[01:01] <BDahl> Anybody Home?
[01:03] <LaserJock> yeah
[01:03] <LaserJock> I suppose
[01:03] <Burgwork> really? wow, I am never home ;)
[01:04] <LaserJock> well, I'm at the lab
[01:04] <LaserJock> lab=home
[01:04] <LaserJock> ;-)
[01:06] <acesuares> !seen RichEd
[01:06] <ubotu> RichEd is on IRC right now!
[01:06] <acesuares> Hi RcihEd !
[01:06] <acesuares> Sorry, RichEd!
[01:33] <jsgotangco> heh
[01:34] <jsgotangco> LaserJock: nice lab feels like my lab
[01:38] <LaserJock> heh
[01:59] <rodarvus> acesuares, RichEd lives on South Africa (timezone UTC-2)
[02:00] <rodarvus> its 2 AM for him, right now (1 AM when you pinged him) ;)
[02:00] <LaserJock> hi rodarvus
[02:00] <rodarvus> hi LaserJock!
[02:00] <LaserJock> how's it going?
[02:00] <rodarvus> UTC+2, not UTC-2
[02:00] <LaserJock> still doing X I see :/
[02:00] <LaserJock> poor guy
[02:00] <rodarvus> heh
[02:01] <rodarvus> yeah, I wish we could find someone quickly to take over X maintainership
[02:01] <rodarvus> in time for the whole edgy+1 cycle, hopefully
[02:01] <LaserJock> I uploaded edubuntu-menus the other day, don't know if you saw that
[02:01] <LaserJock> it's sitting in NEW right now
[02:01] <Burgwork> so you can concentrate on the OLPC stuff?
[02:01] <rodarvus> I'm just updating a few edgy packages in time for knot 3 (due Thursday)
[02:01] <rodarvus> Burgwork, indeed
[02:07] <jsgotangco> rodarvus: i guess we'll see more hair from you when we get to see again after someone really takes over X
[02:07] <jsgotangco> heh
[02:08] <rodarvus> :)
[02:08] <rodarvus> I shave my head from time to time ;)
[02:08] <rodarvus> so mostof the time you can't really tell if I'm bald, or if my head is shaved
[02:09] <jsgotangco> good reason ;)
[02:12] <LaserJock> hehe
[02:12] <bddebian> Howdy
[02:12] <LaserJock> my wife won't let me buzz my hair
[02:13] <LaserJock> hi bddebian 
[02:13] <bddebian> Heya LaserJock
[02:13] <jsgotangco> tried to do it before, wife hated me for it
[02:13] <jsgotangco> said i looked like some chinese mafia thug
[02:13] <LaserJock> :-)
[02:28] <javiolo> hi
[02:29] <javiolo> anyone works on a kids school ?
[02:30] <javiolo> Id like to know what the roamer robot is 
[02:31] <javiolo> Ive read its used on some schools on USA
[02:32] <jsgotangco> whats that?
[02:32] <javiolo> http://education.wichita.edu/mindstorms/roamer/
[02:33] <jsgotangco> oh a mindstorms robot
[02:33] <jsgotangco> err no
[02:33] <jsgotangco> looks like a roomba
[02:34] <javiolo> roomba?
[02:34] <javiolo> ahh
[02:34] <javiolo> heh
[02:35] <javiolo> yes
[03:16] <acesuares> rodarvus thx (but !seen sais: he's there now !!!) :-)
[03:16] <rodarvus> acesuares, most of us let our irc session connected (this is called 'idling')
[03:17] <TalkyToaster> Yo, I want to set up Linux for my nephew, but he won't do it unless he can play a few games (Warcraft, Starcraft and Diablo). I know Wine supports them in other distros, but not sure about edubuntu ....anyone done this?
[03:19] <jsgotangco> TalkyToaster: it should work as well
[03:19] <acesuares> rodarvus: yes, i know
[03:19] <TalkyToaster> jsgotangco, great! I'll let him know. I'll be glad to get him off of windows
[03:20] <jsgotangco> TalkyToaster: performance should be better with a binary video driver
[03:20] <jsgotangco> especially for graphics but does not equate to good overall computer performance
[03:23] <TalkyToaster> jsgotangco, yeah I know there will be lag, but I just want to be able to say, "well it works fro other people" :)
[03:23] <jsgotangco> those games you mentioned should perform well
[03:48] <TalkyToaster> jsgotangco, thanks, he seems to think it is worth a try. He has been hot to work with Java, and is happy that at least that should be not a problem :)
[03:49] <TalkyToaster> Anyway, thanks and later
[03:49] <jsgotangco> cheers
[05:42] <sbalneav> Eveing all
[05:45] <LaserJock> hi
[05:45] <jsgotangco> hi
[05:47] <sbalneav> hello all
[05:47] <sbalneav> LaserJock: How's it going?
[05:48] <LaserJock> ok
[05:48] <LaserJock> I can't seem to get anything done lately
[05:49] <LaserJock> I've been busy running around doing stupid little tasks
[05:49] <LaserJock> and I end my day and it doesn't seem like I got much done
[05:50] <LaserJock> but other than that ;-)
[05:54] <jsgotangco> LaserJock: slacker
[05:54] <sbalneav> hey jsgotangco
[05:54] <LaserJock> well, I'm trying
[05:55] <sbalneav> heh, I've volunteered to HedgeMage to put a little love into the ltsp section of the edubuntu manual.
[05:55] <LaserJock> but I don't seem to get very far some days
[05:59] <jsgotangco> LaserJock: maybe you just need a break, and limit your contributions to a few days instead of all week
[06:00] <jsgotangco> its been a while since I touched actual code work considering the nature of my new work but still much in the loop but more in the use-case side
[06:00] <nixternal> jsgotangco: i think LaserJock needs to work harder, maximize his contributions, work 8 days out of the week ;)
[06:01] <jsgotangco> nixternal: he doesn't seem to be into BSDM though
[06:02] <nixternal> my reserve unit called me up tonight and asked if i would be interested in going back to active duty
[06:02] <nixternal> i politely said "HELL NO!"
[06:02] <jsgotangco> hahahaha
[06:02] <nixternal> my skipper had the same reaction
[06:02] <nixternal> he turned it down as well
[06:03] <nixternal> i will make more money retiring from the reserves than i will from active duty..and they know that..so they try to persuade you to come back
[06:03] <nixternal> im senior enlisted..so i don't work as it is, active or reserves
[06:03] <raymondtracm> hello
[06:03] <nixternal> but if i don't have to work for 2 days out of the month, then i am happy
[06:03] <raymondtracm> anbyody want to help me?
[06:03] <nixternal> hiya raymondtracm ;)
[06:03] <raymondtracm> hi nixternal
[06:03] <nixternal> if it is KDE related I can ;)
[06:04] <raymondtracm> i was wondering wats the minimum sys req to run edubuntu
[06:04] <raymondtracm> i want to get a lab up and running at an elemtnary school
[06:04] <nixternal> GNOME related stuff you would get better answers out of an embryo than you would from me ;)
[06:04] <raymondtracm> i dont know wat KDE and GNOME are
[06:04] <nixternal> i can do that one
[06:04] <raymondtracm> im a linux n00b
[06:04] <nixternal> i have it running on a p2 400???  w/ 196mb of ram, and a 6gb hard drive
[06:04] <jsgotangco> raymondtracm: are you running it as a stand alone machine or a server
[06:04] <raymondtracm> stand alone machines
[06:04] <nixternal> it isn't the fastest in the world, but it is good enough
[06:05] <raymondtracm> i might be getting pIII 500mhz machines
[06:05] <nixternal> just put some memory in them and you will be fine
[06:05] <raymondtracm> how much RAM do I need?
[06:05] <raymondtracm> this is for elementary school kids
[06:05] <jsgotangco> 256 would do
[06:05] <nixternal> i run Kubuntu and Ubuntu on a celeron 400 with 192mb of ram as well
[06:05] <nixternal> 256 would be good, and more would be better ;)
[06:06] <raymondtracm> ic
[06:06] <raymondtracm> any reason to run it in a networked environment vs standalone unnetworked?
[06:07] <raymondtracm> i wont have to buy hubs and ethernet cables if its standalone
[06:07] <jsgotangco> raymondtracm: terminal server setup
[06:07] <raymondtracm> i odnt have a fast server
[06:07] <raymondtracm> i think i have a dual proc PIII for a server
[06:07] <raymondtracm> the school has no money :-(
[06:07] <jsgotangco> well even if you dont connect it to a network, all the good educ stuff are still installed by default in a workstation install
[06:08] <jsgotangco> the only loss is that they wont be connected to the internet for sure
[06:08] <jsgotangco> but if you're just after the installed apps, then its alright
[06:09] <raymondtracm> any other good edu apps to install w/ edubuntu?
[06:09] <raymondtracm> ive heard of linux4kids and tux
[06:10] <raymondtracm> but linux4kids looks like a PITA to install
[09:13] <willvdl> Morning all
[09:14] <Burgundavia> hey pygi, willvdl
[09:21] <pygi> hey Burgundavia 
[09:28] <cbx33> GRrrrr
[09:28] <cbx33> why can't I copy files to a network share on the live CD
[09:28] <cbx33> this is doing my nut !
[09:29] <pygi> :P
[09:29] <cbx33> anyone know why?
[09:29] <cbx33> I setup network places in gnome
[09:29] <cbx33> copy from the local machine
[09:29] <cbx33> but I can't copy it
[09:29] <cbx33> to the network place
[09:29] <cbx33> I can create new folder
[10:19] <RichEd> hello willvdl :)
[10:20] <pygi> hey willvdl, RichEd 
[10:20] <RichEd> We need to have a meeting with cbx33 after lunch ... get the Education Advocacy electronic split into 2 versions, and also a sample & request for print to ChrisK
[10:21] <RichEd> hey pygi :)
[10:21] <willvdl> Hey RichEd, pygi
[10:50] <RichEd> !seen pips1
[10:50] <ubotu> I haven't seen pips1 recently
[11:39] <ogra> cbx33, would you mind taking the wallpaper-generic pic for gdm ?
[11:39] <acesuares> hi ogra !
[11:39] <acesuares> good luck with a move
[11:39] <acesuares> hi RichEd
[11:39] <ogra> i have to go soon, and pick up the truck ...
[11:40] <RichEd> hi acesuares 
[11:40] <acesuares> I pop3 every 2 seconds but did not RETR your mail
[11:40] <acesuares> ...yest...
[11:40] <ogra> RichEd, willvdl, seen the topic ? there are testing instructions ...
[11:40] <acesuares> no where is the topic ?
[11:40] <ogra> try /topic
[11:40] <ogra> (the channel topic)
[11:41] <acesuares> yeah it was truncated now i see
[11:41] <RichEd> acesuares: Can we meet in 30 minutes ? I'll have your mail to you then, and we can discuss it live.
[11:41] <ogra> cbx33, i'll add the wallpapers etc after i come back so we have them in knot3 and can get feedback
[11:41] <acesuares> okay but it looks out window for this meeting 4/5 oct has passed... maybe in april...
[11:41] <ogra> ok, bbl ...
[11:42] <acesuares> dl where ?
[11:43] <acesuares> You can download the Edubuntu CD's from the following link: 
[11:43] <acesuares>  [WWW]  http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/
[11:43] <pygi> 5.10?!
[11:43] <pygi> isn't that wrong relaese acesuares ? :)
[11:44] <acesuares> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/DownloadEdubuntu check it out
[11:44] <acesuares> hi pygi dober dan
[11:44] <RichEd> acesuares: see private dialogue window ... some quick questions re conference
[11:44] <pygi> dobar dan acesuares :P
[11:45] <pygi> acesuares, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/edgy/knot-2/
[11:49] <acesuares> mayeb you can change the wiki ?
[11:49] <acesuares> and pygi, it's not knotr 3 ?
[11:49] <acesuares> ../topic says
[11:49] <acesuares> knot3 testing
[11:50] <pygi> acesuares, ok, then knot 3 :P
[11:50] <acesuares> no you right no knot3 dirt
[11:50] <acesuares> dirt=dir
[11:50] <pygi> heh :)
[11:50] <pygi> know 3 isnt out yet
[11:50] <acesuares> try /topic
[11:51] <acesuares> it goes to the wiki https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuKnot3LTSPTesting but from there no link to d/l
[11:51] <acesuares> brb
[11:54] <pygi> acesuares, daily cd, download it
[11:59] <cbx33> ogra: ok dude
[11:59] <cbx33> sorry was away fixing and I know you are aqway now too ;)
[12:09] <cbx33> RichEd: still up for meeting?
[12:10] <RichEd> cbx33: trying to confirm with will ... his connection keeps on dropping ...
[12:10] <RichEd> I'll phone him in a hour if he does not manage to get online and in here for more than a minute
[12:10] <cbx33> ok
[12:11] <RichEd> He needs to be part of the chat. He made some good contact with Chris Kenyon when he popped past London next week.
[12:11] <cbx33> ahh nice
[12:11] <cbx33> I'm planning to write my introduction email later today
[12:11] <RichEd> So Will will be driving.
[12:11] <cbx33> things have been super busy with SCP/pessulus and work here
[12:11] <RichEd> Good :) Charles is giving some good input.
[12:12] <RichEd> I'm going mad with planing stuff, to break the back of it by tomorrow so i can share properly at the meeting.
[12:12] <cbx33> excellent
[12:12] <RichEd> :LOOP
[12:12] <cbx33> I'm real sorry about the minutes
[12:12] <RichEd> incoming stuff, need process
[12:12] <cbx33> I'll get onto those.....
[12:12] <cbx33> been so busy coding havnt had time :(
[12:13] <acesuares> pygi: daily cd? downloading takes me about 14 hrs, so I need to be really sure... 
[12:14] <RichEd> if will is dodgy today, then tomorrow may be better for our 3-way ... so we will all have some clearer time & headspace.
[12:14] <acesuares> for all I know the daily cd changes *while* I am downloading...
[12:14] <cbx33> ok RichEd 
[12:14] <cbx33> RichEd: did you hear
[12:14] <cbx33> SCP got into main ;)
[12:14] <RichEd> well done cbx33 : onwards and upwards to the core gentlemen !
[12:15] <acesuares> Student Control Panel... ? = SCP ? good ! some more tools to make it easier !!!!
[12:16] <cbx33> acesuares: yup
[12:17] <pygi> acesuares, uh, 14 hours :-/
[12:18] <acesuares> good work! (haven't seen it yet, which downlaod for knot3 ? pygi says 'daily cd' but where ?
[12:18] <acesuares> 14 hrs when lucky
[12:18] <pygi> acesuares, cdimage.ubuntu.com
[12:18] <pygi> find it there :)
[12:18] <acesuares> 128kbit costs about 220 usd /mo
[12:18] <pygi> !!!!
[12:19] <pygi> thats even more expensive then here, a lot more expensive
[12:19] <pygi> and I thought here was expensive
[12:19] <acesuares> and then to think we are at a 9 terabit backbone or so :-((((
[12:19] <cbx33> acesuares: once you have downloaded one you can rsync the updates
[12:19] <cbx33> much quicker and smaller download
[12:19] <acesuares> cbx33: oh! thx !
[12:20] <cbx33> ogra: has a script
[12:20] <cbx33> I was creating a GUI for it
[12:20] <cbx33> I'm not sure if his script is up todate
[12:20] <cbx33> ask him when he returns
[12:21] <acesuares> I am gonna look at it tonight, so at earliest tomorrow morning (i am gmt - 4)
[12:21] <cbx33> ok cool
[12:21] <acesuares> but as I said by the time i have 20060912, 20060913 will be there :-) but then I can do the update so that's cool.
[12:21] <cbx33> yeh the updates are real quick
[12:22] <acesuares> cbx33: I am struggling (for some years now) with some unified ldap based interface to my webserver/emailserver etc
[12:22] <acesuares> http://www.qwido.net has some screenshotsw
[12:22] <acesuares> It's meant to be scalable etc
[12:22] <acesuares> I am trying to move over to ruby away from php
[12:23] <acesuares> but as I am not a full time coder it takes ages to change even the smallest thing
[12:23] <cbx33> ah nice
[12:23] <cbx33> yeh I've looked at ruby
[12:23] <cbx33> but I'm still rooted in php
[12:23] <cbx33> acesuares: tell me about it
[12:23] <acesuares> struggling with samba-ldap now for weeks (here an houir, there an hour)
[12:23] <cbx33> I took on the SCP spec because everyone else was busy
[12:23] <cbx33> I learnt so much
[12:23] <cbx33> but it did take me a while
[12:24] <acesuares> good... i figure... 
[12:24] <acesuares> the startup curce is always quite steep
[12:24] <acesuares> scarmbling around for the docs etc
[12:24] <cbx33> yup
[12:24] <cbx33> my problem was I was using some python API's that didn't have python docs
[12:24] <cbx33> they had C docs
[12:24] <acesuares> ruby seems easy though
[12:24] <cbx33> but were vastly different
[12:24] <acesuares> yakk!
[12:25] <cbx33> I saw a tutorial on it, ruby that is, but never tried it yet
[12:25] <cbx33> been tiooooo busy
[12:25] <acesuares> anyway, one of the side goals is to do some user management for ltsp accounts/samba but on some centralized way )over multiple servers)
[12:25] <acesuares> that replicate parts of the tree to the real servers so they vcan work even if the central server is down
[12:26] <acesuares> but this will take what, another year - if ever...
[12:26] <acesuares> I wish I had a sh*tload of $$$$
[12:26] <cbx33> heheh me too
[12:26] <cbx33> I'd quit work and work on edubuntu
[12:26] <acesuares> It seems you can get a 1 Mbit frame relay for under 1000 usd nowadays :-)
[12:28] <acesuares> brb (time to make breakfast)
[12:43] <RichEd> ping acesuares: You've got mail. Please open it and give me a pong response when you are ready to discuss.
[12:57] <TeePOG> morning all
[12:59] <pygi> hey
[12:59] <TeePOG> how does sound work on the ltsp?
[01:00] <TeePOG> is it forwarded to the thin client?
[01:53] <STORMCHAS3R> good morning all
[01:53] <STORMCHAS3R> If i install edubuntu on a workstation, how do I join and be able to authenticate on a windiws domain using active directory?
[02:10] <STORMCHAS3R>  If i install edubuntu on a workstation, how do I join and be able to authenticate on a windiws domain using active directory?
[02:20] <cbx33> ping RichEd 
[02:20] <RichEd> hi cbx33 ... wassup ?
[02:20] <cbx33> did you catch up with will
[02:20] <cbx33> also could Ihave a few minutes...really just a few in a pm?
[02:21] <RichEd> no not yet, yes for sure.
[02:24] <acesuares> RichEd: sent the message. Let me know if you want to know more.
[02:29] <RichEd> thanks acesuares : The quesions may have been a bit "trivial" given the amount of background you had already shared with me, as well as the excellent link from earlier today. It will however help a lot to have a "common request & response format" for each request, to enable lie-for-like comparison. Your responses will probably end up as the example set that others will look to for guidance.
[02:30] <RichEd> *like-for-like
[02:38] <STORMCHAS3R> how do i change the hostname in edubuntu?
[02:42] <STORMCHAS3R> can you guys please give me some insight on how to use the edubuntu server and get clients connecting to it"?
[02:43] <RichEd> STORMCHAS3R: hi there ... 
[02:43] <RichEd> have you read up in the help and the cookbook ?
[02:43] <STORMCHAS3R> RichEd, morn Rich
[02:43] <STORMCHAS3R> nope, 
[02:44] <STORMCHAS3R> cookbook nice
[02:44] <STORMCHAS3R> ill check it out, ty RichEd 
[02:44] <RichEd> the cookbook is a good place to start ... lemme get the link for you ... it's a whack of a PDF ... brb
[02:44] <STORMCHAS3R> kk
[02:44] <STORMCHAS3R> do you guy listen to podcasts?
[02:45] <pygi> RichEd, cookbook isnt pdf? :)
[02:45] <pygi> STORMCHAS3R, wiki.ubuntu.com/Chapters I think
[02:45] <STORMCHAS3R> ty
[02:45] <RichEd> http://www.edubuntu.org/GettingStarted
[02:45] <RichEd> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation
[02:46] <RichEd> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/EdubuntuCookbook
[02:47] <RichEd> pygi: I confused it with the tuXlabs cookbook which is PDF.
[02:47] <RichEd> STORMCHAS3R: the docs page is good bookmark
[02:47] <pygi> RichEd, ok, no worries :)
[02:47] <STORMCHAS3R> roger that, ty
[02:48] <RichEd> STORMCHAS3R: note that people are quite busy today ... there is usually more responsive guidance ... but the general population will expect you to have gone through at least GettingStarted :)
[02:48] <RichEd> Q1: what's the podcast question in reference to ?
[02:48] <STORMCHAS3R> RichEd, ty for the honesty
[02:49] <RichEd> Q2: what's your need for Edubuntu / circumstances etc.
[02:49] <STORMCHAS3R> I was on one in refernce to implementing linux in education.
[02:49] <RichEd> well we need to chat then ... move to window ->
[02:53] <pygi> RichEd, you are very attached to windows :)
[02:55] <RichEd> pygi #1 multi tasking ... need to keep track of threads ... 
[02:55] <RichEd> pygi #2 don't want to bore the people by saying Hi I'm the education programme manager over and over :)
[02:56] <RichEd> pygi #3 : please ensure you mean windows generic and not windows TM ;)
[03:41] <sbalneav> Morning all
[03:42] <pygi> hey sbalneav 
[03:43] <sbalneav> Morning pygi 
[04:17] <pips1> hullo
[04:17] <pips1> !seen RichEd
[04:17] <ubotu> I last saw RichEd (n=richard@dsl-165-222-126.telkomadsl.co.za) 4m 52s ago, quiting: Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)
[04:18] <pygi> pips1, he was searching for you :P
[04:20] <pips1> hi RichEd
[04:20] <pips1> looking for you too :-)
[04:20] <RichEd> hi ... damn adsl reset ...
[04:20] <RichEd> got phone call give me 10
[04:20] <pips1> oki
[04:21] <STORMCHAS3R> anyone know of a good program to create buisness cards?
[04:22] <pips1> ms powerpoint! (giggle)
[04:22] <STORMCHAS3R> lol, i meant in ubuntu
[04:23] <pips1> STORMCHAS3R: sorry no
[04:23] <STORMCHAS3R> ;)
[04:24] <STORMCHAS3R> ha, alittly ctrl+F action in Synaptic shows "glabels"  w00t
[04:25] <pips1> :)
[04:28] <RichEd> hi ... back ... my first radio interview ... small local station :)
[04:29] <highvoltage> RichEd: seriously your first one?
[04:29] <RichEd> pips1: busy going through your email response now - the matt & jono one
[04:29] <highvoltage> which station?
[04:29] <RichEd> Valley FM - Worcester & Breede Valley
[04:30] <highvoltage> are they going to send you a copy of the interview?
[04:30] <RichEd> highvoltage: My first one since 1996 when I locked myself in a room with only Internet connectivity for 88 days.
[04:30] <RichEd> :)
[04:30] <highvoltage> RichEd: aah, that's how Jane met you, right?
[04:30] <RichEd> highvoltage: I'll ask for it ... it was quite lightweight ... mostly a response to the IOL stories today
[04:31] <pips1> RichEd: ping me once you read the mail, but don't bother to reply yet... it's probably more efficient to make our skype call now.. is that possible?
[04:31] <RichEd> yep ... "I married a chic I met on the internet" <- how much more geekier can you get thatn that ?
[04:32] <pips1> :)
[04:32] <RichEd> highvoltage: Just scanned the mail you sent to Catherine Capers ... some quite provocative statements from her side :)
[04:33] <RichEd> especillay considering the people you CC'd across at k12
[04:33] <RichEd> pips ... have you got my skype details ?
[04:33] <highvoltage> RichEd: I think it's a he
[04:34] <pips1> RichEd: nope, and in fact, I haven't even installed skype on ubuntu partition yet!
[04:34] <highvoltage> he mailed before, I think ogra has learned to just ignore him :)
[04:34] <highvoltage> but somehow I always feel obliged to respond to people.
[04:34] <RichEd> A he called Catherine ? Well good luck to him then :)
[04:34] <highvoltage> RichEd: sometimes these people who make provocotive statements mean well, as hard as that is to believe :)
[04:34] <pips1> RichEd: either i reboot into m$ windows, or I install it... ahm, hold on
[04:35] <highvoltage> RichEd: I think Catherine is part of his surname
[04:35] <highvoltage> there was an explanation in one of the e-mails, but I lost it
[04:35] <RichEd> highvoltage: No, it's a good mail to have replied to and copied to me and the K12 people ... it puts the rat amongst the pigeons
[04:35] <RichEd> stir it up a bit
[04:36] <pips1> RichEd and highvoltage: stop talking about it, I'm almost exploding from curiosity by now ;-)
[04:36] <RichEd> Some of the commente re newbie install 7 docs & help are 100% spot on ... this is part of a debate between Matt, Jono, Philip and myself ...
[04:37] <RichEd> install & docs : not seven docs
[04:37] <highvoltage> :)
[04:38] <pips1> highvoltage: did your mail go to a public list?
[04:38] <RichEd> k12 merger is somewhere in the future, given the LTSP debian merge happening now, but if we can't please this sort of user, and show good support for a non-techncial person, then technical equivalence to K12 is not enough.
[04:39] <RichEd> So, in a funny way, that mail is bang on the head ... spot on problem focus !
[04:39] <RichEd> pips1: I'll mail it to you. Highvoltage mentioned you in the mail by name, so you're in the loop already.
[04:40] <pips1> ok
[04:41] <pips1> was skype dropped entirely?
[04:41] <RichEd> pips1:  let me know when you have skype ... or if it becomes a hassle, we can IRC
[04:41] <highvoltage> RichEd: do you ever tab-autocomplete nicks in your IRC client? It's just funny for me to see my nick with a capital H :)
[04:41] <RichEd> Mostly I autocomplete with a tab. Sometimes my fingers go ahead and autocomplete.
[04:42] <pips1> hehe
[04:42] <RichEd> depends on how many threads are running
[04:42] <pips1> you must be a fast typer then
[04:47] <pips1> RichEd: are you using skype on ubuntu at all?
[04:48] <RichEd> I use a steam powered Turing machine with a tin can and a bit of string.
[04:49] <RichEd> pips1: Yes. I have skype installed on Edubuntu.
[04:49] <pips1> you avoided a confession very well ;-)
[04:49] <pips1> oh
[04:49] <RichEd> Let me see where I found it.
[04:50] <RichEd> Next to my Edubuntu/Ubuntu/Kubuntu/WindowsXP quad boot machine, I have a MS Noebook, a MS Server and in my study I have a MS Tablet as my internet gateway.
[04:50] <pips1> woa
[04:50] <RichEd> I use Edubuntu for 95% of my work.
[04:50] <pips1> glad to hear it :-)
[04:51] <highvoltage> RichEd: too late
[04:51] <pips1> anyway, I start to suspect that I had installed skype with the binary installer provided by them
[04:52] <RichEd> ahhh highvoltage alert .... 
[04:52] <highvoltage> RichEd: I think pips1 were just testing whether you'd confess before we send the bigger probes (you don't want to know what we use them for)
[04:52] <pips1> LOL
[04:53] <pips1> highvoltage RichEd have you ever used ekiga VoIP?
[04:53] <highvoltage> I've been meaning to
[04:53] <RichEd> pips1: I remember a skype page on ubuntu telling why it is not part of main / universe becuse of the proprietary nature of the protocol even though the s/w if free
[04:54] <RichEd> s/w is free <- not if
[04:54] <highvoltage> I'd like to have a good alternative to Skype (not that I use Skype of course, I refuse to)
[04:54] <highvoltage> then I could just suggest that when people want to skype me
[04:55] <pips1> highvoltage: sometimes voice chat is just much more efficient than text chat... 
[04:56] <highvoltage> agreed
[04:56] <sbalneav> highvoltage: I've used ekiga several times, it seems to work.
[04:59] <RichEd> Either I am being doff, or the Skype profile settings page is doff. It does not show my skype name anywhere !
[04:59] <RichEd> I am about to search for myself in the available contacts to see what I called myself.
[05:06] <pips1> RichEd: if you get yourself a sip account, we can talk on ekiga... why not try it out now!?
[05:08] <bddebian> Heya
[05:09] <RichEd> hi bddebian 
[05:10] <bddebian> Hello RichEd
[05:10] <pips1> ack, I got a problem with my router. ekiga says it's symmetric NAT. ekiga wants Cone NAT for STUN support. It tells me to enable port forwarding. Aha, oho
[05:11] <pips1> So much for "it should just work" ;-)
[05:12] <RichEd> pips1: let me know if I must do the eiga thang ... and explain it please :) question posed in [pips1] 
[05:14] <pips1> RichEd: well, I just chose 'forward' all the way in the configuration wizard. but the audio test failed, i.e. I couldn't hear my recording. :-(
[05:16] <pips1> RichEd: sorry for the fuss, I'll reboot and try to call with skype, ok?
[05:16] <RichEd> okily dokily
[05:16] <pips1> cu
[06:17] <sbalneav> Morning ogra
[06:38] <Burgwork> morning sbalneav ogra 
[06:39] <sbalneav> Morning Burgwork 
[06:53] <TeePOG> a question: how do I make edubuntu not run a terminal server? I don't need 2 ltsp servers on the same network
[06:54] <Burgwork> TeePOG, if you are looking for a fat client, install the workstation
[07:28] <LaserJock> ogra: ltsp-server became a dep of edubuntu-desktop?
[07:29] <LaserJock> hmm, no
[07:31] <LaserJock> edubuntu-desktop depends on SCP, which depends on ltsp-server
[07:32] <TeePOG> actually Burgwork, i want a server, but without the ltsp... it's going to be a vmware server
[07:32] <TeePOG> and i'm not downloading another ISO, i have no time
[07:33] <LaserJock> well, I suppose you could remove ltsp after you install it
[07:33] <TeePOG> will the workstation installation not be able to function as a server?
[07:34] <TeePOG> that's what i'm actually doing
[07:35] <TeePOG> hmm
[07:35] <LaserJock> well, the packages all come from the same repo
[07:35] <TeePOG> sure
[07:35] <LaserJock> it's just a matter of how much you want and how much work you'll need to get things the way you want
[07:36] <LaserJock> "server" is a very vague term
[07:36] <TeePOG> and i'm using IS' repo anyway... it's directly upstream, since they're our ISP
[07:37] <cbx33> ping ogra
[07:37] <cbx33> hi LaserJock
[07:37] <LaserJock> hi cbx33 
[07:37] <TeePOG> hi cbx33
[07:37] <LaserJock> cbx33: what file on an .iso tells me the release, etc.
[07:38] <cbx33> umm
[07:39] <cbx33> u using gisomount ?
[07:39] <LaserJock> no
[07:39] <cbx33> heh
[07:39] <LaserJock> I just mounted the .iso
[07:39] <cbx33> that would tell you
[07:39] <cbx33> it's in
[07:39] <cbx33> hang on
[07:39] <LaserJock> diskdefines?
[07:39] <TeePOG> by the way, is there an equivalent to gisomount in kde?
[07:39] <LaserJock> not yet
[07:40] <cbx33> what root folders do you have
[07:40] <LaserJock> neither cbx33 nor I know pykde yet ;-)
[07:40] <cbx33> TeePOG there may be one one day ;)
[07:40] <TeePOG> thanks cbx33
[07:40] <LaserJock> pool, dists, install, no casper so I guess it's an alternate CD
[07:40] <cbx33> dists
[07:41] <TeePOG> if there's one *doze app i miss, it's Daemon Tools
[07:41] <cbx33> what's in there
[07:41] <cbx33> is there a file called disc?
[07:41] <ogra> RichEd, please ignore mails from "Catherine Capers" (yes its a male and has even managed to upset jammcq already)
[07:42] <LaserJock> oh sorry, I already found it cbx33
[07:42] <cbx33> ok np
[07:42] <ogra> cbx33, sorry i have to return the truck now ...
[07:42] <cbx33> ok np
[07:42] <cbx33> just gonna ask about the package
[07:42] <cbx33> ;)
[07:42] <ogra> will still tacke 1h or so 
[07:42] <cbx33> ok
[07:42] <cbx33> np
[07:42] <cbx33> ;#)
[07:42] <LaserJock> well, edubuntu-desktop now wants to install ltsp-server
[07:42] <ogra> LaserJock, thanks for pointing that out ... indeed ltsp-server should only be a suggests
[07:43] <cbx33> indeed
[07:43] <LaserJock> I mean, I certainly don't mind installing it which all that coding goodness ;-)
[07:43] <ogra> (i'd make it an recommends, but i'm not sure about the results nowadays that apt installs recommends by default :) )
[07:43] <LaserJock> but I wondered if it was intended behaviour
[07:43] <ogra> well, it wont do anything without ltsp-server installed ...
[07:44] <ogra> but it will indeed not stop working :)
[08:24] <TeePOG> is there no linux-image for k8?
[08:25] <Petaris> TeePOG: did you try kernel-image?
[08:26] <Petaris> hrm, I use the k8 amd64 image
[08:27] <TeePOG> that's weird... i searched for "linux-" and ony got up to k7
[08:27] <TeePOG> weird
[08:27] <Petaris> linux-image-amd64-k8 - Linux kernel image on AMD K8
[08:27] <TeePOG> ok, will try, brb
[08:30] <TeePOG> i don't have that in my list in synaptic, even tried apt-cache search
[08:35] <TeePOG> Petaris: i installed with the i386 install disc
[08:36] <TeePOG> erm
[08:36] <TeePOG> would you mind to pastebin your sources.list?
[08:37] <Petaris> TeePOG: What arch are you running?
[08:39] <Petaris> TeePOG: http://phpfi.com/151989
[08:39] <TeePOG> edubuntu 6.06.1, literally vanilla workstation install
[08:39] <Petaris> I meant your processors
[08:39] <TeePOG> oh
[08:39] <TeePOG> amd64 3200+
[08:39] <Petaris> k8 may be amd64 only
[08:40] <Petaris> ok, and your running the i386 arch on that
[08:40] <TeePOG> yah i know, got the 686-smp kernel on my p4D
[08:40] <Petaris> I bet the k8 is only if you use the amd64 kernel image
[08:40] <TeePOG> yes, i had no other ISO file and i figured i could apt-get the other kernel
[08:40] <Petaris> ahh, I'm not sure its that simple
[08:41] <Petaris> I don't think it will just show you the amd64 kernels
[08:41] <Petaris> you have to tweak things
[08:41] <TeePOG> damn it
[08:41] <TeePOG> ok
[08:41] <TeePOG> such as?
[08:41] <Petaris> I can't remember off hand
[08:41] <Petaris> they should know in #ubuntu-kernel though
[08:42] <TeePOG> thanks Petaris mate
[08:51] <Petaris> TeePOG: np
[08:53] <TeePOG> i'm going with the k7 kernel, not reinstalling AGAIN, time is of the essence
[08:59] <sbalneav> ogra: Still awake?
[08:59] <LaserJock> sbalneav: did you see the news about the next dev summit?
[09:00] <cbx33> hi guys
[09:00] <sbalneav> No, where is it?
[09:00] <LaserJock> Google HQ
[09:00] <cbx33> sbalneav ogra willbe back later
[09:00] <LaserJock> \o/
[09:00] <sbalneav> Man, how will we find it?
[09:01] <sbalneav> that's a, ah say, that's a JOKE son...
[09:01] <cbx33> guys I'm thinking of upgrading my pc - think a 3800 Dual Core, with an Asus A8N-SLI and 1Gb Corsair RAM would run vmware machines nicely
[09:03] <Burgwork> LaserJock, where is that announced?
[09:04] <Peaceful> Is there a HowTo somewhere for getting LTSP to work with edubuntu?
[09:04] <cbx33> Peaceful check the website, most of it should run OOTB
[09:04] <Peaceful> I just did an edubuntu install and then configured /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf...
[09:04] <Burgwork> edubuntu.org/GettingStarted
[09:04] <cbx33> http://www.edubuntu.org/GettingStarted
[09:05] <cbx33> Burgwork oooh snap
[09:05] <Peaceful> Burgwork: cbx33: I've been through that
[09:05] <cbx33> so what isn't working
[09:05] <Peaceful> I set a machine to network boot (PXE), it gets the ubuntu splash screen, then stops on:
[09:06] <Peaceful> nfs: server x.x.x.x not responding, still trying
[09:06] <cbx33> have you check the nfs service is running?
[09:06] <Peaceful> x.x.x.x is the server's IP address, of course.
[09:06] <Peaceful> cbx33: it appears to be
[09:06] <cbx33> have you tried mounting the nfs from another machine?
[09:06] <cbx33> is this edgy or dapper?
[09:06] <Peaceful> cbx33: no.  I've never used nfs.
[09:07] <Peaceful> cbx33: It's edubuntu 6.06.1
[09:07] <cbx33> ok
[09:07] <sbalneav> Is there a pastebin for this channel>
[09:07] <sbalneav> !pastebin
[09:07] <ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (you can always find it in the channel topic, among other useful things)
[09:07] <sbalneav> ah
[09:07] <cbx33> sbalneav take your pick ;)
[09:07] <sbalneav> Peaceful: Could you paste your /etc/exports file to the pastebin?
[09:07] <Peaceful> sbalneav: sure
[09:07] <cbx33> Burgwork / LaserJock what' the correct way to instruct people to restart a service
[09:07] <cbx33> heheh
[09:08] <cbx33> last time I told someone to do something in CLI and got told off
[09:08] <LaserJock> sbalneav: haha, good old Foghorn.
[09:08] <LaserJock> Burgwork: on fridge
[09:08] <cbx33> I kow the name
[09:08] <cbx33> but can't remember from where ;)
[09:09] <Peaceful> sbalneav: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/23241
[09:09] <Peaceful> That pastebin site is slow for me.  ubunt-nl -> netherlands?
[09:10] <sbalneav> Peaceful: Is your dhcpd server running?
[09:10] <sbalneav> ps -ef | grep dhcpd
[09:10] <Peaceful> sbalneav: yes
[09:10] <cbx33> it's getting the ip sbalneav
[09:10] <Peaceful> dhcpd     7851     1  0 12:51 ?        00:00:00 /usr/sbin/dhcpd3 -q -pf /var/run/dhcp3-server/dhcpd.pid -cf /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
[09:11] <cbx33> is nfs running
[09:11] <cbx33> ps aux | grep nfs
[09:11] <Peaceful> ya, lots of nfsd lines
[09:11] <sbalneav> Maybe the mountd's mucked.  do an invoke-rc.d nfs-kernel-server restart
[09:12] <sbalneav> Lets see if that works
[09:12] <Peaceful> nfsd processes: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/23242
[09:13] <Peaceful> nfs restart:  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/23243
[09:13] <cbx33> try rebootign the client
[09:13] <Peaceful> ok, rebooting...
[09:14] <Peaceful> didn't respond to 3-finger salute.  Had to hard-reset.
[09:14] <Peaceful> splash screen...
[09:14] <cbx33> did it get further?
[09:14] <Peaceful> dropped to text
[09:15] <cbx33> for the login?
[09:15] <cbx33> or for n error?
[09:15] <Peaceful> hasn't got to the same spot yet...
[09:15] <cbx33> ah
[09:15] <Peaceful> it paused on the "IP-Config: eth0 ..." line for a couple of minutes last time, looks like it's taking the same amount of time this time as well
[09:15] <cbx33> hmm
[09:16] <cbx33> sounds odd
[09:16] <sbalneav> It's having trouble with the dhcp
[09:16] <cbx33> yeh seems like it
[09:16] <sbalneav> Can you paste your dhcpd.conf file to the pastebin?
[09:16] <cbx33> Peaceful care to paste your hdcp conf
[09:16] <cbx33> sbalneav hehe
[09:16] <sbalneav> :)
[09:16] <sbalneav> Great minds think alike.
[09:17] <sbalneav> Fools seldom differ.
[09:17] <cbx33> heh
[09:17] <cbx33> indeed
[09:17] <Peaceful> dhcp conf: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/23245
[09:17] <Peaceful> ^- that's /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
[09:18] <Peaceful> now it's to "WARNING: /var/cache/man does not exist"  (it did that last time too)
[09:18] <Peaceful> and there it is:   "nfs: server 10.1.2.58 not responding, still trying"
[09:19] <sbalneav> Is that the IP address of the server?
[09:19] <Peaceful> yep
[09:19] <sbalneav> OK, so it's got the right server.  Any chance you could have some faulty networking hardware?  Something that's dropping UDP packets?
[09:20] <sbalneav> Is this connected to a switch or a hub?
[09:20] <Peaceful> Switch
[09:20] <Peaceful> shouldn't be
[09:20] <sbalneav> Managed or Unmanaged
[09:20] <Peaceful> one of each
[09:20] <Peaceful> two switches between the machines, actually
[09:20] <Peaceful> the managed ones don't have any "features" turned on, though
[09:21] <Peaceful> s/ones/one/
[09:21] <sbalneav> Hmm
[09:21] <sbalneav> On the server, check the dmesg command.
[09:21] <Peaceful> nmap shows nfs open on 2049
[09:21] <sbalneav> See if you're getting any "Too much work on eth0" or equivalent messages.
[09:22] <Peaceful> sbalneav: nope, just the messages from nfsd and a RPC failure to cantact portmap
[09:22] <Peaceful> I'll pastbin it...
[09:22] <sbalneav> ah ha!
[09:23] <Peaceful> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/23248
[09:23] <Peaceful> I put the nmap scan in that pastebin too
[09:24] <sbalneav> Hmm
[09:24] <sbalneav> OK, lets restart portmap, if it's borked, then mountd isn't gonna work.
[09:24] <Peaceful> alrighty.
[09:24] <Peaceful> /etc/init.d/portmap restart    ?
[09:25] <sbalneav> invoke-rc.d portmap restart && invoke-rc.d nfs-kernel-server restart
[09:25] <Peaceful> ah, ok
[09:25] <sbalneav> then reboot client and cross fingers :)
[09:25] <Peaceful> ok, rebooting
[09:26] <Peaceful> splash...
[09:26] <Peaceful> IP-Config: ...
[09:27] <Peaceful> the "RPC: failed to contact portmap (errno -5)." line showed up in dmesg again
[09:27] <Peaceful> client is warning about absence of /var/cache/man again...
[09:28] <sbalneav> I know this is a stupid question, but there's not a firewall on this server, is there?
[09:28] <Peaceful> nope
[09:28] <sbalneav> heh.
[09:28] <Peaceful> I checked iptables myself, it's empty
[09:28] <Peaceful> and we don't have any hardware firewalls at all
[09:28] <sbalneav> dpkg -l | grep nfs
[09:28] <Peaceful> on the LAN at least
[09:29] <sbalneav> got both nfs-common and nfs-kernel-server?
[09:29] <Peaceful> dpkg output: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/23250
[09:29] <Peaceful> yes
[09:29] <sbalneav> showmount -e shows /opt/ltsp?
[09:29] <Peaceful> It's a clean, default install of edubuntu 6.06.1
[09:30] <Peaceful> shows "/opt/ltsp *"
[09:30] <Peaceful> the client hit the same "nfs: ..." error
[09:30] <sbalneav> Since it gets the kernel, and KNOWS where it's supposed to get the nfs from, and does appear to be actually TRYING to nfs mount, Im leaning towards thinking the config's ok.
[09:30] <Peaceful> sounds reasonable
[09:31] <Peaceful> so...is there something I need to configure with nfs?
[09:31] <sbalneav> So, here's the next question: any chance we can get both the server AND the client on the same switch?  I'm assuming one's on one, and the other's on the other.
[09:31] <Peaceful> ya, sure, I could go stick the client on the same dumb switch in the noisy server room
[09:31] <sbalneav> I'm thinking we're dropping udp packets somehow.
[09:32] <Peaceful> wouldn't it be simpler to tcpdump udp packets on the server?
[09:32] <sbalneav> Maybe, if you feel comfortable trying that, have a look.
[09:33] <Peaceful> There's a whole bunch of udp traffic that it sees, but it all looks like broadcast stuff
[09:33] <Peaceful> oh, there the servers sending out udp stuff
[09:33] <Peaceful> to an IP address in the dhcp range
[09:34] <Peaceful> no incoming except for broadcast, though
[09:34] <sbalneav> Hmmm
[09:34] <sbalneav> Something's amiss there.
[09:34] <Peaceful> I'll go stick it on the same switch, to rule that out.
[09:34] <Peaceful> brb
[09:34] <sbalneav> k
[09:39] <Peaceful> ok, I OFFICIALLY hate Cisco now.  Before it was unofficial.
[09:39] <Peaceful> That was IT!
[09:39] <Peaceful> on the same switch, it works just fine.
[09:39] <Peaceful> thanks, guys
[09:39] <Peaceful> I'll go poke around the switches and see if I can't...punish them...somehow
[09:41] <sbalneav> heh
[09:41] <sbalneav> Glad we could help
[09:42] <sbalneav> Cisco equipment is.... idiosyncratic. :)
[09:42] <sbalneav> That's about as generous as I can be :)
[09:45] <Peaceful> ya, no kidding.  Why the heck is a SWITCH dropping UDP traffic??  I want all my switches to be SWITCHES!
[09:50] <Petaris> later all
[10:04] <Peaceful> I can't find a single setting that looks like it would affect udp traffic
[10:04] <Burgwork> Peaceful, might there be a switch to control broadcast traffic?
[10:07] <Peaceful> Burgwork: I don't understand what you're asking
[10:07] <Peaceful> Hmm...here's a setting:
[10:08] <Peaceful> 802.1x->Interface Settings->FastEthernet0/1->Multiple Clients->Disabled
[10:08] <Peaceful> Maybe that interferes with other switches that are connected to the big cisco switch?
[10:11] <TeePOG> this might bethe wrong place to ask, but does Gnome have the equivalent of the KDE YaKuake Quake-style drop-down console? It's my favourite part of KDE
[10:12] <Burgwork> TeePOG, yes, it does, but the name is escaping me right now
[10:12] <TeePOG> nm Burgwork, will search in synaptic
[10:12] <TeePOG> i just cannot be bothered installing KDE on a server whose sole purpose is a VMWare server
[10:13] <Peaceful> hmm, nope, that wasn't the setting.  That's only for authentication stuff, and my authentication stuff is off anyway
[10:29] <cbx33> ogra you alive yet?
[10:32] <cbx33> brb 1.5 hours
[10:38] <ogra> sbalneav, pong
[10:44] <LaserJock> ogra: I don't suppose you've had a chance to look at edubuntu-menus
[10:44] <ogra> not yet, i'll do it tomorrow if the CD isnt totally broken ...
[10:44] <ogra> sorry for that ...
[10:44] <LaserJock> oh yeah, Knot 3
[10:45] <ogra> hmm, cbx33 didnt apply for motu ...
[10:45] <rodarvus> he'll have to wait a few weeks more, I guess :/
[10:46] <ogra> now that he didnt apply he will, yes
[10:46] <rodarvus> (since they are almost done with the TB meeting)
[10:46] <ogra> yep
[10:46] <ogra> i see it
[11:13] <Burgwork> ogra, he went out, maybe he didn't know about it
[11:13] <ogra> well, i asked him to apply for motu :)
[11:13] <ogra> but i guess he was too busy ... he did so much edubuntu work the last weeks
[11:14] <ogra> i guess he spent every spare minute he had for us ...
[11:19] <LaserJock> I'm afraid I might have scared him off a bit too
[11:19] <LaserJock> :/
[11:20] <Burgwork> no, I think he is in the for the long haul
[11:20] <Burgwork> ogra, did you catch ivoks, myself and somebody else talking about public computing in -devel?
[11:20] <LaserJock> I mean, he asked me about it
[11:21] <LaserJock> and I suggested he hang around -motu a bit more
[11:21] <LaserJock> to get know to the team, etc.
[11:21] <ogra> Burgwork, i was very busy with RL half of the day 
[11:21] <ogra> so no, i didnt
[11:24] <pygi> LaserJock, you familiar with autotools perhaps?
[11:25] <LaserJock> pygi: probably not more than you
[11:26] <pygi> LaserJock, oki then, thanks anyway :)
[11:27] <Burgwork> ogra, basically we figured out how to do desktop cleanup very easily
[11:27] <LaserJock> oh man, gcompris source is huge
[11:27] <ogra> LaserJock, yeah ... no fun to upload a new upstream version ...
[11:28] <bddebian> Yep :-)
[11:28] <Burgwork> gcompris 8 is almost out, too
[11:28] <LaserJock> I was just going to look at this python dep bug
[11:28] <ogra> Burgwork, to edgy for us :)
[11:28] <Burgwork> too edgy?
[11:29] <ogra> it can go into edgy+1 
[11:29] <Burgwork> yep
[11:29] <LaserJock> I tried gcompris out on my niece not too long ago
[11:29] <LaserJock> but she was a little young
[11:29] <ogra> to edgy == to near to the bleeding edge ;)
[11:29] <Burgwork> that would be "too", not "to"
[11:29] <LaserJock> details
[11:30] <ogra> right
[11:30] <ogra> ok, off for knot testing ... bbl
[11:30] <Burgwork> oh, bugger
[11:30] <Burgwork> I needed him
[11:31] <LaserJock> me too
[11:31] <LaserJock> must be terrible being that popular ;-)
[11:32] <TeePOG> guys, having a problem... i installed compiz, enabled it... and suddenly all my programs are attached to the menubar at the top, over the gnome bar!
[11:47] <Burgwork> TeePOG, welcome to why we don't use compiz...
[11:47] <TeePOG> hmm... yet some people love it
[11:47] <TeePOG> is there a way to repair the damage?
[11:48] <Burgwork> switch back to metacity?
[11:48] <TeePOG> erm... more information if you please?
[11:48] <TeePOG> sorry, i normally use kde, gnome is a mystery to me
[11:48] <Burgwork> compiz replaces metacity, the default gnome window manager
[11:49] <Burgwork> or it replaces kwin
[11:49] <TeePOG> ah ok...
[11:49] <TeePOG> do i edit some file?
[11:52] <ogra> hrm ... i should probably read the channel backlogs before running blindly into broken CDs ...
[12:05] <TeePOG> where do i tell gnome to use metacity again?