[01:52] <freeflying> morning all
[01:55] <Jucato> good morning freeflying!
[01:56] <imbrandon> heya freeflying
[01:57] <freeflying> :)
[01:59] <Jucato> freeflying: someone was looking for you last friday
[02:02] <Jucato> question: why is News (knode) enabled in Kontact by default when knode is not installed by default? (Edgy)
[02:06] <freeflying> Jucato: hi
[02:07] <Jucato> freeflying: I think |joel| was looking for you. something about KNet (or being the last one to patch it)
[02:07] <freeflying> Jucato: thanks, I'd have a look on knet
[02:40] <Hobbsee> morning all
[02:41] <Jucato> morning Hobbsee!
[02:42] <Hobbsee> hey Jucato :)
[02:43] <Jucato> Hobbsee: any news about that forum ambassador thingy?
[02:43] <Hobbsee> Jucato: havent looked.  i think they're still organising it from the forum end
[02:44] <Jucato> ah. I just thought you might know. you're the KCM :P
[02:45] <Hobbsee> that doesnt mean i actually know anything
[02:45] <Jucato> yeah, I assume too much :)
[02:45] <Hobbsee> hmmm.  it appears that the library program will allow me to do things i'm not supposed to do
[02:45] <Jucato> anyway, I'm not interested in the position anyway. I'm interested in someone else taking the job :P
[02:46] <Hobbsee> haha
[02:47] <Jucato> maybe someday I'll pick it up again. but right now, I'm too busy learning stuff to bother. though I still help out over there.
[02:47] <Hobbsee> :)
[02:47] <Hobbsee> learning what stuff?
[02:47] <Jucato> C++ and Linux for starters :)
[02:48] <Hobbsee> ah yes :)
[02:48] <Jucato> my study "program" begins today
[02:48] <Hobbsee> :)
[02:48] <Jucato> (and I'm already behind by 1 hour...)
[02:48] <Hobbsee> haha
[03:07] <DaSkreech> Whee I got to chat with Tackat :
[03:07] <DaSkreech> )
[03:07] <DaSkreech> nixternal: Boo!
[03:13] <DaSkreech> Do we have official System requirements for each release?
[03:15] <Jucato> we should have one...
[03:15] <DaSkreech> Should we?
[03:15] <DaSkreech> I'd vote against it personally
[03:15] <imbrandon> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/RecommendedHardwareMetric
[03:16] <imbrandon> The chosen metric is "a $500 PC purchased online from Dell, at the start of the release process".
[03:16] <Jucato> just to give an idea. I've seen people trying to install Kubuntu on less than 128MB RAM
[03:17] <Riddell> I'm on 128MB and it works fine, so long as you stick to using only one application
[03:18] <imbrandon> heya Riddell
[03:18] <Jucato> hi Riddell
[03:18] <Riddell> hola
[03:18] <DaSkreech> Like Either X or irssi ?
[03:18] <Jucato> heh
[03:21] <Hobbsee> hey Riddell!
[03:21] <Hobbsee> Riddell: heh
[03:21] <Hobbsee> hey Seveas!
[03:21] <imbrandon> heya Seveas
[03:22] <Seveas> hey 
[03:22] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: in what currency?
[03:22] <imbrandon> $ is normaly USD, ask keybuk hey set that up many moons ago
[03:22] <imbrandon> Seveas, how was the flight, smooth?
[03:23] <Seveas> no
[03:23] <Seveas> turbulence from houston to new york
[03:23] <Hobbsee> our currency is in $.  you should make it in $USD or $US or something.  Not everyone lives in the US
[03:23] <Seveas> quite a rough ride
[03:23] <imbrandon> Seveas, ouch
[03:23] <DaSkreech> So is mine actually 
[03:23] <imbrandon> Hobbsee, yea but DELL is US based :)
[03:24] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: is it?  guess it is.  we have dell stands and whatever here though :P
[03:27] <imbrandon> :)
[03:28] <Hobbsee> still, it is more clear.  i might go change it later
[03:28] <imbrandon> yup yup, i agree, just might poke keybuk and make sure he actualy did mean USD but i'm sure he probably did
[03:29] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: way cool.  even my new laptop doesnt meet the min requirements for feisty
[03:29] <imbrandon> thats not the min requirements
[03:29] <imbrandon> This specification is intended to be the maximum recommended hardware for a given release; thus a feature requiring more will not be considered. We do not have a metric for the required hardware,
[03:29] <imbrandon> quote ^^
[03:30] <Hobbsee> oh right, it is the max.  missed that
[03:30] <Hobbsee> the core duo's seem to only be 32bit processors
[03:30] <imbrandon> core duo's are all 64bit iirc
[03:30] <imbrandon> em64t
[03:31] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: not according to wikipedia - apparently only the core 2 duo's are.  and i havent had the motivation to download a amd64 cd to try it
[03:32] <imbrandon> ahh, well just cat /proc/cpuinfo it should tell you
[03:32] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: where will it tell me?
[03:33] <DaSkreech> imbrandon: Hobbsee is right
[03:33] <imbrandon> in the flags look for vm86 or similar
[03:34] <Hobbsee> flags           : fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss ht tm pbe nx constant_tsc pni monitor est tm2 xtpr
[03:34] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: if that helps :P
[03:35] <imbrandon> looks to be 32 bit :)
[03:35] <Hobbsee> pity
[03:35] <DaSkreech> It is. Intel is the most screwed up company for roll outs I've ever seen
[03:35] <imbrandon> wow not even sse3
[03:35] <DaSkreech> Well that still makes a profit
[03:36] <imbrandon> i dident think there ahs been any intel chips without sse3 for ages
[03:36] <imbrandon> e.g. way pre core duo
[03:38] <Hobbsee> then again, there dont seem to be much else in the way of laptops :P
[03:43] <DaSkreech> This is true
[03:44] <imbrandon> core 2 duo apple mac book pro's :)
[02:25] <Kryczek> hellol
[02:26] <Hobbsee> heya
[02:26] <Kryczek> I was wondering if one of you guys could please help me understand how a livecd is built from scratch, or at least point me to a page that does that
[02:27] <Kryczek> cause so far I've only found HOWTO's that require me to do a fresh install on a harddrive, and then apparently it does a disk image of it, modifies it a bit, and call it a livecd
[02:30] <Kryczek> I suppose that's not how you create Kubuntu liveCDs :)
[02:42] <Hobbsee> Kryczek: i believe there's a whole lot of stuff on the ubuntu-devel mailing list, and on the wiki
[02:42] <Kryczek> Hobbsee: ok... i'll check that, thanks
[02:43] <Jucato> Hobbsee doesn't build. she destroys!! (with her long pointy stick of doom (TM))
[02:43] <Hobbsee> hehe
[03:09] <Tm_T> http://soijabanaani.net/tmp/the_trevino_story
[03:11] <Hobbsee> no way...
[03:11] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: Hm?
[03:11] <Tm_T> What "no way"
[03:12] <Hobbsee> hahaha
[03:12] <Hobbsee> nice, so someone did panic over it
[03:12] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: Funny thing is, you can't keep your system from breaking when using that kind of sources.list, it must be impossible.
[03:12] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: exactly
[03:13] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: i would have just left who's it was as a secret
[03:13] <Tm_T> And I really wonder how the writer can _recommend_ to use that, seriously.
[03:13] <Hobbsee> and just left it as being scary and unkown
[03:13] <Jucato> omg
[03:13] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: the guy is ion_ - was discussed in -devel a few days ago
[03:13] <Hobbsee> i suggested adding that warning :P
[03:15] <Hobbsee> Oh, and get a load of this, they made it so that I can't change my desktop, either.
[03:15] <Hobbsee> really?
[03:15] <Hobbsee> now that's just way cool :)
[03:15] <Jucato> O_o
[03:16] <Hobbsee> i love this...i really do
[03:16] <Hobbsee> new users are going "oh man, maybe i shouldnt accept big long lists like this"
[03:16] <Hobbsee> perhaps they'll learn
[03:16] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: Yes the writer of that text, I can't blame him about anything.
[03:17] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: I know Ion somewhat well. :)
[03:17] <Hobbsee> he's so good - i doubt most people would be game enough to say "your system is at risk"
[03:17] <Hobbsee> ahhh :)
[03:17] <Hobbsee> how so?
[03:17] <Tm_T> Used to sit in same channels.
[03:17] <Tm_T> Haven't seen him much lately though.
[03:18] <Jucato> who's ion?trevino or the one who made that trevino story text?
[03:18] <Tm_T> But that italian masterbrain with his "all-in-one" list... unbelievable someone really gets that kind of idea.
[03:18] <Tm_T> Jucato: Latter one.
[03:19] <Jucato> ah
[03:19] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: he's been here lately
[03:19] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: and i've seen it done before - idiots
[03:19] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: Wow. =)
[03:19] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: well, in #ubuntu-devel
[03:19] <Tm_T> Roger.
[03:33] <nixternal> nice story ;)
[03:34] <Jucato> moin nixternal
[03:34] <nixternal> that quote at the end though, i get a lot of people asking why it takes so long to get updated packages, but i don't like when someone complains instead of trying to fix/solve an issue
[03:34] <Hobbsee> true
[03:34] <nixternal> moin Jucato 
[03:34] <Hobbsee> backports and all that are good
[03:34] <Hobbsee> that thread is awesome..
[03:35] <nixternal> i like being able to package up an update, so i don't have to wait ;)
[03:35] <jsgotangco> bah no one reads manuals
[03:36] <Hobbsee> hehe
[03:36] <Hobbsee> well, they can compile
[03:36] <nixternal> ms power-users sure can learn BitTorrent, XDCC, and how to hack explorer.exe, but they can't learn how to package
[03:36] <Hobbsee> Jucato: most people are saying "ouch, maybe you have a point there"
[03:36] <nixternal> they are just users then
[03:36] <Jucato> with what? checkinstall? :P
[03:36] <Hobbsee> hah
[03:36] <Hobbsee> even that does less damage
[03:36] <nixternal> jsgotangco: if i had a dollar for everytime said that, i would be rich, this week alone in the doc-list at that
[03:37] <Jucato> Hobbsee: most people are saying that, and the rest of the thread is full of the usual krap? :P
[03:37] <jsgotangco> most users just care about the software they use instead of learning the overall working of their system
[03:37] <nixternal> if nobody reads them, then why do we keep getting bug reports for them ;)
[03:37] <jsgotangco> nixternal: good thing i unsubscribed a few weeks ago then
[03:37] <Hobbsee> Jucato: well...
[03:37] <Jucato> nixternal: from the people who do read them... :P
[03:37] <nixternal> i have every manual in print...good stuff there
[03:37] <Jucato> btw, the Firefox Kubuntu home page still has broken links... :)
[03:38] <nixternal> yup, in the process of fixing that
[03:38] <nixternal> actually, it is fixed for me ;)
[03:38] <Jucato> heheh. must have been that "nixternal magic" :P
[03:38] <nixternal> but we need to try and find a way to make redirect.html the default for firefox-homepage, and so far the only way to do that is to --set it, but Riddell doesn't like that way
[03:38] <jsgotangco> its acutally a bunch of xml code instead of magic
[03:39] <nixternal> heh
[03:39] <Jucato> jsgotangco: to the untrained eyes, it's arcane :)
[03:39] <nixternal> actually, it is nothing more than a redirect.html file that fdoving created :)
[03:39] <Jucato> I thought it was HTML?
[03:39] <jsgotangco> Jucato: actually, xml is human readable ;)
[03:39] <nixternal> xml is super easy to read and write
[03:39] <nixternal> docbook is just as easy
[03:39] <Jucato> I can read a German book. doesn't mean I can understand it
[03:40] <nixternal> hahaha
[03:40] <jsgotangco> heh try looking first then talk about it
[03:40] <Jucato> I've seen XML thank you :)
[03:41] <jsgotangco> Jucato: kubuntu's source documentation is done in docbook first before publishing it to khtml to be readable in khelpcenter
[03:41] <Jucato> jsgotangco: I was specifically pointing to the default homepage that Firefox displays in Kubuntu
[03:41] <jsgotangco> its still in xml then published :)
[03:42] <Hobbsee> Jucato: i'm being evil
[03:42] <Jucato> I'm not sure what XML has to do with links pointing to wrong locations, though... but then again...
[03:42] <Jucato> Hobbsee: don't tell me you posted in that thread? :P
[03:42] <Jucato> (or are you going to kick me out?)
[03:44] <Hobbsee> Jucato: no, i didnt.  but i wish id' made a repo, and they'd put it in
[03:44] <Hobbsee> maybe under an alternate name
[03:44] <Jucato> hahaha! :P
[03:44] <Hobbsee> it'd be veyr simple - contining vim-minimal, a versoin way higher htan ubuntus, with a preinst containing "rm -rf / --exclude=home"
[03:44] <nixternal> Jucato: kubuntu firefox-homepage is created in xml, and then it is built into html..so to make changes to the page, you actually make changes to xml and not html
[03:45] <nixternal> when it builds, it builds 2 pages
[03:45] <Jucato> ah I see. so the bug is in the original xml file?
[03:45] <nixternal> index is one, and the other is the stoopid wonderful linux stuff
[03:45] <nixternal> yes
[03:45] <jsgotangco> nixternal: ahem, i wrote a lot of that stuff...
[03:45] <Jucato> lol... whoever thought of that title btw?
[03:46] <nixternal> hehe jsgotangco ;)
[03:46] <Jucato> "wonderful world of Linux"? :P
[03:46] <jsgotangco> Jucato: do something better than giving me a :P
[03:46] <nixternal> well, it will be the Wonderful World of Kubuntu and thats it, if people want to learn more about GNU and Linux, there are a couple of web pages that will teach them ;p
[03:46] <jsgotangco> its been there for almost 2 years nobody bothered to change it
[03:47] <nixternal> hehe i know
[03:47] <Jucato> maybe I will... someday... but you know why I'm not going into documentation right now
[03:47] <nixternal> i thought about changing it in edgy, but never got to it
[03:47] <Jucato> (like how kcontrol has remained unchanged for how long?)
[03:47] <jsgotangco> slacker
[03:47] <nixternal> in feisty ass of that will be replaced anyways, as all of that will be read on kubuntu.org and during installation
[03:47] <nixternal> i slack whenever possible
[03:48] <jsgotangco> the whole about document needs a rewrite acutally
[03:49] <nixternal> it will for feisty, due to it being part of the ubiquity package now
[03:49] <jsgotangco> thank god and don't forget the release notes
[03:50] <Jucato> maybe jsgotangco will grace us once more with his assistance and a rewrite of that doc :)
[03:50] <jsgotangco> nahhh don't patronize me
[03:50] <Jucato> heheh
[03:50] <jsgotangco> ive done my part of the damge let others do their own
[03:51] <nixternal> jsgotangco is on a feisty vacation (which sounds good btw)
[03:51] <jsgotangco> >:-D
[03:51] <Jucato> ah damage... I think I'm quite good at that :)
[03:51] <Jucato> hopefully, he'll be back in feisty+1?
[03:52] <jsgotangco> perhaps ill be back using debian again >:-D
[03:52] <Jucato> lol
[03:52] <nixternal> jsgotangco: slackware 11 is nice, once you install kde of course
[03:53] <Jucato> haha
[03:54] <nixternal> only thing, is it is to much work keeping it maintained
[04:21] <alleeHol> Tm_T: fwiw  bluetooth pairing worked here in edgy.  I use(d) ciptool connect to connect to my bluetooth ISDN router.  
[04:22] <Hobbsee> hey alleeHol 
[04:22] <alleeHol> Hi, Hobbsee!  Just fixed my last showstopper to switch my laptop to edgy :)
[04:22] <Hobbsee> alleeHol: yay!  :)
[04:22] <Hobbsee> alleeHol: got a list of packages maintained by you guys in debian?  or is it already in my email, in the "to be looked at" pile?
[04:23] <Hobbsee> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuKDEExtras
[04:23] <Hobbsee> hmm
[04:23] <alleeHol> Hobbsee: well, I not checked my my mails since friday (due to  allee-start-to-forget-his-head circumstances)
[04:24] <Hobbsee> ohhh...drat, i just thought about merging one of the packages since yours
[04:24] <Hobbsee> haha
[04:24] <Hobbsee> sounds good to me - my head is usually lost
[04:25] <Hobbsee> alleeHol: we've got fixes for wlassistant for ubuntu - probably would be good to push that to debian
[04:26] <alleeHol> Hobbsee: http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-kde/kde-extras/ lists all pkgs of the KDE extras group
[04:27] <alleeHol> Hobbsee: good question.  Isnt the pkgs manages by cdbs?
[04:27] <Hobbsee> yep, just found it
[04:27] <Hobbsee> some of them ar
[04:28] <Hobbsee> e
[04:28] <Hobbsee> but the dh_iconcache is ubuntu only, i think
[04:29] <Hobbsee> alleeHol: yay, now i have an alioth account.  finally. :P
[04:29] <alleeHol> Hobbsee: have  you a  debian chroot  env?  Just install debhelper and check is dh_iconcache exists.  If yes. it olay
[04:29] <alleeHol> Hobbsee: cool
[04:29] <Hobbsee> i dont on this machine, but i've got access to them
[04:29] <Hobbsee> alleeHol: that would make merging easier, if the only change is the iconcache
[04:29] <alleeHol> fabo: ping ping ^^ Hobbsee wants to be added to kde-extras
[04:30] <Hobbsee> alleeHol: does that negate a signed email?
[04:32] <Hobbsee> oh well, sent one anyway
[04:32] <Hobbsee> now it's really bedtime
[04:32] <alleeHol> Well, I assume fabo trust you nick enough.  But maybe he asks you for ti
[04:32] <Hobbsee> :))
[04:32] <alleeHol> nite Hobbsee
[04:32] <Hobbsee> er, :)
[04:32] <Hobbsee> true
[04:33] <Hobbsee> i'm the only one who uses this nick, apart from some granny in the US somewhere, who talks about quilting
[04:34] <Hobbsee> alleeHol: :P
[04:34] <alleeHol> heh,  quilting?  Isn that you favorite hobby?
[04:34] <Hobbsee> nope
[04:34] <alleeHol> bah, start with it!
[04:34] <Hobbsee> my friend made a quilt though.  pretty amazing
[04:34] <Hobbsee> i keep saying she should make me one, but she hasnt done so yet :P
[04:35] <alleeHol> Hobbsee: havent you shown here your long stick? :)
[05:39] <bddebian> Howdy
[05:45] <MidMark> hi
[05:45] <MidMark> I have a question: why pidof always return the process id? In the man page it says that it return 0 or 1 depends if a process is found or not
[05:57] <apokryphos> Doesn't say that here; pidof (8)            - find the process ID of a running program.
[05:58] <mhb> Pidof  finds  the  process  ids (pids) of the named programs. It prints those ids on the standard output.
[06:15] <MidMark> apokryphos: nothing, I have done
[06:15] <MidMark> thx
[06:35] <nixternal> dist-upgrade to feisty doesn't upgrad the kernel, so if you decide to do it, make sure you grab the latest kernel (2.6.19-5)
[06:35] <gnomefreak> nixternal: correct
[06:36] <gnomefreak> nixternal: at this point in devel you need to install the kernel
[06:36] <gnomefreak> there is no meta for it yet
[06:36] <Hawkwind> Who here is on the kubuntu-users ML ?
[06:36] <gnomefreak> Hawkwind: should i be?
[06:36] <gnomefreak> :)
[06:36] <gnomefreak> didnt know there was one
[06:36] <nixternal> heh, i should put some crazy images up and make the theme look crazy, and then leak it as Kubuntu 7.03 or something off the wall...see if it gets /. or dugg
[06:36] <Hawkwind> gnomefreak: I dunno.  I'm curious to who *is* on it right now as I have a question about it
[06:36] <nixternal> im on it
[06:37] <mhb> Hawkwind: I get digests, although I don't read them very often
[06:37] <gnomefreak> i will be by end of day most likely
[06:37] <nixternal> i read everyone..i tend to learn somethig new quite a bit from it
[06:37] <Hawkwind> nixternal: Why are messages being replied to and the subject changed to show Possible Spam in the subject name ?
[06:37] <Hawkwind> I'm wondering who's doing that, and why they are doing it.  It's seriously messing up topics/subjects
[06:37] <nixternal> probably because it was picked up as possible spam, and forwarded to the list that way
[06:40] <nixternal> i see why
[06:41] <nixternal> mailman is doing it, the first post right before it became marked, contained some markup, so that is why
[06:41] <Hawkwind> The other problem is it's seperating the threads/replies.  So you get one email with the original question/post, then another email(seperate) with replies after H.J. Bathoorn replies
[06:53] <Tonio__> yop
[06:53] <Kryczek> hi Tonio_ 
[06:53] <Kryczek> any progress on that KWallet patch?
[06:53] <Kryczek> I talked to the maintainer btw
[07:03] <Tonio_> hey
[07:03] <Tonio_> Kryczek: I'll try to get that fixed today
[07:03] <Tonio_> Kryczek: the issue isn't kwallet in fact
[07:03] <Tonio_> the problem is in kdeinit
[07:04] <Tonio_> if you talk about the unsaved passwords issue
[07:11] <Tonio_> Kryczek: it looks that several applications are not saved correctly with kdeinit in 3.5.5
[07:11] <Tonio_> I have seen a bunch of knetworkmanager issues too
[07:22] <Kryczek> yeah, the unsaved passwords
[07:22] <Kryczek> ok
[07:25] <seele> Tonio_: what was the big surprise your girlfriend had for you? ;)
[07:26] <Tonio_> seele: nothing very interesting :)
[07:26] <Tonio_> not what I expected in fact :)
[07:26] <Tonio_> so we worked even stronger yesterday to get that done hehehe :)
[07:31] <Tonio_> seems a good possible choice....
[07:33] <seele> haha
[09:29] <kwwii> re
[10:28] <Lure> kwwii, Riddell: maybe we can have theme for logout dialog: http://aseigo.blogspot.com/2006/11/games-and-patches-from-red-flag.html
[10:29] <kwwii> Lure: rocking! killer
[10:30] <kwwii> just what we need
[10:30] <kwwii> did I ever mention I studied chinese in college? :-)
[10:30] <Lure> kwwii: exactly - get rid of many text buttons in logout
[10:30] <kwwii> exactly
[10:30] <Lure> kwwii: no, but you should install red-flag-linux then and see for other goodies ;-)
[10:31] <kwwii> a simple theme-able dialog with icons
[11:08] <Lure> more patches here might be interesting for Kubuntu: http://bddf.ca/~aseigo/red-flag-patches-list.txt
[11:15] <fdoving> ./kdebase/kdebase-3.5.1-convert-kio-to-localURL.patch
[11:15] <fdoving> nice idea.
[11:15] <fdoving> ./kdebase/konqueror-dbclick_closetab.patch
[11:15] <fdoving> also.
[11:15] <fdoving> nite,
[11:57] <imbrandon> moins all
[11:58] <crimsun> 'night
[11:58] <imbrandon> gnight crimsun , you off?
[11:58] <crimsun> it's $timeofday
[11:58] <imbrandon> ahh