[12:51] <joejaxx> Kamion: may i pm you?
[12:54] <sivang> night all
[02:34] <Viper550> I ported Dapper's Usplash to Edgy
[03:57] <leonel> ei ei  Egdy with  gnome  2.16.1 ??   
[03:58] <leonel> Nice !
[03:58] <leonel> just updated and came gnome-applets 2.16.1
[03:59] <leonel> thanks  guys really  great Job
[05:33] <kinema> I'm looking for documentation and/or specifications on how deb package repositories are formatted.
[05:33] <kinema> Directory hierarchies, packages.gz, etc...
[05:36] <kinema> never mind.. i just found the repository howto at debian
[05:38] <fabbione> morning
[05:39] <Hobbsee> hey fabbione 
[05:39] <fabbione> hey Hobbsee 
[06:13] <jdong> holy crap the git tree looks busy :)
[06:13] <jdong> am I reading correctly that edgy will have HT off by default, can be enabled via ht=on?
[06:15] <fabbione> jdong: it has been like that since hoary or breezy
[06:15] <fabbione> jdong: that's to circumvent an hw security flow in ht design
[06:15] <jdong> fabbione: oh, ok
[06:15] <fabbione> jdong: we can't fix it, but we can leave the option to the users
[06:15] <fabbione> neither upstream is interested in working around a hw bug
[06:15] <jdong> fabbione: thanks for the info... yeah I remember reading about that somewhere
[06:16] <BlingBonk] > Anyone Heard of Richard Stallman
[06:16] <fabbione> no problem
[06:16] <jdong> just as a thought
[06:16] <fabbione> jdong: no, it's something that has been there forever
[06:16] <fabbione> pointless
[06:16] <jdong> ok
[07:25] <fabbione> tfheen: ping?
[09:03] <tfheen> fabbione: hello
[09:03] <fabbione> heyya
[09:03] <fabbione> tfheen: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/xorg.debdiff <-
[09:05] <tfheen> fabbione: uh, that looks bogus.
[09:05] <fabbione> ?
[09:05] <tfheen> hmm, no
[09:05] <tfheen> sorry, mea culpa.
[09:05] <tfheen> ok, go ahead.
[09:05] <fabbione> ok thanks
[09:13] <Burgundavia> ajmitch: krb5-auth-dialog <-- this SoC work?
[09:13] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: that's RH code
[09:13] <ajmitch> I have to resubmit other code to NEW
[09:36] <fabbione> tfheen: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/xserver-xorg-video-ati.debdiff <- the debdiff looks huge because i did fix some packaging errors but the real changes are much more contained.
[09:40] <tfheen> fabbione: you're aware that we're not in "everything must be reviewed before upload" mode just yet?  I don't know that code well enough to judge, so if you want a second pair of eyes, better to ask rodarvus
[09:43] <fabbione> tfheen: yes i am aware.. i am confident about the changes. i just wanted to make sure changes were not too intrusive
[09:44] <tfheen> fabbione: that's hard to say when I don't know the code base. :-)
[09:44] <fabbione> fair enough :)
[09:47] <sivang> morning
[09:59] <Keybuk> elmo: ping
[10:05] <Keybuk> uhh
[10:06] <Keybuk> what the fuck is up with the wiki?
[10:06] <Keybuk> I just edited a page, and it errored, and then DELETED the page
[10:06] <Burgundavia> Keybuk: welcome to the wiki
[10:06] <Treenaks> moin + disk full?
[10:06] <Burgundavia> luckily the page history is still there, and can be restored
[10:06] <Keybuk> how?
[10:07] <Burgundavia> the get info linki
[10:07] <ajmitch> some crazy people subscribe to the whole wiki, too
[10:07] <Burgundavia> however, you cannot restore the page until the saving bug is fixed
[10:07] <Keybuk> Burgundavia: "Missing 'current' file" when I try that
[10:08] <Burgundavia> Keybuk: you can view the old revision there
[10:08] <Seveas> Keybuk, grab a large heavy object and chase the canonical sysadmins
[10:09] <Burgundavia> Seveas: indeed. He works for the people AND is in the same country
[10:10] <Keybuk> and I know where they live
[10:10] <Seveas> someone should warn them for an incoming keybuk
[10:12] <sivang> "One guided Keybuk coming at 12:00 O'clock. His considered armed and dangerous"
[10:13] <Treenaks> Seveas: what? a bunker made out of enriched uranium? :P
[10:13] <sivang> hehe
[10:38] <robban> Any date when an official cd will be released with this fix? https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.15/+bug/57265
[10:38] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 57265 in linux-source-2.6.15 "Return value of slave_configure in scsi_scan.c is ignored" [Undecided,Fix committed]  
[10:39] <Keybuk> syndicate scott# modprobe nvidia
[10:39] <Keybuk> Not loading nvidia module; not used in /etc/X11/xorg.conf
[10:39] <Keybuk> \o/
[10:39] <Keybuk> mjg59: ^
[10:40] <seb128> Keybuk: hi. could you sync pilot-link (bug #63654), it's required to fix the ftbfs on evolution? 
[10:40] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 63654 in pilot-link "Please sync pilot-link (main) from unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/63654
[10:41] <Keybuk> seb128: yeah, it's archive day today
[10:41] <Keybuk> just fixing up this first
[10:41] <seb128> ok :)
[10:49] <mjg59> Keybuk: Thanks!
[10:50] <Treenaks> hmm.. LaptopTestingTeam has vanished from the wiki
[10:50] <Treenaks> Burgundavia?
[10:50] <Keybuk> mjg59: 
[10:50] <Keybuk> install if cat /etc/X11/xorg.conf 2>/dev/null | tr A-Z a-z | sed -n -e '/^[ \t] *section[ \t] *"device"/,/^[ \t] *endsection/{/^[ \t] *driver[ \t] */{s/^[ \t] *driver[ \t] *"*//;s/"*[ \t] *$//;p}}' | grep -q -w nvidia; then modprobe --ignore-install -Qb  nvidia; else echo "Not loading nvidia module; not used in /etc/X11/xorg.conf" 1>&2; fi
[10:50] <mjg59> Keybuk: Needs te same for nvidia-legacy
[10:50] <Keybuk> mjg59: I did
[10:50] <mjg59> But other than that, hurrah
[10:50] <mjg59> Rock
[10:50] <mjg59> And fglrx?
[10:51] <Keybuk> we could do fglrx
[10:51] <_ion> Doesn't \s work as [ \t]  in sed? I might remember wrong.
[10:51] <Keybuk> _ion: no
[10:51] <_ion> Ok.
[10:51] <Keybuk> and that isn't a useless-use-of-cat-award either
[10:51] <Keybuk> cat is used so I can capture and hide the "file not found" message, without losing any parsing error messages
[10:54] <_ion> mjg59: Feeling better now?
[10:54] <Kamion> _ion: no, [[:space:] ]  does though
[10:54] <_ion> kamion: Yep. :-)
[10:54] <Keybuk> Kamion: that took longer to type :p
[10:54] <Kamion> robban: not at present, since a fixed package hasn't even been uploaded yet
[10:54] <mjg59> _ion: Somewhat
[10:55] <Kamion> robban: we have no schedule for a second point release of dapper at present
[10:55] <mjg59> Lots of real world work to do, but I'll try to take a look at usplash
[10:55] <Keybuk> Kamion: it also only obeys the first use of [[:space:] ] 
[10:55] <Kamion> Keybuk: huh?
[10:55] <Keybuk> if you do ^[[:space:] ] *section[[:space:] ] *
[10:55] <Keybuk> it won't expand the second one
[10:55] <Kamion> seriously? that's a rather crap bug
[10:55] <Keybuk> something to do with "performance reasons"
[10:56] <mjg59> _ion: Which bug number has your patch?
[10:56] <mjg59> I'll try to fit that in today
[10:56] <_ion> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/usplash/+bug/62865/comments/1
[10:56] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62865 in usplash "1024x768 with nVidia GeForce4 Ti 4800 SE: "screen init failed"" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[10:56] <mjg59> Kamion: Having thought about things, it might be the case that we want usplash's resolution algorithm to be dependent on whether the machine is a laptop or not
[10:57] <mjg59> Kamion: vesa sometimes uses different timings to X. If we use the X modes on machines with analogue outputs, there's more of a chance of us going outside the monitor's frequency range
[10:59] <Kamion> we need to order things such that usplash is configured after X anyway, so I'm not too bothered about the exact details of what usplash.postinst does
[10:59] <Kamion> I'll try to sort that out this week
[10:59] <Keybuk> mjg59: what's the fglrx source package, module name and X driver name?
[10:59] <mjg59> Keybuk: xorg-driver-fglrx, fglrx, fglrx
[11:00] <Burgundavia> Treenaks: the wiki is currently having major issues
[11:01] <Treenaks> Burgundavia: quite..
[11:03] <Keybuk> mjg59: which source does the module come in?
[11:03] <mjg59> Keybuk: linux-restricted-modules
[11:03] <Keybuk> it doesn't have an equivalent of nvidia-kernel-common ?
[11:04] <mjg59> No
[11:06] <Keybuk> ok
[11:06] <Keybuk> I guess you can only install the X driver once :)
[11:09] <seaLne> has anyone seen this:
[11:09] <seaLne> apt-get: error while loading shared libraries: /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6: invalid ELF header
[11:09] <seaLne> it nly happened on one of my machines, dist-upgrade failed and reruning gives that
[11:14] <mjg59> seaLne: What does file /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6 say?
[11:15] <seaLne> symbolic link to `libstdc++.so.6.0.8'
[11:15] <mjg59> seaLne: And file /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6.0.8?
[11:15] <seaLne> and its data
[11:15] <mjg59> Your libstdc++ is corrupt somehow
[11:15] <seaLne> yeah different md5sum
[11:16] <seaLne> any suggestions?
[11:17] <mjg59> Reinstall it
[11:17] <ajmitch> & run fsck when you can
[11:19] <seaLne> http://rafb.net/paste/results/izapeC23.html
[11:20] <_ion> Your HDD seems seriously corrupted.
[11:21] <seaLne> ok, if its just my problem thats good
[11:28] <Keybuk> ah, this must be some new definition of "good" I wasn't previously aware of
[11:29] <seaLne> bad for me good for everyone else :-/
[11:30] <Keybuk> this should save on heating bills
[11:31] <_ion> It was too buggy. :-)
[11:35] <robban> Kamion: Ok, thanks
[12:02] <minghua> Keybuk: does debian-change-only syncs (no new upstream tarball) requires UVF too now?
[12:03] <minghua> I was looking at bug 62824
[12:03] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62824 in mayavi "[Sync Request]  mayavi 1.5-4 from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Rejected]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62824
[12:03] <Keybuk> no
[12:04] <Keybuk> I may not have had my glasses on there :)
[12:04] <minghua> Keybuk: thanks
[12:05] <ajmitch> how can I make initramfs a bit more verbose on boot so I can see where it is dying?
[12:05] <Tonio_> Keybuk: hi ! I was searching for someone who could promote a few packages to main...
[12:05] <Tonio_> Keybuk: they all have been accepted by pitti already
[12:06] <Keybuk> Tonio_: are they seeded?
[12:07] <Tonio_> Keybuk: yes
[12:07] <Keybuk> which packages?
[12:07] <Keybuk> ajmitch: remove "quiet"
[12:07] <Tonio_> Keybuk: digikam is seeded, the 2 other packages are dependancies
[12:07] <Tonio_> Keybuk: source packages are : digikam, dcraw, libkexif
[12:07] <Keybuk> Tonio_: ok, they'll be done today then
[12:07] <ajmitch> Keybuk: already removed
[12:07] <Tonio_> same for binaries
[12:08] <ajmitch> not booting with usplash, so I don't think I'm running into the nvidia bug there
[12:08] <Tonio_> Keybuk: source package digikam also produces binary "showphoto", but this one can stay in universe
[12:08] <ajmitch> I'll try with another kernel
[12:08] <Tonio_> Keybuk: thanks!
[12:09] <olemke> seaLne, have you just tried rebooting and see if the problem goes away? I had exactly the same problem with some of the edgy kernels, random libraries were corrupted, but were fine again after a reboot.
[12:09] <seb128> ogra: are you going the fix the "opengl screensavers should be used only on boxes with graphical acceleration available" issue for edgy?
[12:10] <seaLne> olemke: yeah i rebooted but still the same problem, running badblocks to see if there is actually a disk problem
[12:11] <olemke> seaLne, ok, then it might be really a hardware problem :-(
[12:11] <ajmitch> hm, might have just been the xen kernel I was using, something else to complain to zul_ about :)
[12:11] <seaLne> olemke: few week old disk... *shrug*
[12:11] <elmo> ok, wiki should be back now - no data or changes were lost, but RecentChanges for the last 10 hours is missing - the history on individual pages is still retained though
[12:12] <ajmitch> thanks, elmo 
[12:13] <Kamion> BenC: uh - there's no linux-restricted-modules-2.6.17-10-powerpc64-smp, so should linux-restricted-modules-powerpc64-smp maybe be removed again?
[12:19] <doko_> Keybuk: bug 50811, which ones?
[12:19] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 50811 in libservlet2.4-java "Broken Dependancy" [Undecided,Rejected]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/50811
[12:21] <Keybuk> the change to use java-gcj-compat ?
[12:21] <Kamion> doko_: https://launchpad.net/people/doko/+packages lists a number of build failures under "Uploaded packages", which appear to be part of what's causing openoffice.org-gcj to be uninstallable. Could you look at those?
[12:21] <Keybuk> you didn't respond when asked
[12:22] <Kamion> libxalan2-java, libxerces2-java, bsh are the ones I noticed
[12:22] <doko_> Keybuk: you did?
[12:23] <doko_> Kamion: will do, although it's bank holiday
[12:23] <Keybuk> doko: you're subscribed to that bug, and there's a comment asking for your opinion
[12:24] <Kamion> doko_: whenever it's convenient
[12:24] <doko_> Keybuk: so dholbach's "go ahead" was not good enough? anyway, I'll look at it
[12:24] <Keybuk> doko: no
[12:25] <minghua> doko_, Keybuk: I think you guys misunderstood each other.  Keybuk is rejecting because it can't be synced, as we need -3ubuntu1 instead of -3 to keep ubuntu changes, right?
[12:27] <Keybuk> minghua: right
[12:28] <seb128> any reason beagle binary is to universe?
[12:28] <Keybuk> from my reading of the report, it needs to be merged, and not sync'd
[12:28] <Keybuk> and dholbach merely approved that
[12:28] <seb128> beagle-dev and src package are to main
[12:28] <Keybuk> seb128: it's in anastacia output, so I'm gonna look at it in a bit
[12:28] <mneptok> oh, duh. the Germans are all off today.
[12:28] <Kamion> seb128: I just promoted it about two minutes before you said that :)
[12:28] <seb128> Kamion: thank you
[12:29] <Kamion> (was cleaning up CD uninstallables)
[12:29] <tseng> Kamion rules
[12:29] <seb128> could somebody give a retry to nautilus and yelp builds then? ;)
[12:29] <seb128> they failed because beagle-dev was not uninstallable (it Depends on beagle)
[12:30] <tseng> (we still cant find the DD to tell us why he did so)
[12:30] <tseng> it was never that way before
[12:31] <tseng> if we can revert it beagle binary could be demoted if that was intentional
[12:40] <ogra> seb128, i'll surely look into it, but i cant promise it will be non intrusive enough to enter edgy
[12:40] <ogra> mneptok, ouch, my back
[12:44] <Keybuk> slomo or siretart: around?
[12:44] <sivang> mneptok: sent
[12:44] <sivang> mneptok: hope it's understandable and readable :-)
[12:45] <siretart> Keybuk: yes, (sort of)
[12:45] <Kamion> Keybuk: did you promote jack-audio-connection-kit and friends?
[12:45] <Kamion> or did you fix whatever was pulling them in?
[12:45] <Keybuk> Kamion: neither
[12:45] <Kamion> must've gone away by itself
[12:46] <Keybuk> siretart: network-manager-pptp is in NEW
[12:46] <Keybuk> does this have a freeze exception?
[12:46] <Kamion> Keybuk: didn't the first upload predate the freeze?
[12:46] <Kamion>   102437 | S- | network-manager-pptp | 0.6.3+cvs20060819-0u | two days
[12:46] <Kamion>   101122 | S- | network-manager-pptp | 0.6.3+cvs20060819-0u | five days
[12:47] <Keybuk> Kamion: it was after the mail went out
[12:47] <Kamion> ah, didn't check that closely
[12:47] <Keybuk> several hours after
[12:48] <siretart> Keybuk: I don't remember a malone bug about it. who uploaded it?
[12:49] <mjg59> Ngh.
[12:49] <Keybuk> siretart: nobody I've heard of
[12:49] <siretart> hm
[12:49] <mjg59> Has the network-manager "Create network" feature ever worked?
[12:49] <Kamion> oh, heh, I think type-handling is a subtle germinate bug to do with % (whole-source) processing
[12:49] <mjg59> Because it really doesn't seem to now
[12:49] <giftnudel> mjg59: yes, it does
[12:49] <Keybuk> mjg59: yes
[12:49] <giftnudel> well, it did
[12:49] <Keybuk> but that doesn't do what you think
[12:49] <Keybuk> that creates an ad-hoc network with that name
[12:49] <tepsipakki> would it be possible for the dapper-backports -changes to contain the changelog compared to the previous version?
[12:49] <giftnudel> Keybuk: yes, I have done this before
[12:49] <Keybuk> siretart: Craig Box
[12:50] <tepsipakki> now the changelogs are useless, since they only have "automated backport upload..". Where to file a bug?
[12:51] <giftnudel> ubuntu-meta?
[12:51] <mjg59> Keybuk: Yes, that's what I'd expected
[12:51] <mjg59> Instead, I got it appearing to attempt to DHCP
[12:51] <Keybuk> mjg59: oh, then yes, it seems to work
[12:51] <Keybuk> yeah it does that
[12:51] <Keybuk> and when the dhcp fails, it falls back to a link-local
[12:52] <mjg59> And finally timing out and dropping back to there being no network
[12:52] <Keybuk> oh
[12:52] <Kamion> giftnudel: no, ubuntu-meta is almost never the right place
[12:52] <Keybuk> it's entirely possible all that is broken in Ubuntu :)
[12:52] <mjg59> Keybuk: Heh
[12:52] <Kamion> tepsipakki: file it without a source package and subscribe ubuntu-archive - it's a script that we haven't got round to getting into soyuz yet
[12:52] <mjg59> Keybuk: It'd be good if someone else could give it a quick check, and make sure it's not just me
[12:52] <giftnudel> Kamion: well, I thought for such stuff not belonging to a package
[12:52] <Kamion> giftnudel: no
[12:53] <tepsipakki> Kamion: ok, will do
[12:53] <Kamion> giftnudel: if it doesn't belong to a source package, don't enter a source package at all
[12:53] <giftnudel> oh, ok
[12:53] <Kamion> giftnudel: otherwise the few things that really do belong to ubuntu-meta get buried in crap
[12:53] <giftnudel> right, that shows Ubuntu, correct?
[12:53] <Kamion> yes
[12:53] <Keybuk> mjg59: the only laptop I have here is this one
[12:53] <Keybuk> (in a working state, that is)
[12:53] <giftnudel> Kamion: well, I forgot you can file a bug without a package, thanks
[12:56] <ajmitch> Keybuk: first nm-pptp upload predated the freeze by several hours
[12:56] <siretart> Keybuk: never heared about him as well
[12:56] <Keybuk> ajmitch: it still appears to post-date it for me
[12:56] <ajmitch> Keybuk: at least I recall uploading it in the morning before the freeze was announced
[12:57] <Keybuk> oh hmm
[12:57] <Keybuk> maybe you're right
[12:58] <Keybuk> ajmitch: gktools rejected; copying, the source files, and debian/copyright disagree
[12:59] <StevenK> Nice!
[12:59] <ajmitch> hm
[12:59] <ajmitch> I thought I'd checked that one over 
[01:01] <ajmitch> Keybuk: just the missing LGPL eggtryicon.*?
[01:01] <Keybuk> ajmitch: COPYING is GPL
[01:01] <Keybuk> source is LGPL
[01:02] <Keybuk> this requires upstream intervention
[01:02] <StevenK> And debian/copyright says MIT? :-P
[01:02] <ajmitch> I must have been blind there
[01:02] <ajmitch> I'll try & track them down
[01:02] <Keybuk> I like this one
[01:02] <Keybuk> the author has pasted their standard GPL preamble at the top of every source file
[01:02] <Keybuk> including those copied from gettext
[01:03] <herzi> tfheen: are you at work today?
[01:08] <tfheen> herzi: yes
[01:08] <ogra> herzi, we didnt unite with norway yet so there is no bank holiday :)
[01:10] <simira> germans...
[01:11] <ogra> heh
[01:11] <ajmitch> we'll see if the gktools author responds..
[01:11] <ogra> simira, it would gain you an extra fee day ;)
[01:12] <ogra> *free
[01:13] <sivang> mneptok: did my email reach you ?
[01:20] <Keybuk> lfittl: ping?
[01:21] <herzi> tfheen: can you take a look at the casper bug report on launchpad then, please?
[01:21] <tfheen> herzi: which bug?
[01:21] <herzi> the one i asked you about on sunday
[01:22] <lfittl> Keybuk: pong
[01:22] <herzi> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/casper/+bug/63277
[01:22] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 63277 in casper "Doesn't work from USB devices" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[01:22] <Keybuk> lfittl: I'm rejecting glest and glest-data I'm afraid
[01:22] <tfheen> herzi: have you tried with today's daily?
[01:22] <Keybuk> glest is GPL 2, but glest-data has no permission for modification
[01:23] <Keybuk> so glest-data could go into multiverse
[01:23] <Keybuk> but the strict dependency between the two implies a GPL violation to me
[01:23] <lfittl> Keybuk: hmm
[01:23] <Keybuk> if it were a suggests, and glest could function without the data, then I wouldn't have a problem
[01:23] <lfittl> Keybuk: and how about putting glest into multiverse as well?
[01:24] <lfittl> Keybuk: GPL violation also applies to art and code?
[01:24] <Keybuk> lfittl: like I said, the fact there's a dependency there implies a GPL violation to me
[01:24] <Keybuk> the two aren't functionally different entities
[01:24] <Keybuk> so shipping them together means that the data must be GPL also, under the terms of the GPL
[01:24] <lfittl> Keybuk: ok, thats unfortunate, will try to contact upstream about that, thanks
[01:24] <Keybuk> if the data could be replaced, or glest could work without it, then I would agree that they were different things
[01:24] <lfittl> yep, understood
[01:25] <mneptok> sivang: it did, thanks.
[01:25] <mneptok> sivang: i will pass along the action items
[01:25] <Keybuk> I'm erring on a slightly strict side of "intent of the licence" rather than "letter of the licence"
[01:25] <herzi> tfheen: no, not yet
[01:25] <herzi> tfheen: is that supposed to be fixed?
[01:26] <lfittl> Keybuk: what would be your proposed solution for upstream? release the art under a different license?
[01:26] <Keybuk> lfittl: release the art under a licence that permits modification
[01:26] <Keybuk> and GPL compatible, obviously
[01:26] <tfheen> herzi: yes
[01:26] <Keybuk> given their current text of the art licence permits more free distribution than the GPL allows, I suggest MIT
[01:26] <Keybuk> or just GPL the artwork
[01:27] <lfittl> k, and if they don't want to do that, we need at least some sample art that has a gpl compatible license
[01:27] <Keybuk> then they should release the source under a different (or dual) licence, such that we are permitted to distribute it with the artwork
[01:27] <Hobbsee> Keybuk: @ https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gaim-librvp/+bug/63684  <-- remove the one that's in the archive.
[01:27] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 63684 in gaim-librvp "Please remove gaim-librvp from the archive" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
[01:28] <Keybuk> Hobbsee: which one is in the archive?
[01:28] <Hobbsee> 0.8-1
[01:28] <Keybuk> BZZZT
[01:28] <Keybuk> incorrect answer
[01:28] <Hobbsee> the version for 2.x hasnt been written yet :P
[01:28] <Keybuk> 0.9-1 is in the archive
[01:28] <Keybuk> it just hasn't built
[01:28] <Hobbsee> right, so my system....
[01:28] <Hobbsee> ah.  i checked that originally
[01:28] <Hobbsee> just cheated and ran apt-cache policy to check
[01:28] <Hobbsee> indeed, you're right.
[01:29] <Keybuk> lfittl: ironically, it's distribution that's the problem -- if we didn't attempt to distribute the artwork at all, and it was up to the user to download it an put it in the right place, then I wouldn't be concerned either
[01:29] <Keybuk> because then we're not violating the GPL by forcing GPL and non-free packages together
[01:29] <Keybuk> we're just shipping an incomplete (but free) source :)
[01:32] <lfittl> heh, I always hate license problems ;)
[01:35] <BenC> Kamion: There should be. The last lrm upload I did enabled it
[01:40] <ajmitch> Keybuk: well, I got a quick reply on the gktools issue :)
[01:43] <Kamion> BenC: ah, it failed to build: http://librarian.launchpad.net/4625766/buildlog_ubuntu-edgy-powerpc.linux-restricted-modules-2.6.17_2.6.17.5-8_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[01:44] <BenC> Kamion: Ok, I'll fix that and reupload
[01:44] <Kamion> thanks
[01:44] <ogra> hmm
[01:45] <BenC> no madwifi for ppc64
[01:45] <ogra> am i supposed to have the ppc *and* the ppc64 linux-image on the powerpc CD 
[01:45] <shawarma> Does anyone know where pitti is?
[01:45] <ajmitch> shawarma: holiday in .de today
[01:45] <BenC> ogra: Yeah, it can dual boot
[01:45] <Kamion> ogra: yes
[01:45] <shawarma> ajmitch: so back tomorrow?
[01:46] <ajmitch> shawarma: I'd presume so, I can't be certain though :)
[01:46] <shawarma> ajmitch: Ok, that's fine. thanks.
[01:49] <ajmitch> sigh, trying to convince an upstream of licensing problems is tedious
[01:56] <tseng> ajmitch: i hope it isnt RML
[01:57] <ajmitch> nope
[01:57] <ajmitch> damn, should have plugged the laptop in
[01:57] <tseng> you mentioned to me missing gpl header, i told him in person
[01:57] <tseng> he was not thrilled
[01:57] <tseng> heh
[01:57] <ajmitch> g-p-m didn't warn me of battery going flat
[01:58] <tseng> is there any way to turn off the beep, tw
[01:58] <tseng> btw
[01:58] <ajmitch> what beep?
[02:01] <gnomefreak> Kamion: when you get a sec. with livecd installer grub gets put on MBR correct? I always get an error 15 file not found after grub comes up i choose ubuntu. this is dual boot with win 2k pro and edgy
[02:02] <tfheen> anybody got an idea about https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/casper/+bug/63398 ?  It's clearly not a casper bug.  I could just say "mdadm and lvm2 were removed on purpose, rejected"
[02:02] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 63398 in casper "[regression]  live cd doesn't support lvm/md (software raid) devices" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[02:20] <Kamion> gnomefreak: yes, it goes on the MBR. I think you might need somebody who can cope with grub better than I can
[02:20] <gnomefreak> Kamion: ok ty
[02:27] <Kamion> gnomefreak: could be it's pointing at the wrong device or something
[02:28] <gnomefreak> ill look into it i have to set edgy up on other pc this week so i will see if it happens on that one too. i didnt know if this was a bug that was known. i couldnt locate any on LP about it
[02:38] <bddebian> Howdy folks
[02:39] <seb128> hi bddebian
[02:39] <Keybuk> hmm
[02:39] <bddebian> Hello seb128
[02:39] <Keybuk> when a printer doesn't actually print anything
[02:39] <Keybuk> that means it's broken?
[02:39] <seb128> Keybuk, infinity: could you give a build retry to nautilus, yelp, evolution ?
[02:40] <bddebian> Keybuk: Won't print a test page from itself?
[02:40] <Keybuk> bddebian: it prints it
[02:40] <Keybuk> but doesn't actually put any ink on the paper
[02:40] <bddebian> Change the toner/ink? ;-)
[02:41] <imbrandon> could be a dry inkwell
[02:41] <Keybuk> seb128: edgy?
[02:41] <Keybuk> bddebian: done that
[02:41] <bddebian> Keybuk: Is it a laser or ink jet?
[02:42] <Keybuk> ink jet
[02:42] <bddebian> Hmm
[02:42] <bddebian> You pulled the little plastic strip off the cartridges?
[02:42] <Keybuk> there wasn't one
[02:43] <bddebian> Sorry, does it have a head cleaning option, or can you see any gunk built up on the head?
[02:43] <imbrandon> yea thats what i was gonna say check the heads ( if its not one that has new heads on the ink carts )
[02:43] <seb128> Keybuk: yep
[02:47] <Keybuk> bddebian: from fixyourownprinter.com, it seems it's a common problem with this printer model
[02:47] <Keybuk> and it's a hardware failure
[02:50] <bddebian> Joy
[03:10] <Keybuk> doko: libjfreechart-java will need a rebuild?
[03:10] <Keybuk> likewise libjcommon-java
[03:13] <Keybuk> Tonio_: ping
[03:16] <moi1392> hello, I have a feature request for ubuntu and want to submit it here before launchpad to be sure it make sense
[03:17] <seb128> moi1392: hi
[03:17] <moi1392> seb128: :) hello
[03:19] <moi1392> it's about xorg, I frequetly see on forum poeple that configure bad xorg and then it fail to load ! it's specially critical with newbies because the only way for them is to reinstall all the system !
[03:19] <seb128> what do you suggest to solve that?
[03:20] <moi1392> I wonder if it's a good idea to have a static second config file (for example /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf) that is set at the installation time and never change, then, if xorg fail to load with /etc/X11/xorg.conf, it could try with that more failsafe config file
[03:20] <moi1392> it's a low term and low cost solution, but could really help many poeple !!
[03:21] <Amaranth> I wonder though, how someone would manage to break xorg in a stable release but not know how to fix it.
[03:21] <moi1392> I don't know anything about X development, but i'm sure it not that hard to implement
[03:22] <moi1392> Amaranth: many poeple try to change their xorg.conf option for some (not alays good) reason and then the server fail to load
[03:22] <tepsipakki> the static file would not work if the user changed the adapter
[03:23] <tepsipakki> ..which uses different driver
[03:23] <Amaranth> the real solution is adapter and monitor autodetection
[03:23] <seb128> moi1392: users should not touch something like that if they don't know what they are doing
[03:23] <moi1392> tepsipakki: we could use the vesa driver for example, it's a "failsafe" solution only
[03:23] <Amaranth> tepsipakki: not really, vesa would still work
[03:23] <tepsipakki> of course
[03:23] <Amaranth> But if you switch PCI slots it'll probably fail
[03:23] <moi1392> seb128: i'm agree, but users touch it !
[03:23] <seb128> moi1392: and they learn to not touch it again then :p
[03:24] <pepsiman> monitor autodetection doesn't work when the monitor is off
[03:24] <Amaranth> I meant monitor hotplug
[03:24] <Tonio_> Keybuk: pong
[03:25] <pepsiman> Amaranth: now that would be cool
[03:25] <Amaranth> it's possible, apparently it was demoed at GUADEC
[03:25] <Amaranth> anyway, time to go
[03:25] <moi1392> seb128: yes, but the first time, the X fail to load and the user is angry against ubnutu and not against itself because he broke it !
[03:26] <tepsipakki> maybe the error message should say something about a mirror ;)
[03:26] <Keybuk> Tonio_: digikam moved to main for you
[03:26] <Tonio_> Keybuk: great, and same for its 2 deps I assume ?
[03:26] <seb128> moi1392: not a lot we can do against people blaming somebody else when they break something
[03:27] <Kamion> moi1392: at present, there's no one xorg.conf file that would work properly for everyone
[03:27] <Keybuk> yup
[03:27] <moi1392> seb128: yes, we can work to avoid that think to be broken *so easyly* (ok, actually, not that so easyly...)
[03:27] <Kamion> moi1392: X upstream is working on full autodetection, so that under normal circumstances you won't need xorg.conf at all
[03:27] <Tonio_> Keybuk: okay thanks, I'm updating kubuntu-desktop
[03:27] <Kamion> moi1392: that will solve this problem much better
[03:28] <moi1392> Kamion: I know that, but my idea is only a low term solution, and since *it looks* (may be i'm wrong here..) easy to implement, it could be a good idea
[03:28] <Kamion> doesn't sound trivial to implement to me
[03:29] <Kamion> if you want to prove me wrong by means of a patch, you're welcome ;)
[03:29] <moi1392> Kamion: if I remember well, you can give the xorg config file at a parameter to /usr/bin/X, so if it fail to load, simply retry with a parameter :)
[03:29] <Kamion> but at present I doubt there's an xorg.conf which will work on all hardware, which brings you back to autodetection, which brings you back to files that people sometimes need to edit and will sometimes screw up
[03:30] <Kamion> moi1392: doesn't really help, see above
[03:30] <moi1392> Kamion: I take a look at this later today :)
[03:30] <Kamion> ultimately, if people are going to go and edit system files by hand, there's only so far you can go to protect them
[03:31] <Kamion> because you'll find that somebody will write a howto that tells people to edit your next layer of protection
[03:31] <Kamion> and then you need a third layer
[03:31] <Kamion> and it all gets totally mad
[03:31] <Keybuk> Kamion: odd, ubuntu-desktop depends on libgnome2-perl, which depends libgtk2-perl, which depends libcairo-perl, which is in universe
[03:31] <Keybuk> how do the CDs build?
[03:31] <Keybuk> ah
[03:31] <Keybuk> it's a build dep
[03:31] <Keybuk> sorry
[03:31] <moi1392> Kamion: agree with that ! but again, it's a short term solution that can prevent some poeple saying aroud "ubuntu is bad, I just miss to change something, or try to install some driver and it doesn't work anymore..."
[03:32] <Kamion> moi1392: short-term solutions that invent extra files that we then have to carry around for ever, upgrade, etc. are often worse than no solutions, I'm afraid
[03:33] <Kamion> one has to be careful about which hacks one decides to introduce ...
[03:33] <moi1392> Kamion: I have no good answer to that :/ you take a point.
[03:34] <Kamion> moi1392: a better answer might be a way to get to a safe mode from a boot option, like we already have on the live CD
[03:34] <Kamion> though we already have "recovery mode" which is single-user, so the wording would be difficult at the grub menu
[03:35] <Keybuk> it'd make sense to merge the two anyway
[03:36] <Keybuk> single-user could still be an X server
[03:36] <Kamion> what, have sulogin ask "do you want to continue booting to X?" or something?
[03:36] <Keybuk> or just not bother with sulogin at all?
[03:36] <Keybuk> and just leave that there for people who know about kernel command-line options
[03:36] <Kamion> bit concerned that we'd be breaking some recovery cases where you do need sulogin
[03:37] <thom> yeah, that sounds like a really bad idea tbh
[03:37] <Kamion> we shouldn't call it "single-user" if it starts X
[03:37] <Keybuk> which need sulogin?
[03:37] <Kamion> if rc2 is fucked
[03:37] <Keybuk> we don't call it "single-user", we call it "recovery mode"
[03:37] <Kamion> 14:36 < Keybuk> single-user could still be an X server
[03:37] <Keybuk> sorry, I meant the grub option
[03:37] <Kamion> ok
[03:38] <Kamion> yeah, don't massively object to tat
[03:38] <Kamion> that
[03:38] <thom> right
[03:41] <elmo> hmm, what now?
[03:41] <Keybuk> oh, just demoting nagios to universe ;)
[03:41] <Keybuk> (actually, I'm not, I promoted its deps -- they were split from a package that was previously in main)
[03:42] <elmo> I'd be surprised if nagios was ever in main
[03:42] <elmo> it's not something I can imagine pitti endorsing without violence involved
[03:42] <Kamion>     nagios | 2:1.3-0+pre6 |         hoary | source
[03:42] <Keybuk> it has the comment "# SECURITAH REVIEW" next to it
[03:43] <Keybuk> I'm entirely happy to put it in universe
[03:43] <elmo> I'm easy, I think we should, if only because it's superseded by nagios2
[03:44] <elmo> btw - what's the best way for someone as lazy as me to get xvnc4viewer into main?
[03:44] <elmo> xvncviewer is buggy to the point of unsuability
[03:44] <Keybuk> oh, well then
[03:44] <StevenK> elmo: Hack the xfree86 source of the bastard so it builds?
[03:44] <StevenK> s/of/out of/
[03:44] <StevenK> That was the situation last I looked at it, if I recall.
[03:44] <elmo> StevenK: xvncviewer has the same problem?
[03:45] <StevenK> elmo: Graah. My memory isn't quite that good.
[03:45] <StevenK> IOW, I'm not sure.
[03:50] <seb128> infinity: do you know why http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/ddebs/pool/main/e/evolution-exchange/ has no i386 version? the package has built on i386 before amd64
[03:58] <sebest> anybody knows why /proc/net/dev is not updated in real time on ubuntu, it seesm to be updated every 1/2 seconds
[04:00] <Keybuk> is it updated in real time on any other distrbution?
[04:03] <StevenK> elmo: Can I suggest you bug pitti? He was the one that pointed out that vnc{,4} still contained Xfree86 code in the source tree, and he may know what it will take to get the damn thing promoted.
[04:03] <elmo> StevenK: yeah, will, do thanks
[04:04] <StevenK> elmo: No problem.
[04:06] <sebest> Keybuk, yes it seems
[04:06] <sebest> Keybuk, when i do this : for i in `seq 1 1000` ; do cat /proc/net/dev | grep eth0; done
[04:06] <sebest> on my custom kernel i have a different value on each line
[04:07] <sebest> on ubuntu, i have 5 different lines
[04:07] <Keybuk> *shrug* could be caused by anything
[04:08] <sebest> Keybuk, it seems to be kernel related?
[04:08] <sebest> and it gives bad behaviour with tools like  nload
[04:08] <Keybuk> it would definitely be kernel related ;)
[04:09] <sebest> the graphics of nload are flawed becuase of this
[04:09] <sebest> because it computes the difference every 500ms, so it gives 0 
[04:10] <sebest> 1/2 of the time
[04:11] <sebest> Keybuk, first i thought it could be controlled throught sysctl, but i didn't find anything related to this
[04:12] <seb128> herzi: does adblocker has an UI now?
[04:13] <seb128> herzi: and why is it not built by default by upstream?
[04:13] <herzi> it is built
[04:13] <seb128> no it's not
[04:13] <herzi> but it should be enabled in the user config by default
[04:13] <seb128> or it would be shipped with the package
[04:13] <seb128> ah
[04:13] <herzi> sorry
[04:14] <herzi> today is bug-day for me
[04:14] <seb128> herzi: I didn't really get your blog on "Ubuntu is like WIndows" BTW
[04:15] <seb128> herzi: I didn't have to reinstall any of my Ubuntu (out of my desktop because services-admin trashed /etc/rc.d) and I upgrade from version to version
[04:17] <elmo> someone remind me of the shell idiom to iterate over lines in a file?
[04:18] <StevenK> for i in $(cat file) ; do echo $i ; done  ?
[04:18] <elmo> i.e. like for i in <blah>; do <blah> done, but line splitting, not word splitting
[04:18] <StevenK> Ah
[04:18] <kristog> while read line ?
[04:18] <_ion> while read ...; do ... ; done <file
[04:19] <_ion> That doesn't read the whole file to memory.
[04:19] <elmo> thanks
[04:19] <herzi> seb128: yes, updating works
[04:19] <herzi> but if i update for some releases
[04:19] <herzi> and then reinstall
[04:20] <herzi> there's a feelable difference
[04:22] <seb128> herzi: there should not
[04:22] <herzi> i have had missing splash screens for breezy, missing upstart for edgy
[04:23] <herzi> i often feel surprised when setting up new ubuntu versions (as i did this weekend on the laptop as a result of the broken HD)
[04:23] <Kamion> elmo: IFS='
[04:23] <Kamion> '
[04:23] <herzi> surprised in the positive sense
[04:23] <Kamion> with that literal line-break in there
[04:23] <Kamion> you'll want to save IFS first and restore it afterwards
[04:23] <herzi> but then this is also negative because IMHO it should not differ and show all the beauty also when upgrading
[04:24] <Kamion> elmo: while read works too, and may be easier (lighter on memory too, as _ion said), although it has the disadvantage that any variables you set inside the loop won't be preserved outside the loop because the loop body becomes a subshell
[04:25] <Kamion> herzi: such things are possible, but we do want to hear about them in the form of bug reports
[04:26] <herzi> Kamion: the problem is that you don't expect me to have two installations and always compare them
[04:26] <herzi> so i don't recognize them always in the moment they appear
[04:27] <herzi> (the missing splash screen was something I realized with dapper, so it was already skipping a whole release)
[04:27] <_ion> foo | while read x; do foo=42; done; echo $foo  nothing
[04:27] <seb128> herzi: usually things like that happens when you remove ubuntu-desktop at some point
[04:28] <_ion> while read x; do foo=42; done < bar; echo $foo  42
[04:28] <seb128> herzi: because the ubuntu-* make sure you have things like upstart or new splash installed on upgrade otherwise
[04:29] <_ion> kamion: 
[04:30] <seb128> herzi: using the dist-upgrader is also a good idea, dunno if you did so, because it has some magic and does smarts things on upgrade
[04:31] <herzi> seb128: i usually dist-upgrade after modifying the sources.list to play with eg. edgy right now
[04:31] <seb128> herzi: with ubuntu-* installed before dist-upgrade?
[04:31] <herzi> so the dist-upgrader won't notice
[04:31] <herzi> it should
[04:31] <herzi> but i'm not completely sure
[04:31] <seb128> herzi: right, my point is that you can't blame Ubuntu do make good upgrades if you don't use the tools that are available for that
[04:32] <seb128> herzi: update-manager makes sure you have ubuntu-desktop installed I think, it installs it if required and remove it after upgrade or something like that I think (mvo knows that better)
[04:32] <herzi> i'm using update-manager
[04:32] <seb128> s/do make good upgrades/to not make good upgrades
[04:33] <herzi> seb128: of course
[04:33] <seb128> herzi: update-manager -c -d I mean (the "upgrade to next major version" mode)
[04:34] <seb128> which has the smart logic I was speaking about
[04:34] <herzi> ahja, good to know
[04:34] <herzi> is there a wiki page about that?
[04:34] <Kamion> _ion: right, true, I'm normally using the former form so I forgot the distinction
[04:35] <seb128> herzi: http://daniel.holba.ch/blog/?p=14
[05:03] <ne78> will edgy be relased without rubygems ? That's a blocking issue for rails developper wanting to use rails. The root of the problem seems to be debian not accepting gems (altought they accept python easy_install/cpan/rpm/tar)
[05:04] <ne78> s/wanting to use rails/wanting to use ubuntu/
[05:04] <Kamion> Do you have a reference to this alleged Debian problem?
[05:05] <Kamion> The only upstream source package format accepted by either Debian or Ubuntu is .tar.gz, but it's not uncommon for maintainers to repack whatever upstream happens to ship in the form of a .tar.gz.
[05:05] <Kamion> In the case of CPAN, they ship .tar.gz source. Source RPMs get repacked. Python source is normally .tar.gz, I believe.
[05:06] <Kamion> Neither Debian nor Ubuntu is likely to accept foreign *binary* packages in the near future.
[05:07] <StevenK> Kamion: I think the point is that with Perl, you can use CPAN to install stuff that isn't in Debian. With Ruby/Gems, you can't, since Debian doesn't provide gems.
[05:08] <Kamion> Is gems the toolset used to install native Ruby packages?
[05:08] <StevenK> Yup
[05:08] <StevenK> gems install rails, etc
[05:08] <Kamion> Then I want a reference to this Debian issue that ne78 mentions.
[05:08] <StevenK> There's a bug filed, I know. 
[05:09] <Kamion> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=334962 is the only one I can find
[05:09] <Ubugtu> Debian bug 334962 in ruby1.8 "ruby1.8: 1.8.3 breaks RubyGems" [Important,Open]  
[05:10] <StevenK> That's not it, I just found it.
[05:10] <Kamion> ah, I see http://pkg-ruby-extras.alioth.debian.org/rubygems.html
[05:10] <pitti> slomo: hi
[05:10] <slomo> hi pitti :)
[05:11] <Hobbsee> hey pitti 
[05:11] <tkamppeter> Hi, piiti, did you celebrate the reunification of Germany?
[05:11] <Kamion> but that says that a rubygems package will be made available
[05:12] <Kamion> Perhaps one of the MOTUs who knows about ruby should go and talk to the Debian pkg-ruby-extras team and find out whether rubygems is in a state where it can be incorporated
[05:13] <Kamion> lucas is our normal point of contact there
[05:13] <ne78> launchpad has https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/rails/+bug/34840 about it
[05:13] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 34840 in rails "Rails needs gems" [Medium,Rejected]  
[05:13] <slomo> pitti: did you get my /query?
[05:13] <tkamppeter> pitti, Mike Sweet has fixed bug 57445, can you package CUPS again, and also for bug 63707?
[05:14] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 57445 in cupsys "Printing not possible with line break or mis-interpreted encoding in job title" [Undecided,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/57445
[05:14] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 63707 in cupsys "[edgy]  Error printing HTTP / IPP device-uri" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/63707
[05:14] <Kamion> there's http://packages.debian.org/experimental/interpreters/rubygems
[05:14] <Kamion> ne78: I suggest you talk to lucas and find out whether he thinks we can sync rubygems from Debian experimental
[05:14] <ne78> Kamion: that would be great
[05:14] <ne78> Kamion: who is lucas ?
[05:15] <StevenK> Kamion: But for Edgy+1, I suspect
[05:15] <elmo> how the heck do release critical bugs work in malone these days?
[05:16] <Kamion> ne78: Lucas Nussbaum; he's involved both with Ubuntu and with the Debian pkg-ruby-extras team, I believe. I've commented on the bug you mentioned with a question.
[05:16] <Kamion> StevenK: If it's vaguely workable and doesn't interfere with ruby, it could be pulled in for edgy
[05:16] <ne78> Kamion: ok thanks
[05:17] <Kamion> elmo: set milestone ubuntu-6.10, set appropriate importance
[05:17] <elmo> Kamion: how do you see milestones in the normal "I'm looking at a bug" page though?
[05:17] <Tonio_> Kamion, Keybuk, mdz : I just noticed kmplayer-konq-plugins went back to universe, which is an issue still we have it in kubuntu seeds... Is there a reason for this ?
[05:18] <ne78> StevenK: it doesn't interfer with ruby, it's a optional component without any reverse depends
[05:19] <pitti> slomo: hi, yes, it took several minutes for my IRC connection to settle
[05:19] <pitti> hi tkamppeter 
[05:19] <Kamion> elmo: I don't think you can, without clicking on the fiddle-with-bug-status expander
[05:19] <Kamion> elmo: we use https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+milestone/ubuntu-6.10
[05:20] <pitti> tkamppeter: marked bugs accordingly, will fix tomorrow (I have to care for an urgent issue right now)
[05:20] <elmo> Kamion: _classy_
[05:22] <Kamion> elmo: the way it lists all the fixed bugs is particularly good
[05:23] <Keybuk> Tonio_: it wasn't seeded
[05:24] <Kamion> desktop: * kmplayer-konq-plugins # more stable than kaffeine
[05:24] <Kamion> Keybuk: was too
[05:24] <Riddell> yes, it's in our desktop seed
[05:24] <Tonio_> Keybuk: afaik it is...
[05:25] <Keybuk> then it wouldn't have been in the list of things to demote
[05:25] <Keybuk> so wouldn't have been demoted?
[05:26] <Kamion> Keybuk: well, it appears to be in the list of things to *promote* now
[05:26] <Kamion> Keybuk: I think you demoted all of kmplayer source by mistake rather than just some binaries, or something like that
[05:27] <Keybuk> could have done if it looked like all of kmplayer went into universe
[05:27] <Keybuk> germinate hasn't settled yet anyway
[05:27] <Keybuk> will leave it another publisher run and look what needs fixing then
[05:28] <elmo> Kamion: I think even better is how the sorting ... doesn't
[05:28] <Kamion> mdz: re bug 61514, would you cry very much if I just nuked the time remaining altogether? With it being rather unreliable due to CD read speeds, I kind of feel like just the percentage ought to be enough
[05:28] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 61514 in ubiquity "Time remaining display should be less granular" [Low,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/61514
[05:29] <Kamion> elmo: definitely
[05:30] <elmo> anyway, would someone (esp. a {ba,}sh fanatic) like to look at 63740 and a) confirm it, b) set it to RC?  if we're going to have ndiswrapper in main, it shouldn't be entirely broken
[05:30] <Kamion> oh my, and it doesn't even skip duplicates
[05:31] <tkamppeter> pitti, have seen your comments on the bug reports. Thanks in advance.
[05:31] <StevenK> bug 63740
[05:31] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 63740 in ndiswrapper "ndiswrapper wrapper (sic) uses bashisms" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/63740
[05:31] <pitti> my pleasure :)
[05:31] <mdz> Kamion: I would not cry if we disabled it for now and did it properly for edgy+1
[05:32] <Kamion> elmo: I'll just fix it, how about that ...
[05:32] <elmo> Kamion: giggle, that works too
[05:33] <Kamion> mdz: I'll take that as a "yes" - I'd rather fix it once while I'm there
[05:34] <Keybuk> could you fix it to actually work while you're in there
[05:34] <Keybuk> and generate correct modprobe alias lines?
[05:34] <Keybuk> so it'll get automatically loaded
[05:35] <elmo> it worked for me just now - apart from the auto loading part
[05:35] <elmo> well, once I installed ndis 1.8
[05:35] <elmo> that's probably another bug
[05:35] <elmo> well it is - there's several open about it already
[05:36] <Kamion> Keybuk: why don't you do it then - I have no idea beyond the obvious shell bug
[05:37] <Kamion> [^...]  -> [!...]  in debian/ndiswrapper and debian/rules
[05:37] <Keybuk> because I don't know my way around the windows inf files well enough to do it properly
[05:37] <Keybuk> I've been bugging upstream on/off about it for the best part of a year
[05:38] <Kamion> in that case, I'll just fix elmo's bug
[05:38] <Keybuk> I was more arguing for demoting it to universe since it doesn't actually work properly anyway
[05:39] <BenC> pitti: oooh...I found something you might like for edgy+1
[05:39] <Kamion> Keybuk: can't say I care
[05:39] <pitti> BenC: ooh, a surprise??? :)
[05:39] <BenC> pitti: corename in 2.6.19 kernel (maybe 2.6.18 supports it too) will support pipes, so you can do "| /usr/bin/apport" :)
[05:40] <pitti> BenC: \o/
[05:40] <pitti> BenC: well, that still doesn't completely replace our interface since we need the signal number
[05:40] <BenC> means it can support core's in chroots and such
[05:40] <pitti> BenC: but maybe the signal number can be extracted from the core
[05:40] <BenC> pitti: right, but I can build on this functionality now that it's there
[05:41] <pitti> yeah, that rocks
[05:41] <BenC> we can revisit this in mountain view
[05:41] <BenC> I'll have installable kernels for edgy+1 before then
[06:06] <Keybuk> ya know ... I really prefer the dapper usplash to edgy
[06:06] <gnomefreak> it feels more complete to me
[06:07] <gnomefreak> but edgys isnt too bad
[06:07] <pitti> 'more complete' in the sense that it actually works, yes :)
[06:07] <Keybuk> the progress bar is far too thin and mean, and having it bunched up at the top of the screen just looks bad
, sorry
[06:07] <gnomefreak> lol pitti 
[06:07] <mantiena> Hi all
[06:07] <gnomefreak> pitti: mine works fine
[06:11] <heno> Keybuk: agree, why is it so thin and bright?
[06:12] <sivang> re
[06:12] <mantiena> maybe somebody knows when language-packs will be updated ?
[06:12] <elmo> Kamion: thanks (ndiswrapper)
[06:13] <Kamion> np
[06:13] <seb128> "Proposal: NetworkManager for GNOME 2.18."
[06:13] <seb128> interesting
[06:14] <seb128> let's see how the discussion is going to turn ;)
[06:14] <slomo> don't think it will be included... it's not really mature enough imho ;)
[06:15] <seb128> slomo: RedHat and Novell seem to think it is, that will count for something
[06:15] <Burgwork> slomo, nor do I
[06:16] <Burgwork> slomo, I wonder if I shoudl start the discussion of with a discussion of why I think it is not mature
[06:16] <seb128> Burgwork: you think the linux stack behind it is not ready or do you think n-m is not?
[06:16] <Keybuk> the lack of support for common networking cases is the worrying thing for me
[06:17] <Keybuk> e.g. static networks
[06:17] <seb128> it just ignores those for the moment no?
[06:17] <Burgwork> seb128, n-m
[06:17] <Keybuk> right, there's no way to set up a static network with NM
[06:17] <Burgwork> which is tons of fun
[06:17] <seb128> should not be too hard to fix
[06:18] <Keybuk> "hard to fix" ?
[06:18] <Keybuk> well, first you'd have to write a GUI for configuring static networks
[06:18] <seb128> "use n-m for non-static and keep using what we have for static" would work for now
[06:18] <Keybuk> that's what we do
[06:18] <Keybuk> but this to me is a reason not to make it part of GNOME by default
[06:18] <seb128> right, expected that we don't do n-m
[06:18] <Keybuk> it's just not complete enough
[06:19] <seb128> excepted
[06:19] <seb128> right
[06:19] <seb128> is somebody working on that part?
[06:19] <Keybuk> not that I know of
[06:20] <seb128> I mean if they started working on it 2.18 can be realistic
[06:20] <Burgwork> Keybuk, what about the atheros issue?
[06:22] <Keybuk> "the atheros issue" ?
[06:23] <Burgwork> the fun interaction between n-m and those cards
[06:25] <jdong> Burgwork: I have an atheros and it appears to work fine with nm
[06:26] <jdong> two atheroses, actually
[06:26] <jdong> what interaction is it?
[06:28] <Keybuk> Burgwork: works for me
[06:30] <Burgwork> I have had a few issues, but I should probably test nm, given the last one I tested was a few months ago
[06:32] <jdong> the only issue I can _think_ of is that the available networks list might not refresh properly once you are connected to a network
[06:43] <doko_> Kamion: all -java binaries built on all archs (db4.4 still in NEW)
[06:47] <Kamion> doko_: thanks; db4.4 accepted
[06:59] <Fibbs> Hi folks
[06:59] <Fibbs> Can someone here explain me what to do to get ubuntu edgy beta to run as a DomU in xen? I have the problem that xen is complaining about the glibc (tls nonsegneg) also after moving /lib/tls away.
[06:59] <Fibbs> On some distributions there are methods to configure glibc with some config file but i did not find nothing about this
[07:00] <lotusleaf> Fibbs: have you tried #ubuntu+1
[07:00] <zul> or #ubuntu-xen
[07:01] <Fibbs> zul: oh, didn't know that there was a ubuntu-xen channel
[07:01] <Fibbs> great...
[07:01] <Fibbs> lotusleaf: What does #ubuntu+1 threat about?
[07:02] <lotusleaf> Fibbs: see topic here re: support issues and /join #ubuntu+1 for Edgy support and #ubuntu-xen which may help your particular issue
[07:14] <mantiena> who is responsible for language-packs generation ?
[07:14] <seb128> mantiena: pitti and carlos and launchpad
[07:14] <mantiena> seb128, thans
[07:14] <seb128> np
[07:15] <seb128> usually better to ask your question
[07:15] <seb128> easier to give an appropriate reply
[07:15] <mantiena> pitti, maybe you know when language-packs will be updated ?  ;)
[07:15] <pitti> mantiena: I'll care for it tomorrow
[07:16] <pitti> mantiena: we have a new stable release updates process, so I'll just upload them to dapper-proposed for now
[07:16] <pitti> and to dapper-updates a week after
[07:17] <mantiena> pitti, I'm asking about language-packs for egdy :)
[07:18] <pitti> mantiena: ah; well, I'll have them uploaded tomorrow, too
[07:18] <pitti> mantiena: our normal schedule is 'first Monday in the month', but I was too busy yesterday
[07:19] <mantiena> ;)
[07:19] <mantiena> pitti, thanks for info
[07:26] <jdong> is it a known issue that fglrx isn't modprobing by default anymore?
[07:26] <jdong> I know there was a recent l-r-m upload that was supposed to make fglrx modprobe by default....
[07:26] <jdong> if it's used in xorg.conf
[07:45] <tucoz> hi, i have filed a bugreport and chose the linux-source package. However, this is wrong and i can not change this. Should i close the bugreport, or leave it open even though it is for the wrong package?
[07:48] <seb128> tucoz: how can't you change it?
[07:49] <tucoz> I want to change it to xorg-driver-fglrx , but launchpad doesn't find that. And if i wipe out the package text, nothing gets changed.
[07:49] <tucoz> I figured it was better to have nothing, than the wrong target
[07:49] <Kamion> tucoz: you need to use a source package name - try 'linux-restricted-modules-2.6.17' (for edgy, or ...-2.6.15 for dapper)
[07:50] <Kamion> $ apt-cache showsrc xorg-driver-fglrx | head -n1
[07:50] <Kamion> Package: linux-restricted-modules-2.6.17
[07:50] <pitti> mantiena: hm, wait - we just recently updated edgy langpacks for the beta, I don't think another update is justified yet; do you see a particular reason to do it now?
[07:50] <tucoz> ah. so that is how it works. Thank you
[07:50] <pitti> mantiena: (I'm only concerned about dapper right now, it does need an update)
[07:53] <jdong> baah... keybuk... you broke my fglrx.ko... :)
[07:54] <jdong> "   * Don't allow the fglrx module to be loaded if it's not used in xorg.conf"
[07:54] <jdong> ^^ apparently it doesn't load it even IF it's in xorg.conf :D ^^
[07:54] <_ion> That's a feature.
[07:55] <jdong> LOL
[07:55] <jdong> _ion: are you auditioning to be RMS or something?
[07:55] <_ion> How did you guess? :-)
[07:56] <jdong> well, it's indirectly causing bug 63558 too
[07:56] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 63558 in usplash "Latest usplash leaves my consoles corrupted" [Low,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/63558
[07:56] <jdong> so I guess that's a feature, too :D
[07:56] <_ion> I don't have a long enough beard, though.
[07:58] <jdong> grr... fglrx should really TELL me when its kernel module is not found
[07:58] <jdong> nvidia does that... (by... bombing out and displaying GDM's BSOD)
[07:59] <jdong> that way I won't file erroneous bugs on usplash
[08:06] <mantiena> pitti, yes, I see the reason for updating edgy langpacks at least one time before edgy release candidate :) Now langpacks are more than week old and people are translating, for example I've translated gnome-app-install for edgy 3 days ago :)
[08:06] <pitti> mantiena: oh, of course we'll update them again for the RC
[08:07] <pitti> mantiena: but translators should use my daily generated updates for testing
[08:11] <mantiena> pitti, where ?
[08:12] <pitti> mantiena: deb http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/langpacks/daily/edgy ./
[08:13] <pitti> mantiena: likewise for s/edgy/dapper-updates/ etc.
[08:13] <pitti> hi sabdfl
[08:14] <mantiena> pitti, thanks
[08:17] <sabdfl> hi efters
[08:17] <tfheen> hello Mark
[08:18] <abattoir> Kamion: hi, w.r.t bug 62777 , the fix has not yet been uploaded right?
[08:18] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62777 in ubuntu-cdimage "kubuntu installs oem-config-gtk" [Undecided,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62777
[08:18] <jdong> lol, efters.... gotta remember that one :)
[08:19] <Kamion> abattoir: I've deployed the fix on the cdimage build machine, but I only committed the corresponding oem-config fix to bzr a few minutes ago
[08:19] <Kamion> so no, not yet uploaded
[08:19] <Kamion> I was going to hoover up a few other bugs first
[08:19] <Kamion> abattoir: I've pushed the branch with the fix, though
[08:19] <abattoir> Kamion: ok, because i tested 1003 build, doesnt seem to install oem-config at all, i'll try installing again
[08:20] <Kamion> sounds slightly different, perhaps; /var/log/syslog (or /var/log/installer/syslog after reboot) might be interesting
[08:20] <sabdfl> hey jdong, how's the backport scene?
[08:20] <abattoir> Kamion: ok, i'll check that if installation fails again(oem user is created, btw)
[08:21] <jdong> sabdfl: pretty good, pretty good. finally dapper-backports is working as expected :)
[08:21] <sabdfl> are you guys basically running it from start to finish?
[08:21] <jdong> sabdfl: yeah; it's primarily me dealing with the requests, testing the packages, and approving the packages...
[08:21] <Kamion> abattoir: nod, thanks
[08:22] <jdong> it's been slightly overwhelming these past few weeks though, still catching up :)
[08:22] <abattoir> Kamion: thank you ;)
[08:22] <sabdfl> broad shoulders!
[08:22] <jdong> yeah
[08:23] <jdong> I'll also have to try to find the time to go through the MOTU process... more and more I'm finding the need to patch into universe, and I feel kind of bad for nagging folks in #ubuntu-motu to do my dirty work :)
[08:26] <Riddell> Gloubiboulga: did anyone make a xubuntu usplash?
[08:26] <Gloubiboulga> Riddell, yes jmak did
[08:30] <Riddell> Gloubiboulga: great
[08:51] <t0mmY-> hi there, having trouble with ubiquity, stalls at the time/date setup, anyone have any ideas? thank you.
[08:52] <jdong> t0mmY-: this is primarily a development channel.... have you tried the other channels of support first?
[08:52] <jdong> (#ubuntu, #ubuntu+1 if it's Edgy, etc)
[08:52] <t0mmY-> or at least is there any other ways installing ubuntu edgy with out having to download the alternate cd?
[08:53] <t0mmY-> jdong, no i have not, sorry, saw the NO support message a little bit to late. :)
[08:55] <t0mmY-> how about the alternate installer thing? ideas?
[08:58] <jdong> t0mmY-: make sure it's not a bad burn. do a media check. from the livecd, the only supported installer is ubiquity
[08:59] <jdong> t0mmY-: else, go for an alternate cd
[08:59] <Kamion> wait please
[08:59] <t0mmY-> have done a media check, its ok, so..
[08:59] <Kamion> let me dig up that bug and find out if it would be useful to have somebody to talk to in real-time who's experiencing it
[08:59] <t0mmY-> okei, nice :)
[08:59] <jdong> no, Kamion <- installer god :)
[09:00] <t0mmY-> hehe
[09:00] <Kamion> t0mmY-: is this the edgy beta?
[09:00] <t0mmY-> yeah, downloaded the iso today..
[09:01] <Kamion> t0mmY-: Ubuntu, Kubuntu ...?
[09:01] <dholbach> bug 62752?
[09:01] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62752 in ubiquity "timezone selection in ubiquity hangs, when just proceeding and clicking next" [High,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62752
[09:01] <t0mmY-> ubuntu
[09:01] <t0mmY-> okei..
[09:01] <Kamion> dholbach: thanks, that's the one I was looking for
[09:01] <t0mmY-> hehe
[09:01] <dholbach> de rien :)
[09:02] <rod_> is there some minimal boot cd / floppies to install ubuntu?
[09:02] <Kamion> t0mmY-: could you start the installer with 'sudo env UBIQUITY_DEBUG=1 ubiquity 2>/tmp/ubiquity.log', reproduce the hang, and attach /tmp/ubiquity.log and /var/log/syslog to bug 62572, please?
[09:02] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62572 in totem "totem-gstreamer-firefox-plugin is obsolete and should be removed" [Low,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62572
[09:02] <Kamion> t0mmY-: er, bug 62752 I mean
[09:02] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62752 in ubiquity "timezone selection in ubiquity hangs, when just proceeding and clicking next" [High,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62752
[09:03] <Kamion> rod_: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/edgy/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/mini.iso (similar for dapper) is the smallest I support
[09:03] <Kamion> rod_: that's 8.5MB, downloads the rest from the network
[09:03] <rod_> awesome, tx Kamion 
[09:03] <Kamion> haven't been able to cram the kernel onto a floppy, I'm afraid
[09:03] <jdong> lol
[09:04] <Kamion> well, it's not laughable, it was possible with 2.4
[09:05] <Kamion> but we've never had Ubuntu install floppies because we started out with 2.6, and AFAIK nobody's ever managed to get d-i floppies working with 2.6
[09:07] <rod_> Kamion, heh ^^   It's mostly that I dont want to download first knot1, then knot2, then beta....    Now I can just do clean installs this way
[09:07] <Kamion> you do need to remember to refresh that install image every so often
[09:07] <rod_> or whenever when edgy is out, get the latest versions instead of first the stock versions and later download all the mass updates
[09:07] <Kamion> it'll break whenever the kernel ABI changes, which is relatively often in a development cycle
[09:08] <rod_> hmm did you just say it uses a 2.4 kenel/
[09:08] <jdong> Kamion: I haven't used any 2.6-based distros that support floppy kernels at all
[09:08] <t0mmY-> Kamion, i have now uploaded them too bug 62752
[09:09] <jdong> Kamion: so I don't think it's a ubuntu or d-i specific problem
[09:09] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 62752 in ubiquity "timezone selection in ubiquity hangs, when just proceeding and clicking next" [High,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/62752
[09:09] <Kamion> rod_: no, 2.6
[09:09] <jdong> Kamion: IIRC knoppix still supports like 2 or 3 floppy boots... they split up their images in some way
[09:09] <Kamion> rod_: we were discussing something else
[09:09] <jdong> maybe it's just kernel then initrd.gz
[09:09] <rod_> Kamion, sry, i read it wrong with my lousy english
[09:09] <jdong> maybe theirs can split that way easily
[09:10] <rod_> Kamion, since i think you make these iso's... Would you like any feedback after the installation using this iso?
[09:10] <Kamion> well, the d-i floppy scheme is a boot floppy with kernel, root floppy with initrd, possibly driver floppies
[09:10] <doko_> Kamion: all CD images are 17MB smaller now. OOo still works; please keep about 4MB free (would like to know from heno, if the -hicontrast icons should be included again)
[09:10] <Kamion> rod_: bug reports on anything that goes wrong are always good
[09:10] <Kamion> doko_: great, thanks!
[09:10] <Kamion> noted
[09:11] <Kamion> doko_: if you could let me know if you hear that -hicontrast isn't needed, that would be good
[09:11] <doko_> ok
[09:12] <Kamion> t0mmY-: oh, I see, it's line-wrapping
[09:12] <Kamion> see the end of http://librarian.launchpad.net/4643437/syslog - that's wacky
[09:12] <Kamion> t0mmY-: thanks, that's perfect, I should be able to take it from here
[09:13] <t0mmY-> Kamion, Alright, what do you suggest for me to do in the mean time? Download alternate cd thingy ? :)
[09:13] <Kamion> t0mmY-: yep
[09:14] <jdong> t0mmY-: wait for the next ubiquity, then apt-get update from the livecd? :)
[09:14] <jdong> if your RAM permits
[09:15] <t0mmY-> jdong, will that take long? hehe, probably.. or..??
[09:15] <t0mmY-> i can install applications..
[09:15] <jdong> t0mmY-: that's a question to ask kamion :)
[09:15] <t0mmY-> jdong, i knwo..
[09:15] <jdong> t0mmY-: just enough ram to do an apt-get update and apt-get install ubiquity
[09:15] <jdong> shouldn't need any more than 512
[09:15] <jdong> at the most
[09:15] <t0mmY-> Kamion, long before new package?
[09:16] <jdong> your sources.list on the livecd needs to reference archive.ubuntu.com though; I expect you know how to change that if it doesn't?
[09:16] <t0mmY-> jdong, got 1gb at the moment.. so i am good.. :)
[09:16] <Kamion> well, it's annoying that I can't reproduce the bug, but maybe a day
[09:16] <Kamion> jdong: that's the default
[09:16] <t0mmY-> jdong, yeah..
[09:17] <jdong> Kamion: ok, good to know
[09:17] <Kamion> t0mmY-: subscribe to that bug and you'll get a mail when it's fixed
[09:17] <t0mmY-> Kamion, any more information i might provide to help you solve this?
[09:17] <t0mmY-> Kamion, will do..
[09:20] <Kamion> t0mmY-: dunno yet :-) my test rig's busy with something else right now, and I'm in a meeting, so I haven't dived in and analysed it in full
[09:21] <t0mmY-> Kamion, alright, the alternate cd will be downloaded in about 20 minutes so, if you need something before that just ask. :)
[10:23] <jdong> slomo: any reason why our x264 hasn't been updated since july?
[10:23] <slomo> jdong: ENOTIME
[10:23] <slomo> no other reason :)
[10:23] <jdong> slomo: would we have a chance of UVF'ing that? :D
[10:23] <slomo> no idea what has changed
[10:23] <slomo> maybe :)
[10:24] <jdong> from the improvement side, doom9 is raving over newer releases though
[10:28] <jdong> slomo: are there any valuable ubuntu chances?
[10:28] <jdong> changes*
[10:28] <jdong> to the package
[10:28] <slomo> look at the package, i can't remember anymore ;)
[10:28] <slomo> but iirc no
[10:30] <jdong> doesn't look like it
[10:31] <jdong> now, the moment of truth.... :)
[10:32] <jdong> slomo: do we have anything that builds against x264 that I need to check for breakage?
[10:32] <jdong> I'm testing the obvious mencoder
[10:33] <jdong> but the media players all decode with libavcodec
[10:39] <jdong> how do I query for what source packages build-dep on libx264-dev?
[10:39] <slomo> grep-dctrl on Sources
[10:40] <jdong> ah, that's a wonderful idea
[10:40] <slomo> i don't know another way :)
[10:42] <jdong> slomo: only avidemux and mplayer... I'll test both
[10:43] <jdong> slomo: the marillat package builds fine in edgy, x264 cmdline works
[10:43] <jdong> mplayer rebuilt cleanly, too
[10:43] <jdong> I'm testing it now
[10:43] <slomo> file an UVF exception later with everything needed
[10:46] <jdong> slomo: I will
[10:50] <jdong> LOL
[10:50] <mc44> _ion, another fun thread that wont die :)
[10:50] <_ion> Yeah. :-)
[11:04] <Kamion> aha
[11:11] <jdong> slomo: avidemux needs a simple patch to work around an API change
[11:11] <jdong> is that still ok?
[11:11] <jdong> slomo: I'm working out exactly what that "simple patch" is right now :D
[11:11] <slomo> maybe
[11:11] <slomo> sorry, i'm busy currently :(
[11:14] <jdong> slomo: I'll attach the patch to the UVF ticket then. it's a simple two-liner
[11:15] <sivang> jdong: where do you file he UVF expection tickets? 
[11:15] <jdong> sivang: launchpad?
[11:15] <jdong> under the source package
[11:15] <sivang> jdong: ah, so it's bug reports :-)
[11:15] <sivang> jdong: sure, just got confused over the "ticket" term
[11:16] <jdong> sivang: ticket, bug, same thing :)
[11:16] <jdong> right now, it's just me talking to myself and motu-media getting spammed :D
[11:23] <jdong> slomo: I've completed the UVFe, assigned it to ubuntu-motu-uvf as I'm supposed to
[11:23] <jdong> enjoy :)
[11:24] <_ion> The new community wallpapers are nice.
[11:25] <tseng> _ion: link?
[11:25] <_ion> Well, apt-get install_or_source edgy-community-wallpapers :-)
[11:26] <_ion> Blubuntu, Peace and Tropic being the new ones.
[12:05] <Ingmar^> was there any recent change to the xv extension that would cause me to have dropped frames in all video players I installed (vlc, kaffeine & mplayer ) ??
[12:05] <Ingmar^> evening all :-)
[12:07] <jdong> but what video card?