[12:19] <LaserJock> awww shucks, looks like I don't get AIGLX
[12:19] <LaserJock> and I was sooo looking forward to the cube :-)
[12:20] <imbrandon> LaserJock, you can do aiglx with the freedrivers iirc, you just need to enable composite in xorg.conf ( thats all i did for compiz/beryl to work )
[12:20] <ajmitch> LaserJock: why not?
[12:20] <LaserJock> yeah, but I can't use the free drivers
[12:20] <ajmitch> don't you want ultra-shiny bling to rot your eyes?
[12:21] <LaserJock> heh
[12:23] <LaserJock> imbrandon: I might be able to use XGL, but I might as well commit software suicide ;-)
[12:23] <imbrandon> not xgl , aiglx built into 7.1
[12:23] <ajmitch> LaserJock: what drivers do you use?
[12:23] <gnomefreak> but you need the beta drivers
[12:24] <LaserJock> I use the ATI binary driver
[12:25] <LaserJock> becuase that's the only one that supports my card
[12:25] <ajmitch> ah, sucks to be you then
[12:25] <LaserJock> yes, that's what I'm saying :-)
[12:25] <gnomefreak> are we still playing with the idea of grumpy groundhog or was that stopped?
[12:26] <ajmitch> it'll probably still happen one day
[12:26] <LaserJock> I'll just have to go stare at the Sun for a while
[12:26] <ajmitch> but it's *not* a distro for people to run
[12:26] <joejaxx> LaserJock: how big is main + universe?
[12:26] <joejaxx> 20gb?
[12:26] <ajmitch> it will be a repository of really bleeding-edge packages
[12:26] <imbrandon> haha like 110gb
[12:27] <imbrandon> bleeding-edgy == broken 98% of the time
[12:27] <ajmitch> more like 99.9%
[12:28] <LaserJock> you think?
[12:28] <ajmitch> we're talking automated compilation from upstream CVS/SVN, etc
[12:28] <LaserJock> I wouldn't think it would be too bad
[12:28] <LaserJock> depends on the core I suppose
[12:28] <ajmitch> can you imagine running a system built on bleeding-edge gcc & glibc?
[12:29] <ajmitch> I know there are some people that do it..
[12:29] <imbrandon> LaserJock, heh well the core would always be changing too thats the thing
[12:30] <imbrandon> hum is TheMuso awake yet ?
[12:30] <imbrandon> scratch that
[12:37] <TheMuso> imbrandon: Yes I am here.
[12:37] <ajmitch> morning TheMuso
[12:37] <TheMuso> But only for another 40 mins or so.
[12:37] <TheMuso> Morning ajmitch.
[12:38] <imbrandon> moins TheMuso
[12:38] <imbrandon> nevermind i dident have time to finish it up, i was going point you to the farm spec
[12:39] <TheMuso> Hey imbrandon.
[12:39] <imbrandon> but i still have a bit more to do
[12:39] <TheMuso> Oh ok.
[12:39] <imbrandon> ( and its dinner time )
[12:39] <TheMuso> What do you mean didn't have time to finish it?
[12:39] <imbrandon> makin a proper spec
[12:39] <imbrandon> of it
[12:39] <TheMuso> Well just ping me when you finish it, and I will keep my eye out for it.
[12:53] <FunnyLookinHat> gnomesword bug
[12:53] <FunnyLookinHat> Ubugtu, gnomesword
[12:58] <LaserJock> bug #65451
[12:58] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 65451 in gnomesword "[UNMETDEPS]  gnomesword has unmet dependencies" [Undecided,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/65451
[01:01] <FunnyLookinHat> heh yea I found it after a quick search
[01:19] <whiprush> ajmitch: awake?
[01:24] <LaserJock> imbrandon: what keyboard layout do you use on a mac?
[01:24] <imbrandon> pc105 iirc
[01:25] <imbrandon> what ever it defaults to
[01:28] <minghua> pc104, more likely
[01:30] <LaserJock> ok
[01:32] <LaserJock> I'm just not sure about some of the buttons
[01:35] <imbrandon> well it should have loaded powerbuttonsd
[01:35] <imbrandon> for those
[01:36] <imbrandon> e.g. the fn+ keys
[01:39] <LaserJock> imbrandon: this isn't on a laptop, just a regular mac keyboard
[01:39] <LaserJock> imbrandon: but I don't have a numlock or insert key, etc.
[01:42] <minghua> they are just different names
[01:42] <minghua> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_keyboard says you use "Help" as insert, and "clear" as numlock
[01:46] <imbrandon> LaserJock, yea but iirc powerbutonsd makes mac keyboards act "right"
[01:47] <LaserJock> oh, now I'm not sure what "right" means :-)
[01:47] <imbrandon> well act like you would expect them to in macosx
[03:25] <imbrandon> ajmitch, whoop here comes hobbsee everyone hide
[03:25] <imbrandon> heh
[03:26] <TheMuso> hahaha
[03:26] <TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee.
[03:26] <imbrandon> hehe
[03:26] <imbrandon> heya Hobbsee
[03:26] <imbrandon> [20:25]  <imbrandon> ajmitch, whoop here comes hobbsee everyone hide
[03:26] <imbrandon> [20:25]  <imbrandon> heh
[03:26] <imbrandon> [20:25]  --> Hobbsee has joined this channel (n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee).
[03:27] <zul> aieee
[03:27] <Hobbsee> hey TheMuso, imbrandon
[03:27] <Hobbsee> :P
[03:27] <TheMuso> imbrandon: What you got going there? ESP?
[03:28] <imbrandon> man ;)
[03:28] <imbrandon> msn*
[03:29] <TheMuso> Oh ok.
[03:29] <TheMuso> Why bother when she is going to be on IRC at the same time?
[03:29] <imbrandon> hehe
[03:29] <imbrandon> TheMuso, sometimes i use IM's when i'm not on irc
[03:30] <TheMuso> Right.
[03:30] <zul> imbrandon: traitor...using msn
[03:30] <imbrandon> or if i'm not on my normal computer
[03:30] <imbrandon> zul, hahah Hobbsee is my onlyu msn contact
[03:30] <imbrandon> all the rest are jabber ;)
[03:30] <zul> imbrandon: still....we are going to have to have a little talk though
[03:30] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: i'm not all the time...
[03:30] <ajmitch> help!
[03:31] <TheMuso> I use MSN for my friends who don't know any better, but I also have a Jabber account.
[03:31] <imbrandon> RUN !!
[03:31] <imbrandon> TheMuso, same
[03:31] <zul> heh there should be an motu octagon at uds
[03:32] <imbrandon> a wha?
[03:32] <zul> like a ring..
[03:32] <imbrandon> i'm sure there will be plenty of motu bof's
[03:32] <imbrandon> i know what an octigon is i just dont see the corelation
[03:33] <LaserJock> like the ubuntu logo
[03:33] <LaserJock> except we have more
[03:33] <TheMuso> I am really starting to feel sad about not going to this UDS.
[03:34] <imbrandon> :/
[03:34] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: next tiem
[03:34] <TheMuso> heh. Gartner reckon Apple should license hardware manufacturing/distribution to Dell.
[03:34] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: Depends on where it is I guess, but yeah.
[03:40] <imbrandon> woot flash9 works great even with konqui, too bad this still isnt ppc or amd64 builds\
[03:40] <imbrandon> guess we'll still need to fixup gnash for that ( and free x86 )
[03:41] <Nafallo> amd64 is planned, isn't it?
[03:41] <ajmitch> yes
[03:42] <imbrandon> Nafallo, i guess planned but when they released the beta there is only x86 ;(
[03:43] <Nafallo> yea, I've looked at it some hours ago :-)
[03:43] <imbrandon> arg , netsplit
[03:44] <imbrandon> yea i loaded it about an hour ago and tested it with konqui and ff
[03:44] <imbrandon> interesting libgnash overides libflash even if both are installed
[03:44] <imbrandon> anyhow brb more mt dew
[04:22] <imbrandon> LaserJock, what was that site your wife needs ?
[04:24] <LaserJock> http://www.topsecretrecipes.com/
[04:32] <LaserJock> imbrandon: does it work?
[04:32] <imbrandon> LaserJock, http://federation.imbrandon.com/ss110.png
[04:33] <imbrandon> good new eh?
[04:33] <imbrandon> news*
[04:34] <LaserJock> yes, very
[04:34] <LaserJock> how'd you install flash 9?
[04:34] <imbrandon> from the adobe site, i'm working on a deb now
[04:35] <imbrandon> i'm just hacking the flasplugin-nonfree 7 deb to make an "unofficial" one as its far to late for edgy
[04:35] <imbrandon> but i'll put it on imbrandon.com
[04:35] <LaserJock> that'd be awesome dude
[04:36] <imbrandon> its super simple to install from the site if you wanan grab it from there ( but your welcome to wait )
[04:37] <imbrandon> litterly its download a tar, untar it , copy the *.so ( one file ) to /usr/lib/firefox/plugins  then restart firefox
[04:44] <LaserJock> imbrandon: where did you download the tar? I can't find it
[04:45] <imbrandon> LaserJock, one sec
[04:46] <imbrandon> LaserJock, http://download.macromedia.com/pub/labs/flashplayer9_update/FP9_plugin_beta_101806.tar.gz
[04:46] <hub> imbrandon: it is not a good news
[04:46] <hub> imbrandon: the technology is still NOT open
[04:47] <chillywilly> hi
[04:47] <imbrandon> hub, good news he can get his wife off windows now
[04:47] <hub> who needs flash anyway
[04:47] <imbrandon> hub, i know thus i'm packaging gnash too ;)
[04:47] <imbrandon> hub, LaserJock's wife wont leave windows untill that website worked on linux , so yes good news ;P
[04:48] <imbrandon> even if its still evil its far less evil than full blown windows
[04:49] <hub> what is evil is all these incompetent people that think that flash belong to the www
[04:49] <LaserJock> for sure
[04:53] <Nafallo> yay! xen :-)
[04:53] <Nafallo> now I just want amd64 serverkernel for it ;-)
[04:53] <ajmitch> Nafallo: then wait for feisty
[04:53] <ajmitch> or roll your own, shouldn't be hard
[04:54] <Nafallo> I won't run feisty on my server :-)
[04:54] <Nafallo> yea, I was about to do that at some point I think.
[04:54] <ajmitch> oh well
[04:54] <Nafallo> I have sources in my develdir ;-)
[04:54] <ajmitch> I don't think we'll have another x-s-2.6.17 build through
[04:54] <ajmitch> since it takes over the buildd for awhile
[04:54] <Nafallo> we need more of those then :-)
[04:55] <hub> edgy is still very rough
[04:55] <hub> I have to use a pre-dapper kernel to have a functionnal laptop
[04:55] <hub> crossing my finger that all the udev thing will not break because of that
[04:57] <LaserJock> imbrandon: wahoo, it worked
[04:58] <imbrandon> LaserJock, rockin, i almost have a deb ready too
[04:58] <LaserJock> I didn't realize it was just one file
[04:58] <imbrandon> yea just one .so
[04:58] <imbrandon> its all most plugins are that are staticly linked
[05:34] <crimsun> oh god, please don't package the beta of flash9
[05:35] <imbrandon> umm ok, why not? you know if not there will be lots of crack about getting ti working
[05:35] <crimsun> you are virtually ensuring people will SCREW their systems AND file bugs against flashplugin-nonfree -- which I will not be pleased about.
[05:35] <crimsun> (the entire download mechanism needs to be reworked for the beta of flash9 anyway)
[05:36] <imbrandon> hrm actualy i already have it working
[05:36] <imbrandon> i just dident announce the url ( and wont now i guess )
[05:36] <Hawkwind> Flash 9 just simply works.  There is no hassle with it
[05:36] <crimsun> well, yes, it's certainly kludgeable. I did it, too, but I'm not going to condone it.
[05:36] <imbrandon> crimsun, right
[05:37] <imbrandon> i just thought a professional doing it would be better than crack on the forums ( can we call ourselfs profesional heh )
[05:37] <crimsun> it's all crack until Bart sorts it for Debian.
[05:38] <imbrandon> right but the _level_ of crack is far less
[05:38] <imbrandon> :) but i do see your point , i'm not saying that
[05:38] <imbrandon> i just dident want to see checkinstall debs floating arround
[05:40] <Hawkwind> Ickkkkkkk
[05:41] <crimsun> note that if you make a deb available, you are breaking their EULA.
[05:41] <imbrandon> even downloading from them like 7 does ?
[05:42] <crimsun> depends what you're doing with libflashplayer.so.
[05:43] <crimsun> Even copying libflashplayer.so across the network breaks it.
[05:43] <imbrandon> it just apt-get sourced flashplugin-nonfree from the repos and hacked it to look for the new tar.gz
[05:43] <imbrandon> changed the versions etc
[05:43] <crimsun> s/versions/md5sums/ ?
[05:44] <imbrandon> yea
[05:44] <imbrandon> md5sum of the tar and of the file inside
[05:44] <crimsun> this new EULA makes my skin crawl
[05:45] <imbrandon> heh yea kinda like the gplv3 does to me
[05:45] <imbrandon> one sec more soda
[05:46] <LaserJock> crimsun: is it much worse then for the previous version (7?) ?
[05:46] <crimsun> it's shades creepier
[05:53] <hub> it is not even free ware
[05:54] <hub> because you allow them to audit at YOUR expenses your use of their software
[06:01] <imbrandon> hub, yes it is a nasty , but as i've said before without getting to much into the whole FLOSS vs propiatary talk, some things are perceived as nessesary evils such as flash ( i'm one of those ) and untill gnash is more mature I have to choose my battles, but on the flip side of that I'm am packaging gnash too to grab a wider audiance and hopefully make it more mature faster
[06:01] <hub> I choose my battle
[06:01] <hub> boycott flash
[06:01] <imbrandon> so in other words i agree with you on the ideas, but in practice the world isnt perfect
[06:01] <hub> in practice you are hypocryt
[06:02] <imbrandon> no i've never said i'm 100% floss, and never will probably in the forseeable future, so thats not a hypocryte
[06:02] <imbrandon> i beleavein floss and stand behind it 100%, that dosent mean i'm RMS and shun closed also
[06:03] <imbrandon> if there is an open alternative i use it, if there is not ( in the case of flash ) i cant so i dont shoose to do without
[06:03] <imbrandon> s/shoose/choose
[06:03] <tritium> crimsun already gets to support users with flash 9 and sound problems ;)
[06:04] <crimsun> yeah. I /love/ it.
[06:04] <imbrandon> tritium, should be alot less though as it uses alsa and gracefully fails now or so they say
[06:04] <hub> imbrandon: I do without as well. lookm, no flash
[06:04] <tritium> imbrandon: dunno, but he's already getting questions in #ubuntu
[06:05] <imbrandon> ouch
[06:05] <hub> they is IMHO the best strategy
[06:05] <imbrandon> hub, and thats your choice, i dont say its a bad one, its just not the correct choice for me
[06:05] <imbrandon> i do without flash on my ppc every day , as its the machine i use the most
[06:05] <imbrandon> as far as a desktop
[06:07] <imbrandon> point is its not a perfect world, and not everyone is a floss ONLY person, nor should they be imho but that just _my_ opinion, and honestly we both know where each other stand and this isnt really the place so i'll stop here
[06:08] <imbrandon> thats one reason i sold my nvidia cards for intel graphics
[06:08] <hub> instead of wasting time supporting their proprietary shit, why not helping on gnash?
[06:08] <imbrandon> so i could use 3d with oss drivers
[06:09] <imbrandon> hub, I am , but is dosent happen over night
[06:09] <imbrandon> hub, you dident see the part where i said i'm trying to bring gnash to a wider audiance in feisty so we'll get more and better bug reports
[06:09] <imbrandon> and hopefull make it mature faster
[06:10] <imbrandon> and as soon as it does i'll use it fulll time
[06:11] <imbrandon> hub, infact see http://www.imbrandon.com/packages/pool/edgy/gnash/ <-- my plem packages ( i wouldent install them though as there is some known packaging issues i have yet to upload fixes for )
[06:11] <imbrandon> but point is i am doing both, i'm not a black or white person , there is grey for me
[06:12] <imbrandon> infact there is grey for every person that run oo.o or ff or krita or many other floss apps on windows
[06:13] <imbrandon> its just one more step in evolution, look at it like this, flash9 has brought one more person to linux ( and a future gnash user when it works for them ) e.g. LaserJock's wife
[06:13] <imbrandon> its cases liek that that make it not black or white for me
[06:29] <crimsun> I wonder if anyone's actually going to provide feedback on a dapper-updates package in the 'test' phase of SRU.
[06:29] <ajmitch> crimsun: that'd require people knowing about the package & wanting to test it
[06:30] <crimsun> you'd figure with the number of people whining about broken sound there'd be /someone/ aware of it.
[06:30] <crimsun> I may as well just trawl the forum now and post.
[06:30] <ajmitch> easier to just complain
[06:30] <ajmitch> I tend to trawl forums & harass users to post bugs when I get the urge
[06:32] <LaserJock> well, that's what I'm worried about with the SRU process
[06:32] <LaserJock> are we going to get much out of it?
[06:32] <ajmitch> probably not
[06:32] <LaserJock> the 2 weeks in -proposed
[06:32] <ajmitch> way too many packages
[06:32] <ajmitch> 2 weeks is a long long time
[06:32] <LaserJock> yes it is
[06:33] <ajmitch> I don't particularly like it since we have no way of making sure that the packages get the testing needed in those 2 weeks
[06:34] <LaserJock> it'll be interesting to see what comes of these motu specs for UDSMV
[06:34] <ajmitch> interesting times
[06:36] <LaserJock> it all feels quite overwhelming
[06:36] <ajmitch> why so?
[06:36] <LaserJock> lots of issues, things to think about, and that's beside just doing the actual package maintenance
[06:37] <ajmitch> it's always like this, we just choose to ignore it most times
[06:37] <LaserJock> I don't want us to get so bogged down that we stop actually doing any work
[06:37] <ajmitch> a constant problem
[06:37] <LaserJock> but it seems like somebody should be working about it
[06:37] <ajmitch> that's why we go to MV to talk about it
[06:39] <LaserJock> we need a UDS at crimsun's house :-)
[06:40] <ajmitch> heh
[06:43] <imbrandon> hehe
[06:48] <tritium> LaserJock: which specs?
[06:49] <LaserJock> there are quite a few governance specs
[06:50] <tritium> LaserJock: is there a URL with a list?
[06:50] <LaserJock> https://features.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/motu
[06:50] <tritium> thanks
[06:51] <LaserJock> https://features.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/new-developers
[06:52] <LaserJock> tritium: btw, the list of Mountain View specs is : https://features.launchpad.net/sprints/uds-mtv/
[06:52] <ajmitch> lots of crack
[06:53] <ajmitch> & growing
[06:53] <tritium> LaserJock: are you going?
[06:53] <ajmitch> 'beryl-by-default'
[06:55] <tritium> I may try to go if I can combine it with a business trip.
[06:56] <LaserJock> tritium: i've got a departmental seminar on the 7th
[06:56] <LaserJock> so I'll drive over that afternoon
[06:57] <ajmitch> LaserJock: you won't be there before then?
[06:57] <tritium> LaserJock: nice, maybe I'll see you there
[06:57] <LaserJock> ajmitch: unfortunately not
[06:57] <imbrandon> ajmitch, he is comming tuesday
[06:57] <LaserJock> it's really bad timing
[06:57] <ajmitch> unfortunate
[06:58] <LaserJock> my inlaws called and said they are coming down in like a week
[06:58] <LaserJock> then I had this seminar planned before the UDS announcment
[06:59] <imbrandon> LaserJock, so your not comming at all , or just late ?
[06:59] <LaserJock> I'll be there Tuesday night on
[07:00] <imbrandon> ahh ok
[07:00] <LaserJock> my seminar is at noon
[07:00] <LaserJock> I plan on driving pretty much straight from there
[07:00] <LaserJock> so I should be there by dinner :-)
[07:00] <imbrandon> beryl_by_default should be feisty+2
[07:00] <imbrandon> not feisty
[07:00] <imbrandon> heh
[07:01] <imbrandon> LaserJock, yea its only like 5.5 hours right ?
[07:01] <imbrandon> from reno to sf that is
[07:01] <LaserJock> something like that
[07:02] <LaserJock> 4 hrs to SF
[07:02] <imbrandon> i took a trip to SF like 2 times for concerts when i lived in reno
[07:04] <imbrandon> stoped at donner lake a few times with the kids too
[07:04] <imbrandon> heh
[07:04] <minghua> deferred?
[07:05] <ajmitch> yeah
[07:05] <minghua> a good reason not to write the release codename in your spec name :-)
[07:08] <LaserJock> yeah, wouldn't want people to know our specs were from hoary or something ;-)
[07:10] <hub> http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS7719803018.html <- ahahah
[07:15] <imbrandon> hub, yea good think  7.0.63 hasent been used in ages, i'm sure i could drudge up vunerabilties for linux2.4 or most anything else :)
[07:15] <imbrandon> s/think/thing
[07:43] <minghua> we have spam in malone now?
[07:43] <minghua> where should I report this?  #launchpad?
[07:44] <imbrandon> minghua, i would say so
[08:09] <imbrandon> ohh ohh i soo want a sun blackbox
[08:09] <imbrandon> actualy i could probably build one for what they cost
[08:09] <imbrandon> heya Fujitsu
[08:09] <Fujitsu> Hi imbrandon.
[09:06] <tonyyarusso> Hi all, I recently formally wrote up a feature specification proposal, and as I do not having coding skills it would need someone to step up for both the Drafter and Assignee positions.  I would greatly appreciate it if anyone would be willing to do that.  The spec is filed at https://features.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/gaim-calendar-auto-aways if you'd like to take a look.
[09:12] <superm1> imbrandon, do you think it will be possible to get two last patches in for mythtv and mythplugins prior to edgy release?
[09:15] <imbrandon> well RC is being released in a  few hours, depends on how critiacl the fixes are
[09:15] <imbrandon> most likely not tbh but i can look
[09:16] <superm1> i wouldn't call either of them critical.  just the mythplugins would make for a cleaner install of mythweb
[09:16] <superm1> the mythtv isn't very important at all
[09:16] <imbrandon> then i would say not
[09:16] <superm1> bug 66564 for mythplugins if you would like to look
[09:16] <imbrandon> only things getting in now are ultra critical
[09:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 66564 in mythplugins "Mythweb doesn't set permissions correctly" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/66564
[09:17] <superm1> oic
[09:17] <superm1> well makes sense :)
[09:17] <imbrandon> heh we are 6 days from release and all ;)
[09:18] <superm1> well it's okay, our deers will be very accepting i'm sure
[09:18] <imbrandon> food time , brb
[09:18] <imbrandon> ;)
[09:19] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: it must be some time to upload some crackful stuff, then!
[09:19] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee, of course.
[09:20] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: :D
[09:20] <superm1> is there any particularly urgent stuff you guys will need a hand with still?  i'll have a few hours tomorrow at work that I can probably kill giving a hand.
[09:20] <Hobbsee> superm1: unmet deps
[09:21] <superm1> hehe, thats always the story :).  Okay
[09:21] <superm1> i haven't looked at the list for a day or two.
[09:21] <Hobbsee> superm1: well, they're very useful, assuming they actually get into the archive.  also just fixing various bugs in the archive
[09:23] <superm1> very well.  i'll see you guys tomorrow then and see what i can do to lend a hand more.  -Night
[09:57] <Fujitsu> Evening, ajmitch.
[09:57] <Hobbsee> hey ajmitch
[09:58] <ajmitch> put the changelog on malone?
[09:58] <Fujitsu> I got a UVF for it a couple of days ago.
[09:58] <ajmitch> yeah
[09:58] <ajmitch> but for the upload
[09:58] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: with all these new MOTU recruits, i get to be the lazy MOTU instead of you :P
[09:59] <ajmitch> it helps to see changelogs on bugs when it's approval time
[09:59] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: I can still be a lazy MOTU
[10:00] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: not when you have to do UVFe stuff
[10:01] <ajmitch> & a whole bunch of other release-critical stuff
[10:01] <Fujitsu> ajmitch, post the changelog entries since the current Ubuntu version as a comment on the bug?
[10:01] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: basically I need justification for uploads - being a UVF exception it should be ok
[10:02] <ajmitch> but for everything else I'd like to see changelogs on bugs
[10:02] <ajmitch> otherwise uploads sit & rot in the queue
[10:02] <Fujitsu> OK.
[10:05] <Fujitsu> ajmitch, uploaded.
[10:05] <ajmitch> ok
[10:05] <ajmitch> I'll wave it through next time I see an archive admin alive
[10:06] <Fujitsu> Thanks
[10:06] <minghua> nice... xchat-gnome crashes
[10:06] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: that's when they dont sit and rot on revu :P
[10:07] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: you can do something about REVU
[10:07] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: no i cant.  what would i do?
[10:09] <ajmitch> review stuff
[10:09] <ajmitch> it's the logical answer
[10:09] <ajmitch> hello Yagisan
[10:09] <Hobbsee> nah...
[10:09] <ajmitch> suggest fixes for peopl
[10:10] <Yagisan> G'day ajmitch
[10:11] <Yagisan> almost finished excising, re-implementing non-gpl code in my project, so hopefully I can get a package in edgy+1
[10:11] <Yagisan> it was a pain in the arse to audit too O_o
[10:11] <minghua> I wonder how I can request a package removal
[10:12] <Yagisan> Hobbsee, ajmitch - so hows uni treating you ?
[10:12] <ajmitch> file a bug, subscribe ubuntu-archive
[10:12] <Fujitsu> minghua, file a big `Please remove X from the archive' or thereabouts.
[10:12] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 41533 in mozilla-locale-zh-cn "[UNMETDEPS]  mozilla-locale-zh-cn has unmet dependencies" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/41533
[10:12] <ajmitch> give good reasons for removing it
[10:12] <Fujitsu> And do as ajmitch said.
[10:12] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: my next assignment is due next week.  all is good :)
[10:12] <ajmitch> Yagisan: uni? what uni?
[10:12] <Yagisan> Hobbsee, I have a final exam tommorow
[10:12] <minghua> ajmitch, Fujitsu: thanks, I'll do that when I confirm in an edgy environment
[10:13] <Yagisan> ajmitch, IIRC you had a uni id card when I last saw you
[10:13] <ajmitch> Yagisan: that was earlier this year
[10:13] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: ouch
[10:13] <Hobbsee> hehe, he does
[10:13] <Fujitsu> Yagisan, run along and study, then :P
[10:13] <minghua> (or is there an easy way to check a binary package's dependency, like packages.d.o?)
[10:13] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: quiet, you
[10:13] <Fujitsu> package.ubuntu.com, minghua?
[10:13] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: :D
[10:13] <Fujitsu> *packages
[10:13] <Hobbsee> minghua: apt-cache show foo | grep Depends
[10:13] <minghua> Fujitsu: is that up-to-date enough?
[10:14] <Yagisan> Fujitsu, I've not studied yet - and I don't intend to start now - 75% for lack of effort so far is perfectly acceptable
[10:14] <minghua> Hobbsee: not when I am not under edgy :-)  but thanks
[10:14] <ajmitch> packages.u.c is generally pretty crap, I've found
[10:14] <Fujitsu> ajmitch, `generally'? `Pretty'?
[10:14] <ajmitch> minghua: or you ask in the channel for someone to tell you the dependencies
[10:14] <Fujitsu> Always and very, I think you'll find.
[10:15] <Hobbsee> minghua: ah
[10:15] <Fujitsu> minghua, LP can actually tell you all that stuff.
[10:16] <Yagisan> Hobbsee, ever notice that everything taught in programming class, never ever matches whats in the real world
[10:16] <Hobbsee> a little
[10:16] <Fujitsu> minghua: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/i386/mozilla-locale-zh-cn/1.6-0.1
[10:17] <minghua> Fujitsu: Ahh... Thanks!
[10:17] <minghua> LP UI is a nightmare
[10:18] <ajmitch> minghua: launchpad is full of hidden gems
[10:18] <Fujitsu> minghua, it really is a nightmare, yes.
[10:18] <ajmitch> as well as traps which will bite your ankle off
[10:18] <Fujitsu> I just go looking through it sometimes, and find all sorts of stuff.
[10:19] <highvoltage> I find the launchpad staffers real friendly though. When I get lost they always help without complaining :)
[10:19] <Yagisan> sometimes it feels you have to know a bug exists before you can find it on LP.
[10:19] <minghua> I think package wise, I still prefer packages.d.o and packages.qa.d.o
[10:20] <minghua> although malone is sometimes more handy than Debian BTS
[10:20] <Fujitsu> Oh.
[10:20] <Fujitsu> I forgot the -sa
[10:20] <ajmitch> common mistake
[10:21] <ajmitch> why?
[10:21] <Fujitsu> I would have expected it to choke and kill itself.
[10:21] <Fujitsu> LP seems to like doing that.
[10:22] <Fujitsu> Like OOPSing if a bug has too many dupes.
[10:22] <Fujitsu> Who knows how it manages to time out for that sort of thing.
[10:22] <minghua> Hmm, maybe this is not a case for removal, just the locale package out-of-date with mozilla
[10:22] <Lathiat> Fujitsu: walking the status and doing lots of queries on too many bugs?
[10:22] <minghua> but nothing we can do here, as the Debian package is also out of date
[10:22] <Fujitsu> Lathiat, even so.
[10:23] <minghua> I'll just add the comments then
[10:24] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: getting the subscribers for all of the duplicate bugs?
[10:25] <ajmitch> which probably is done by a massive number of joins
[10:25] <Fujitsu> ajmitch, with only about 250 dupes, it can't take that long.
[10:25] <ajmitch> so you think
[10:26] <Fujitsu> Plus it breaks what are the most common bugs completely, so it's sort of important to not stuff up things like that.
[11:02] <dholbach> good morning
[11:04] <ajmitch> hey dholbach
[11:07] <dholbach> hi ajmitch
[11:08] <imbrandon_> moins dholbach
[11:08] <dholbach> heya imbrandon_
[11:09] <imbrandon_> Fujitsu: we were both way off on the path thing, but i got it fixed up now for sure, started a new build and i'm off to sleep
[11:09] <imbrandon_> see ya in a few hours
[12:42] <sivang> dholbach: we should improve the unmetdeps script to actually tell which bin packages out of a source are the ones broken,
[12:42] <sivang> dholbach: surely there should be a way for this if the script manages to actully find any
[12:42] <dholbach> sivang: go ahead :)
[12:43] <sivang> dholbach: I've done something locally for my usage, but I wanted to ask you if you know if this can be checked without attemptong to install the packages?
[12:43] <sivang> my script for running iside a chroot looks like:
[12:43] <sivang> BINS=`apt-cache showsrc $1 | grep Binary | sed -e s/Binary\:\ // | xargs -d ","`
[12:44] <sivang> for bin in $BINS;
[12:44] <sivang> do
[12:44] <sivang>  sudo apt-get -y install $bin  | grep -A5 "unmet dependencies"
[12:44] <sivang> so you get only those that didn't install due to unemtdeps
[12:44] <sivang> done
[12:44] <dholbach> why now parse the output of   apt-cache -i unmet  ?
[12:46] <sivang> dholbach: right, I'll try that, for myself I wanted to have a script that actually installs them for some tests I am doing (like after fixing)
[12:47] <sivang> dholbach: hmm, this is easier that I thought :)
[12:48] <dholbach> enjoy it
[12:51] <minghua> dholbach: you maintain the glom package in ubuntu, don't you?
[12:51] <dholbach> minghua: yes
[12:51] <minghua> dholbach: did you see glom author's new blog entry?
[12:51] <dholbach> yes
[12:52] <dholbach> I'm just busy with stuff and we don't have a policy for SRUs in Universe yet
[12:52] <minghua> what do you think the chance is for glom 1.0.8 to enter dapper-update?
[12:52] <dholbach> we release in 7 days
[12:52] <dholbach> atm I don't really care much about dapper-updates to be honest
[12:52] <dholbach> don't get me wrong, I like Murray very much and I'll think about it and see what can be done
[12:52] <minghua> dholbach: no, I am not pushing you
[12:53] <minghua> dholbach: I am thinking of working on getting glom 1.0.8 into dapper-update once we have SRU policy in place
[12:53] <dholbach> I'm happy to do that and work on it
[12:53] <dholbach> but we need the policy first
[12:53] <dholbach> there's a document on the wiki about it
[12:53] <dholbach> but nobody bothered to add something to it after our meeting
[12:54] <minghua> dholbach: I see.  just checking with you, thanks.  I know you are busy about edgy release :-)
[12:54] <dholbach> Thanks :-)
[12:54] <dholbach> glom kicks ass and I want to do for it what I can
[01:22] <kkubasik> According to the wiki I'm supposed to ask here to get my gpg key synced to I can upload to REVU
[01:23] <minghua> kkubasik: please read topic
[01:23] <minghua> there is an URL for you to add your key
[01:24] <kkubasik> alright, I joined the group ;)
[01:24] <kkubasik> its ok that I upload packages to revu even though were in a freeze?
[01:25] <minghua> kkubasik: yes, REVU is not affected by freeze
[01:25] <kkubasik> I'm working on merging a couple different things, but I'm new to packaging so I wanted to get some feedback
[01:25] <kkubasik> awesome, thanks!
[01:25] <geser> minghua: it was necessary that a revu admin synced the gpg keyring manually. has this changed?
[01:25] <minghua> geser: I have no idea :-)  I don't use REVU myself
[01:26] <minghua> I don't think it changed though.  so kkubasik you probably need to wait a while before you can upload to REVU :-)
[01:27] <kkubasik> no problem ;)
[01:34] <geser> kkubasik: I might be helpful to ping the REVU admins to get their attention
[02:20] <edscho1> Anyone know what the Debian way is to replace one official package to the latest compiled from source? Removing the package first with apt-get will also remove dependencies. Can I make a stub package to prevent this?
[02:32] <minghua> edscho1: Yes, you can.  You want to look at equivs package.
[02:32] <edscho1> minghua: thanks :)
[03:29] <gnomefreak> libflash-mozplugin is non-free as well is flashplugin-nonfree?
[03:48] <bddebian> Heya gang
[03:48] <bhale> hi
[03:49] <bddebian> Hello bhale
[03:56] <bhale> hm, kkubasik is here
[04:07] <Q-FUNK> http://q-funk.iki.fi/2006-10-19_Eesti_Ekspress_Linutop.pdf
[04:54] <fowlduck> should i scratch building new packages in an edgy environment and just wait until feisty is available?
[04:55] <Riddell> fowlduck: no
[04:55] <Riddell> when feisty is available it'll be much the same as edgy
[04:55] <chantra> hi guys, how to you make a dpatch patch?
[04:55] <bhale> man dpatch-edit-patch
[04:55] <chantra> is it diff -ruN ?
[04:55] <bhale> no.
[04:56] <chantra> bhale: arf :)
[04:56] <sivang> chantra: what bhale said, dpatch-edit-patch will provide you anything you need, you just need to follow it precisly
[04:56] <fowlduck> Riddell, ok, thanks :)
[04:56] <bhale> http://blog.brandonhale.us/articles/search?q=dpatch
[04:56] <bhale> the dpatch manpage admittedly sucks
[04:57] <chantra> bhale: :)
[04:58] <bhale> that post was famous when MOTU first started
[05:00] <chantra> bhale: , actually, I already made the patch in a diff -ruN format
[05:00] <bhale> ok?
[05:00] <chantra> can I easily convvert it ?
[05:01] <bhale> you can copy the header into it from a real dpatch
[05:01] <chantra> or maybe just user my patch and exit
[05:01] <bhale> or you can use dpatch-edit-patch on a clean source t ree
[05:01] <bhale> and apply the patch
[05:01] <bhale> then exit the shell
[05:02] <bhale> if you try it, you will get it
[05:02] <bhale> just have to do it
[05:12] <chantra> bhale: cheers
[05:12] <chantra> the trick is to copy the patch into the package directory
[05:12] <chantra> as I could not get my patch from the parent directory :s
[05:24] <bhale> it should be in debian/patches
[05:24] <bhale> (sigh)
[06:42] <Admiral_Chicago> netsplit?
[07:48] <LaserJock> lucas: I didn't know you had a 40 node cluster to build on
[07:49] <LaserJock> that's quite cool
[07:49] <lucas> I have more nodes than that, but 40 is enough :)
[07:50] <LaserJock> lucas: is that at your uni?
[07:50] <lucas> it's a french research project on grid computing, so there are resources shared by different laboratories
[07:51] <lucas> the goal is to reach 5000 CPUs. We have about 1200 nodes currently (so 2400 CPUs)
[07:52] <LaserJock> holy cow
[07:52] <LaserJock> and they run Debian?
[07:53] <lucas> depends on the cluster. some of them, yes. some of them run ubuntu, or fedora core or rocks
[07:53] <lucas> but one can "deploy" his own work environment on the nodes
[07:54] <lucas> so, if you want to work on debian/ubuntu, you just have to deploy a debian/ubuntu environment
[07:54] <LaserJock> crazy
[07:56] <LaserJock> lucas: how much access do you have to it?
[07:58] <lucas> well, I can run jobs on it, and I'm part of the technical committee for it
[07:58] <LaserJock> cool
[07:58] <LaserJock> I just wondered if we need to do Universe-wide audits it would be a whole lot easier on something like that
[07:58] <LaserJock> where you did the FTBFS run in 4-5 it would have taken us forever
[07:59] <lucas> it takes about 10 days on a single node
[07:59] <lucas> my plans are to improve my tools, and then to run other tests
[08:00] <cbx33> LaserJock, where are the menu files stored....
[08:00] <cbx33> i know you did that dynamic menu thing
[08:00] <LaserJock> cbx33: my menu files or the general ones?
[08:00] <cbx33> the general ones
[08:01] <LaserJock> lucas: that's super cool
[09:19] <fowlduck> how do I report a package for which no binaries have been built in edgy?  It appears libapache2-mod-mono and libapache-mod-mono don't have anything.
[09:22] <thiagocmartinsc> Hi! who is working on asterisk package ?!
[09:22] <thiagocmartinsc>  I see that's asterisk.init doesn't manage varrun correctly...
[09:23] <LaserJock> fowlduck: you could file a bug :-)
[09:23] <LaserJock> thiagocmartinsc: not sure
[09:24] <fowlduck> LaserJock: hmm, i can download it manually, erg
[09:24] <thiagocmartinsc> my asterisk.init is right at this time.. for asterisk-1.2.12.1
[09:24] <LaserJock> thiagocmartinsc: looks like shawarma_away maybe is the last uploader
[09:25] <thiagocmartinsc> I see Soren Hansen in the last entry on changelog for 1:1.2.12.1.dfsg-1ubuntu1
[09:26] <thiagocmartinsc> maybe send an email..  :-P
[09:27] <LaserJock> fowlduck: mod-mono is FTBFS
[09:28] <LaserJock> looks like an unmet dep problem from the build log
[09:28] <slomo> fowlduck, LaserJock: no, just broken apache or apache2... they must be installed both at the same time but one of them is broken to not allow this anymore
[09:29] <slomo> infinity already promised me more than once to fix it ;)
[09:29] <fowlduck> ya, found that bug now :)
[09:29] <LaserJock> sladen: right, it was a unmet dep in apache2-threaded-dev
[09:30] <Burgwork> thiagocmartinsc: again, bugs go to the bug tracker, along with patches to fix it
[09:31] <slomo> LaserJock: i'm not sladen ;)
[09:31] <slomo> poor sladen :P
[09:32] <LaserJock> bah
[09:32] <LaserJock> I didn't even see that
[09:35] <sladen> mooo
[09:37] <LaserJock> sorry sladen
[09:37] <thiagocmartinsc> Burgwork, Ok!
[09:38] <Burgwork> thiagocmartinsc: that way, it doesn't get lost, as Ubuntu doesn't have such strong package ownership, like Debian
[09:40] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: like Burgwork says, ideally copy the upload to a mailing list, or attach the patch to the corresponding bug report
[09:40] <thiagocmartinsc> Burgwork, but, on asterisk-1.2.12.1.dfsg-1ubuntu1 found on edgy, Soren Hansen says "create /var/run/ directory if necessary and set proper permissions"
[09:41] <thiagocmartinsc> but it's not happening...!
[09:41] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: _what_ is not happening
[09:41] <Burgwork> thiagocmartinsc: regardless of who introduced the bug, it is a bug
[09:41] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: what error message do you get?
[09:42] <thiagocmartinsc> /etc/init.d/asterisk doesn't create /var/run/asterisk like /etc/init.d/ssh ... remember... /var/run is mount at boot.. ok?!
[09:44] <thiagocmartinsc> I'm talking about the check_privsep_dir() func on init.d...
[09:45] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: have you filed all of this in a bug report, then we can keep everything in one place and not loose information
[09:45] <Burgwork> sladen: where is my "irc is a not a bug reporting tool" spec
[09:45] <thiagocmartinsc> no, this is my first report....
[09:45] <sladen> I'm not sure who Soren Hansen is, are they the Debian maintainer, one of the upstream authors, another user?
[09:46] <LaserJock> sladen: it's shawarma
[09:46] <sladen> LaserJock: ta
[09:46] <thiagocmartinsc> Soren Hansen is the guy that's upload the asterisk-1:1.2.12.1.dfsg-1ubuntu1 to EDGY!
[09:47] <thiagocmartinsc> apt-get source asterisk and you see it...
[09:47] <thiagocmartinsc> :-P
[09:47] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: can you go to  https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/asterisk/+filebug  and include all of the information you've pasted into IRC so far
[09:47] <thiagocmartinsc> of course!
[09:47] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: thank you for that.  You can also see the changelog by do  less /usr/share/doc/asterisk/changelog
[09:48] <thiagocmartinsc> sladen, yes.. I know that...  but I don't have asterisk of edgy installed here... sorry...
[09:49] <ajmitch> morning all
[09:49] <thiagocmartinsc> I'm working with pkg-voip-maintainers...
[09:49] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: right, so where are you seeing this bug if you don't have asterisk installed?
[09:49] <thiagocmartinsc> becasuse I know that.
[09:50] <sladen> how do you know?
[09:50] <thiagocmartinsc> asterisk.init on edgy sources don't manage the /var/run ... so, after a reboot.. asterisk don't found /var/run/asterisk.
[09:51] <thiagocmartinsc> on Debian we don't have /var/run on a tmpfs...
[09:53] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: right, so give the bug a title "asterisk.init fails when /var/run is tmpfs"
[09:53] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: and please, please, please, pretty please, file a bug report
[09:53] <thiagocmartinsc> Ok man!
[09:53] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: excellent! :)
[09:53] <thiagocmartinsc> You don't need to tell me 2 times!!! :-D
[10:10] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: so, do we have bug number yet?
[10:10] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: there are people who are happy to work on this, but can't without a bug number
[10:10] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: and if I asked you again, that would be nagging, right :)
[10:12] <thiagocmartinsc> sladen, I forgot my password on launchpad..   hehehe
[10:13] <thiagocmartinsc> in a few minutes I will post a BUG report...
[10:32] <thiagocmartinsc> sladen, https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/asterisk/+bug/67001
[10:32] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 67001 in asterisk "asterisk.init fails when /var/run is tmpfs" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] 
[10:33] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: woooooooo!
[10:34] <thiagocmartinsc> sladen, what's up man?!
[10:34] <sladen> you deserve a lollipop reward
[10:35] <ajmitch> man, I wish I got rewards
[10:35] <sladen> are you able to get a copy of  'asterisk.init' before and after you modified them and type   diff -u old-asterisk.init new-asterisk.init
[10:36] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: having a diff would help us enormously since it shows the changes and can be applied automatically
[10:36] <thiagocmartinsc> yes.. I have a diff
[10:37] <sladen> thiagocmartinsc: if you do Add comment  then Add attachment, you can upload it and tick the 'patch' box
[10:39] <thiagocmartinsc> Mmmm... Ok!
[10:48] <gnomefreak> how do i update the iso using rsync i used -vPz rsync://server  ~/edgy-desk....iso  there is a -u option but do i need to run the --inplace flag also?
[10:52] <fdoving> no. --inplace should not be needed.
[10:53] <gnomefreak> so -vPzu should be all
[10:54] <fdoving> you don't need -u either.
[10:54] <gnomefreak> it will update the iso as long as i add the dir?
[10:56] <LaserJock> gnomefreak: rsync -az --progress is what I use
[10:56] <gnomefreak> that updated the iso
[10:56] <fdoving> gnomefreak: i use 'rsync -vPz --progress --bwlimit=100'
[10:58] <gnomefreak> ty in 40minutes i will play with those commands
[11:00] <gnomefreak> bbl gotta get dinner ready for oven