=== licio [n=licio@ubuntu/member/licio] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === DrPepperKid [n=mirco@unaffiliated/macslow] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === _ion [i=johan@kiviniemi.name] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === poningru [n=poningru@ip72-209-68-178.ga.at.cox.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Hobbsee [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Hobbsee_ [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Hobbsee_ [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === freeflying [n=freeflyi@ubuntu/member/freeflying] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === freeflying [i=flyingfr@gobstopper.dreamhost.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === fernando [n=fernando@unaffiliated/musb] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === fernando [n=fernando@unaffiliated/musb] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === nmsa [n=nmsa@202.182.31.90] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === fernando [n=fernando@unaffiliated/musb] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === rrittenhouse [n=tad@cpe-76-188-35-66.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Yawner [n=alex@82-44-194-226.cable.ubr07.haye.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === gustavol1 [n=gustavo@201.37.115.208] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === j_ack [n=rudi@p508DB70C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Burgundavia [n=corey@S0106000fb085cc63.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === maccabeus [n=ircer@c-71-236-241-193.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === maccabeus [n=ircer@c-71-236-241-193.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Burgundavia [n=corey@ubuntu/member/burgundavia] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [04:48] anybody out there? [04:54] yes, but this isn't a help channel [04:55] 5 bugs reported already [04:58] np -- not looking for help === maccabeus [n=ircer@c-71-236-241-193.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === Burgundavia [n=corey@ubuntu/member/burgundavia] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === MacSlow [n=mirco@unaffiliated/macslow] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === juliux [n=juliux@ubuntu/member/juliux] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Lure [n=lure@ubuntu/member/lure] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === slomo_ [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === robitaille [i=robitail@ubuntu/member/robitaille] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === dholbach [n=daniel@i59F71272.versanet.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === pradeep [n=pradeep@59.92.69.197] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === mvo [n=egon@p54A65BD0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === freeflying [i=flyingfr@ubuntu/member/freeflying] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Yawner [n=alex@82-44-194-226.cable.ubr07.haye.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Panzerboy [n=stelian@unaffiliated/panzerboy] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === dous [n=dous@124.104.0.197] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === alefteris [n=alefteri@athedsl-123945.otenet.gr] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === alefteris [n=alefteri@athedsl-123945.otenet.gr] has left #ubuntu-meeting [""] === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === dand [n=dand@gw.datagroup.ro] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === willvdl [n=will@vc-196-207-41-253.3g.vodacom.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [11:10] @schedule [11:10] Schedule for Etc/UTC: 29 Nov 12:00: Edubuntu === willvdl [n=will@vc-196-207-41-253.3g.vodacom.co.za] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] === juliux [n=juliux@ubuntu/member/juliux] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [11:16] @schedule berlin [11:16] Schedule for Europe/Berlin: 29 Nov 13:00: Edubuntu === Hobbsee [n=Hobbsee@CPE-124-189-12-73.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === finalbeta [n=finalbet@d5152A68A.access.telenet.be] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Adri2000 [n=Adri2000@unaffiliated/adri2000] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === fernando [n=fernando@unaffiliated/musb] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Huahua [n=hua_@122.0.229.83] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === rodarvus_ [n=rodarvus@200.176.1.26] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === MatthewV [n=MatthewV@202.183.115.23] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Huahua [n=hua_@122.0.229.83] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === jerom1 [n=jeromeb@LSt-Amand-152-32-6-178.w82-127.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Ubugtu] : Current meeting: Edubuntu | Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | === jerom1 [n=jeromeb@LSt-Amand-152-32-6-178.w82-127.abo.wanadoo.fr] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === jerom1 [n=jeromeb@LSt-Amand-152-32-6-178.w82-127.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === RichEd [n=richard@dsl-241-80-195.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Kamping_Kaiser [n=kgoetz@easyubuntu/docteam/kgoetz] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [12:54] :) [12:54] hi RichEd [12:54] hi Kamping_Kaiser ... juliux ... life slowly getting back to normal .... for a few weeks at least [12:55] RichEd, hehe [12:55] RichEd, hope you get some stuff done in your normal weeks :) [12:55] i hope to catch you some time in them, just btw :) [12:56] RichEd, i am in contact with a school inberlin, they are using edubuntu on a few pc;) [12:56] hope so too ... on both accounts ... looks like it may be quiet until Jan, and then 3 more countries in 1 month :( [12:56] juliux: great :) we'll sneak in slowly ... and become a majority :) [12:56] RichEd, i will do so;) [12:57] sorry but i have to go to university now:(((( [12:57] i will read the log [12:57] np juliux : we'll be chatting soon ... probably early next week' === Burgundavia [n=corey@S0106000fb085cc63.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === RichEd -> coffee ... back in 3 === willvdl [n=will@vc-196-207-41-253.3g.vodacom.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ogra looks at the agenda .... [12:59] meh, please dont edit the static parts of it ... there is a section for additional topics .... [12:59] hmm, cbx33 isnt here ... [01:02] um... meeting? [01:02] yes ? [01:03] ogra: do you feel up to driving the meeting ? [01:03] i'm fine driving the tech issues [01:03] okie ... [01:03] ready when you are :) [01:03] since i dont have much to say yet ... edubuntu-desktop and ltsp were moved to match feisty ... we're preparing the first milestone CD for thursday [01:04] thats about it on the tech side ... dunno how much we can reveal public abotu the poland outcome yet ... [01:04] (until there are definite things) [01:05] cbx33 suggested a discussion about an edubuntu TB [01:05] but he's not here [01:05] tb? [01:05] pity [01:05] technical board [01:05] oh === rraphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [01:05] he thinks we should ahve a more democratic approach for leading development ... [01:05] I think it's a nice idea [01:05] while i agree i think its a bit early for that [01:06] will help to pull in more developers [01:06] we dont have many devs yet, so there is no real benefit in managing teams etc [01:06] the team is only a handfull ... [01:07] apart from that i think we will need such a structure at some point ... [01:07] see your point [01:08] but currently it looks to me that it would generate useless extra work with more meetings etc without weighting out the benefit we'll have from it [01:10] ogra, what happens with the milestoe CD [01:10] apart from that we discuss thech issues in the meeting here and now, that should be enough until we have a crowd of devs that becomes hard to manage ... [01:10] willvdl, ?? can you be more specific ? [01:10] imho, it is nice from a philosofical PoV, but mostly bureaucracy at this moment (as ogra said, the team is still quite small to have a TB) [01:11] just wondering if it's not really early for one? [01:11] willvdl, well, the release schedule is our rule ;) [01:11] actually its important to start early with the milestones to see the breakage ;) [01:12] is it basically edgy with whatever feisty inclusions there are present in it [01:12] willvdl: yes. [01:12] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeistyReleaseSchedule [01:12] new installer, though. [01:12] ah. [01:13] as ogra says; if we don't start off doing milestones early we get to play a month of catch-up, which leads to the milestone freeze lasting a week which makes people angry at me which makes me sad. [01:13] it wont have the two CD spilt or anything yet ... or any nifty stuff ... [01:13] and since I don't like to be sad and developers don't like to be angry, we do frequent milestones instead. [01:14] Mithrandir, i ove you for the freezes :) [01:14] no problem with the schedule, just curious what would be in it [01:14] its a snapshot from the current archive ... stabilized for installability [01:14] (which is what the freeze is for) [01:15] that's what all the milestones are, really. [01:15] right [01:16] RichEd, any additions to the tech side of life ? [01:16] not too much ... just that we are all looking forward to feisty features :) [01:16] yeah :) [01:17] People are impressed with the directory sign-on & fat client ... [01:17] fat clietn would rock [01:17] i'm already poking around in the fat client area since yesterday ... [01:17] have you explained to the people here the main new features ? or have they all seen them on the wiki ? [01:18] chatted last week about them [01:18] but we'll need the auth-server in place first, moquist was doing a lot with it already, i'll have to check the code [01:18] fat client takes us into the realms of "education enterprise deployment" ... manage thousands of w/s from one master config. [01:19] edubuntu-network-auth-client and edubuntu-network-auth-server are the two most impotrant ones [01:19] Which means we will start pushing the buttons of decision makers, and not just local school Admins. [01:19] then we have ltsp-fat-clients and edgy-plusone-thinclient-sound [01:19] ogra, how much work is that (he asks naively) [01:19] auth-serv that is [01:20] the auth server is already implemented by moquist .. its majorly translating his scripts into sane package defaults for existing packages [01:20] he uses it with ubuntu at his schools [01:21] cool [01:21] i hope to be done with the initial implementation before end of the year, fat-clients are easy and almost ready and should just afll into place then === freeflying_ [n=freeflyi@221.222.74.190] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [01:22] the sound architecture will be a bit more since we need to teach pulse to ignore certain autoconfig options, but shouldnt be hard either [01:22] i expect that to be done before the distro sprint [01:22] nice [01:23] ltsp-management-gui and student-control-panel-upgrade are real development efforts, they will take their time [01:24] the ltsp-persistent-home spec is already implemented by sbalneav, just not committed to the packages yet [01:24] looks like lots is going on [01:24] well, and local-apps seems not to happen in ubuntu directly, but i know sbalneav plans the for upstream ltsp, so we'll just inherit it [01:24] I'm really interested in the SCP and LTSP-gui [01:24] (the spec isnt approved yet) [01:25] yeah === licio [n=licio@ubuntu/member/licio] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [01:25] yeah, SCP will rock [01:25] it will make such a difference [01:26] but we'll have to rename both, in an agreement with jammcq (ltsp upstream) we'll call them "thin-client-manager" (SCP) and "thin-client-configurator" (ltsp-manager) === jerom1 [n=jeromeb@LSt-Amand-152-32-6-178.w82-127.abo.wanadoo.fr] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] [01:26] ltsp wants to get rid of the ltsp branding in all apps [01:26] thin-client-manager could be a bit misleading [01:27] well, actually it would be thin-client-session-manager [01:27] as a name [01:27] but thats a bit long [01:27] tcsm then :) === Hobbsee_ [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [01:28] "manager" might create the wrong expectation [01:28] the idea is to leave out complicated words without meaning ... my mother wouldnt know about "session" [01:28] well, yu manage thin-client connections [01:28] *you [01:28] while with the other tool you configure thin-client connections [01:29] it's probably a moot point, but "manager" might mean that you manage the thin-client itself [01:29] well, you will probably be able to at some point ;) [01:29] as in configure, etc [01:29] i.e. shut down the clients.... [01:29] or reboot them ... or make changes on the fly [01:30] hmm, in that case [01:30] no objections then :) === _ion [i=johan@kiviniemi.name] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [01:30] but suggestions for better names are always welcome indeed :) [01:31] its just important the the "ltsp" goes away and has something more descriptive [01:31] which was the reason for "thin-client" [01:31] what if it goes fat-client too? [01:31] it wont [01:32] ltsp-fat-client? [01:32] fat clients will have their own mechanism, since they are totally different underneath ... you will rather have a "golden workstation" where you make all the changes to the system like to any other ubuntu system [01:32] thinking purely of namespace... [01:33] they will then be picked up by the other fat clients [01:33] oh, right ... thats a ... [01:33] netbooted-workstation then ;) [01:34] fat-client is a bad term anyway [01:34] cool. I just get the feeling that "thin-client" changes definition somewhat every now and then [01:34] a thin client is a diskless device that runs the display and in/output for a session running on the server [01:35] thin clients can do local processing as well cant tehy? otehrwise they are a terminal...? [01:35] some thin-clients have disks or flash-ram [01:35] right [01:35] but still thats the official definition we use for a thin client ... [01:36] I can understand the need for dropping "terminal" though [01:36] ambiguous that one is [01:36] anyhoo, it's an ltsp decision that one [01:36] right [01:36] thin-client is something users can imagine ... ltsp isnt [01:36] thats the main reason [01:37] we'll very likely switch to ubuntu-thin-client-server from ltsp-server at some point as well [01:38] ok, if there are no other tech issues i'd say we should move on [01:38] yeah, we hammered that one down :) [01:39] next topic: Technical Documentation [01:39] and i'd like to postpone further discussion about the TB issue until more devs are present ... [01:39] woot [01:39] (i.e. next meeting) [01:39] or at least cbx33 :) [01:39] yeah [01:40] well, Laser would also be nice [01:40] pity cbx33 and LaserJock aren't here [01:40] anyhoo, I've been looking hard into docs recently [01:40] yay [01:40] which includes marketing on some levels too [01:40] and have scratchpad (https://wiki.edubuntu.org/WillVanDerLeij) which will find a logical home soon [01:41] Firstly though, we need to get into the SVN repo [01:42] and so doing integrate more into Ubuntu Doc Proj [01:42] thin-client-config and getting-started both are dapper oriented and need updates [01:42] ogra, which brings me to versions... [01:43] We need 6.06 versions obviously [01:43] and 6.10 versions [01:43] while contributing to 7.04 [01:43] the pages sbalneav wrote for the handbook are fine for ltsp documentation [01:43] (6.10 and 7.04) [01:43] willvdl: i spoke to newz2000 about how we tag info to apply to a release version .... [01:43] gettingstarted and thinclientconfig are fine for 6.06 [01:44] we need to get some sort of systematic approach ... some info does not apply to all releases, and some does [01:44] wiki & wwww [01:44] ogra, you're referring to help.u.c? [01:44] right, there are changes during development ... added features or changed ones [01:44] RichEd, that's my 3rd point :) [01:45] :) [01:45] willvdl, nope, to the handbook parts in svn [01:45] ogra, cool. doc.u.c only refers to trunk so it is not really that helpful [01:45] note that we need a back-review of existing ... and then a policy for tagging new docs (by the author at time of creation hopefully) [01:46] willvdl, ask sbalneav where they are exactly ... even if the handboook isnt ready his ltsp pieces will work standalone [01:46] RichEd and tagging contributions to docs [01:46] will do [01:47] My point is we need official versions for "About" [01:48] Do we need a "Desktop Guide" like K/Ubuntu? [01:48] (looking at help.u.c) [01:49] nope [01:49] we need guides for the added value [01:49] but not for the desktop itself ... [01:50] We use apps from both, so we would refer to the other Desktop Guides [01:50] having the original ubutu docs for server and desktop should be fine ... we should wrap a nice css around them to rebrand and add extra docs for the changes [01:50] our "Desktop Guide" would then be only our added value... [01:50] nope, it would be a combo [01:51] s we can benefit from the exisiting docs [01:51] sorry bit confused... [01:52] we need to refer to the K/Ubuntu desktop guides somewhere [01:52] nope [01:52] or auto-capture their info? [01:52] we will include the ubuntu server/desktop guide with a different branding and theme so they match edubuntu [01:52] and add chapters for the added value [01:53] and where would the added chapters live? [01:53] during packaging the ubuntu docs will be rebranded and merged with our extra docs ... [01:54] everything will end up in the edubuntu-docs package which already exists as an empty package ... [01:54] point being there would still be an Edubuntu Desktop Guide? [01:55] yes, it would be the merged doc [01:55] with our added chapters and the merged sections from Ubuntu [01:55] Excellent [01:55] right [01:55] sorry [01:55] thats what i was planning ... [01:55] lawnmowers outside my window [01:55] so we only need to maintain the additions [01:55] rebranding and themeing shoud happen automatically [01:56] (and merging) [01:56] groovy [01:56] yay docbook + svn [01:57] So we have our "standard" stuff and the Handbook [01:57] right [01:57] The Handbook will need versioning [01:57] first it will need finishing :P [01:57] :) [01:57] I'm curious about the School Advocacy doc [01:58] Would that not logically become the "About Edubuntu" doc? [01:58] hedgemage and pygi both disappeared somehow ... [01:58] we'll need a new handbook team i suspect [01:58] (oh, and jerome as well) [01:58] ogra, got a plan brewing :P [01:58] it is cunning I hope [01:58] :( that's quite a few "pillars" we've lost [01:58] currently sbalneav is the only active handbook writer [01:59] https://help.ubuntu.com/6.06/ubuntu/about-ubuntu/C/index.html [01:59] well, hedgemage wanted to return in the dev area at some point [01:59] ^^^ is the About doc for ubuntu [01:59] willvdl, there is also an about-edubuntu somewhere [01:59] jerome created it long ago [01:59] In the wiki? [01:59] nope, in the edubuntu section of the svn somewhere [02:00] oh. it's not on help.u.c [02:00] i knoe its in svn since breezy or dapper [02:00] *know [02:01] either way, my question is more along the lines of what to do with ESA doc [02:01] It is essentially an "About" doc [02:01] isnt it a bit big for "about" ? === ogra hasnt see it since some time, but imagines its to big [02:02] willvdl: we need to make specific versions ... not the one size fits all [02:02] well it does delve into individual packages [02:02] programmes rather [02:02] people in Edulinuix agreed that a decision maker needs different info to a user / admin [02:02] *Edulinux [02:03] OK, "About" would then be a high level look at what is possible [02:03] and ESA would be a middle level look at what is in edubuntu and what it can do for you [02:04] RichEd, just remember these are official docs rather than promotional or sales materials [02:04] we could have an overview for 4 sections : User, Teacher, Admin, Decision Maker [02:04] = bullet points [02:04] and then a detailed version of each ? [02:05] RichEd but in which doc do you want such info? [02:05] not sure what you mean ... I take it we are talking about Edubuntu Schools Advocacy ? [02:06] So something like: [02:06] #1 ESA - Overview [02:06] #2 ESA - For Users [02:06] #3 ESA - For Teachers [02:06] etc ? [02:06] so #1 is like the About Ubuntu doc [02:07] Yep ... but more for spurring someone to use it, not for someone who has just installed it [02:07] that's what About docs are for [02:07] okay [02:08] OK [02:08] I'll look into splitting up docs for different audiences [02:09] and how to manage the common info [02:09] The Handbook audience is then who specifically? [02:09] admins, teachers, users [02:09] or is it more like the Ubuntu Book, good for everyone [02:10] Hand Book is all Hands On people [02:10] (currently rather admins and administrating teachers afaik) [02:10] (but target should be all three) [02:10] So again, we could (if clever about it) intelligently merge and copy Handbook info into other docs [02:10] It may break in the long term into: Handbook - for Admin / Handbook for Teachers Users [02:11] right [02:11] (Admins spend more time on confirm, Users on applications) [02:11] That would be a packaging thing again [02:11] *config [02:11] gnight all [02:11] Kamping_Kaiser, gnight [02:11] night Kamping_Kaiser :) chat soon [02:11] gnight Kamping_Kaiser [02:11] see you tehn RichEd :) [02:12] The trick is to drive contributions to all supported versions of the docs... === Kamping_Kaiser [n=kgoetz@easyubuntu/docteam/kgoetz] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["More] [02:13] well, released versions of the software wont change much [02:13] agreed, but still need to finish some docs [02:13] so there is no real need for updates on the tech front (beyond enhancements) [02:14] or "known bug" fixes, errata updates etc [02:14] Moving onto the wiki and info in it? === highvoltage is here!!! [02:15] right, then ou just need to provide one url for all versions [02:15] woot, just in time! [02:15] hey highvoltage :) [02:15] ogra, help.u.c [02:15] so you can have perversion subpages on the wiki [02:15] ouch [02:15] that should have been per-version [02:16] hi RichEd, sorry, was reading scrollback [02:16] i'm no friend of h.u.c at all ... [02:16] np [02:16] but if its unavoidable then h.u.c [02:16] ogra, it does host the stable docs... [02:16] ogra: heh, I was just telling willvdl about that earlier [02:16] making it much easier to maintain then the wiki [02:17] willvdl, yeah, and makes quick support impossible if you have the wiki urls stored ... [02:17] ah, see what you mean [02:17] the delay through the forwarding isnt really helpful :) [02:17] must be a clever way round that [02:18] yes, only store the new urls ... but the you miss out the new wiki docs [02:18] well, what are the new wiki docs in this case? [02:18] its something that should be overthought again by a good documentation person imho === jsgotangco [n=jsg123@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:19] we'll soo what the doc team has to say [02:19] https://wiki.edubuntu.org/HowtoWriteLTSP5Plugins would be something new [02:20] it should stay on the wiki so people can change it easily and contribute to it [02:20] OK, or even the capturing of forum info into community doc wiki [02:20] the ubuntu doc team has a process around that. need to study in detail [02:21] willvdl: pips1 and i were talking about forum data, and moving good info into wiki === mruiz [n=mruiz@www.3ie.cl] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:21] that will be a lot of work, you will need reviewers [02:21] we will work on some sort of procedure, because this is a good place for a new community volunteer to help [02:21] RichEd, have a look at the Doc Proj, they have a page up on how they plan to do that [02:22] ogra, I guess I'm only really worried about getting rid of deprecated or outdated wiki pages [02:22] Great. I mean there are people who are keen to help, but say "I am not that technical" ... so they can at least spot a solution, and tidy the thread into a doc as a way to start. [02:22] no [02:22] ?? [02:22] hey [02:22] thats a typical prob with the forums ... [02:22] hey jsgotangco [02:23] explain ogra ? [02:23] jsgotangco, hey === willvdl thinks he sees where ogra is going [02:23] instead of filing bugs and helping in solving them there are workarounds provided in a forum thread instead of getting people to use maolne [02:23] so we'll use valuable info, as well as the users probably loose the advised way to work around a bug [02:24] ogra: I see that there would be moderators in between ... [02:24] technical probs should all be handled via bugs (even workarounds for them) [02:24] who would be that ? you need a decent technical background [02:24] ogra, I guess that is the key probelm in oderating a forum (or even a list) [02:25] currently i rather see all tech people as devs than as reviewers ;) [02:25] So if a user problem crops up in the forum, and some communtiy person explains a solution to a user, then IF it is a good solution and approved, then we make it a wiki page. And then the thread on the forums says: See wiki link for approved solution. [02:25] that still keeps the bug away from the developers attention, so it might never be fixed === willvdl nods [02:26] bugs should really all go into the bugtracker and be discussed there [02:26] That should be part of the approval process. File bug. [02:26] RichEd, it does also depend on what is being fixed [02:26] right ;) [02:26] Not necesaerily a fix, it could just be advice on how to use something that is working ! [02:26] we have many open bugs but we also have many bad advises to work around them ;) [02:26] *neccessarily [02:26] It's just a process question really. Will check with Doc Proj about this === finalbeta [n=finalbet@d5152A68A.access.telenet.be] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:27] in malone you usually have at least one responsible person for development or packaging subscribed [02:28] If we have the same user question popping up often in forums or #edubuntu, then even if we have documented help, that means people are not finding it easily. Hence move to a FAQ page with more visibility. [02:28] ++ [02:28] That's the sort of thinking I mean ... not Fixing Bugs :) [02:28] RichEd, or LaunchPad Answers [02:28] Yep, as long as it is easy to find for the newbie ! and an unregistered nebie as wel ! [02:29] *newbie [02:29] FAQ is always good ... [02:29] any moderated knowledge base is good [02:30] re [02:30] right, despite the fact that you need knoledgeable moderators to have a good quality [02:30] but there is still a great need for wikis and the like...as ogra said, helps in devel [02:30] collaboration rather [02:30] and thats wheer we're lacking atm at least on the tech side ... [02:31] ogra, which sections specifically? [02:31] every dev should do development as first prio atm ... we'll need the bridge people who understand the tech issues but are no coders [02:31] meaning, ubuntu related stuff can be handled by the larger ubunut community [02:32] but the edubuntu specific stuff has been mainly around LTSP [02:32] as we expand out community and audience, we shold have more people at various levels ... depending in the skill of the volunteer, we need to find a good fit for them to feel productive. they can always advance towards dev as their confidence and skills levels grow. [02:32] dont forget for some people think there english is to bad to write bugreports [02:32] it will be mainy around educational software and enterprise techniques in the future [02:32] *mainly [02:32] e.g for Edulinux, ther will be others helping with Training Manuals ... that can be harnessed for our wiki pages. [02:32] *there === gnomefreak [n=gnomefre@ubuntu/member/gnomefreak] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:33] willvdl, LTSP will only be one small aspect in the future ... [02:33] the future, sure, but for now... [02:33] the two CD release opens a ton of new opporunities [02:34] well, i'm taking about feisty [02:34] ogra, agreed [02:34] see where this is going [02:34] anyhoo, back to the wiki... :) === gnomefreak [n=gnomefre@ubuntu/member/gnomefreak] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:34] we'll target more than the classroom, feisty will be a big chnge in all areas === RichEd nods === cjwatson [n=cjwatson@82-69-40-219.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:35] so we should be prepared for that on the doc side [02:36] especially if we dont ship the second CD it will need a good amount of extra docs here [02:36] agreed [02:36] Priority is to get DApper 100% up-t-date === rodarvus [n=rodarvus@ubuntu/member/rodarvus] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:37] ugh [02:37] The wiki needs housekeeping though [02:38] I get what ogra says about linking from the wiki to "official" doc sections [02:38] dapper misses a lot of features and automatisms ... thats a huge effort [02:38] (LTSP wise) === martin_ [n=martin@p508B1FDF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === dand [n=dand@gw.datagroup.ro] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:39] we also need to structure the wiki around the different versions better === martin_ [n=martin@p508B1FDF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:40] at the moment one is not always quite sure which version a specific section is referring to === willvdl remembers RichEd mention tagging [02:40] willvdl: re that structure comment, matt nuzum will give us the "next version of his www structure" soon ... we'll see how we can work with that [02:41] great. [02:41] he is revising the www.ubuntu and wiki.ubuntu ... and what CMS to use [02:42] The requirement we have = "which version" is broader as we get into *ubuntu and "which variant" [02:42] Not only for us in education, but *buntu support in general for Matt [02:42] cool [02:44] I'll keep specifics around sections and chapters and docs in a sidebar [02:44] Lastly, on docs: [02:45] just want ot get our meeting logs etc. tracked with/like the other teams [02:45] gtg, sorry will catch up on logs later [02:45] seems there is some recent work/devel going on there [02:45] bye highvoltage [02:45] ciao boet [02:46]