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[12:50] <Cyorxamp> Hi gays
[12:50] <Cyorxamp> dexem_away is gay but away
[12:50] <Cyorxamp> Oh it rhymes
[12:51] <Cyorxamp> lool is gay too
[12:51] <Cyorxamp> You know would be easy if I knew who was an op
[12:51] <Cyorxamp> Then I could insult the right people to make the job go quicker
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[12:51] <Cyorxamp> lucasvo he is a gay
[12:51] <Cyorxamp> Burgwork, was gay, till he gave it up
[12:52] <Cyorxamp> gnomefreak... there you are
[12:52] <Cyorxamp> Send your gay friends round!
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[12:52] <Cyorxamp> I can get around that ban in edubuntu too easy, can u make it tighter?
=== bhale is now known as tseng
[12:52] <Cyorxamp> double check kubuntu, xubuntu, offtopic and +1 as well just incase
[12:52] <Cyorxamp> tseng is gay, Burgwork is gay
[12:52] <Cyorxamp> gay gay gay gay gay
=== mode/#ubuntu-devel [+o tseng]  by ChanServ
[12:53] <Cyorxamp> yey!
=== mode/#ubuntu-devel [+b *!*=Cyorxamp@*.112.21.19.bbplus.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net]  by tseng
=== Cyorxamp was kicked off #ubuntu-devel by tseng (tseng)
[12:53] <Fujitsu> Thanks tseng, he's been around.
[12:53] <shackan> thanks
=== mode/#ubuntu-devel [+b *!*@*.112.21.19.bbplus.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net]  by tseng
=== mode/#ubuntu-devel [+o Fujitsu]  by tseng
[12:54] <tseng> in case he is determined enough to come back
[12:54] <tseng> i will be gone in an hour or so
[12:54] <gnomefreak> he is
[12:54] <Fujitsu> OK.
[12:54] <Fujitsu> He will come back, believe me.
[12:54] <gnomefreak> tseng: every channel hes working on
[12:55] <tseng> gnomefreak: sigh
[12:55] <Fujitsu> (thanks)
[12:55] <tseng> Fujitsu: he msg'd to tell me he could get around my ban
[12:55] <gnomefreak> its been a 3 month battle with him
[12:55] <gnomefreak> tseng: proxy if he has one and dont think he does
[12:55] <gnomefreak> tseng: +d JackONeill
[12:55] <Fujitsu> Ah, so that's what +d does...
[12:55] <Fujitsu> That's trivial to get around, of course...
[12:56] <gnomefreak> :)
[12:57] <Fujitsu> Has he hit #[xk] ubuntu yet? I haven't seen him.
[12:57] <pygi> Fujitsu: #u-meeting
=== tseng is now known as bhale
[12:58] <gnomefreak> hes in -meeting now
[12:58] <Fujitsu> Fun.
[12:58] <Fujitsu> I knew there was something I normally had on my autojoin list but forgot this reinstall... 
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[12:59] <Fujitsu> Doesn't large-scale trolling like this warrant something more than seperate-channel bans?
[12:59] <bhale> yes, ask staff
[12:59] <gnomefreak> Fujitsu: i cant contact any of the IRC ops i know
[12:59] <bhale> #freenode
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[12:59] <Fujitsu> nalioth is staff, isn't he?>
[12:59] <bhale> yes
[12:59] <gnomefreak> we have 2 in -ops but neither are around
[12:59] <bhale> seriously, #freenode
[01:00] <gnomefreak> or ignoring the kline i asked for
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[01:10] <FireRabbit> someone named cyorxamp has his phone number published on his website
[01:10] <FireRabbit> gotta wonder..
[01:11] <bhale> has someone talked to #freenode?
[01:11] <bhale> or shall I do it myself
[01:11] <FireRabbit> same person that has an acount on the ubuntu forums
[01:11] <gnomefreak> bhale: i talked to a staff 
[01:11] <bhale> gnomefreak: nice
[01:11] <gnomefreak> i waitiing for reply
[01:11] <gnomefreak> been waiting
[01:11] <bhale> ugh
[01:11] <bhale> you cant join #freenode?
[01:11] <bhale> i hate this network
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[01:12] <gnomefreak> bhale: you op in fridge?
[01:13] <bhale> no
[01:13] <gnomefreak> bhale: its #freenode-social and you need +v
[01:13] <bhale> i see that
[01:13] <bhale> and it angers me
[01:13] <gnomefreak> is you use /stats p it will give you list of staff online
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[01:14] <bhale> OFTC lets me talk to the staff
[01:14] <bhale> when I have a problem
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[01:25] <psusi> vg=${ROOT#/dev/mapper/} << that takes what is in the ROOT variable and strips off the /dev/mapper part right?
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[01:26] <psusi> hrm... yea... I think I found the 3 min hang during boot... it's the LVM script
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[01:30] <psusi> yea... someone changed the LVM script to keep polling to see if the lvm volume shows up for 180 seconds if the root device name starts with /dev/mapper
[01:31] <psusi> this is no good... hrm..
[01:33] <psusi> looks like it was Fabio
[01:33] <psusi> fabbione, ping
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[01:44] <psusi> hrm... would be really nice if certain common tasks between packages didn't have to be duplicated... such as updating the initramfs... be nice to just do it once after all 3 packages that require it have been installed, instead of after each one
[01:44] <keescook> ah, sweet.  solved the G5 thermal issues
[01:44] <yacoob> Dear developers, answer me this. Ubuntu is created from snapshot of debian unstable. The packages get frozen at some time, and after release are getting only security updates.
[01:44] <keescook> Now if I only knew the Right way to do it.  :)
[01:45] <yacoob> But does such freeze also affects multiverse and universe repos?
[01:45] <LaserJock> yes
[01:45] <yacoob> Mhm. So I get rather stable base.
[01:45] <yacoob> I was afraid that *verses are running target, aka debian unstable :)
[01:46] <FireRabbit> nope, should be stable
[01:46] <psusi> no... but.... we do have the backport repo again don't we?
[01:46] <keescook> yacoob: nope, they get frozen too.  That's why I started using Ubuntu for all my servers.  :)
[01:47] <yacoob> keescook, well, for most things server-wise I'm fine with debian stable + a little bit of backports
=== Nafallo only runs Ubuntu everywhere... :-)
[01:48] <keescook> yacoob: I had a lot of developers wanting pretty modern stuff, which is why I like it.  :)
[01:48] <Nafallo> why is Ubuntu marked as not spelled correctly _in_ Ubuntu? :-)
[01:48] <yacoob> understandable. Mine are simple boxes :>
[01:48] <psusi> I upgraded my server at work from breezy to dapper a few weeks ago..... only problem was that the tightvnc server was no longer able to locate the rgb database since it moved so emacs broke
[01:48] <psusi> took me a few weeks to get around to solving that one
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[01:48] <keescook> yacoob: for simple stuff, yeah, debian stable is good.  a have a friend that sticks to that for the same reason.  :)
[01:49] <yacoob> I wonder how many folks were switching from debian to ubuntu...
=== Nafallo holds his and up
[01:49] <Nafallo> insert hand somewhere :-)
[01:49] <yacoob> similar reasons? :>
[01:50] <Nafallo> well, I got involved in and in love with the project that had an official amd64-distro :-).
[01:51] <Nafallo> after that there where no turning back to the rather stale debian.
[01:51] <Nafallo> here we can do new stuff, break the ice.
[01:51] <yacoob> hehe.
[01:51] <yacoob> Well, I got a bit fed up with debian. 
[01:52] <Nafallo> right. the one and only biggest reason for me was after all the flamewars :-P
[01:52] <Nafallo> Ubuntu was just... nice :-)
[01:52] <yacoob> I love the idea, infrastructure, and got used to it in many places
[01:52] <yacoob> but it was hit with a paralysis, I think
[01:53] <yacoob> trying to be the perfect saint distro, last firefox dispute... :/
[01:53] <Nafallo> hmm, might be,
[01:53] <yacoob> it's not what end-users want to deal with :)
[01:53] <Nafallo> I'll still use it. and I switched to epiphany half a year ago ;-)
[01:55] <Burgwork> keescook: any thoughts? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Website/LifeCycle
[01:55] <Burgwork> keescook: long term plan: move that page to the website
[01:56] <psusi> does lvm really place the dev nodes for the volume group in /dev, while the volumes themselves are in /dev/mapper?
=== psusi wonders why this script was written this way
[01:56] <Nafallo> psusi: no. /dev/vg/lv
[01:56] <psusi> ohh, /dev/vg is a directory?
[01:56] <Nafallo> psusi: /dev/mapper/vg-lv are just some kind of "nice way" to access them.
[01:57] <psusi> I see.... the yea, the script is waiting for a directory to show up that never does because I'm using dmraid, not lvm.... the device already exists in /dev/mapper, but the script is looking for the vg directory
[01:59] <Nafallo> how nice of it :-)
=== psusi needs to poke fabbione when he gets back.... time for beer and jazz now
[01:59] <yacoob> time for old-fashioned sleep
[01:59] <sfllaw> 8/g 25
[01:59] <sfllaw> Bleh.
=== yacoob hopes to find a release in the morning :>
[01:59] <sfllaw> Time to go to bed.
=== Nafallo talks to a geeky gentoo girl about... stuff :-P
[02:00] <yacoob> ohhh, ask her to show you her use flags :D
[02:00] <yacoob> "Wanna unroll some loops with me?"
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[02:00] <Nafallo> lol
[02:01] <Nafallo> we've already been there. I reminded her of her gf before we went to far ;-)
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[02:40] <Burgwork> mdz: Hoary EOL didn't make it to -announce
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[02:50] <jdub_> oh man, moser is now posting to d-d-l
[02:51] <ajmitch> excellent :)
[02:51] <Fujitsu> Hahah.
[02:51] <Fujitsu> What fun.
[02:51] <Burgwork> jdub_: I was commenting on that earlier in the day
[02:51] <Burgwork> I feel bad, knowing that we are kind of responsible
[02:51] <ajmitch> it's only a small essay
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[02:52] <jdub_> "let's try this user-abusive stuff that was done 10 years ago and regarded as a complete failure"
[02:52] <jdub_> "*even back then*"
[02:52] <jdub_> "and we *hated* users back then"
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[02:55] <Nafallo> hehe
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[03:27] <bddebian> Howdy
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[03:36] <Hobbsee> hey bddebian 
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[03:48] <jono> hey
[03:49] <bhale> hello jono
[03:49] <Artemis3> hi
[03:49] <jono> hey
[03:49] <ajmitch> hey jono 
[03:49] <jono> hows it going, busy night? :P
[03:49] <bhale> ARE WE THERE YET?
[03:49] <bhale> is about all
[03:49] <jono> heh
[03:50] <jono> I am pissed and tired and aching
[03:50] <ajmitch> and also questions about when feisty opens (or releases)
[03:50] <zul> is it done yet? how about now
[03:50] <jono> but wantedto check in
[03:50] <jono> Ubuntu won best distro award tonight again :)
[03:50] <zul> sweet..
[03:50] <ajmitch> sweet
[03:50] <Artemis3> i want to help seed torrent images...
[03:50] <Fujitsu> Is Feisty released yet? Is it usable?
[03:50] <jono> heh
[03:50] <bhale>  /kick Fujitsu 
[03:51] <Fujitsu> I've seen similar things two or three times this morning in #ubuntu.
=== mode/#ubuntu-devel [-o bhale]  by bhale
[03:53] <Hobbsee> hi jono 
[03:53] <bhale> jono: i dont think we have done anything innovative in a long time
[03:53] <jono> hey Hobbsee
[03:53] <bhale> jono: if Novell ever gets their act straight we would be relegated to the back seat
[03:53] <jono> bhale: doesnt matter, we kick arse and take names anyway :P
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[03:54] <bhale> not that Best Distro is anything more than fluff in most contexts
[03:54] <jono> hehe yeah
[03:55] <bhale> rock on
[03:55] <bhale> http://fedora.redhat.com/
[03:56] <bhale> good day to download ubuntu
[03:56] <infinity> We don't have to innovate; we're brown.
[03:56] <bhale> ugh.
[03:57] <_ion> upstart?
[03:57] <bhale> we do innovate by changing the shade of brown every 6 months
[03:57] <ajmitch> morning infinity 
[03:57] <infinity> Oh, upstart is innovative, but not in the sorts of ways most end users would ever care about.
[03:57] <tritium> "What can brown do for you?"
[03:57] <bhale> _ion: yes users are horribly excited
[03:57] <infinity> (Or, rather, not in ways they SHOULD care about, though plenty seem to have opinions)
[03:57] <Fujitsu> The biggest user experience change in the world, upstart.
[03:58] <Artemis3> i like chocolate
[03:58] <infinity> *shrug* .. Edgy was a fast and messy cycle.  I suspect feisty to be a bit more fun.
[03:58] <bhale> didnt mean to kill jono's buzz
[03:58] <Nafallo> infinity: aye!
[03:58] <bhale> infinity: BerylByDefault!
[03:59] <Fujitsu> The short cycle really stifled any big changes, I think (other than upstart)
[03:59] <Fujitsu> bhale: YES!
=== Nafallo looks forward to make everything upstartisch ;-)
=== Fujitsu looks forward to seeing somebody being crushed by a certain somebody when they shoot down BerylByDefault.
[04:01] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: :D
[04:01] <bhale> who will be crushing who, I wonder
[04:01] <Fujitsu> I presume we all know who will be doing the crushing.
=== _ion looks forward to the planned changes being implemented in upstart.
[04:01] <jdub> Fujitsu: it wasn't the cycle, it was the desires of the hackers. :-)
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[04:02] <bhale> yes I am sure BerylByDefault will all end in tears
[04:02] <bhale> big salty ones
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[04:02] <Fujitsu> Tears, as well as a mess on the ground where somebody has been stepped on.
[04:02] <bhale> it horribly conflicts with LaptopHardwareSupport
[04:03] <ajmitch> we'll see
[04:03] <ajmitch> beryl may improve sufficiently by then
[04:04] <Fujitsu> ajmitch: It's got 4 months, has it not?
[04:04] <bhale> something like thaqt
[04:04] <jdub> i really don't like the messaging that beryl == community version
[04:04] <ajmitch> approximately
[04:04] <bhale> jdub: i dont like that hackers run around trying to wrap their brain around gnome-session-save
[04:05] <ajmitch> jdub: having the shiny word 'community' does imply a lot, doesn't it?
[04:05] <bhale> i spelled it out in no unclear terms
[04:05] <jdub> bhale: hrm?
[04:05] <bhale> jdub: less-than-clueful beryl guys
[04:05] <bhale> guy wanted to make a .desktop file for beryl --replace
[04:07] <bhale> holy crap, miguel posted a gtk# roadmap
[04:07] <bhale> i only asked 2 years ago
[04:08] <jdub> heh
[04:08] <bhale> Coming Soon: data binding
[04:08] <bhale> this will be hot
[04:08] <ajmitch> not that the 5 page presentation has much roadmap info
[04:08] <ajmitch> "All the cool kids use Gtk#"
[04:09] <bhale> you're right, this is useless
[04:09] <bhale> but I can dream
[04:09] <bhale> most of the problems will be solved by being forced into the gnome release cycle
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[04:12] <jdub> bhale: it's a pity they're going to do data binding at the Gtk# level though
[04:12] <bhale> jdub: I guess so
[04:12] <bhale> doing it in C and then marshalling into proper objects is surely more work to make a nice interface
[04:14] <bhale> the codename for mono 2.0 is Sirloin
[04:15] <RadiantFire> marshalling in C isn't that horrible, there is a nice makefile that can autogenerate the code for you :-)
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[05:07] <bronson__> Is there an easy way to get rid of *.dpkg *.diff.gz *.changes *.upload *.dsc in my build directory?
[05:07] <bronson__> Just clean things out?
[05:07] <bronson__> Or do all developers set up their own alias for that?
[05:07] <bronson__> I find that once I upload a package, I have no interest in having all that cruft hanging about.
[05:10] <_ion> Well, debclean --cleandebs removes *.{deb,changes,build} files from parent directory, but not the rest.
[05:11] <fabbione> morning guys
[05:11] <ogra> ugh
[05:11] <ogra> time for bed ... fabbione is up
[05:11] <ajmitch> morning fabbione, ogra 
[05:20] <bronson__> _ion: thanks.
[05:21] <bronson__> I'm looking at the changelog for the postfix package...  It's got 2.2.2 and 2.2.3 releases interleaved.
[05:22] <bronson__> But those releases start with different source bases right?
[05:23] <bronson__> How does the single changelog file get used for different original sources?  Isn't it more convenient just to keep a postfix-2.2.2 build tree and a separate postfix-2.2.3 tree?
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[06:11] <keescook> Burgwork: lifecycle wiki> yup, looks right for the dates.
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[06:49] <_samuel> hello
[06:50] <_samuel> when will 6.10 be out?
=== Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-devel.log
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=== Topic for #ubuntu-devel: Ubuntu Development (not support, even with edgy) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs |  Edgy is so frozen, you would not believe
=== Topic (#ubuntu-devel): set by mdz at Tue Oct 24 13:08:38 2006
=== #ubuntu-devel  [freenode-info]  channel flooding and no channel staff around to help? please check with freenode support: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#gettinghelp
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[07:27] <BHSPitLappy> jdong, connection difficulties? :)
[07:28] <jdong> BHSPitLappy: more like trying to make xchat behave
[07:28] <jdong> it decided to magically send user list to /dev/null
[07:28] <jdong> and it took me 20 tries of zapping xchat.conf lines to get it back
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[08:11] <Kagou> hi
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[09:03] <pitti> Good morning
[09:03] <Nafallo> morning pitti :-)
[09:04] <Fujitsu> Hey pitti.
[09:04] <BHSPitLappy> good 2am
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[09:06] <pitti> so, did any catastrophes turn up?
[09:07] <Fujitsu> pitti: Who knows. You're the only major dev to be in here for quite some time... I presume everybody is congregating in #canonical... :S
[09:08] <pitti> Fujitsu: not really, #ubuntu-release is where most of the action was yesterday
[09:08] <pitti> but yesterday all looked good
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[09:08] <Fujitsu> Today is good, but... you know... people discovered .pool and posted it to digg?
[09:09] <Lathiat> heh
[09:09] <Lathiat> yay for trying to get mirrors updated first
[09:09] <Fujitsu> Yeah...
[09:10] <Fujitsu> Can we get a big red `GO AWAY' put on the top of that page?
[09:10] <tfheen> Fujitsu: it'll happen for fawn, yes.
[09:10] <Fujitsu> tfheen: Oh good... It's been dugg, makes an appearance in #ubuntu every 20 or so seconds...
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=== Fujitsu speculates.
=== Nafallo waits for .torrent ;-)
[09:19] <Fujitsu> Can we introduce a bug into the installer that, say, blows up some hardware, and then push that to the mirrors for people to discover... Then fix it at the last minute? That would turn people of getting the non-official ISOs :P
[09:20] <tfheen> Fujitsu: we could zero out the first 64 blocks of the ISO.  That'd make it rsync quickly, while being unbootable.
[09:20] <Lathiat> tfheen: hrm thats not the silliest idea
[09:20] <Fujitsu> I was thinking how it could be made to rsync quickly, yes :P
[09:20] <maswan> .. or we could just not care?
[09:20] <Lathiat> assuming everyone rsyncs
[09:20] <Fujitsu> Lathiat: The mirrors do, which is all that matters.
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[09:20] <maswan> distribute them 600 should work for most mirrors too, except you'd only distribute them to the mirrors that sync directly
[09:21] <Lathiat> i assume the mirrors dont sync from releases.  then ?
[09:22] <tfheen> we have a two-tier setup internal to the DC too, afaik.
=== Fujitsu runs off to dinner.
=== Lathiat nods
[09:22] <maswan> tfheen: well, yeah, but that could be fairly easy to solve
[09:23] <maswan> tfheen: as long as you control the rsyncd.conf you can enable downstreams mirrors to get it
[09:23] <maswan> anyway, my vote is for: *shrug* and not caring about silly diggs
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[09:31] <sivang> morning
[09:32] <mdz> Burgwork: it wasn't sent to -announce
[09:33] <tfheen> maswan: did we manage to run se.releases out of disk space?
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[09:35] <FireRabbit> hey the EdgyReleaseNotes page on the wiki still has the old artwork in the login screen shots, etc.... is anyone already working on this?
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[09:38] <Artemis3> pool is cool and all, but where are the torrents? torrents should always go first :P
[09:38] <tfheen> Artemis3: 6.10 isn't released yet.
[09:38] <Artemis3> ...
[09:39] <Artemis3> yes yes whatever
[09:39] <FireRabbit> someone jump the gun on ubuntu.com?
[09:39] <Artemis3> just want to help seeding
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[09:39] <tfheen> FireRabbit: there was some miscommuncation there, yes.
[09:39] <Fujitsu> tfheen: That's caused a lot of confusion in #ubuntu :S
[09:40] <tfheen> Fujitsu: yes. :-(
[09:40] <tfheen> we'll try to do better in six months
[09:40] <Fujitsu> Hopefully :)
[09:41] <Fujitsu> Having a default page for .pool would help things a lot.
[09:41] <infinity> Causing confusion in #ubuntu is, admittedly, not very hard.
[09:41] <FireRabbit> :)
[09:41] <Artemis3> it has a . so its "hidden" isn't?
[09:42] <Artemis3> i'd say torrents first :P
[09:42] <FireRabbit> if nobody else is working on the release notes wiki page i can update the screenshots.. but i dont want to overstep anyone
[09:42] <Fujitsu> infinity: Very true.
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[09:47] <dholbach> GOOD MORNING
[09:48] <Artemis3> hi
[09:48] <FireRabbit> hey
[09:51] <maswan> tfheen: not that I can see
[09:51] <maswan> tfheen: edubuntu/.pool/edubuntu-6.10-install-powerpc.iso
[09:51] <maswan> tfheen: (current file, still rsyncing)
[09:52] <tfheen> maswan: ok, so you're just not done yet.
[09:52] <tfheen> you tend to have a gillion gbit/sec so I was surprised.
[09:52] <maswan> tfheen: well, the backend store is a moderately fast nfs box
[09:53] <maswan> tfheen: that's why we have a mod_disk_cache[hacked]  setup to scale to a gillion Gbit/s
[09:53] <tfheen> maswan: ah.  :-)
[09:55] <maswan> tfheen: seems to be going at 2M/s now, but that changes a bit over 
[09:56] <tfheen> maswan: sounds good.  I'll go find some breakfast, then
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=== yacoob parses backlog
[10:21] <yacoob> cheer for hurry :)
=== Fujitsu applauds fabbione.
[10:23] <Fujitsu> Thankyou thankyou thankyou :D
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[10:24] <Artemis3> clap clap clap
[10:26] <yacoob> fap fap fap?
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[10:27] <ajmitch> evening all
[10:28] <Fujitsu> Hi ajmitch.
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[10:33] <seb128> what log file is used by the alternate installer?
[10:33] <jordi> hmm
[10:34] <mvo> seb128: wasn't that /var/log/installer/ ?
[10:34] <maswan> tfheen: done
[10:34] <jordi> is anyone else see firefox being closed when  you log into gmail?
[10:34] <tfheen> maswan: hooray! :-)
[10:34] <seb128> mvo: no such directory
[10:34] <seb128> neither to / nor /target
[10:35] <mvo> :/
[10:35] <seb128> some package fails to install with alternate install from edubuntu i386 DVD
[10:35] <dholbach> jordi: no, not here
[10:36] <seb128> I get the red screen with the error and can switch to the VT with the log, there is no enough scrollback to figure the issue though
[10:36] <jordi> dholbach: I have a box here where it's perfectly reproducible
[10:36] <dholbach> jordi: any funky plugins?
[10:36] <seb128> jordi: close, like "crash"?
[10:36] <dholbach> jordi: ubuntu edgy firefox 2.0?
[10:37] <jordi> brand new .mozilla/firefox
[10:37] <jordi> "The program 'Gecko' received a X Window System error."
[10:37] <infinity> seb128: syslog?
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[10:38] <dholbach> .xsession-errors?
[10:38] <jordi> The error was "BadMatch (invalid parametre attributes)"
[10:38] <jordi> yeah, that's in .xsession-errors
[10:38] <jordi> this was a dapper box just upgraded
[10:40] <seb128> infinity: that is a good reply
[10:40] <seb128> fuse-utils not being happy
[10:40] <infinity> Ugh.
[10:40] <infinity> edubuntu-server task...
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[10:48] <jordi> dholbach: wow this is weird
[10:48] <dholbach> jordi: hm?
[10:49] <seb128> ogra: 
[10:49] <seb128> Oct 26 08:01:21 in-target: Setting up fuse-utils (2.5.3-2.1ubuntu4) ...
[10:49] <seb128> Oct 26 08:01:21 in-target: creating fuse device...
[10:49] <seb128> Oct 26 08:01:22 in-target: creating fuse group...
[10:49] <seb128> Oct 26 08:01:22 in-target: Adding group `fuse' (115)...
[10:49] <seb128> Oct 26 08:01:22 in-target: Done.
[10:49] <seb128> Oct 26 08:01:22 in-target: FATAL: Could not load /lib/modules/2.6.17-10-386/modules.dep: No such file or directory
[10:49] <seb128> Oct 26 08:01:22 in-target: dpkg: error processing fuse-utils (--configure):
[10:49] <seb128> ogra: known?
[10:50] <jordi> dholbach: firefox crash
[10:51] <dholbach> jordi: did you try to get a backtrace or check the strace?
[10:54] <jordi> not yet
[10:54] <jordi> I was trying to see if this was happening elsewhere
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[10:57] <jordi> ** Message: plugin_get_value 1 (1)
[10:57] <jordi> I get a bunch of these
[10:57] <seb128> ogra: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/fuse/+bug/68344
[10:57] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 68344 in fuse "Error while loading modules.dep, break edubuntu install" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[11:00] <jordi> hrm, disabling javascript "solves" it
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[11:08] <jordi> epiphany doesn't crash
[11:08] <jordi> as soon as gtalk logins in gmail, it crashes firefox
[11:09] <seb128> use epiphany ;)
[11:09] <jordi> I do :)
[11:09] <jordi> my workmate doesn't
[11:09] <jordi> this will make him have an epiphany :)
[11:09] <tfheen> jordi: gmail works fine for me.
[11:09] <tfheen> (using ff, i386)
[11:11] <jordi> does it spew any message on the console?
[11:11] <dholbach> jordi: did you try an strace or a backtrace?
[11:11] <jordi> I tried attaching gdb to it
[11:12] <jordi> *** glibc detected *** gdb: double free or corruption (!prev): 0x09833200 ***
[11:12] <jordi> hrm
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[11:12] <jordi> stracing
[11:12] <dholbach> lloydinho: http://daniel.holba.ch/temp/PICT1459.JPG http://daniel.holba.ch/temp/PICT1464.JPG (instead of holiday pictures ;-))
[11:15] <lloydinho> dholbach: awesome. Now you can prove what a lousy anthropologist I am. :-)
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[11:15] <lloydinho> Threatening the locals and drinking their beer.
=== lloydinho hugs dholbach
[11:16] <lloydinho> :-)
[11:16] <dholbach> I thought otherwise... you were doing great ;-)
[11:16] <dholbach> not "going to bed early" like doko
[11:17] <jordi> dholbach: I can't get anything too sensical from this strace
[11:17] <lloydinho> heh. doko was being the sensible one, for sure.
[11:17] <doko> ?
[11:17] <dholbach> ... for once :)
[11:17] <jordi> http://pusa.uv.es/~jordi/ff.bz2
[11:19] <ogra> seb128, no, not known ...
[11:19] <ogra> weird
[11:20] <dholbach> jordi: and doing a backtrace and breaking on gdk_x_error?
[11:22] <seb128> brb
[11:23] <dholbach> jordi: I can't make heads or tails of it, sorry
[11:24] <cjwatson> I wonder if that edubuntu fuse thing is specific to the DVD somehow
[11:24] <cjwatson> can't immediately think how but I suppose it's possible
[11:24] <ogra> well, fuse-utils is installed in the same way in the CD installer
[11:24] <infinity> cjwatson: I assume it applies to any installation that installs edubuntu-server in the initial package selection.
[11:25] <jordi> dholbach: I still don't get anything :|
[11:25] <cjwatson> depmod should be run at the end of base-installer
[11:25] <infinity> cjwatson: (And may get fuse-utils installed before linux-image)
[11:25] <cjwatson> infinity: I really, really doubt that's happening here
[11:25] <infinity> Oh, hrm.  So this Should Not Be(TM)?
[11:25] <cjwatson> indeed ...
[11:25] <cjwatson> I need the full syslog
[11:25] <cjwatson> "in-target" also does rather imply that it's after base-installer
[11:26] <ogra> it is
[11:26] <cjwatson> I doubt base-installer uses in-target - it assumes too much infrastructure
[11:26] <ogra> edubuntu-server gets installed after -desktop
[11:26] <ogra> its the very last thing that gets installed usually
[11:26] <cjwatson> surely at the same time
[11:26] <cjwatson> as in, in the same tasksel run
[11:27] <ogra> yep
[11:28] <infinity> So, the kernel's installed at this point, and even if it didn't do a depomod for some sick reason, LRM and initramfs-tools both would have "tried harder" to get a modules.dep in place too.
[11:28] <infinity> Oh, wait.
[11:28] <infinity> cjwatson: Does that CD pick a target kernel that differs from the install kernel?
[11:29] <infinity> (I assume yes, since the DVDs get all the kernels, and do hw-based selectoin)
[11:29] <ogra> doesnt seem like
[11:29] <infinity> THAT's why the modprobe is wrong.
[11:29] <ogra> /lib/modules/2.6.17-10-386/modules.dep
[11:29] <infinity> Cause it'll modprobe for the running kernel, and we don't have modules for that.
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[11:29] <ogra> thats the same one the install CD installs
[11:29] <infinity> ogra: Yeah, exactly.  The DVD boots with -386, but the chroot has -generic installed.
[11:29] <infinity> (Guessing)
[11:29] <ogra> argh
[11:29] <ogra> thats tricky ...
[11:30] <infinity> cjwatson: Is my guess on for this one?
[11:30] <infinity> (that would break on ppc/ppc64 too)
[11:30] <infinity> Oh, wait, no, it wouldn't.,
[11:30] <ogra> i'll try soon, my rsync just finished the DVD
[11:30] <infinity> Cause those pick the kernel at boot time.
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[11:32] <infinity> seb128: Do you have the full syslog from that DVD failure?
[11:33] <seb128> infinity: yep
[11:33] <infinity> seb128: Post it please? :)
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[11:33] <seb128> infinity: chinstrap, my userdir
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[11:34] <infinity> Oct 26 07:37:39 base-installer: info: Using kernel 'linux-image-generic'
[11:34] <infinity> Bingo.  I win.
[11:34] <tfheen> can we work around this using preseeding?  (Force it to install both kernels)?  If so, we can roll new edubuntu DVDs and test those and then release those tomorrow
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[11:36] <infinity> Ugly solution, but I guess it could work.
[11:36] <infinity> Or is there a preseed to just turn off base-installer's automatic kernel selection instead?
[11:36] <ogra> i'm fine with that, as long as we have an edubuntu DVD
[11:36] <tfheen> I didn't say it was pretty. :-)
[11:36] <infinity> That might be less ugly.
[11:36] <ogra> loosing i386 would be very odd 
[11:37] <cjwatson> infinity: ah yes, the DVD might well do that
[11:38] <cjwatson> we can preseed it
[11:38] <cjwatson> um, give me a minute ...
[11:38] <cjwatson> we can't force it to install both kernels, but we can force it to install just -386
[11:39] <infinity> That seems the best solution right now.
[11:42] <ogra> it installs -386
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[11:42] <ogra> we need to install just -generic if the DVD boots with it, or am i wrong
[11:43] <infinity> Other way around.
[11:43] <infinity> The DVD boots -386, it auto-selects -generic as the better kernel and installs that.
[11:43] <ogra> doesnt the DVD boot the -generic ?
[11:43] <ogra> ah
[11:43] <cjwatson> what infinity said
[11:43] <ogra> right
[11:43] <ogra> my bad
[11:43] <cjwatson> the problem is that -386 ISN'T there
[11:43] <ogra> argh
[11:44] <cjwatson> I mean, isn't installed
[11:44] <cjwatson> technically, this preseeding change affects all edubuntu images
[11:44] <cjwatson> (i386)
[11:45] <cjwatson> actually, yeah, that's a point, how does this not affect the normal CDs?
[11:45] <cjwatson> edgy-alternate-i386.list:/pool/main/l/linux-source-2.6.17/linux-image-2.6.17-10-386_2.6.17-10.33_i386.deb
[11:45] <cjwatson> edgy-alternate-i386.list:/pool/main/l/linux-source-2.6.17/linux-image-2.6.17-10-generic_2.6.17-10.33_i386.deb
[11:45] <cjwatson> base-installer should pick -generic there too
[11:45] <infinity> The normal CDs don't have -generic in ship?
[11:45] <infinity> Oh, they do?
[11:45] <cjwatson> tfheen: HOLD
[11:45] <infinity> Then it should affect both, yeah.
[11:46] <fabbione> the normal CD probably don't install fuse by default?
[11:46] <cjwatson> it should
[11:46] <cjwatson> in the edubuntu-server install
[11:46] <tfheen> cjwatson: holding.
[11:46] <ogra> right, it does
[11:47] <infinity> cjwatson: That's the ubuntu-alternate list, no?  I don't see -generic in edubuntu-install.
[11:47] <cjwatson> oh, you're right
[11:47] <cjwatson> ok, phew, false alarm
[11:48] <cjwatson> right, so technically this preseeding fix affects all Edubuntu images, but it'll be a no-op for CDs, so we won't rebuild
[11:48] <ogra> right
[11:48] <tfheen> since dvds go to releases.ubuntu.com, I was planning on holding them off for a few hours anyway.
[11:48] <mdz> cjwatson: so the issue is limited to the edubuntu DVD, yes?
[11:48] <tfheen> s/go/don't go/
[11:48] <cjwatson> tfheen: they go to cdimage
[11:49] <cjwatson> mdz: yes, only i386
[11:49] <mdz> we can pull it
[11:49] <cjwatson> I've already rolled out the debian-cd fix
[11:49] <cjwatson> it can trivially be rebuilt with no archive changes
[11:49] <cjwatson> s/fix/workaround/
[11:49] <tfheen> cjwatson: please don't do that yet.
[11:49] <cjwatson> yeah, I'm not going to until you're finished with releases.u.c
[11:49] <tfheen> good, thanks.
=== GmanAFK is now known as Gman
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-devel:tfheen] : Ubuntu Development (not support, even with edgy) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs |  Edgy is released.
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[12:04] <ajmitch> tfheen: well done
[12:04] <crimsun> 'grats, all.
[12:04] <tfheen> congrats everybody
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-devel:cjwatson] : Ubuntu Development (not support, even with edgy ... or feisty) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Edgy is released.
[12:04] <StevenK> tfheen: Nice!
[12:05] <ajmitch> good work everyone :)
[12:05] <cjwatson> tfheen: can I rebuild the edubuntu i386 DVD now?
[12:05] <elkbuntu> nice work everyone :)
=== StevenK looks for the annoucement.
[12:05] <tfheen> cjwatson: yeah, should be fine.
[12:05] <StevenK> tfheen: So now you're off to sleep for 3 days? :-)
[12:06] <ivoks> congrats
[12:06] <tfheen> StevenK: we still have xubuntu, ports and DVDs to do.  But _then_.
[12:06] <ogra> yippie !
[12:06] <StevenK> tfheen: Heh
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[12:09] <cjwatson> $ bzr push --create-prefix sftp://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.feisty
[12:09] <StevenK> Neat.
=== sivang opens a bottle of champage
=== ajmitch fetches
=== StevenK creates Edgy ISOs to take to the office tomorrow.
[12:12] <yacoob> allright, where do I suck up to? :)
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[12:14] <tfheen> cjwatson: AIUI, you don't need create-prefix any longer.
[12:15] <cjwatson> habit :)
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[12:16] <seaLne> should torrents work? they aren't listed on http://torrent.ubuntu.com:6969/ and get rejected
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[12:16] <dholbach> sfllaw: I think you can stop testing the CDs now - we just released
[12:17] <thom> well, there's the benchmark - http://www.j5live.com/?p=266
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[12:18] <sfllaw> dholbach: Yay!
=== sfllaw hugs dholbach.
[12:19] <sfllaw> But not really, because I am hacking up a lung.
[12:19] <sfllaw> And I would hate to give dholbach the plague.
[12:19] <dholbach> oh no! not the plague again!
[12:19] <ajmitch> what a way to celebrate the release
[12:19] <ajmitch> sfllaw: I hope you get some rest :)
[12:20] <cjwatson> ogra: updated Edubuntu i386 DVD available
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[12:20] <cjwatson> seb128: would you mind retesting edubuntu/dvd/i386/server ?
[12:21] <ogra> ok, it will take me some time to rsync
[12:21] <cjwatson> 20061026
[12:21] <Ng> congrats on the release :)
[12:21] <Artemis3> congrats
[12:21] <imbrandon> cen someone fix the BT tracker please "rejected by tracker - Requested download is not authorized for use with this tracker."
[12:21] <cjwatson> Artemis3: btw, we deliberately don't put torrents up until we're done, because at any point up to the last moment we might have to stop and respin for some showstopper
[12:22] <seb128> cjwatson: not at all, will take some time to rsync, burn a new DVD and redo an install though, I'm starting on it now and will have lunch while it's working
[12:22] <cjwatson> Artemis3: .pool is just there so that third-party mirrors can be there in advance of the general public; if we have to respin, it typically does not take long for them to rsync updates
[12:22] <Artemis3> cjwatson, i understand that, what i mean is to distribute bittorrent only first, and then, couple of hours, or a day layer the rest
[12:22] <cjwatson> Artemis3: I don't see us doing that, no
[12:23] <cjwatson> thanks for the suggestion but it has been made before and we've decided against it
[12:23] <Artemis3> ok just wondered about it no problem
[12:23] <imbrandon> cjwatson, are we "official" now ?
[12:24] <cjwatson> imbrandon: yes
[12:24] <imbrandon> kk thanks
=== bhale hugs tfheen 
[12:24] <imbrandon> the BT will be updated soonish? ( i like to seed for people )
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[12:25] <imbrandon> great work fellas btw , everyone ( too long of list to go though )
[12:25] <cjwatson> imbrandon: it should be, but IIRC torrent.ubuntu.com is having load problems
[12:25] <Artemis3> dht is working tho
[12:25] <imbrandon> cjwatson, ok no worries, rsycing now anyhow still
[12:25] <Artemis3> get the torrents :)
[12:25] <cjwatson> dht?
[12:25] <seaLne> torrents are fine now
[12:25] <imbrandon> dist host tracking
[12:25] <cjwatson> ah, good
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[12:26] <cjwatson> I'm not convinced, torrent.ubuntu.com:6969 lists lots of ancient images that were deleted long ago
[12:26] <cjwatson> elmo: ?
[12:26] <cjwatson> oh, well, maybe not ancient, but definitely gone
[12:26] <imbrandon> yup working now
[12:27] <imbrandon> seeding *-desktop.iso's
[12:28] <yacoob> hm
[12:28] <yacoob> how come there are >1 images of same type?
[12:28] <yacoob> (namely, dapper-alternate-i386)
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[12:28] <cjwatson> yacoob: old daily builds
[12:29] <cjwatson> I'll purge those
[12:29] <tfheen> imbrandon: torrent.u.c is getting there now.
[12:29] <imbrandon> tfheen, yup yup, got my seeds on two networks running now
[12:29] <imbrandon> thanks
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[12:31] <cge> tfheen: It is working, or it is going to be working soon?
[12:31] <tfheen> cge: it's working for some of the images, but not all
[12:32] <cge> tfheen: ah
[12:35] <elmo> cjwatson: looking
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[12:43] <ubuntu_demon> My congratiolations to you all! 
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[12:46] <mdz> thanks
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[12:47] <highvoltage> good job, Ubuntu team, and congratulations!
[12:48] <highvoltage> especially on the innovative stuff like upstart.
[12:48] <highvoltage> inovation++ :)
=== sivang awaits anxiously for feisty to open to upload stuff ;)
[12:48] <ajmitch> sivang: patience..
[12:48] <StevenK> sivang: Give them a few days to get over releasing Edgy first. :-)
[12:49] <shackan> does anybody know what happened to chmj ?
[12:49] <sivang> true, I said I was anxious , nothing more :)
[12:49] <sivang> I believe a week could go between rlease and reopneing
[12:49] <ubuntu_demon> bye guys
[12:50] <cjwatson> shackan: he's working for impi linux now
[12:51] <shackan> cjwatson, thanks
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[12:53] <pirast> congratulations everyone to the release of ubuntu 6.10 :-)
[12:55] <tfheen> maswan: we're not maxing out your 2gbit? :-(
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[12:57] <yacoob> upstart makes me wonder
[12:57] <yacoob> that's pretty brave, isn't it?
[12:57] <Spads> edgy, even.
[12:58] <highvoltage> *very* :)
[12:58] <Robot101> yacoob: it's in a compatibility mode, mostly it just behaves like init :)
[12:58] <Keybuk> well, it always behaves "like init" :)
[12:59] <yacoob> Robot101, aw, so I won't stumble around looking for my /etc/init.d? :)
[12:59] <Keybuk> it will always run init scripts in /etc/init.d and /etc/rcX.d because that's the easiest way to maintain backwards compatibility
[12:59] <Keybuk> and it's also the most sane way to develop it
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[12:59] <Keybuk> otherwise I'd need to work solidly and convert every single package on the same day
[12:59] <Keybuk> with the compat stuff, I can do them one at a time
[01:00] <Nafallo> tfheen: time is only 13, schools stop at 15 or so, don't they? :-)
[01:00] <highvoltage> Keybuk: it is awesome though. an init replacement is long overdue. props to you for making Ubuntu such a trailblazer :)
[01:01] <mnepton> Upstart is a fanatstic idea. i just don;t know if i really trust the people behind it, though.
[01:01] <Keybuk> mnepton: ?
[01:01] <mnepton> (mostly because Keybuk won't buy me candy)
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[01:01] <Keybuk> I haven't said I won't buy you candy :)
[01:02] <Nafallo> hehe
[01:02] <Keybuk> I also haven't said I won't throw you in SF Bay :p
[01:02] <tfheen> Nafallo: and the US is still mostly asleep.
[01:02] <mnepton> Upstart is a fanatstic idea. and the team behind it is comprised of the exact people i would choose.
[01:02] <yacoob> highvoltage, as long as trailblazer don't turn into shooting star... :>
[01:02] <Keybuk> yacoob: but they'
[01:02] <Keybuk> er so pretty ...
[01:02] <Nafallo> tfheen: yea. but are they using the se. one?
[01:02] <Keybuk> (gnargh, WHO PUT US KEYBOARDS ON THESE PIECES OF CRAP?!)
[01:03] <yacoob> well, as for me it's only a "whoa, interesting change"
[01:03] <Nafallo> Keybuk: the vendors!?
[01:03] <Nafallo> :-)
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[01:03] <yacoob> I'm fine with standard init schema
[01:04] <mark> Won't mirror without dists/edgy-updates/main/debian-installer/binary-amd64/Packages.gz signature in Release at /usr/bin/debmirror line 1300.
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[01:07] <elmo> t.u.c should be happier (or getting that way) now
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[01:12] <Gloubiboulga> tfheen, is there anything we (Jani or I) need to do for the xubuntu release?
[01:13] <tfheen> Gloubiboulga: tell me if you don't want to release.  I was planning on doing xubuntu right after the ubuntu and kubuntu dvds were published
[01:13] <tfheen> (which is happening now)
[01:13] <Gloubiboulga> tfheen, I'm happy with a release, but I'm going to mail Jani to have his agreement
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[01:17] <_lemsx1_> I want to congratulate you guys for the new release!
[01:18] <tfheen> thanks. :-)
[01:19] <_lemsx1_> way to go. seriously. I've been evangelizing (switching people to Linux) a lot more than ever ;-)
[01:20] <_lemsx1_> my goal for 2007 is to convince my boss to trial Linux on the desktop at work ;-)
[01:20] <TheMuso> On behalf of the a11y team, I'd like to thank all the devs for supporting us to get a lot of accessibility related features into Edgy. I believe this is the most accessible release of any Linux distro to date, and things can only get better from here. Thanks for your help and support guys. Much appreciated.
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[01:21] <tfheen> TheMuso: feisty'll be even better.
[01:21] <tfheen> TheMuso: you coming to UMV?
[01:22] <TheMuso> Unfortunately not.
=== dholbach hugs TheMuso
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[01:24] <heno> For feisty we'll aim for Just Works braille support do deafblind people can do an independent install as well
[01:24] <heno> That will definitely be a first :)
[01:24] <TheMuso> heno: Just works braille won't be nearly as easy as one might think, as there are a lot of serial Braille displays around.
[01:24] <TheMuso> Mine is one of them.
[01:25] <StevenK> There's like what, ten different protocols?
[01:25] <tfheen> since standardisation is for wimps
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=== StevenK is trying to remember the emacspeak config question.
[01:25] <_lemsx1_> umm... the shipit requests will be Edgy or Dapper? there is no way to choose
[01:25] <heno> TheMuso: Right, but Dave and I have a plan (Dave being the brltty maintainer)
[01:26] <TheMuso> Oh nice.
[01:26] <ogra> _lemsx1_, dapper only
[01:26] <heno> TheMuso: I'll forward you some emails
[01:26] <TheMuso> The hardest bit I think will be auto-detection.
[01:26] <TheMuso> heno: Cool. I'd be very interested to have a look.
[01:26] <_lemsx1_> ogra: thanks. good to know
[01:26] <heno> Will have to use a very simple config system when that fails
[01:26] <TheMuso> Yeah.
[01:26] <_lemsx1_> ogra: will Edgy be shipped?
[01:26] <heno> TheMuso: will forward now
[01:27] <TheMuso> Thanks.
[01:27] <gnomefreak> lemsx1: only for loco teams that were approved
[01:27] <heno> it's party in the wiki too
[01:27] <gnomefreak> _lemsx1_: please keep general edgy topics/ support in #ubuntu this is a development channel
[01:27] <TheMuso> So what voip solution is being used for the next UDS? Has that been finalized yet?
[01:28] <tfheen> TheMuso: SIP, I think.
[01:28] <TheMuso> Oo nice.
[01:28] <tfheen> and conference phones, or something.
[01:28] <maswan> tfheen: sure you are
[01:28] <tfheen> I wonder how that'll work out in practice
[01:28] <TheMuso> Yeah.
[01:28] <ogra> tfheen, surely better than paris
=== StevenK might have to make an effort to attend some sessions.
[01:28] <tfheen> maswan: now we are, yeah.  We were just dibbling around 1.5Gbit for a while.
[01:28] <TheMuso> How many hours behind UTC is the UDS location?
[01:29] <StevenK> -5, from memory
[01:29] <TheMuso> StevenK: Thanks.
[01:29] <maswan> tfheen: ah, boring :)
[01:29] <Spads> No
[01:29] <gnomefreak> i hop emore than that
[01:29] <TheMuso> Looks like I'll have to do all-nighters.
[01:29] <Spads> -8
[01:29] <Spads> West Coast
[01:29] <gnomefreak> im -4
[01:29] <StevenK> Oh right.
[01:29] <Nafallo> maswan: you have like 2.5Gbit, or?
[01:29] <Spads> PST8PDT
[01:29] <TheMuso> Become a night owl for a week.
[01:29] <gnomefreak> they are -7 or -8
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[01:29] <maswan> Nafallo: the uni has 2.5, ACC has 2
[01:30] <Spads> -7 now, -8 during UDS
[01:30] <StevenK> TheMuso: Heh, if I do that, my manager won't like it very much. :-P
[01:30] <gnomefreak> thats sounds right
[01:30] <TheMuso> StevenK: My sympathies.
[01:30] <Nafallo> maswan: then we need to push 100Mbit more then ;-)
[01:30] <TheMuso> Added to that, I think we'll be +11.
[01:30] <ogra> cjwatson, rinning the edubuntu DVD install in qemu here, base install just picked -386 ... seems to be fine 
[01:30] <_lemsx1_> gnomefreak: yes, I know that. I just figured you guys would know better about that topic. Is development going on today? I thought you were celebrating or something :-)
[01:30] <TheMuso> Wow. Gets confusing quickly.
[01:30] <ogra> *running
[01:30] <StevenK> TheMuso: It so doesn't, they'll be 19 hours behind us.
[01:30] <gnomefreak> _lemsx1_: with releases every 6 months there is no time to celebrate ;)
[01:31] <tfheen> thom: regarding matching fedora -- we've torrented out about 2.5k images already.  A bit more than an hour into the release. :-)
[01:31] <lotusleaf> Thank you to all the developers for another beautiful release.
[01:31] <TheMuso> StevenK: I just worked that out.
[01:31] <_lemsx1_> gnomefreak: lol. I know. well, keep up the good work
[01:31] <TheMuso> Um ok.
[01:31] <siretart> congrats for the release!
[01:31] <TheMuso> Thats not too bad.
[01:32] <TheMuso> Start at approx 4 in the morning.
[01:32] <TheMuso> I can do that.
[01:32] <StevenK> It probably means most of the sessions will be going on while I'm working.
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[01:35] <leonel> THANK YOU ALL for edgy ..  GOOD WORK  EXELENT WORK  thank  you all  again 
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[01:39] <thom> tfheen: yah :-)
[01:41] <TheMuso> heno: Thanks.
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[01:48] <tfheen> Gloubiboulga: gotten a response from janimo yet?
[01:48] <Gloubiboulga> tfheen, no :/
[01:49] <tfheen> Gloubiboulga: ok, I can just hold off for a while, then
[01:49] <Gloubiboulga> he was fine with the 20061023 isos, so I guess he'll be fine with the new ones
[01:49] <tfheen> ogra: you're making sure the edubuntu dvd gets testing?
[01:49] <ogra> tfheen, its running
[01:50] <ogra> diung a qemu install and already saw -386 passing by
[01:50] <ogra> so it looks good, but i want it to finish first 
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[01:50] <tfheen> I hope you're planning on testing the live bits, etc too?
[01:50] <lritter> can someone perhaps have a look at this one
[01:50] <lritter> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.17/+bug/63418
[01:50] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 63418 in linux-source-2.6.17 "CPU soft lockup during bootup" [Medium,Confirmed]  
[01:51] <ogra> tfheen, sure, but there was nothing that could have affected them 
[01:51] <ogra> so i dont expect regressions
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[02:01] <doko> cjwatson: kubuntu-meta was accepted for edgy?
[02:02] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: sure, we're ready :)
[02:02] <janimo> tfheen: xubuntu latest images good to go
[02:02] <Riddell> doko: where?
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[02:03] <doko> Riddell, cjwatson: bug 66923
[02:03] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 66923 in kubuntu-meta "kubuntu-desktop doesn't depend on openoffice.org-kde" [High,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/66923
[02:03] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, ok :)
[02:03] <Riddell> doko: yes, that got in
[02:03] <doko> Riddell: but not on the CD?
[02:04] <Riddell> doko: was when I tested, kubuntu-desktop on my amd64 depends on openoffice.org-kde
[02:04] <sladen> ogra: do you have release notes/fodder about what's in Edubuntu 6.10 ?
[02:04] <ogra> sladen, yup
[02:05] <sladen> ogra: I couldn't see it anywhere obvious on the Edubuntu site (eg. Frontpage, download links)
[02:05] <ogra> but we're still fiddling with the website and i still test the last change to the DVD
[02:05] <ogra> http://www.edubuntu.org/Download
[02:05] <cjwatson> doko: yes
[02:06] <sladen> ogra: I was thinking more http://kubuntu.org/announcements/6.10-release.php or http://www.ubuntu.com/news/610released
[02:06] <ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdgyAnnouncementEdubuntu
[02:07] <mark> it seems like the Release files under dists/edgy-{updates,security,backports} are not up to date
[02:07] <ogra> RichEd will send it out as soon as we have sorted our stuff
[02:07] <tfheen> janimo: yay, good.
[02:09] <cjwatson> mark: I think those will be sorted out next time the publisher runs, but we have a few other things to do first
[02:10] <mark> I can imagine :)
[02:10] <mark> congratulations with the release, btw
[02:10] <cjwatson> thanks
[02:11] <cjwatson> I'll check out the Release files once we're back in somewhat normal operation
[02:11] <mark> thanks, that'll make my mirror work again
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=== simira celebrates the release with some marcipan cake
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[02:17] <Nafallo> ooh
=== Nafallo joins simira on that one :-)
[02:18] <bhale> EdgyReleaseNotes still mentions Beta several times
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[02:21] <janimo> Riddell, ogra, you both have separate announcements and send them to ubuntu-announce as well I assume?
[02:21] <ogra> janimo, yep
[02:21] <Riddell> janimo: yes
[02:21] <janimo> thanks
[02:21] <ogra> i think Riddell sent his already
=== janimo wonders whether all the LTSP 5 thing should be mentioned wrt the xubuntu alternate CD as well
[02:22] <Riddell> I did, I should poke mdz to check and let it through
[02:22] <Riddell> mdz: polite poke
[02:23] <ogra> janimo, as you like 
=== hunger is waiting for feisty now:-)
[02:23] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: can you think of anything new I missed from the RC annoucnement that should be mentioned?
[02:23] <hunger> Congratulations on getting edgy out!
[02:23] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: gnome-app-install and new panel applets is what I can think of now
[02:24] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, I need to read it again 
[02:25] <janimo> ogra: yes, I am reluctant since I haven;t tried LTSP out and had no feedback so I could not claim all those LTSP-5 features working
[02:25] <janimo> as I am not sure they are all server side or you tweaked gnome and other system bits to have it all working
[02:25] <janimo> I'll settle for juste mentioning LTSP as for dapper
[02:26] <ogra> did you solve the "users can shutdown the server in xfce" bug ?
[02:26] <janimo> ogra: partly. The user can solve it by editing xfce kiosk settings file.
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[02:26] <ogra> ah, great
[02:26] <janimo> ogra: for dapper even that did not work
[02:26] <ogra> is that documented anywhere ?
[02:26] <janimo> ogra: I'm afraid not, I guess we'll have to add it to the newly launched website :)
[02:26] <ogra> we have requests about that bug from time to time ...
[02:27] <janimo> ogra: indeed the bug is in LP and is open AFAIK
[02:27] <ogra> right
[02:27] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, I can't think of anything else...
[02:28] <janimo> ogra: there was no LTSP/xfce testing I know of during edgy, at least I got no feedback so I wouldn;t be surprised if bus started showiung up starting today :)
[02:28] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: I'll mention the new site as well
[02:28] <janimo> s/bus/bugs/
[02:28] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, good idea
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[02:28] <ogra> janimo, ok, i'll prepare for a bugflood then :)
[02:29] <janimo> ogra: :)
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[02:33] <highvoltage> janimo: sorry, I did test an early RC of the xubuntu alternate cd with ltsp and it did work (meant to provide it sooner, I know it's way too late now)
[02:33] <ogra> yay, fuse-utils installed fine this time ... cjwatson sees it worked .... 
[02:33] <ogra> *seems
[02:33] <highvoltage> janimo: for what it's worth, in the new LTSP there's a script where you can test LTSP using qemu as a thin client, that will make it easier for you to test it in the future
[02:33] <highvoltage> ogra: \o/
[02:36] <cjwatson> ogra: great
[02:36] <cjwatson> tfheen: wanna publish edubuntu DVDs, then?
[02:36] <cjwatson> oh, aren't xubuntu DVDs going to have the same problem?
[02:36] <tfheen> there are no xubuntu DVDs
[02:36] <tfheen> so no.
[02:36] <cjwatson> that works :)
[02:37] <mvo> janimo: have you any idea about bug #68027 ?
[02:37] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 68027 in update-manager "sudo update-manager -c -d crashes during xubuntu upgrade" [High,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/68027
[02:38] <tfheen> cjwatson: care to archive the xubuntu beta release too?
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[02:38] <mvo> janimo: or, for that matter. have you seen it during a normal upgrade?
[02:38] <cjwatson> tfheen: done, not synced
[02:39] <tfheen> cjwatson: I just started a sync, I can do another one in ten minutes or
[02:39] <tfheen> +so
[02:39] <tfheen> ogra: tell me when you want your DVDs published
[02:42] <seb128> I've an edubuntu alternate install from DVD running atm
[02:42] <seb128> should be fine to confirm if the bug is fixed soon
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[02:52] <janimo> mvo: I have only done clean installs of edgy recently so did not encounter the bug
[02:53] <janimo> as I commented there I have no idea why it happens
=== janimo looks again at LP
[02:54] <janimo> highvoltage: so xubuntu LTSP works ok?
[02:54] <mvo> janimo: I really wonder why it happens on xubuntu but not on ubuntu (even if I install there with a  clearlooks theme)
[02:54] <janimo> mvo: wird, I thought at first that it had to do with the alternate depends in xubuntu-meta. Now I have no idea
[02:54] <highvoltage> janimo: it worked ok with the first xubuntu alternate beta. I do regret that I didn't have time to test with any newer iso's
[02:54] <janimo> mvo as those changes slightly since dapper
[02:55] <janimo> highvoltage: well let's hope it did not break in the meantime :)
[02:55] <highvoltage> janimo: for sure :)
[02:55] <highvoltage> I can't think of a reason that it would break.
[02:55] <mvo> janimo: i reproduce it here in a upgrade test and this error (from gtk) took down the complette desktop, only the background was visible, everything else gone with gdk errrors. pretty scary :/
[02:56] <janimo> releasing xubuntu is half faith, half Q&A
[02:57] <tfheen> janimo: xubuntu images should be published now.  Please check torrents, etc
=== tfheen goes to have a break
[02:57] <janimo> mvo: could be a gtk bug that is so evil that is only triggred on xubunt?
[02:57] <janimo> tfheen: thanks
[02:58] <mvo> janimo: it must be something like this. might be a ordering issue. if e.g. clearlooks is upgraded before gtk and the gtkrc is reread then this might trigger it. but I have no idea why a) gtkrc is re-read b) gtk does not ignore that problem
[02:58] <Fujitsu> tfheen: You deserve one!
[02:59] <mvo> janimo: I'm sorry, I only reproduce it yesterday so I didn't managed to figure out what exactly went wrong :/
[03:01] <mvo> janimo: /usr/share/themes/Clearlooks/gtk-2.0/gtkrc:59: error: unexpected identifier `animation', expected character `}' is what makes it crash, but I just checked, gtk itself is upgraded before this happens
[03:01] <janimo> mvo: well it's ok, we can just tell people to reinstall and not recomment dist-upgrade for now.
[03:02] <janimo> but  it is weird how come ubuntu escapes this
[03:02] <mvo> indeed
[03:05] <janimo> mvo, is there a way to recover from the crashed dist-upgrade?
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[03:05] <janimo> mvo: should I explicitely mention in the release note not to use dist-upgrade?
[03:06] <mvo> janimo: the usual dance: "dpkg --configure -a ; apt-get install -f ; apt-get dist-upgrade ; apt-get install xubuntu-desktop" 
[03:06] <mvo> janimo: when do you plan to send those out? will I have time to do another upgrade test "by-hand" (i.e. without the upgrader on a terminal)?
[03:06] <janimo> mvo, if you wish I can wait
[03:07] <janimo> mvo so is this something that can be solved now that the archive is frozen?
[03:07] <janimo> mvo, so there's no hurry 
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[03:08] <mvo> janimo: hard to say, but probably not :/ 
[03:09] <janimo> mvo either way I can hold off the announcement until you think we have some workaround or advice
[03:09] <janimo> or anything worth holding for :)
[03:10] <gnomefreak> mvo: update-manager is for buuntu/k/x/ed right?
[03:10] <gnomefreak> ubuntu/k/x/ed
[03:10] <janimo> mvo I assume it's the same error with apt-get dist-upgrade?
[03:11] <mvo> gnomefreak: in general yes, but we are currently investigating a issue with xubuntu - we may have to recommend not using it there
[03:11] <mvo> janimo: that is what I would like to figure out
[03:11] <gnomefreak> mvo: kubuntu is fine though
[03:11] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, the usual dist-upgrade is OK
[03:11] <Gloubiboulga> I tested it yesterday
[03:13] <janimo> is upgrade-manager doing something smarter than apt- dist-upgrade besides being better looking?
[03:14] <seb128> janimo: yep
[03:14] <seb128> janimo: the dist-upgrader mode you mean?
[03:14] <gnomefreak> janimo: it should grab missing -desktop packages downgrading libgl1-mesa-glx if user is running compiz/xgl/stuff
[03:14] <seb128> janimo: it's installing resolving conflicts, remove deprecated packages, install new packages on update, etc
[03:15] <gnomefreak> downgrade maybe wrong term
[03:15] <janimo> ok, I have only  used upgrades form one release to another once I think, so am not very familiar with what these tools do
[03:16] <ogra> tfheen, the edubuntu DVD iso is definately fixed now ... starting a live/ubiquity test to be safe now ...
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[03:18] <seb128> tfheen, ogra, cjwatson: edubuntu i386 alternate install worked fine for me too with the updated DVD
[03:18] <ogra> seb128, thanks for the test :)
[03:19] <seb128> np
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[03:28] <doko> pitti: are ve, ts, ss, ns/nso unsupported languages?
[03:29] <pitti> doko: we have langpacks for -ts
[03:29] <pitti> but none for the others
[03:30] <doko> pitti: are the locales available?
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[03:47] <gnomefreak> have the dvd images been released?
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[03:47] <_lemsx1_> gnomefreak: people are downloading the cdimages.ubuntu.com/dvd/current one
[03:47] <gnomefreak> ok ty
[03:47] <jsgmobile> Its at cdimage.u.c
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[03:51] <morgs> http://releases.ubuntu.com/6.10/MD5SUMS only lists md5s for -rc- images...!?!
[03:51] <gnomefreak> morgs: yes
[03:51] <pitti> doko: yes, locales are available
[03:52] <cjwatson> morgs: looks fine from here; reload
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[04:00] <vinze> Jani told me to talk to you
[04:01] <vinze> Because there's a problem with the Xubuntu torrents
[04:01] <janimo> vinze: hi
[04:01] <vinze> Hey
[04:01] <janimo> vinze: I think it's tfheen that we need to tell
[04:02] <vinze> Wasn't I talking to him? :S
[04:02] <janimo> vinze: you did not talk to anyone in particluar :)
[04:02] <infinity> What's the problem with the torrents?
[04:02] <vinze> I messages him with "hey" and then I though he said "ehy" :S
[04:02] <vinze> Anyway, you get an error message
[04:03] <vinze> Requested download is not authorized for use with this tracker. 
[04:04] <Nafallo> oh. that bug again...
[04:04] <vinze> Can it be solved?
[04:06] <Nafallo> I guess the admins are aware. they was last time.
[04:06] <Nafallo> Znarl, elmo ^ just in case
[04:06] <infinity> 08:05 < elmo> infinity: but in this case, it's not a tracker problem
[04:06] <infinity> 08:05 < elmo> there's no released xubuntu stuff in the torrent tree on lithium
[04:06] <infinity> tfheen: ^^^
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[04:07] <vinze> So what to tell in #xubuntu?
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[04:08] <Nafallo> vinze: that's in being worked on :-)
[04:08] <ogra> vinze, to wait ...
[04:08] <vinze> OK
[04:08] <vinze> Thanks
[04:08] <Nafallo> s/in/it/
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[04:10] <seb128> there is no distro team meeting today, right?
[04:11] <jdong> seb128: have you been able to reproduce the nautilus 100% CPU bug?
[04:11] <seb128> jdong: no
[04:11] <jdong> :(
[04:11] <jdong> man that sucker is annoying
[04:12] <zul> seb128: no according to the topic
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[04:12] <Nafallo> jdong: I have that from time to time.
[04:12] <jdong> seb128: have any of the posted backtraces been useful?
[04:12] <seb128> jdong: no
[04:13] <Nafallo> jdong: almost always when the totem-thumbnailer is running...
[04:13] <jdong> seb128: what would be needed to be more helpful?
[04:13] <jdong> Nafallo: I get it when doing a download, or encoding an AVI, and viewing that folder in nautilus
[04:14] <jdong> it doesn't happen immediately, but give it a bit of time and it'll spike CPU usage
[04:14] <jdong> hitting refresh really helps it along though
[04:14] <seb128> jdong: sending a patch
[04:14] <Nafallo> jdong: sounds about right.
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[04:14] <Nafallo> I have that on my amd64.
[04:14] <seb128> jdong: I've a backlog of around 380 desktop bugs atm, I don't have an afternoon to spend on that one, sorry
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[04:15] <jdong> seb128: ok...
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[04:18] <jdong> seb128: do you think Dapper's nautilus would build/work in Edgy? :D
[04:18] <bhale> jdong: it would rebuild alright
[04:18] <bhale> and run
[04:19] <jdong> that might be worth my time to do...
[04:19] <jdong> this bug is pretty crippling for me... have to spend my time worrying about telling nautilus to look away any time I do something
[04:19] <jdong> :)
[04:19] <seb128> jdong: I doubt that's a nautilus bug
[04:20] <jdong> hmm, you think it's gnome-vfs or something?
[04:20] <seb128> gnome-vfs2 inotify code yep
[04:20] <seb128> and downgrading gnome-vfs2 would not be a piece of cake
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[04:20] <seb128> really not
[04:20] <jdong> no it wouldn't
[04:21] <seb128> new gnome-vfs2 uses dbus etc
[04:21] <jdong> hmm, maybe I'll go check FC6
[04:21] <seb128> you have faster to reinstall dapper
[04:21] <jdong> see if they have the bug
[04:21] <seb128> why wouldn't they?
[04:21] <seb128> we don't patch gnome-vfs2 for that
[04:22] <jdong> seb128: they might've fixed it in their distro, but it hasn't reached upstream yet? 
[04:22] <seb128> I doubt of it
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[04:22] <seb128> I looked at FC patches before edgy for a bunch of tarballs
[04:22] <seb128> and gnome-vfs and nautilus were some of them
[04:23] <seb128> and I grab patches useful
[04:23] <seb128> I don't think there was anything for that issue
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[04:26] <tfheen> cjwatson: doesn't publish-release always put stuff in the torrent tree?
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[04:26] <cjwatson> tfheen: not if you're only pre-publishing
[04:26] <cjwatson> tfheen: but otherwise yes
[04:27] <tfheen> elmo: /srv/cdimage.ubuntu.com/www/torrent/xubuntu/releases/edgy/release seems pretty populated to me?
[04:27] <tfheen> elmo: do we just need a new sync-mirror?
[04:28] <infinity> seb128: How do you add arbitrary headers with Evolution?
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[04:29] <infinity> seb128: RichEd needs guidance, and I use Tbird, mutt, and mailx exclusively. :)
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[04:30] <seb128> infinity: I think you don't
[04:30] <infinity> seb128: Crazy talk.  And they call this an MUA?
[04:30] <seb128> to be honest I never had to add one I think ;)
[04:31] <seb128> upstream wishlist about that: Thanks for the bug report. This particular bug has already been reported into our bug tracking system, but please feel free to report any further bugs you find.
[04:31] <seb128> ups
[04:31] <seb128> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=201186
[04:31] <Ubugtu> Gnome bug 201186 in Mailer "ability to add custom headers in composer" [Enhancement,Reopened]  
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[04:32] <infinity> No activity for over a year.  Guess that answers that.
[04:36] <elmo> tfheen: it hadn't come through - forcing a sync now
[04:41] <sivang> hi
[04:42] <pirast> hi sivang
[04:42] <sivang> hi pirast 
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[04:48] <sivang> hmm, loco team channel logs are also on fabbione 's machine?
[04:48] <fabbione> sivang: no
[04:48] <fabbione> you need to ask smurf 
[04:49] <sivang> fabbione: okay, thanks, I actually need stuff removed from there
[04:50] <sivang> I've had some bad politically incorrect spammer over
[04:51] <cjwatson> sivang: I wouldn't stress, if it's the same guy who's been on lots of other Ubuntu channels, I'd advise just ignoring him
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[04:57] <sivang> cjwatson: do you recall nicks?
[04:58] <smurf> sivang: I can edit the logs if absolutely necessary, but ...
[05:01] <fabbione> smurf: my policy is not to edit them...
[05:01] <fabbione> smurf: otherwise it becomes a mess
[05:02] <ogra> sivang, Cyorxamp
[05:03] <keescook> howdy all
[05:03] <gnomefreak> he was taken care of if i understood correctly by staff :)
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[05:09] <ivoks> smurf: btw, locobot_3 has wrong URL under ircname
[05:10] <smurf> ivoks: thanks, will fix
[05:10] <ivoks> smurf: it misses 's' :)
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[05:13] <tfheen> elmo: thanks.
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[05:31] <agutierr> hello all. I have a question about preseed. Someone knows how I can preseed security host ?
[05:31] <cjwatson> apt-setup/security_host
[05:31] <zMott> what with all the new mono items 
[05:32] <zMott> is this part of the new frame work?
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[05:48] <Windkracht8> Hello, does anyone know when qt 4.2 will be available in the Ubuntu repository's?
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[05:53] <cjwatson> Windkracht8: it's already there - libqt4-core, libqt4-gui, libqt4-dev, etc.
[05:53] <cjwatson> edgy
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[05:55] <Windkracht8> cjwatson, but not for dapper
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[05:56] <cjwatson> Windkracht8: no
[05:56] <cjwatson> it won't ever be in dapper
[05:56] <Vaske_Car> does anybody know why I get dark background as soon as X start? Turned off PC yesterday normaly and today it does not start..
[05:56] <Windkracht8> I just looked at my mail, I
[05:57] <Windkracht8> 've got a new mail from ubuntu-announce, looks like I'm updating
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[06:00] <Windkracht8> Why aren't we getting free cd's for edgy?
[06:00] <blueyed> Is there a channel for the website? http://www.ubuntu.com/products/GetUbuntu/download?action=show&redirect=download does not work with Konqueror (the javascript click-open part).. :/
[06:02] <blueyed> ..probably because of the invalid HTML on that page..!
[06:02] <Windkracht8> 6 euro for a cd!
[06:03] <LarstiQ> tempting
[06:03] <cjwatson> CDs will be sent out to local community teams for local distribution, to save on shipping costs
[06:03] <Burgwork> mdz: is there a reason the EOL was not sent to -announce? previous ones were
=== Windkracht8 going to update
[06:04] <Windkracht8> bye all
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[06:08] <heno> fabbione, BenC: does the server kernel have the speakup module?
[06:08] <heno> we've had people wanting to install it that way
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[06:09] <BenC> heno: yeah, it does
[06:09] <heno> cool, thanks
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[06:12] <surak> seb128: ping
[06:12] <seb128> surak: pong
[06:14] <surak> seb128, I have a strange bug here. I have a postscript file, which doesn't show very well in both evince and gv. Logically I would suppose the bug is in ghostscript. However, gs-esp shows it fine.
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[06:14] <surak> this confuses me. Where should I post the bug? :)
[06:15] <seb128> evince and gv probably
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[06:15] <surak> gv opens up a warning, in blank, about ghostscript. evince says "loading" forever.
[06:15] <sladen> surak: can you file a bug and attach the file
[06:16] <sladen> surak: and CC me
[06:16] <surak> sladen: will do
[06:16] <LarstiQ> BenC: attached some info to bug 61743, hope it will be of use 
[06:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 61743 in linux-source-2.6.17 "invalid opcode on amd64" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/61743
[06:21] <surak> Let's see if launchpad can handle the file. I didn't gzipped it, it's about 77mb - duh
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[06:25] <seb128> surak: better to gzip it then
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[06:42] <bddebian> Howdy
[06:43] <surak> hi
[06:51] <mdz> Burgwork: yes, it was decided that it was not relevant to enough of the folks on that list
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[06:51] <keescook> I need a bigger desk
[06:51] <mdz> Riddell: didn't get your earlier poke; you'll need to tell me what it was about
[06:52] <pitti> keescook: too many bags with sweets, candy, and bubble gum? :)
[06:52] <Riddell> mdz: just the kubuntu ubuntu-announce post
[06:52] <keescook> pitti: hah.  no, the trick-or-treat candy is safely hidden in the kitchen.
[06:52] <surak> sladen: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/evince/+bug/68412
[06:52] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 68412 in evince "Evince doesn't show a .PS file correctly." [Medium,Needs info]  
[06:53] <Burgwork> mdz: hmm, ok. I would consider EOL to be a fairly major announcement
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[06:54] <keescook> it's so nice to use edgy on my i386 laptop.  everything works.  :)
[06:57] <jdong> keescook: obviously you need to put beryl or something on it then :D
[06:58] <keescook> jdong: heh.  I did earlier; it got reinstalled a few times over the last few days, though.  :)
[06:58] <jdong> hehe
[06:58] <jdong> I gotta admit, it's fun
[06:58] <jdong> and beryl's making it a lot easier than compiz from before...
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[06:59] <keescook> jdong: that's for sure!
[06:59] <sladen> surak: remember to bzip2/gzip the file next time :)
=== sladen downloads it at 100Mb, compresses, downloads at 4Mb
[07:00] <mdz> Burgwork: how many ubuntu-announce subscribers are still running hoary?
[07:00] <Burgwork> jdong: I am deeply concerned about the beryl fork
[07:01] <Burgwork> mdz: probably not many, but it is an announcement, one that needs to be widely shared
[07:01] <jdong> Burgwork: I don't know nearly enough about the circumstances of the fork...
[07:01] <surak> sladen: I already pressed the "send" button before verifying its size. Then I got afraid of cancelling and doing something bad in launchpad. And I was curious if LP could handle it :)
[07:01] <jdong> so I can't really make an informed opinion about it
[07:01] <Burgwork> jdong: my issue is more that if we choose beryl, we are diverging from what everybody else is doing, for no clear gain
[07:02] <jdong> Burgwork: the beryl-manager is one  good reason
[07:02] <jdong> and its effects are definitely better to me
[07:02] <Burgwork> WMs must be rock solid
[07:02] <jsgotangco> its already a fork, so its not everybody now, there are sombody doing another thing
[07:02] <jdong> Burgwork: beryl-manager hasn't crashed on me yet... I've only crashed it once by sending a kill to it
[07:02] <jsgotangco> s/are/is
[07:02] <Burgwork> jsgotangco: it existing and us shipping it are two different things
[07:02] <jdong> to test beryl's fallback
[07:03] <jdong> and beryl falls back to metacity very well
[07:03] <Burgwork> then we maintain two WMs
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[07:03] <Burgwork> which truly sucks
[07:03] <jdong> Burgwork: no matter what there will be a group of people interested in maintaining beryl....
[07:04] <jdong> I'm sure the same can be said about compiz
[07:04] <jdong> anyway
=== jdong is off for a few hours....
[07:05] <Burgwork> jdong: something existing and us shipping it are two different things
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[07:05] <Burgwork> there is lots of stuff in universe we don't much care about
[07:05] <jdong> Burgwork: true... but still
[07:05] <jdong> anyway
[07:05] <jdong> I really don't care which is default
[07:05] <jdong> as long as it's good :D
[07:05] <jsgotangco> well you can't force people to do something thats not interesting for them
[07:05] <jdong> but I'd still like to see beryl in a Ubuntu repository
[07:05] <jdong> rather than a 3rd party one
[07:06] <Burgwork> yes
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[07:08] <_ion> seveas: Please upload falcon to feisty, btw. :-)
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[07:10] <mdz> Riddell: done
[07:11] <Riddell> now it feels like a proper release :)
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[07:21] <agutierr> Someone knows something about this message on ubuntu edgy installer: Please presss one of these keys: ,, p....
[07:21] <agutierr> :??
[07:22] <_ion> What about it?
[07:23] <_ion> Are you sure it's ,, and not e.g. ?
[07:23] <Burgwork> agutierr: that is for determining keyboard type
[07:23] <agutierr> Umm
[07:23] <agutierr> I am using preseeds
[07:24] <agutierr> is there a way to omit this question ?
[07:24] <agutierr> (thanks)
[07:24] <surak> it assumes things wrong for me all the time. If I press comma once, it says "wow! you're using a belgium keyboard"
[07:24] <surak> :)
[07:25] <_ion> The installer asks whether you want to run the detection thing, doesn't it?
[07:26] <_ion> If it doesn't ask you to press comma and you press comma, what else could it do?
[07:28] <surak> it can ask before for a specific layout or it can try to detect
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[07:32] <zMott> riddell: what with the mono components...
[07:32] <Riddell> ?
[07:32] <zMott> when I upgrade today... notice allot of mono this, mono that..
[07:33] <zMott> is this part of the new frame work..
[07:33] <Riddell> nothing to do with me
[07:33] <zMott> just asking
[07:33] <zMott> Mark, made a comment, about festy fawn
[07:33] <zMott> that will have some new underpinning
[07:35] <zMott> Riddell: its it true.
[07:39] <iwj> Oh, bugger.  I just updated my xen install to edgy and now X is badly broken.
[07:45] <highvoltage> iwj: ouch
[07:48] <iwj> Yay, another hard crash.
[07:49] <tfheen> iwj: what arch?
[07:49] <iwj> And it works just fine not inside xen.
[07:49] <iwj> i386
[07:50] <iwj> My graphics is
[07:50] <iwj> 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation 82845G/GL[Brookdale-G] /GE Chipset Integrated Graphics Device (rev 01)
[07:51] <iwj> Using the vesa driver doesn't help so I suppose it's probably something with Xen.
[07:51] <dholbach> cjwatson, fabbione: whenever you have the time again - could you look at bug 59620? I was asked to look at it because there is some sort of quarrel going on, but I guess I'm not apt enough myself to judge. Thanks a lot!
[07:51] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 59620 in parted "This ext2 filesystem has a rather strange layout (newer ext2/ext3)" [Undecided,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/59620
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[07:55] <highvoltage> iwj: for what it's worth, in my experiences with edgy the vesa driver has caused me quite some problems, perhaps there's been some big changes with it upstream
[07:56] <iwj> I last updated this install about two weeks ago.
[07:56] <iwj> IIRC
[07:57] <dholbach> pitti: apport-retrace is so GOOD STUFF!
=== dholbach hugs pitt
=== dholbach hugs pitti
=== pitti hugs dholbach 
=== dholbach hugs pitti
=== dholbach hugs pitti
[07:57] <keescook> hehe
[07:57] <pitti> whoa!
[07:57] <surak> :)
=== Robot101 hugs dholbach 
[07:58] <Robot101> :)
[07:58] <dholbach> hey Robot101
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[07:58] <dholbach> Robot101: how's it going?
[07:58] <zul> hey pitti 
[07:58] <pitti> hi zul
[08:00] <dholbach> pitti: we just need more dbgsym packages
[08:00] <Robot101> dholbach: got a pair of very obscure and annoying to fix bugs
[08:00] <dholbach> Robot101: good luck with that!
[08:00] <ajmitch> morning all :)
[08:01] <dholbach> heya ajmitch
[08:01] <keescook> hiya ajmitch 
[08:04] <Seveas> HUGS FOR EVERYONE -- thanks for another great Ubuntu release
=== pitti hugs Seveas 
[08:04] <highvoltage> *hugs*
[08:05] <Amaranth> hehe
[08:06] <Amaranth> I've got a guy PMing me saying "tell the devs thank you"
=== iwj files bug 68440.
[08:06] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 68440 in xorg "X does not work, causes crash" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/68440
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[08:06] <iwj> Damn, I should change the title to mention Xen.
[08:06] <surak> Amaranth: perhaps he/she is too shy to say for him/herself
=== ajmitch hugs pitti & Seveas 
[08:06] <Robot101> I've got edgy running under a xen domain atm
[08:06] <Amaranth> surak: i think he doesn't want to bother you
[08:07] <Robot101> lots of warnings at bootups about not being able to access /dev/mem
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[08:09] <iwj> Robot101: Hmm.  Do you have a working X server ?
[08:09] <Robot101> iwj: I'm XDMCPing
[08:09] <iwj> Err, you mean, the Xen domain is running the xdmcp server ie the X clients ?
[08:09] <iwj> In my case the Xen domU is running the actual X server.
[08:10] <iwj> Sorry, dom0
[08:10] <Robot101> dom0 is etch and runs the X server, domU is edgy and is running the clients
[08:10] <iwj> I suppose I could try etch instead :-).
[08:10] <ajmitch> though you shouldn't be having problems with edgy anyway..
[08:10] <Robot101> is that screwed up checksumming crap fixed upstream yet?
=== ajmitch runs edgy as dom0 just fine with the i810 driver
[08:11] <Robot101> I've got ethtook -K foad off die die die stab in all of my network scripts/interfaces too
[08:11] <iwj> Robot101: I haven't heard about it being fixed.
[08:11] <Robot101> oh, actually
[08:11] <iwj> ethtool> Quite so.
[08:11] <Robot101> the X server asserted
[08:11] <iwj> Did you see my rant about it on xen-whereever ?
[08:11] <Robot101> yeah
[08:11] <Robot101> it doesn't work for backend drivers, so you lose anyway
[08:12] <zul> iwj: which rant?
[08:12] <iwj> ajmitch: Oh, you too.  Mine is using i810 too.
[08:12] <iwj> zul: The one about checksumming.
[08:12] <zul> ah ok
[08:12] <iwj> Robot101: Quite.  Dreadful, isn't it.
[08:12] <Robot101> I had to turn off DRI to make the X server work
[08:12] <iwj> Turn off DRI.
[08:12] <iwj> OK, I'll try that :-).
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[08:13] <iwj> I only barely know what DRI is ...
[08:13] <iwj> Try that> when it's finished rebooting again.
[08:14] <iwj> checksum rant: http://lists.xensource.com/archives/html/xen-devel/2006-03/msg01001.html
[08:14] <zul> you know it would be nice to hear these bug reports earlier ;)
[08:15] <iwj> zul: Yeah, but I didn't want to break my machine by constantly taking the edgy updates.
[08:15] <iwj> You know how it is.
[08:15] <zul> yeah i nkow
[08:15] <highvoltage> iwj: a 4 month release cycle doesn't leave much time for bug hunting :)
[08:15] <Robot101> iwj: when it was crashing for me I got some abort() or assert error
[08:16] <iwj> Robot101: Lucky you, an error message :-).
[08:16] <Robot101> yeah it didn't bring the machine down or owt
[08:18] <iwj> 30 boots => fsck time
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[08:23] <zul> iwj: its complaining about missing /dev/wacom
[08:24] <sladen> zul: the symlink creation code will do interesting things is the PNP ID for the wacom was detected, but the serial driver hasn't loaded
[08:24] <sladen> zul: /is/if/
[08:24] <iwj> Nope, disabling DRI didn't help.
[08:25] <iwj> zul: Well, err, I don't think that's really a complaint, is it ?  I don't have a wacom tablet :-).
[08:25] <zul> :)
[08:26] <zul> iwj: which kernel is this 2.6.17/2.6.16?
[08:27] <iwj> 2.6.17
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[08:28] <ajmitch> hi slomo 
[08:28] <iwj> You can see from the Xorg.0.log
[08:28] <zul> okies ill have a look at it again
[08:28] <slomo> hi ajmitch :)
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[08:33] <iwj> I think I'm going to give up on this for now.
[08:35] <zul> try with 2.6.17
[08:35] <yacoob> It's pages like this that makes you go 'Okay... what's wrong with the world...?'
[08:35] <yacoob> http://wherethehellismatt.com/
[08:36] <jdong> http://thatisntreallyontopic.com/
[08:37] <yacoob> Sure. Shutting myself up right away.
[08:37] <yacoob> (with offtopic content, that is)
[08:38] <iwj> zul: I _am_ using 2.6.17.
[08:39] <zul> ah ok..
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[08:41] <iwj> ajmitch:, Robot101: what boot options are you passing to xen, if any ?
[08:43] <ajmitch> nothing unusual, just the root filesystem
[08:43] <Robot101> on domU: root=/dev/sda1 ro
[08:44] <Robot101> on dom0: root=/dev/md0 ro console=tty0
[08:44] <iwj> Right.  Err, but what about    kernel /boot/xen-3.0-i386.gz    where I have no options at all.
[08:44] <ajmitch> nothing extra there
[08:44] <Robot101> ditto
[08:45] <zul> all i have is noreboot and i havent done anything funky
[08:46] <iwj> Hmm.  Oh well.
[08:47] <iwj> Perhaps some X expert will have a clue.
[08:47] <iwj> I'm off to the pub.
[08:47] <iwj> Thanks for your help, anyway.
[08:47] <Robot101> ooh, carlton
=== Robot101 has a bike now
[08:47] <iwj> I need a shower first, so I'll be about 30m ...
[08:47] <iwj> See you there ?
[08:47] <iwj> bikes++
[08:48] <Robot101> I'll ponder it, I've found a bug with google talk's server and I'm chatting with a googler who just arrived at work about it (doh)
[08:48] <iwj> :-)  Have fun ...
[08:48] <Robot101> yay timezones
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[09:30] <rgl> hi
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[09:32] <eXistenZ> Hey, there is some kind of bug in gnome-edgy.
[09:33] <eXistenZ> When I try to move an icon from the left part to the right, the icon turns into yellow with a question mark inside.
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[09:34] <seb128> eXistenZ: what do you mean "from the left part to the right"?
[09:35] <seb128> eXistenZ: please use launchpad for bugs too, or #ubuntu for users questions
[09:36] <eXistenZ> seb128, I mean, try to make a shortcut for the terminal in your gnome-panel, put it in the left side, then move it (by dragging it) to the right side, and it will turn into yellow with a question mark
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[09:36] <seb128> eXistenZ: that might be https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gnome-panel/+bug/59431
[09:36] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 59431 in gnome-panel "panel launchers get emptied after left mouse button drag&dropping twice" [Unknown,Unconfirmed]  
[09:36] <eXistenZ> seb128, indeed
[09:36] <frandavid100> hello! how can I add a new page to wiki.ubuntu.com?
[09:36] <yacoob> hm, is there an udeb for installer with iwpriv?
[09:37] <seb128> frandavid100: type the page name and it'll ask if you want to create it
[09:37] <frandavid100> really?
[09:37] <seb128> frandavid100: yep
[09:37] <seb128> wiki.ubuntu.com/YourTitle
[09:37] <eXistenZ> seb128, what about that bug?
[09:37] <frandavid100> thanks guys!
[09:38] <seb128> eXistenZ: that's the bug you were speaking about
[09:38] <seb128> frandavid100: np
[09:38] <eXistenZ> seb128, yes. Has it been fixed?
[09:38] <seb128> eXistenZ: no, you would not have it if that was the case
[09:38] <seb128> eXistenZ: and the bug on launchpad would be closed
[09:39] <yacoob> looks like there is no iwpriv. Oh well.
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[10:11] <frandavid100> could you guys give this spec a look? https://features.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/cafebuntu
[10:11] <frandavid100> What would I need to get it going?
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[10:16] <frandavid100> no comments?
[10:16] <Burgwork> frandavid100: looking
[10:16] <frandavid100> thanks Burgwork
[10:16] <frandavid100> :)
[10:16] <Burgwork> frandavid100: that should in an informational spec
[10:16] <yacoob> Hm. When are there going to be shipits for 6.10?
[10:17] <Burgwork> breaking out each of the various pieces needed
[10:17] <Burgwork> yacoob: no shipit for edgy
[10:17] <yacoob> why is that?
[10:17] <yacoob> too edgy? :>
[10:17] <Burgwork> no, dapper si supported for longer
[10:18] <Burgwork> frandavid100: figure out each piece of the tech: lockdown, payment, wine, etc.
[10:18] <Burgwork> one spec for each piece
[10:18] <frandavid100> aha
[10:18] <frandavid100> and that spec with links for them all right?
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[10:18] <goliath23> hi
[10:18] <Burgwork> frandavid100: well, the spec would be informational, and the other specs would depend on it
[10:19] <Burgwork> frandavid100: you going tob e in MTV?
[10:19] <frandavid100> who me?
[10:19] <Burgwork> yep
[10:19] <frandavid100> you surely don't mean the music channel do you?
[10:19] <Burgwork> mountainview
[10:19] <nixternal> lol
[10:19] <goliath23> I think there is a major problem with the update from dapper to edgy. /usr/bin/perl is killed everytime it's called from dpkg or apt-get with the message "stack smashing detected"
[10:20] <Burgwork> goliath23: please file a bug
[10:20] <frandavid100> don't really know what it is or how I could be
[10:20] <Burgwork> this is not the place to report bugs
[10:20] <Burgwork> frandavid100: no worries then
[10:20] <goliath23> i'm stuck with a half updated system here.
[10:20] <goliath23> X not running and so on.
[10:20] <Burgwork> frandavid100: write all those pieces out, then create implementation specs for each
[10:20] <goliath23> any idea how I could disable "stack smashing protection"?
[10:20] <Burgwork> frandavid100: there is already a guest-login spec from edubuntu
[10:20] <Burgwork> take a peek at that
[10:20] <frandavid100> I'll do my best Burgwork
[10:21] <Burgwork> frandavid100: no worries. Ask for feedback often
[10:21] <frandavid100> thanks for the advice Burgwork
[10:21] <frandavid100> gotta have some dinner, later!
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[10:22] <Burgwork> frandavid100: no worries
[10:24] <goliath23> could anyone of you guys please help me out with a i386 perl executable somewhere on a webspace thats compiled without SSP?
[10:25] <goliath23> maybe that gets started to fix things here. 
[10:25] <pitti> goliath23: -v ?
[10:25] <goliath23> obviously the new perl executable in edgy is compiled with a new stack smashing protection that somehow has false positives on my desktop pc .. on the laptop everything is fine
[10:26] <pitti> goliath23: right, we use SSP by default now
[10:26] <goliath23> pitti: -v of what? perl? v5.8.8
[10:26] <pitti> goliath23: no, on your problem :)
[10:26] <goliath23> ah, :)
=== goliath23 calls himself with -v.
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[10:30] <pitti> goliath23: I use Perl quite regularly, I didn't notice any problem with it; what does it break?
[10:30] <goliath23> so I changed sources.list and replaced dapper with edgy. then aptget update and apt-get dist-upgrade. somewhere in between dist-upgrade failed. now I get messages about missing dependencies if I call apt-get and it suggest a "apt-get -f install" if I do that, it tries to remove xserver-xorg, but the post-installation script is killed by SSP
[10:30] <goliath23> and not only with removing xserver-xorg. it also fails on manual dpkg operations on other packages.. always with the same message.. : *** stack smashing detected ***: /usr/bin/perl terminated
[10:30] <goliath23> leaving me in a quite undesirable situation :
[10:30] <goliath23> :)
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[10:30] <pitti> weird
[10:30] <goliath23> so maybe a perl executable as it was in dapper would help me to get at least something running again.
[10:30] <goliath23> one that was compiled without SSP
[10:31] <pitti> goliath23: let's continue this in /query
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[10:33] <BHSPitLappy> anyone else notice that some of the descriptions are wrong, in http://releases.ubuntu.com/edgy/ ?
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[10:40] <david__> pitty: ich muss doch wieder zurck und recovery starten, sobald der versucht X hier zu starten hngt er sich auch
[10:40] <david__> brb
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[10:45] <Goliath233> pitti: still here
[10:45] <Goliath233> ?
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[10:47] <Goliath233> pitti: ?
[10:48] <pitti> Goliath233: yup; /msg please
[10:48] <Viaken> Edgy rocks. Nice job. ;)
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[10:48] <Goliath233> pitti: I can't the registered username is still taken
[10:48] <Goliath233> private msgs are disabled for non registered nicks
[10:49] <Goliath233> pitti: please join me in #ssp-problem
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[10:58] <psusi> fabbione: ping
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[11:03] <yacoob> why isn't *buntu using differential packages list with apt?
[11:03] <pitti> yacoob: doesn't work well for us
[11:03] <pitti> yacoob: Debian has one update per day, Ubuntu has 24
[11:04] <yacoob> hm? stable ubuntu gets 24 updates per day?
[11:04] <yacoob> wait, you mean the upload cycle?
[11:04] <pitti> yacoob: no, the development release does
[11:05] <pitti> yacoob: but *-updates and *-security lists are so small, it's not worth the effort IMHO
[11:05] <yacoob> hmm. Perhaps.
=== Toadstool hugs * for edgy
[11:05] <yacoob> ok, and what's problem then with dev? too much load on server to generate the diffs?
[11:06] <pitti> yacoob: with 24 Packages.gz updates per day there would be a *lot* of diffs
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[11:09] <Amaranth> couldn't you only flip it on for final releases?
[11:10] <Amaranth> although after that it's not worth it, like you said
[11:10] <Amaranth> alright :P
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[11:30] <darkyoshi372> Hi all, I have a suggestion to make. I tried to set up file sharing between Edgy and a Mac, but after about an hour, I gave up. It should be very easy to set up files haring with a GUI, especially NFS, which is native to Linux. Perhaps there could be a little app in +1 that sets up a network for you, once you know the security risks involved?
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[11:37] <Nafallo> darkyoshi372: dude, that app exists :-)
[11:37] <darkyoshi372> huh?
[11:37] <Nafallo> darkyoshi372: system -> administration -> shared maps or something like that. I'm using Swedish personally.
[11:37] <darkyoshi372> shared folders?
[11:37] <Nafallo> darkyoshi372: and #ubuntu is for support btw :-)
[11:38] <darkyoshi372> I know, I STILL couldn't set it up
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[11:38] <darkyoshi372> I don't want support
[11:38] <darkyoshi372> I'm suggesting this as a feature
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[11:38] <jdong> darkyoshi372: this isn't where you suggest features either
[11:38] <Nafallo> darkyoshi372: worked for me yesterday. if it didn't work, file a bug :-).
[11:38] <darkyoshi372> okay...
[11:39] <Nafallo> the feature is already there :-)
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[11:41] <pitti> yay hal 0.5.8.1
[11:43] <yacoob> w32codecs seems to be MIA.
[11:43] <pitti> Riddell: still here?
[11:43] <yacoob> Anyone can point me to some working copy and perhaps update the wiki on the issue?
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[11:44] <jabra> http://www.ubuntu.com/download/releasenotes doesn't have the release notes yet
[11:44] <jabra> just fyi
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[11:45] <Chipzz> yacoob: no, w32codecs is in no way an official ubuntu or debian package, nor will it ever be
[11:45] <Chipzz> it can't be because it's basically *illegal* to distribute it I think
[11:46] <Chipzz> so I think you're on your own here
[11:46] <yacoob> Chipzz, all well and sound, but I mean that the wiki is no longer valid :>
[11:46] <yacoob> and I bet many folks use it anyway, thus my question.
[11:46] <Chipzz> yacoob: use google? there are plenty of places you can download a w32codecs package from
[11:47] <Chipzz> and while I agree that the wiki should be up-to-date
[11:47] <Chipzz> this is not the correct place to complain about the wiki
[11:47] <yacoob> Right.
[11:47] <Chipzz> I think the forums would be more apropriate
[11:48] <pitti> even better, just fix the wiki :)
[11:48] <Chipzz> pitti: can anyone edit the wiki? :)
[11:48] <LaserJock> yacoob: talk to #ubuntu-doc for wiki issues
[11:48] <pitti> Chipzz: sure
[11:48] <LaserJock> Chipzz: yes
[11:48] <_ion> Hmm, whoever is the upstream of w32codecs (mplayer devs?) have got the files from *somewhere* (microsoft.com? apple.com? real.com?). Perhaps someone should make something not unlike msttcorefonts that downloads the official wmplayer, quicktime, realplayer etc. and extracts the dlls from them.
[11:48] <pitti> _ion: Microsoft is the upstream :)
[11:48] <Chipzz> pitti: not microsoft exclusively I think?
[11:48] <_ion> s/upstream/midstream/ ;-)
[11:49] <Chipzz> :)
[11:49] <pitti> and Microsoft permits usage and downloading the TTF fonts, but not the codecs
[11:50] <Chipzz> _ion: I have serious doubt about the legality of the zip-file on the mplayer site btw, but that's their problem really ;)
[11:50] <wasabi_> MS doesn't permit that naymore.
[11:50] <wasabi_> But their existing license was non revokable or something.
[11:50] <wasabi_> So, somebody mirrored them on sf.net
[11:50] <sivang> wasabi_: the fonts ?
[11:50] <wasabi_> Yes, the fonts. 
[11:50] <sivang> yes , they don't allow it.
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[11:50] <mirak> hello
[11:51] <mirak> are you sure generic kernel are 100% sure ?
[11:51] <pitti> http://www.microsoft.com/truetype/fontpack/win.htm -> oh, "oops"
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[11:51] <mirak> because I really have kernel crashes since they were introduced into edgy
[11:51] <yacoob> just out of curiosity, how many of you actually have w32codecs installed?
=== pitti uses amd64 and thus doesn't
[11:52] <_ion> The script could represent the user with a confirmation dialog that says "Normally you don't have rights to extract the codecs from these programs. Do you have an express written permission from Microsoft, Real and Apple to do that?"
[11:52] <_ion> :-P
[11:52] <LaserJock> yacoob: I don't
[11:52] <yacoob> _ion, add '*wink*wink*' at the end :>
[11:52] <mirak> does anyone reported crashes when using generic kernels ?
[11:52] <pitti> yacoob: so far I met very few to none videos which mplayer doesn't grok with native codecs
[11:52] <Chipzz> pitti: just wondering btw, while (for the end-users) linking to the w32codecs deb is the sane thing to do, has anyone looked into the legal aspect of doing that? or is canonical not accountable for the content of the wiki's?
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[11:53] <yacoob> pitti, i have plethora of old stuff in various crazy formats
[11:53] <yacoob> I ditched vivo, at least... :)
[11:53] <psusi> my ubuntu install is pure floss
[11:53] <pitti> Chipzz: German juristiction makes the link owner responsible for the linked target
[11:53] <pitti> so I wouldn't like to set one
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[11:54] <pitti> yacoob: old stuff shouldn't be a problem - the very latest codecs might be
[11:54] <yacoob> pitti, huh? That's ridiculous...?
[11:54] <psusi> how utterly retarded
[11:54] <yacoob> (link target thingy)
[11:54] <pitti> e. g. WMV often gives problems, but most of my vids are mpeg-4 (in .avi)
[11:54] <wasabi_> To be honest, I believe the US leans strongly in that direction too.
[11:54] <wasabi_> And again, to be honest, I'd agree with it.
[11:54] <wasabi_> You can't show somebody how to break the law, recommend they do so, and not have some responsibility.
[11:55] <yacoob> it's so just happens that I have most of the stuff gathered on my stuff LV, so I'll run through it and quickly see.
[11:56] <Chipzz> would saying "just google for w32codecs ubuntu debs" or linking to a google search be any better?
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[11:58] <yacoob> perhaps link to mplayer's page would be good?
[11:59] <yacoob> http://www.mplayerhq.hu/design7/dload.html has them, plus instruction where to put it
[11:59] <Chipzz> yacoob: but they don't have debs
[11:59] <pitti> so what?
[11:59] <pitti> it's about unpacking a tarball in /usr/local...
[11:59] <yacoob> targz should be fine
[12:00] <yacoob> provided edgy's mplayer will look there
[12:00] <_ion> pitti: Then you don't get the updates automatically with apt-get upgrade.
[12:00] <pitti> ... or whereever
=== pitti is sure that somewhere out there is a w32codecs deb
[12:01] <_ion> debian-multimedia.org IIRC
[12:01] <StevenK> I thought it was linked to from RestrictedFormats ?
[12:01] <Chipzz> pitti: considering the efforts ubuntu goes through to make everything easy for the user, unpacking a .tar.gz isn't quite user-friendly
[12:01] <pitti> Chipzz: I agree
[12:01] <yacoob> aw, shoot :/
[12:01] <pitti> Chipzz: however, *I* wouldn't like to put such a deb on my homepage, and I guess this is true for most devs
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[12:02] <Chipzz> pitti: that's why I said that linking to the mplayer page may not be the best idea
[12:02] <yacoob> kaffeine still fails to play .avi from smb share :(
[12:02] <Chipzz> pitti: hence the link to google search?
[12:02] <pitti> Chipzz: something blurry like 'search the web for a w32codecs deb package' might do
[12:02] <pitti> gdebi does the rest :)
[12:02] <yacoob> I wonder whether it's \ in the MRL that confuses the smb plugin...
[12:03] <StevenK> -rw-r--r-- 1 steven users 13M 2005-11-16 15:32 w32codecs_20050412-0.0_i386.deb
[12:03] <StevenK> Hrrm.
[12:04] <StevenK> It seems when I did my install, there was a pointer to a .deb
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[12:04] <_ion> stevenk: That is a *VERY* old version.
[12:04] <StevenK> Well, this machine did start off with Breezy...
[12:05] <ajmitch> _ion: about the same version that I have
[12:05] <ajmitch> 20050412-0.0
[12:05] <_ion> Hence the need for updates with apt-get. :-) Of course, the legal issues hinder that.
[12:05] <ajmitch> yep, looks the same
=== ajmitch manages fine without it on amd64
[12:06] <Chipzz> $ dpkg -l | grep w32
[12:06] <Chipzz> ii  w32codecs                             20060611-0.0                         win32 binary codecs
=== _ion has ran into many wmvs that only work correctly with a new version of w32codecs.
[12:06] <_ion> s/ran/run/