[12:32] <SimonAnibal> ogra, alive?
[12:33] <ogra> SimonAnibal, appears like, yes :)
[12:33] <SimonAnibal> Heh, Hi, I'm Simon Anibal Ruiz Rolfs, we've interacted on the mailing list before
[12:34] <ogra> highvoltage, how can i help ?
[12:34] <ogra> ergh
[12:34] <SimonAnibal> Corey Burger told me I should hook up with you about AD auth
[12:34] <ogra> hi , how can i help ?
[12:34] <SimonAnibal> You want it badly by Feisty
[12:34] <SimonAnibal> I want it badly by Feisty
[12:34] <ogra> me too
[12:34] <SimonAnibal> See, I'm the only high school implementation of Ubuntu in the United States
[12:35] <SimonAnibal> As far as Richard Weideman knows
[12:35] <ogra> i invited the smbladp upstream developers to mountainview to the conference (actually we're just sitting on the same table at the ltsp conference here)
[12:35] <SimonAnibal> We have 279 workstations
[12:35] <SimonAnibal> and need this piece very soon, especially in the wake of the Novell Microsoft announcement
[12:36] <SimonAnibal> Which is to say
[12:36] <ogra> the plan is to integrate what they have built into edubuntu, pop a gui on top and rip out the gnome users-admin from the server install
[12:36] <ogra> smbldap is widely used in edu distros i.e. K12LTSP
[12:36] <SimonAnibal> If I can't deliver AD integration, I may not be able to keep Ubuntu here
[12:36] <SimonAnibal> And I don't want that to happen
[12:36] <ogra> its a proven well working setup ...
[12:36] <SimonAnibal> That's good, the main piece we need, though, is the client side
[12:36] <Burgwork> issue is, SimonAnibal doesn't control the server
[12:37] <SimonAnibal> In the U.S. the server side isn't going to matter
[12:37] <SimonAnibal> at least strategically right now
[12:37] <ogra> and you apparentl need it with edgy 
[12:37] <SimonAnibal> I'd like to get it up and running ASAP
[12:37] <SimonAnibal> And I can be your real world test case
[12:37] <SimonAnibal> My experience can help smooth out the rough areas
[12:38] <ogra> then i'm likely the wrong guy to talk to, ajmitch implemeted it in edgy but didnt finish it off, i know it works but needs maual work of the admin
[12:38] <SimonAnibal> That's fine, and that's the first step
[12:38] <SimonAnibal> A good, solid HOWTO is the first step
[12:38] <SimonAnibal> I can work with a HowTo myself
[12:39] <SimonAnibal> and implement it
[12:39] <SimonAnibal> and then I can help solidify that HOWTO into a gui or something
[12:39] <ogra> right, try to get hold of ajmitch, he should be able to point you to the right docs or help you out answering support questions
[12:39] <SimonAnibal> awesome
[12:39] <ogra> :)
[12:40] <ogra> in feisty we'll hopefully have both (server and client) basically integrated in edubuntu ... 
[12:40] <SimonAnibal> ajmitch, Get a hold of me, I'll start hanging out in here on top of my other places or you can email me at sruiz@mccsc.edu I need your expertise and documents on Active Directory integration from the client side
[12:41] <SimonAnibal> Cool
[12:41] <SimonAnibal> So talk to me about what's going on with Edubuntu and Ubuntu-Education
[12:41] <SimonAnibal> I notice you're not in #ubuntu-education, and I don't remember you being on the ubuntu-education mailing list
[12:41] <SimonAnibal> are we separate projects?
[12:42] <ogra> there yre many many overlaps ... but RichEd made them distinct projects  since people also use ubuntu in education 
[12:42] <ogra> s/yre/are/
[12:43] <SimonAnibal> So, then, what is Edubuntu if not Ubuntu taylored for Education?
[12:44] <Burgwork> that is a fun distinction
[12:44] <Burgwork> I disagree with the breakup as RichEd laid it down
[12:45] <SimonAnibal> I wouldn't mind a little enlightenment, if you have the time
[12:45] <SimonAnibal> I don't mind working with both projects if they both fit my goals
[12:45] <ogra> Burgwork, ++
[12:46] <ogra> but now its in place
[12:46] <Burgwork> it is not laid in the sand
[12:46] <ogra> so lets make the best out of it :)
[12:46] <SimonAnibal> As far as I understood it, wasn't that going to be under discussion at Mountain View?
[12:47] <ogra> my hope is that edubuntu gets lots of input from the ubuntu-education side so we can in the end provide everything thats needed everywhere in edubuntu
[12:47] <ogra> and dont need the distinction anymore
[12:47] <Burgwork> I  think RichEd sees Edubuntu as merely LTSP
[12:47] <ogra> which is wrong ...
[12:47] <Burgwork> ie: just an implementation
[12:47] <Burgwork> I see Edubuntu as "Ubuntu in Education and all that implies"
[12:47] <ogra> right
[12:47] <SimonAnibal> Well, unfortunately you've both seen me comment that that's what my experience of it has been
[12:47] <ogra> even my personal focus lies in ltsp, its still more than that
[12:48] <SimonAnibal> I think LTSP should be available on all platforms
[12:48] <ogra> ltsp is only a minor part
[12:48] <ogra> it is
[12:48] <Burgwork> it is
[12:48] <Burgwork> bugger :)
[12:48] <SimonAnibal> right, but I mean in practice
[12:48] <Burgwork> you can install LTSP on Ubuntu
[12:49] <SimonAnibal> In practice no other package has it, but Edubuntu
[12:49] <ogra> but edubuntu is the only distro that fully configures a default setup so that even an arts teacher who doesnt know much about computers can use it right away
[12:49] <ogra> in ubuntu and xubuntu you need to do manual setup after install thats the whole difference
[12:49] <SimonAnibal> Right
[12:49] <SimonAnibal> Shouldn't that be available to users of (K)(X)Ubuntu
[12:49] <ogra> we're just talking about http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/LTSPManager/
[12:50] <SimonAnibal> apart from the educational stuff?
[12:50] <ogra> i hope it will be done by feisty
[12:50] <SimonAnibal> cool
[12:50] <ogra> then it doesnt matter on which system you use it 
[12:50] <SimonAnibal> Because the other side is
[12:50] <sbalneav> Edubuntu = ubuntu + ltsp + educational program + educational content + classwork managemtent tools.
[12:50] <SimonAnibal> Not every school WANTS LTSP
[12:50] <ogra> it will be a charm to set up ltsp and maintain it
[12:50] <sbalneav> LTSP's a part, but the educational part puts the edu in edubuntu.
[12:50] <ogra> sbalneav, ++
[12:51] <Burgwork> but edubuntu can also be the standalone pcs
[12:51] <ogra> ltsp was simply the part that wasnt developed yet ...
[12:51] <Burgwork> and when my company gets it act together and releases our multiseat stuff as free software, multiseat
[12:51] <ogra> the main focus for edubuntu will move on
[12:51] <ogra> for feisty its AD 
[12:52] <SimonAnibal> So, I agree with Richard as far as the LTSP part, while important to eduation in third world countries, is not really "educational" technology, and...well, neither is AD for that matter
[12:53] <Burgwork> SimonAnibal: the key thing is not to get hung up on one piece of technology
[12:53] <Burgwork> I think that is where RichEd is stuck as well
[12:53] <SimonAnibal> Heheh
[12:53] <Burgwork> LTSP is one part, currently a large part
[12:53] <SimonAnibal> Well, I guess I don't understand why it's default for Edubuntu, and not a simply option for all is all
[12:53] <ogra> SimonAnibal, edubuntu is about integrating that technologies as well as educational apps ...
[12:54] <ogra> because we oriented on the biggest edu distro which s K12LTSP ...
[12:54] <SimonAnibal> Ahhh....I see
[12:54] <SimonAnibal> it's sort of vestigial, like?
[12:54] <SimonAnibal> Or, ummm, hereditary
[12:55] <ogra> in fact my big hope is to have the K12 community joining us at one point and considering edubuntu as a base for them instead of redhat 
[12:55] <ogra> merging the efforts to become the biggest force 
[12:55] <SimonAnibal> And you're tackling each major technology that'll get us there at a time
[12:55] <ogra> right
[12:56] <SimonAnibal> Ok, well, then, from what you're saying the new era of Edubuntu is exactly where I fit in as far as where you can help me and I can help you
[12:56] <ogra> i'm mostly alone, so i *can* only attack one at a time ;)
[12:56] <SimonAnibal> Well, I'm sorry I misunderstood
[12:56] <SimonAnibal> I am rather new to all of this
[12:57] <SimonAnibal> Which sort of limits my use
[12:57] <ogra> totally not :)
[12:57] <SimonAnibal> And my situation limited me from being of use in the last era of Edubuntu
[12:57] <ogra> your feedback is a valuable contribution already ;)
[12:57] <SimonAnibal> Since using modern machines as LTSP clients wouldn't be very worthwhile
[12:58] <ogra> it would
[12:58] <SimonAnibal> oh?
[12:58] <ogra> LTSP is more than "reusing old hardware"
[12:58] <ogra> lots more
[12:58] <Burgwork> my dream is "Edubuntu cluster"
[12:58] <SimonAnibal> I thought the idea was to pass off processing to something with processor speed
[12:58] <Burgwork> a mix of thin and fat clients, all sharing one giant pool of computing power
[12:58] <ogra> its about maintaining only one centralized server
[12:58] <SimonAnibal> If you already have a 2.4 GHz processor, what's the point?
[12:59] <ogra> you can run a full diskless workstation on that 2ghz cpu
[12:59] <ogra> but without local HD
[12:59] <SimonAnibal> how much network traffic for 297 workstations?
[12:59] <sbalneav> SimonAnibal: Which is more work, maintaining a lab of 40 machines with hard drives, or maintaining one machine that serves 40 diskless thin clients :)
[12:59] <ogra> which means you can do all maintenance locally on the server and all workstations in your network pick it up right away
[01:00] <cbx33> can i view the schedule yet?
[01:00] <cbx33> for uds?
[01:00] <ogra> cbx33, no
[01:00] <cbx33> also, where do I get information about gobby...and ekiga
[01:00] <SimonAnibal> I'm looking at SystemImager as a way to do all the work on one "golden client" and pushing that image out to everyone else
[01:00] <ogra> cbx33, it will be mailed out early enough 
[01:00] <cbx33> Damn it all
[01:00] <cbx33> I want to make sure I can attend the SCP spec
[01:00] <Burgwork> SimonAnibal: I would rather do kickstart
[01:00] <cbx33> I hope it's during time I'm either not travelling or free
[01:01] <ogra> SimonAnibal, thats exactly what ltsp provides you
[01:01] <Burgwork> SimonAnibal: clean installs are better than images
[01:01] <SimonAnibal> Would this require having a DHCP server?
[01:01] <SimonAnibal> And how much network traffic per workstation?
[01:01] <SimonAnibal> those are my main questions
[01:02] <ogra> yes it requires that a dhcp server tells the workstation to boot for a ltsp server
[01:02] <SimonAnibal> then it's already not possible for me
[01:02] <SimonAnibal> our IS department has forbidden DHCP servers
[01:02] <SimonAnibal> They have "jurisdiction" of that
[01:02] <ogra> do they run one ? 
[01:03] <SimonAnibal> They do, and they don't let anyone else mess with it
[01:03] <ogra> thats fine, they just need to set it up the right way :)
[01:04] <SimonAnibal> So, how would the workstations function without a harddisk? NFS?
[01:06] <ogra> they boot from a readonly NFS root on the server
[01:06] <his_dudnes> may i join with an edubuntu/ltsp question?
[01:06] <ogra> then set up tmpfs'es for the files it needs read/writeable in ram
[01:06] <ogra> you can than make it mount /home from a centralized server ... 
[01:07] <ogra> his_dudnes, indeed
[01:07] <SimonAnibal> So, what, it runs everything from memory?
[01:07] <ogra> yep ... as a normal system does as well ...
[01:07] <SimonAnibal> Ok...what happens in the following scenario:
[01:08] <SimonAnibal> It's a beautiful Monday morning and the teachers come in. They flip the switch and 279 workstations all light up at once.
[01:08] <SimonAnibal> on a 100 Mbit network
[01:09] <ogra> you will need gigE for full workstations in that scenario 
[01:09] <ogra> 100 mbit is fine for normal thin clients but not for running fully set up workstations
[01:12] <SimonAnibal> ack
[01:15] <icheyne> what are the system requirements of Edubuntu?
[01:16] <icheyne> recommended requirements - not minimum
[01:16] <icheyne> :)
[01:16] <nixternal> heh, anything greater than the minimum requirements ;)
[01:17] <ogra> lol
[01:17] <ogra> icheyne, for a classroom server or a standalone workstation ?
[01:17] <icheyne> standalone
[01:17] <icheyne> please
[01:17] <ogra> edubuntu provides both
[01:17] <his_dudnes> well i had set an ltsp on mandriva (ltsp 4.1), when time came to migrate to ubuntu, i thought that "apt-get install edubuntu-desktop" would have it all setup out of the box , it wasnt quite so.I edited "/etc/ltsp/dhcp3.conf " and ran ltsp-build-client, I am stuck exactly after the tftp stage of booting, if understand it well in edubuntu tftp doesnt provide the kernel directly it provides an intermediate file with  "pxe" in the file name (i am not now on 
[01:17] <his_dudnes> the server). Sow it never gets past that pxe file.alsow i was wandering wich is the script that updates /etc/hosts etc. the old "ltspcfg" equivalent, if i understoud well the guides, i must not run the old ltspcfg scripts because they are deprecated.I think i am missing something obvius but i cant get pass that point...
[01:18] <nixternal> sorry ogra for that answer..i couldn't come up with anything better
[01:18] <his_dudnes> excuse the flod
[01:18] <icheyne> oh man - got to go
[01:18] <icheyne> bye all
[01:18] <icheyne> :(
[01:18] <ogra> icheyne, for a worstation that same as for ubuntu with ~500MB more diskspace for the educational apps
[01:19] <icheyne> oh?
[01:19] <ogra> *thats
[01:19] <icheyne> same as Ubuntu
[01:19] <ogra> right
[01:19] <icheyne> ok that's great
[01:19] <icheyne> thanks so much
[01:19] <icheyne> :)
[01:19] <icheyne> bye
[01:19] <ogra> edubuntu workstation is ubuntu+edu apps
[01:19] <cbx33> see'yall later
[01:19] <ogra> ciao cbx33 
[01:19] <cbx33> ogra, does the schedule get mailed to everyone?
[01:19] <nixternal> thanks for the warning cbx33 ;)
[01:19] <ogra> cbx33, nope
[01:19] <cbx33> nixternal, what warning ;?
[01:19] <ogra> there will be a notification mail
 see'yall later
[01:20] <cbx33> ah right ok
[01:20] <nixternal> let me know you will be back later ;)
[01:20] <cbx33> heheh
[01:20] <cbx33> ah ha ha :p
[01:20] <ogra> his_dudnes, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPQuickInstall
[01:20] <nixternal> hehe
[01:20] <cbx33> right I'm off....
[01:20] <his_dudnes> thanks ogra
[01:20] <ogra> his_dudnes, oh, sorry that wont help you ... youre beyond setting it up
[01:20] <nixternal> man i wish i was goin' to mtv...damn thy government!
[01:20] <ogra> try running: sudo ltsp-update-kernels 
[01:21] <ogra> sorry, but we have to leave the conference room here ... 
[01:22] <his_dudnes> thanks
[01:22] <ogra> his_dudnes, subscribe to edubuntu-devel and mail the list, i'll answer you there ...
[01:22] <his_dudnes> thanks a lot....
[01:22] <ogra> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel
[01:22] <ogra> ;)
[01:32] <SimonAnibal> I'm obviously having connection problems here
[01:32] <SimonAnibal> ogra, Burgwork: if you read this and can answer my concern at sruiz@mccsc.edu, I'd really appreciate it. I REALLY want to make the best decisions up front for this network, and your expertise would be GREATLY appreciated!
[01:33] <SimonAnibal> ogra, Burgwork: I mean the LAN bandwidth concern
[01:33] <SimonAnibal> I'm cutting out now
[01:33] <SimonAnibal> ciao!
[03:57] <outchy> i have a question about installing edubuntu on a g4 powerbook ... i can't get it to boot from CD and i've spent the last 2 hours scouring the internet for the answer
[03:58] <outchy> does anyone know?
[07:17] <highvoltage> LaserJock: are you around?
[07:18] <highvoltage> edubuntugirl: tell LaserJock not sure if you've seen this before... http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2006/10/23/science/20061024_ILLO_GRAPHIC.html
[07:18] <edubuntugirl> Righto, highvoltage!
[07:19] <LaserJock> highvoltage: yes, I saw it today
[07:19] <edubuntugirl> LaserJock: by the way, highvoltage told me to tell you 'not sure if you've seen this before... http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2006/10/23/science/20061024_ILLO_GRAPHIC.html' 34 seconds ago (on Sat Nov  4 08:17:55 2006)
[07:19] <Kamping_Kaiser> lol
[07:19] <Kamping_Kaiser> cool
[07:20] <LaserJock> I wonder how well that kind of periodic table would work well
[07:20] <LaserJock> it seems a little complicated at first glance
[07:20] <LaserJock> but I've had the good 'ole periodic table drilled into my head
[07:20] <LaserJock> we had to memorize it
[07:21] <highvoltage> I think making even the slightest change would probably have huge effects. Text books would need updating, lots of software would need updating... and like you, many people have it memorised.
[07:21] <highvoltage> having said that, I don't believe in stopping progress :)
[07:22] <LaserJock> that's would be a bugger to code
[07:22] <LaserJock> s/'s//
[07:22] <LaserJock> I do see some interesting points
[07:22] <highvoltage> it would be nice for programs such as gperiodic to 'know' that there might be different layouts in te future, so that you can switch between different views and models.
[07:22] <LaserJock> heh
[07:22] <highvoltage> :)
[07:23] <LaserJock> I don't know that I'll have to worry about it anytime soon
[07:23] <highvoltage> yeah. it will probably take a few decades for scientists to battle it out.
[07:23] <LaserJock> highvoltage: at least
[07:23] <highvoltage> I can see the flamewars on the scientists periodictable-chat mailing lists.
[07:24] <LaserJock> sometimes science takes a while for these kinds of things
[07:24] <LaserJock> in general most chemisty textbooks are roughly 50 years behind current research
[07:25] <highvoltage> geez
[07:25] <LaserJock> it's pretty difficult
[07:25] <LaserJock> chemisty, in particular, seems difficult
[07:26] <LaserJock> as we just keep adding chemistry knowledge
[07:26] <LaserJock> rather then redoing or replacing
[07:49] <sbalneav> Evening all
[07:49] <highvoltage> hi sbalneav 
[07:49] <Kamping_Kaiser> hi
[07:50] <sbalneav> Hey highvoltage, Kamping_Kaiser
[07:50] <Kamping_Kaiser> :)
[07:50] <highvoltage> sbalneav: with the official ltsp 5 release, are you going to use xdmcp or ssh?
[07:50] <highvoltage> hey Kamping_Kaiser 
[07:50] <Kamping_Kaiser> :)
[07:50] <sbalneav> With the stuff that I'm working on this week, it should be able to use both.
[07:50] <sbalneav> and still do localdevices.
[07:51] <highvoltage> does localdevices work with xdmcp on edgy's ltsp?
[07:51] <sbalneav> No, not at the moment.
[07:51] <highvoltage> eesh.
[07:51] <sbalneav> Only with the LDM ssh-tunneled connection.
[07:51] <Kamping_Kaiser> does anyone know if it would be possible to backport ltsp5 to dapper?
[07:51] <Kamping_Kaiser> i'm hoping for device support ;|
[07:52] <highvoltage> Kamping_Kaiser: you should be able to do a manual installation of it, but as the saying goes, it won't be officially supported
[07:52] <sbalneav> But, I demoed a proof of concept today that combines both.  I figure there's about 20 hours worth of work to finish it off.
[07:52] <highvoltage> (not by ubuntu anyway)
[07:52] <highvoltage> wow
[07:52] <highvoltage> I suppose I could use the xfce4 style local decives with xdmcp? although that would be a bit hacky :/
[07:53] <Kamping_Kaiser> highvoltage, i apreciate it wouldnt be supported, i' suppose i'll have to investigate a manual install :|
[07:53] <Burgundavia> sbalneav: are you paid by your work to work on LTSP?
[07:53] <highvoltage> Kamping_Kaiser: check the ltsp wiki when ltsp 5 is released :)
[07:53] <Burgundavia> Kamping_Kaiser: looking at the deps, it shouldn't be to bad. I would recompile
[07:53] <sbalneav> Burgundavia: Nope.  I work for free :)
[07:54] <sbalneav> Shuttleworth does pay, however, to bring me down to the UDS conferences, which is GREATLY appreciated, by me.
[07:54] <sbalneav> However, the rest of what I do, I do simply because I love to do it. :)
[07:55] <sbalneav> We'll do it when it's done :)
[07:55] <LaserJock> oh no
[07:55] <sbalneav> And not a second sooner :)
[07:55] <LaserJock> sbalneav: has been converted to the Debian side
[07:55] <Kamping_Kaiser> hehe
[07:55] <LaserJock> s/://
[07:55] <sbalneav> Heh, we've NEVER had any sort of firm release schedule.
[07:56] <sbalneav> We're even WORSE than debian :)
[07:56] <Kamping_Kaiser> *grin*
[07:56] <sbalneav> However, I think you'll see a tarball out from us within the short term.
[07:57] <Kamping_Kaiser> yay. then i just have to get it installing in dapper without uber breakery
[07:57] <sbalneav> The problems not the chroot.
[07:58] <sbalneav> The problems the patches to Nautilus we had to make to fix broken behavior in /media handling.
[07:58] <sbalneav> THAT will be the tricky part to backport.
[07:58] <sbalneav> And without it, localdevices in dapper will be useless.
[07:58] <Kamping_Kaiser> oh :(
[07:59] <sbalneav> So, why not upgrade to edgy, and simply get the good stuff now?
[07:59] <Kamping_Kaiser> its a community group's server, and i want tehm on the LTS
[08:00] <sbalneav> Right, because you're going to be wanting to run a 5 year old operating system in the future :)
[08:00] <Kamping_Kaiser> 3 years.
[08:00] <highvoltage> i think it's good that ltsp doesn't rush it. ltsp 4.2 was of excellent quality, and 5 is nearly a re-write, and users will expect the same quality they had in 4.2
[08:00] <Kamping_Kaiser> i'm happy for them to take their time, i'm just getting excited
[08:01] <Kamping_Kaiser> but the lts is what is keeping the server where it is.
[08:01] <highvoltage> ubuntu's upgrades are very fragile at the moment.
[08:02] <Kamping_Kaiser> :(
[08:02] <sbalneav> No they work fine.  Unless you've buggered up your box by running that idiotic "faster dapper" shell script.
[08:02] <sbalneav> And if you have, you deserve whatever you get :)
[08:03] <Kamping_Kaiser> hehehe
[08:03] <sbalneav> I had 5 boxes, all upgraded from dapper to edgy just fine.
[08:03] <highvoltage> I had many boxes that upgraded fine too, but then again...
[08:03] <Burgundavia> if you don't have dumb stuff installed, you should be mostly good
[08:03] <Burgundavia> no upgrade is going to be painless
[08:03] <highvoltage> I've had a couple of boxes that had nothing strange of them and they still didn't upgrade fine
[08:04] <highvoltage> which is due to legitamite bugs.
[08:04] <Burgundavia> highvoltage: is legitamite a new kind of vegamite? maybe one that is allowed in the US?
[08:04] <highvoltage> upgrading from sysvinit -> upstart did somevery strange stuff on my boxes.
[08:04] <highvoltage> Burgundavia: d'oh!
[08:04] <highvoltage> hehe
[08:04] <Burgundavia> *grin*
[08:05] <LaserJock> yeah, I did 3 upgrades just fine
[08:05] <Burgundavia> my father used to eat that stuff. All this ZA blood and I dispise teh stuff
[08:05] <highvoltage> Burgundavia: hey I just got up like, 30 minutes ago, it takes a while for the engrish to kick in
[08:05] <Kamping_Kaiser> Burgundavia, what vegimte?
[08:05] <Kamping_Kaiser> *emite
[08:05] <highvoltage> we don't have vegemite in .za
[08:05] <Burgundavia> or marmite
[08:05] <highvoltage> aaaah
[08:05] <Kamping_Kaiser> marmites horrible
[08:05] <Burgundavia> both look like road tar
[08:05] <Kamping_Kaiser> vegemite rocks
[08:05] <Burgundavia> and taste only slightly better
[08:06] <Kamping_Kaiser> lol
[09:03] <highvoltage> wow. glade is great. I finally grok it. if only I knew it was this simple *ages* ago.
[09:04] <Burgundavia> highvoltage: what are you working on?
[09:05] <jsgotangco> highvoltage: glade is the bomb
[09:13] <highvoltage> Burgundavia: just a simple chooser screen for a live cd
[09:13] <Burgundavia> highvoltage: chooser screen?
[09:13] <highvoltage> Burgundavia: so that a user can choose to start ubiquity directly, instead of launching the whole livecd
[09:13] <Burgundavia> ah, cool
[09:13] <Burgundavia> we need that
[09:13] <highvoltage> or they can choose just to have a rescue environment (which I still have to write)
[09:13] <Burgundavia> we really need that
[09:13] <highvoltage> i hope to get it in upstream ubuntu once its more polished
[09:14] <highvoltage> our release date is 15 November, so I have to get it all working by then :)
[09:14] <jsgotangco> everything is so quiet, most of the people are on a plane
[09:14] <highvoltage> yep.
[09:14] <highvoltage> they're on a plane. they can't complain.
[09:14] <highvoltage> </silly nirvana reference>
[09:15] <Burgundavia> snakes?
[09:16] <jsgotangco> haha
[09:16] <highvoltage> snakes on planes are *so* last UDS
[09:17] <Burgundavia> highvoltage: are you headed to MTV?
[09:17] <jsgotangco> it seems anything voip wasn't even considered this time
[09:17] <Burgundavia> no, it was
[09:17] <highvoltage> Burgundavia: nope, I am flooded with work atm :/
[09:17] <Burgundavia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperSummitMountainView/Participate/Ekiga
[09:17] <highvoltage> I would've really, really liked to go though.
[09:17] <Burgundavia> yes
[09:17] <Burgundavia> similarly for myself
[09:17] <highvoltage> yes, I'll be doing the ekiga thing :)
[09:18] <highvoltage> (when possible)
[09:18] <highvoltage> timezone differences might make it difficult.
[09:18] <Burgundavia> same tz as me
[09:18] <jsgotangco> *sigh* i will have to fix my router jsut for ekiga
[09:18] <Burgundavia> which actually makes it harder
[09:18] <highvoltage> but I'm getting used to less sleep these days :)
[09:18] <Burgundavia> jsgotangco: unlikely
[09:18] <Burgundavia> ekiga should be able to bypass it
[09:19] <jsgotangco> surely?
[09:19] <jsgotangco> hmm but im in kde now
[09:19] <jsgotangco> heheh
[09:19] <highvoltage> ekiga should run fine in kde.
[09:20] <Burgundavia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperSummitMountainView/Participate/KPhone
[09:20] <Burgundavia> got ya covered
[09:20] <Burgundavia> they are using SIP
[09:20] <Burgundavia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperSummitMountainView/Participate/SIP
[09:21] <Burgundavia> jsgotangco: are you on KDE these days?
[09:22] <jsgotangco> Burgundavia: well as of 2 days ago ive been using it exclusively
[09:22] <Burgundavia> ah
[09:22] <jsgotangco> i just dont want to miss anything
[09:23] <jsgotangco> there are some stuff that i seem to like it more here
[09:23] <Burgundavia> kde has always had too many options and not enough planning for me
[09:25] <Burgundavia> I fear the KDE people are going to have a backlash with 4, because there has been this "promising the world" expectation, with little to see
[09:25] <Burgundavia> such as maybe, spinny cubes or other bits
[09:26] <jsgotangco> well its pretty much an all or nothing project
[09:27] <Burgundavia> yep
[09:28] <Burgundavia> there is going to be solid stuff underpining KDE4, I just wonder it will be like our edgy
[09:28] <Burgundavia> not very edgy, mostly infrastructure
[09:28] <jsgotangco> 2 non-free software i use (opera, skype) work very well in kde
[09:30] <Burgundavia> right
[09:30] <Burgundavia> I hate skype and everything it stands for
[09:30] <Burgundavia> however, it does work
[09:30] <jsgotangco> surely i dont like being tied to it, but all my contacts use it
[09:31] <jsgotangco> no one i know has even heard of gizmo at least
[09:32] <Burgundavia> there is no project to take voip back, a firefox like project
[09:33] <jsgotangco> that's sad ekiga isn't something that is nice to use for starters
[09:33] <Burgundavia> yes
[09:33] <Burgundavia> I can't wait for telepathy to wipe ekiga and gaim off my desktop
[09:35] <jsgotangco> yeah
[09:37] <Burgundavia> kopete is going to use telepathy, which rocks
[09:38] <jsgotangco> if there's one thing i currently hate ok kde
[09:38] <jsgotangco> is that the bluetooth support is pretty spotty
[09:38] <Burgundavia> gnomes is not that great
[09:39] <jsgotangco> its pretty straightforward and it works most of the time
[09:40] <jsgotangco> zakame was able to use his 3G phone connection via bluetooth with a lot of hacks from rfcomm
[09:40] <jsgotangco> so we're building on that and hopefully do something more easier
[09:42] <Burgundavia> mjg was working on some stuff in bluez
[09:42] <Burgundavia> however, KDE not using gstreamer kinds of sucks
[09:42] <Burgundavia> I guess that is why I don't use KDE
[09:42] <Burgundavia> inablity to make decisions
[09:42] <jsgotangco> that's one thing too
[09:46] <jsgotangco> Burgundavia: check this out
[09:46] <jsgotangco> http://technology.guardian.co.uk/weekly/story/0,,1930975,00.html
[09:46] <Burgundavia> wow
[09:47] <Burgundavia> how people use tech is so different across teh world
[09:47] <jsgotangco> wireless data is getting pretty cheap here too
[10:05] <highvoltage> in south africa our landlines are way too expensive
[10:06] <jsgotangco> our landlines are cheap but most of us find them pretty useless most of the time
[10:07] <jsgotangco> as prepay is always been the main driver of things here
[10:07] <Burgundavia> would it shock to you learn I don't own a cellphone?
[10:07] <jsgotangco> *gasp*I
[10:10] <jsgotangco> highvoltage: how is wireless data billed over there?
[10:25] <[Daumantas] > hello
[10:25] <[Daumantas] > anybody here?
[10:25] <highvoltage> yep
[10:26] <[Daumantas] > what u can recomandate for intel 166mhz and 50 mb of ram PC ?
[10:26] <highvoltage> to be honest?
[10:26] <[Daumantas] > mhm..
[10:26] <Burgundavia> the recycling bin
[10:26] <highvoltage> find out if you have a local pc recycling plant.
[10:27] <[Daumantas] > :>>>
[10:27] <highvoltage> you could get it to work as a thin client, barely, but it's not worth the effort. it will be painfully slow.
[10:27] <[Daumantas] > maybe i can download oldest version of edubuntu?
[10:27] <highvoltage> won't work on it.
[10:28] <[Daumantas] > hmm
[10:28] <Burgundavia> highvoltage: my first computer was a 120mhz computer
[10:28] <Burgundavia> that worked well, back in the late 90's
[10:28] <Kamping_Kaiser> it will work as an xdm client, but igs ugly
[10:28] <highvoltage> my first computer was a 4.77 mhz computer
[10:28] <Burgundavia> a web only client
[10:28] <[Daumantas] > i find this laptop in my new car :>>
[10:28] <highvoltage> my second one 33 mhz
[10:28] <highvoltage> [Daumantas] : that sounds dodgy :)
[10:29] <[Daumantas] > :>
[10:35] <pygi> morning everyone
[10:36] <Kamping_Kaiser> gday
[10:36] <juliux> morning pygi 
[10:54] <highvoltage> hey pygi 
[10:55] <pygi> highvoltage: hey, how is you? :)
[10:55] <highvoltage> I'm under high load and slightly stressed, but I'm being very productive and feeling good.
[10:55] <pygi> nice ^_^
[10:55] <highvoltage> how are you pygi?
[10:56] <pygi> highvoltage: just got back from exam at uni :) Testing the -tao thingy in libburn, works smoothly
[10:56] <pygi> I'm sick, tired, and quite exhusted :P
[10:56] <pygi> or whatever the spelling is :)
[10:58] <highvoltage> pygi: get some fresh air!
[10:59] <pygi> highvoltage: hehe, I know ^_^ Took some walk after exam :P Now I need a tea :)
[10:59] <highvoltage> ah, exams. that's enough to make anyone sick.
[10:59] <pygi> hehe :P
[11:52] <ebees> Ooops, looks like I'm the only one here tonight :)
[11:52] <pygi> nop :)
[11:52] <juliux> ebees, nop
[11:52] <ebees> :)
[11:53] <ebees> I was thinking it was likely, but am glad it's not true :))
[11:53] <ebees> I'm just curious about a couple of things. Maybe you may be able to provide me with some information or directions
[11:53] <ebees> ?
[11:54] <pygi> always ^_^
[11:55] <ebees> I've been given a PowerEdge 2300 (dual PIIIs). I'm wondering how well this would perform as a server for Edubuntu (I'm going to put at least 512Mb RAM on it for about three thin clients)???
[11:55] <Kamping_Kaiser> shold be ok
[11:55] <Kamping_Kaiser> *should. what P3's exactly though?
[11:56] <ebees> I'm not entirely sure - I only got it yesterday and haven't had time to check up - though I'm pretty sure they're at least 500Mhz - I think think think :)))
[11:56] <Kamping_Kaiser> P3s start at ~500 ;)
[11:57] <Kamping_Kaiser> 2x1gig do 3 clients easy, 2x500 will be pushing it.
[11:57] <ebees> Really? Bugger
[11:57] <ebees> I'll probably have to consider using it for a home server then
[11:58] <ebees> Thought it's probably over-kill for that :))
[11:58] <Kamping_Kaiser> yep :) but most home servers are :)
[11:58] <ebees> LOL
[11:58] <Kamping_Kaiser> mines giong to be a 600mhz alpha
[11:59] <Kamping_Kaiser> i'll basicly be an ssh gateway :P
[11:59] <ebees> I'll have to wait until I get some moolah and buy something with a bit more.... how do you think it would for only two think clients? Two P2s with 128Mb RAM?
[11:59] <ebees> THINK clients... wish I had some of them. Most of mine don't :)
[11:59] <pygi> you cant use 128 ram for two clients :P
[12:00] <ebees> Sorry, I'm just confusing things here. I was was thinking of connecting two P2 each with 128MbRAM to the poweredge
[12:00] <ebees> running 512Mb RAM
[12:04] <ebees> No?
[12:06] <pygi> I'm confused about what you are talking :P
[12:06] <ebees> From the beginning :)
[12:06] <ebees> If the machine I haven't will struggle with 3 thin clients
[12:07] <ebees> Would it do any better running the Poweredge with 512 Mb RAM and connecting two P2s with 128 or 196Mb RAM?
[12:08] <ebees> I'm not au fai with the mechanics of Edubutu, servers and clients etc. So am wondering if the more powerful the client, would this ease the strain on the server?
[12:23] <highvoltage> ebees: no, it wouldn't
[12:23] <highvoltage> ebees: the server would do the same ammount of work regardless
[12:24] <ebees> Fair enough. It was just a thought. I've seen Dell selling new one's for $AU499 - and I guess I can always check eBay :(
[12:24] <ebees> thanks for the info though
[12:24] <highvoltage> ebees: the next version of edubuntu ltsp might be able to share some loads with the clients. we are looking forward to having that functionality
[12:24] <ebees> Is this the one after 6.10?
[12:25] <highvoltage> yep
[12:25] <ebees> I'm curious because I have a daughter starting school (kindergarten) next year. I run Xubuntu with Ed icons etc for her on a P2 with 192Mb RAM
[12:25] <ebees> I want to get ahead of the game :)
[12:25] <ebees> and speak to the IT staff at the school when she starts
[12:26] <ebees> I know they run iMacs at the school and some Windows machines
[12:26] <ebees> We don't use either at home
[12:26] <ebees> I'd like to introduce them to the side of light and goodness!
[12:27] <ebees> away from the path into temptation and deliver them from evil
[12:27] <ebees> =)
[12:27] <ebees> for ever and ever, amen
[12:28] <ebees> ooops... I think my childhood is showing.
[12:29] <Kamping_Kaiser> hehe
[12:32] <ebees> Well, it's quite late here in Oz (Dorothy) so I'm going to have to sign off soon.
[12:32] <Kamping_Kaiser> where are you?
[12:33] <ebees> Sydney, Australia
[12:33] <ebees> Also, I have to work tomorrow - bugger, damn, ham and spam.
[12:33] <ebees> the money's good though :)) Whoo hooo
[12:34] <Kamping_Kaiser> ah sydney
[12:34] <Kamping_Kaiser> the big smoke
[12:34] <Kamping_Kaiser> you should get into slug (if your nto already)
[12:34] <ebees> Yes, too true unfortunately. Glad I dont have aircraft noise too.
[12:34] <Kamping_Kaiser> theres some cool ubuntuers in sydn.
[12:34] <ebees> Yeah, already a member (about two years now)
[12:34] <Kamping_Kaiser> :)
[12:34] <ebees> How'd you know about SLUG
[12:34] <ebees> ?
[12:35] <Kamping_Kaiser> i'm in Adl. hills. i know /something/ about the rest of aust :)
[12:35] <ebees> Ooooooh. A southerner :)
[12:35] <ebees> I could make jokes about the woods and hill and hicks... but I've never been to SA.
[12:36] <ebees> Tasmania though, that's another story :))
[12:36] <Kamping_Kaiser> heh. well i'm origonaly from tas, so go hog wild :P
[12:36] <ebees> But don't we all say that
[12:36] <ebees> I like how you can have a laugh about "a map of Tassie" with tourists :)))))
[12:36] <ebees> Naughty I know
[12:37] <Kamping_Kaiser> *g*
[12:37] <ebees> Have you got one ? 
[12:37] <ebees> Laugh
[12:37] <Kamping_Kaiser> a big tas with 'tasmania and its territory', and a small aust
[12:37] <ebees> Like the one of NZ. It has a map of NZ - North Island/ South Island. Then "West Island" and shows Australia :)))
[12:38] <Kamping_Kaiser> rofl
[12:38] <Kamping_Kaiser> the kiwis are weird ;P
[12:38] <ebees> Thinking of which; did you know there are more sheep per capita in Aus than in NZ
[12:38] <ebees> I was completely surprised
[12:38] <ebees> <shakes head>
[12:38] <Kamping_Kaiser> not supprised, we have a lot mroe land to put them in... we dont have to share our beds
[12:38] <Kamping_Kaiser> (is that CoC compliant?)
[12:39] <ebees> ???
[12:39] <ebees> Coc?
[12:39] <Kamping_Kaiser> code of conduct
[12:39] <Kamping_Kaiser> !coc
[12:39] <ubotu> The Ubuntu Code of Conduct to which we ask all Ubuntu users to adhere can be found at http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct/
[12:39] <ebees> just looking
[12:40] <ebees> "Be respectful"  - bugger. Sometimes the truth cannot be spoken ;0
[12:41] <Kamping_Kaiser> ebees, also /join #ubuntu-au
[12:41] <Kamping_Kaiser> yeh, we (in -au) have been arguing over what that means (be respectfull)
[12:41] <ebees> Hey Kaiser... where on earth did you pick up that name (I was going to say 'handle" but that'd give away something I used to do :)
[12:42] <Kamping_Kaiser> um. playing counterstrike .... :P
[12:42] <ebees> Yeah, but Kamping ???
[12:42] <ebees> ;)
[12:43] <Kamping_Kaiser> its a skill ;P
[12:43] <ebees> we're all men of the world. You can tell me
[12:43] <ebees> What? Scouts?
[12:43] <Kamping_Kaiser> rofl no
[12:43] <Kamping_Kaiser> camping in FPS's and not having other gamers kick your arse for it
[12:43] <ebees> what is camping?
[12:43] <Kamping_Kaiser> oh
[12:43] <Kamping_Kaiser> i see.
[12:43] <ebees> Remember I'm from Sydney :)
[12:44] <Kamping_Kaiser> so your nto a gamer?
[12:44] <ebees> No, wish I had the time
[12:44] <Kamping_Kaiser> where you choose a gun (usually a 1 hit kill jobbie) and hide in a corner/out of the way
[12:44] <Kamping_Kaiser> then dont move, and blast anything that goes past
[12:44] <ebees> I see. A sniper
[12:44] <Kamping_Kaiser> basicly yes
[12:44] <Kamping_Kaiser> but that level of skill is optional ;P
[12:44] <ebees> dangerous. In real life,  often if they got caught people did quite nasty things to them.
[12:45] <Kamping_Kaiser> yes, but i pick my battles... i /dont/ do that stuff in real life
[12:46] <ebees> Thank goodness... mind you, you said you were from Adelaid..,. and we all know how many loonies live in SA. In NSW we just have them in Parliament :)
[12:46] <Kamping_Kaiser> looool. scary but true... but you also put yours in canberra
[12:47] <ebees> US? What about you lot... oh, I see. You mean we SURROUND them... it's part of sneaky plan actually :)
[12:47] <ebees> We're just waiting.. biding our time... patience is required.
[12:48] <Kamping_Kaiser> *grin*
[12:48] <ebees> I'm just adding you to my 'watched nicks" :)
[12:48] <Kamping_Kaiser> heheehe
[12:48] <Kamping_Kaiser> i'll be in -au again starting some time next week (probably thursday evening)
[12:49] <ebees> I'd love to play online....
[12:49] <Kamping_Kaiser> i'v been having some time off
[12:49] <ebees> I'm going to join 
[12:49] <Kamping_Kaiser> :)
[12:49] <ebees> is there some easy way to join #ubuntu-au automatically withouth manually adding the group?
[12:49] <ebees> I RARELY use IRC
[12:49] <Kamping_Kaiser> what irc client are you using?
[12:49] <ebees> konversation
[12:50] <Kamping_Kaiser> i havent used it :)
[12:50] <ebees> yeah, me too
[12:50] <ebees> ooops. crossed comms
[12:50] <ebees> :)
[12:50] <Kamping_Kaiser> :)
[12:50] <ebees> what do you use?
[12:50] <Kamping_Kaiser> Xchat2/irssi (as needed)
[12:50] <ebees> what is that?
[12:50] <Kamping_Kaiser> incase its needed :)
[12:50] <ebees> what is that?
[12:51] <Kamping_Kaiser> xchat? irc client. mirc clone (i hear)
[12:51] <ebees> never heard of it. Though I try to keep up-to-date I've not used IRC for years.
[12:52] <ebees> I used ICQ <cough  - windows days> when it first came out... but then I've stopped many a bad habit :)
[12:52] <Kamping_Kaiser> its gtk, so if your usign gnome/xfce it would look better then if you use kde. dont know how the kde clients go for irc
[12:52] <Kamping_Kaiser> heh. i use gaim for my icq
[12:52] <ebees> Me too.
[12:52] <ebees> It's pretty good. THough when someone on a Mac tried to send a file it crashes
[12:52] <ebees> I have rels that we vid conference with
[12:53] <ebees> they're on Macs in HK
[12:53] <Kamping_Kaiser> oh, i dont do fancy stuff like that
[12:53] <ebees> It's brilliant
[12:53] <Kamping_Kaiser> if i need files copied, i give someone an ssh acount :)
[12:53] <ebees> crossed comms sorry
[12:53] <ebees> ssh to your machine?
[12:54] <ebees> whoops... very late
[12:54] <Kamping_Kaiser> hehe. yes
[12:54] <ebees> kids are going to be awake at the crack of dawn
[12:54] <ebees> and I have to go to work ... bugger
[12:54] <Kamping_Kaiser> darn. i better let you sleep
[12:54] <ebees> Nice speaking/writing to you. I'll join the other group too.
[12:54] <ebees> thanks for the info
[12:54] <ebees> :)
[12:54] <Kamping_Kaiser> no worries :)
[12:55] <Kamping_Kaiser> just hit me if you need a hand
[12:55] <ebees> No probs.. though I don't have stick that big.. Can I remote connect to one closer to where you live LOL
[12:55] <ebees> Linux :) Brilliant!
[12:55] <Kamping_Kaiser> lol
[12:56] <Kamping_Kaiser> :)
[12:56] <ebees> thanks again. Hopefully we can connect again and you can tell me how many poor buggers you've shot in the arse :)
[12:56] <Kamping_Kaiser> hehe, catch you tehn mate :)
[12:56] <ebees> Oh, you should take some screen video so I can have a laugh :))
[12:56] <ebees> 'night
[12:57] <Kamping_Kaiser> :)
[03:42] <ctkroeker> Has anyone gotten the new edubuntu edgy to serve ltsp clients?
[03:43] <stgraber> yes, what's your problem ?
[03:45] <ctkroeker> Thedefault install does not have the /opt/i386/ltsp directory, hence, it can't serve clients
[03:45] <ctkroeker> fuse isn't installed, neither is ssh
[03:45] <stgraber> did you choose the Workstation install ?
[03:46] <stgraber> normally you choose the first option of the menu ("Install to disk")
[03:46] <stgraber> and that's good
[03:46] <stgraber> it asks you what's your primary network card
[03:46] <ctkroeker> This is fom the DVD disk, I did the default install
[03:46] <ctkroeker> nope
[03:46] <ctkroeker> doesn't ask the net. card
[03:47] <stgraber> did you see the "Build LTSP chroot" part of the install ?
[03:47] <stgraber> it should take around 5-6 minutes, so you should have seen it if you were around during the install
[03:47] <ctkroeker> It never showed me that part
[03:47] <stgraber> so it did a classical Workstation installation, not the LTSP one
[03:48] <ctkroeker> it wasn't a text install, it was the live version with the "Install" icon on the desktop
[03:48] <ctkroeker> guess so, but the dvd doesn't have an option for server install
[03:49] <stgraber> hmm, the live install is only for the workstation (if they didn't change it last minute)
[03:49] <stgraber> the LTSP install is text mode
[03:49] <ctkroeker> oh, k
[03:49] <stgraber> btw, I never tried the DVD
[03:49] <ctkroeker> I'll try it again when I get back to work
[03:49] <stgraber> k
[03:49] <ctkroeker> post back later if I need more help, thanks
[03:50] <stgraber> np
[06:29] <LaserJock> hi ogra 
[06:58] <sbalneav> Morning all
[07:00] <LaserJock> hi sbalneav 
[07:01] <sbalneav> Hey LaserJock
[07:01] <LaserJock> sbalneav: you in Mt. View?
[07:02] <sbalneav> No, we're still at the LTSP conference now, doing some wiki work.
[07:02] <sbalneav> We'll head down there after dinner tonight.
[07:02] <LaserJock> where is the LTSP conf. ?
[07:02] <sbalneav> We'll all be in MTV by bedtime.
[07:02] <sbalneav> At Giardelli's in San Fransisco.
[07:02] <sbalneav> The ocean's about 200 feet away.
[07:03] <sbalneav> Look out the window, across the street, and there it is.
[07:03] <sbalneav> I can see alcatraz and Fishermans wharf
[07:04] <LaserJock> Giardelli's ?
[07:04] <LaserJock> awesome
[07:04] <LaserJock> I love it there
[07:04] <sbalneav> It's nice, we got a conference room here for 2 days for $400 smackers.
[07:05] <sbalneav> Which is GREAT for downtown SF
[07:06] <cbx33> hey people
[07:07] <highvoltage> hey see bee ex
[07:07] <cbx33> ummm....wanted to ask about UDS and ekiga
[07:08] <cbx33> someone said ekiga will be used at UDS for long distance participation
[07:08] <LaserJock> cbx33!!
[07:08] <cbx33> LaserJock, !!!
[07:08] <cbx33> dude how are you
[07:08] <LaserJock> cbx33: yeah: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperSummitMountainView/Participate/Ekiga?highlight=%28ubuntudevelopersummit%29
[07:09] <LaserJock> cbx33: I'm at my grandpa's house
[07:09] <cbx33> nice
[07:18] <cbx33> LaserJock, howz it going
[07:18] <LaserJock> oh, it's going
[07:20] <cbx33> heheh
[07:20] <LaserJock> I always have too much to do and not enough time
[07:20] <cbx33> oh dear
[07:20] <LaserJock> but I'm trying to relax a little here at my grandpas
[07:21] <cbx33> but I can't connect again
[07:23] <cbx33> how does this ekiga thing work...if I wanted to phone LaserJock  you for example
[07:24] <LaserJock> you can put in my ekiga address thingy
[07:24] <cbx33> do you have an account with someone?
[07:24] <LaserJock> hang on a sec
[07:28] <LaserJock> cbx33:  try sip:laserjock@ekiga.net
[07:28] <cbx33> ok hang on
[07:29] <cbx33> remote user is unreachable
[07:30] <cbx33> is that ekiga.net hingy free?
[07:32] <LaserJock> try it now
[07:32] <LaserJock> yeah
[07:32] <cbx33> ok
[07:33] <LaserJock> I think you connected
[07:33] <cbx33> connected...then got some strange noise
[07:33] <cbx33> did you hear me say hi?
[07:33] <LaserJock> no
[07:33] <LaserJock> I didn't say anything though
[07:39] <nixternal> ooh kphone
[07:54] <stgraber> any idea of why my ekiga crash when trying to find my NAT type ?
[09:08] <LaserJock> highvoltage: you here?
[09:08] <highvoltage> yes
[09:09] <highvoltage> what's the chances, I was just going to ask you and ogra's opinion on something
[09:09] <highvoltage> but you can go first.
[09:09] <LaserJock> highvoltage: Kalzium is implementing that new periodic table
[09:09] <LaserJock> carsten just told me now he just added it
[09:10] <highvoltage> heh!
[09:10] <highvoltage> he doesn't waste time now does he.
[09:11] <highvoltage> LaserJock, ogra: we're basing the tuxlab installation cd on the ubuntu live cd infrastructure, it makes life for me so much easier
[09:12] <highvoltage> but...
[09:12] <highvoltage> people have complained that the live cd takes up a lot of memory and that it won't be installable on old pc's, and that it doesn't have a rescue environment like the alternate cd.
[09:13] <highvoltage> so today, I worked on a tool to fix it. it's still ugly, and needs work, but here's a screenshot:
[09:13] <highvoltage> http://jonathancarter.co.za/albums/screenshots/dvd.sized.png
[09:13] <highvoltage> it starts up instead of the xsession, so that the user can choose to run ubiquity directly, skipping the entire desktop.
[09:14] <highvoltage> it also gives them the option of running a terminal that will launch an ncurses menu for rescuing grub, getting a shell and some other less usefull things.
[09:14] <LaserJock> highvoltage: that's at boot?
[09:14] <highvoltage> LaserJock: yes
[09:14] <highvoltage> LaserJock: well, as soon as X starts up
[09:14] <highvoltage> not at boot really
[09:14] <highvoltage> that window is centered on the screen, it's just python and glade
[09:15] <LaserJock> hmm, so it boots and gets to where it would normally log into gnome
[09:15] <LaserJock> and instead you have a menu
[09:15] <highvoltage> yes
[09:15] <highvoltage> it saves memory on old pc's because you don't have to run gnome + installer
[09:15] <highvoltage> ubuntu doesn't currently install well on some machines with 256MB RAM
[09:16] <highvoltage> do you think this could go into ubuntu if it's polished up real nicely?
[09:16] <LaserJock> highvoltage: check out http://img508.imageshack.us/my.php?image=kalziumhextv0.png
[09:16] <LaserJock> highvoltage: well I personally like the idea
[09:17] <highvoltage> boobies
[09:17] <LaserJock> highvoltage: but I just don't know what the Ubuntu core guys will think
[09:18] <highvoltage> that kalzium screenshot looks quite cool
[09:18] <highvoltage> things are moving so fast these days
[09:18] <ogra> LaserJock, who cares, its a customized CD ...
[09:18] <ogra> highvoltage, looks nice
[09:18] <LaserJock> ogra: well, he asked if it could go into Ubuntu
[09:19] <ogra> how much mem does it save ? the CD still needs to load the squashfs, no ? so i imagine you wont gain much ...
[09:19] <pygi> ogra: can I pm you with a question? :)
[09:19] <highvoltage> ogra: I understand it's a customised cd, I was just thinking that it would be nice to have similar (or the same) functionality in the ubuntu system
[09:19] <highvoltage> well, you save at least the memory used by an entire gnome session
[09:19] <ogra> highvoltage, talk to Kamion/cjwatson then 
[09:19] <highvoltage> that's a few dozen MB
[09:20] <LaserJock> yeah, 256MB is the keey
[09:20] <LaserJock> it seems like we are right at the line
[09:20] <highvoltage> ok, I think I'll send it to them when it's more polished up. it's probably too late for feisty anyway.
[09:20] <LaserJock> when you factor in shared graphic memory
[09:20] <LaserJock> some machines with 256MB don't seem to work
[09:20] <highvoltage> yep. I've seen ubuntu fail plenty of times on 256MB machines, where kubuntu and xubuntu work fine.
[09:21] <highvoltage> but yes, not really an edubuntu issue.
[09:21] <highvoltage> LaserJock: who else is working on gperiodic?
[09:22] <highvoltage> is it likely that gperiodic will now get the new tables now that kalzium has it?
[09:22] <LaserJock> highvoltage: gperiodic is dead
[09:22] <LaserJock> highvoltage: I'm working on gchemutils a little
[09:22] <LaserJock> highvoltage: which is done by jbrefort 
[09:23] <LaserJock> it's going to be a really cool chemistry suite
[09:23] <highvoltage> ah ok. I didn't realise.
[09:23] <highvoltage> I didn't know about gchemicals, is it new?
[09:24] <LaserJock> ghemical or gchemutils?
[09:24] <highvoltage> sorry, misread. gchemutils
[09:24] <highvoltage> ah, I see it's in the repositories, so not new then.
[09:25] <LaserJock> gchemutils has been around for a while
[09:25] <LaserJock> but it's struggled to get into Debian/Ubuntu
[09:25] <LaserJock> we have a pretty old version
[09:25] <LaserJock> we need to get some of the deps packaged better, etc.
[09:26] <highvoltage> ah yes, I've seen this before.
[09:27] <LaserJock> there is chemical-mime-data, gchempaint, and gchemutils
[09:27] <LaserJock> all done by jbrefort 
[09:28] <jbrefort> chemical-mime-data are by dleidert ;)
[09:29] <LaserJock> but I think the debichem project will get things in better shape
[09:29] <LaserJock> we need to get bodr and the rest up-to-date
[09:29] <highvoltage> would be nice to get in edubuntu too
[09:30] <LaserJock> yeah, once things are together in feisty
[09:30] <LaserJock> I"m going to make a custom chemistry Ubuntu CD
[09:30] <LaserJock> ghemical, gchemutils, and a couple other apps
[09:35] <jbrefort> this makes me think I must send a couple of patches related to ghemical ;)
[09:37] <LaserJock> jbrefort: how is the interaction between the 2?
[09:38] <jbrefort> ghemical and gchempaint ?
[09:38] <LaserJock> yeah
[09:38] <jbrefort> edit formulas in gchempant and open them in ghemical is a two clicks operation
[09:39] <jbrefort> if ghemical is there, when you right click on a molecule in gchempaint, you have a menu entry to export the molecule to ghemical and it opens ghemical with the molecule loaded
[09:40] <jbrefort> then , you can has hydrogens and optimize the geometry
[09:40] <jbrefort> s/has/add/
[09:41] <LaserJock> that is so sweet
[09:41] <LaserJock> that's the kind of thing that's going to rock
[09:41] <jbrefort> though there are some issues with polycyclic aliphatic componds (decaline generally has only one chair, the other cycle being in the cross boat conformation
[09:41] <LaserJock> ah
[09:41] <jbrefort> it's already in gchempaint 0.6.x
[10:04] <pygi> wb ogra :P
[11:55] <theresa> good evening everyone!
[11:55] <ogra> hi
[11:56] <theresa> i have a few questions regarding edubuntu!
[11:56] <ogra> shoot :)
[11:57] <theresa> i'm on kubuntu at the moment....would I only have to install certains applications/packages that edubuntu uses, or will i have to install the whole desktop? i just wanna try a few things...
[11:57] <ogra> then i'd just pick the single apps ... which apps are that ?
[11:57] <ogra> (the ones you want to try)
[11:59] <theresa> well, i'm totally new to edubuntu, and I'm thinking about baseing my bachelor assignment on edubuntu, maybe doing a case study to see how kids (at my old highschool) react to it and if they find it useful compared to any other windows applications?!
[12:00] <ogra> if you want to give them the ful experience, i'd go with a liveCD :)
[12:00] <ogra> *full
[12:00] <theresa> but before I approach any professor at my uni about the idea/project I would have to mess around a bit to get an idea of what I'm going/wanting to do...
[12:00] <theresa> true, haven't thought about that yet!
[12:00] <theresa> good idea!
[12:00] <pygi> ^_^
[12:00] <ogra> ;)
[12:01] <theresa> i'd love the idea of spreading the ubuntu love AND doing my bachelor assignment at the same time :)
[12:02] <LaserJock> heh
[12:02] <theresa> what do you guys think? is it a good idea?
[12:02] <ogra> indeed !
[12:03] <theresa> i've only seen a few screenshots but edubuntu looks promising :)
[12:03] <theresa> without me being a teacher actually....
[12:04] <sbalneav> ls
[12:04] <sbalneav> w
[12:04] <LaserJock> sbalneav: I think that's /names in irc ;-)
[12:04] <sbalneav> Whoops
[12:05] <pygi> theresa: promoting edubuntu is always a good idea ;)
[12:05] <theresa> pygi: what experiences do you have with edubuntu so far?
[12:06] <pygi> theresa: only positive ones ^_^ Did several real-world implementations, holded several presentations about it, and contributing to it's development :)
[12:07] <theresa> pygi: what do you mean by "real-world implementations" ?
[12:07] <pygi> theresa: well, implementations in schools ^_^
[12:08] <theresa> pygi: cool, and how were the kids reactions to it? and what did the teachers say about it?
[12:08] <pygi> theresa: everything went smoothly :)
[12:09] <theresa> pygi: great to hear that, but could you please be a bit more precise?
[12:09] <pygi> theresa: in what way? :)
[12:09] <LaserJock> theresa: http://www.edubuntu.org/news/7
[12:10] <theresa> pygi: for example, how did you motivate the kids to use edubuntu rather than sticking to the old software, or were there any problems for example porting a certain application to edubuntu (if it wasn
[12:11] <theresa> if it wasn't available on edubuntu already...
[12:11] <pygi> theresa: I formed a team, we wrote a book
[12:11] <pygi> teachers used that book, ...
[12:11] <pygi> no Windows, they used Edubuntu :)
[12:12] <theresa> pygi: ahh i see, i thought about going to my highschool (students would be from age 10-18)
[12:12] <theresa> pygi: how old were these kids?
[12:12] <pygi> theresa: high school :)
[12:13] <pygi> but high school is 14-18
[12:13] <theresa> yeah maybe we have a different schooling system here ;)
[12:14] <pygi> indeed :)