-crack behave on your system?
[10:04] <imbrandon> ppc is still compiling though
[10:04] <toma_flep> i thought upstart was experimental
[10:04] <imbrandon> i dont notice a diffrence
[10:04] <Jucato> well, apparently not anymore :D
[10:04] <imbrandon> i've used it a few days
[10:04] <imbrandon> it /was/ , now its edgy ;)
[10:05] <Jucato> using upstart, booting should be faster, right? or generally everything should be faster?
[10:05] <Hobbsee> toma_flep: it just got put into edgy main, as a dep of ubuntu-minimal
[10:05] <Hobbsee> Jucato: it will be, yes
[10:05] <imbrandon> wow you know what , i'm on konversation on osx hahaha
[10:05] <Hobbsee> or it should be
[10:05] <imbrandon> this is nice
[10:06] <imbrandon> Jucato: eventualy not yet
[10:06] <Jucato> "it will be, yes" for which question? (I asked 2)
[10:06] <imbrandon> Hobbsee: yesterday it did ;)
[10:06] <imbrandon> Hobbsee: not really not till everything is changed to upstart 
[10:06] <imbrandon> e.g edgy +2
[10:06] <Hobbsee> Jucato: it will be, yes, that it's faster
[10:07] <imbrandon> it will be as in it will be faster, atm its the same
[10:07] <imbrandon> untill the init scripts are replaced by upstart jobs
[10:07] <Jucato> ah
[10:07] <imbrandon> to be completed by edgy + 2
[10:07] <imbrandon> Hobbsee: as i said not YET
[10:07] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: ahh...right
[10:07] <Jucato> but Edgy will be released with upstart already?
[10:07] <imbrandon> its the same atm
[10:08] <Jucato> I've only noticed just a while ago how Edgy seems to be actually faster than Dapper on my system... if just by a bit...
[10:08] <imbrandon> becosue upstart is just running the old init scripts , but once they are ustart jobs ( 100% conversion by edgy + 2 ) then it will be faster
[10:08] <imbrandon> Jucato: yes
[10:08] <imbrandon> so over time ( the next year ) you will see it get faster and faster
[10:09] <Jucato> yay
[10:09] <imbrandon> bah
[10:10] <imbrandon> i did benchmarks on a mepis system and its not any faster
[10:10] <imbrandon> and its ALOT more unstable
[10:10] <toma_flep> it still has to start stuff, so I'm curious if it will be faster
[10:10] <Jucato> heh. well it was on mine... for whatever reason, I don't know...
[10:10] <imbrandon> its all perceived speed
[10:10] <imbrandon> no real speed
[10:11] <Jucato> probably
[10:11] <imbrandon> Jucato: show me real numbers and i'll beleave you, turn off the kde candy as they do and it will be the same, as i said percieved speed
[10:11] <Jucato> although more people seem to notice perceived speed that actual benchmarked speed
[10:12] <Jucato> they turn off the eye candy?
[10:12] <imbrandon> anyhow /me gets back to work
[10:12] <Jucato> I didn't notice that they did. they still had bouncy icons, etc.
[10:12] <Jucato> anyway...
[10:13] <Jucato> the price of being popular :D
[10:14] <Jucato> Hobbsee: have you experienced ext3 partitions being unmounted when you log out?
[10:15] <Hobbsee> Jucato: havent noticed it, but i havent really looked either
[10:15] <Jucato> ah..
[10:15] <Jucato> all my partitions are mounted at boot, but when I log out ang back in again, only the VFAT/NTFS partitions remain mounted (ironic isn't it?)
[10:16] <Hobbsee> that's kinda scary
[10:16] <Hobbsee> mounted via console, or on konq?
[10:16] <Jucato> via fstab...
[10:16] <Jucato> of course / isn't unmounted
[10:16] <Hobbsee> hey wait, how does / get unmounted when you logout?
[10:17] <Jucato> I'm not sure how...
[10:17] <Hobbsee> and /home?
[10:17] <Jucato> I didn't put /hom on a separate partition in Edgy
[10:17] <Jucato> but the / and /home partitions of Dapper get unmounted
[10:17] <Jucato> that's using the default fstab...
[10:18] <Jucato> I'm prepared to file a bug report if someone else could confirm it. abattoir confirmed it happens on ReiserFS and XFS
[10:20] <Hobbsee> Jucato: ohhh...is that the problem.
[10:20] <Hobbsee> Jucato: yeah.  there's already a bug for that, iirc
[10:20] <Jucato> in kubuntu-team?
[10:20] <Hobbsee> well, somewhere.  could be in kdebase/kdelibs/kubuntu-meta/anywhere else
[10:21] <Jucato> heh
[10:21] <Hobbsee> Jucato: https://launchpad.net/bugs/58552
[10:21] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 58552 in kubuntu-meta "Mounting Problems in Kubuntu Edgy after the Xserver is restarted" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  
[10:21] <Jucato> ah there...
[10:22] <Jucato> hm... unless Kubuntu now restarts X when you log off... (which I think it doesn't), simply logging off unmounts partitions
[10:22] <Jucato> except that the VFAT and NTFS ones remain mounted...
[10:24] <Jucato> I'll just add a comment to that bug report, then
[10:25] <Hobbsee> Jucato: change it to confirmed, too
[10:25] <Hobbsee> back in a bit
[10:25] <Jucato> okies
[10:29] <Jucato> done :D
[10:31] <Jucato> brb... need to get some food :D
[10:34] <Hobbsee> interesting.
[10:34] <danimo> re
[10:34] <danimo> hi Hobbsee
[10:35] <Hobbsee> hey danimo 
[10:35] <Jucato> what's interesting?
[10:35] <Hobbsee>  apparently my machine had decided to shut down, after reaching the critical temperature of 3430 (or similar) degrees celcius.
[10:35] <danimo> ok, running on upstart now
[10:35] <Jucato> ooh....
[10:36] <danimo> Hobbsee: that's what I'd call core overload :)
[10:36] <Hobbsee> danimo: seems okay
[10:36] <Hobbsee> the upstart
[10:36] <Hobbsee> bit of a pain to install
[10:39] <danimo> Hobbsee: a bit of a pain to reboot afterwards :)
[10:40] <Hobbsee> danimo: sudo reboot -f
[10:42] <danimo> Hobbsee: sync, sync, poweroff-button worked equally well :)
[10:42] <Hobbsee> danimo: hehe.  true that.
[10:43] <Jucato> hm....
[10:43] <danimo> Hobbsee: true, but startup time hasn't really improved
[10:43] <Hobbsee> true.  it wont yet
[10:44] <Jucato> :D
[10:44] <Jucato> does Edgy really load/install less modules than Dapper?
[10:45] <imbrandon> no
[10:45] <imbrandon> and loaded modules totaly depends on your hardware
[10:45] <Jucato> hm.. I might have accumulated some modules in Dapper...
[10:45] <imbrandon> ummm not unless you installed 3rd party drivers
[10:46] <imbrandon> and even so they arent loaded unless you have the hardware, so it dosent realy matter
[10:46] <Jucato> the only driver I installed is nvidia.
[10:46] <imbrandon> then the only extra module you have is nvidia ;)
[10:46] <Jucato> :D
[10:47] <imbrandon> and like i said its really donsent make a diffrence if you had 500 extras, it only takes up hdd space
[10:47] <imbrandon> thats the great thing about modules they are only loaded if used
[10:47] <imbrandon> ;)
[10:47] <Jucato> ah yes. I still have 106 modules :D
[10:47] <Jucato> both in dapper and in edgy
[10:48] <imbrandon> was your hardware the same ? if so its always gonna be the same no matter what release or distro you use
[10:48] <Jucato> ah so the number of modules that lsmod spits out has nothing to do with the speed of startup?
[10:48] <imbrandon> Jucato, absolutely zero
[10:49] <Jucato> thanks! now I know :D
[10:49] <Jucato> heh I think I've learned more in IRC in the 1 month I've been here than in the forums for over 7 months :D
[10:50] <Jucato> ok.. 3 more issues/possible bugs waiting to be confirmed or filed :D
[10:50] <imbrandon> forums are junk, i learned that in 1997 ;)
[10:50] <Jucato> heh
[10:50] <Jucato> lol sorry for the interruptions :D
[10:50] <imbrandon> no worries ;)
[10:51] <Jucato> lol
[10:51] <Jucato> forums, IRC, ML, they all have their strengths and weaknesses :D
[10:51] <Jucato> but I started learning Linux from a forum
[10:52] <imbrandon> ;)
[10:52] <imbrandon> forums are ok, but 98% of the time they breed eleitisim and mis-information
[10:53] <imbrandon> so i stray away from them and warn all newbs i come accross to also
[10:54] <imbrandon> hahaha never use sudo for a graphical app, and kwrite in kde no gedit ;)
[10:54] <imbrandon> seee ;)
[10:54] <Jucato> yeah. that was rampant in ubuntuforums.
[10:54] <Jucato> even when they had a separate Kubuntu section
[10:54] <Hobbsee> true that
[10:54] <Hobbsee> kate crashes constantly with kdesu, i find. :(
[10:55] <imbrandon> heh
[10:56] <imbrandon> my feeling is if they cant use nano atleaste they have no business running sudo, it boils down to ...... bah i dont wannna get on a rant
[10:56] <Jucato> lol
[10:56] <imbrandon> but there is no point in makeing a sudo command and no root if users are told to arbitrarly use it and not why and the dangers etc
[10:57] <Jucato> hahah
[10:57] <Hobbsee> heh
[10:57] <Hobbsee> no you wont
[10:57] <Jucato> lol
[10:57] <Jucato> she's evil.....
[10:57] <Hobbsee> :P
[10:57] <Hobbsee> i've had imbrandon's machine rebooted enough times when i wasnt expecting it :P
[10:58] <imbrandon> house*
[10:58] <Jucato> whitehose....
[10:58] <imbrandon> wow really , i'm a red alien with green eyes ;)
[10:58] <Jucato> a white colored _____hose
[10:59] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: I don't believe you
[10:59] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: you should, surely.
[11:01] <Jucato> bah! thought I was in dapper...
[11:09] <Jucato> brb..
[11:27] <Hobbsee> hey Tonio_ 
[11:27] <Tonio_> hey :)
[11:27] <oniryx> hello, looking for help with a kio kdirwatch error, with message "Too Many Open Files" using KDE 3.5.4, the error was noticed after launching digikam
[11:31] <Riddell> toma_flep: you pinged?
[11:32] <toma_flep> Riddell: yes, i'm not getting valid backtraces for kmail
[11:32] <toma_flep> Riddell: i've installed the -dbg package and gdb
[11:32] <toma_flep> do i need to do anything else?
[11:36] <Riddell> not as far as I know
[11:36] <imbrandon> moins Riddell
[11:37] <oniryx> I've dumped few line error message here : http://pastebin.com/784000
[11:37] <toma_flep> Riddell: ok, can you explain to me how the -dbg package is created
[11:38] <toma_flep> i'm not understanding kdepim's debian folder
[11:38] <imbrandon> Riddell, amarok 1.4.3 is out, i filed the uvf, and compiled it for i386 and amd64 for both dapper/edgy and uploaded to imbrandon.com but not ppc yet ( no ppc avail atm ) have a debdiff reday for when the uvf is approved 
[11:39] <Riddell> toma_flep: it's mostly cdbs magic, you set the variable and it suck out all the debug symbols from any libraries it finds and puts them into debug libraries
[11:39] <Riddell> imbrandon: is it generally released?
[11:39] <imbrandon> yup
[11:39] <Riddell> don't give us much warning do they
[11:39] <imbrandon> Riddell, http://amarok.kde.org/content/view/81/66/
[11:39] <Riddell> I'll try and get my ppc running again today
[11:39] <imbrandon> heh they gave me about 1 hour warning
[11:40] <imbrandon> and gave me the tarbal about 30 minutes early hehe but its avail to the public now
[11:41] <toma_flep> Riddell: can you start gdb kmail and see if it complains on your computer (or anyone else)
[11:45] <Riddell> it says no debugging symbols found but otherwise seems to work ok, let me install kdepim-dbg
[11:46] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'm on svn wengophone... but it is a mess, you cannot imagine...
[11:46] <Tonio_> Riddell: sources are 150 MB
[11:47] <imbrandon> brandon@voyager:~$ gdb kmail
[11:47] <imbrandon> GNU gdb 6.4.90-debian
[11:47] <imbrandon> Copyright (C) 2006 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
[11:47] <imbrandon> GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are
[11:47] <imbrandon> welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions.
[11:47] <imbrandon> Type "show copying" to see the conditions.
[11:47] <imbrandon> There is absolutely no warranty for GDB.  Type "show warranty" for details.
[11:47] <imbrandon> This GDB was configured as "i486-linux-gnu"...Using host libthread_db library "/lib/tls/i686/cmov/libthread_db.so.1".
[11:47] <imbrandon> (gdb)                                    
[11:48] <toma_flep> imbrandon: type: start --nofork
[11:48] <imbrandon> seems fine
[11:49] <Tonio_> :'( why are they using scons....
[11:50] <imbrandon> [Switching to Thread -1248401744 (LWP 31422)] 
[11:50] <imbrandon> main (argc=2, argv=0xbfbfdba4) at /build/buildd/kdepim-3.5.4/./kmail/main.cpp:67
[11:50] <imbrandon> 67      /build/buildd/kdepim-3.5.4/./kmail/main.cpp: No such file or directory.
[11:50] <Riddell> Tonio_: there was a blog yesterday saying they were using cmake
[11:50] <imbrandon>         in /build/buildd/kdepim-3.5.4/./kmail/main.cpp
[11:50] <imbrandon> (gdb)                                                                           
[11:50] <Riddell> toma_flep: I get 
[11:50] <Riddell> main (argc=2, argv=0xbfa43ac4) at /build/buildd/kdepim-3.5.4/./kmail/main.cpp:67
[11:50] <Riddell> 67      /build/buildd/kdepim-3.5.4/./kmail/main.cpp: No such file or directory.
[11:50] <Riddell>         in /build/buildd/kdepim-3.5.4/./kmail/main.cpp
[11:51] <Tonio_> Riddell: they are using both in fact
[11:51] <Riddell> Tonio_: fun
[11:51] <Tonio_> Riddell: :'(
[11:51] <Riddell> toma_flep: if I do "run" instead of "start --nofork" that seems to work
[11:52] <toma_flep> Riddell: ah, my fault
[11:52] <Tonio_> Riddell: have an example of a package done with cmake and cdbs ?
[11:52] <toma_flep> Riddell: does no more 'no debugging symbols found' after installing the -dbg package?
[11:52] <toma_flep> s/does/so/
[11:53] <Riddell> toma_flep: I don't see 'no debugging symbols found' any more
[11:54] <toma_flep> Riddell: oki, thanks. gonna format my computer now ;-0
[11:58] <Jucato> aw... Hobbsee's gone...
[11:59] <Riddell> toma_flep: err, huh?
[12:00] <toma_flep> Riddell: you're on edgy?
[12:00] <Riddell> toma_flep: yes
[12:00] <toma_flep> imbrandon: you too?
[12:00] <Jucato> should I still file the "Katapult doesn't work anymore after update in Edgy" bug?
[12:00] <Riddell> Jucato: it's been filed
[12:00] <Jucato> ah
[12:00] <toma_flep> Jucato: there is a bug
[12:01] <Jucato> it also crashes when you try to configure it
[12:03] <imbrandon> yup
[12:03] <imbrandon> toma_flep, yup
[12:04] <toma_flep> ok, so it could be a dapper thingie
[12:05] <Jucato> um... KDE bug? is it 132885 or 132882?
[12:08] <toma_flep> oki
[12:08] <toma_flep> work ow
[12:08] <toma_flep> now
[12:38] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'm stopping there...... cmake build system is only for testing currently and looks incomplete.
[12:39] <Tonio_> Riddell: and concerning scons, the problem is that qt4 path are completly stupid, so I would have to patch all of them....
[12:39] <Hobbsee> sigh
[12:39] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'll try to get a real tarball for edgy+1, but svn is too messy to be packaged
[12:39] <Jucato> wb Hobbsee!
[12:40] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: what's this for?
[12:40] <Hobbsee> heya.
[12:40] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: voip solution for kubuntu
[12:40] <Riddell> thanks Tonio_ 
[12:40] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: the problem is that there is no tarball, no build instructions, and the svn is a hudge mess of 8000 folders and 160MB
[12:41] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: ahh, okay
[12:41] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: too late to package this for edgy, but probably edgy+1
[12:41] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: point
[12:43] <Tonio_> that's a nonsense
[12:43] <Tonio_> those guys look more interested in playing with all technologies than providing a simply working thing...
[12:44] <Tonio_> scons, cmake, XUL, blabla, but nothing seems very usable since there is no doc provided with them....
[12:44] <Tonio_> stupid french.......
[12:46] <Tonio_> Riddell: we'll have to make a spec for edgy+1 for voip solution, so that work on that will not be started so late :)
[12:49] <Tonio_> yop kwwii_
[12:49] <Hobbsee> hey kwwii_ 
[12:49] <Tonio_> kwwii_: I had a question concerning the usplash work
[12:49] <Tonio_> kwwii_: are you gonna do that too ?
[12:49] <Jucato> hi kwwii_!
[12:50] <kwwii_> Tonio_: yepp, I guess so :-)
[12:50] <kwwii_> hi Jucato
[12:50] <kwwii_> Tonio_: I will make a simple logo version in case it ends up with 16 colors again, and a nicer 3d version if it has more
[12:50] <Tonio_> kwwii_: hehe ;)
[12:52] <Hobbsee> kwwii_: nice :)
[12:54] <Riddell> kwwii_: feel free to use any other format supported by QMovie
[12:54] <Riddell> not sure if there are any of course
[12:54] <kwwii_> hehe :-)
[12:54] <Riddell> Tonio_: what would be in a spec?  mostly it's an upstream issue
[12:54] <kwwii_> the gif is almost done now
[12:58] <Tonio_> Riddell: if we consider this software is the only possibility, I agree, but maybe there are other solutions
[12:58] <Tonio_> kphone or something else
[02:32] <jjesse> morning :)
[02:32] <Hobbsee> hey jjesse!
[02:33] <Jucato> Hobbsee: ey, were you able to poke jdong?
[02:33] <Hobbsee> Jucato: havent so far
[02:33] <Jucato> oh
[02:36] <Lure_> Riddell, kwwii_: any plans to replace kde icon with kubuntu logo - all other distro's seem to do that
[02:36] <Riddell> Lure_: nope
[02:36] <Riddell> system menu has a kubuntu icon :)
[02:36] <Lure_> Riddell: why not - Ubuntu is doing it and all other KDE distos do it...
[02:37] <abattoir> could we have a special 10yrs. of KDE icon or something for edgy? :P
[02:37] <Jucato> or could at least a Kubuntu icon be made available, for an alternative?
[02:37] <Lure_> Riddell: yes, I know (side text), but nothing is there which would associate it with kubuntu on typical screenshots (besides great purple color ;-))
[02:38] <Jucato> why didn't Kubuntu use it's logo for the K Menu before? (me probably needs some history lesson...)
[02:38] <Hobbsee> did kubuntu *have* a logo before?  :P
[02:39] <Jucato> it does now...
[02:39] <Jucato> It would make Kubuntu consistent with Ubuntu and Xubuntu, right?
[02:39] <kwwii_> Lure: probably a good idea
[02:42] <Riddell> because I don't like removing KDE logos
[02:42] <Jucato> :)
[02:43] <Hobbsee> bah.  lets just bypass Riddell :P
[02:43] <Jucato> lol
[02:44] <danimo> Riddell: any chance that we get the konq start page fixed?
[02:44] <danimo> Riddell: likewise for khelpcenter, etc
[02:45] <Jucato> I thought ryanakca already did that?
[02:46] <Riddell> danimo: I was thinking of just leaving it like that
[02:47] <Jucato> schizophrenic colors...
[02:49] <Riddell> oops, I think I killed danimo with shock
[02:49] <Riddell> it was only a joke!
[02:49] <Jucato> lol
[02:49] <Hobbsee> Riddell: dont kill the developers!  it's not a good idea!
[02:50] <jjesse> just updated edgy system and having a problem
[02:50] <jjesse> sudo reboot and recieve this error "shutdown: unable to send message: Connection refused
[02:50] <Riddell> sounds like upstart :)
[02:51] <jdong> Hobbsee, Jucato, sup?
[02:51] <Jucato> hmm.... 
[02:51] <jdong> jjesse: think you just got upstart
[02:51] <Hobbsee> jdong: konvi seems to be missing from backports, ditto kopete.
[02:51] <jdong> jjesse: save everything, ALT+SYSRQ+U, ALT+SYSRQ+S, ALT+SYSRQ+B
[02:52] <jdong> (lower case, though)
[02:52] <jdong> Hobbsee: konvi didn't build, and I can't upload one that builds
[02:52] <jdong> Hobbsee: kopete, I am baffled, as with xchat
[02:52] <Hobbsee> jdong: ahhhh... why didnt it build?
[02:52] <jdong> Hobbsee: the -ubuntu1 upload also ftbfs'ed in edgy
[02:53] <seaLne> reboot -f also works with newly installed upstart
[02:53] <jdong> seaLne: is it as safe as remounting ro, syncing, then rebooting though?
[02:54] <seaLne> jdong: not sure, i'd definitly sync first
[02:54] <seaLne> kubuntu is just about usable with 700MHz and 256Mb
[02:55] <jdong> seaLne: it shouldn't be bad on that system
[02:55] <jdong> I've used kubuntu on less before
[02:55] <Hobbsee> jdong: looks like trouble with a lack of automake1.9
[02:55] <jdong> though same amount of ram
[02:55] <danimo> Riddell: sorry, I went to the kitchen
[02:55] <jdong> Hobbsee: yeah, later uploads of konvo are fine
[02:55] <Jucato> whoa... amarok 1.4.2 is in backports?
[02:56] <jdong> Jucato: I told you that a few days ago :)
[02:56] <danimo> Riddell: thing is, I'd prolly buy it :)
[02:56] <seaLne> i'm still on the live cd just now, so will probably improve when the install finishes and booted off hd
[02:56] <Jucato> lol I must have missed it. :)
[02:56] <jdong> seaLne: OUCH.... livecd on that system?
[02:56] <jdong> Hobbsee: it seems like good progress is being made on bug 58165
[02:56] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 58165 in hal "security policy error with hald after latest updates" [Untriaged,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58165
[02:56] <jdong> err, 58144
[02:56] <jdong> bug 58144
[02:56] <Jucato> jdong: but what about imbrandon's PPC fix?
[02:56] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 58144 in soyuz "Backport is rejected if an older backport is already there" [Critical,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58144
[02:56] <Hobbsee> jdong: going to backport the next version of konvi anyway?
[02:56] <Hobbsee> jdong: ahhh...
[02:56] <jdong> Hobbsee: yes, as soon as I can :)
[02:56] <Hobbsee> jdong: :)
[02:56] <seaLne> jdong: did k3b make it?
[02:57] <jdong> seaLne: no, for same reason
[02:57] <seaLne> ah thought you were saying it was fixed
[02:57] <jdong> seaLne: I said "good progress" ;-)
[02:57] <Riddell> seaLne: is there a k3b-i18n to match the current k3b?
[02:57] <seaLne> no, i was noticing that when you uploaded .16
[02:58] <seaLne> i keep forgetting about k3b-i18n i'll do it later today
[02:59] <jdong> Jucato: where/what version is that?
[02:59] <jdong> Jucato: imbrandon already requested a newer version backported, but again, needs 58144 loving
[02:59] <Jucato> jdong: there was a bug with amarok 1.4.2 on PPC. I think imbrandon's fixing it or building it already
[03:01] <Riddell> sebas: what's the reason for power manager not being a kuniqueapplication?
[03:01] <sebas> Riddell: It breaks dcop.
[03:02] <Hobbsee> ooh fun, let's break dcop then!  :P
[03:02] <sebas> It's a bug somehwere in the stack, dcop gets a connection error when it's a KUniqueApplication, regular KApps work.
[03:02] <Riddell> sebas: but with the patch you sent for python dcop does that fix it?
[03:02] <sebas> Riddell: I'll add a workaround shortly, let the __init__ check if there's another instance and then exit().
[03:02] <sebas> Nope, that fixes void as return type for dcop calls, unrelated.
[03:03] <Riddell> ok
[03:04] <sebas> Sometimes, it feels like I'm the only one using dcop with python / PyKDE, every time I write code for it, I run into another bug which breaks basic functionality.
[03:04] <sebas> That makes it all the more challenging, of course :-)
[03:06] <abattoir> sebas: i've run into it too :P
[03:07] <sebas> abattoir: That makes me feels less like a pioneer, thanks!
[03:07] <abattoir> sebas: that was definitely not the intention :)
[03:08] <sebas> It was positive, though.
[03:12] <jdong> Hobbsee: infinity is sending kopete through
[03:13] <jdong> Hobbsee: xchat is still a mystery, but we don't care about it here :)
[03:13] <Jucato> lol
[03:13] <Hobbsee> jdong: hehe.  nice
[03:14] <jdong> ah, yet another soyuz bug
[03:14] <Jucato> Hobbsee: bug #2 again? :)
[03:14] <jdong> [09:13]  <Kamion> namely that you only get binaries for one architecture for any given backport
[03:14] <Hobbsee> jdong: lovely.  why?
[03:14] <jdong> soyuz bug :)
[03:15] <jdong> the 2nd architecture gets rejected because version foo is newer than version foo in pocket BACKPORTS :)
[03:15] <Hobbsee> very lovely.
[03:17] <jdong> :)
[03:27] <Jucato> btw, why is the default identity in Konversation set to "ubuntu" by default? it's set to auto-join #kubuntu anyway, so...
[03:28] <Hobbsee> oh yes, i was wondering that.
[03:28] <abattoir> Jucato: you mean for the live cd ?
[03:28] <abattoir> Jucato: otherwise isnt it set to your username ?
[03:28] <Hobbsee> abattoir: no, the user in konversationn before you customise it.
[03:28] <Hobbsee> oh, yeah, oops
[03:28] <Jucato> lol
[03:28] <Jucato> live CD :D
[03:28] <abattoir> Jucato: because the username is the livecd is ubuntu :)
[03:28] <Jucato> ah...
[03:29] <Jucato> why? :)
[03:29] <Jucato> ok nvm that...
[03:29] <abattoir> *in the livecd
[03:29] <Jucato> thanks for enlightening me :) (silly question when you think of it...)
[03:34] <Tonio_> sebas: waiting for you to fix the dcop issue with power-manager, I can't configure kde to "not restore" the applet on restart
[03:34] <Tonio_> Riddell: interested in that fix temporary or are we waiting a bit ?
[03:35] <Riddell> Tonio_: we'll wait on sebas
[03:35] <Tonio_> Riddell: sure
[03:35] <Riddell> Tonio_: something we do need is to fix amarok to show OSD in a corner not the centre of the screen
[03:36] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'm doing it
[03:36] <sebas> Hm, so you actually urge me to *fix_it_now*?
[03:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: I will also set kicker size to 48 via kds, since nobody has been able to explain me why my kicker patch doesn't work and aseigo didn't respond to my mail
[03:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: top left corner probably ?
[03:38] <Tonio_> sebas: no, not urge you to fix ;) just to let you know that if there is no fix ready for edgy, I have a little workarround, that's all :)
[03:38] <sebas> Which workaround?
[03:38] <Hobbsee> OSD's are evil.  why are we showing them anyway?
[03:38] <Jucato> because OSD's are fun :)
[03:38] <Tonio_> sebas: it is possible to configure kde for not restoring an application
[03:38] <sebas> Uhm, ow, that way.
[03:38] <Tonio_> sebas: then only one guidance power manager is reload at kde starup
[03:39] <sebas> But I can workaround it quite easily.
[03:39] <Tonio_> sebas: okay
[03:39] <sebas> No rocket-science involved.
[03:39] <Jucato> heh
[03:39] <Hobbsee> Jucato: heh.  I cant stand them.
[03:40] <Tonio_> Riddell: is there someone that can approve uvf er while mdz isn't there ?
[03:40] <Jucato> would it mean that katapult (not working anyway) and kmix won't be loaded, since they're neither in /usr/share/autostart and ~/.kde/Autostart ?
[03:40] <Tonio_> Riddell: I really would like to upload latest katapult
[03:40] <sebas> Has the feature freeze already happened?
[03:41] <Riddell> Tonio_: kamion can
[03:41] <Riddell> sebas: today I think
[03:41] <Jucato> Tonio_: could you please check bug 59023 if it's related to Katapult not working (or I'm just dreaming about this crash)
[03:41] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 59023 in katapult "Katapult" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/59023
[03:41] <sebas> Ah, funky.
[03:42] <Jucato> argh! darn the bug title...
[03:42] <sebas> BTW, I didn't manage to get a second batttery, so atm it looks like powermanager will not support that (don't even know what will happen)
[03:42] <Tonio_> Jucato: resolved by latest katapult package
[03:42] <sebas> Riddell: Don't you have an Ultrabay battery?
[03:42] <Jucato> Tonio_: ah thanks :)
[03:43] <Riddell> sebas: you could ask for someone with a second batter to send us their lshal, then we should be able to recreate it with hal-set-property
[03:43] <Riddell> sebas: I have a cheapo thinkpad that doesn't take ultrabay batteries alas
[03:43] <sebas> Riddell: Hm ... it's really all far too fishy to implement it without the actual hardware ... 
[03:44] <sebas> I.e. all the event stuff, when does what run out, unplugging, plugging in ... 
[03:45] <Riddell> true
[03:46] <sebas> Last hope is that someone at aKademy has one and lets me borrow it.
[03:46] <Riddell> that's a good idea
[03:46] <sebas> I've already asked on our department mailinglist, but no one has such a beast.
[03:47] <Riddell> canonical has a bunch of laptops to test stuff against now, unfortunately they're all in Canada and not allowed to leave the office
[03:47] <sebas> I have a solution themn!
[03:47] <sebas> Actually two.
[03:47] <jjesse_> send me a laptop and i'll test it :)
[03:47] <seaLne> Riddell: isthat the replacement for laptop testing?
[03:48] <sebas> 1) I fly to Canada to write those bits
[03:48] <Riddell> seaLne: no, it's for hardware certification
[03:48] <sebas> 2) Someone get me an NX Shell on one of those things
[03:48] <Tonio_> Riddell: kamion will revu, thanks for the info
[03:48] <Riddell> even with NX on them you'd still need someone to plug in and unplug for you
[03:48] <jjesse_> @time detroit
[03:48] <Ubugtu> Current time in America/Detroit: September 05 2006, 09:48:45
[03:48] <jjesse_> @time UTC
[03:48] <Ubugtu> Current time in Etc/UTC: September 05 2006, 13:48:54
[03:48] <allee> sebas: 1b) trip to munich ;)
[03:49] <sebas> Riddell: Hm, then it's 1) :>
[03:49] <Riddell> jjesse_: the laptops can't leave the office, that's the problem
[03:49] <sebas> Or 1b)
[03:49] <Riddell> allee: what's in Munich?
[03:49] <jjesse_> thats a bummer
[03:49] <allee> Riddell: laptop with 2 batteries
[03:49] <sebas> allee's laptop with two batteries.
[03:49] <sebas> allee: You could write it.
[03:49] <Riddell> teach allee python and get him to code it?
[03:49] <sebas> Right.
[03:50] <sebas> allee: Go, buy a book and read it.
[03:50] <sebas> Python gets you laid!
[03:51] <seaLne> you'd need it after trying to read programming python :P
[03:51] <sebas> Nonsense, Python definitely is as good as sex.
[03:51] <sebas> Voluntary sex even!
[03:52] <Riddell> what does that make Ruby?
[03:53] <Hobbsee> i cant believe i walked in to read that  :P
[03:53] <Jucato> heh
[03:54] <bddebian> Heya
[03:55] <hunger> I think voluntary sex is not against the code of conduct, is it?
[03:55] <Hobbsee> hey bddebian 
[03:55] <bddebian> Hello Hobbsee
[03:55] <Hobbsee> hunger: i dont think it is.  i was more surprised.
[03:57] <sebas> Hobbsee: It's all for the good, we need to convince allee to write some code in a language he doesn't know yet.
[03:58] <Hobbsee> sebas: point.  when you find a good guide, please point me to it too.
[03:58] <Hobbsee> although it wont help me get laid, of course :P
[03:58] <sebas> Hobbsee: A python programming guide?
[03:58] <Hobbsee> yeah
[03:58] <sebas> Nothing's easier in fact.
[03:59] <sebas> http://docs.python.org/tut/ :>
[03:59] <DaSkreech> Hi Hobbsee
[03:59] <Hobbsee> hey DaSkreech 
[03:59] <Hobbsee> sebas: thanks.  will look at the end of the year
[04:00] <sebas> Is Australia's end of the year different from the European one?
[04:00] <DaSkreech> Doesn't Ubuntu ship with dive inti python?
[04:00] <DaSkreech> into even
[04:01] <abattoir> DaSkreech: it does
[04:01] <gnomefreak> DaSkreech: yes its a depend of ubuntu-desktp
[04:01] <gnomefreak> kubuntu-desktop also iirc
[04:02] <DaSkreech> Well there you go. Python guide
[04:02] <Tonio_> Riddell: uploaded kds with required changes for amarok
[04:02] <Jucato> yep /usr/share/doc/diveintopython
[04:03] <Lure> sebas: btw, I will get my travel battery end of week, so I can look into multiple battery support
[04:03] <Lure> Riddell: ^^^ is it ok to have this in after feature freeze?
[04:06] <Riddell> Lure: sure, it's a bug not a feature
[04:09] <Tonio_> sebas: I just noticed power-manager doesn't warn when the battery gets critical state, is that in your plans to add this feature ;) Just to know
[04:09] <apachelogger> everyone please digg amarok 1.4.3 :) http://www.digg.com/linux_unix/Amarok_1_4_3_Released_Now_with_Rendezvous_Support
[04:09] <sebas> Tonio_: It does an action then, but in case of "Do Nothing", I can add a notification.
[04:09] <sebas> Lure: Ah, excellent!
[04:10] <sebas> Tonio_: I can add that quickly, I guess.
[04:10] <Lure> allee: but I expect you to test ;-)
[04:10] <Tonio_> sebas: I think that would be nice, yes, but that's only my own opinion
[04:10] <Tonio_> anyone agrees ?
[04:10] <Lure> Tonio_: but there is warning notification... I have seen it couple of times...
[04:11] <Tonio_> Lure: well I got my computer shut yesterday without any notification
[04:11] <Tonio_> Lure: maybe that's a local issue :)
[04:12] <sebas> Tonio_: Hm, it should already do that, i.e. show "doing nothing"
[04:12] <Lure> Tonio_: true, I am running svn version, and these was added recently I think. sebas?
[04:12] <sebas> Yeah, I did some hacking (and even testing!) on those parts last night, so yesterday's version is ancient in that respect.
[04:13] <Lure> I think it would make sense to upload new version after sebas workarounds KUniqueApplication bug
[04:13] <sebas> It suspended properly on criticalLevel
[04:13] <Tonio_> sebas: I checked "none", and will test toonight :)
[04:13] <sebas> Lure: It's committed 5 minutes ago.
[04:13] <Lure> sebas: ;-)
[04:13] <Lure> Riddell: will you package it?
[04:13] <sebas> Tonio_: You can now configure it, that makes testing a lot easier.
[04:13] <Lure> Riddell: btw, is Regional&Accessibility supposed to have Folder icon?
[04:14] <Tonio_> sebas: sure
[04:14] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'm packaging latest amarok for testing
[04:14] <Tonio_> unless anyone's already on it
[04:15] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: imbrandon was
[04:15] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: in fact, new versions are already in his repo, for i386 at least
[04:15] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: okay I'll let him test then :)
[04:15] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: shouldn't we test it and write an uvf exception request fo that ?
[04:15] <Hobbsee> apokryphos: well, the changelogs mention that, so...
[04:15] <apokryphos> yup
[04:16] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: imbrandon's already written the UVF exception.  no major crashes here with it
[04:16] <apachelogger> H
[04:16] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: cool :)
[04:16] <apachelogger> hm
[04:16] <apachelogger> Hobbsee: you already didged? ;-)
[04:16] <Tonio_> okay let's forget that, I have better to do with kaffeine/kmplayer and mimetypes
[04:16] <Tonio_> there are some things to be done on that point
[04:17] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: hehe, fair enough.  or you could attack the bug on why some partitions are unmounted on kde logout.
[04:17] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: I'm affraid that's a pure code issue and I can't do something myself
[04:17] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: I already looked at that and that's not a config issue
[04:17] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: note that I haven't been able to reproduce
[04:18] <Tonio_> I have to learn that now I have time for this
[04:18] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: okay.
[04:18] <Tonio_> Hobbsee: klipper bug is probably prior to this in any case
[04:19] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: fair enough
[04:19] <Hobbsee> apachelogger: hmmm?
[04:19] <apachelogger> Hobbsee: http://www.digg.com/linux_unix/Amarok_1_4_3_Released_Now_with_Rendezvous_Support
[04:19] <Hobbsee> apachelogger: i dont have an account
[04:19] <apachelogger> Hobbsee: please create one :-)
[04:20] <apachelogger> we usually start tradition to have every amarok release at digg.com
[04:20] <apachelogger> so it's worth 
[04:21] <kwwii_> Riddell: http://bootsplash.org/picsForHWDB.tar.gz  (everything except the icon for the app itself)
[04:28] <Jucato> after the 09052006 update, inserting CD's no longer does anything except put an icon on the desktop. It doesn't launch the KDE Media Manager dialog box nor open a Konqueror window/tab. bug or a feature? :)
[04:30] <Hobbsee> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/k/kdelibs/kdelibs_3.5.4-0ubuntu10/changelog is the corresponding changelog
[04:31] <Tonio_> Jucato: known bug, _Sime is fixing it since it is probably relative to is media:/ patch
[04:32] <Jucato> ah that's great. was looking for the bug report to confirm or file :)
[04:34] <Tonio_> Jucato: kamion just reviewed, I'm uploading katapult
[04:34] <Jucato> Tonio_: yay!
[04:35] <kwwii_> did Riddell step out for a moment?
[04:35] <kwwii_> who in the hell told him he could stop working????
[04:36] <Jucato> lol
[04:37] <Riddell> hmm?
[04:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: you can stop working ;)
[04:37] <gnomefreak> no download for amarok 1.4.3 not even on thier site so how can they say relesed
[04:37] <Tonio_> kwwii_: is that okay ? :)
[04:37] <Jucato> I thought imbrandon was already building it? or already did?
[04:37] <kwwii_> Tonio_: only after he checks my HWDB stuff and assures me that he has the latest versions of the powermanagement icons
[04:38] <Tonio_> kwwii_: hehe
[04:38] <kwwii_> ls
[04:38] <abattoir> gnomefreak: the source is on the kde mirrors
[04:38] <kwwii_> oops
[04:38] <gnomefreak> ah
[04:38] <abattoir> gnomefreak: you might need to click on the image in the d'load page, click on source and choose your mirror
[04:39] <abattoir> *image on the announce page rather
[04:39] <Tonio_> kwwii_: did I told you I stopped smoking ?
[04:39] <Tonio_> kwwii_: fuckin' hard but I'll succeed
[04:39] <kwwii_> ouch, you'll get fat
[04:39] <Tonio_> sebas: thanks :)
[04:40] <Tonio_> kwwii_: nope since I restarted sport too
[04:40] <kwwii_> Tonio_: :-)
[04:40] <Tonio_> 30 minutes running + 30 minutes excercices every day + swimming pool twice a week
[04:40] <Tonio_> I wanna stop smoking AND re-become slim and muscled
[04:40] <kwwii_> sounds like you need a kid
[04:41] <Riddell> kwwii_: I'll do that today
[04:41] <sebas> Getting a kid, or getting fat?
[04:42] <Lure> Riddell: should we get suspend/resume icons in some base package or should ksmserver just reference guidance icons?
[04:42] <Riddell> Lure: if ksmserver needs them they should be in kdelibs or kdebase
[04:43] <Lure> Riddell: we can do without, but it would be nice if match the one used by power-manager...
[04:43] <fdoving> Tonio_: come to norway and work for me, as a lumberjack, after one day you'll find out you can't continue smoking, after 6 months you're slim and muscular :)
[04:43] <Tonio_> fdoving: lol :)
[04:43] <Riddell> Lure: but we don't have them in power manager yet
[04:44] <Lure> Riddell: I am using svn version and they are there (just copied them to right dir)
[04:44] <Lure> Riddell: it is orange and blue icon
[04:44] <Lure> Riddell: you get them in menu
[04:45] <Tonio_> yeah ! 400 000 french government workstation are switching to OOo/opendocument ;)
[04:45] <Tonio_> that's a good news
[04:45] <Lure> sebas: btw, we do not have proper application icon for power-manager (still show X icon)
[04:45] <Lure> Tonio_: windows?
[04:46] <seaLne> Lure: will Bug #58767 be fixed with your changes?
[04:46] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 58767 in k3b "k3b: On verify of CD burn, do not open "What do you want to do?" dialog" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58767
[04:46] <Tonio_> Lure: for the moment yes, but linux is in project too
[04:46] <Tonio_> Lure: switching from windows to linux isn't as easy as msoffice/OOo
[04:46] <sebas> Lure: No, but I tried setting one, somehow doesn't work.
[04:46] <Lure> Tonio_: important is that they started to use OSS
[04:46] <Tonio_> Lure: but as long as the new standard is an opened one, I must say I don't mind a lot
[04:46] <Tonio_> Lure: true
[04:46] <Lure> sebas: as many things in PyQt/PyKDE ;-)
[04:47] <Riddell> Lure: are those the icons from gnome-power-manager?
[04:47] <kwwii_> Riddell: I just found that I missed an icon in my new powermanager package...I'll fix the mistake and send you a new link in a bit
[04:47] <sebas> Lure: Exactly.
[04:47] <Lure> seaLne: I am not working on this... _Sime might be looking into this...
[04:48] <kwwii_> Riddell: do we need the other icons in powermanager as well?
[04:48] <Lure> kwwii_: you can just commit them in svn
[04:48] <Lure> Riddell: do not know - I suspect sebas know where he got them... ;-)
[04:49] <Tonio_> hum another post from trolltech on kubuntu-devel... :)
[04:49] <Lure> Tonio_: interesting...
[04:49] <seaLne> Lure: ah so it was
[04:49] <Tonio_> Lure: 2 options : someone subscribe the list to their newsletter or they are interested in kubuntu :)
[04:50] <Riddell> Lure: I commite
[04:50] <sebas> We need a "general application icon", a CPU icon, kwwii_ 
[04:50] <Riddell> Lure: I commited the icons
[04:50] <Lure> Tonio_: I may apply for US one as I am already there at that time.. ;-)
[04:50] <Riddell> sebas: a "general application icon" can just be the fully charged battery
[04:50] <Riddell> but having suspend and hibernate icons would be nice
[04:51] <kwwii_> sebas: for what? powermanager?
[04:51] <kwwii_> having a new cpu icon would have made the HWDB bg pic nicer :-)
[04:52] <Lure> Riddell: problem is it is hard to ilustrate suspend/hibernate - either it is too generic (like gnome/our current) or very technical like kpowersave (they show RAM and disk and some arrow)
[04:52] <Lure> Riddell: I am fine with technical, but not sure what do they mean for Joe user....
[04:53] <Tonio_> Lure: agree
[04:54] <Lure> kwwii_: if you have some great idea (which artist should always have ;-)), feel free to suggest some...
[04:54] <sebas> kwwii_: Yes.
[04:54] <sebas> Riddell: And the icon that we use when there is no battery?
[04:55] <kwwii_> that, and all the time in the world will get you a long way :-)
[04:55] <kwwii_> sebas: the charged icon shows
[04:55] <Lure> kwwii_: lol
[04:55] <sebas> There is "charged" and there is "no battery", that's quite a difference IMO.
[04:56] <sebas> We have quite some non-battery-related stuff, CPUfreq in itself is useful when there's no battery ... 
[04:57] <kwwii_> actually, all you really need to see there is a plug
[04:57] <Hobbsee> Tonio_: yes, i wondered why that trolltech message was there.
[04:58] <Lure> Hobbsee: because some Qt OSS developers contribute to Kubuntu?
[04:58] <Riddell> Lure: I think generic is fine, just different colours of the shutdown icon would be good
[04:58] <Hobbsee> Lure: true
[04:59] <Lure> Riddell: shutdown? you mean the red one?
[05:00] <Riddell> Lure: yeah
[05:00] <Lure> Riddell: I would agree it is a bit confusing to have Quit use the same icon as Shutdown computer
[05:01] <Lure> Riddell: but this is alos used in K-menu, so I am not sure if we should change it...
[05:01] <Tonio_> imbrandon: good point for the changes on konversation tabs, I should have done that before :)
[05:04] <Lure> Riddell: so how do you add new icons to kdelibs-data (I suspect directly to /usr/share/icons/crystalsvg) with package (as we have binary files to add)?
[05:04] <Riddell> Lure: yeah, it would have to be uuencoded files installed manually in debian/rules
[05:05] <Lure> Riddell: ugly - do we need to provide all sizes?
[05:05] <Riddell> Lure: ideally yes
[05:07] <Tonio_> Riddell: do you prefer uuencoded files instead of svg converted on the fly to png during the build ?
[05:07] <Lure> Tonio_: nice idea - just need to find .svn files...
[05:07] <Tonio_> Lure: arf, in that case of course....
[05:08] <Riddell> Tonio_: only if ksvgtopng can do the SVG conversion ok, which it often can't
[05:09] <Tonio_> Riddell: I'm doing this with librsvg2-bin and the result is pretty nice
[05:09] <Tonio_> Riddell: wlassistant icons are done that way
[05:09] <Riddell> if it works then sure that's fine
[05:10] <Tonio_> Lure: if you're interested, you may have a look at wlassistant source package, everything is in it, including a loop to create all different icons' size from an svg
[05:11] <Lure> Tonio_: thanks, will do
[05:13] <Tonio_> Lure: no pb
[05:16] <Riddell> DaSkreech: against CoC
[05:16] <Hobbsee> lol
[05:17] <jdong> DaSkreech: not acceptable?
[05:17] <Hobbsee> Riddell: yet throwing various people out the window may or may not be against the COC, and you'd have to bring it up with the CC to decide :P
[05:17] <jdong> now, now, I chill in here to get AWAY from my CoC enforcing duties :)
[05:17] <jdong> you guys are ruining my vacation :)
[05:17] <Hobbsee> jdong: hah.
[05:18] <Jucato> lol
[05:18] <Hobbsee> jdong: what's a vacation?
[05:18] <Riddell> Hobbsee: huh?
[05:18] <Hobbsee> Riddell: was a joke in #u-d a while ago :P
[05:18] <DaSkreech> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommonCustomizations and search for bmp-dock
[05:18] <Hobbsee> Riddell: talking about defenestrating people, and trying to figure out if that was against the COC or not :P
[05:18] <jdong> Hobbsee: I'm not sure... I think it has something to do with stopping work or something
[05:18] <Hobbsee> they deserved it though
[05:19] <Hobbsee> jdong: hmmm....okay, i dont know about htat one.
[05:19] <DaSkreech> Though I'm not sure how you get around that :)
[05:19] <jdong> oh btw, did the Riddell summoning thing yesterday work?
[05:19] <DaSkreech> jdong: Apparently I ran out of mana
[05:19] <jdong> aww
[05:19] <jdong> :(
[05:19] <Hobbsee> jdong: the which?
[05:20] <jdong> * mornfall summons Riddell
[05:20] <jdong> * DaSkreech draws Circles on the floor and sprinkles salt
[05:20] <jdong> * mornfall puts 5 candles on the Circle and draws lines
[05:20] <jdong> from yesterday
[05:20] <Hobbsee> ahhh...
[05:20] <Hobbsee> wasnt there for that
[05:20] <Jucato> lol
[05:20] <jdong> you guys are.... interesting.... :)
[05:21] <Hobbsee> jdong: the correct term is weird.  :P
[05:21] <Jucato> heh
[05:21] <jdong> that too :)
[05:22] <gnomefreak> amarok is behind schedule pretty far :(
[05:22] <jdong> now I can only use one core
[05:23] <Riddell> jdong: well I'm here aren't I?
[05:23] <Hobbsee> gnomefreak: why so/  they just released 1.4.3
[05:23] <Hobbsee> ah
[05:23] <jdong> Riddell: yes, but like 20 hours later :-/
[05:23] <Hobbsee> he speaks!
[05:23] <Hobbsee> :P
[05:23] <jdong> Riddell: I would've thought a ping works better
[05:23] <jdong> :)
[05:24] <jdong> now, where's my amarok 1.4.3 packages? lol
[05:24] <Jucato> lol
[05:24] <jjesse_> was that a delayed summon?
[05:24] <Jucato> summoning sickness?
[05:24] <Riddell> kwwii_: we're missing an app icon for kubuntu-hwdb, otherwise that all looks great
[05:25] <gnomefreak> Hobbsee: 1.4.3 is no where to be found and 1.4.4 was released aug. 24th 2006 but i guess not
[05:25] <Hobbsee> gnomefreak: um?
[05:26] <abattoir> gnomefreak: http://download.kde.org/download.php?url=stable/amarok/1.4.3/src
[05:26] <Jucato> http://amarok.kde.org/index.1.4.3.html
[05:26] <gnomefreak> http://amarok.kde.org/wiki/Schedule:1.4
[05:26] <Jucato> The War of the Links
[05:27] <Jucato> August 23th, 2006: Official release of Amarok 1.4.3 <-- definitely late...
[05:28] <gnomefreak> nvm ty Jucato i read that wrong but yes either way 1.4.3 fairly late
[05:31] <Hobbsee> gnomefreak: what is?  amarok?
[05:31] <Hobbsee> gnomefreak: imbrandon already has packages
[05:31] <gnomefreak> i have a feeling it is
[05:32] <gnomefreak> yay no building :)
[05:32] <gnomefreak> is he releasing them to repos at all?
[05:33] <Hobbsee> yes
[05:33] <Hobbsee> it's in his normal repo (found on planet)
[05:33] <gnomefreak> k
[05:34] <gnomefreak> ty looking for it
[05:35] <jdong> yay, go imbrandon!
[05:36] <danimo> re
[05:36] <danimo> Hobbsee: did you already look into upgrading amarok?
[05:36] <Hobbsee> danimo: imbrandon's already done it
[05:36] <Hobbsee> he beat even me :P
[05:37] <Jucato> you guys are on a race or something? :)
[05:37] <jdong> of course
[05:37] <Hobbsee> indeed
[05:37] <Jucato> heh
[05:37] <danimo> Hobbsee: d'oh, but not in universe yet I take it?
[05:37] <Hobbsee> last person's a rotten egg!
[05:37] <jdong> gender supremacy?
[05:37] <danimo> jdong: more like packager pride
[05:37] <Jucato> now if only soyuz could get out of the way?
[05:37] <Hobbsee> danimo: a) was never in universe b) waiting on a UVF exception
[05:37] <Hobbsee> jdong: i win.  duh.  :P
[05:37] <jdong> :)
[05:38] <danimo> Hobbsee: err, main, sorry
[05:38] <jdong> yeah, let's fix soyuz.......
[05:38] <jdong> lol
[05:39] <jdong> idn, I personally think soyuz should've been fixed faster regarding backports
[05:39] <jdong> it sounds like all that's needed is to remove a couple if statements
[05:39] <jdong> but the code's already written, just awaiting deployment :)
[05:40] <Jucato> er... who's responsible again for au.archive.ubuntu.com?
[05:40] <Hobbsee> ...not me
[05:40] <Hobbsee> ubuntu-mirrors?
[05:40] <Jucato> ehe... their backports are completely empty...
[05:40] <Jucato> poor guys :)
[05:42] <Riddell> kwwii_: see my message?
[05:45] <carlo1> hy
[05:45] <carlo1> help
[05:46] <jdong> Jucato: au's mirror is ... messed
[05:46] <Jucato> heh...
[05:46] <Riddell> hello carlo1 
[05:47] <carlo1> please a chanel spanisn of ubutun no see chanel winth /list
[05:47] <Hobbsee> jdong: as always
[05:47] <jdong> !es
[05:47] <ubotu> Para Espaol por favor usen #ubuntu-es, #kubuntu-es o #edubuntu-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda.
[05:48] <carlo1> tkans god day
[05:56] <Hobbsee> right.  really bedtime now.
[05:57] <danimo> bye Hobbsee
[05:57] <jdong> who needs sleep?
[05:57] <jdong> lol
[05:57] <Jucato> heh
[05:57] <Hobbsee> jdong: me  :P
[05:57] <Hobbsee> jdong: else i collapse.
[05:57] <Hobbsee> jdong: which i did at a friends place - twice in under 12 hours.
[05:58] <jdong> :)
[05:58] <Hobbsee> that was fun :P
[05:59] <danimo> Hobbsee: caffeine and beer work
[05:59] <danimo> Hobbsee: keeps you up for some time
[05:59] <danimo> then you get close to a heart attack
[05:59] <Hobbsee> danimo: beer would get me drunk.
[05:59] <Hobbsee> danimo: and that would be bad.
[06:00] <jdong> Hobbsee: try vicodin instead of beer
[06:00] <jdong> vicodin and caffeine is godly
[06:00] <Hobbsee> dont konw what that is
[06:00] <Jucato> if jdong uses it, then it must be really really good
[06:00] <jdong> lol
[06:01] <Hobbsee> he's gotta have something good to do the backports.
[06:01] <Jucato> heh
[06:01] <Jucato> ah the backports...
[06:01] <Hobbsee> or just be severely insane.
[06:01] <Jucato> that too :)
[06:01] <jdong> :)
[06:02] <Jucato> it can be both: he has something really good to make him crazy enough to do the backports
[06:02] <sebas> newegg for one with two batteries ;-)
[06:02] <Jucato> heh
[06:03] <jdong> oh, poor sebas...
[06:04] <jdong> sebas: how about making guidance work with no batteries?
[06:04] <jdong> sebas: it's not very fond of my buggy toshiba ACPI
[06:04] <jdong> all I get is "present: yes" out of my battery.... no further info
[06:04] <jdong> guidance-power-manager crashes because of it
[06:09] <sebas> jdong: 1) It doesn't use ACPI, 2) it's supposed to work without batteries (it does here)
[06:09] <sebas> 3) Only bug about power-manager if you're running svn-current :>
[06:09] <jdong> heh
[06:09] <jdong> where's my convenient svn-current deb packages?
[06:09] <jdong> :P
[06:09] <sebas> So, which version are you running?
[06:09] <jdong> whatever is in edgy
[06:09] <sebas> jdong: Roll me one!
[06:10] <sebas> Edgy is ancient in that respect.
[06:10] <jdong> @lart sebas being lazier than jdong
[06:10] <jdong> grr
[06:10] <sebas> At least *I* have a working power-manager :-)
[06:10] <jdong> funny....
[06:12] <seaLne> Riddell: why is your k3b-i18n called 1build1 and why is the changelog empty?
[06:14] <Hobbsee> sebas: you get people good enough the first time that you dont need retaliation?  :P
[06:15] <Jucato> lol! I just noticed only now that the last patched correctly removed my Power Management options in System Settings :)
[06:16] <sebas> Hobbsee: retaliation is in return, not for a second time, right?
[06:16] <Hobbsee> sebas: point.
[06:16] <Jucato> re-retaliation...
[06:17] <seaLne> anyone know if using build instead of ubuntu in the version has a special meaning, such as maybe nothing was changed?
[06:18] <Riddell> seaLne: the changelog shouldn't be empty, it needed rebuilt to get picked up by rosetta and using 1build1 instead of 1ubuntu1 means it still gets synced when the debian sync gets turned on
[06:21] <seaLne> when is sync likely to happen and is it worth a version of it just now and if so should .17 be build or ubuntu?
[06:21] <Riddell> seaLne: sync won't happen again until edgy+1, unless debian already has a new version in which case we could request a sync
[06:21] <seaLne> 0.12.17-1 is in debian
[06:21] <Riddell> seaLne: if we upload a new version that's not in debian it should be ubuntu1
[06:22] <Riddell> seaLne: sounds like we want a sync then
[06:22] <Riddell> seaLne: could you file a bug on k3b-i18n and subscribe ubuntu-archive (and ping me to confirm it)
[06:25] <seaLne> Riddell: bug #59048
[06:25] <Jucato> er... ubotu?
[06:25] <DaSkreech> Right My desktop just went nuts and now I can't get rid of adept_notifier
[06:26] <DaSkreech> Jucato: I think that's Ubugtu's job :)
[06:26] <Jucato> er.. yeah...
[06:26] <Jucato> lol
[06:26] <seaLne> well neither of them are doing it :)
[06:26] <Jucato> bug 59048
[06:27] <Jucato> rawr?
[06:31] <jdong> aww, bots are not happy
[06:31] <Jucato> heh...
[06:32] <abattoir> Riddell: oem-config-kde is on its way into edgy :)
[06:32] <Riddell> abattoir: kamion has merged?
[06:32] <abattoir> Riddell: yes
[06:33] <Riddell> seaLne: sorry, I forgot the new sync policy also needs 
[06:33] <Riddell>     - Debian package component (main, contrib, non-free)
[06:33] <Riddell>     - Copy of the new debian/changelog entries
[06:33] <Riddell> seaLne: changelog is at http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/k/k3b-i18n/current/changelog
[06:33] <Riddell> abattoir: excellent news
[06:33] <abattoir> Riddell: he just asked me to fix the indenting
[06:37] <seaLne> Riddell: done
[06:38] <Riddell> thanks seaLne 
[06:51] <Riddell> kwwii__: could you make the hwdb_head.png image have a white background?
[07:09] <Riddell> seaLne: it's (nearly) impossible to package
[07:09] <seaLne> what about the kanotix packages?
[07:11] <seaLne> every time i look at nx i never actually get round to setting it up
[07:12] <Riddell> this is the trouble, it's crazy hard to set up
[07:13] <Riddell> seaLne: there's also policy issues with the packaging, NX includes a copy of some X libraries which is nasty for security
[07:13] <seaLne> ah
[07:14] <jdong> it's not 'crazy hard' to set up.... :-/
[07:14] <jdong> imo Xvnc + inetd is 'crazy hard' :)
[07:15] <jdong> Seveas's nx packages make nx a lot easier to set up than that
[07:16] <seaLne> no edgy tho?
[07:17] <kwwii__> Riddell: sure, why?
[07:18] <Riddell> kwwii__: the background on the left and right of the header is white, currently is looks strange if you resize the window to be wider
[07:18] <Riddell> kwwii__: also we're missing an applicaiton icon for hwdb
[07:19] <kwwii__> ahhhh
[07:19] <kwwii__> ok, I made it white, and I already started on the icon
[07:20] <kwwii__> it will be amazingly similar to the processor icon for power manager
[07:22] <Riddell> that's all good
[07:29] <seaLne> is there anything like dh_make for cdbs?
[07:31] <allee> seaLne: the only difference would be a much smaller rules file
[07:31] <seaLne> so it would be "normal" to just use it then change rules?
[07:32] <allee> seaLne: if one does not simply start with debian/ from another pkgs, yes
[08:08] <DaSkreech> _Sime: Ping
[08:09] <_Sime> DaSkreech: pong
[08:09] <DaSkreech> _Sime: You are working on KSS for Edgy?
[08:09] <_Sime> DaSkreech: yes
[08:10] <DaSkreech> _Sime: Where do file bugs?
[08:11] <seaLne> Riddell: how does python qt4 live alongside qt3? is it called qt4 in its name?
[08:11] <_Sime> DaSkreech: about the version in edgy?
[08:11] <Jucato> _Sime: would you know who's in charge of System Settings UI in Dapper?
[08:12] <_Sime> Jucato: I am, kinda.
[08:12] <Jucato> hehe! DaSkreech found some issues with selecting modules using the keyboard
[08:12] <seaLne> Riddell: ah it is, ruby dosen't seem to be
[08:14] <_Sime> launchpad is the best place for bug reports in kss.
[08:17] <Jucato> _Sime: will we be able to select modules in KSS (KDE System Settings, right?) on Edgy?
[08:17] <_Sime> Jucato: what do you mean by select modules?
[08:18] <DaSkreech> With the keyboard
[08:18] <DaSkreech>  :)
[08:18] <Jucato> using the keyboard to go from Appearance to Desktop to etc
[08:19] <Riddell> seaLne: is this package names or file names?
[08:19] <seaLne> both
[08:20] <seaLne> where package refers to the ruby module rather than .deb package
[08:20] <seaLne> qtruby 4 is still called qtruby and is called Qt
[08:20] <Riddell> that's quite evil
[08:21] <Riddell> need to ask rdale for advice when he's around
[08:21] <_Sime> Jucato: oh that. yeah that is a known bug. One which I'll try to have a go at after FF.
[08:21] <seaLne> the only thing i could see is rename everything rather than conflict but that dosen't sound good
[08:21] <seaLne> yeah he isn't around just now
[08:21] <Jucato> _Sime: ah great. thanks!
[08:22] <Tonio_> Lure: just fyi, I'll ping sladen concerning the vaio laptop keys
[08:22] <Tonio_> probably toonight or tomorrow
[08:22] <Jucato> DaSkreech: heard that? better file that Dapper bug though :)
[08:24] <Lure> Tonio_: great - I would like some sony tests ;-)
[08:24] <DaSkreech> _Sime: Also I'm not sure how hard it is (since I've been really lazy and haven't pulled the code) but how hard is it to disable the greyed options?
[08:24] <DaSkreech> _Sime: the code is on the kde svn?
[08:24] <DaSkreech> Playground?
[08:24] <Tonio_> Lure: which ones ?
[08:24] <_Sime> DaSkreech: disable the greyed options? you mean after searching in KSS?
[08:24] <Lure> Tonio_: testing laptop buttons spec on sony
[08:25] <Tonio_> Lure: how ? it doesn't produce anything here untill sladen hads the sony support to the laptop-buttons package...
[08:25] <Tonio_> Lure: see https://launchpad.net/bugs/50692
[08:25] <DaSkreech> _Sime: yes
[08:25] <Riddell> seaLne: so they both have /usr/lib/ruby/1.8/Qt.rb ?
[08:25] <Lure> Tonio_: when sladen fixes, then you can test
[08:26] <Tonio_> Lure: yes, that's why I have to ping him
[08:26] <_Sime> DaSkreech: dunno
[08:26] <DaSkreech> _Sime: It's in Playground?
[08:27] <_Sime> DaSkreech: playground/base/systemsettings
[08:27] <DaSkreech> OKies :)
[08:28] <_Sime> DaSkreech: don't forget to SVN up, because I just added a small usability feature to it for El. :)
[08:28] <_Sime> Tonio_: are you still looking after the KSS package?
[08:28] <DaSkreech> 5 minutes ago?
[08:28] <el> _Sime, the labels ? :)
[08:28] <_Sime> el: the Hit indicator
[08:28] <el> and: hi Sime_ :)
[08:29] <_Sime> el: Hi
[08:29] <el> _Sime, cool  !
[08:29] <Riddell> Hit indicator?  sounds violent
[08:29] <el> Riddell, hehe
[08:29] <_Sime> el: It displays "23 hits in General" etc on the right side of hte search box.
[08:29] <Tonio_> _Sime: hu ?
[08:29] <_Sime> fairly simple
[08:29] <Tonio_> _Sime: I'm waiting for you to tell me there is a new upload to provide :)
[08:29] <el> _Sime, 23? wow, a lot 
[08:30] <DaSkreech> He was searching for e :)
[08:30] <Tonio_> _Sime: the problematic package has been uploaded 5 days ago
[08:30] <_Sime> Tonio_: I just added a new little feature to it in SVN.
[08:30] <el> Riddell, could you pack me another package so I can see it?
[08:31] <Riddell> el: not immediately but hopefully today I can
[08:31] <el> Riddell, no need to do it immediately :)
[08:31] <Riddell> _Sime, Tonio_: did we work out why some of the categories in edgy were broken?
[08:32] <Lure> _Sime: why do we use folder icon for Accessibility?
[08:33] <Riddell> el: a summary of a digest?
[08:33] <_Sime> Lure: works here on my edgy (but mine might be hacked)
[08:33] <el> Riddell, yeah... it's an experiment. to see if it will become easier for non-technical contributors to keep track of current development
[08:34] <DaSkreech> el: What?
[08:34] <DaSkreech> el: You summarizing the summary of the svn commits?
[08:34] <el> hehe, yes ;-)
[08:34] <trappist> my accessibility icon is also a folder
[08:34] <el> DaSkreech, well, like a reference book
[08:34] <Lure> _Sime: interesting... what icon do other see for Accessibility in System Settings
[08:35] <DaSkreech> el: You mean like canallith?
[08:35] <trappist> Lure: folder here
[08:35] <_Sime> Lure: cog thingy
[08:35] <seaLne> Lure: me to
[08:35] <seaLne> (folder)
[08:35] <el> DaSkreech, canallith?
[08:36] <Lure> _Sime: do you use default icon theme (Crystal SVG) or something else?
[08:37] <seaLne> Lure: i'm on a fresh install and haven't changed anything apart from background
[08:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: I didn't saw that problem
[08:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: any example ?
[08:38] <DaSkreech> el: blast it's down. It was a this month in svn written for new york post journalists and grandmas
[08:38] <DaSkreech> canllaith :)
[08:38] <_Sime> Lure: default
[08:38] <Lure> _Sime: this is really strange...
[08:39] <el> DaSkreech, uuuh - double work! but it's down now you say?
[08:39] <_Sime> Lure: do you have /usr/share/desktop-directories/kde-settings-advanced.directory ?
[08:39] <DaSkreech> Yeah she hasn't updated in over a year
[08:39] <el> DaSkreech, ok. then i'll continue my copy-paste work here ;-)
[08:39] <Lure> _Sime: yes
[08:40] <Lure> _Sime: /usr/share/desktop-directories/kde-settings-accessibility.directory too and Icon field is set to "locale"
[08:41] <DaSkreech> el: Guess I could mail her and find out what's up she's likely to start up again when the KDE4 starts to roll with things that people care about
[08:41] <DaSkreech> el: Though it sounds as if you are writing for diffeent audiences
[08:42] <_Sime> Lure: my settings-advanced icon is kcmsystem.
[08:42] <el> DaSkreech, yes, probably. Mine is for people like me who don't follow the commits on a regular base but like to be notified when something e.g. in kdepim happens.
[08:42] <el> DaSkreech, especially when it's GUI-related
[08:43] <el> I skip some of the pure-geek comments ;-)
[08:43] <_Sime> Lure: do you have a /usr/share/desktop-directories/kde-settings-accessibility_ss.directory ?
[08:44] <DaSkreech> el: Hers is purely for people who can with a straight face call the monitor the CPU but know how to use a Word Processor better than most folks know how to handle a knife and fork
[08:44] <Lure> _Sime: no
[08:44] <_Sime> Lure: it looks like it is not in the KSS package, although the Makefile.am does install it.
[08:45] <_Sime> Lure: packaging error.
[08:45] <Lure> Tonio_: ^^^
[08:45] <el> DaSkreech, ha haa! :) that's interesting, too. if she starts again, maybe i can include it as explanations in the wiki. that would be very cool, actually
[08:46] <DaSkreech> Yeah. She got me started in following what was going on cause KDE is scary scary world :)
[08:47] <el> hihi :)
[08:47] <Tonio_> Lure: hum........
[08:47] <Tonio_> I'm looking at the source package, just gimme a while
[08:48] <Tonio_> Lure: maybe I didn't upload the good version
[08:50] <_Sime> Tonio_: you want to see if kde-settings-accessibility_ss.directory is being installed. (the Makefile.am *should* do that)
[08:52] <DaSkreech> lnxkde: Sup sup sup?
[08:53] <Tonio_> _Sime: it should but it doesn't install it.......;
[08:53] <Tonio_> I don't understand
[08:53] <Tonio_> _Sime: I'm looking at the source package and I must say I don't understand
[08:55] <DaSkreech> el: http://canllaith.org/?page_id=6
[08:56] <Tonio_> _Sime: maybe it doesn't like that underscore....
[08:56] <Tonio_> I'm testing
[08:57] <lnxkde> DaSkreech: all nice you!?
[08:57] <DaSkreech> lnxkde: Not bad. Was just thinking about you early today
[08:58] <el> DaSkreech, these are good explanations. i'll contact her - thanks for the link :)
[08:58] <Tonio_> _Sime: I'm testing and will tell you what about
[08:58] <lnxkde> DaSkreech: :D running KDE 4 on MAC OS X
[08:58] <Tonio_> the only thing that can cause the error is that "_ss", I'm trying to replace with "-ss"
[08:58] <DaSkreech> sure. she's working secularly now so don't expect instaresponses : but she's lovely 
[08:58] <Tonio_> if that doesn't cause the issue, I don't know
[08:59] <DaSkreech> lnxkde: and you haven't blogged it  :-P :-(
[08:59] <lnxkde> no :( but it is avery easy thing :)
[09:00] <lnxkde> http://ranger.users.finkproject.org/kde/
[09:00] <lnxkde> just donwload the eavrything.dmg and install it :D
[09:03] <kwwii__> how does one install svn on edgy?
[09:03] <allee> kwwii__: apt-get install subversion
[09:03] <kwwii__> hehe, I spent 5 minutes looking for svn :p
[09:04] <kwwii__> lnxkde: I will try that, one second :-)
[09:06] <kwwii__> lnxkde: hehe, 1.16GB, guess it might take a few minutes :-)
[09:06] <lnxkde> kwwii__: yep
[09:07] <lnxkde> kwwii__: but once you download the 6 hrs download from my 512 cable
[09:07] <lnxkde> you will just mount the dmg and then click ok the kde.pkg and next next
[09:07] <kwwii__> lnxkde: yeah, no doubt...it says it'll take 1.5 hours
[09:07] <lnxkde> :)
[09:08] <kwwii__> pretty quick download considering the size
[09:08] <lnxkde> you have a faster conection :)
[09:08] <lnxkde> lol
[09:08] <lnxkde> kwwii__: I am using konqueror QT/Mac on OS X is very nice :)
[09:09] <DaSkreech> lnxkde: PPC?
[09:10] <kwwii__> lnxkde: the main reason I want it is for konqueror - the best ftp broswer ever made! :-)
[09:10] <lnxkde> DaSkreech:  :D noooooo
[09:11] <lnxkde> DaSkreech: I am running OS x on my dell 5150 laptop
[09:11] <lnxkde> :)
[09:11] <kwwii__> you'd die waiting for that download
[09:11] <lnxkde> what?
[09:11] <lnxkde> I am using it on my laptop.
[09:11] <DaSkreech> 131 days
[09:12] <kwwii__> all that time for evil clowns to bite your feet
[09:12] <lnxkde> lol
[09:14] <lnxkde> kwwii__: I just use it to test os x , I always wanted to have a MAC but had no money for it..
[09:14] <lnxkde> so
[09:14] <lnxkde> I have been using OS x86 for one week
[09:14] <jjesse> does klipper crash for everyone else on startup for edgy?
[09:14] <lnxkde> but well
[09:15] <lnxkde> I was wondering if it was a good Idea to upgrade to edgy
[09:16] <kwwii__> jjesse: it works for me
[09:16] <kwwii__> funny enough, considering that the problems usually occur on my computer
[09:17] <kwwii__> edgy seems to work pretty well, just not on obscure PPC boxes
[09:17] <jjesse> that's the only problem i have w/ edgy
[09:17] <Lure> jjesse: yes it is know problem (also in launchapad) - quick workaround is to do "rm ~/.kde/share/config/klipperrc"
[09:18] <jjesse> thanks Lure
[09:20] <DaSkreech> lnxkde: You like crashy things :)
[09:20] <lnxkde> DaSkreech: yep lol
[09:20] <DaSkreech> Then jump to it :)
[09:24] <kwwii__> Riddell: I am adding the powermanager stuff directly in KDE svn
[09:29] <Lure> kwwii__, Riddell: found svg for suspend/hibernate from gnome: http://lure.homelinux.net/kubuntu/gnome-session-hebirnate.svg and http://lure.homelinux.net/kubuntu/gnome-session-suspend.svg
[09:29] <Lure> should we use this or do we have better option?
[09:30] <kwwii__> Lure: we will make our own, much the same as that, but with typical kde highlights
[09:30] <kwwii__> Lure: which package should that go in?
[09:31] <kwwii__> and/or who should I give it to :-)
[09:31] <Lure> kwwii__: we will probably stick it together with crystalsvg (kdelibs-data), so that it is available to all programs that need it (ksmserver for logout and power-manager)
[09:32] <kwwii__> Lure: we already have a few icons in crystal for that stuff, don't we?
[09:32] <Lure> kwwii__: I can prepare package and fix ksmserver/power-manager when we have it, then Riddell or Tonio_ would need to upload
[09:33] <Lure> kwwii__: crystalsvg does not include power mgmt stuff (I did not find anything) - you icons are bundled with power-manager for kde-guidance package
[09:33] <kwwii__> hehe, I think I made them for suse and they never went upstream
[09:34] <kwwii__> Lure: I will take care of it and give you a link when I am done
[09:34] <kwwii__> Lure: any examples of where this will show up?
[09:35] <Lure> kwwii__: great - I will work for some other improvements (code) that will go with that upload
[09:35] <kwwii__> cool :-)
[09:36] <Lure> kwwii__: Logout dialog (currenlty abusing player_pause and vcs_update) and power-manager menu (right click) - current SVN version uses gnome icons already
[09:36] <danimo> re
[09:36] <danimo> kwwii__: nice icons
[09:37] <kwwii__> Lure: cool, thanks for the info...one question, why is powermanager showing the quit icon (for the program, not the computer) as a shutdown icon
[09:37] <kwwii__> danimo: not all of them are, but it is a start
[09:38] <danimo> kwwii__: I was surprised that this is not one pic with a special color
[09:38] <danimo> kwwii__: like in kpowersaved
[09:38] <danimo> where the color is filled with white and a color that indicates the battery level
[09:40] <kwwii__> danimo: which is better?
[09:42] <danimo> kwwii__: it's not about things being better, it's about avoiding X versions of the discharged icon
[09:42] <Lure> kwwii__: other kde tray programs also use quit icon for the program, but logout screen uses it for shutdown - funny?
[09:42] <kwwii__> Lure: messed up...we should fix that
[09:42] <kwwii__> it is an action icon problem
[09:43] <kwwii__> it is even used in konqueror
[09:47] <Seveas> seaLne, nx for edgy won't happen soon -- edgy is still too much moving
[09:48] <nixternal> why is amarok so slow when xferin' to an ipod
[09:48] <seaLne> Seveas: ta
[09:49] <allee> Seveas: curious, has nx so many interdependencies to core OS features?
[09:50] <kwwii__> dude, I never noticed that the exit and log-out/shutdown icons are the same until now
[09:50] <kwwii__> bad, bad, bad
[09:50] <Seveas> allee, not that much but rebuilding it is a pain
[09:50] <kwwii__> that proves that I do not like the icons in the menus :p
[09:51] <Lure> kwwii__: I also did a week ago (when I was looking for proper suspend/hibernate versions)
[09:51] <allee> Seveas: isn't this just a debuild and then be patient? ;)
[09:52] <Seveas> allee, very patient
[09:52] <allee> Seveas: heh, okay
[09:52] <Seveas> it also needs 2 hours of up/downloading to buildds and mirrors
[09:52] <kwwii__> Lure: I think it is time that I made all those icons new, from the same template
[09:52] <Seveas> nx isn't the smallest
[09:52] <allee> Uhm
[09:53] <kwwii__> making new crystal icons...bad dog!
[09:55] <Riddell> kwwii__: feel free to make use new Oxygen icons
[09:56] <kwwii__> why is it that the more I do, the longer the list of things to do becomes :-)
[09:57] <kwwii__> Riddell: does the animation for the hwdb interface look ok to you?
[09:57] <Riddell> kwwii__: looks wonderful
[09:58] <seaLne> is the icon for guidance pm the final one?
[09:59] <kwwii> cool
[10:00] <seaLne> it seems a bit bright to me as i keep catching it out the corner of my eye
[10:07] <Tonio_> _Sime: I think I have the solution for kss
[10:07] <Tonio_> it is a little problem in the rules file
[10:07] <Tonio_> _Sime: I'll let you know in 5 minutes
[10:07] <kwwii> seaLne: which icon? the app icon?
[10:09] <Riddell> seaLne: there's been a newer one since Knot 2
[10:10] <seaLne> ah i haven't restarted so its not the very bright green anymore?
[10:10] <Riddell> it's not uploaded yet
[10:11] <kwwii> well, niether koffice, nor OO works on my edgy ppc
[10:11] <Riddell> seaLne: http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/playground/base/guidance/powermanager/icons/battery-charging-100.png?rev=581239&view=auto
[10:11] <Riddell> kwwii: koffice is waiting on ruby on ppc not being broken
[10:11] <Riddell> and openoffice I guess is just broken
[10:11] <kwwii> I take that back, OO has a broken splash screen...5 minutes later it starts
[10:12] <seaLne> ah much less stressfull on the eye
[10:15] <kwwii> 28 minutes till kde on osx :-)
[10:21] <danimo> kwwii: KDE 4 I assume
[10:22] <Tonio_> _Sime, Riddell: kss packaged fixed and uploaded
[10:22] <ryanakca> danimo: imbrandon fixed the konqueror page
[10:22] <_Sime> Tonio_: cool, thanks
[10:26] <Lure> can any of you run this on your laptop/desktop/whatever and report if it returns properly: lshal | grep formfactor
[10:26] <danimo> ryanakca: cool
[10:28] <kwwii> sebas: ping?
[10:28] <kwwii> system.formfactor = 'unknown'  (string)
[10:29] <Lure> kwwii: :-( ppc? laptop or desktop?
[10:29] <kwwii> ppc desktop
[10:29] <danimo> ryanakca: it's not yet uploaded though, is it?`
[10:29] <ryanakca> danimo: no... bug him :)
[10:30] <danimo> imbrandon:  bug, bug!
[10:44] <kwwii> lnxkde: the kde icon in the installer is a bit too big..it would look better if it was smaller
[10:46] <kwwii> lnxkde: and it looks like you got a bad version of the file, or rendered the svg with a program with poor svg supprot
[10:48] <lnxkde> kwwii:  I didnt build it!
[10:48] <lnxkde> I just use it
[10:48] <kwwii> hehe
[10:48] <lnxkde> :p
[10:48] <kwwii> rangerRick made it ?
[10:49] <lnxkde> yep I think :D
[10:49] <lnxkde> join #kde-darwin <-- there you can talk to the one that builds that :)
[10:49] <kwwii> I'll ping him then
[10:49] <lnxkde> :p
[10:56] <Riddell> Tonio_: you uploaded system settings?
[11:00] <Tonio_> Riddell: yes, I corrected the package
[11:00] <Riddell> Tonio_: the upload failed
[11:01] <Tonio_> Riddell: let me check my mails......
[11:01] <kwwii> konqueror on osx...it really works
[11:01] <kwwii> I am amazed
[11:01] <Tonio_> Riddell: grmpf....... okay I missed this, redoing it
[11:04] <kwwii> more  importantly, KMahjongg
[11:04] <DaSkreech> Much more important
[11:07] <Tonio_> Riddell: accepted this time... sorry for the error
[11:07] <Riddell> I don't mind :)
[11:10] <Tonio_> Riddell: Power Management appears in "found objects", should we change the desktop file to have it in system ?
[11:10] <Riddell> Tonio_: yes
[11:11] <Tonio_> Riddell: I assume you have svn access, can I send the modified file by email eventually ?
[11:12] <Riddell> Tonio_: patches are good
[11:13] <Tonio_> Riddell: hum, the file I'm talking about isn't guidance-power-manager one
[11:13] <Tonio_> Riddell: it is /usr/share/applications/kde/laptoppowermanagement.desktop
[11:15] <Riddell> that's from system settings
[11:18] <Lure> Tonio_: I think this is left over from klaptopdaemon/system settings
[11:18] <Lure> Tonio_: it looks like kde-systemsettings provides it...
[11:18] <Tonio_> Lure, Riddell: yes I just removed the installation of that file from debian/rules
[11:18] <Tonio_> I'm testing and uploading again :)
[11:19] <Lure> btw, where should we put Strigi - it is also put in Lost+Found currently
[11:21] <Lure> Riddell: are you fine that we only present suspend/hibernate in logout if HAL claims that machine is laptop? Some desktop users are complaining that they have hibernate option, but it does not work (I think ACPI/HAL reports it, but does not work)
[11:21] <Lure> my noname desktop also has this problem...
[11:21] <Riddell> Lure: I would expect that if HAL reports it can hibernate then we should trust that
[11:22] <Riddell> Lure: might be an idea to look at the gnome patch and see how it works
[11:22] <Riddell> Lure: strigi, no idea but I guess upstream will fix it
[11:22] <Lure> Riddell: you do not want to know - they do not trust hal either - they have gconf entry for this
[11:23] <Lure> Riddell: I think install/whatever properly configures these gconf entries
[11:23] <Riddell> oh fun, but there must be a default settings for the gconf entry
[11:23] <Lure> Riddell: will ask on #ubuntu-devel
[11:40] <pounk_> hello
[11:40] <Lure> we still have plenty of time until feature freeze... ;-)
[11:41] <pounk_> Is it a joke the new kubuntu theme?
[11:41] <Lure> Riddell: how should I mark laptop buttons spec? we are still missing the suspend/hibernate/battery key, but the rest is in place
[11:42] <Lure> pounk_: why?
[11:42] <Riddell> Lure: that's a bug, we can mark it as implemented
[11:42] <pounk_> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/EdgyEft/Knot2/Kubuntu?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=translatepage.pnghttps://wiki.kubuntu.org/EdgyEft/Knot2/Kubuntu?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=translatepage.png
[11:42] <Lure> Riddell: everything is a bug by this definition - cool! ;-)
[11:43] <Lure> Riddell: will mark as implemented
[11:44] <Riddell> :)
[11:47] <Riddell> pounk_: what's funny about it?
[11:51] <Riddell> imbrandon: around?
[11:52] <imbrandon> yup
[11:53] <imbrandon> was just about to head to the meeting
[11:53] <imbrandon> Riddell, ^^
[11:53] <pounk_> Riddell, NOTHING, it's sucks, and on forums, I see that everybody think it's sucks
[11:54] <PtitGNU> pounk_: what are you talking about ?
[11:54] <pounk_> check that: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/EdgyEft/Knot2/Kubuntu?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=translatepage.pnghttps://wiki.kubuntu.org/EdgyEft/Knot2/Kubuntu?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=translatepage.png
[11:55] <pounk_> the new kubuntu theme
[11:55] <imbrandon> pounk_, we're all aware of it
[11:55] <Riddell> pounk_: some more constructive critisism would help
[11:56] <pounk_> more contructive critisism: keep the old theme
[11:56] <pounk_> or change the colors
[11:56] <Riddell> imbrandon: there's a bunch of files not installed with amarok, any reason why? http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/22679
[11:56] <trappist> I personally don't care for mixing blue with brown, but my aesthetic eye is pretty worthless
[11:57] <Riddell> trappist: there's no brown in it
[11:57] <Riddell> pounk_: still not helpful
[11:57] <trappist> Riddell: there's that worthlessness :)  the whole background looks like of bluish-brown to me, as if it's trying to compromise
[11:58] <Riddell> looks purple to me
[11:58] <imbrandon> Riddell, the debian/tmp/usr/bin/amarok_daapserver.rb is on pourpouse , the rest have been like that since 1.4.1 so never asked nor changed it
[11:58] <trappist> looks purple at the corners, and brownish toward the center
[11:59] <Riddell> imbrandon: what's wrong with amarok_daapserver.rb?
[11:59] <PtitGNU> pounk_: mmmh, ok, I don't like this new theme too... it's very ugly (for me)... But it is possible to make an iso with the older theme if you want :)
[11:59] <imbrandon> Riddell, its not done yet, half implmented
[11:59] <Riddell> trappist: it's yellow in the centre, and I agree it's not very nice
[11:59] <kwwii> trappist: don't worry, it will change
[11:59] <kwwii> soon
[11:59] <Tonio_> night all
[11:59] <imbrandon> gnight Tonio_
[12:00] <trappist> kwwii: awesome
[12:00] <imbrandon> Riddell, the all could be installed i guess, its just been that way an i dident take the time to ask why 
[12:00] <imbrandon> ( e.g. it was before i started messing with amarok )
[12:00] <Riddell> imbrandon: I'll make it so and see what breaks
[12:00] <imbrandon> heh ok , sounds good
[12:01] <imbrandon> okies, CC meeting time , i told fujitsu i would be there to cheer, so bbiab
[12:02] <imbrandon> moins Hobbsee
[12:02] <Hobbsee> hi all
[12:02] <Hobbsee> Riddell: oh dear, sounds foreboding.  waht's this for?
[12:03] <Riddell> Hobbsee: adding these files to amarok which currently aren't in the package http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/22679
[12:05] <Hobbsee> Riddell: fun
[12:06] <PtitGNU> is it possible to make a pool to let's the users choose their prefered default theme for the new release ?
[12:07] <Hobbsee> PtitGNU: here?  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Kubuntu-Edgy-Ideas  and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Kubuntu-Edgy-Ideas for feedback?
[12:07] <imbrandon> PtitGNU, you can participate in the ubuntu-art mailing list 
[12:07] <kwwii> PtitGNU: when you see the next version you will not want that :-)
[12:08] <Lure> PtitGNU: I do not think this makes much sense - it is not a beauty contest
[12:08] <Hobbsee> kwwii: ooh, show :)
[12:08] <kwwii> PtitGNU: your opinion is definitely important...but I think that people will be happy with it
[12:08] <Lure> PtitGNU: but havving old theme available as package/theme to choose would make sense
[12:09] <kwwii> well, 5a in my package
[12:09] <kwwii> :-)