[12:19] Riddell: it looks like I can't connect sftp://bazaar.launchpad.net [12:19] Permission denied (publickey). [12:20] Riddell: I used id "tonio" as it is supposed to be this one, am I missing something ? [12:26] Tonio_: have you uploaded your public ssh key to launchpad? === Riddell beds [12:26] Riddell: bah, I think so yes.... [12:26] Riddell: I couldn't dput to ubuntu without this...... [12:27] Riddell: We'll see this tomorrow :) [12:27] Tonio_: that's gpg [12:27] they're different [12:27] Riddell: ah... here is the problem then... will do that and finish to read the wiki [12:28] Riddell: good ight [12:28] +n [12:28] Tonio_: yes, it depends on unrar-nonfree [12:29] ryanakca_: I changed this to unrar-free and suggested only unrar-nonfree [12:29] ryanakca_: we don't that to go in multiverse right ? [12:29] ok, well, as long as it has some form of 'unrar'... [12:31] is anyone running edgy with nvidia-glx (one in repos) working in the -10-generic kernel? === gnomefreak [n=gnomefre@ubuntu/member/gnomefreak] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Ingmar^ [n=ingmar@108.38-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Riddell [i=jr@muse.19inch.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Parkotron [n=parker@dyn129-100-97-133.bc.uwo.ca] has joined #kubuntu-devel [01:10] mhb: hey, what's the feedback about that kubuntu testers group? [01:11] ryanakca_: It's already been formed and has an LP page [01:11] good === Riddell [i=jr@muse.19inch.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === goldenear [n=goldenea@vol75-4-82-225-33-186.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === pberger [n=ingbert@dslb-084-056-058-044.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === pberger [n=ingbert@dslb-084-056-058-044.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === jjesse [i=user@69-87-142-101.async.iserv.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [02:04] Riddell: pong [02:15] hmm anyone alive here? [02:15] :) [02:17] "I'm getting better.." === Huahua [n=hua_@122.0.231.102] has joined #kubuntu-devel === pberger [n=ingbert@dslb-084-056-058-044.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === oofus [n=chris@oofus.demon.co.uk] has joined #kubuntu-devel === jjesse [i=user@69-87-142-101.async.iserv.net] has left #kubuntu-devel [] === ash211 [n=andrew@user-11fata0.dsl.mindspring.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel === pberger [n=ingbert@dslb-084-056-058-044.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #kubuntu-devel ["Konversation] === ryanakca [n=ryan@unaffiliated/ryanakca] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === jdong_ [n=jdong@d192-24-235-141.try.wideopenwest.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde_ [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde__ [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === DaSkreech [n=skreech@port0002-abm-adsl.cwjamaica.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde__ [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde__ [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde__ [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === jdong_ [n=jdong@d192-24-235-141.try.wideopenwest.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel === freeflying [n=freeflyi@ubuntu/member/freeflying] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === ash211 [n=andrew@user-1121h77.dsl.mindspring.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Hobbsee [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Huahua [n=hua_@122.0.231.102] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:13] Hey Hobbsee [05:13] hey DaSkreech [05:13] What's up? [05:13] Hung up the Stick yet? [05:14] i've discovered that my uni exam timetable is pretty horrible === ash211 [n=andrew@user-1121a7c.dsl.mindspring.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Hobbsee_ [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Ubug2 [n=bugbot@ubuntu/bot/ubugtu] has joined #kubuntu-devel === ubotu [n=ubotu@ubuntu/bot/ubotu] has joined #kubuntu-devel === ajmitch [n=ajmitch@ubuntu/member/ajmitch] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:58] ... === abattoir [n=abattoir@cm61.omega22.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #kubuntu-devel === nixternal [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/nixternal] has joined #kubuntu-devel === ash211 [n=andrew@user-1121a7c.dsl.mindspring.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:26] eh? [06:27] hmm [06:30] ... === claydoh [n=clay@216-220-245-202.midmaine.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:30] *** qt_plugins_3.3rc (Y/I/N/O/D/Z) [default=N] ? [06:30] go with the default i take it? [06:30] thats the first i can remember seeing that during and upgrade [06:33] Yes Ignore No Oops Default ZapSystem? [06:33] who knows, i went with the default though [06:34] this is twice in a week we had tornadoes and junk again [06:34] it is almost fall here and we are getting the worst storms of the year [06:34] nixternal: I'm waiting snow [06:35] ooh i can't wait for snow [06:35] =) [06:35] Informer! [06:35] i need to get the snowboard out of the shed and get ready for the powder [06:35] I hope we get more snow than just ~50 cm this year [06:36] hum [06:36] heya nixternal [06:36] wasabi homey [06:36] nadda [06:36] power comes back on and i faced with updates ;) [06:37] man, hear comes some more thunder [06:37] hoked up my mouse and junk to the lappy to make my "stay" a little better ;) [06:37] hehe [06:37] did some mythtv junk [06:37] hrm whatelse [06:37] oh a acidrip fix for jdong [06:37] heh [06:37] in other words bored [06:38] hi all [06:38] heya zphou [06:38] zphou, why the new nick ? [06:38] ;) [06:38] imbrandon: this morning :) [06:38] ahh [06:39] imbrandon: too many nick like mine, so I changed :) [06:39] ahh yea [06:40] imbrandon: have u tried beryl on your ppc? [06:40] zphou, not yet, i was thinking about it [06:41] but i dont have aiglx setup atm [06:41] imbrandon: I've built them, do you need them [06:41] debs ? [06:41] I can not use tookhem on my poor ib [06:41] imbrandon: ya [06:41] heh, didn't know that was freeflying in disguise [06:42] nixternal, i reconised it becouse oh his real name is close to the nice [06:42] nick* [06:42] zphou, sure [06:42] brb, reboot..but you won't notice since i rock bip! ;) [06:42] nixternal: :) [06:43] imbrandon: upload to your server? === serzholino [n=serzholi@16x.zp.ua] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:44] zphou, yea thats fine [06:46] imbrandon: but the passwd and accound are on the desktop in my office, and now I'm on my vacation :) [06:47] ahh [06:48] better [06:48] zphou, i dont know your password heh, but anywhere is fine [06:48] how big are they ? [06:49] imbrandon: not too big :) [06:49] heh you can email them then [06:49] imbrandon@k.o [06:52] imbrandon: i upload to http://www.ubuntu-zh.org/~freeflying/beryl-deb/ [06:52] imbrandon: just a moment [06:52] kk === Hobbsee [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:55] imbrandon: done [06:59] nice , ok i'll grab it here in a bit [07:03] tonio ping [07:03] err no tonio [07:03] ;( [07:07] don't mess with the wiki at all, it is garbage and will cause you to loose all of your work [07:07] like the UWN issue 16 went from almost done to gone [07:08] heya [07:08] hiya Hobbsee! [07:08] Hobbsee: hey [07:08] :) [07:10] Hey Hobbsee :) [07:11] Your Uni is forcing you to get up in the morning? [07:11] :) [07:11] if i want to be at class, yes. [07:11] i hate hplip [07:11] Pfft class is overrated [07:11] yeah, well... [07:20] :-) [07:23] Hobbsee: universe freeze now? [07:24] zphou: yep === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:38] Good night all [07:40] night DaSkreech [07:40] hey raphink [07:40] hi Hobbsee [08:18] raphink: hi [08:18] imbrandon: how about beryl on your ppc? :) === Lure [n=lure@ubuntu/member/lure] has joined #kubuntu-devel [08:33] hi zphou [08:49] bug 61331 [08:49] Malone bug 61331 in xorg "[edgy] extremely bold ttf fonts in kubuntu (edgy)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] http://launchpad.net/bugs/61331 [08:49] huh? [09:02] nixternal: by installing msttcorefonts, i expect [09:04] nope [09:04] Tahoma isn't in there [09:05] i made that a "needs more info bud" ;p) [09:05] ah === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Seveas [n=seveas@ubuntu/member/seveas] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === pascalFR [i=9q5B0cBR@cha92-7-82-230-174-61.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Tonio__ [n=tonio@94.8.100-84.rev.gaoland.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [09:54] hi [09:54] hey Tonio__ :) === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Ingmar^ [n=ingmar@108.38-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel === marseillai_ [n=mars_@AMarseille-256-1-104-212.w90-10.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #kubuntu-devel [10:52] Riddell: ping ? [10:56] Tonio_, ping [10:56] imbrandon: hi ! [10:56] Tonio_, sorry i dident get your query last night in time, but no i havent heard from canonical yet [10:56] i was kinda wondering what was up myself [10:57] have you ? i guess not or you wouldent be asking me hehe [11:03] imbrandon: oups, okay I have your response :) [11:04] Tonio_, maybe today ? dunno [11:04] imbrandon: I don't know [11:04] Tonio_, i dont even know whom to ask about it [11:05] lol [11:05] i would imagine they just got busy though [11:05] yeah [11:05] imbrandon: pv [11:06] has anyone seen this: [11:06] apt-get: error while loading shared libraries: /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6: invalid ELF header [11:07] wow , nope [11:07] seaLne, ^ [11:08] this is on a machine that hadn't been updated for about a week, dist-upgrade failed and now that === abattoir [n=abattoir@cm61.omega22.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Hobbsee [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Hobbsee_ [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #kubuntu-devel [11:52] Tonio_: hi [11:55] Riddell: hey :) [11:55] Riddell: yesterday you told me to : [11:55] 1/ update the seeds -> done [11:55] 2/ update kubuntu-meta -> doesn't work [11:56] 3/ contact elite person to promote the packages to main [11:56] Riddell: shouldn't I invert 2/ and 3/ ? ;) [11:56] Riddell: looks like I need the packages in main to update the metapackage [11:57] Tonio_: mm, yes [11:57] Riddell: okay I'm preparing the mail for the elite guys [11:58] just ping on irc is the usual way [12:02] Riddell: ah okay, will do then [12:09] moins Riddell [12:12] Riddell: keybuk will do that today, and then I'll update kubuntu-meta [12:12] groovy [12:13] it makes sense how the seeds are managed now... I spent half of the night looking at this [12:13] Riddell: ho and you were right concerning my ssh keys :) [12:14] Tonio_: putting sftp://bazaar.launchpad.net/ into konqueror is interesting [12:15] Riddell: yes, I've done that and checked the structure... [12:15] Riddell: I don't understand everything of course, but it globally makes sense [12:22] Riddell: I'll improve mimetypes integration concerning video formats today [12:23] kaffeine misses a few of them === Ingmar^ [n=ingmar@vpna143.ugent.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel [12:23] the point is do I patch kaffeine.desktop, or should I do that in kds..... I'm unsure at the moment [12:24] Tonio_: if the new mimetypes are useful to anything but kaffeine they should go into kdelibs [12:24] Tonio_: talk to danimo, he said something about new mimetypes recently [12:24] Riddell: no it is only kaffeine [12:24] there are a few video formats that kaffeine recognizes but that aren't associated to kaffeine currently [12:25] I'll probably patch kaffeine.Desktop [12:25] then kaffeine is the package to patch [12:25] kmplayer has them but not kaffeine, which is a nonsense since they use the same engine :) [12:25] Riddell: okay, will do that way then [12:25] right === mbiebl [n=michael@dslb-084-056-217-058.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [12:26] Riddell: ho and I saw your comment on kmplayer, sorry for the "s/ship/shit" hehe :) [12:27] it was late :) [12:27] t and p are quite far apart on my keyboard :) [12:27] heh [12:27] Riddell: on mine too, that's the problem hehe :) [12:28] imbrandon: see bugs 62554 [12:28] Malone bug 62554 in kmplayer "0.9.2a -> 0.9.3 UVF Exception Request" [Undecided,Fix released] http://launchpad.net/bugs/62554 [12:28] Tonio_, well if kmplayer and kaffeine both use them would it not be better to put in kdelibs for both ? just asking as i dont deal with those packages much at all === imbrandon looks [12:29] imbrandon: kdelibs has the mimetypes, but I need to change kaffeine to be associated to them, here is the point [12:29] ahhh ok === imbrandon misunderstood [12:33] Tonio_, hahaha @ the bug boo boo [12:34] imbrandon: as I said, it was *very* late ;) [12:34] hehe yea ;) [12:35] but yes, I've been 0wn3d, as young people would way :) [12:35] ;) === oofus [n=chris@oofus.demon.co.uk] has joined #kubuntu-devel [12:35] Riddell, p0wnd j00 [12:35] lol [12:36] s/way/say [12:36] rahhhhhhhhhh [12:36] those keys are closed this time :) [12:36] hehe [12:38] hum, I read yesterday that kde 3.5.6 might use beryl or an improved kwin with effects.... [12:38] that's cool news, since it would be a pain to wait for kde4 to do the same than metacity already has [12:40] cool [12:41] beryl? [12:41] Tonio_, zphou made some ( ppc only ) beryl packages i was looking into trying sometime today [12:41] Riddell, compiz fork [12:41] sounds gtkish [12:42] but beryl works with kde better afaik [12:42] than plain compiz [12:42] Riddell: beryl is a fork of compiz, to remove gconf deps etc....... [12:42] but i dont have alot of experince with eithert other than just playing with them [12:43] Riddell: beryl should be independant from gtk stuff, that's why certain kde guys suggest to consider this waiting for a new kwin [12:44] imbrandon: I wanted to test, but there are no beryl + aiglx packages for edgy at the moment [12:44] imbrandon: only xgl, and I don't want xgl on my laptop :) [12:45] Riddell: in case you're interested : http://wiki.beryl-project.org/index.php/Install/Ubuntu [12:45] Tonio_, no aiglx ? [12:45] imbrandon: nope [12:45] ahh yea the aiglx page is empty [12:45] works for dapper but no packages for edgy...... [12:46] shouldent be hard to adapt then [12:46] i wouldent imagine [12:46] Riddell: talking about that do you actually know why aiglx isn't in ubuntu ? I though it was one of the main goals of edgy...... [12:46] Tonio_, it is afaik [12:47] Tonio_, xorg 7.1 has aiglx by default afaik [12:47] imbrandon: then why do we have to install another X from compiz repos to use it ? [12:47] ummm we dont compiz and everything is in edgy [12:48] ajmitch did alot of work in that area not long ago with quin [12:48] beryl is just a themable compiz without the gconf dependency [12:48] Riddell, basicly === goldenear [n=goldenea@vol75-4-82-225-33-186.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [12:50] Tonio_, http://www.ubuntu-zh.org/~freeflying/beryl-deb/ you might ask zphou for the /debian [12:50] if you wanna build for non-ppc [12:50] ( those are for edgy ) [12:51] Tonio_: because most people can't use it with free drivers [12:51] Riddell: yeah, because of nvidia, once again.......; [12:52] yea nvidia free driver dosent work with it ;( [12:52] imbrandon: it should change in the near future [12:53] imbrandon: hm? [12:53] ajmitch, talking about third party repos shouldent be needed for compiz in edgy [12:53] ( not beryl ) [12:54] hum works pretty well :) [12:54] imbrandon: oh right [12:54] imbrandon: I just installed beryl from the dapper repo, and it works like a charm :) [12:54] people will still use them [12:55] yea something about new crack but since quins broke my install i'm leary about repos i dont trust ;) [12:55] well the issue is still that we really miss kwin then.... I'll still wait I think :) [12:56] Tonio_, yea with kwin it will be nicer for kde but it will be a while i'm thinking [12:56] kde 3.5.6 or kde 4 [12:56] I read 3.5.6 [12:58] Tonio_, rember the link? [12:58] imbrandon: it was a french kde developper on a french forum :) [12:58] imbrandon: don't think that would help you a lot :) [12:59] ahh ok [12:59] i was thinking it was on a ML or dot [01:01] I think I'd remember if I'd published a story like that on the dot :) [01:02] heheh true [01:02] Riddell, you run dot ? [01:02] hehe [01:02] yes [01:02] oh wow , i dident know that [01:05] hum, even yakuake works :) [01:06] I'm impressed ;) [01:06] you just used the dapper debs ? [01:06] no rebuild ? cool === serzholino [n=serzholi@16x.zp.ua] has left #kubuntu-devel [] === andre^off [i=bnc@62.75.169.150] has joined #kubuntu-devel [01:30] Tonio_: I'm removing your kubuntu_54_mouse_scroll_speed.diff from kde 3.5.5 [01:30] Riddell: we have 3.5.5 now? [01:31] I do [01:31] nice :) [01:31] Riddell: so you're in need of testers, i take it? [01:31] Riddell, is it tagged yet ? or early stuff === imbrandon needed a reason to rid the lappy of gnome ;) [01:31] I assume it's tagged since there are tars [01:31] 2.5.5 going in edgy ? [01:31] err s/2/3 [01:32] Hobbsee: not yet, I've only compiled arts [01:32] Riddell: ahh okay [01:32] imbrandon: I've no idea [01:32] may as well. saves us supporting 2 versions. [01:32] Riddell, cool , man i wish i had my fast box to help [01:32] grr === imbrandon looks at a xine-lib patch [01:33] imbrandon: trying to build the world? [01:34] Riddell: is there any reason you removed it ? [01:34] Riddell: I though the patch had gone to the svn no ? [01:35] heh ajmitch nah just to fix *.shn files in amarok [01:35] ajmitch, but yea lots of things depend on xine-lib soooo === imbrandon contemplates it [01:35] Tonio_: it doesn't apply, there's been a change to that file but I'm not sure if it's the same as your patch [01:35] imbrandon: you could use my box if you could stand the lack of bandwidth [01:36] ajmitch, that would be rockin [01:36] imbrandon: what do you need? [01:37] I found that only 1 of the 2 power supply fans has stopped [01:37] just pbuilder really [01:37] ahh nice [01:37] well kinda nice [01:37] heh [01:37] better than none [01:37] so it still has some airflow [01:38] ;) [01:38] plus there are a bunch of other fans in the case which I haven't hooked up but still can === ajmitch is just digging to get the cables out now [01:46] Riddell: remove the patch, I'll have a look later.... but toma confirmed me that the patch had been merged in svn [01:48] Tonio_: ok, so that'll be why it doesn't apply :) [01:52] Riddell: What's the status of the meeting minutes? [01:53] nevermind, I see they're published. [01:53] Thanks! === jita [n=tejinder@unaffiliated/jita] has joined #kubuntu-devel [01:56] how much time it takes to boot the system completely? [01:57] sebas: planning any sort of publicity for it? [01:57] jita: that depends on 50 different things [01:58] its takes too much time on my machine amd athlon 2.0 with 512MB ram [01:58] around 1 min 20 secs [01:59] is it normal? [02:01] jita, yea a minute and a half is about right [02:02] and whats the proper way of disabling the services i dont need from the boot? [02:08] jita, more approperate for a support channel but afaik you can install "bum" ( boot up manager ) and do it from there [02:08] or just do it the "debian" way of thinking and uninstall what you dont need [02:10] Tonio_: hmm, kubuntu_75_kicker_taskbar_resize.diff also doesn't apply [02:10] in kdebase === mbiebl [n=michael@dslb-088-064-163-041.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [02:15] was that the one to make it 48px by default? with 3.5.5 we could probably reengerre that OR set it in k-d-s [02:16] imbrandon: yeah, i twould have been [02:17] how do i disable some partitions frm auto mounting from boot? [02:18] edit /etc/fstab and add the option "noauto" , again more suited to a support channel like #kubuntu [02:19] ;) [02:21] could anyone please look at this bug? https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/mesa-utils/+bug/63461 [02:21] Malone bug 63461 in mesa-utils "Xlib: extension "GLX" missing on display ":0.0"" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] === bddebian [n=bdefrees@71.224.172.103] has joined #kubuntu-devel [02:38] Howdy [02:38] heya bddebian [02:38] Hi imbrandon === Czessi [n=Czessi@dslb-088-073-033-228.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [02:53] hello everyone [02:53] moins mhb [02:54] Riddell, how are simes patches holding up in 3.5.5 ? === el [n=konversa@port-83-236-238-37.static.qsc.de] has joined #kubuntu-devel [03:03] imbrandon: fine, just one indentatio change needed === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel [03:03] indentation [03:05] sweet === froud [n=froud@dsl-145-39-98.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #kubuntu-devel [03:24] is there a testing repo for 3.5.5 yet? [03:26] Riddell: kubuntu_75_kicker_taskbar_resize.diff is not from me [03:28] Riddell: you added it to close kde bug 128552 [03:28] KDE bug 128552 in taskbarapplet "REGRESSION: "Length" has no effect if External TaskBar is at the side of the screen" [Normal,Resolved: fixed] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=128552 [03:32] Tonio_: oh, oops :) [03:32] Tonio_: ok, guess that's been fixed upstream then [03:32] Riddell: hehe :) [03:32] Riddell: probably yes [03:33] that'll be digikam in main then [03:33] yup [03:33] Riddell: yes, I'm just waiting for the information to refresh on the repos and I'll upgrade kubuntu-desktop [03:33] Riddell: thanks for letting me do, that helps to learn ;) [03:38] btw is there anyway to stop kubuntu usplash from overwriting the settings? and kubuntu adds a grub splash also but doesnt work. [03:39] gnomefreak: as long as your theme isn't called "kubuntu", settings aren't overwritten [03:40] Tonio_: i use the ubuntu usplash and any update to kubuntu usplash changes it to kubuntu usplash [03:40] ah oups........ usplash :) [03:40] its overwriting update-alternatives [03:40] gnomefreak: yes, we did that to force changing the settings since there was an error [03:41] gnomefreak: that should be removed from kde before edgy is out [03:41] ok cool [03:41] gnomefreak: but we need to keep it for the moment [03:41] gnomefreak, well not atm they arent really designed to be installed side by side , but i'll work on a way to make that not happen as i was the one that added it in [03:41] thats fine i just wasnt sure if you were aware of it [03:41] aware of what? [03:41] gnomefreak: in fact we renamed the usplash so we have to for the removal and reinstalling of the old one [03:41] usplash being overwriten [03:41] ah [03:42] Riddell: yes, that's what we had to force in kds [03:42] when you have all the usplashes installed , kubuntu is defaulted ever time k-d-s is updated ( that last bit of --set i added is doing it ) but i need to find another solution [03:42] Riddell, ^^ [03:42] the problem is that since we renamed since dapper, I wonder what is the impact for people migrating from dapper to edgy without the force........ [03:42] maybe we will have to let it, I'm unsure [03:43] Tonio_, exactly , i'll figure it out before today is over, i was just looking at that infact [03:43] imbrandon: no rush [03:43] i just wasnt sure if it was meant to do that [03:43] imbrandon: the problem is that certain people have a "manual" alternative for an unknown reason [03:43] imbrandon: if it is not "auto" for everyone, we don't have another choice than forcing the deletion and reinstallation [03:43] Tonio_, yea , its a race [03:43] which sets it by default [03:44] gnomefreak: so here is the problem...... [03:44] Tonio_, right right, yea thats why i made it that way, but i wasent thinking of if people have two -desktops installed [03:44] gnomefreak: if we remove that, it'll work for 90% of the users, but potentially about 10% will have the issue [03:44] gnomefreak: what's this about a grub splash? [03:44] Tonio_, i have another solution i think ;) slow up buddy hehe [03:45] Riddell, usplash [03:45] imbrandon: can you explain please ? [03:45] Riddell: kubuntu install sets up a grub theme but before grub comes up it says it cant be found [03:45] gnomefreak: are we really installig this ? [03:45] gnomefreak: never seen that [03:45] Tonio_: maybe [03:45] Tonio_: i install a buch of things with kubuntu [03:45] Tonio_, where the packages use the rank in updatealternative instead of -set === insanekane [n=kane@202.83.35.108] has joined #kubuntu-devel [03:46] gnomefreak: we have kubuntu-grub-splashimages but that certainly shouldn't be installed by default [03:46] kubuntu-grub-splashimages - grub splashimages for Kubuntu [03:46] Tonio_: but i think even installing the grub-themes package but still should let the person config it [03:46] Riddell: yeah it isn't... but maybe it doesn't work with grub updates, since raphink didn't maintain it recently afaik [03:47] we have splash images for grub? i though those were turned off intentionaly becouse it broke on most video cards [03:47] imbrandon: yes, but there is a package, raphink did it [03:47] imbrandon: we don't ship it by default, of course [03:48] Tonio_, as far as the usplash thing, i have it fixed localy i think testing after bit and i'll upload it tonight or in the morning [03:48] Tonio_: my package doesn't work? [03:48] imbrandon: well if you find a better way to fix the alternative even when set to manual, would be nice :) [03:48] basicly using the update-alternatives in the usplash to determine not the -set [03:48] raphink: don't know, but gnomefreak reports it doesn't [03:48] i know i installed the kubuntu-grub-splash package now. but since its not pointing to right place (maybe due to dualbooting) it tells me to hit a key to continue than grub comes up. i dont think its that bad personally cause i can easily stop it but im thinking newusers may not know how to edit /boot/grub/menu.lst [03:49] gnomefreak, new users also wont install that package ;) [03:49] but good point [03:49] imbrandon: alot of people look to change the grub screen [03:50] gnomefreak: nope, a lot of geeks do :) [03:50] ok us too ;) [03:50] gnomefreak: and geeks generally now how to edit menu.lst [03:50] as you and me in fact [03:50] that and its as easy as adding a splash.xpm.gz to /boot/grub/ [03:50] my sister will never install kubuntu-grub-splash [03:50] no "package" needed ;) [03:51] well that + update-grub [03:51] ;) [03:51] the point is I wouldn't let a package touching to menu.lst [03:51] first because it is hard to make it automatic, since the file depends on the machine config [03:52] and secondly, because if we miss an upgrade, that is way to dangerous :) [03:52] Tonio_, packages dont have to , grub looks for a specific image name e.g. splash.xpm.gz unless its specified in the config [03:53] # Splashimage line added by kubuntu-grub-splashimages package [03:53] splashimage=(hd0 [03:53] (hd1,-1)/boot/grub/splashimages/KUBUNTU_splashscreen_blue_neon_logo_03.xpm.gz [03:53] imbrandon: yeah but that's a pain to manage too, since if we have packages providing this, we have to maintain the conflicts btween all of them [03:53] that is default in grub [03:53] so cp myimage.xpm.gz to /boot/grub/ && update-grub works [03:53] whent he package is installed [03:53] Tonio_, thats what the alternatives system is for ;) [03:53] but I agree that's another possibility [03:54] imbrandon: I don't say it is not fesable ;) [03:54] may not be "easy" but its right [03:54] ;) [03:54] just that it is long to do [03:54] yea [03:54] imbrandon: we can think about it for edgy +1 [03:54] true [03:54] too late for edgy and mdz would kill us if we even think to touch to something relative to grub ;) [03:55] and honnestly, I don't want to loose my upload rights ^_^ [03:55] ok , i'm gonna go grab some food, gnomefreak / Tonio_ i'll try to get the usplash stuff figured out tonight 100% but for now you have to use kubuntus gnomefreak ;) [03:55] imbrandon: very cool :) have a good meal [03:56] Tonio_, agreed [03:56] ( on the grub ) [03:56] imbrandon: can "don't use gnome, that sucks" be an alternative solution to the bug ? ;) [03:56] hahaha [03:56] i wish [03:56] hehe ^^ [03:56] gnomefreak: kidding of course :) [03:57] Riddell, did we ever talk kwwii into putting a color behind the usplash ? imho i'm with you and thing it would rock [03:58] s/thing/think [03:58] imbrandon: thats fine ;) [03:59] gnomefreak, tbh it was a hack to the postinst i added that causes that to make upgrades from dapper to edgy work smooth, but i have a better solution now i'll try tonight [03:59] imbrandon: ok [03:59] imbrandon: yeah I did, he suggested one..... we should give a try [03:59] becosue when i was doing it i dident think about gnome uspalshers with both desktops installed [04:00] Tonio_, ohh he made one ? [04:00] nice [04:00] ok welp i'm off to some food, bbiab [04:00] imbrandon: no but he suggested a color :) we should give a try [04:00] ahh ok [04:00] we should re-ask him [04:00] right, hopefully he will pop in today [04:01] ;) [04:01] imbrandon: hopefully :) [04:02] imbrandon: just received this : Invitation to UDS Mountain View [04:02] ;) === DaSkreech [n=skreech@port0034-afo-adsl.cwjamaica.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel [04:04] Tonio_: nice! congrats! [04:04] Congrats! [04:05] hehe thanks :) [04:06] imbrandon: how about the beryl on your ppc? === gnomefreak [n=gnomefre@ubuntu/member/gnomefreak] has joined #kubuntu-devel [04:11] Tonio_, whoohoo , me too "Subject: Invitation to UDS Mountain View" [04:11] ;) [04:11] zphou, i havent installed it yet, i have it downloaded [04:11] but not installed yet, have a few more things to get finished, moving my /var and /home to a new partition and stuff [04:11] but i will before today is done [04:11] :) [04:13] imbrandon: cool, you got invitation to UDS :) [04:19] imbrandon: congratulations [04:19] oh good, i didnt get an email [04:19] hehe thanks [04:21] It's open to the public? [04:22] Oh Wow it's @ google :) === DaSkreech pokes imbrandon [04:22] Grab me a copy of Goobuntu :) [04:22] Riddell: shouldn't you add a blank repository for edgy in amarok-latest and koffice-latest before the release? it will perhaps avoid problems .... [04:23] problems? [04:23] DaSkreech: giibuntu? [04:23] gilbuntu is more like it [04:25] marseillai_: for people upgrading? [04:25] from dapper? [04:25] hmm [04:25] Riddell: people who change every "dapper" by "edgy" in there sources.list and have errors when upgrading [04:25] Hobbsee: yes [04:26] I see, I suppose I could do that [04:28] marseillai_, well if there is nothing in the repo ( e.g. blank Packages.gz ) then apt will complain just as much afaik [04:28] imbrandon: shouldn't do [04:29] are you sure that an empty repos is not better than a non existing repo imbrandon ? 'im not sure .... [04:29] ahh ok i was thinking it would maybe its just if one arch is missing but the Releases says its there [04:29] Tonio_: I'm removing kubuntu_13_downgrade_kwallet.diff too since it doesn't apply, we can re-do the patch if we still have kwallet problems [04:30] Riddell: yes [04:30] Riddell: do you think we really needd kwallet? [04:30] freeflying: of course [04:30] I can't live without it, all those passwords [04:30] Riddell: we can think about replacing it eventually ;) [04:31] kde-pwmanager is a kwallet emulator, and is by far more complete [04:31] pwmanager ? [04:31] And Riddell is we :) [04:31] Tonio_: more complete in what way? [04:31] Riddell: but all passwd stored in it are plain text [04:31] Riddell: you can use it as password generator too [04:31] freeflying: they are not, they're strongly encrypted [04:32] Riddell: and its UI to store and read the pawsswords is more "clear" to me [04:32] Riddell: anyone can read the passwd from it [04:33] freeflying: it's definately encrypted, ~/.kde/share/apps/kwallet/kdewallet.kwl [04:33] freeflying: yeah there is no security issue with it [04:33] Riddell: but when you happen left your desktop, then anyone can read your passwds using kwallet [04:34] freeflying: and can do many more....... [04:34] freeflying: first security is the user.... [04:34] :) [04:34] freeflying: right click and lock session [04:34] ;) [04:35] marseillai_: I see :) === abattoir [n=abattoir@cm61.omega22.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #kubuntu-devel [04:35] freeflying: only if you have given kwallet manager permission to read the wallet always [04:36] freeflying, you shouldent walk away from the computer without locking the screen anyhow [04:36] heh [04:36] heh, seems I'd give up :) [04:37] http://wiki.debian.org/DebianDesktopArtwork/WallpapersEtch interesting bunch, I'd go for 1 or 2 [04:37] fabo: is there going to be a common default wallpaper between gnome and kde in etch? [04:38] yea i like #1 [04:39] hum, yes, #1 is cool [04:45] Riddell: we'll try but etch is too close ... so i don't think it will be the same [04:49] i like 6 [05:03] Riddell: kubuntu-desktop uploaded === Porkotron [n=parker@dyn129-100-97-133.bc.uwo.ca] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:11] Riddell, ping [05:11] hi imbrandon [05:11] hey , i'm i reading this wrong or is there a messup in the dates [05:11] for UDS [05:11] Dates - Please arrange to arrive by the evening of Saturday 4th [05:11] November. The event will start at 09.00 on Monday 5th November [05:11] 5th is Sunday [05:11] Sunday 5th to Friday 10th November 2006 [05:12] says https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UbuntuDeveloperSummitMountainView [05:12] ok so she just mistyped and said monday [05:12] just makin sure [05:12] curious day to start on sunday, not surprised she got confused [05:12] yea [05:12] Tonio_: "Removed kmplayer-konq-plugins" ? [05:13] Riddell: hu ? [05:13] what's that ? [05:13] Tonio_: your upload of kubuntu-meta [05:13] Riddell: I just performed ./update [05:13] it's still in the seeds [05:14] Riddell: hum...... [05:14] yeah, I missed that in the changelog...... === claydoh [n=clay@216-220-245-202.midmaine.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:14] what's this ? [05:15] Riddell: it went back to universe........ [05:15] Riddell: who did this ? [05:15] yes, it has [05:15] no idea [05:15] Riddell: could my upgrade cause this ? [05:15] i dident touch it .... heh [05:15] Riddell: maybe someone though it was a frontend to mplayer and thus it couldn't be in universe [05:16] that does seem to be a common misunderstanding [05:16] yeah no issues in the seeds, I was *very* carefull when I touched this [05:16] Riddell: yes, kmplayer name is stupid........ [05:16] mdz commented on a bug reciently thinking it was a mplayer frontend [05:16] Riddell: I'm pinging on #ubuntu-devel [05:16] that's why goldenear is changing it :) === hunger [n=tobias@p54A60560.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:18] I'm pretty sure it is this..... === Lure [n=lure@clj46-234.dial-up.arnes.si] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:21] actualy kmplayer will stay kmplayer for kde 3.5 [05:21] goldenear: yeah we know ;) [05:21] it will become oskar for kde 4 :) [05:21] just that it confuses the "masters" of ubuntu since they generally use gnome :) [05:22] heh [05:22] I'm pretty sure it has been removed because of its name...... [05:23] I can't see an other reason... === hunger_ [n=tobias@p54A618E8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:23] kmplayer is fully gpl and not mplayer or any closed source codec dependent [05:24] btw Tonio_, I've switched to edgy now :) [05:24] goldenear: we know :) just that the name is historic :) [05:24] goldenear: and your feedback ? [05:24] It was really a pain to install it !!! [05:25] the desktop cd doesn't work for me (I report the bug)... It fails during hardware detectection [05:26] the alternate cd works, but it doesn't recognise my network card (missing r1000 module, "bug" reported) [05:26] I had to install the fr language pack after install (when r1000 module is loaded) [05:27] Also I don't know if it's normal, but I don't have a splash screen during the boot process === jdong [n=jdong@ubuntu/member/jdong] has joined #kubuntu-devel === freeflying [n=freeflyi@61.190.64.118] has joined #kubuntu-devel === hunger__ [n=tobias@p54A62D67.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:29] Tonio_: did we add foomatic-cleanupdrivers to k-d-s? [05:30] Riddell: yes [05:30] Riddell: so if I understand correctly, keybuk removed it by mistake ? [05:32] Tonio_: seems to be the case, lets poke him in a few hours if it hasn't gone back in [05:32] https://launchpad.net/bugs/42965 suggests foomatic should be fixed, but lets leave foomatic-cleanupdrivers in k-d-s anyway for now [05:32] Malone bug 42965 in foomatic-db-engine "Can't add a printer in KDE: parser error?" [High,Fix released] [05:32] Riddell: yes, I'll reupdate kubuntu-desktop [05:33] hum, interesting, so can remove the foomatic stuff from kds then...... [05:33] in the future I mean :) [05:34] Riddell: let's keep it for edgy, as it doesn't have any consequences, and we'll try to remove it for edgy+1 and see if we get bugs during the dev cycle [05:34] that sounds reasonnable [05:34] yes === Ingmar^ [n=ingmar@vpnb065.ugent.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:41] Tonio_: also about feedback, I'm happy to see that acpi/hibernate is now working (except the wifi has to be ifdown and up to be working after resume) :) [05:41] goldenear: knetworkmanager is the key for this ;) [05:41] The big problem is that suspend doesn't work properly: the screen stay blank when the computer wakes up :( === jdong [n=jdong@ubuntu/member/jdong] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:42] ah... === jdong [n=jdong@ubuntu/member/jdong] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:42] goldenear: knetworkmanager is the key for this ;) <- I don't agree, under windows wifi is working after resume... this is a bug! [05:43] goldenear: yes, true, but knetworkmanager is a good workarround waiting for the acpi support to improve :) [05:43] I like the automatic mp3 codec install from amarok also... this will avoid many questions on the irc and in the forums :D [05:44] goldenear: we now have the same for flash in konqueror too :) [05:45] yes I also see this... but it's still the same old flash pluggin with the sound delay issue :( [05:45] I hope gnash will be ready soon :) [05:45] goldenear: yes, we haven't been able to develop flash9 on our own :) [05:45] Tonio_: I've nerver setup my wireless network using knetworkmanager :) [05:46] goldenear: the good news is that the structure of that konq plugin allow to make it compatible with any external lib [05:46] goldenear: that will be used too with flash9 when it's out [05:47] freeflying: well if you like to connect with the shell :) that's your problem ^^ [05:47] you mean in 2010 ? ;) [05:47] goldenear: first months of 2007 [05:47] that's not that far :) === jdong_ [n=jdong@d192-24-235-141.try.wideopenwest.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel [05:47] Tonio_: knetworkmanager always tell me that I have not any wireless devices :) [05:48] sure .... they already promise flash 8 for last year :) [05:48] wait and see... [05:48] freeflying: yeah that can happen with certain drivers that are uncompatible [05:48] freeflying: that can be resolved in wpasupplicant configuration [05:48] freeflying: simply start the good driver and that should be okay [05:49] knetworkmanager is not very user friendly for wifi configuration (no way to list available network and no way to use wpa) [05:49] knetworkmanager by default uses wext [05:49] goldenear: hu ???????? [05:49] Tonio_: good driver? [05:49] goldenear: that kwifimanager, not knetworkmanager :) [05:50] freeflying: look at wpa_supplicant man page [05:50] freeflying: it starts with a 'driver' parameter [05:50] Tonio_: i see, thanks [05:50] by default knm uses wext, which is generic, but you can change this [05:50] kwifimanager ??? is that installed by default ? [05:51] goldenear: no, by default we have wireless-assistant, which is nice, but no wpa [05:51] goldenear: then you can install knetworkmanager, which does everything, as long as your wifi driver is 'wext compatible' [05:51] most are, except madwifi for example, but that's on the way to be resolved === Tonio_ has learned the lesson ! [05:52] wireless-assistant had never worked for me... it detects network around, but always report it can't connect (even if it actualy do it). [05:52] I think ndiswrapper is now compatible with wext for example [05:53] I almost alway use the command line to set up my wifi :) [05:53] goldenear: btw it is now unmaintained.... only knetworkmanager really works [05:53] except aseigo, I don't know any person using kfiwimanager too :) [05:53] kwifimanager you mean ? [05:54] goldenear: no, only knetworkmanager really works [05:54] kwifimanager sucks, and same for wireless-assistant [05:54] what is the dialog run by when you install mp3 support for amarok? [05:54] I used kwlan is dapper [05:54] gnomefreak: depending the desktop used [05:54] is worked pretty well and has wpa support [05:54] Tonio_: it loops [05:55] gnomefreak: I scripted to use gtk under gnome, kde under kde and xterm for the rest [05:55] but the bug is under amarok i was gonna change it but i cant think of it [05:55] gnomefreak: there was an issue, but that is supposed to work now no ? [05:55] bug 63783 [05:55] Malone bug 63783 in amarok "Insists on installing mp3 codec" [Undecided,Confirmed] http://launchpad.net/bugs/63783 [05:55] does someone work on Kubuntu package installer? (like gdebi) [05:55] Tonio_: it keeps going as of yesterday [05:55] gnomefreak: lemme check [05:56] mhb: i dont think there is one for kubuntu yet [05:56] gnomefreak: hum.... using kde ? [05:56] im not he might be i was using gnome at the time [05:56] mhb: there is one, in the form of a service menu [05:56] mhb: use gtk-qt engine and then mv gdebi kdebi? :D [05:56] right click on a deb file and you'll see [05:57] Tonio_: the service menu is nothing more than dpkg -i in an xterm [05:57] mhb: that's limited but it works [05:57] jdong_: true that [05:57] Tonio_: that's not a very compelling replacement to gdebi :) [05:57] which actually does effective dependency resolution === jdong_ just installs gdebi on kubuntu and calls it a day [05:57] i think we should have one [05:57] well that can be scripted.... === mhb votes for one too [05:58] jdong_: too many gtk libs i think for some users to do that [05:58] mhb: it's blocked on pykde supporting an embedded konsole, which will happen in the next release with luck [05:58] gnomefreak: pfft.... most people won't have a problem with that [05:58] gnomefreak: I think it pulls in like 10MB->55MB of packages altogehter [05:59] from fresh kubuntu [05:59] and if people install firefox, gdebi hitches almost for free [05:59] jdong_: doesn gnome-base get inclueded? [05:59] ah [05:59] gnomefreak: concerning the loop, I'll try to have a look at that toonight...... [05:59] Depends: python (>= 2.4), python (<< 3), python-gtk2 (>= 2.6.3-2), python-glade2 (>= 2.6.3-2), python-apt (>= 0.6.16.2), python-vte (>= 1:0.11.15-4), gksu (>= 1.3.6-1), gnome-icon-theme (>= 2.14.0-1) [05:59] looking at the depends for it most are python === gnomefreak looking at them :) [06:00] ty Tonio_ [06:00] Depends: hicolor-icon-theme, librsvg2-common [06:00] that's it [06:00] other than gtk2, it doesn't ask for anything else [06:00] and many kubuntu users will have gtk2 needed by their other favorite apps anyway [06:00] true [06:00] unless you're a kde purist :) [06:00] sadist maybe ;) [06:01] kubuntu is indeed kde pure [06:01] jdong_: which apps ? ^^ [06:01] Tonio_: gdebi [06:01] Tonio_: firefox is probably the biggest one [06:01] gnomefreak: no ! I was talking about gtk apps kubuntu users should use :) [06:01] Tonio_: konq is an awesome browser [06:01] oh [06:01] but it isn't always a replacement for firefox [06:01] FF [06:01] jdong_: my real battle is to convince people that firefox sucks :) [06:01] that's my first battle [06:01] Tonio_: you're gonna have a tough time with that [06:02] I'm pulling up konq to digg.com, the icons are distorted [06:02] and ther'es overlapping text [06:02] it has its good points and bad points but i think its the most widely used [06:02] I pull it up to gmail and get sent back to static html world [06:02] those two alone are enough to make lots of users run back to firefox [06:02] jdong_: those are IE6 users arguments [06:02] anti-flame disclaimer: I use konq in kde for most of my kde browsing [06:02] "I use IE6 because all websites work" [06:03] ;) [06:03] Tonio_: still... I could care less about the standards when I need to pay my bills and the site doesn't like it [06:03] :) [06:03] the point is I consider firefox doesn't do what it has been designed to [06:03] I'm not saying firefox is elegant [06:03] it really isn't [06:03] but a lot of the times linux has few other alternatives [06:04] firebird has been annouced to be a fast/simple reimplementation of mozilla [06:04] even opera is not up-to-par with the whole websites working ordeal [06:04] the result is something that is even slower and much more complicated [06:04] that's a bad result [06:04] I agree... [06:04] opera and konqueror have generally the same "bugs" [06:04] yes, because of their strict standards compliance [06:04] the reason is simple, they are the closests to the standards [06:05] exactly [06:05] I prefer to avoid a stupid website than browsing with a diplodocus that takes 30 seconds to start, like firefox [06:05] I've got a few sites that are unavoidable [06:06] for academic purposes and for banking [06:06] and pulling up firefox is less evil than pulling up IE6/WINE [06:06] :-) [06:06] jdong_: I generally send an email describing the ugly code, and most of the time, except for big websites, the webmaster is pleased to correct it a bit [06:07] (ahem, big sites, proprietary homework submitting solutions) [06:07] jdong_: but yes, I use firefox (shame on me) on very rare circumstances [06:07] where webmasters ignore me for the simplest requests [06:07] (allowing +'s in e-mail addresses) [06:07] the french train company for example -> website uncompatible with opera or konq [06:07] I don't have another choice than using firesox [06:07] Tonio_: you got a CD handy to help me reproduce yet another kubuntu-media bug? [06:08] jdong_: so cd there, sorry.... what is the issue ? [06:08] Tonio_: when you insert a cd, you get the kde deamon dialog, right? [06:08] I pull it up to gmail and get sent back to static html world ----------->> you must change konqueror identity for this page [06:08] jdong_: yes [06:09] marseillai_: faking identity still ends up with quirky ajax. buttons don't work... I've lost e-mails to that [06:09] Tonio_: select do nothing or X it out [06:09] (use case: I'm inserting a DVD to acidrip it. no mounting is needed) [06:09] okay, and then what happens ? [06:09] jdong_: for me it works fine. i use it all days and it's exactly the same interface with konqueror and firefox [06:09] Tonio_: now, kubuntu has no idea about the cd, and you never get the chance to mount it again [06:10] Tonio_: to make matters worse, press the eject button on the cd drive.. [06:10] Tonio_: and kioslaves pops up with an ugly error that it doesn't know about /dev/scd0 [06:10] jdong_: interesting.......; let me test [06:10] and if you used acidrip or other block-device-accessing programs, you now have a locked cd tray === Tonio_ goes taking a cd [06:10] so you're down to a terminal issuing eject commands :) === Goldenear_ [n=goldenea@vol75-4-82-225-33-186.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:11] Tonio_: about the wifi not working after hibernate, shouldn't this simply be fixed but ifdown any working network interface before hibernate/suspend and ifup them after resume ? [06:11] Tonio_: the no-second-chance-to-mount-if-you-don't-take-your-first gotcha also applies to USB sticks [06:11] but the CD/DVD one is extra annoying [06:12] yesterday when I was acidripping 12 dvd's, it got so annoying to the point that I had to go to GNOME to finish my work [06:12] jdong_: works here [06:12] Riddell: ping [06:12] I can discard, eject, and I'm prompted again [06:12] Tonio_: if you cancel the mount dialog, you can still mount? [06:13] jdong_: yes [06:13] hi Lure [06:13] Tonio_: without ejecting it? [06:13] I can manually eject and mount it [06:13] well, you have to eject it [06:13] but /media does not recognize the cd as a cd [06:13] i agree with jdong! when you unmount a CD or an usb disk he disappear from desktop or kicker applet and you must use command line to mount it. [06:13] if you cancel and don't eject [06:13] jdong_: true too, you simply go to /media using system menu [06:13] double click and it mounts === oofus [n=chris@oofus.demon.co.uk] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:13] Tonio_: brb, let me check if a recent kde update changed the situation [06:14] Tonio_: why we can't show unmount device on desktop since edgy ? [06:14] now only mount device are shown === jdong [n=jdong@ubuntu/member/jdong] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:14] Tonio_: your gonna hurt me :( [06:15] gnomefreak: why ? [06:15] amarok has no splash screen for me anymore [06:15] jdong: simply go in /media using konq === DaSkreech finds out that Ctrl+L clears in Konversation :-( [06:15] you can mount and eject from there [06:15] ok, back [06:15] test 1: inserting cd.... [06:15] canceled mount dialog [06:15] gnomefreak: I didn't touch this :) [06:15] no desktop icon.... [06:15] going to media... [06:15] ok, nvm, cdrom is fixed [06:15] gnomefreak: default amarok has been changed, that's all :) [06:15] mount is availabe from right click [06:15] oh ok [06:16] Tonio_: though clicking the drive (opening the link) opens a blank folder [06:16] my friend gets mediamanager not started when he types media:/ [06:16] jdong: yes, that's a known issue, _Sime will fix it [06:16] Tonio_: ok [06:16] let me play with usb sticks then [06:16] jdong: but that's the only known issue on that point [06:16] Riddell: what is you plan with shortcuts for suspend/hhibernate/battery (that sebas mentioned in mail)? [06:16] ah nevermind i didnt know there was a setting :( [06:17] Tonio_: with the cd unmounted, open a terminal [06:17] jdong: the issue was probably that you had cdrom0 hidden, and you used the symlink cdrom [06:17] jdong: I fixed kds on that point [06:17] Tonio_: run dd if=/dev/cdrom of=/dev/null [06:17] Lure: pykde has a bug which means we use kglobalaccelarator in guidance power manager [06:17] Tonio_: to simulate ripping a cd or some other block device activity [06:17] Lure: so best place to add them would be to your ksmserver patch [06:17] Tonio_: then press the eject button [06:17] Riddell: so ksmserver would just display the dialog? [06:17] jdong: hum, yes, I can see this [06:17] Tonio_: kioslaves returns the cryptic unknown-device error [06:18] Tonio_: a "disk in use" is much more friendly than that :) [06:18] Riddell: I could also add battery key support in kmilo (call powermanager->showTip over dcop) [06:18] Tonio_: and if a program leaves the tray locked... it's even worse [06:18] Tonio_: dd don't keep the tray locked. Some cd ripping programs do. in that case, you're off to eject-land [06:18] Lure: well it could directly just hiberate/suspend. [06:18] Lure: yes, that would be cool [06:19] Tonio_: before we had the possiblity to show or not the unmount device on desktop. why remove this possiblity? [06:19] marseillai_: imo that was a regression introduced by sime's patches [06:19] (which btw are wonderful in every other way!) [06:19] I love the streamlined /media [06:19] just there's still a few quirks [06:19] jdong: i can understand to not show them by default [06:19] Riddell: problem is that I do not know what users would prefer - typically laptops have only one key (standby and sleep) and they might assigne different action [06:20] marseillai_: no, as in the option no longer functions correctly..... [06:20] Lure: ah, tricky [06:20] marseillai_: due to the patches [06:20] and imo kicker applet for removable device is largely better than desktop icons ...... [06:20] Lure: well showing the dialogue is fine then. or we could see what gnome does [06:20] jdong: I'm wondering if that not the same issue than the "blank page" when you go in using konq [06:20] jdong: maybe it just doesn't mount while it is supposed to [06:20] Tonio_: it might be [06:20] Riddell: I will check gnome again, but I think they have gconf entry... [06:20] Tonio_: well, I don't always want to mount [06:20] jdong: better discuss this with _Sime since he has all keys concerning this [06:21] ok, will try to catch him [06:21] jdong: the point is that's different from the kde base [06:21] he has patched this widely, so only him can understand what happens in fact [06:22] Lure: the gnome solution to everything :) [06:22] Tonio_: if I plug in a usb stick and tell it to do nothing, I don't ever get the chance to mount it again [06:23] media is devoid of usb devices [06:23] jdong: looking [06:23] Tonio_: and do nothing actually mounts the device (!) [06:24] Tonio_: while cancel does what I just complained about [06:24] do nothing should mount the device [06:24] that "normal" [06:24] it means "mounts and do no action after this" [06:24] that makes sense [06:24] Tonio_: maybe that should be stated then [06:24] Tonio_: I always thought do nothing means leave it unmounted [06:25] (with an unmounted usb stick icon, etc) [06:25] I'm liable to yank it out assuming it was unmounted [06:25] hum, that probably just string issue in kde, should say "mount and don't perform anything else" [06:26] that's better [06:26] even Mount instead of "do nothing" [06:26] true that :) feel free to report on kde bts :) === marseillai_ is now known as marseillai [06:27] Tonio_: you know how much I hate to touch that site :D [06:27] jdong: that's why I'm telling you "free free to do it" ;) I won't lol [06:27] :D [06:27] the messiest website I've ever seen....... [06:27] Tonio_: at least cancel should = do nothing in action [06:28] Tonio_: that's a _Sime issue, right? [06:28] wasn't a kdebase upload yesterday supposed to effect that? [06:28] jdong: yes it is [06:28] and yes, I agree with you [06:28] cancel should "do nothing" [06:28] yep [06:28] the problem is still there with the close button :) [06:28] ugh [06:28] why not just have do nothing DO NOTHING :) [06:29] currently 2 of 3 buttons think that's the case [06:29] and that's a majority vote of buttons :) [06:29] lol [06:29] jdong: hum, because I think the "mount/unmount" doesn't have to be let to the user [06:29] it is complicated and doesn't have any reason to exist [06:30] Tonio_: it should be exposed because it dictates whether or not it's safe to yank the device [06:30] do you "mount" on windows or osx ? the system deals with that on its own, and that's I think the goal of sime, making it automatic [06:30] until linux has another way around that issue, KDE should not cover up that aspect [06:30] jdong: I agree on that point [06:30] and OSX and Windows both have vfat drivers that are MUCH more resilient to yahnking corruption [06:30] that's an aspect we cannot compete with [06:30] as much as I hate to admit it [06:31] I've done plenty of linux yanking tests [06:31] both sync and async [06:31] linux corrupts the fat structures far more often than windows or OSX [06:31] hum, that's true, yes [06:32] either way, I have no issue with automounting, like what gnome does [06:33] it does make the user's life easier [06:33] but don't give me the impression that you didn't ;-) [06:33] (s/Do Nothing/mount/ is probably our best solution) [06:33] even if upstream doesn't do it, we should [06:33] jdong: too late to change the strings now === serzholino [n=serzholi@16x.zp.ua] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:34] btw, we'll probably make a point with _Sime concerning the known bugs and resolved problem, and decide if we finally include his patches or not [06:34] k [06:35] maybe if there are too many issues we can had them for edgy + 1 so that _Sime has more time to polish the work [06:35] to be perfectly honest, if I were reviewing kubuntu today, I would come down very harshly on the kubuntu media issues I've noted [06:35] both today and the other days [06:35] but fortunately I don't have that kind of free time :D [06:35] jdong: take note on the issues, and be there when we debate this :) [06:36] Tonio_: that's why I'm trying to brainwash you to take my side for me :D [06:36] jdong: I'm taking notes, don't mind :) [06:36] Riddell: gpm by default does nothing, but there is gconf entry to be able to change it - not sure if some postinst updates it... [06:36] I'd love to have free time for kubuntu/ubuntu on my command, but sadly that's not the case [06:36] and murphy's law states that I'll be busy whenever an important debate like that happens [06:36] Riddell: isn't there a meeting on thursday ? [06:37] Riddell: that was discussed last week [06:38] Riddell, Tonio_: I think we should really add gdb as dependancy to kubuntu-desktop [06:38] Lure: true [06:39] is there any reason why this is not done (sorry - I could not attend last meeting where I have put this to agenda :-( ) === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:39] Lure: I don't see any, but maybe Riddell has its reasons...... [06:41] Lure: we don't have space on the CD for developers tools is the general reason. plus would we then need the -dbg packages? [06:41] Lure: I presume that the gnome apport crash handler thing installs gdb for you, we should look at doing something similar in future [06:42] Riddell: there is now depo for dbg packages, but also w/o, stack dump is usable as binaries are not stipped [06:42] Riddell: problem is that we have a crash dialog on crash that when Stack trace is selected throws another error :-( [06:43] not very nice to user :-( [06:44] any idea how much it adds to the CD? [06:44] Riddell: gdb package is 2.3-3.7MB (depends on platform) + not so many depends [06:44] Riddell: all depends are probably already in: libc6 libncurses5 libreadline5 [06:46] Riddell: yep, all dependancies are already in [06:46] http://packages.ubuntu.com/edgy/devel/gdb [06:46] Riddell: are CDs oversized/on the edge? [06:46] Lure: they're getting close and digikam was just added [06:47] amd64 already has no language-support-en [06:47] Riddell: I still think we can drop something else (openoffice ;-) [06:48] just kidding [06:48] Riddell: talking about that, what is the priority ? provide the maximum softwares or provide windows applications.......; because that takes space too [06:48] Riddell: krita is maybe not too useful for general public though [06:48] provide the maximum software isn't a priority, we just provide an operating system [06:48] and winfoss kicks arse [06:49] Riddell: but if we miss space can we think about removing the windows stuff on the cd ? [06:49] lots of people need graphics apps [06:49] Riddell: yes, but we should have usable desktop with photo mgmt and proper crash reporting ;-) [06:49] Tonio_: no, winfoss is great stuff [06:49] Riddell: we could drop konversation as all users of IRC have internet connection ;-) [06:49] yea winfoss is great but no lang-en isnt [06:50] imbrandon: that's on amd64, which has no winfoss [06:50] ahh [06:50] Riddell: true regarding winfoss, but if I am deciding on 3.7MB gdb for crash reports or 17 MB windows/scribus I know what I would choose [06:50] Lure, WHA!?! no konversation ?!? [06:50] heh [06:51] Lure: especially when projects like the opencd already exist... [06:51] i think we need more install-mp3 type scripts [06:51] imbrandon: I would also like to keep it (as it needs promotion), but fact is that IRC is not used by all users and all IRC users have internet connection - and do not depend on shipit CD only [06:52] not all computer users have cameras either by that definaition [06:52] ;) [06:52] or music collections ... or .... we could name alot of things [06:53] imbrandon: true, but I would suspect digital photos are more likely than irc [06:53] imbrandon: but anyway, we need to find something that we all agree can be dropped === beligum [n=beligum@d54C49278.access.telenet.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel [06:54] I wonder what seed gdb should be added to [06:54] gdb vs. exe debate? [06:55] i'm with keybuk tbh and say we make a dvd + alternate cd base install ;) but thats a whole nother conversation [06:55] Riddell: same as kde... [06:55] Riddell: desktop... === raphink just wants to say that in Ichthux his choice was very fast too... the first things I removed were all the .exe and such [06:55] raphink: hehe, yes, a bit :) [06:56] raphink, heh [06:56] I needed 60MB and I didn't need 10seconds to choose where to find them [06:56] ok i got to run for a while, bbiab [06:56] I'm not distributing an open-source OS to encourage people to use the apps on Windows [06:56] imbrandon: I would drop krita (maybe replace it with simple kpaint) as first choice - when we finally replace openoffice with koffice, we get it back === raphink is also against porting KDE to Windows anyway, but well it's FLOSS so no way to prevent it [06:56] +1 on the office change [06:57] raphink: problem is that on amd64 there is no winfoss [06:57] well in my opinion winfoss is nice, but should remain "optional", in the way that "we had it if we have the space for" [06:57] Lure: yeah, that's another problem indeed [06:57] Lure: let's switch to koffice !!!!!!!! [06:57] Riddell, why do we use oo.o over koffice ? [06:57] -> keep space and promote kde apps, 2 in 1 [06:57] imbrandon: because it is better ? [06:57] insanekane, hahah ok [06:58] koffice powa :) [06:58] insanekane, that why its always the first thing to get uninstalled right ? === raphink is for koffice, too [06:58] insanekane: depends on the point of view.... for my needs, koffice is enough and BY FAR better integrated..... [06:58] Tonio_: good for you [06:58] kubuntu is considered the most KDE-based distro in a way [06:58] Tonio_, exactly intergration and for the avg JOE it works great [06:58] we focus on KDE more than most distros [06:58] and I think koffice just fits with that choice [06:59] theres good integration between OOo apps as well [06:59] imbrandon: koffice is too buggy [06:59] imbrandon: true that, people that need more feature can install oo.o [06:59] Tonio_, exactly [06:59] Riddell: hum, that's really better with latest versions [06:59] programs get debugged when they're used in FLOSS [06:59] Tonio_: being able to type text and render it on screen is a big feature of OOo [06:59] Riddell, it isnt any more buggy than oo.o , and crashes ALOT less [06:59] Riddell: weren't systemsettings and adept too buggy when we added them? [06:59] imbrandon: the problem is communicating with msoffice [07:00] and yet they are far more important parts of the system than office [07:00] imbrandon: switching will probably be possible when opendoc plugins for mso are available [07:00] raphink, +1 [07:00] we all know that systemseting is what it is today _because_ it was integrated [07:00] and the same for adept [07:00] I would like to give its chance to koffice today [07:00] it deservesit [07:00] okay let's remove winfloss, replace oo.o, everything after beta, and let mdz have an heart attack :) === imbrandon wispers "edgy" [07:01] but seriously, all of this can be discussed for edgy+1 === imbrandon wispers "edgy" one more time then slips out the door [07:01] yea i think we need to give koffice a serouis look for edgy+1 [07:01] when is koffice 2 to be released? [07:01] after kde 4 [07:02] argh [07:02] insanekane: talking about oo.o integration, did you notice the bug with fonts on oo.o menus on kde ? [07:02] they look ugly [07:03] Hi all, I'm looking for someone who wants to take over the ScreenKast packaging... [07:03] fuzzy, for a reason I can't explain [07:03] Tonio_: those issues are of a very low priority [07:04] Tonio_: most users in the world cannot use Koffice because of the lack of support for their language [07:04] Tonio_: ugly as hell [07:04] insanekane: for me (since I focus on polishing), they are important :) === [niceday] [n=daniel@87.100.54.53] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:04] I'm pretty sad to see that nothing has been done for firefox kde intergration in edgy :( [07:04] firefox still have the ugly gtk file dialog :( [07:05] Goldenear_: me to, but this is one more reason to reconsider konqueror [07:05] Goldenear_, mostly becouse firefox isnt stable enough even on gnome atm , it still crashing all the time [07:05] Goldenear_: true that, because the patch to get kde dialog is an evil hack [07:05] Lure: reconsider konqueror? [07:05] konqueror is great [07:05] hi [niceday] [07:05] I mostly use konqueror... but many sited doesn't work in konq :( [07:05] imbrandon: did you add the kubuntu meeting to fridge? [07:05] I can't do a tenth of what I do with konqueror with firefox [07:05] so firefox is a must [07:05] beligum: that's on my plans but for "after edgy is out" [07:06] raphink: I have still some issues to use it at work, but it seems that I will have to fix these intranet apps ;-) [07:06] <[niceday] > Riddell: hi. i'm just taking a tour through some channels (adding them to my list) [07:06] Riddell, pretty sure, lemme make sure , one sec [07:06] Goldenear_: so let's fix konqueror [07:06] or rather, adapt it [07:06] Goldenear_: true that, because the patch to get kde dialog is an evil hack <-- is there a better solution ? (existing) [07:06] raphink: other reason is that I am used to firefox and some of extentions... [07:06] cause konqueror is about the only browser to really respect the standards [07:07] Goldenear_: using firefox "because it display bad coded websites" is encouraging what made IE that popular....... [07:07] Goldenear_: that's not a solution [07:07] yes Tonio_ [07:07] totally agreed [07:07] also I would like to see konqueror (or a kthml based broswer) for windows... [07:07] Tonio_: allright, thx. My time runs out to spend a lot of time on it [07:07] the more konqueror there are, the more websites will be corrected [07:07] same with opera [07:07] this way we could have a multiplateform browser ligther than firefox [07:07] Tonio_: exactly - this is why I plan to try to switch again [07:07] I am for adding a firefox spoofing id on konqueror, that says as commentary "I'm just pretending to use Firefox because your website is a mess" [07:08] so people will get it in their stat [07:08] ;) [07:08] the more konqueror there are, the more websites will be corrected <- most problem I have are not from websites but from konq... eg ajax support [07:08] so we can watch these websites using the spoofing (works most of the time) while still lettting people know that they should care about standards [07:08] Goldenear_: ajax support issues are due to websites [07:09] Goldenear_: konqueror was one of the first browsers to have good ajax support [07:09] Goldenear_: on vbulletin, which has good code, ajax works nicelly, even with konqueror [07:09] actually the first one to pass the ajax test properly iirc [07:09] just because people talk SMS all the time, we aren't going to adapt our doc and make itt horrible [07:10] and all the same for code imo [07:10] Riddell, ugh i did but i forgot to tick the "published" box, its published now [07:10] we aren't going to lower our standards because people don't mind about theirs [07:10] sorry [07:10] Goldenear_: what do we want ? a kde based operating system or a kde based with gnome apps, like suse or mandriva ? [07:10] Goldenear_: no need to do something that already exists [07:10] Tonio_: I've made my choice :) [07:10] I have a more pragmatic approch to the problem... many websites are not konqueror compatible... I need to use them now and I don't thing their webmasters are ready to fix them... [07:10] the whole point about KDE is integration [07:10] that's the reason I think we should on using kde apps only [07:11] so the only solution is at the moment to use firefox... [07:11] no Goldenear_ I do not agree [07:11] (And I don't even talk about ie only compatible sites) [07:11] Goldenear_: and if firefox fails on certain websites ? (that happens) [07:11] and if mozilla decided to respect the standards, then there would be no issues [07:11] since the websites would be made compatible [07:12] if firefox continues to go out of the standards, like IE is, I would shit on it the same way I shit on IE [07:12] I didn't find a site not working with firefox since a pretty long time... [07:12] Goldenear_: why ? [07:12] because the websites have been made compatible with it [07:12] because it is widely used [07:12] so there are 2 solutions : [07:13] - people are using konqueror and the same thing happens [07:13] yep [07:13] it's because more and more people use FF === toma [n=toma@84-53-90-221.wxdsl.nl] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:13] that websites are compatible [07:13] and it's because more and more people use open document [07:13] - mozilla is making a good gecko that respects the standards, and that'll correct the issues for ALL BROWSERS in the world [07:13] that the next version of MS Office will understand it [07:13] not the other way round [07:13] 95% of people are using Windows... Konqueror doesn't work on windows... [07:14] Goldenear_: yet... [07:14] Goldenear_: yet [07:14] that's the point :D [07:14] Goldenear_: yet [07:14] konqueror is being ported on windows [07:14] ** for the brave deb http://kubuntu.org/packages/kde-355/ edgy main [07:14] hehe [07:14] Goldenear_: using firefox on kde is a temporary solution, but the consequences will be a dirty web at the end [07:14] But I want to use the sites now !!! [07:14] and konqueror will have even more compatibility issues [07:15] Riddell, whoo hoo , upgrading now [07:15] Goldenear_: how did the first firefox users do ? they were boycotting the crappy websites [07:15] Goldenear_: that's the only way to get a clean web [07:15] imbrandon: note I havn't tested them yet myself [07:15] haha [07:15] hehe ok [07:16] Goldenear_: your point is the same than people saying "I'll use linux when drivers are available" [07:16] yes [07:16] reasonnable opinion, but if everyone says this, we will NEVER get the drivers :) [07:17] open-source exists because people have made the choice to loose technical options to gain freedom [07:17] the first people creating the change have to accept compromise for the future [07:17] if you choose technical stuff over freedom [07:17] you'll lose your freedom [07:17] and you'll never get more [07:17] Tonio_: let me ask you a question: Why companies such as SNCF, Grosbill, or Le mistere des finances would make their website konqueror compatible ? [07:17] it seems today is discussion day here :o) [07:17] Goldenear_: companies need money [07:17] konqueror is a great navigator [07:17] Goldenear_: because it is used by the masse [07:17] even safari is based on KHTML [07:18] Riddell: I'll set up a virtual Edgy machine and test the packages, after all, I'm in Kubuntu Testers now :o) [07:18] if konqueror begins to be used by many [07:18] they will have to adapt [07:18] mhb: ah hah, yes :) [07:18] Goldenear_: when grosbill doesn't sell anymore because all konqueror users are going to another website, they'll change it [07:18] of core konq is great... that's why I mostly use it ! [07:18] But I can't reserve a train ticket of pay my taxes with it ! [07:18] Goldenear_: you know what I'm doing ? [07:19] I'm sending an email to the webmaster saying the code sucks, and I'm phoning to get the bill [07:19] when the guy will receive 500 mails a week, maybe the code would get cleaned a bit [07:19] Goldenear_: when grosbill doesn't sell anymore because all konqueror users are going to another website, they'll change it <-- all konqueror users ? you mean 0,1 % of their customers ? ;) [07:19] please, be more realistic [07:19] that's what happened with firefox at the begening [07:20] actually, the issue for me is with mozilla [07:20] but firefox is working on linux ... [07:20] AND WINDOWS !!!! [07:20] if mozilla decides to go back to the standards, then the websites will not have another choice than beeing standard compatible [07:20] the OS used by 95% of people! [07:20] that makes the difference [07:21] Tonio_: you've package kxmame it's so great but it doesn't depend on xmame ....... [07:21] Goldenear_: and konqueror soon will === lnxkde_ [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:21] marseillai: bah.......; it does no ? [07:21] Tonio_: you mean konqueror will be a native Windows app ? [07:21] Goldenear_: yes [07:21] as koffice, and as all kde [07:21] yes [07:21] Tonio_: j'ai install kxmame, il me demande aucune dpendance, se lance et me dis ; t'as pas xmame! [07:22] marseillai: je regarde [07:22] Goldenear_: qt4 is ported on windows, nativelly [07:22] but konqueror is kde dependent [07:22] not all kde will be port mais a big part of it will [07:22] Goldenear_: how so? [07:22] many people won't use it under windows if they also need to install kde [07:22] Goldenear_: many GNOME users use konqueror only [07:23] marseillai: Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 5), kdelibs-dev, cdbs, docbook2x, libxine-dev, xmame-common [07:23] Goldenear_: every kde library wich not depend too much on unix system will be port. [07:23] tricky it is not added as a dep...... marseillai I'm changing this [07:23] Goldenear_, not really have a look at this http://www.imbrandon.com/misc/kde4-osx.png [07:23] Tonio_: jdis pas le contraire hein. jdis juste que ca ne marche pas [07:23] marseillai: I'm fixing this [07:24] oki === lnxkde__ [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:25] imbrandon: but konqueror won't run on OSX with (at least some part of) kde installed on it :/ [07:25] kdelibs, big deal, vb6 apps wont run on windows without vb6 libs either , and point ? === jdong [n=jdong@ubuntu/member/jdong] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:26] I think there should 3 broswers sharing the same basis (mostly khtml): Konqueror on Linux, Safari on os X and a new one on Windows... [07:27] Safari is more or less a port of Konqueror Goldenear_ [07:27] This is the only way I see to have a real alternative to ie and ff [07:27] Riddell: installing kde355 now... [07:27] although they have dirty patches in it ;) [07:27] Safari is more or less a port of Konqueror Goldenear_ <-- I know that, but the SNCF website is working on Safari ;) [07:28] Goldenear_: because osx users are using safari, there is a chance that websites get compatible in the future [07:28] that's the point [07:28] there's a lot of differences between KHTML and safari [07:28] lots of patches [07:28] that won't get in KDE [07:28] konqueror, compared to one year ago, as fair less compatibility issues [07:28] hopefully kde 4 will use the port of safari webkit to qt [07:28] indeed.... and a sync between the two would be nice :) [07:29] is there a grub configuration tool for KDE? [07:30] Riddell, is there ppc packages there ? [07:30] ( for 355 ) [07:30] I'd like that in Kubuntu because I edit menu.lst almost every time I install K. [07:30] imbrandon: no [07:31] ahh ok, no wonder i was having issues [07:31] lol [07:31] mhb: I'd like one too, but nobody has stepped up to do one. I dont think it would be very hard to make a guidance tool for it === abattoir is tempted to raise his hand :P [07:32] abattoir: you're already doing smart! === mhb too [07:32] mhb: do it! [07:32] Riddell: well, i could do this too, edgy+1 target? [07:32] hopefully kde 4 will use the port of safari webkit to qt <-- so the only missing thing will be a win32 webkit base browser :) [07:32] or maybe mhb and me could work on it together ;) [07:32] rahhhhhhhhhhhh ! /usr/include/linux/joystick.h:131: error: '__s64' does not name a type [07:32] the error is back......... [07:33] abattoir: sure, just be careful not to work on too much stuff at once [07:33] Riddell: ok, ok :P [07:33] Tonio_: it never went away [07:33] Goldenear_: konqueror on win32 :) [07:34] I think edgy+1 target is possible [07:34] Riddell: since kxmame compiled one day, I can tell you it had went away :) [07:34] Riddell: ftbfs now, but working a moment ago [07:34] abattoir: how's smart doing, btw? [07:35] mhb: i'm working on a Qt UI for it [07:35] Riddell: I mean a browser not needing kde :) [07:38] Riddell: no errors with upgrade to kde355, now rebooting to see the difference... ;-) === Riddell waits nervously for Lure to return [07:43] Is 3.5.5 for Edgy or Dapper ? [07:44] Hawkwind: edgy [07:44] Nice [07:44] abattoir: Wait! You're sleep typing :P === Lure [n=lure@ubuntu/member/lure] has joined #kubuntu-devel [07:44] :P [07:44] Lure! === Lure is running kde355 [07:45] Lure: and? anarchy? world peace? [07:45] Riddell: session manager started my apps in wrong desktops, and it looks like I cannot move them between desktops (drag&drop) [07:45] uh oh [07:46] Riddell: even switching desktop does not work from panel ;-( === goldenear is trying to install kde4 [07:46] so kwin go foobar [07:46] Riddell: will try new profile (my is old from hoary times with some customization === serzholino [n=serzholi@16x.zp.ua] has left #kubuntu-devel [] [07:47] Riddell: it switches desktops if I click the app in taskbar, just the Desktop Pager seems to be broken [07:49] so control-F2 is broken? [07:49] Riddell: kdesu also does not work - "Conversation with su failed." [07:49] wau! [07:49] my desktop is shadded [07:49] "to check: sudo, printing, kicker height, scroll wheel, kwallet, desktop changing" [07:50] like if I would select logout, just without the logout dialog... ;-) [07:50] Riddell: big todo... :-( [07:51] Riddell: it is really funny - whole screen is shadded (I can barely read), just my mouse cursor is shinny white ;-) [07:51] Riddell: actually it is a bit lighter than logout shade - just tried it... [07:52] Riddell: maybe it is caused by Start New Session I used couple of seconds before... [07:52] it looks like I will use Dapper tommorow at work ;-) [07:53] Riddell: "kdesu (kdelibs): ERROR: su has exited while waiting for pwd." on console when running kdesu === jdong [n=jdong@ubuntu/member/jdong] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Lure logout/login to get rid of this shade === Lure [n=lure@ubuntu/member/lure] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Lure is back to edgy shine ;-) [07:56] so hmm, a few bugs then I guess [07:57] woohoo, my display config is back!! thank you! ;) [07:58] Riddell: about the gwenview translation stuff, is there a doc i can read to show me how to create the .pot file the correct way? an easy way maybe? I am new to creating package translations [07:59] nixternal: there is a gwenview-i18n tar that needs to be packaged [08:00] roger that === nixternal finds it [08:01] got it [08:03] Riddell: kontact/kmail/karm/akregator looks ok [08:03] ok..how do i go about packaging it? do i add it to the gwenview package, or is it seperate? [08:03] Lure: they havn't been packaged yet [08:03] Riddell: will have to run now, but will keep you posted if I notice something else [08:04] Lure: thanks [08:04] Riddell: ok, this is the reason they work ;-) === Ingmar^ [n=ingmar@108.38-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel [08:47] Is webmin not available for Kubuntu anywhere ? [08:50] webmin is mysteriously MIA for a while now === jdong never bothered to ask/investigate === allee [n=ach@dialin-212-144-131-195.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Ingmar^ [n=ingmar@108.38-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel [09:02] _Sime: tonio told me that you are the "master" for device gestion in kubuntu. So i ask you if it is possible to select if we want to see or not unmount device on desktop or in "support de stockage" kicker applet ? [09:04] <_Sime> marseillai: Showing Unmounted is no longer supported for the simple reason that the user doesn't need to know about details like mounting/unmounting. It should work automatically. [09:04] _Sime: yes of course [09:04] _Sime: then please change the string "Do Nothing" to something more accurate.... [09:04] <_Sime> that's the idea [09:04] <_Sime> jdong: like what? [09:04] Do Nothing gives me the impression it's safe to yank out the drive [09:04] _Sime: well, you don't want to use mount.... hmm.... [09:05] Tonio_ and I were talking about this earlier [09:05] at that time, I liked the term Mount [09:05] even "Don't open in new window" is better [09:05] <_Sime> I know. That problem with the Close button is fixed btw. [09:05] thx for that bugfix [09:06] but i can understand the fact that you disable it by default! but you should leave the option for those who want see it! for example when my usb hard drive crash i now need to mount it manually or in /media. and worse than it now i need to use command line to mount nfs instead of simply doing mount on kicker applet with dapper .... [09:06] _Sime: is there some way to show an icon for unmounted usb sticks? === Dinofly [n=dinofly@vbo91-1-82-238-217-179.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [09:06] _Sime: sometimes I'd unmount but realize I still need to do something [09:07] _Sime: or in the case of my 3 partition USB HD, I can't yank out all 3 without linux panicking (root on USB) [09:07] <_Sime> marseillai: kicker applet for unmounted NFS, _should_ be the same as before. [09:07] it isn't _Sime [09:07] and it isn't for usb key too .... [09:07] and option to show unmount device have disappear [09:09] <_Sime> jdong: short answer no. How do you "accidently" unmount it? [09:10] <_Sime> marseillai: usb keys are either inserted and ready, or removed//ready to be removed. That is model that we are trying to achieve. [09:10] _Sime: I unmount it with the intent to remove it, but later decided not to remove it, but continue using it [09:10] <_Sime> marseillai: if you want to remount you usb key, remove it and insert it. That seems simple and logical. [09:10] _Sime: my usb slots are hard to reach [09:10] and I'd rather not go for re-inserting [09:11] and for my external, I prefer to keep the fat32 partitions unmounted except when needed [09:11] I've lost a lot of data before due to linux's flaky vfat [09:11] <_Sime> external what exactly? [09:11] usb hd [09:11] it has 3 partitions [09:11] 1 ntfs, 1 fat32 , 1 linux root [09:11] I boot off of it for linux on one of my systems [09:12] <_Sime> jdong: but if you say "Safely remove" in KDE, can you then actually safely remove you USB drive? [09:12] _Sime: not technically. I can safely remove that partition if I can perform surgery on 7200rpm platters :) [09:13] <_Sime> jdong: I mean the whole drive? [09:13] no, linux is mounted on that drive [09:13] if I remove it, linux will crash [09:14] kubuntu/hal/ubuntu treats partitions 1 and 2 as usb removable devices, 3 as a linux system device [09:15] <_Sime> jdong: you've kind of a got an extreme case there. :-/ [09:16] I know I do [09:16] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/ is a bit incomplete for Kubuntu [09:16] <_Sime> jdong: I'm not sure how that can be beter handled..... a toughie. [09:16] but it's one use case that at least somewhere there needs to be the mount/unmount notion..... [09:16] maybe in the panel applet or something [09:16] or keep the unmounted device icons around [09:18] <_Sime> I'll have to have a good think about that one. I'm afraid that it doesn't really fit the model very well. Maybe I can find some sort of compromise / middleground. [09:20] <_Sime> jdong: have you got any easier bugs? 8-) === claydoh [n=clay@66.252.46.192] has joined #kubuntu-devel [09:27] Riddell: how do you workarround the joystick.h error in kdebase ? [09:27] Riddell: I can't seem to find a solution for the kxmame package [09:27] Riddell: you should theorically get the same issue in kcontrol, unless there is a fix in the code..... [09:28] _Sime: I have an easier one :) [09:28] _Sime: blank folder when browsing a cd in konq :) [09:28] _Sime: still waiting :) [09:28] Tonio_: maybe s/__s64/long long/ as a fix? (assuming the devs want signed 64 bit integer) [09:28] and yes, jdong has very complicated issues, I agree :) [09:29] <_Sime> Tonio_: cd = audio cd or CDROM? [09:29] Tonio_: I just don't compile it [09:29] Riddell: ah........ hehe :) [09:29] tvo: that's an idea, I'll investigate. [09:30] Riddell: heh, that's not possible in my case, but I'll search ;) [09:30] _Sime: audiocd [09:30] _Sime: when I insert an audio cd and wanna browse it with konq, I just get an empty folder, when audiocd:/ protocol works [09:30] <_Sime> Tonio_: browsing in the FS with konq? [09:31] _Sime: yes, browsing /media/cdrom0 [09:31] <_Sime> Tonio_: step by step, explain? [09:31] _Sime: I just insert an audio cd, then get the screen to choose action, and I choose "open with konqueror" [09:31] that opens /media/cdrom0, but the folder is empty [09:31] <_Sime> ok, gotcha [09:31] same if I browse with the system applet, of course :) [09:33] tvo, Riddell: found a topic with a kde dev suggesting to build without -ansi [09:33] seems to work, but I need to test the app deeply [09:35] ah probably __s64 is some sort of gcc extension then [09:36] tvo: probably.... [09:36] Riddell: shouldn't we ping benC concerning this issue ? [09:37] hum, yes building without -ansi works perfectly...... I'm just wondering the potential consequences..... [09:37] <_Sime> Tonio_: ok, I've just those things up on the wiki (=TODO list). [09:38] _Sime: you already had that bug no ? [09:38] _Sime: I already reported to you a few weeks ago [09:38] <_Sime> Tonio_: yes, but I forget things a lot. [09:38] _Sime: hehe :) [09:41] <_Sime> it's not that funny actually :-| [09:41] <_Sime> just kidding. :) I do forget a lot though... out of sight, out of mind with me [09:42] Tonio_ / _Sime: hehe, funny :) [09:42] I'll think of some easier bugs for you [09:43] :) [09:44] <_Sime> has anyone had any luck with pluging in digital cameras on dapper? [09:45] <_Sime> I tried yesterday with a couple and it just did not work properly. [09:45] _Sime: I plug mine in all the time. However, I don't use KDE so it doesn't automount which is how I like it actually [09:46] _Sime: is it a libgphoto camera or USB mass storage camera? [09:46] that makes a big difference === jdong_ [n=jdong@d192-24-235-141.try.wideopenwest.com] has joined #kubuntu-devel [09:46] dapper's libgphoto is a bit antiquated.... [09:46] I've wanted to backport, but didn't dare to :) === Ingmar [n=ingmar@108.38-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel [09:49] <_Sime> marseillai: usb keys are either inserted and ready, or removed//ready to be removed. That is model that we are trying to achieve. ------->> yes but some computer don't have front usb port so it can be hard to unplug/plug usb devices. and more than that i don't see the problem that can be cause by enable the possibility to show that if it's not the default setting ? [09:49] sorry for the delay [09:56] Tonio_: I did submit a bug [09:57] Tonio_: he says it's KDE's fault (and KDE says it's linux's fault) === dr_kabuto [n=franky@ppp-80-136.25-151.libero.it] has joined #kubuntu-devel [10:00] Riddell: well everyone on the web says it is kernel-header issue [10:00] Riddell: could be interesting to build kde without -ansi, since it helps building correctly.... I just wonder the consequences of this..... [10:02] <_Sime> jdong: libgphoto I think. I has working the past using KDE's camera:/ [10:02] my camera was quite buggy with dapper's libgphoto [10:02] svn builds helped :D [10:03] <_Sime> jdong: is libgphoto updated in edgy? [10:04] _Sime: considerably, yes [10:04] I've not used my camera's usb cable in a while though [10:05] (sd card reader now works in edgy. yay) [10:18] _Sime: i'm wondering. is it due to your patch on kio media:/ that several option has disappear from this configuration windows : ftp://marseillai.homelinux.org/kicker1.png for "support de stockage" kicker applets ? [10:22] _Sime: I was wondering concerning the "icons to show on the desktop", did you touch this to only give the possibility to check "mounted devices" ? [10:22] _Sime: half of the icons have dissapered [10:23] <_Sime> Tonio_: yes, and I would have removed the string "mounted" from the titles if the freeze wasn't no. [10:24] <_Sime> s/no/on/ [10:24] _Sime: see this : http://tonio.homelinux.org/tmp/capture13.png [10:24] _Sime: that can cause a few issues concerning usability [10:25] imagin I create an nfs mount point [10:25] _Sime: Then I want to see it unmounted, so that I can double click on it and it mounts automatically [10:25] _Sime: how to do this if I can't display this ? [10:26] _Sime: shouldn't we configure this in kde, but let the possibility for the user to display it if he wants ? === Ingmar^ [n=ingmar@108.38-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel [10:26] <_Sime> Tonio_: you should be able to mount it in /media using a right-mouse menu. But yeah, I need to have a closer look at that w.r.t. nfs and paritions. [10:26] _Sime: I personnally don't use this, I browse nfs with kios [10:27] <_Sime> Tonio_: I might have removed too much.. [10:27] _Sime: how to mount it in /media ? [10:27] I don't see the point [10:27] another solution is to use nfs:/ ioslave [10:30] _Sime: note that I agree to remove "unmounted floppy, cdrom dvd" etc...... [10:30] I just think that partitions and network shares should appear :) [10:31] <_Sime> right click on the mount point in /media. [10:33] _Sime: if you create a NFS mountpoint on kde desktop, via right click, create new, blabla, will it appear in /media ? [10:33] <_Sime> Tonio_: don't know, I don't think I've ever done that. :) [10:34] _Sime: hehe, that's why :) [10:34] those don't appear in /media :) [10:34] _Sime: that's why we should remove those options in kdesktop config concerning NFS and partitions [10:45] _Sime: another option is to remove the possibility to create a NFS peripherical [10:45] _Sime: kio smb doesn the trick [10:45] kio nfs, sorry [10:50] _Sime: I must say that if I had to vote, I would vote to remote the possibility to create this too.... [10:50] that's even more simple === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === Ingmar^ [n=ingmar@108.38-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde_ [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === lnxkde [n=lnxkde@206.248.91.29] has joined #kubuntu-devel === abattoir [n=abattoir@cm61.omega22.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #kubuntu-devel === mbiebl [n=michael@dslb-084-056-221-113.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel [11:51] I can't install the kde 4 package in edgy... some packages are reported to be corrupted (wrong size)... === Ingmar^ [n=ingmar@108.38-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #kubuntu-devel [11:54] kde4libs-data_3.80.1-0ubuntu1_all.deb and kdepim libs are reported to have wrong size by apt-get install :( [11:54] Riddell: do you manage the deb http://kubuntu.org/packages/kde4-3.80.1/ . repository ? [12:02] was there any recent change to the xv extension that would cause me to have dropped frames in all video players I installed (vlc, kaffeine & mplayer ) ?? [12:02] or am I facing a config issue