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| mbiebl | Has anyone used upstart in combination with selinux? | 01:02 |
|---|---|---|
| mbiebl | I don't use selinux myself, I was just wondering. | 01:02 |
| ajmitch | mbiebl: yes, I have a hacked up patch for that to finish cleaning | 01:16 |
| mbiebl | ajmitch: cool, was it much effort to add selinux support? | 01:16 |
| mbiebl | Will you try to push the patch upstream? | 01:17 |
| ajmitch | not much effort & yes, of course | 01:18 |
| mbiebl | cool | 01:20 |
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| frinov | hi. trying to figure out where default runlevel is set in edgy. looking thru /etc/event.d | 03:17 |
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| matteo | can upstart handle dependencies? | 04:41 |
| _ion | He was in a hurry. | 04:48 |
| AlexExtreme | yeah... | 04:57 |
| AlexExtreme | it annoys me when people do that, they don't even give you a chance to answer :/ | 04:58 |
| _ion | It's more amusing than annoying to me. :-) | 05:01 |
| AlexExtreme | heh | 05:01 |
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| Fry-kun | ookay.. so i got the system booting.. | 06:02 |
| Fry-kun | turned out that i didn't change enough in the config files - telinit and shutdown need to point to their /usr/local/sbin/ variants | 06:03 |
| Fry-kun | i see no major problems in /var/log/boot | 06:03 |
| Fry-kun | but i still don't get gdm greeter :( | 06:04 |
| AlexExtreme | hold on, i know why :) | 06:04 |
| Fry-kun | if i log into the text terminal and run startx, it works with no problem | 06:04 |
| AlexExtreme | you have an rc5 file, right? | 06:04 |
| Fry-kun | yes | 06:04 |
| Keybuk | does "runlevel" say 5 or 2? | 06:05 |
| AlexExtreme | ok, hold on | 06:05 |
| Fry-kun | Keybuk: booted with a standard fc5 method right now - will try next time i boot with upstart | 06:07 |
| AlexExtreme | Fry-kun: http://pastebin.com/820508 - put that in a event.d/dm | 06:08 |
| AlexExtreme | next time you boot you should get gdm | 06:08 |
| Keybuk | oh, does Fedora start X from inittab? | 06:09 |
| Fry-kun | okay, sounds good | 06:09 |
| AlexExtreme | Keybuk: yes, frugalware does too | 06:10 |
| AlexExtreme | it's to get it to respawn if gdm dies | 06:10 |
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| Keybuk | cool | 06:12 |
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| wasabi_ | Keybuk: Your upstart stuff ever going to come up? Want to just pick some time and do it? | 06:13 |
| wasabi_ | The scheduler seems to be angry. | 06:14 |
| Keybuk | wasabi: I appear to have a free afternoon ;) | 06:14 |
| Keybuk | want to go over the stuff iwj did again | 06:14 |
| Keybuk | and then talk about the job state stuff | 06:14 |
| wasabi_ | Yeah. | 06:15 |
| wasabi_ | My only booking this afternoon is some java stuff at 15:00 | 06:15 |
| wasabi_ | Anytime after or before is cool. | 06:15 |
| wasabi_ | Does ian have a draft of the syntax anywhere? | 06:16 |
| Keybuk | http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/d/upstart.text | 06:16 |
| Keybuk | it's complete crack, of course | 06:16 |
| wasabi_ | that guy's a nut. but pretty cool. | 06:16 |
| Keybuk | smart, but ... odd | 06:17 |
| wasabi_ | like the rest of us. | 06:17 |
| Fry-kun | AlexExtreme: by the way, about that advice from the mailing list (to set PATH to /usr/local/sbin first).. combined with different paths for getty, rc, et.al. in various distros - wouldn't it be easier on the end users if the paths were included from some upstart config file? | 06:17 |
| AlexExtreme | no | 06:18 |
| AlexExtreme | the preferred way would be to have a set of job files that work with different distros (in my opinion, of course) | 06:18 |
| wasabi_ | My concern with ian's stuff is it's Very Complicated. | 06:19 |
| wasabi_ | Both to implement and for a user to understand. | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | yeah | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | and I think we can implements ian's stuff with /bin/sh :) | 06:20 |
| wasabi_ | Yeah. Heh. | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | on ... | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | script | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | ... | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | end script | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | would have the same effect | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | we just need an "initctl wait-for" | 06:20 |
| wasabi_ | ian: "It must represent any state machine." | 06:20 |
| wasabi_ | me: "Why?" | 06:20 |
| wasabi_ | I don't think I like the idea of upstart tracking state of things on the system anyways. The idea of a simple event system is appealing. | 06:21 |
| wasabi_ | And any knowledge upstart has is out of date. | 06:21 |
| Keybuk | indeed | 06:21 |
| Fry-kun | Alex: but /usr/local vs / will still be there, do you want to maintain a copy for each distro for each install version? or make users change 20 files just to start the system? | 06:22 |
| AlexExtreme | well... | 06:22 |
| AlexExtreme | upstart is an init system, it will require some DIY, as with any other init system :) | 06:23 |
| Fry-kun | haha | 06:23 |
| Fry-kun | i thought ubuntu philosophy was above these issues ;) | 06:24 |
| AlexExtreme | well | 06:24 |
| AlexExtreme | upstart is replacing a core system component :P | 06:24 |
| Fry-kun | that's true | 06:24 |
| AlexExtreme | anyway don't ask me about the ubuntu philosophy, i'm not even a ubuntu user ;) | 06:25 |
| Fry-kun | but it's not very hard to make it painless | 06:25 |
| Fry-kun | lol ok | 06:25 |
| Fry-kun | anyway i'll go try to boot up with my new init system | 06:26 |
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| Fry-kun | yay, it works1 | 06:30 |
| Fry-kun | takes a while after i get the tty login, but it boots up fair and square | 06:30 |
| AlexExtreme | great :) | 06:31 |
| Fry-kun | hope there isn't anything else that doesn't start up by itself | 06:31 |
| Fry-kun | <.< | 06:31 |
| Fry-kun | >.> | 06:31 |
| Fry-kun | now the main (PITA) task - converting all services to use upstart instead of sysv | 06:32 |
| Fry-kun | is there a set of examples somewhere? maybe even a repository of common services pre-converted | 06:33 |
| AlexExtreme | nope | 06:33 |
| Fry-kun | darn | 06:34 |
| Fry-kun | oh well, more fun this way i suppose | 06:34 |
| Fry-kun | oh yeah, it's implied of course.. but to make it explicit: Thank you, Alex! | 06:36 |
| AlexExtreme | np :) | 06:36 |
| Fry-kun | is it just me or did the getting-started doc change from /usr/local to /opt/upstart ? | 06:39 |
| AlexExtreme | yes | 06:40 |
| Fry-kun | oh good, i thought i was losing my mind | 06:41 |
| Fry-kun | so what's the reasoning? | 06:41 |
| AlexExtreme | no idea :) | 06:42 |
| Fry-kun | :D | 06:43 |
| Fry-kun | oh yeah.. so let's say I change half of my services to use upstart instead of sysv -- that means i have to remove their sysv versions (..right? or else they'll try to run 2 copies at once) -- so how do i set up the system to be able to boot using either upstart or sysv (in case upstart fails)? | 06:52 |
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| -ChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- [#ubuntu] Welcome to #ubuntu! Please read the channel topic and consider spending some time on the FAQ mentioned there | 08:06 | |
| -ChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- [#ubuntu-server] Ubuntu Server Discussions (development and support) | 08:06 | |
| !alindeman:*! Hi all, a rotation server just split. It's being removed and we're looking into it further. | 08:07 | |
| !alindeman:*! As always, if you have further questions or issues, please contact an on-duty staff member ( /stats p ) | 08:09 | |
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| Fry-kun | found another problem - apparently the limited user can't reboot/shutdown | 08:51 |
| _ion | Sounds more like a feature. | 08:51 |
| Fry-kun | it complains: "shutdown: /dev/initctl : No such file or directory" | 08:51 |
| _ion | if you mean a non-root user. | 08:51 |
| Fry-kun | lol | 08:51 |
| Fry-kun | yes | 08:51 |
| _ion | There's sudo, you know? | 08:52 |
| Keybuk | Fry-kun: wrong shutdown | 08:52 |
| Fry-kun | in fedora, it uses a symbolic link to consolehelper | 08:52 |
| AlexExtreme | Fry-kun: you need to use the upstart shutdown program | 08:52 |
| Fry-kun | which in turn runs userhelper, which checks if the user is allowed to run the program | 08:52 |
| AlexExtreme | if you installed it in /usr/local, do sudo /usr/local/sbin/shutdown | 08:52 |
| Fry-kun | then if so, runs | 08:53 |
| Fry-kun | X doesn't do that :P | 08:53 |
| Fry-kun | it just runs "shutdown" - and then the system says "FU" and X goes "oh well, i'll just restart" | 08:53 |
| Fry-kun | and starts up again | 08:53 |
| AlexExtreme | well | 08:53 |
| AlexExtreme | you'll have to run it yourself manually ;) | 08:54 |
| Fry-kun | which means i have to run shutdown/reboot from a console every time X( | 08:54 |
| Fry-kun | gee, thanks :( | 08:54 |
| Fry-kun | there must be a better way... | 08:54 |
| Fry-kun | man consolehelper: "[...] programs like /sbin/shutdown are paired with a link from /usr/bin/shutdown to /usr/bin/consolehelper. Then when non-root users [...] call the "shutdown" program, consolehelper will be invoked to authenticate the action and then invoke /sbin/shutdown. (consolehelper itself has no priviledges; it calls the userhelper(8) program do the real work.)" | 08:57 |
| Fry-kun | "So to make /sbin/foo or /usr/sbin/foo managed, you need to create a link from /usr/bin/foo to /usr/bin/consolehelper and create the file /etc/pam.d/foo, normally using the pam_console(8) PAM module" | 08:58 |
| Fry-kun | will see if that works | 08:58 |
| _ion | Replace /sbin/shutdown with the upstart version. | 08:58 |
| AlexExtreme | but that'll break if he goes back to sysvinit | 08:59 |
| _ion | Then put the original file back again. | 08:59 |
| AlexExtreme | but he switches between the 2 ;) | 08:59 |
| Fry-kun | when it breaks, i won't be able to | 08:59 |
| Fry-kun | if/when | 09:00 |
| _ion | How so? | 09:00 |
| _ion | Just boot with init=/bin/bash | 09:00 |
| Fry-kun | gah | 09:00 |
| Fry-kun | but.. but... ! | 09:00 |
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| Fry-kun | i was thinking to make a copy of rc.* in etc to something like rc_upstart.*, so as to make both methods work | 09:34 |
| Fry-kun | what do you think? | 09:34 |
| phsdv | Fry-kun, making a copy to rc_upstart.* does not change your shutdown issue, right? It is still /sbin/shutdown in X | 10:08 |
| Fry-kun | right | 10:15 |
| Fry-kun | but it's another issue that i'm trying to solve | 10:15 |
| phsdv | ok, sorry | 10:18 |
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| phsdv | Fry-kun: I went to the logs, you want to be able to boot from either upstart or sysvinit, correct? | 10:28 |
| phsdv | I do not think you have to make copies for being able to boot from both. I did not do it and I can boot from both. | 10:42 |
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| Fry-kun | the reason i want to use upstart in the first place is to be able to boot faster than i do with sysv - but if there's some problem with upstart, i don't want to lose more time than it takes for upstart to boot | 11:24 |
| Fry-kun | in other words, i can't afford to drop into single user mode just to switch to a working configuration | 11:25 |
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