[12:26] <fdoving> gnite all.
[12:33] <ryanakca> night fdoving
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[02:46] <freeflying> congrats all  :)
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[03:42] <gnomefreak> jdong: ping
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[03:49] <jdong> gnomefreak: pong
[03:49] <jdong> heh :)
[03:57] <gnomefreak> jdong: you going to UDS
[03:57] <jdong> gnomefreak: no, I'm not
[03:57] <gnomefreak> ok just wondering
[04:16] <Hobbsee> cool, my isp added all the kubuntu and ubuntu iso's to their unmetered page already
=== Hobbsee downloads it
[04:21] <Hobbsee> [12:20]  <Hobbsee> Total Bytes received 47368 Kb (6.66%)
[04:21] <Hobbsee> [12:20]  <Hobbsee> Current speed = 402.00Kb/s, Average D/L speed = 614.97Kb/s
[04:21] <Hobbsee> [12:20]  <Hobbsee> Time Remaining 17 Minutes 56 Seconds
[04:21] <Hobbsee> nice :)
[04:31] <Hobbsee> Riddell: all the links in http://www.kubuntu.org/download.php are wrong - they refer to dapper
[04:31] <Hobbsee> oh wait, i cant read
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[04:32] <Hobbsee> 1f9baed847eff89b03c754fcaea8070e
[04:32] <Hobbsee> 1f9baed847eff89b03c754fcaea8070e
[04:32] <Hobbsee> good, bigpond got the correct file then...
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[04:42] <Hobbsee> 1f9baed847eff89b03c754fcaea8070e
[04:42] <Hobbsee> and it came down fine.  good
[04:42] <Jucato> hi Hobbsee! :)
[04:42] <Hobbsee> hey Jucato :)
[04:43] <Jucato> what came down fine.good? :P
[04:43] <Hobbsee> Jucato: kubuntu-6.10-desktop-i386.iso
[04:43] <Jucato> ah... :(
[04:43] <Hobbsee> Jucato: whihc my ISP has kindly decided to host already
[04:43] <Hobbsee> along with all the ubuntu ones
[04:44] <Jucato> md5sum verified.. but the burn... didn't go well :(
[04:44] <Jucato> nice!!
[04:44] <Hobbsee> yeah!
[04:44] <Hobbsee> :(
[04:44] <Hobbsee> i'm just burning now
[04:44] <Hobbsee> i'm hoping to try this out on dad's laptop
[04:44] <Jucato> I'm seeding the alternate and desktop ISO's for 386 once I get Edgy back up :)
[04:44] <Hobbsee> nice :)
[04:45] <Jucato> I'm doing something... well... crazy :P
[04:45] <Jucato> Edgy is the time to be edgy
[04:45] <Hobbsee> hehe
=== Hobbsee doesnt seed things
[04:45] <Jucato> btw, I confirmed a KOrganizer bug in LP. it's a KDE 3.5.5 actually so I put a link to the the KDE bug report
[04:46] <Hobbsee> yay :)
[04:46] <Jucato> a fix is already available according to kde bugs. that makes 2 KDE 3.5.5 bugs with fixes already (that didn't make it)
[04:47] <Hobbsee> they'll make it into feisty then
[04:47] <Hobbsee> and there will always be bugs
[04:47] <Jucato> heheh :)
[04:47] <Jucato> there's also a KWin bug that I already told Tonio about. it was fixed Oct. 10. too bad the patch didn't make it to Edgy :(
=== Jucato is getting that "buggy" feeling again :P
[04:48] <Hobbsee> heh
[04:48] <Hobbsee> make sure it gets in for next time
[04:49] <Hobbsee> patches that you write are also good - ie, so all they have to do is put it in
[04:49] <Jucato> hehe I don't write patches yet :P
[04:49] <Hobbsee> debdiffs, with the kde patch included :P
[04:49] <Jucato> hm.. I though Tonio said the patches would probably be put in -updates?
[04:50] <Hobbsee> probably
[04:52] <Jucato> Hobbsee: you're going to UDS? (I forgot...)
[04:52] <Hobbsee> Jucato: nope.  probably MV+1 though
=== Hobbsee has exams and the like
[04:52] <Jucato> aaah
[04:52] <Jucato> :(
[04:52] <Jucato> they won't get to see the queen
[04:52] <Hobbsee> they'll deal :P
[04:52] <Hobbsee> besides, it's freezing over there
[04:53] <Jucato> hehe
[04:54] <Hobbsee> ROFL!
[04:54] <Jucato> O_o
=== Hobbsee just heard the "success" tune from burning a cd in k3b
[04:55] <Jucato> lol
[04:55] <Jucato> funny ain't it?
[04:56] <Hobbsee> yep
[04:56] <Hobbsee> i thought my laptop had gone nuts
[04:56] <Jucato> hahah
[04:57] <Hobbsee> oh drat, dad took his laptoip
[04:58] <Jucato> :(
[05:02] <Hawkwind> Hobbsee: You better bust out the pointy stick!
[05:02] <Hobbsee> Hawkwind: why so?
[05:02] <Hawkwind> Hobbsee: Poke him with it and tell him not to take *his* laptop anymore without asking you first :)
[05:02] <Hobbsee> Hawkwind: heh.  it is still his.  for the moment
[05:03] <Hawkwind> Or, you could just beat Jucato with it if you're bored :P
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[05:04] <Jucato> why me...
[05:04] <Jucato> :(
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[05:26] <Hobbsee_> i'd like to make a complaint
[05:26] <Hobbsee> !network
[05:26] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about network - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[05:26] <Hobbsee> !wifi
[05:26] <ubotu> Wireless documentation can be found at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs
[05:26] <Hobbsee> !network is <alias> wifi
[05:26] <ubotu> I'll remember that, Hobbsee
[05:26] <Hobbsee> !-wifi
[05:26] <ubotu> wifi aliases: wireless, ndiswrapper, broadcom, bcm43xx, ndis, wpa, wep, madwifi, ralink, ipw, wpa2, acx111, network - added by Seveas on 2006-07-25 23:42:07
[05:26] <Hobbsee> oh, so i did guess right
[05:26] <Hobbsee> anyway, i'd still like to make a complaint
[05:27] <Jucato> ooh
[05:27] <Hobbsee> we dont actually include knm on the cd
[05:27] <Hobbsee> if we do, we dont do it in such a way that you can easily access it from the live cd
[05:28] <Hobbsee> and since i cant seem to make wlassistant work at all...that's not good
=== Hobbsee eventually installed knm over a wired connection to the other laptop
[05:28] <Jucato> :(
[05:29] <Hobbsee> oh well.  dad's wifi card is screwed.
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[05:31] <ajmitch> Hobbsee! Hobbsee_!
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[05:32] <Hobbsee> hey ajmitch!
[05:32] <ajmitch> and one of the Hobbsees leaves us :(
[05:33] <Hobbsee> hehe
[05:33] <Hobbsee> indeed
[05:33] <Hobbsee> i'm only on one machine at the moment, too
[05:33] <Hobbsee> finished playing with dad's colleague's laptop
[05:35] <Jucato> the laptop of the colleague of the dad of Hobbsee...
[05:35] <Hobbsee> yep
[05:35] <Hobbsee> the colleague left the company, so dad got the laptop, for being the closest.  oh, and i got the ram :D
[05:35] <Jucato> hahah
=== Jucato wished he had a laptop, but wouldn't know what he would use it for...
[05:37] <Hobbsee> currently the house has 5 computers.  or did, as of last night.
[05:37] <Jucato> O_O
[05:37] <Hobbsee> for three people, that's kinda scary :P
[05:37] <Hobbsee> (most of them arent ours)
[05:37] <Jucato> hehe
[05:37] <Jucato> kinda fun too :)
[05:38] <Hobbsee> nixternal: ping?
[05:38] <Jucato> btw Hobbsee, is it possible to have Edgy installed and be packaging/developing for Feisty on the same system? maybe Feisty on a separate partition?
[05:38] <Hobbsee> Jucato: sure.  dual, or tripple boot
[05:38] <Hobbsee> the only limit on how many OS' you can have is based on hard disk space
[05:38] <Jucato> um.. without having to reboot again and again?
=== Hobbsee routinely tripple boots
[05:39] <Hobbsee> er, vmware
[05:39] <Jucato> how about chroot stuff?
[05:39] <Hobbsee> of course, if you're building things for feisty, why not just use a pbuilder/chroot?
[05:39] <Hobbsee> you can run X-based apps in the chroot too, if you want
[05:39] <Jucato> ah
[05:39] <Jucato> ok that's what I was looking for :)
[05:39] <nixternal> Hobbsee: pong
=== Jucato wonders if he could also do pbuilder/chroot for KDE4...
[05:40] <Hobbsee> nixternal: bug 68521? 
[05:40] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 68521 in kubuntu-docs "Kubuntu release notes refer to Firefox 2.0 which isn't included" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/68521
[05:40] <Hobbsee> Jucato: er?  i think you misunderstand the idea of a chroot
[05:40] <Jucato> Hobbsee: I obviously did :)
[05:40] <Hobbsee> :P
[05:40] <nixternal> damn
[05:40] <Jucato> nvm the rantings of a developer-wannabe...
[05:40] <nixternal> she has a point there, what to do
[05:40] <Hobbsee> Jucato: pbuilder/chroots, to my knowledge, do releases - so you can have a feisty chroot, an edgy chroot, etch chrood, sid chroot, etc
[05:41] <Hobbsee> nixternal: where are the release notes?
[05:41] <Hobbsee> nixternal: distributed on the cds?
[05:41] <nixternal> hrmm
[05:41] <Jucato> KDE Help Center? Kubuntu Documents?
[05:41] <nixternal> kubuntu docs yes, so khelpcenter
[05:43] <Hobbsee> so you cant change them, obviously.  unless its' in updates, but that's beside the point.  by the time they've updated, they wont be reading the documentation
[05:51] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: upgraded to feisty?
[05:51] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: not as yet.  i should though
[05:51] <Hobbsee> :P
[05:53] <Jucato> Hobbsee: feisty's open already?
[05:53] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: now look waht you've done :P
[05:53] <Hobbsee> Jucato: sure!  now get bugfixing!
[05:53] <Jucato> ok I'll stay quiet
[05:53] <Jucato> :P
[05:54] <Jucato> well it wasn't open yet last night... so...
=== Jucato shrugs and keeps quiet...
[05:56] <Hobbsee> Jucato: it wont be open for a while
[05:56] <Hobbsee> Jucato: and they'll have to build the toolchain first
[05:56] <Jucato> that's why I was asking... (more of a surprised question...)
[05:59] <Hobbsee> Jucato: most people ask that immediately - on the forums too
[06:00] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: i have an evil idea.
[06:00] <Jucato> Hobbsee: heh.. well, I'm not like *most* people... I'm weird... :P
[06:00] <Hobbsee> :P
=== Hobbsee is weirder still
[06:01] <Jucato> oh no doubt about that :D
=== Jucato hides from long pointy stick
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=== Hobbsee twirls her long pointy stick around
[06:03] <Jucato> hehe
[06:04] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: what a surprise
[06:05] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: an idea about "spreading misinformation on the forums, seeing as how there is so much there already"
[06:05] <ajmitch> hah
[06:05] <ajmitch> what sort of misinformation?
[06:06] <Jucato> yeah... gang up on the forums :P
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[06:23] <nixternal> heh
[06:26] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: along the lines of "yes, feisty repos are open" or something
[06:28] <ajmitch> "feisty's just great, isn't it?"
[06:28] <nixternal> [22:53:19]  <Jucato> Hobbsee: feisty's open already?
[06:28] <nixternal> ghahahaha
[06:28] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: yep!
[06:28] <Hobbsee> nixternal: :D
[06:28] <ajmitch> well they're *partly* open
[06:28] <nixternal> damn, he left before i could make fun of him
[06:28] <nixternal> for gcc and what not
[06:28] <ajmitch> for a very limited base set of pakages
[06:28] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: in that the feisty pbuilders may build?
[06:28] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:28] <ajmitch> kernel has been uploaded
[06:28] <nixternal> open for the "under the hood" type stuff
[06:29] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: when should they finish the toolchain?
[06:29] <ajmitch> 16:14 -!- BenC changed the topic of #ubuntu-kernel to: Ubuntu kernel development discussion ONLY | Kernel Wiki: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CategoryKernel |
[06:29] <ajmitch>           2.6.19-1.1 uploaded. Don't use it, it's for bootstrapping only
[06:29] <nixternal> gcc, kernel, glibc the fun stuff
[06:29] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: no idea
[06:29] <ajmitch> be patient
[06:29] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: starting merging early would be good :P
[06:29] <ajmitch> back later :)
[06:29] <Hobbsee> which was what i was thinking of
[06:29] <Hobbsee> okay
[06:29] <nixternal> hehe, Hobbsee we can get a start on it tonight
[06:29] <Hobbsee> nixternal: not if most things arent there - they'll just break
[06:29] <nixternal> you take a through m, and i will take n through z
[06:29] <Hobbsee> nixternal: besides, i'm not working without MOM
=== Hobbsee hates to think of hwo many packages she'll have to merge again
[06:30] <nixternal> oh ya, mom would be nice
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[06:40] <nixternal> wb imbrandon
[06:40] <nixternal> you didn't sleep long
[06:42] <Hobbsee> hey imbrandon!  
[06:42] <freeflying> hi Hobbsee nixternal imbrandon 
[06:42] <Hobbsee> hi freeflying 
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[06:45] <nixternal> hiy freeflying
[06:45] <nixternal> !seen mornfall
[06:45] <ubotu> mornfall is on IRC right now!
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[07:29] <freeflying> do u have a presentation for edgy, there will be a release party next week in Beijing
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[09:46] <mhb_> good morning
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[09:49] <Hobbsee> hey mhb_ 
[09:49] <danimo> moins!
=== danimo yawns
[09:50] <Hobbsee> heya danimo 
[09:51] <mhb_> sorry that I'm twice here but I have some trouble getting to my server (note: never buy D-Link modems again)
[09:53] <Hobbsee> hehe
[09:53] <Hobbsee> dlinks should be good
=== Hobbsee has a dlink wifi card
[09:54] <Hobbsee> mhb_: i doubt its' a problem
[09:54] <danimo> dlink is the root of all evil (tm)
[09:54] <mhb_> Hobbsee: the modems are dropping ssh connections randomly
[09:54] <Hobbsee> ah
[09:54] <Hobbsee> danimo: nooo!  marvell is.
[09:55] <Hobbsee> danimo: my dlink card works without fail, without ndiswrapper pain.  i'll not hear a work against dlink.
[09:55] <Hobbsee> :P
[09:55] <mhb_> Hobbsee: they had trouble because they use linux in their router/modems but they refused to release the source code (IIRC)
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[10:04] <Hobbsee> mhb_: ahhh
[10:05] <imbrandon> heya Hobbsee, moins el
[10:05] <imbrandon> and *
[10:05] <imbrandon> very stormy here
[10:05] <Hobbsee> hi imbrandon!  got the new amarok done yet?
[10:05] <imbrandon> its compiling on ppc now
[10:05] <el> moin imbrandon, moin Hobbsee :)
[10:06] <imbrandon> but amd64 and i386 yea
[10:06] <Hobbsee> hey el!
[10:06] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: nice :)
=== el is soo tired.... *yawn*
[10:06] <el> coffee!
[10:06] <imbrandon> i cant give it out just yet though Hobbsee shhhhhhh
[10:06] <imbrandon> el, yea coffee !!!
[10:06] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: yeah, fair enough
=== Hobbsee would test it, but her sound is playing up again
[10:07] <imbrandon> Hobbsee, wel i can give it to you , but you know what i mean heh
[10:07] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: yeah.  it cant leak
[10:07] <imbrandon> "generaly"
=== Hobbsee wonders why some guy in #kubuntu has /queried her, and appears to want to chat
[10:08] <imbrandon> sides its not like you dont have access to the same tarball as I :)
=== Hobbsee only wrote 1 thing in #kubuntu in hte last hour or so!
[10:08] <Hobbsee> true
[10:08] <imbrandon> man its storming pretty good here
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[10:13] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: so we can expect you to vanish as you lose power?
[10:13] <imbrandon> i hope not
[10:13] <imbrandon> heh
[10:14] <imbrandon> well my irc client is on an ups, but that dont help as i wont be able to type lol
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[10:16] <Hobbsee> heh
[10:17] <crimsun> I _love_ sound issues.  *sigh*
[10:17] <Hobbsee> crimsun: hehe.  
[10:18] <imbrandon> heya crimsun
[10:18] <imbrandon> heh i bet
[10:23] <danimo> 29GB of Ubuntu mirrored :)
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[11:04] <two-face> Hi
[11:08] <two-face> what is the way to get always in sync with the devlopment version?
[11:09] <Hobbsee> er, run the development version?
[11:10] <two-face> where do you point to?
[11:10] <two-face> you need to change the sources.list everytime a new dev version starts, don't you?
[11:15] <Hobbsee> yes
[11:15] <Hobbsee> there are chroots and stuff as well, which is useful
[11:15] <Hobbsee> seeing as things tend to break
[11:16] <two-face> do they?
[11:16] <Hobbsee> in developmetn?  of course
[11:17] <Tm_T> b0rkage <3
[11:17] <two-face> it depends how annoying
[11:18] <two-face> Tm_T: <3 ?
[11:18] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: it's already feeling weird to not be running a development version
[11:19] <crimsun> oh don't worry, plenty of bugs abound to make it seem beta still!
[11:20] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: Indeed.
=== hunger is booored. No new debs (== new and exciting ways to screw up my system;-) for days.
[11:20] <imbrandon> Hobbsee, woot " dpkg-deb: building package `amarok' in `../amarok_1.4.4-0ubuntu1_i386.deb'. "
[11:20] <Tm_T> two-face: Heart, you know. ;)
[11:21] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: yay :)
[11:21] <Hobbsee> hunger: i know!  so sad.
[11:21] <two-face> Tm_T: still not getting it :)
[11:21] <imbrandon> hunger, unless you make/break them your self heh
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[11:23] <Tm_T> two-face: Start using 'feisty' repositories from first weeks, and you will soon get it. ;)
[11:26] <two-face> alright
[11:26] <two-face> I'll think about it
[11:26] <hunger> Well, I am optimistic that feisty will become very interesting again;-)
=== hunger is looking forward to the upstartification of the boot process.
[11:27] <Tm_T> Me too
[11:27] <Tm_T> And all that transition breakage. <3
[11:27] <Tm_T> Rebooting like russian roulette.
[11:28] <hunger> Maybe I can even sneak in my cryptodisks script that I try to get into ubuntu since hoary:-)
[11:28] <two-face> what compared to debian unstable?
=== hunger admits being too lazy to push it for edgy with the rewrite for upstart on the horizont.
[11:29] <two-face> s/what/how/
[11:29] <hunger> two-face: debian has no upstart:-) it uses the tried and true sysv-init.
[11:30] <hunger> two-face: debian can only break one init-script or another... upstart can screw up all of them at the same time;-)
[11:30] <two-face> i mean stability
[11:30] <two-face> of the dev version
[11:30] <Tm_T> Should be reasonable, though gcc/xorg transitions might hit in time to time.
[11:30] <hunger> two-face: I got 3 or 4 total screwups following edgy. I used to get the same number on debian unstable.
[11:30] <Tm_T> Right?
[11:31] <hunger> two-face: debian/unstable release cycles are longer... so there is more time inbetween screwups... some people might call that more stable.
[11:31] <two-face> hunger: alright, i'm pondering :p
[11:32] <hunger> two-face: but usually those screwups are pretty easy to fix (in ubuntu and debian), so I am not really worried.
[11:32] <two-face> hunger: i'm a debian dev so I can get along with it
[11:33] <Tm_T> two-face: Nicve. :)
[11:33] <hunger> two-face: I am just a user, here and on debian.
=== Tm_T thinks with more collaboration between disrtos we get better products.
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[11:34] <Tm_T> Hmm, not sure I did choose right words to describe my meaning.
[11:37] <two-face> hunger: so what's better with upstart?
[11:40] <Tm_T> speed++ atleast.
[11:40] <hunger> two-face: It is a different system.
[11:40] <two-face> ok
[11:40] <hunger> two-face: upstart is event-based: It executes scripts in response to events comming in.
[11:40] <two-face> alright
[11:41] <hunger> two-face: Events are things like "sytem-started-to-boot" or successful/unsuccessful execution of startup scripts, heartbeat failures, network connections starting to come in, udev, cron, etc.
[11:42] <hunger> two-face: It promises to unify several distinct systems in a classical unix env into one central service. Should make administration somewhat nicer. And it is supposed to speed up system boot, too.
[11:43] <two-face> interesting thanks
[11:44] <two-face> i'm off now
[11:44] <two-face> bye
[11:45] <hunger> Damn... all the upstart links I had are no longer functional.
[11:47] <cmvo> hunger: http://upstart.ubuntu.com
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[11:59] <Tm_T> Hmh, how deb version comparison was done?
[12:25] <imbrandon> Tm_T, dpkg --compare-versions ?
[12:26] <Tm_T> Hmm, that's the one, but it doesn't seem to work very well.
[12:26] <imbrandon> hows that?
[12:27] <Tm_T> "dpkg --compare-versions 4:3.5.5a-2 > 8:4.5.5-1" should work?
[12:27] <imbrandon> dpkg --compare-versions 3 gt 2 && echo yes, ladies
[12:27] <imbrandon> dpkg --compare-versions 1 gt 2 && echo yes, ladies
[12:27] <Tm_T> Hmm.
[12:27] <Tm_T> gt?
[12:27] <imbrandon> greater than , gt, lt , eq
[12:28] <Tm_T> I see.
[12:29] <Tm_T> Me stupid, I think I did read manual a bit too fast.
[12:30] <imbrandon> lol, nah
[12:30] <Sime> Riddell: did someone just hack dot.kde.org?
[12:30] <imbrandon> Sime, looks normal to me
[12:31] <Sime> imbrandon: try posting.
[12:31] <Sime> imbrandon: replying I mean.
[12:31] <Jucato> hi Sime! congrats on the nice job btw :)
=== Jucato totally forgot about the Dot...
[12:35] <Sime> Jucato: thanks
[12:37] <Sime> I guess Riddell is either sleeping or dead.
[12:37] <Jucato> O_O
[12:37] <Jucato> hopefully just sleeping :)
[12:38] <Tm_T> ...so why these flies then?
=== Tm_T hides
[12:41] <imbrandon> Sime, hrm i posted a reply just now
[12:41] <imbrandon> seems fine also
[12:41] <imbrandon> what are you noticing ?
[12:44] <Sime> from home it works fine, but from here at work...
[12:44] <Sime> I'll try to screenshot it.
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[12:51] <mhb_> Sime: he deserves a rest, I guess
[12:52] <Sime> http://www.simonzone.com/weird_dot.png
[12:52] <Sime> this is what I get when I try to post from work.
[12:53] <imbrandon> sure, thats normal if your not logged in, click <moot>
[12:53] <imbrandon> like it says
[12:53] <kwwii> hehe, nice screenshot
[12:54] <imbrandon> heya kwwii :)
[12:55] <Sime> wtf
[12:55] <Sime> that's considered normal!?
[12:55] <Tm_T> Sime: Well well well, some router + dns hacked. =)
[12:55] <imbrandon> Sime, yes, you need to click <moot> to say your not a bot
[12:56] <Tm_T> imbrandon: ssshht!
[12:56] <Sime> I guess my problem is that it looks too l33t.
[12:57] <Jucato> Sime: I was just wondering if there would be a sort of wiki page explaining the changes made to media/ and / (hidden-root). So far, there have been no questions in IRC, but there are some in the forums (and in dot.kde)
[12:59] <Sime> Jucato: I guess I can write one later today. (unless someone else jumps in before me).
[01:00] <Jucato> Sime: that'd be great! so I'd have something to point to when people ask. right now I point to your blog, but I don't think people would like to see all the discussions there :P
[01:01] <Jucato> btw, I made an ubotu factoid just in case someone asks about it.
[01:01] <Jucato> !hidden
[01:01] <ubotu> Kubuntu Edgy has implemented a new feature that hides most of the filesystem. To view them, go to / (root) and select "Show hidden files" in the View menu. To change which directories are hidden, you can edit "/etc/kubuntu-default-settings/hidden-root" and remove the names of directories you want to make visible again. For more info: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuKDEMedia and http://www.kdedevelopers.org/node/2231
[01:01] <Jucato> it's !hidden and !hidden-root
[01:01] <imbrandon> they should edit the symlink not the actualy file
[01:01] <imbrandon> incase it changes
[01:02] <Jucato> ah ok. so edit /.hidden instead?
[01:02] <imbrandon> yes
[01:02] <Jucato> ok I'll edit
[01:02] <Sime> it's it the file itself?? and not the symlink?
[01:02] <imbrandon> symlinks are subject to change, and later might be setup in alternatives
[01:02] <imbrandon> e.g. sudo nano /.hidden
[01:03] <imbrandon> so if we cahnge the location of the file its not a big deal
[01:03] <Jucato> ah. that's logical :)
[01:03] <Sime> ok, as long as people don't delete the symlink; It will came back in a later update. The file is a config file though.
[01:03] <imbrandon> i plan on adding an alternative option for it in feisty
[01:03] <imbrandon> right if they want it blank they should just empty the file, not delete it
[01:04] <imbrandon> but i'm working on right now a laternatives for all the "oposers" to change via "sudo update-alternatives showhidden" etc etc etc via feisty
[01:05] <Jucato> lol
[01:05] <Jucato> "oposers" :)
[01:05] <Jucato> that'd be great :)
[01:05] <imbrandon> no actualy it would suck ass , its a loud minority, those that think they know better by mounting via hand to /mnt not the recomended way via /media
[01:06] <imbrandon> but anyhow i'm not getting into that
[01:06] <Jucato> imbrandon: shoud I add a "do not delete the file" statement, too?
[01:06] <Jucato> well, like I said before, the loudest people are the ones who complain :)
[01:06] <imbrandon> Jucato, why ? anyone that has a need to edit the file has the understanding to not delete it, thats my whole popint, new users shouldent be editing it
[01:07] <imbrandon> Jucato, yes and its those that you quickly scold and tell to shut the fuck up
[01:07] <Jucato> well, some people who have had experienced this new feature tell to delete the file
[01:08] <imbrandon> then they are the ones prone to break their system by editing things they need not
[01:08] <imbrandon> you will never teach those people
[01:08] <Sime> I think that the complaining will die down quite quickly. I was expecting worse...
[01:09] <Jucato> yeah... anyway I'm leaving the factoid as it is. just edited the part about editing /.hidden
[01:09] <imbrandon> actualy i have seen alot of good responses on dot.kde.org, very very very few complain
[01:09] <Jucato> Sime: actually me too. I'm quite surprised no one has been complaining in IRC yet
[01:09] <imbrandon> Jucato, why are you suprised, like i said it affects very few people 
[01:09] <Jucato> most of the complaints are coming from imbrandon's favorite online place :)
[01:10] <imbrandon> a few corner cases
[01:10] <imbrandon> exactly, now see why i hate that bane of the internet?
[01:10] <Jucato> specially those who keep on mounting stuff at /mnt :P
[01:10] <Sime> for such a big visual change, it has been well received, and understood by most people.
[01:10] <Jucato> or maybe some haven't even noticed... they're probably used to direct "kdesu kate /foo" or "sudo nano /foo"
[01:11] <mhb_> Sime: is it documented on the wiki already?
[01:11] <mhb_> Sime: some FAQ about it?
[01:11] <imbrandon> Jucato, and as i have said many times, the way to "fix" the problem is not to tell them how to edit the file or weather to delete it or not, its to fucking inform them MOUNT THE SHIT IN THE RIGHT PLACE :)
[01:11] <imbrandon> heheh
[01:11] <mhb_> imbrandon: we should provide some FAQ which we could point to
[01:11] <Jucato> imbrandon: yeah. (although I don't know the difference between mounting in /mnt and /media)....
[01:11] <imbrandon> mhb a faq about how to mount drives?
[01:11] <Jucato> mhb_: Sime said he'd be making a wiki
[01:12] <imbrandon> Jucato, /mnt is the old old way 
[01:12] <Sime> mhb_: read the irc backlog (if you've got it :-) )
[01:12] <mhb_> imbrandon: no, the other one
[01:12] <mhb_> Sime: yeah, but not accessible today
[01:12] <mhb_> imbrandon: the thing Sime is making, if I understand correctly
[01:13] <mhb_> imbrandon: good then :o)
[01:13] <Sime> ..unless someone beats me to it. ;-)
[01:13] <Sime> hint hint
[01:13] <imbrandon> mhb , yes i knew what you ment, i was being sarcastic in that i feel its a waiste of time , better spent informing the loud minority of abusers to do things the right way
[01:14] <mhb_> imbrandon: if you point the minority to a FAQ you waste even less time
[01:14] <mhb_> imbrandon: that's what I meant
[01:14] <Jucato> that's why I made the factoid :P
[01:14] <Jucato> I'd hate having to argue/talk abut it
[01:14] <imbrandon> mhb that solves nothing, becouse in the long run they will still mount /mnt and complain they have to edit the /.hidden
[01:15] <Jucato> btw, I tested editing /.hidden to show /mnt again, and it works in Amarok's Build Collection. got to remember to reply to that thread...
[01:15] <imbrandon> btw , yea please reply to it telling the user to mount his partition in /media like it should be
[01:15] <imbrandon> Jucato, ^
[01:16] <imbrandon> thats the correct "fix"
[01:16] <Jucato> will do :)
[01:17] <mhb_> imbrandon: well they will, but we don't need to repeat 1000times why Kubuntu is like this and like that
[01:18] <imbrandon> short term fix will bite you in the long run, not good, point them to a faq about mounting partitions
[01:19] <mhb_> imbrandon: didn't mean the mounting partitions thing but the /.hidden stuff
[01:19] <mhb_> imbrandon: before Sime decided to make a page (or so I understood) there was almost nothing about it
[01:19] <mhb_> AFAIK
[01:19] <imbrandon> mhb .hidden only seems to need to be explained to idiots that comlain about stuff in /mnt thus the "root" of the problem
[01:19] <Jucato> mhb_: there was, but in Sime's blog
[01:20] <imbrandon> mhb no there are 2 very comprehensive pages about the changes
[01:20] <imbrandon> for those that want the "details" just for the sake of details
[01:20] <imbrandon> those that need it "explained" are becouse they are mounting the wrong way
[01:20] <Jucato> imbrandon: actually another "complaint" about it is implementing/hiding features without informing users, or just plainly hinding things...
[01:21] <imbrandon> Jucato, so to install digikam by default we need to get every users concent? that makes no sense and is just a gripe Jucato
[01:21] <Jucato> imbrandon: I think what mhb_ is looking for (which I'm probably looking for, too) is a doc that explains why it was done, how it was done, and how to get around it
[01:22] <Jucato> imbrandon: of course not. at least something telling them that this was done. there was no mention of it anywhere in any of the release notes
[01:22] <imbrandon> Jucato, sure then make one on why libnjb is compiled into amarok in edgy, why digikam is installed by default ..... want me to go on?
[01:23] <Jucato> um... those are probably not as "controversial" or "big" as this one... but ok... I'll stop...
[01:23] <imbrandon> Jucato, basicly becouse its a non-issue that a few ( 3 or 4 ) users are comlaining about becosue they are doing sometihng wrong, why would a simple change need a pressrelease
[01:23] <imbrandon> yes they are, they are just as "contriversial" as any other non-issue
[01:24] <imbrandon> it just dosent effect the "moaners" , but you wont beleave how many people bitch about extra libs installed that they dont use
[01:24] <mhb_> imbrandon: at least 10+ users complained about it when I asked them in my blog (in Czech)
[01:24] <mhb_> imbrandon: I think you're telling everyone to STFU which is not very Ubuntu-ish :o)) (no offence)
[01:24] <imbrandon> mhb , nice 10+ out of 12 million plus installs , very very very small percentage, thus my non-issue stance
[01:25] <imbrandon> i'm not telling everyone to STFU, i'm telling you to let them know how to fix it the "correct way" not some half baked hot-fix
[01:25] <mhb_> imbrandon: point me to a page where it is described which file in /etc you should change for disabling the /.hidden
[01:25] <mhb_> imbrandon: please
[01:26] <imbrandon> mhb there isnt one, nor there needs to be, point me to a page describing how to get rid of libnjb from amarok becouse i dont have a nomad player
[01:26] <imbrandon> see my point ?
[01:26] <mhb_> imbrandon: doesn't affect everyone, thus I can't
[01:26] <mhb_> imbrandon: there should be one
[01:27] <imbrandon> mhb and .hidden dosent effect everyone either, only those whom mount things wrong
[01:27] <mhb_> imbrandon: or like things not hidden
[01:27] <imbrandon> sure, then  its simply sudo nano /.hidden, why a faq for one command ?
[01:28] <imbrandon> i garentee someone that dosent "like" more libs installed cant run one command
[01:29] <mhb_> imbrandon: we should describe why we did this, how we did this and how to get rid of that (and why deleting /.hidden is not a good fix)
[01:29] <mhb_> imbrandon: yes, most of that is in Sime's blog, but that's no official doc
[01:31] <imbrandon> mhb not really, i dont think its worth the time spent on it, name a good reason ?
[01:31] <mhb_> imbrandon: how should I know rm /.hidden is a bad fix?
[01:31] <imbrandon> why shoudl i explain that any more than including libnjb
[01:32] <imbrandon> mhb if you have any reason to rm .hidden then you know that symlinks arent the real file
[01:32] <Jucato> "why did we hide the filesystem?"
[01:32] <imbrandon> if you dont know that then you should really be thinking about why you need .hidden gone
[01:32] <allee> imbrandon: as long as the .hidden is not to en/disable like dot-file in file dialog and konqueror, it's a usability bug that need to be fixed.  It's not about your/my taste, refering people to command line is not a fix, otherwise you can argue KDE away in favour of the shell ;)
[01:32] <imbrandon> allee, it is, "show hidden files"
[01:33] <mhb_> allee: it's not a bug, imbrandon is right about that
[01:33] <allee> oh, isn't this for dot-files.
[01:33] <kwwii> ahhh, features and power-users
[01:33] <mhb_> allee: but he will have to explain it 100 times
[01:33] <imbrandon> allee, .hidden and dot files can both be shown
[01:33] <mhb_> allee: and he's quite happy about it :o) 
[01:33] <Jucato> kwwii: hehehe :)
[01:34] <imbrandon> mhb no i wont thats where your wrong, the only ones that ask have another root problem or are trolling is what i'm getting at
[01:34] <imbrandon> fix the root problem and ignore the trolls
[01:34] <allee> mhb_: explaining it 100 times is no problem ;)  We had/have to do it for sudo still ;)
[01:34] <imbrandon> allee, exactly
[01:35] <imbrandon> moins kwwii
[01:35] <mhb_> kwwii: hi
[01:36] <kwwii> hi mhb_
[01:36] <mhb_> imbrandon: if you insist :o) after all,it's your temper, not mine :o)
[01:36] <mhb_> imbrandon: I'll write a FAQ for the Czech users at least :o) 
[01:37] <imbrandon> mhb :)
[01:37] <imbrandon> and i will get back to writing a kcontrol module to edit the .hidden and informing users to MOUNT IN THE CORRECT PLACE
[01:37] <Jucato> mhb_: and Sime will still try to write a wiki probably :)
[01:38] <imbrandon> faq == short term , bite you with more questions .... other fixes the issue
[01:38] <Jucato> imbrandon: ooh.. kcontrol module? nice :)
[01:38] <mhb_> imbrandon: hm, I wanted to do that, but Riddell said it would not likely be accepted ... interesting
[01:40] <mhb_> imbrandon: but if you have this blessing I support you all the way :o)
[01:40] <mhb_> s/this/his
[01:41] <imbrandon> i wasent aware anyone needed blessing from Riddell to work on a project ? dont get me wrong Riddell is the man but ummmm .... i dont quite understand your statement
[01:42] <imbrandon> if i do it and its not in "official" kubuntu thats one thing, but ummm that dosent stop anything hehe
[01:42] <mhb_> imbrandon: that's what I meant :o)
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[01:43] <imbrandon> mhb , well not to take anything away from Riddell as he has the final say on what is or isnt in kubuntu but there are many , including me and you and kwwii and allee and Hobbsee and coutless others that work on things :)
[01:44] <imbrandon> some make it in , many others do not, but that dosent stop anyone or anything :)
[01:44] <mhb_> imbrandon: I just tend to ask around before starting anything
[01:45] <mhb_> imbrandon: that's my way, if you want to do something just for yourself you can, of course :o)
[01:45] <mhb_> imbrandon: I don't criticise you, I just remembered I asked Riddell about it ... nothing more
[01:45] <imbrandon> hehe i know
[01:45] <imbrandon> :)
[01:46] <imbrandon> mhb as you well know ( and many others ) i get "excited" easy , take it with some salt , its all good in the hood
[01:47] <mhb_> imbrandon: ok :o) keep on doing whatever you like, that's the best way
[01:49] <imbrandon> kwwii, http://federation.imbrandon.com/ss113.png <--- we going to try again to get Riddell to sucum to the kmenu in my screenshot ?
[01:49] <imbrandon> ( at mountain view hehe )
[01:50] <Tm_T> imbrandon: Aaah, oxygen!
[01:50] <imbrandon> Tm_T, yes oxygen :)
=== Riddell likes default kmenu
[01:52] <kwwii> hehe
[01:52] <imbrandon> hehe moins Riddell
[01:52] <Tm_T> What is default kmenu?
[01:52] <kwwii> hi Riddell
[01:52] <imbrandon> Riddell, but you cant blame me for trying
=== Tm_T can't remember
=== allee feels honoured that imbrandon mentioned him, considering allee's inactively the last months
[01:56] <kwwii> I think that the problem with using the kubuntu logo there is that it does not visually tell me that it is a menu
[01:57] <kwwii> I think the kde logo has the same problem though
[01:57] <mhb_> kwwii: that's what I wanted to say
[01:57] <imbrandon> kwwii, yea 
[01:57] <mhb_> kwwii: is it going to change in O. ?
[01:57] <mhb_> (the K menu icon)
[01:58] <kwwii> no idea
[01:58] <Hobbsee> morning Riddell 
[02:00] <mhb_> Riddell: your biggest fan welcomes you :o)
[02:01] <Hobbsee> mhb_: if that was in reference to me....
[02:02] <Hobbsee> then i will *certainly* use my long pointy stick of doom on you.
[02:02] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: that icon is very dark.  lighter, and it would be good.
[02:03] <imbrandon> i just took the orig and shrinked it, but yea
[02:03] <Jucato> imbrandon: me likey :)
[02:04] <mhb_> Hobbsee: nope
[02:04] <Hobbsee> mhb_: oh good.
[02:04] <mhb_> Hobbsee: don't you know I'm his biggest fan? :o)
[02:04] <Hobbsee> ah
[02:04] <Jucato> but kwwii's right about it not looking like a menu/button :)
=== Hobbsee has already had enough rubbish in #ubuntu-devel for her patience level to be down
[02:05] <kwwii> hehe
=== Hobbsee goes off to do the dishes.
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[03:24] <bddebian> Howdy
[03:24] <Hobbsee> BOO!
[03:25] <bddebian> aaahh
[03:25] <bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
[03:26] <Hobbsee> hehehe
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[03:44] <Tm_T> Hi Hobbsee.
[03:45] <Hobbsee> hey Tm_T :)
[03:46] <Hobbsee> goldenear: kontact is in kdepim
[03:46] <goldenear> ?
[03:47] <Hobbsee> goldenear: the bug report you just filed?
[03:47] <goldenear> ah ok...
=== Hobbsee fixed it
[03:47] <Hobbsee> goldenear: (yes, i'm omnipresent, so know that you just filed a bug, and what it contains :P)
[03:48] <goldenear> launch pad propose me to fill the bug in kontact package after a search... but kdepim it ok :)
[03:48] <goldenear> Hobbsee: are you a goddess or something ?
[03:48] <goldenear> ;)
[03:48] <Hobbsee> goldenear: indeed.  well, so people say.
[03:49] <goldenear> and How many bugs do we have to sacrify to make you happy ? :D
[03:49] <mhb_> Hobbsee: the goddess of hope, the goddess of brown, the goddess of all that you've burned to the ground ... (can't help myself)
[03:50] <Hobbsee> goldenear: to sacrify?  to fix, more like it!
[03:50] <Hobbsee> goldenear: all of them :P
[03:50] <Hobbsee> mhb_: why the goddess of brown?  last i knew, i wasnt the goddess of ubuntu
[03:51] <mhb_> Hobbsee: it's a song nobody knows
[03:51] <Hobbsee> ahh
[03:53] <goldenear> [15:47]  * Hobbsee fixed it <-- you mean you've already fix the bug or only the lauchpad entry ?
[03:53] <Hobbsee> goldenear: i fixed the LP entry.
[03:53] <Hobbsee> goldenear: i dont fix things in kdepim :P
[03:55] <Tm_T> =)
[03:55] <goldenear> you're not a very powerfull goddess then :p
=== Tm_T hides
[03:55] <Tm_T> Hide are sharp objects!
[03:56] <Tm_T> s/are/all/
[03:56] <Tm_T> =)
[03:56] <Tm_T> !away
[03:56] <ubotu> Please don't use public away messages or change your nick to 'someone|away'.  We know you're away when you don't respond to messages. Also see !guidelines
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[03:58] <Tm_T> =)
[03:58] <Tm_T> I forgot how funny it can be under medication.
[03:58] <Tm_T> Oh well, fixing my back. ->
=== Hobbsee whinges over not having irssi installed on the live cd.
[04:07] <Hobbsee> oh yeah, guess we do have konvi
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[04:14] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: Unusable when you have problems with X though.
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[04:22] <Hobbsee_> Tm_T: true that
[04:22] <Hobbsee> hmmm.  i wonder if knetworkmanager just doesnt work on the live cd at all
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[04:35] <Sime> concerning that "Hidden Files" wiki page that I'm supposed to be writing. What should it be linked from?
[04:37] <jucato> hm...
[04:37] <jucato> no response :)
[04:38] <mhb_> Sime: some release notes, I guess
[04:38] <mhb_> Sime: or What's New (if there is such a page)
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[04:52] <MidMark> is there a chance for that error? -> http://img162.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscf0569qy1.jpg
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[04:53] <Hobbsee> MidMark: that's not an error
[04:53] <Sime> mhb_: it is not very clear where it should go.
[04:53] <Hobbsee> MidMark: well, what are you meaning is an error?
[04:53] <MidMark> Hobbsee: but a friend of mine cannot boot edgy
[04:53] <MidMark> and this is the screenshot with nosplah flag
[04:53] <Hobbsee> MidMark: that's booted, and dropped into a virtual terminal.
[04:54] <nixternal> moins
=== Hobbsee notes that that's intended behaviour, for a boot with nosplash.
[04:54] <Hobbsee> or do you get an X when you boot with nosplash?
[04:54] <Hobbsee> i didnt think so
[04:54] <MidMark> I don't know
[04:54] <MidMark> nosplash should give X or not?
[04:54] <Hobbsee> it doesnt usually, last i checked
[04:55] <MidMark> so how can I check for errors during boot?
[04:55] <MidMark> which flags?
[04:55] <MidMark> because live cd freeze
[04:55] <Hobbsee> check /var/log/syslog
[04:55] <MidMark> how can I do if it freeze?
[04:55] <Hobbsee> and boot in recovery mode
[04:55] <Hobbsee> it should automatically get written to.
[04:56] <Hobbsee> i think alt+a+sys req or something forces it to write to the file
[04:56] <MidMark> recovery mode=safe graphic?
[04:57] <Hobbsee> recovery mode = no graphics
[04:58] <MidMark> I need the parameter that tell me how to boot a live cd but ONLY without splash screen, just to see error
[04:59] <Hobbsee> oh, a live cd..
[04:59] <Hobbsee> yeah, try safe graphics
[04:59] <MidMark> ok
=== Hobbsee keeps forgetting that the cds dont have a diagnostic mode per se, anymore
[05:00] <MidMark> it's a shame that kubuntu doesn't let to just hit ESC and see what is printed by kernel and other stuff
[05:00] <MidMark> it's a painful to understand why it's freezing
[05:01] <jucato> I thought pressing Ctrl+Alt+F1 will let you see the boot process, even with USplash running? iirc...
=== Hobbsee beds
[05:01] <Hobbsee> jucato: not anymore, particualrly
[05:01] <jucato> night Hobbsee!
[05:01] <jucato> aw...
[05:01] <jucato> :(
[05:01] <Hobbsee> and there is something that gives a semi-verbose mode
[05:01] <Hobbsee> or something
=== Hobbsee doesnt remember at this time of night
[05:01] <MidMark> ok thanx
[05:02] <mhb_> Sime: do you have it ready?
[05:02] <Sime> mhb_: I was working on it. :)
[05:02] <mhb_> Sime: the wiki page, I mean
[05:02] <Sime> I was writing the text here first.
[05:03] <mhb_> Sime: oh, ok
[05:09] <MidMark> buys how can I check errors printed on boot if boot freeze?
[05:11] <mhb_> MidMark: if you boot the Recovery mode you should see them right away
[05:12] <MidMark> I'm in a live cd, what is revocery mode for you?
[05:12] <MidMark> safe graphics?
[05:13] <mhb_> one moment
[05:21] <mhb_> MidMark: not safe graphics
[05:21] <MidMark> so what?
[05:22] <MidMark> how can I access to recovery mode?
[05:23] <mhb_> MidMark: got it :o)
[05:23] <mhb_> MidMark: choose other options
[05:23] <mhb_> MidMark: F6 I think
[05:23] <MidMark> ok
[05:24] <mhb_> MidMark: then remove the "quiet" option and the "splash" option and add "nosplash"
[05:24] <Sime> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuHiddenFiles
[05:24] <Sime> mhb_: ping
[05:24] <mhb_> Sime: great, thanks
[05:24] <mhb_> Sime: I appreciate both the fix and the wiki
[05:25] <MidMark> thx
[05:26] <mhb_> Sime: someone noted that this may not be in accordance with the FHS ... was that problem resolved?
[05:27] <Sime> mhb_: why would it be a problem? having a file in / ?
[05:27] <imbrandon> hum anyone know whom John Tapsell is ?
[05:27] <mhb_> Sime: I think it was fdoving ... yes, having a "special" file in /
[05:28] <mhb_> Sime: quote: " Applications must never create or require special files or subdirectories in
[05:28] <mhb_> enough flexibility for any package.
[05:28] <mhb_> "
[05:28] <mhb_> the root directory. Other locations in the FHS hierarchy provide more than
[05:28] <mhb_> and sorry about the "\n"s
[05:28] <Sime> mhb_: I don't think the FHS applies to this case.
[05:28] <imbrandon> that was solved when it moved to /etc/ and symlinked wasent it
[05:29] <mhb_> imbrandon: well symlink is a "special" file, AFAIK
[05:29] <Sime> I don't think the FHS people has this in mind when they thought that rule up.
[05:29] <Sime> it is not created by an application either.
[05:29] <Sime> nor is it required.
[05:30] <Jucato> but aren't there also a vmlinuz and a initrd.img symlink in /
[05:30] <Sime> can someone link that page in somewhere.
[05:30] <mhb_> Sime: dpkg can be considered an application :o) 
[05:30] <Sime> Jucato: yeah, I saw that too. :-/
[05:30] <mhb_> Sime: http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.txt.gz
[05:31] <Jucato> Sime: is it ok if I use that wiki for the bot factoid?
[05:31] <mhb_> Sime: but I agree, it's no big deal
[05:31] <Sime> Jucato: doesn't worry me.
[05:33] <Jucato> !hidden
[05:33] <ubotu> Kubuntu Edgy has implemented a new feature that hides most of the filesystem. For more information: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuHiddenFiles
[05:33] <Jucato> now it looks shorter :D
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[05:49] <MidMark> mhb_: ok, it hangs here -> http://img312.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscf0572gs6.jpg
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[06:02] <fdoving> gah.. another bug with the .hidden stuff.
[06:02] <Jucato> ??
[06:02] <Sime> fdoving: what's up?
[06:03] <Jucato> what's the bug this time? :)
[06:03] <fdoving> Sime: open the konq in file manager mode, press F9 to get the sidebar choose root directory (red folder)
[06:04] <fdoving> even with hidden files shown you will only have /home and /media in the directory tree.
[06:04] <fdoving> that sucks.
[06:04] <Jucato> er yeah...
[06:04] <Jucato> confirmed
[06:05] <Sime> yeah, konq sidebar doesn't understand hidden.
[06:05] <fdoving> i must admit this feature is not on my top 10 features in edgy list.
[06:06] <Jucato> btw, CD icons on the desktop no longer show the name/label of the CD, just cdrom0 or cdrom1
[06:06] <Jucato> dunno if that's a feature or a bug...
[06:07] <fdoving> Sime: I edited the https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuHiddenFiles page a little. Added GTK section + small fixes, don't know if all are to the better. please take a look.
[06:08] <Sime> looks fine
[06:09] <Jucato> (that borker guy is making a lot of noise about this...)
[06:11] <fdoving> I can only agree with people complaining about this feature.
[06:11] <Jucato> excuse me Sime, I'm just curious if Launch Feedback was accidentally left out of System Settings?
[06:12] <Sime> you'll have to ask El about that.
[06:12] <Jucato> ah ok
[06:12] <Jucato> dang she just left...
[06:16] <mhb_> MidMark: I'll take a look
[06:17] <MidMark> mhb_: thanx a lot
[06:18] <mhb_> MidMark: hm, so kernel booted fine ...
[06:18] <mhb_> MidMark: did you check the CD for errors?
[06:18] <MidMark> no I can check
[06:19] <mhb_> MidMark: /etc/rc.local should be empty, at least it's empty on the installed Kubuntu system
[06:19] <MidMark> and on live cd?
[06:20] <mhb_> MidMark: I guess as well, this is a weird freeze point, better check the CD first
[06:22] <MidMark> ok
[06:31] <MidMark> mhb_: pressing enter after the rc.local it shows the command prompt
[06:32] <MidMark> X problem?
[06:32] <MidMark> now I'm checking the cd
[06:32] <mhb_> MidMark: could be an X problem
[06:35] <MidMark> then starting with startx will show the errors?
[06:35] <nixternal> Riddell: ping?
[06:35] <mhb_> MidMark: exactly
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[07:02] <Pupeno_> Hello.
[07:04] <MidMark> mhb_: seems X -> http://img56.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscf0577go8.jpg
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[07:06] <Mez> who wa it who does the newsletter ?
[07:07] <fdoving> ubuntu weekly? 
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[07:12] <Pupeno_> Sorry for the off-topic, but doesn't anybody know of a workarround to install on a reiserfs partition using Kubuntu Edgy (Dapper just worked) ? I've created the partitions by hand (cfdisk) but choosing to install in them makes the install complaint about "No root filesystem".
[07:17] <fdoving> are you using the alternate cd? 
[07:24] <Pupeno_> fdoving: no.
[07:25] <fdoving> not sure if installing to reiser is supported by the live/desktop cd.
[07:26] <Pupeno_> fdoving: I know it isn't, but the limitation is due to be able to make the partitions, not being unable to mount them or copy files into it. I have already made the partitions and the filesystem by hand, the installer refuses to install.
[07:27] <Pupeno_> Dapper just worked there.
[07:30] <nixternal> firefox front page bug 65685
[07:30] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 65685 in kubuntu-docs ""About Kubuntu" missing "wonderful-linux.html"" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/65685
[07:30] <nixternal> that isn't a kubuntu-docs issue, that is an /etc/alternatives issue
[07:31] <nixternal> what package deals with the etc/alt and the firefox homepage?
[07:43] <nixternal> nm, found it
[07:43] <fdoving> kubuntu-docs :)
[07:49] <nixternal> easiest fix would be to create a link in the ubuntu-artwork/home directory to the wonderful-linux.html file in /usr/share/doc/kde/HTML/en/kubuntu/about-kubuntu/ direcotry
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[07:57] <fdoving> isn't it easier to change the url in the postinst script to file:///usr/share/doc/kde/HTML/en/kubuntu/about-kubuntu/index.html ? 
[07:57] <nixternal> that is how it should be
[07:58] <fdoving> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 59 2006-10-27 00:55 firefox-homepage -> /usr/share/doc/kde/HTML/en/kubuntu/about-kubuntu/index.html
[07:58] <fdoving> in my /etc/alternatives
[08:03] <fdoving> ah.
[08:03] <nixternal> ya
[08:03] <fdoving> now i understand.
[08:03] <nixternal> hehe
[08:04] <nixternal> it took me a second as well...
[08:04] <nixternal> but if there is going to be links, there needs to either be more than 1, or they set the homepage to read directly from the doc dir
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[08:05] <nixternal> the 2 pita bugs have been linked to /etc/alternatives (usplash and firefox homepage)...that is part of the reason i can't stand /etc/alternatives..it is turning into a nightmare
[08:05] <fdoving> relative links will break this way.
[08:06] <fdoving> there is also a hackish alternative, i tend to use when i make homepages. forwarding with html-refresh.
[08:06] <nixternal> actually, the firefox package probably has a file that sets the homepage to /etc/alternatives
[08:07] <nixternal> that would be a simple "hackish" fix for sure
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[08:14] <fdoving> nixternal: example; http://ubuntu.lnix.net/misc/ffhelp.html.txt
[08:14] <nixternal> ya
[08:15] <fdoving> i think that is as good as symlinking the whole dir.
[08:16] <nixternal> well symlinking the whole directory causes the pages to open, but there is no formatting to them
[08:16] <nixternal> so symlinking the entire directory fixes the 404 error, but there is no formatting at all from the css files
=== fdoving votes for the hackish version. 
[08:17] <nixternal> i will leave that one up to Riddell
[08:18] <fdoving> adding it to the package as redirect.html or something. and then link file:///usr/share/ubuntu-artwork/home/index.html to it, instead of /usr/share/doc/kde/HTML/en/kubuntu/about-kubuntu/index.html
[08:18] <nixternal> that would be easy to do
[08:19] <nixternal> and would be the way i would fix this now for edgy, and worry about a "real" fix for feisty
[08:19] <nixternal> which we are already planning on a total documentation rewrite
[08:19] <fdoving> and it would work. No need to make symlink-mania.
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[09:13] <nixternal> Riddell: http://nixternal.ubuntu-rocks.org/kubuntu-docs.debdiff
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[09:17] <Riddell> thanks nixternal 
[09:18] <nixternal> hope that is alright for the debdiff, but no problem...im pretty sure you are swamped right now
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[09:19] <mhb_> Riddell: have you discussed with somone the possibility of translating directory names through a .directory file?
[09:19] <mhb_> Riddell: I just wonder...
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[10:19] <Sime> is anyone using strigi?
[10:22] <fdoving> have it installed.. don't use it much.
[10:22] <Sime> is it any good?
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[10:25] <fdoving> the daemon crashes alot here on powerpc. can't really tell if it is any good. promising.
[10:29] <nixternal> i have messed with strigi and it is a pita
[10:29] <nixternal> it never once worked well for me
[10:29] <nixternal> so i apt-got removed it
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[11:43] <Mez> Riddell: ping
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[11:47] <fdoving> hmm.. so the kubuntu special-upgrade section is removed from EdgyUpgrades ? 
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[12:02] <Mez> anyone around ?
[12:04] <nixternal> physically yes, mentally no
[12:05] <Mez> nixternal, fancy doing some katapult testing ?
[12:05] <nixternal> sure can
[12:05] <nixternal> i would love to have kwrite in katapult ;)
[12:05] <Mez> kwrite in katapult ?
[12:06] <nixternal> yup
[12:06] <Mez> how do you mean ?
[12:06] <nixternal> so when i alt+space, i can type "kwrite" and it would open ;)
[12:06] <Mez> nixternal, and what does it do now 
[12:06] <nixternal> it doesn't recognize kwrite
[12:06] <Mez> do you have a K Menu entry for it ?
[12:06] <nixternal> hrmm
[12:07] <nixternal> nope
[12:07] <nixternal> if it is in kmenu, then it will be in katapult?
[12:07] <Mez> nixternal, it works on K menu entries ;)
[12:07] <nixternal> sweet
[12:07] <Mez> nixternal, you might have to restart katapult, but yes
[12:07] <nixternal> i have been wanting to know, and now i do ;)
[12:12] <nixternal> `woohoo
[12:12] <nixternal> ok, what needs testing?
[12:14] <Mez> you ok to compile or want me to build a .deb?