/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2006/10/12/#ubuntu-marketing.txt

popeywell.. :)12:07
popeyI know a man :)12:07
jendaoh no...12:07
cbx33yeh....we need some nice poster designs...people can print out and make their own12:07
popeythey can do all kinds of stuff12:07
cbx33and tee-shirt transfer designs12:07
cbx33really funky think geek stuff ;)12:07
cbx33clever and witty ;)12:07
Burgworkjenda: a website like that would rock12:07
jendacbx33: is this nice enough: http://www.monipodio.net/tmp/poster-layout.jpg ?12:07
jendaBurgwork: it has been my primary focus for about three months :)12:07
popeyI'll go and speak to the guys tomorrow and see if they're interested12:07
popeyand see what kind of prices we can get12:08
cbx33coool artwork jenda12:08
BurgworkI like that poster, but it really doesn12:08
jendaHowever, I'm entirely dependent on other people's technical skills to create the site.12:08
cbx33popey, :D12:08
Burgworkt fit with the rest of our artwork12:08
cbx33Burgwork, we can have some occifial type stuff12:08
cbx33and some more "fu" stuff12:08
cbx33fun12:08
Burgworkthat would rock12:08
jendaBurgwork: it's basically the form Spreadubuntu has taken over the course of time... in my mind :)12:09
Burgworkthat is exactly what we need12:09
popeypricing is of course an issue12:09
jendaand some "F-U" stuff too ;)12:09
Burgworknone of the this duplicating the fridge stuff12:09
popeywoudl you envisage some element of the price of each design going back to the designer?12:09
popeyor not?12:09
jendapopey: hasn't been much of an issue for me yet - worked OK.12:09
popeyhowever12:09
jendapopey: only as voluntary donations. I promised to give 5 free posters to the designer of the poster.12:10
popeygiven that people don't get paid for submitting bug requests, there's an argument that they shouldn't expect it for submitting designs for t-shirts12:10
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jendapopey: that is entirely correct.12:10
cbx33popey ++12:10
BurgworkI would be careful with money12:10
Burgworkoffering free stuff is better12:10
jendaonly as volunatry donations.12:10
jendaBurgwork: just try :)12:10
popeywho pays for the printing then?12:11
popeyI was discussing this with Jono more as a commercial enterprise12:11
popeybut am open to other suggestions12:11
cpk2i could see jendas poster in a bus stop add =P12:11
cpk2it fit in there heh12:11
jendaBurgwork, popey: in theory, I have solved this problem by keeping the finances entirely privately managed, from which the entire profit or a 0-100% portion would be donated to Ubuntu.12:11
popeyshipit costs a bucketload of money for ubuntu, I can't see them financing a shitload of t-shirts shipped free12:12
cbx33true12:12
cbx33I wouldn't have a problem buying the items12:12
popeywhat do you mean by that?12:12
jendapopey: I print 500 pcs, and sell them very cheap. It pays the price, and a few are left over for the author and to donate.12:12
popeyin english?12:12
popeyok12:12
jendahehe12:12
jendait means that:12:12
jendaI sold 1000 stickers, earned a profit of about $5012:13
popeyi have done a similar thing, I bought a bunch of debian t-shirts and sold them to lug members, the "profit" I gave to the LUG12:13
jendaI use the money to fund the posters, which is in theory similar to donating to Ubuntu... because whatever the profit is from the posters, It goes either to fund another project, or will be donated directly. I will keep $31.30, ie. 10% of the bare production cost of the posters.12:14
popeyso (for the sake of argument) and to keep the running costs as low as possible, a buy-it-now type auction of 100 t-shirts at 10 quid (for example) each on ebay12:14
popeyonce they're gone, they're gone12:14
popeynext design..12:14
jendaI have a very specific reason to keep them 31.30 - it is to prove that it's possible to do this without interfering with the community ethics etc.12:14
cpk2how much is 10 quid?12:15
popey10 GBP12:15
jendaEven all the designers know I'm keeping that, and not a single person remarked anything.12:15
jendahehe12:15
cpk2ah ok12:15
popeythat was just plucked out of the air12:15
popeyit's not necessarily a realistic price12:15
popeyalthough I know I can get them done for 8 quid retail, so less in bulk12:15
jendaok12:15
jendaumm...12:16
jendaa guy is having them done here in CZ for about 312:16
cpk2haha wow12:17
jendaI plan to make use of that too - the eastern countries are incredibly cheap.12:18
cpk2i dont even think making shirts myself is that cheap =(12:18
popeyhehe12:18
jendaI can create and sell a poster for $1 and still have about 25% profit to cover unlooked for losses.12:18
jendaLet's not forget that :)12:19
popeyheh12:19
jendapopey: since I just PM'd a guy with the details of my plan for the project, I will edit that and paste it here...12:19
jenda1) get this site completed: http://doc.ubuntu.com/~marketing/DIY%20Material/DIY%20Website/DIY%20Website/12:21
jendaOnce the website is done, it can contain several pieces of info that each imply a new function. I think this will come in this order (this seems the only way I can achieve the result - some final release of a complete SU has proven impossible)12:21
jenda2) First I will document the batch of stickers I created and sold, then the batch MenZa has created and I'm selling, and finally the posters, and how that works.12:21
jendaI will include all the digital data and even financial info on the projects, how I contacted the printers etc. I want people to know how much it cost, how much i made, where it went.12:22
jenda3) I will scour the resources we have and fill up the bzr branch will all the DIY material I can find and list it all on the site.12:22
jenda4) There are several other people now that wish to create DIY material and ship (one wants foil stickers like the windows ones, the other wants blacklight UBuntu posters, there are cups, t-shirts, etc.)12:22
jendaThese will be documented on the site too.12:22
jendaThat includes pix and ordering info (even for the projects I did)12:22
jenda5) A general encouragement on how these projects are doable and beneficial for Ubuntu.12:22
jendaI strongly believe we should allow people to have a profit - that is why I'm taking $31.30 from the poster project (10% of the poster's price).12:22
jendaI want people to see that it's OK to make a profit, and thus motivate them more.12:22
jendaIt is a big financial risk, and it's best for Ubuntu if it's done by people in cheaper countries, where even somethnig like $31.30 is tangible.12:22
jenda6) this is where the hard-designed part ends, and where it starts opening up for ideas... The next thing I'd have in mind would be a list of requested DIY and all other DIY related info... and...12:22
jenda7) A database of Marketing HOWTOs - a list of things you can do to spread ubuntu.12:22
jendai didn't plan further, but eventually, it should be getting close to what SU was meant to be in the beginning.12:22
jendathere :)12:22
jendaAnd now, I really need to go to bed. I'm usually available here, but will be away this weekend. My email is jenda at ubuntu dot com12:23
popeysounds great12:23
popeyyou don't need me ! :D12:23
jendaI need all the help I can get :)12:23
popeyunless of course you do :)12:23
popeyok, go to bed, i need to too, keep in touch on this12:24
jendaI'd like to know how this differs from what you had in mind... and how it fits in with it...12:24
jenda(not now :))12:24
popeyit does except I don't think I can offer much?12:24
popeyI don't want to even attempt to compete with you12:24
jendaThere is no such thing12:25
jendaI _encourage_ people to do their own similar projects.12:25
popeyok12:25
jendaI have no interest in making all the DIY material myself - in fact, I never planned to do more than the stickers and posters.12:25
jendapopey: if what you're thinking is creating material and sending it out to the world for a price you set - then the site is here for you to store pix etc. and give ordering info.12:26
jendaIf, however, you had something broader in mind, I'd love to hear what it was :)12:27
jendaBTW, the website looks like this now, in its preview: http://doc.ubuntu.com/~marketing/DIY%20Material/DIY%20Website/DIY%20Website/12:27
popeyno, it really was pretty simple, an ubuntu merchandise site for europeans12:28
jendaah, OK12:28
jendaBasically, an alternative to cafepress, right? :)12:28
popeybut it wasn't exactly massively well thought out12:28
jendadoesn't matter, that's why we talked about it :)12:28
popeyjust a n idea I threw jonos way12:28
jendahmm12:29
jendaOK, and are you planning to, perhaps, create some material and ship it?12:29
popeythat was the plan12:29
jendaIn that case, once the site is done, it's there to help you get out to the community :)12:30
popey:)12:30
popey..however12:30
popeyI should point out I have two other "big ideas" which I need to work on, so this one is a back burner for now12:30
popey:)12:30
popeybut I'm glad we talked about it, it has refreshed my mind somwhat12:31
jendahehe12:31
jendamay I ask what the other two are? (generally)12:31
popeyi have an application that I'd like to develop12:32
popeywhich I have earmarked some time for12:32
jendaok - that's nowhere near my field :)12:32
popeythe other is training12:32
jendatraining... cool :)12:32
popeycreating training material for ubuntu users12:32
jendamhm...12:32
jendahow does training material differ from documentation?12:32
popeyvideos :)12:33
jendaand have you seen ubuntuvideo.com?12:33
popeyi have, yes12:34
jendaok12:34
jendaI guess you could find a spot there with training videos :)12:34
BHSPitLappySO MAD12:34
BHSPitLappywhoops12:34
BHSPitLappyso mad12:34
jendaHello BHSPitLappy ;)12:34
popeyright, sleepy time12:35
BHSPitLappymy mom's making this great dinner right now12:35
BHSPitLappyI can smell it being prepared12:35
BHSPitLappybut I can't have any12:35
BHSPitLappyhow is that fair12:36
jendaheh12:37
jendathat's not fair, and it's OT :)12:38
jendaBut i'm off to bed too.12:38
jendanight :)12:38
popeynn12:38
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Burgworkanybody else reading LWN right now?03:55
nixternal_i am03:57
Burgworkread the thing about tracking users03:58
elkbuntuhmm?04:14
MadpilotBurgwork, why are you still Burgwork, anyway? Not home yet?04:17
elkbuntuhe was 20 mins ago04:18
elkbuntuas in.. 'still burgwork'04:18
Madpilotya, I saw. Just got back04:18
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Burgundaviahey wickedpuppy04:55
wickedpuppyhi04:55
wickedpuppythe question or rather the unhappiness is that ubuntu is nice but it includes binary drivers ...04:56
Burgundaviaah04:56
Burgundaviaso I would say this04:56
wickedpuppyclearly there are people who are against binary drivers04:56
BurgundaviaUbuntu doesn04:56
Burgundavia't want to have to include to binary drivers, but includes them in a very needed places where things just don't wokr04:56
Burgundaviaprimarily these are networking drivers, mostly for wireless cards04:56
Burgundaviaif you want to help Ubuntu not have to ship them, please contact the manufacturer to say that you are unhappy and would like them to release specs04:57
wickedpuppyI see ... i am going to put it very nicely though ... i am on the local linux user group mailing list04:57
Burgundaviayep04:58
wickedpuppybut then why not put those on restricted repo ? after all its just wireless cards .. people has problem with wireless cards all the time04:58
wickedpuppyif its for mobo .. that would be another thing entirely04:59
wickedpuppyno mobo ... no install04:59
Burgundaviathey are in the restricted section05:00
Burgundaviayou just need to install them by default, as otherwise there is no way to download the wireless card05:00
Burgundaviado you see the chicken and egg issue?05:00
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wickedpuppyoh yes i see it05:00
wickedpuppybut sometimes pureness is against logic05:01
wickedpuppythen i go nut05:01
BurgundaviaI would rather use free drivers as well05:01
wickedpuppywell i suppose that would be all. Thank you very much for the help Burgundavia05:02
wickedpuppy:P05:02
Burgundaviano worries05:02
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Burgundaviaanybody awake?09:46
Burgundaviahttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue17  need proofing09:46
elkbuntusure09:47
elkbuntui just had the stupidest job interview ever. instead of good-cop bad-cop, it was dumb and dumber, and instead of a floodlight it was the afternoon sun behind them so i couldnt actually look at them :-/09:48
Burgundaviaelkbuntu: watch out for collisions09:48
Burgundaviahedgemage and cbx33 from #edubutnu are also looking09:48
elkbuntui'll wait then09:49
Burgundaviacheers09:49
BurgundaviaI plan on sendin first thing09:49
Burgundaviaso you have 8 hours09:49
elkbuntuok09:49
FlannelBurgundavia: "his videos present" instead of presented09:50
BurgundaviaFlannel: please edit it inline, in turn09:52
Burgundaviaelkbuntu: I want the wiki + gobby09:52
FlannelBurgundavia: right.  Wasn't sure what the right protocol for it was ;)09:52
Burgundaviaor we just wait for telepathy allow tomboy or gedit collaborative09:52
elkbuntuok. gobby ip address again?09:53
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Burgundaviaall on the editing page09:54
Burgundaviabut for now please keep it in the wiki09:54
elkbuntuah ok then. wiki slow on my end, that's all09:55
PlugBurgundavia: I wanted to add something about the new network-manager PPTP VPN support I've been working on09:55
PlugIs there still a 'cool new feature' section?09:55
BurgundaviaPlug: is it in teh archive yet?09:55
Burgundaviaif it hit the archive after the 7th, it belongs in 1809:55
Plugprobably later than that - I'll whip something up for 18 then.09:56
PlugI see "Feature of the Week" has mostly disappeared lately?09:57
Burgundaviayes, mostly due to not having any volunteers09:59
Plugok, if you have anything you need done, just point me at it10:00
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Burgundaviaelkbuntu: go to town10:15
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serenityhi08:53
serenityWe are planning a Edgy Eft Releaseparty in Germany, just for your notes.08:56
Mitch_elkbuntu -- wow; ubuntucounter.org has 200,000 hits in the last 4 days =S09:03
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Burgworkhttp://www.dailycupoftech.com/?page_id=4710:52
Burgworkheh10:52
Burgworkhttp://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/articles/book_review_beginning_ubuntu10:53
Burgworkhttp://www.arsgeek.com/?p=62511:08
jendaMitch_: wow :)11:21
BHSPitMonkeyMitch_, is it your site?11:32
BHSPitMonkeyaw why can't I just use my launchpad login11:32
Mitch_no no... not my site.11:32
Mitch_its Elkbuntu's site.11:32
Mitch_i host it free for her11:32
BHSPitMonkeyhmm11:33
Mitch_=)11:33
Mitch_and all ubuntu related sites...11:33
BHSPitMonkeyI wonder if the existence of nubuntu suggests that ubuntu itself isn't secure11:33
jendaBHSPitLappy: not anymore than SELinux suggests that Linux isn't...11:39
BHSPitMonkeyk11:40
jenda...or Enigmail suggesting that email isn't :-D11:41
BHSPitMonkeyit isn't11:42
jendaI know :)11:55
jendaThat's why I like enigmail11:55
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jendanixternal: email for you in the locoteam list ;)11:59

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