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| rowanjl | I've got a question, I'm not familiar with how Linux boots so be warned: | 12:33 |
|---|---|---|
| rowanjl | What controls the output during the boot? | 12:33 |
| Keybuk | various different pieces | 12:33 |
| rowanjl | mm | 12:33 |
| Keybuk | obviously init is initially responsible for setting stdout of the scripts it runs | 12:33 |
| rowanjl | yeah | 12:33 |
| Keybuk | the scripts are then responsible for actually outputting stuff | 12:33 |
| Keybuk | often they use the LSB functions for that | 12:34 |
| Keybuk | and those functions may know that a graphical splash screen is running | 12:34 |
| rowanjl | Which gives it the uniform look? | 12:34 |
| rowanjl | I mean | 12:34 |
| Keybuk | or that the script's stdout is not /dev/console, so write to /dev/console explicitly | 12:34 |
| Keybuk | the LSB functions | 12:34 |
| rowanjl | Item name... [OK|FAILED|... | 12:34 |
| Keybuk | /lib/lsb/init-functions | 12:34 |
| rowanjl | hmm | 12:34 |
| Keybuk | often overriden by /etc/lsb-base-logging.sh | 12:35 |
| rowanjl | You ever notice how the image overlay often disappears to early? | 12:35 |
| Keybuk | yes, usplash times out if it doesn't receive something in a certain time period | 12:36 |
| rowanjl | ahh, I see | 12:36 |
| rowanjl | I guess that makes sense, untill my mother uses it ;) | 12:37 |
| rowanjl | She was scared the first time that happened... pretty sad | 12:37 |
| Keybuk | yeah | 12:38 |
| Keybuk | mostly it's when your disk gets checked that it disappears | 12:38 |
| Keybuk | so you can see the disk check output underneath | 12:38 |
| rowanjl | On my computer it happens while X is loading | 12:39 |
| rowanjl | Or just before | 12:39 |
| Keybuk | yeah, there's a brief blank before it switches to X | 12:40 |
| Keybuk | has to be, as it has to clear up the console | 12:40 |
| Keybuk | sadly the Linux VT layer sucks | 12:40 |
| Keybuk | it's not possible to change VT settings unless it's the current VT | 12:40 |
| rowanjl | Hmm | 12:40 |
| Md | Keybuk: are you sure? I remember using e.g. setleds ... < /dev/tty2 | 12:41 |
| rowanjl | I worry about these things sometimes, how can they be polished... | 12:41 |
| rowanjl | There's all this fuss about Linux for Desktops, but is that really what we need? | 12:42 |
| rowanjl | A desktop OS is better off booting right into its graphical layer | 12:42 |
| Keybuk | Md: some bits work, most don't -- see setupcon for some hacks | 12:42 |
| Keybuk | we can't change the console font and keymap while usplash is running without chvt'ing to a text screen | 12:43 |
| Keybuk | rowanjl: why? no other desktop OS boots directly into graphical | 12:43 |
| rowanjl | No major ones | 12:43 |
| rowanjl | ;) | 12:43 |
| Keybuk | name one | 12:44 |
| rowanjl | Syllable | 12:44 |
| Keybuk | at what point does it start the full graphical? | 12:44 |
| Keybuk | an x86 doesn't boot into graphical | 12:45 |
| Keybuk | so at some point, you have to do a flip | 12:45 |
| rowanjl | No your right, but it IS different to Linux | 12:45 |
| rowanjl | because it was never indented to have a console | 12:45 |
| Keybuk | the Linux console is just hysterical | 12:45 |
| rowanjl | pardon? :/ | 12:46 |
| Keybuk | we could get rid of it easily, and just start X on the framebuffer on the first VT, etc. | 12:46 |
| Keybuk | sorry, historical ;) | 12:46 |
| rowanjl | heh | 12:46 |
| rowanjl | I know I'd miss the console, but I guess a real desktop Linux variant would replace it | 12:47 |
| Keybuk | there isn't anything to gain from getting rid of t | 12:49 |
| Keybuk | sure, it makes you feel fluffy, but there's no improvement | 12:49 |
| Keybuk | and it means that there's no quick escape to a login prompt when you break X :) | 12:49 |
| rowanjl | true :P | 12:50 |
| rowanjl | but it also means people will pay us to fix their Linux boxes :P | 12:50 |
| Keybuk | we have to have a text VT when we boot, because that's what the host architecture gives us | 12:50 |
| rowanjl | You could do what Windows does, have a Safe Boot option. | 12:50 |
| Keybuk | sure, we can have all that | 12:50 |
| Keybuk | but there's still no reason to get rid of a text console | 12:51 |
| rowanjl | Most of us do now anyhow | 12:51 |
| rowanjl | Well, there is, Users like polish, textmode isn't polished | 12:51 |
| Keybuk | but users won't even know it's there | 12:51 |
| rowanjl | but there are probably better ways to hide it | 12:52 |
| Keybuk | "hide" ? | 12:52 |
| rowanjl | hide the console | 12:52 |
| Keybuk | why does it need to be hidden? | 12:52 |
| rowanjl | like I was saying before, it is often visible when it doesn't really need to be | 12:52 |
| rowanjl | because end users are not geeks. | 12:52 |
| Keybuk | at the moment, it does need to be visible at those moments | 12:52 |
| Keybuk | we slowly, but surely, fix those | 12:52 |
| rowanjl | yeah | 12:53 |
| Keybuk | ideally when X starts, the splash screen would just be replaced by X | 12:53 |
| rowanjl | yep | 12:53 |
| Keybuk | but we can't do that right now, because we can't reset the console underneath | 12:53 |
| Keybuk | that's a code limitation, that should be fixable in the long term | 12:53 |
| rowanjl | mm | 12:54 |
| === rowanjl remembers Red Hat 5.2 booting... | ||
| rowanjl | now that was pretty bad | 12:54 |
| rowanjl | everythings come a long way since | 12:54 |
| === Keybuk just made sure that there was a spec for that for uds-mv | ||
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