[12:34] <shawarma> slomo: Is it ok if I request a sync of last-exit? 
[12:40] <ailean> composite-by-default has been deferred? :(
[01:06] <joejaxx> does anyone know how i can pull the dependencies of packages that are being downloaded with apt-get -d?
[01:06] <joejaxx> apt-get -d --reinstall* that is
[01:07] <LaserJock> ailean: where did you see that?
[01:09] <chillywilly> woah, lots of updates for edgy
[01:09] <gnomefreak> LaserJock: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/composite-by-default
[01:09] <chillywilly> wassup wit dat? ;)
[01:09] <ailean> LaserJock, check https://blueprints.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/composite-by-default
[01:09] <joejaxx> that spec says drafting
[01:09] <ailean> yes gnomefreak  :)
[01:10] <joejaxx> drafting not deferred :)
[01:10] <ailean> it changed
[01:10] <joejaxx> oh ok
[01:10] <ailean> who changed it :)
[01:11] <joejaxx> ailean: i do not know
[01:11] <joejaxx> rmjb: :D
[01:11] <Burgwork> unfortunately, there is no way to know
[01:11] <ailean> everything is okay
[01:11] <ailean> a flap about nothing
[01:11] <rmjb> hey joejaxx
[01:11] <ailean> :P
[01:11] <joejaxx> :P
[01:11] <ailean> i'm happier
[01:11] <joejaxx> does anyone know tha answer to my question? :)
[01:11] <joejaxx> i do not know if it can be done or not
[01:11] <Adri2000> LaserJock: I added the man page and made the changes to the *.install to homebank
[01:12] <LaserJock> darn, I was hoping it was deferred
[01:13] <joejaxx> LaserJock: lol!
[01:13] <LaserJock> Adri2000: cool
[01:13] <rmjb> joejaxx: I must have missed the question... though if it's hard core packaging I might not be able to answer it
[01:13] <ailean> lol
[01:13] <Burgwork> LaserJock: so was I
[01:13] <joejaxx> rmjb: 16:06 < joejaxx> does anyone know how i can pull the dependencies of packages that are being downloaded with apt-get -d?
[01:13] <joejaxx> 16:06 < joejaxx> apt-get -d --reinstall* that is
[01:13] <Adri2000> LaserJock: I hope you will advocate it now :)
[01:13] <ailean> LaserJock, not a fan of the aul xgl stuff then?
[01:14] <LaserJock> ailean: not by default, no
[01:14] <joejaxx> rmjb: ie i want the packages AND their dependencies in the cache whether they are installed already or not
[01:15] <ailean> LaserJock, what about a choice at the first startup?
[01:16] <LaserJock> ailean: won't happen
[01:16] <joejaxx> rmjb: i do not think you can do it
[01:16] <LaserJock> joejaxx: what are you trying to do?
[01:17] <ailean> LaserJock, you have to allow a certain level of graphics into things but maintain the option to have a simple window manager too
[01:17] <joejaxx> LaserJock: pull the dependencies of five packages and the packages themselves to the apt cache
[01:17] <LaserJock> ailean: I can imagine a "Bling? No Bling?" question in the installer, that's about it.
[01:17] <joejaxx> but they are already installed which is why i used the --reinstall application flag
[01:18] <LaserJock> ailean: the level og graphics we have now is insufficient?
[01:18] <LaserJock> s/og/of/
[01:19] <LaserJock> it took me 2 minutes it install the beryl wobbly windows
[01:19] <LaserJock> if it was officially in the repos it'd take me 1 min
[01:19] <ailean> LaserJock, took me 2 mins too
[01:19] <LaserJock> I don't think that's a whole lot to ask
[01:19] <crimsun> 1 minute?
[01:19] <crimsun> which X driver is this?
[01:20] <LaserJock> can't remember
[01:20] <LaserJock> but I just put in the beryl repo in sources.list
[01:20] <LaserJock> and installed it
[01:20] <joejaxx> i installed it and used it for a week i have not used it at all since those two weeks
[01:20] <ailean> LaserJock, that's all i did
[01:20] <LaserJock> and then relogged in
[01:20] <ailean> LaserJock, worked no probs
[01:21] <crimsun> it's pretty horrible on this i915gm (using i810-modesetting)
[01:21] <LaserJock> I don't see why we need to make it any easier at this point
[01:21] <ailean> i think this kind of thing is necessary to convince people that ubuntu is a viable alternative
[01:21] <LaserJock> I certainly hope not
[01:21] <ailean> people are shallow. they need bling
[01:21] <LaserJock> bling that works maybe
[01:21] <ailean> lol
[01:21] <ailean> mine works
[01:21] <joejaxx> ailean: i think this project is more than just attracting users
[01:21] <crimsun> corey has been doing a lot of bug triaging wrt compiz
[01:22] <ailean> what is it about joejaxx?
[01:22] <crimsun> not sure about beryl
[01:22] <Burgwork> attracting users with bling is great. We are going to keep them with things that work
[01:22] <Burgwork> crimsun: nothing on beryl. Not yet in the repos
[01:22] <LaserJock> I'd rather not have them for 10 minutes and then say "this stuff sucks, I'm not using Linux ever again"
[01:22] <joejaxx> ailean: everything that ubuntu is about
[01:22] <Burgwork> ailean: please see my last blog post on planet
[01:22] <ailean> joejaxx, i.e. on the cutting edge of debian?
[01:22] <ailean> Burgwork, a link?
[01:22] <ailean> oh
[01:23] <ailean> sorry
[01:23] <joejaxx> ailean: minix does not have 5 million users but it was the start of a revolution
[01:23] <joejaxx> example: ^
[01:23] <LaserJock> it's about a stable, usable, accessible, and open source computing environment, IMO
[01:23] <joejaxx> LaserJock: yeap
[01:24] <LaserJock> if we can do all that and have bling then I'm all for it
[01:24] <joejaxx> ailean: http://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu
[01:24] <ailean> Burgwork, what's your name in real life?
[01:25] <crimsun> (it's Burgwork!)
[01:25] <ailean> hehehe
[01:25] <joejaxx> LaserJock: i just hope we do not turn into vista
[01:25] <ailean> i honestly have had not one problem running beryl
[01:26] <LaserJock> that's great, really
[01:26] <ailean> ok, got it
[01:26] <LaserJock> it's just that we can't give that to everybody
[01:27] <crimsun> particularly when it doesn't work even on the level of the standard window manager
[01:27] <jdong> one day, compiz/beryl will have FUNCTIONAL focus-stealing prevention
[01:27] <jdong> then the world will be happy and there will be peace at last
[01:27] <joejaxx> jdong: lol
[01:27] <crimsun> (and yes, I know it's a complaint and that my time would be better spent implementing said things, but hey, I have an entire subsystem to worry about)
[01:27] <jdong> and hopefully by then we get a new administration in the US?
[01:28] <jdong> and not mr flying ticket counters
[01:28] <Burgwork> ailean: Corey Burger
[01:29] <Burgwork> http://www.advogato.org/person/Burgundavia/diary.html?start=115
[01:29] <ailean> Burgwork, got it :) thanks
[01:29] <Burgwork> hey crimsun
[01:29] <ailean> Burgwork, i have to say, i find none of the things you say true about Beryl - maybe so with compiz
[01:29] <crimsun> 'lo Burgwork 
[01:29] <LaserJock> I mean, the thing I'm looking at is metacity (stable, mature, window manager) vs. compiz/beryl (unstable, blingy, not really a window manager yet)
[01:29] <Burgwork> ailean: when it is in the repos, I will test it
[01:29] <LaserJock> that's the other thing
[01:29] <ailean> Burgwork, I can move apps from one viewport to another using the same commands and when i maximise it does so to that viewport
[01:30] <LaserJock> beryl isn't even in Universe right now
[01:30] <Burgwork> indeed
[01:30] <ailean> Burgwork, the ONE problem i have had is keeping kaffeine on top of other windows
[01:30] <LaserJock> and we're supposed to get it in Main and default by like March?
[01:30] <jdong> LaserJock: what's stopping it from being Universe?
[01:30] <jdong> just out of curiousity
[01:30] <LaserJock> people packaging it
[01:30] <Burgwork> ailean: it is not hard to write a WM, it is hard to write one that works in most cases
[01:30] <imbrandon> jdong: it includes mesa cruft
[01:30] <jdong> LaserJock: and why aren't there people packaging it?
[01:30] <imbrandon> moins all
[01:30] <jdong> imbrandon: ok, I like that answer better :)
[01:30] <joejaxx> imbrandon: ! :D
[01:30] <crimsun> it what?!
[01:30] <Burgwork> jdong: apparently several have tried
[01:30] <LaserJock> jdong: they'd rather work on it
[01:30] <joejaxx> hello
[01:31] <jdong> imbrandon: hey brandon :)
[01:31] <ryanakca> shawarma: hmm... where do I get ddeb? and just in case it's a corrupt /var/lib/dpkg-whatever... how do I check
[01:31] <crimsun> mesa cruft? goodness. that's nearly as bad as including x server code.
[01:31] <joejaxx> Burgwork: your full ircnick sounds like the name of a country
[01:31] <imbrandon> heh
[01:31] <joejaxx> Burgwork: :)
[01:31] <xerxas> I'm using feisty with ndiswrapper, i updated the system, it updated the kernel from 2.6.17 to 2.6.19 but didn't installed ndiswrapper-utils-1.9 and my wireless card wasn't working , should I report this ? 
[01:31] <jdong> the Beryl guys seem to already have some degree of packaging... is it not possible that Ubuntu helps them out with that?
[01:31] <Burgwork> joejaxx: it is a deliberate corruption of Burgundy, so I am not surprised
[01:31] <ailean> Burgwork, oh, and when I flick TO beryl, the windows default to the top of the screen instead of below the top bar
[01:32] <crimsun> shawarma: in pitti's dir on people.uc.
[01:32] <crimsun> shawarma: sorry
[01:32] <joejaxx> Burgwork: ah! oh ok
[01:32] <jdong> if spinny cubes is really such a goal for feisty it wouldn't be a bad idea to put some priority on it :-/
[01:32] <crimsun> ryanakca: in pitti's dir on people.uc
[01:32] <jdong> (not trying to deride on anyone's efforts... apologies to anyone if that's the case)
[01:32] <imbrandon> jdong: we have, infact __I__ have, but its not of the quality that keybuk and others will accept, read back the logs in #ubuntu-devel last week
[01:32] <jdong> imbrandon: I see, thanks for the info. I had no idea
[01:33] <imbrandon> and by quality i dont mean the packing , i mean the upstream code
[01:33] <xerxas> crimsun,  ?
[01:33] <xerxas> you're working on the kernel ? 
[01:33] <crimsun> yes, all several million lines.
[01:33] <xerxas> :)
[01:33] <imbrandon> heya crimsun sorry i dident see your PM untill now, you still need that done ?
[01:33] <crimsun> while asleep and walking uphill both ways.
[01:33] <imbrandon> hahaha
[01:33] <ajmitch> but you only wrote about 1 million or so of those
[01:33] <xerxas> on packaging the kernel 
[01:34] <xerxas> have you seen my question about kernel update vs ndiswrapper-utils ? 
[01:35] <LaserJock> Burgwork: do you know if drafters can/should set the target milestone on their specs?
[01:35] <Burgwork> LaserJock: I don't know. try
[01:35] <Burgwork> it might only be the distro drivers themselves
[01:36] <LaserJock> my specs always seem to get left in the dust
[01:36] <crimsun> imbrandon: yes, please
[01:36] <imbrandon> crimsun: sure one second
[01:36] <crimsun> xerxas: fresh install of 7.04 or dist-upgrade(s)?
[01:37] <xerxas> dist-upgrade
[01:37] <imbrandon> crimsun: btw you or anyone else for that matter can probably get ahold of my easier on jabber now a days ( just FYI incase this comes up again etc )
[01:37] <crimsun> xerxas: that's a known issue
[01:37] <xerxas> I do updates quite frequently 
[01:37] <xerxas> crimsun, k
[01:37] <Burgwork> LaserJock: the way to not get them left in the dust is to promote the crap out of them. Get somebody on the core team to review them
[01:37] <ailean> Burgwork, maximising windows does not put them under the bottom panel, the window title has always updated as far as I can see, windows are always raised visually, the window list is always there, updating panel applets still draw over full screen apps, windows to sneak over to the next viewport by 5-10 pixels, but this doesn't mean that they are *in* the other viewport
[01:37] <ailean> just to give my opinion on beryl :)
[01:38] <Burgwork> ailean: cool, but until I see that package, those bugs stand. Besides, compiz upstream is far more sane than beryl
[01:38] <ryanakca> crimsun: I'm guessing that people.uc = people.ubuntu.com? either that or people.uc is on a super super slow connection
[01:38] <joejaxx> ryanakca: people.ubuntu.com :D
[01:38] <ryanakca> lol
[01:39] <crimsun> I abbreviate domains
[01:39] <ailean> Burgwork, fair enough :)
[01:39] <LaserJock> Burgwork: it's been reviewed, it's been sitting in "Pending Review" for a while
[01:39] <Burgwork> LaserJock: linky?
[01:39] <ryanakca> crimsun: why not use http://www.ubuntu.com/ instead of people.ubuntu.com ?
[01:39] <ryanakca> crimsun: they both give the same thing ;)
[01:40] <LaserJock> Burgwork: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/edubuntu-menus-completion
[01:40] <ryanakca> nevermind :)
[01:41] <crimsun> because historically www.do and people.do have been separated.
[01:41] <Burgwork> LaserJock: then you need to poke ogra
[01:45] <LaserJock> Burgwork: personally I don't really see the point for community people
[01:45] <LaserJock> specs seem basically to be the way Canonical people justify their time
[01:45] <Burgwork> LaserJock: for getting specs approved? for very good reason. Those specs show the community what we are working on
[01:45] <LaserJock> and it works well that way
[01:46] <LaserJock> but whether it is approved or not I'm going to implement it
[01:46] <LaserJock> so why all the hassle
[01:46] <Burgwork> the marketing team  (read: me) is going to talk about specs more
[01:46] <Burgwork> LaserJock: you sound very beat down
[01:46] <imbrandon> with composite-by-default defered PLEASE tell me binary drivers is axed
[01:46] <ryanakca> oh crud... shawarma said to install the ddebs, so that I could do a proper backtrace, but how am I supposed to do that when apt-*, aptitude, adept, synaptic, kynaptic, etc keep on segfaulting? or did he mean install just the ddebs for apt?
[01:46] <Burgwork> imbrandon: nah, just something odd
[01:47] <imbrandon> hrm
[01:47] <LaserJock> Burgwork: ah well, I almost joined Jorge but thought better of it
[01:47] <Burgwork> hmm, troublesome
[01:47] <Burgwork> I almost joined him as well
[01:47] <imbrandon> does anyone know of a good LVM overview website / page / document , right off hand before i go googleing
[01:48] <LaserJock> I think jdub's latest blog is a lot of it ;-)
[01:48] <ailean> imbrandon, it's not deferred
[01:48] <ajmitch> LaserJock: I'm not surprised, really
[01:48] <Burgwork> LaserJock: the burnout thing? yes, good read
[01:48] <ryanakca> imbrandon: http://tldp.org/HOWTO/LVM-HOWTO/ ?
[01:49] <imbrandon> sounds like a good place to start
[01:49] <ryanakca> and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logical_Volume_Manager_(Linux)
[01:50] <ailean> bedtime
[01:50] <ailean> night all
[01:50] <ryanakca> night ailean
[01:50] <LaserJock> cya
[01:52] <ajmitch> LaserJock: I just implement stuff whether it's approved or not
[01:52] <LaserJock> yeah, that's sort of what I'm going with
[01:52] <joejaxx> anyone here experienced greatly with apt and ebian?
[01:52] <joejaxx> debian*
[01:52] <LaserJock> but I get really stressed out over these specs
[01:52] <LaserJock> and it seem like for minimal gain
[01:53] <crimsun> you're not going to like teaching, then.
[01:53] <crimsun> 99% of what you'll do as a univ professor boils down to "being ignored"
[01:53] <ajmitch> hence why crimsun spends all his waking hours on ubuntu
[01:54] <crimsun> shhh.
[01:54] <xerxas> I'm trying to compile tapioca sharp using cdbs, it uses a autogen.sh and I get this with pbuilder:
[01:54] <xerxas> chmod a+x /tmp/buildd/libtapioca-cil-0.3.9svn20061207/./configure
[01:54] <xerxas> chmod: cannot access `/tmp/buildd/libtapioca-cil-0.3.9svn20061207/./configure': No such file or directory
[01:54] <crimsun> you probably have to bootstrap/autogen
[01:54] <xerxas> how can I say in debian/rules that we need to run autogen.sh before ./configure ? 
[01:55] <xerxas> crimsun, bootstrap/autogen ? what do you mean ? 
[01:55] <crimsun> does configure after the checkout?
[01:55] <crimsun> exist ^
[01:55] <xerxas> from what i've seen, projects like avahi uses autogen.sh but the source also gives configure 
[01:55] <xerxas> crimsun, no, but some projects using autogen.sh does
[01:56] <xerxas> tapioca-sharp doesn't 
[01:56] <xerxas> I think that's my problem 
[01:56] <xerxas> (I'm not in the default cdbs behaviour with autogen.sh) 
[01:58] <xerxas> crimsun, what do you mean by "you probably have to bootstrap/autogen" ? 
[01:59] <xerxas> using debootstrap ? instead of cdbs ? 
[01:59] <crimsun> xerxas: if after a checkout configure does not exist, you'll need to invoke whatever creates it. Sometimes (normally) there's an autogen.sh or bootstrap script that does so, but you can always do it manually.
[02:00] <fernando> hi all
[02:00] <xerxas> If I run autogen.sh it creates a configure 
[02:00] <xerxas> crimsun, can I run autogen.sh manually not within a pbuilder ? 
[02:00] <xerxas> hi fernando  
[02:03] <crimsun> certainly
[02:04] <xerxas> crimsun, ok , thanks, I find this weired 
[02:05] <xerxas> I mean , it's strange to create a configure with a script if it doesn't depend on the current environment (hardware ?)  
[02:15] <zul> yo
[02:15] <imbrandon> ello zul 
[02:16] <zul> hiya imbrandon 
[02:18] <ajmitch> hi zul 
[02:24] <plugwash> the autotools generate a horriblly long detection script based on what your package needs
[02:24] <plugwash> running that detection script detects if the system the build is being done on has what your package needs
[02:24] <plugwash> i agree its strange but thats how autotools works
[02:34] <Lathiat> xerxas: autogen.sh/bootstrap.sh is for SVN that has no ./configure
[02:34] <Lathiat> xerxas: we provide autogen.sh/bootstrap.sh in case you want to edit configure
[02:46] <xerxas> Lathiat,  ? what do you mean by we ? 
[02:50] <Lathiat> xerxas: i'm one of the avahi devs :)
[02:50] <xerxas> plugwash, isn't configure doing the same ? 
[02:50] <xerxas> Lathiat,  ok :) 
[02:52] <plugwash> configure is the horriblly long detection script generated by autotools
[02:53] <Lathiat> wonderful, wonderful autotools
[02:55] <plugwash> i think the reason some projects don't keep configure in thier cvs/svn repositries is that having autogenererated files in your version control system sucks for merging
[02:56] <Lathiat> yeh
[02:56] <Lathiat> we dont keep configure in svn
[02:56] <Lathiat> no need really
[02:56] <Lathiat> the tarballs have them, tho
[02:56] <Lathiat> and it just makes a mess of diffs
[02:57] <xerxas> ok
[02:58] <xerxas> so I should run autgen.sh before doing a dh_make , like if it was in the upstream distribution ?
[02:59] <plugwash> i doubt it really matters whether you put it in the upstream tarball or the diff.gz
[02:59] <bddebian> Heya gang
[02:59] <xerxas> ok
[02:59] <xerxas> need to go sleep 
[02:59] <xerxas> 3 A.M here, work tomorrow , a bit crazy :)
[03:15] <cmpalmer> jdong: keybuk doesn't seem to be in #ubuntu-devel
[03:15] <jdong> cmpalmer: it's late
[03:15] <jdong> :)
[03:15] <crimsun> I wouldn't expect him to be, since he's in the UK.
[03:17] <jdong> crimsun: deep breaths?
[03:17] <crimsun> it's ok, we're in the same LUG.
[03:17] <jdong> :)
[03:18] <crimsun> cmpalmer: catch him during normal UK business hours
[03:19] <ajmitch> amazing, someone that's met crimsun in person?
[03:19] <crimsun> he can attest to my sharp pointy teeth.
[03:20] <ajmitch> cmpalmer: crimsun actually exists, then?
[03:20] <LaserJock> run away!
[03:21] <bddebian> hehe
[03:21] <LaserJock> ajmitch: I too am interested, I'm not so sure
[03:21] <bddebian> So how do we request packages from Debian that are not in the archive currently?
[03:25] <jdong> bddebian: staple a Ben Franklin to an envelope and mail to the address I PM'ed you
[03:25] <jdong> ;-)
[03:25] <bddebian> Heh
[03:26] <cmpalmer> cmpalmer: yes. I've even seen him eat
[03:26] <cmpalmer> damn tab-completion
[03:26] <cmpalmer> :/
[03:26] <cmpalmer> ajmitch: he is real. he eats food
[03:26] <crimsun> he hasn't seen me sleep, though.
[03:27] <cmpalmer> this is true :/
[03:28] <LaserJock> he's a darn robot I tell you!
[03:28] <LaserJock> he doesn't sleep!
[03:30] <bddebian> F' 'em ;-P
[03:35] <bddebian> ajmitch: So how do I do it "properly" man?
[03:35] <ajmitch> you don't
[03:36] <ajmitch> packages that are new in debian get stuck into a special NEW queue that gets reviewed when an ftpmaster gets bored
[03:36] <ajmitch> up until DebianImportFreeze, anyway
[03:38] <bddebian> ajmitch: Not new in Debian homey, I mean like gnumach and mig ;-)
[03:38] <ajmitch> oh, noone wants those in
[03:39] <bddebian> I do :-)
[03:39] <ajmitch> you're special though
[03:40] <ajmitch> they're probably blacklisted or just unbuilt
[03:42] <plugwash> or need a binary upload which it seems hardly anyone can do because they are self compiling compilers
[03:44] <bddebian> ajmitch: Probably, so how do I ask to get them unblacklisted?
[03:45] <LaserJock> find out what Scott or Colin really want for their birthday
[03:45] <LaserJock> PS3? ;-)
[03:46] <ajmitch> bddebian: ask?
[03:46] <bddebian> I am
[03:46] <ajmitch> you know who to ask
[03:46] <bddebian> But I don't wanna :)
[03:47] <ajmitch> then I can't help
[03:51] <bddebian> I've missed you honey
[03:53] <LaserJock> ahh, the good old days
[03:53] <bddebian> heh
[04:00] <ajmitch> LaserJock: you mean when everyone hugged each other & ponies ran free in the field?
[04:00] <LaserJock> the good old days
[04:00] <LaserJock> "run free pony, run FREE!"
[04:00] <lotusleaf> omg ponies!
[04:01] <bddebian> "a stallion needs to run.. And run free.."
[04:01] <ajmitch> we may all be too young
[04:02] <bddebian> Oh man..
[04:09] <ajmitch> bddebian: don't worry, I'll be offline for the weekend, so you won't have to put up with me
[04:12] <bddebian> ajmitch: Bah, I love you man
[04:12] <LaserJock> hmm, that's an interesting hostmask
[04:13] <ajmitch> no you don't, admit it
[04:13] <bddebian> I do
[04:13] <bddebian> And I'm growing more fond of Australia lately too ;-)
[04:14] <LaserJock> hah
[04:14] <ajmitch> it comes from dealign with php all day long
[04:14] <ajmitch> ew, nasty
[04:14] <bddebian> What's nasty?
[04:14] <ajmitch> australia
[04:14] <LaserJock> ajmitch: is it web app kind of php?
[04:14] <ajmitch> LaserJock: quite
[04:14] <ajmitch> LaserJock: CRM web app
[04:14] <bddebian> ajmitch: Why because they don't want Sharia law?
[04:15] <ajmitch> no, because it's full of australians
[04:16] <bddebian> hehe
[04:18] <lotusleaf> jdong: does the statue pick its own foot and eat it?
[04:18] <bddebian> Holy crap is nethack takign forever to eat
[04:18] <jdong> lotusleaf: no, it's lecturing me about my nvidia drivers
[04:18] <bddebian> lotusleaf: haha
[04:19] <lotusleaf> jdong: wouldn't it be funny if rms had a secret bunker where he ran nvidia and danced with an ipod all while laughing like a lunatic?
[04:19] <bddebian> Oh crap that struck me funny jdong
[04:19] <jdong> lol
[04:20] <bddebian> My wife is sitting here calling me a total freaking geek because I'm laughing so hard
[04:20] <jdong> lol
[04:21] <jdong> hysterically laughing while having an IRC client open tends to freak out the non-nerds 
[04:21] <bddebian> yeah
[04:21] <ajmitch> bddebian: you have irc there when your wife is around?
[04:21] <bddebian> But she's reading over my shoulder and wondering wtf I'm laughing about :-)
[04:21] <crimsun> no wonder you married folk are so bitter :-)
[04:21] <bddebian> haha
[04:22] <ajmitch> not my own, of course
[04:23] <bddebian> "nethack is takign forever to eat"?? WTF was I talking about? Sheesh
[04:24] <bddebian> s/eat/build/
[04:24] <LaserJock> yeah, I was wondering
[04:25] <LaserJock> didn't want to say anything, thought maybe he's started eating Ubuntu too
[04:25] <bddebian> Man, no mercy in here tonight
[04:25] <crimsun> you should be used to it. You're married.
[04:26] <LaserJock> haha
[04:26] <LaserJock> I think my wife wanted to start an "Ubuntu widows support group"
[04:27] <bddebian> heh
[04:27] <bddebian> Motu-aholics Anonymous?
[04:27] <LaserJock> yep
[04:28] <LaserJock> I was thinking of a "You know you're and Ubuntu addict if:" wiki page
[04:29] <LaserJock> s/and/an/
[04:29] <ajmitch> "You fly halfway across the world to meet up with fellow MOTUs for a drink & a few specs"
[04:29] <LaserJock> sleep seems very optional
[04:29] <ajmitch> who needs it?
[04:30] <ajmitch> bad news, LaserJock 
[04:30] <ajmitch> I'm going a whole weekend without my computer
[04:30] <LaserJock> forget the seasons but know the release schedule by heart
[04:30] <ajmitch> feb 8th = feature freeze & uvf
[04:30] <ajmitch> dec 21st = debian import freeze
[04:30] <crimsun> motu superstars!
[04:31] <ajmitch> don't say any more, I'll realise how addicted I am
[04:31] <crimsun> it's probably a bad sign that I have LP URLs memorized.
[04:31] <bddebian> Shit no .desktop file :-(
[04:31] <ajmitch> crimsun: well, a sign that LP's UI sucks
[04:31] <VoX> crimsun: a few of my friends work for LP
[04:31] <jdong> crimsun: lol
[04:31] <jdong> crimsun: well, it's worse when you know bug numbers BEFORE ubotu comes back with the blurb
[04:32] <LaserJock> you look at a new Core Duo2 laptop and think how much faster pbuilder will unpack
[04:32] <crimsun> I always chuckle when I see Ubugtu announce bugs that are status rejected. 9/10 times seb has already poked.
[04:32] <jdong> LaserJock: didn't I plead tmpfs to you the other day?
[04:32] <LaserJock> yeah, yeah
[04:33] <jdong> LaserJock: seriously consider it :)
[04:33] <LaserJock> I think lvm+sbuild might work
[04:33] <jdong> LaserJock: mount tmpfs onto /var/cache/pbuilder/builds
[04:33] <jdong> LaserJock: and allocate some swap
[04:33] <jdong> LaserJock: it's really worth it :)
[04:45] <ajmitch> ok, back in a few days
[04:45] <bddebian> Enjoy ajmitch
[04:45] <crimsun> cya ajmitch 
[04:45] <imbrandon> later ajmitch 
[04:49] <LaserJock> ajmitch: don't go!
[04:50] <LaserJock> :(
[04:51] <joejaxx> hello all
[04:51] <imbrandon> heya joejaxx 
[04:54] <joejaxx> hello imbrandon 
[04:54] <bddebian> Heya imbrandon, joejaxx
[04:55] <imbrandon> moins bddebian 
[04:55] <LaserJock> bddebian: and you didn't even get yelled at :-)
[04:55] <bddebian> Hehe, yeah
[04:55] <joejaxx> hello
[04:56] <joejaxx> i figured the only way to get those packages
[04:56] <joejaxx> was getting the apt-cache from a chroot
[04:56] <joejaxx> there is no other way
[04:57] <joejaxx> funstuff
[05:02] <rmjb> off to bed
[05:02] <rmjb> g'night all
[05:05] <bddebian> joejaxx: Nah, we're just sad that ajmitch left us :-)
[05:06] <crimsun> python-lame? hmm
[05:06] <bddebian> hehe
[05:07] <joejaxx> oh ok
[05:07] <crimsun> joejaxx: but thank goodness we still have the motu trinity present!
[05:07] <joejaxx> crimsun: lol
[05:07] <joejaxx> who is that?
[05:07] <crimsun> bddebian, imbrandon, and LaserJock.
[05:08] <bddebian> Stop it.. I have been useless :-(
[05:08] <crimsun> that makes the rest of us less than useless. Hmm.
[05:09] <bddebian> Oh BS
[05:11] <bddebian> Hmm, where is he seeing an attal-themes-medieval source package?
[05:11] <bddebian> Feisty maybe?
[05:12] <crimsun> pretty certain
[05:13] <joejaxx> crimsun: the alt disc for feisty works
[05:13] <joejaxx> i was happy about that
[05:13] <crimsun> joejaxx: 20061205/xubuntu?
[05:13] <joejaxx> the regular one
[05:13] <bddebian> Hmm, packages.u.c doesn't show it
[05:13] <joejaxx> maxillian said on the ml he was goingi to test the powerpc
[05:13] <joejaxx> going*
[05:14] <joejaxx> crimsun: the powerpc build that is
[05:45] <bddebian> Sheesh, finally
[05:52] <crimsun> joejaxx: interesting, seeing how i386/daily (20061205) failed utterly on my hardware
[05:53] <joejaxx> crimsun: i will download the that build tonight and test it
[05:54] <joejaxx> crimsun: 05 is herd1? what about 07?
[05:54] <crimsun> 05 was the Herd 1 candidate
[05:54] <joejaxx> oh ok
[05:57] <bddebian> Damnit I just built njplot for no reason :-(
[06:11] <imbrandon> gah
[06:11] <imbrandon> anyone seen this error before ?
[06:11] <imbrandon> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/35884/
[06:12] <bddebian> Low on disk space?
[06:12] <crimsun> that's a faq
[06:13] <bddebian> What'd you call me? ;-P
[06:13] <imbrandon> lol
[06:13] <crimsun> an old married man.
[06:13] <imbrandon> does that mean the mem limit in apt.conf is too low ?
[06:14] <imbrandon> ahh rock on, APT::Cache-Limit 12582912;
[06:14] <imbrandon> in apt.conf fixes it :)
[06:15] <imbrandon> hopefully it dont bork the box
[06:19] <imbrandon> well so much for that
[06:36] <bddebian> Gnight folks
[06:49] <slomo> shawarma: if our changes can be dropped (what i would expect), just file a sync
[06:57] <crimsun> slomo: any plans to package libmpcdec 1.2.4?
[06:58] <slomo> well, i would do it after the weekend probably... but if you want to do it just do it :)
[06:59] <crimsun> I'll look at it, but I probably won't get to it before you :)
[07:01] <slomo> do you know if this fast seeking stuff in libmpcdec is just new api? or old api improved?
[07:02] <crimsun> I don't know offhand; it's purportedly fully backward compatible with SV7, but whether the API has changed I haven't checked
[07:02] <slomo> it's backward compatible, yes... just want to know if all our applications can take advantage of it without any work ;)
[07:04] <crimsun> yeah, that's one thing I'd investigate
[07:04] <slomo> hm, gst plugin should work instantly as it uses mpcdec functions for seeking
[07:04] <slomo> nice
[07:05] <crimsun> well that covers like 1/3 of all major cases :), the other ones being mplayer and vlc ;)
[07:06] <slomo> i would be surprised if vlc didn't use the functions that are already there for seeking ;) for mplayer it wouldn't surprise me
[08:05] <crimsun> slomo: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/35891/ is a nice summary
[08:06] <slomo> yay
[08:06] <slomo> abi incompatible but no soname change
[08:06] <slomo> lovely
[08:06] <slomo> and set_seeking is probably needed to tell the lib to do either fast or normal seeking?
[08:07] <crimsun> yep.
[08:08] <slomo> crimsun: are there more incompatibilities when comparing the public headers? and i expect those removed functions to be in no public header... right?
[08:18] <Sp4rKy> hi there
[08:18] <Sp4rKy> crimsun: are you a "master of revu" ? :p
[08:18] <Sp4rKy> i'm installing revu2 on my personnal server
[08:19] <Sp4rKy> and it's a bit complicated
[08:19] <Sp4rKy> i don't really understand how the cron script should work
[08:21] <LaserJock> siretart and sistpoty are the guys who wrote it
[08:21] <LaserJock> they are your best bet
[08:21] <Sp4rKy> i know
[08:21] <Sp4rKy> but they're not here now :p
[08:22] <Sp4rKy> and hi LaserJock :)
[08:22] <LaserJock> hi :-)
[08:47] <Kagou> hi
[08:53] <Sp4rKy> hi Kagou 
[08:53] <Kagou> hey Sp4rKy 
[08:55] <Sp4rKy> how are you ?
[08:58] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 43150 in maxima "[SRU]  maxima frontends fail to connect" [Undecided,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/43150
[08:59] <Sp4rKy> siretart: please ping me when you're back :)
[09:00] <Kagou> Sp4rKy: fine :)
[09:01] <siretart> Sp4rKy: sorry, revu2 is nowhere finished. it needs a lot of code
[09:01] <siretart> but I told you that before
[09:02] <Sp4rKy> siretart: yep
[09:02] <Sp4rKy> but i tought is usuable
[09:02] <Sp4rKy> isn't it ?
[09:02] <siretart> no. it isn't
[09:02] <siretart> not at all. yet.
[09:02] <Sp4rKy> k :|
[09:02] <Sp4rKy> siretart: so i'll reup revu1 :)
[09:02] <siretart> ok
[09:03] <Sp4rKy> and may disturb you again about conf :D
[09:46] <Sp4rKy> siretart: i've got strange error about conf file :
[09:46] <Sp4rKy> http://revu.dunnewind.net/index.py
[09:46] <Sp4rKy> NoSectionError: No section: 'database'
[09:46] <Sp4rKy> whereas i've it in my conf file
[09:53] <Admiral_Chicago> waht the EoL going to be for Feisty?
[09:53] <Admiral_Chicago> what is the*
[09:54] <Burgundavia> Admiral_Chicago: 18 months from release
[09:55] <Burgundavia> october 2008
[09:55] <Admiral_Chicago> Burgundavia: okay thanks, i thought so.
[09:55] <Burgundavia> here to server
[09:55] <Burgundavia> serve, rather
[09:56] <Admiral_Chicago> Burgundavia: just updating a wiki.https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UpgradeNotes#preview
[09:57] <Admiral_Chicago> err no
[09:57] <Admiral_Chicago> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UpgradeNotes
[09:57] <Burgundavia> rock
[09:58] <Sp4rKy> siretart: it seems to work, but i had to hardcode some conf var 
[09:58] <Admiral_Chicago> i changed it, actually release date is more important than the EoL
[09:59] <Admiral_Chicago> Burgundavia: nixternal must be getting mad at me, I've edited like 6 wiki pages today that get emailed to him about updates
[09:59] <Admiral_Chicago> or he love me for it, not sure yet
[10:01] <elkbuntu> doesnt nixternal get mailed about just about every wiki page update?
[10:02] <Burgundavia> think so
[10:02] <Burgundavia> ajmitch used to be that insane as well
[10:03] <StevenK> Used to be?
[10:03] <StevenK> :-P
[10:08] <Riddell> Robert Carr online?
[10:13] <Admiral_Chicago> elkbuntu: i believe so
[10:14] <Admiral_Chicago> everyone i've ever edited gets sent to him
[10:14] <Admiral_Chicago> i think i bother him enough with Ubuntu Chicago  LoCo stuff
[10:14] <Admiral_Chicago> :\
[10:34] <dholbach> good morning
[10:35] <shawarma> When doing a fakesync, when should I use <debian-version>build1 and when should I use <debian-version>ubuntu1 as the version string?
[10:35] <Fujitsu> Hi dholbach.
[10:35] <dholbach> hi Fujitsu
[10:35] <Fujitsu> shawarma: Only use build1 if it is a rebuild of the current Ubuntu version.
[10:36] <StevenK> Why a fakesync, though?
[10:36] <StevenK> Just file a sync request, no?
[10:36] <shawarma> StevenK: md5sum mismatch.
[10:36] <shawarma> StevenK: ...due to conversion from bz2 to gz.
[10:37] <shawarma> Fujitsu: A couple of days ago cjwatson and LaserJock told me to use build1 for a package that was being fakesynced..
[10:37] <Fujitsu> Actually, that's probably not a bad idea.
[10:38] <Fujitsu> Except... Hm...
[10:38] <shawarma> Fujitsu: No, since if Debian has a new upstream next time we need to merge, it'll just get synced automatically.
[10:38] <Fujitsu> No, it will still need manual action until there's a new upstream version, so build1 is inappropriate.
[10:38] <Admiral_Chicago> dholbach: morning
[10:38] <dholbach> hey Admiral_Chicago :)
[10:38] <Admiral_Chicago> how is it going?
[10:39] <shawarma> Fujitsu: I'll take it up with cjwatson. :-)
[10:39] <Fujitsu> Good idea.
[10:39] <Fujitsu> All my fake syncs already had ubuntu1, so I've not had to think about such things.
[10:39] <Fujitsu> Evening, \sh.
[10:40] <\sh> moins
[10:41] <shawarma> Good morning, \sh.
[10:42] <Fujitsu> Yay, some archive adminning is being done! With any luck, this means #43150 will be fixed, finally!
[10:51] <mneptok> Fujitsu: that bug has been marked "Won't Fix: irritates Fujitsu"
[10:53] <Fujitsu> (to a pole, which will be mounted above a fire)
[11:04] <TheMuso> Is the procedure for requesting backports on the wiki anywhere?
[11:06] <dholbach> should be on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources
[11:06] <TheMuso> thanks
[12:43] <elkbuntu> mneptok, i really do not need that sort of mental imagery within the hours before trying to sleep
[12:45] <shawarma> Fujitsu: Just got a /msg from cjwatson. the build1 postfix for fakesyncs is the right way to do it. 
[12:46] <Fujitsu> shawarma: OK, I would have debated that if it hadn't come from cjwatson.
[12:47] <shawarma> Fujitsu: Exactly. :-)
[12:47] <mneptok> elkbuntu: you'll soon learn to be thankful for the "himself" ;)
[12:47] <geser> fakesyncs should have -Xbuild1 instead of -XubuntuY?
[12:48] <Fujitsu> geser: Apparently.
[12:50] <shawarma> geser: Yes.
[12:50] <Fujitsu> StevenK: As do I...
[12:52] <shawarma> StevenK: Well, I suppose it's not *that* different. Fakesync is just a rebuild where you use an orig.tar.gz that's really no different from the one the Debian version was built with. It
[12:52] <shawarma> 's usually only an md5sum mismatch or variations thereof.
[12:52] <shawarma> Nothing has actually been changed. Just like a rebuild.
[12:52] <StevenK> Fine. But the _reasons_ are different.
[12:52] <geser> sometimes it's only a bad versioning
[12:53] <Fujitsu> And note that a rebuild can be synced straight over, a fake sync cannot always.
[12:53] <shawarma> StevenK: Indeed. and such differences are noted in the changelog.
[12:54] <shawarma> Fujitsu: The thing is that if there's a new upstream version, the sync will be automatic and we don't have to do anything. If there's no upstream version, we'll do the merge manually. So in the former case, it's easier, in the latter case it's just like it always was. Is there really anything to be lost?
[12:55] <shawarma> "If there's no upstream" should of course read "If there's no new upstream".
[12:55] <Fujitsu> shawarma: But a buildX implies that there needs to be NO manual intervention.
[12:56] <shawarma> Fujitsu: True. I wonder what happens when the new diff.gz and .dsc is synced over from debian and the build deamons notice that the md5sum of the orig.tar.gz is off..
[12:57] <StevenK> The upload is rejected
[12:58] <shawarma> StevenK: It's a sync, not an upload per se.. Who gets notified?
[12:59] <StevenK> ubuntu-archive, that is, the person actually doing the sync?
[01:03] <shawarma> StevenK: I just checked with cjwatson again.
[01:03] <shawarma> StevenK: The syncsource script is run by a human, so this particular error would not go uncaught. That's the first thing.
[01:03] <StevenK> Yes, which is what I just said.
[01:04] <shawarma> StevenK: Oh, yes. I was in another window /msg'ing with cjwatson. Sorry, I didn't notice.
[01:05] <shawarma> StevenK: It was a bit unclear as to whether merges.ubuntu.com would handle things without 'ubuntu' in the version string, hence it's a bit unclear whether it would show up there.
[01:06] <shawarma> StevenK: I dunno. I'll stick with -build1 for now. 
[01:09] <shawarma> Question: Am I the only one who finds it tedious to have to ping the person who did the last merge of a package before you can go ahead and merge it again?
[01:11] <Fujitsu> Is there a way I can get the maintainer field unclobbered for my packages?
[01:11] <StevenK> Yup.
[01:11] <StevenK> Kick infinity, since there is a whitelist.
[01:11] <Fujitsu> OK! Thanks.
[01:12] <shawarma> Huh?
[01:13] <shawarma> How is the maintainer field clobbered?
[01:14] <StevenK> During the build process on the buildds
[01:14] <shawarma> StevenK: Oh, it removes the Debian maintainer or something?
[01:15] <StevenK> It does not.
[01:15] <shawarma> Then what?
[01:38] <joejaxx> crimsun: yeah it gets stuck on "Starting PC Card Services"
[01:46] <ssam> hello i have just uploaded my first package to revu http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3711
[01:47] <joejaxx> ssam: nice :)
[01:47] <ssam> now do i just wait for comments?
[01:48] <joejaxx> well someone will review it comment
[01:48] <joejaxx> it and comemnt*
[01:49] <ssam> do i need to add it to a list on the wiki, or anything like that?
[01:50] <joejaxx> i do not think so
[01:50] <ssam> ok
[01:50] <ssam> thanks
[01:50] <joejaxx> ssam: you are most welcome
[02:02] <dholbach> I'll add the OpenWeek sessions to MOTU/School too
[02:03] <dholbach> any objections?
[02:05] <dholbach> ok, done ;)
[02:08] <joejaxx> :)
[02:18] <mneptok> joejaxx: still smoking that rock?
[02:19] <joejaxx> mneptok: lol!
[02:19] <mneptok> oh, wait. you aren't an athlete. i think that's part of the equation.
[02:20] <joejaxx> mneptok: lol
[02:20] <mneptok> just thinking about that still causes me to actually lol irl
[02:20] <joejaxx> haha
[02:20] <mneptok> frickin' character.
[02:20] <joejaxx> yeap :P
[02:21] <joejaxx> bbl
[02:22] <mneptok> he needs to be in the deepest, darkest part of texas, on a porch, shotgun on his lap, his wife (aunt lurleen) inside baking a pie
[02:24] <elkbuntu> mneptok, your favourite bus driver?
[02:26] <mneptok> elkbuntu: the very same
[02:26] <elkbuntu> i so wish i had have been there for that
[02:27] <\sh> do we have actually a method for the dependency crap between debians iceweasel/icedove and firefox/thunderbird?
[02:27] <elkbuntu> then again, i was one of the ones lucky enough to get the palo alto detour
[02:27] <mneptok> "my waaaaf wuz a May-yun ..."
[02:27] <mneptok> s/my/mah/
[02:27] <elkbuntu> please dont make me chortle bourbon
[02:44] <shawarma> \sh: Are you going to be handling the merges with your name on them?
[02:45] <\sh> shawarma: I wanted to
[02:45] <\sh> but if you want take some :)
[02:46] <shawarma> \sh: I'll probably do that. I'm still working my way down the list doing the ones with unfamiliar names on them. When I'm done with those, I'll just start from the top, and yours is the first one of those. :-)
[02:47] <\sh> afterstep is a sync, apoo is a sync (synced today) avifile (sync) bacula is somewhat broken
[02:47] <shawarma> \sh: ..and that one puzzles me, actually. It's afterstep. MoM says that this is your previous merge: http://merges.ubuntu.com/a/afterstep/afterstep_2.2.2-1ubuntu1.patch
[02:47] <shawarma> Yes, I already did apoo. Don't know why. :-)
[02:47] <\sh> shawarma: I merged it last time, but was a mistake
[02:48] <shawarma> \sh: Ah, ok. I thought I was missing something somewhere. :-)
[02:48] <\sh> shawarma:  nope ;)
[02:59] <Tonio_> any motu available there for revuing http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3689
[02:59] <Tonio_> already advocated so just one confirmation required for upload.
[02:59] <Q-FUNK> dholbach: it seems that there are some dependency differences between debian and ubuntu on planner.  I'll jsut add an explicit dependency to libdbus-gblib-1 and re-upload to debian.
[03:01] <Q-FUNK> dholbach: libdbus-glib-1-dev that would be
[03:18] <joejaxx> what whould you all say whould be a fair size to make a root partition for ubuntu?
[03:19] <joejaxx> the size lets say for a server install and the size for a desktop install
[03:19] <joejaxx> if i want to have the rest of the drive be home
[03:20] <joejaxx> i am trying to see how i should partition this drive
[03:20] <joejaxx> to allow space for ubuntu to grow
[03:21] <raphink> did you consider LVM?
[03:22] <joejaxx> no
[03:24] <joejaxx> raphink: is that going to work well with a hardware raid 1+0?
[03:25] <joejaxx> nevermind it should be transarent to ubuntu anyway
[03:34] <raphink> sure joejaxx
[03:34] <joejaxx> raphink: so the partition actively resize with lvm?
[03:34] <raphink> it should work
[03:34] <joejaxx> LOL
[03:34] <raphink> I'm actually setting a lvm on a raid myself
[03:35] <raphink> just now
[03:35] <joejaxx> why did i not know about this before
[03:35] <raphink> although it's a raid5, not 10
[03:35] <joejaxx> i have been looking for something that was like the vmware hdd resize method
[03:35] <joejaxx> raphink: thanks for telling me :)
[03:36] <joejaxx> i should reformat this laptop now then
[03:51] <bddebian> Heya gang
[03:51] <\sh> hey barry
[03:54] <bddebian> Hi \sh
[03:55] <dholbach> Q-FUNK: no, that was a problem with libgnomeui - it's fixed in ubuntu now
[03:55] <dholbach> Q-FUNK: it's not needed
[03:55] <dholbach> Q-FUNK: a give-back or rebuild in ubuntu should do
[03:55] <Q-FUNK> dholbach: done.
[03:55] <Q-FUNK> infinity took care of it
[03:56] <dholbach> rock and roll
[03:56] <dholbach> so dbus-glib not needed as a build-dep
[04:03] <Q-FUNK> indeed not
[04:03] <Q-FUNK> which is nice
[04:10] <proppy> oy
[04:51] <poningru> thats it
[04:52] <poningru> I am logging all the ubuntu hugs and putting it up on a website
[04:52] <poningru> should be easy to do
[04:52] <proppy> auto hugging too ?
[04:52] <poningru> sure why not
[04:52] <proppy> hugbuntu
[04:53] <proppy> :)
[04:53] <proppy> make a wiki page instead :)
[04:54] <poningru> hmm
[04:55] <proppy> i wonder if there is some tool to update a moinmoin wiki via a script
[04:55] <proppy> i should be easy with a bit of curl
[04:55] <poningru> hehe true that
[04:55] <poningru> though I have never maintained a moin
[04:55] <poningru> so dont know the things that go into it
[04:56] <proppy> there is definitly room for nice procrastination into this :)
[04:58] <poningru> oh yeah
[05:50] <zorglu_> q. is it possible to make a package for edgy/feisty on a dapper installation ?
[05:50] <imbrandon> yes
[05:50] <imbrandon> just use the pbuilder howto to make a edgy or feisty ( or both ) pbuilder
[05:50] <imbrandon> zorglu_: ^^
[05:51] <zorglu_> is there a special name for this process
[05:51] <zorglu_> ah ok, thanks
[05:51] <imbrandon> !pbuilder
[05:51] <ubotu> pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
[05:51] <imbrandon> there is the link to the howto, it tells you how to setup multi pbuilders
[05:51] <zorglu_> it is my first time as packaging for ubuntu, pbuilder is the recommended way ?
[05:51] <imbrandon> yup :)
[05:52] <zorglu_> cool :)
[06:38] <rexbron> Hello, Would anyone here be able to tell me WHY mjpegtools is in multiverse?
[06:39] <Laser_away> rexbron: becuase it or something it depends on is non-free
[06:43] <rexbron> LaserJock: From what I can tell from looking at the dependacies, everything is in main
[06:43] <LaserJock> then I would guess mjpegtools itself is non-free then
[06:44] <rexbron> LaserJock: But the package says the code is GPL
[06:44] <LaserJock> it comes from the Marillat Debian repo
[06:44] <rexbron> I am refering to mjpegtools0c2a
[06:44] <rexbron> as that is the one in multiverse
[06:44] <zorglu_> maybe it contain patented stuff ?
[06:45] <rexbron> is mpeg non-free?
[06:45] <zorglu_> unsure, i was just suggesting
[06:45] <rexbron> I am just really confused...
[06:46] <rexbron> Is there a place where one can find the information as to why a package was put into multiverse?
[06:46] <rexbron> on a package by package basis?
[06:47] <LaserJock> rexbron: no
[06:48] <LaserJock> but you could perhaps as an archive maintainer
[06:48] <rexbron> ok I will contact the maintainer
[06:48] <rexbron> ty for your help
[06:48] <LaserJock> I'm just really not up on the multimedia-in-Multiverse stuff
[06:49] <rexbron> I am trying to help with ubuntu studio and part of that is trying to make it all free software
[06:49] <LaserJock> I couldn't find any obvious Multiverse deps
[06:49] <LaserJock> ah, cool
[06:49] <rexbron> and as far as I can tell this package is free, but I will need to do more research
[06:50] <LaserJock> well, usually packages in Marillat are there because of none-free or something similar
[06:50] <LaserJock> _MMA_: you around?
[06:51] <_MMA_> Hello :)
[06:51] <_MMA_> Arent you at work? :)
[06:51] <LaserJock> ummm ....
[06:51] <_MMA_> lol
[06:52] <LaserJock> rexbron was just asking about mjpegtools
[06:53] <rexbron> sup _MMA_
[06:53] <rexbron> :)
[06:53] <LaserJock> I think probably the best place to ask is either the MOTU Multimedia team or the archive admins
[06:53] <_MMA_> Ok. Like elmo?
[06:53] <rexbron> I am emailing the maintainer right now
[06:53] <LaserJock> rexbron: who?
[06:54] <rexbron> Cristian Marillat
[06:54] <LaserJock> _MMA_: well, I'd check with slomo first, then Keybuk or cjwatson
[06:54] <LaserJock> rexbron: I don't think that'll help
[06:54] <LaserJock> he doesn't have anything to do with Ubuntu
[06:54] <rexbron> can not hurt to try?
[06:55] <rexbron> LaserJock: who would you sugest then?
[06:55] <_MMA_> LaserJock: is slomo om the Multimedia team?
[06:55] <LaserJock> should be
[06:55] <_MMA_> Do they have a channel? :)
[06:55] <LaserJock> you're in it
[06:55] <_MMA_> lol
[06:55] <LaserJock> https://launchpad.net/people/motumedia
[06:56] <LaserJock> slomo, siretart, and crimsun are the easy targets ;-)
[06:57] <_MMA_> Ok. Since crimsun hangs with us Ill ask him.
[07:01] <Sp4rKy> hi there
[07:12] <Hacim07> quit
[07:13] <dholbach> hey proppy
[07:13] <proppy> hoy dholbach
[07:13] <proppy> i reuploaded unittest++
[07:14] <proppy> the previous diff.gz was bloated
[07:14] <dholbach> right
[07:14] <dholbach> I got your mail
[07:14] <dholbach> but didn't have a chance yet
[07:14] <proppy> because i didn't generate it properly
[07:14] <jorgp> where can I find a list of debian environment variables I can set in my profile?
[07:15] <proppy> dholbach: np
[07:19] <imbrandon> heya LaserJock dholbach 
[07:20] <dholbach> heya imbrandon
[07:21] <LaserJock> hola imbrandon 
[07:23] <imbrandon> any "screen" guru's ? i want to flip the consoles in a split screen
[07:24] <imbrandon> eg make the console thats on top , bottom and vice versa
[07:28] <LaserJock> I only use it for one thing at a time and that's irssi
[07:29] <imbrandon> :)
[07:38] <zorglu_> q. i try to package a statically linked program, is there an already packaged programm i could look at to 'inspire' myself ?
[07:41] <zul> imbrandon: ditto
[07:42] <imbrandon> i found a way
[07:42] <zul> how?
[07:43] <joejaxx> imbrandon: 
[07:43] <joejaxx> Ctrl+A
[07:43] <joejaxx> Ctrl+a
[07:43] <joejaxx> S
[07:43] <joejaxx> gives you split consoles on screen
[07:43] <imbrandon> C^a X then C^a n too the one you want on top then C^a S then C^a tab then C^a n again
[07:43] <imbrandon> joejaxx: yea i know
[07:43] <joejaxx> oh ok
[07:44] <imbrandon> joejaxx: thats not what i wanted, i wanted to reverse those
[07:44] <Kaleo> hi guys
[07:44] <joejaxx> oh
[07:44] <imbrandon> e.g. its a PITA but doable
[07:45] <joejaxx> Kaleo: hello
[07:45] <joejaxx> imbrandon: yeah
[07:45] <Kaleo> is there a place where is written who is responsible for a package in Universe ?
[07:46] <imbrandon> Kaleo: we have no "maintainers" all MOTU are responsible for all packages
[07:46] <imbrandon> in universe
[07:46] <Kaleo> Ok
[07:46] <Kaleo> can I point you to a package which needs some love then ?
[07:47] <rexbron> imbrandon: are the MOTU responcible for uploading to multiverse aswell?
[07:47] <imbrandon> sure, but it would be better to file a bug
[07:47] <imbrandon> rexbron: yes
[07:47] <Kaleo> bug #66452
[07:47] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 66452 in gaphor "Dependancy problems - not synced from Debian?" [Unknown,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/66452
[07:47] <imbrandon> rexbron: universe and multiverse
[07:47] <imbrandon> rexbron: and core-dev for main
[07:47] <rexbron> ok
[07:47] <Kaleo> and assign it to universe-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com ?
[07:48] <imbrandon> dont assign anything
[07:48] <rexbron> what is the procidure for requesting a sync from debian?
[07:48] <imbrandon> !sync
[07:48] <imbrandon> bah
[07:48] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about sync - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[07:48] <Kaleo> ok
[07:48] <imbrandon> umm lemme find it rexbron 
[07:48] <rexbron> ty
[07:49] <imbrandon> rexbron: its on https://wiki.kubuntu.org/DeveloperResources
[07:49] <imbrandon> near the top
[07:50] <rexbron> cool
[07:50] <imbrandon> Kaleo: but in refrence to what you were saying awhile ago, NEVER assign a bug to someone, you MAY want to subscribe them to it
[07:51] <Kaleo> I see
[07:51] <rexbron> imbrandon: are we in UVF yet?
[07:51] <imbrandon> Kaleo: but in this case they are already subscribed :)
[07:51] <imbrandon> rexbron: no
[07:51] <rexbron> ok
[07:52] <Kaleo> imbrandon: there is also a rule saying that one should assign a bug to oneself whenever one set the status to Needs info
[07:52] <imbrandon> Kaleo: right but thats totaly diffrent
[07:52] <Kaleo> indeed
[07:52] <imbrandon> thats assigning it to your self, you never ever assign someone else
[07:52] <Kaleo> yes
[07:52] <Kaleo> understood
[07:53] <Kaleo> thank you
[07:53] <imbrandon> np
[07:56] <davromaniak> hi
[07:57] <davromaniak> is there a REVU admin here ?
[07:57] <rexbron> imbrandon: Could you advise me one how to go about: A copy of the entries from debian/changelog corresponding to the changes relative to the current version in Ubuntu
[07:58] <rexbron> is that a copy of all the changes since the ubuntu version?
[07:58] <imbrandon> no , that is check the ubuntu changelog , make sure ALL changes have been adopted upstream
[07:58] <imbrandon> and list those changes buttle point verifying each one hase been put into debian, otherwise its not a sync its a merge
[07:59] <rexbron> oh
[08:00] <davromaniak> I made a package, added myself to "Contributors of packages for ubuntu universe", and I have to ask an admin to re-sync the REVU uploaders keyring
[08:00] <rexbron> imbrandon: What is the policy for new upstream releases in debian?
[08:00] <davromaniak> so, may I have to send a mail ?
[08:06] <rexbron> as from looking at the change log, it would need to be a merge
[08:06] <rexbron> imbrandon: as from looking at the change log, it would need to be a merge
[08:07] <zorglu_> "dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot"  produces "dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: autotools-dev" error, any suggestion on where should i look ?
[08:08] <rexbron> zorglu_: sudo apt-get build-dep <package>
[08:08] <rexbron> I think that should do the trick
[08:09] <rexbron> just checking, you have build-essential installed, right?
[08:09] <zorglu_> rexbron: and why what i should replace "<package>" ?
[08:09] <zorglu_> yep i have my program and trying to build a package for it
[08:09] <rexbron> ok, so it is not in the ubuntu repos
[08:09] <zorglu_> aka there is no existing .deb for it
[08:10] <rexbron> alright
[08:10] <rexbron> different procidure then
[08:10] <rexbron> have you read the packaging guide?
[08:10] <zorglu_> i read quite of bit of doc :)
[08:10] <zorglu_> http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/ch-build.en.html this one
[08:10] <rexbron> might want to read the ubuntu docs
[08:10] <zorglu_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Packaging/Kubuntu?action=show&redirect=KubuntuPackagingGuide#head-d06acad1c46b4212504b21730b1c1170af18f9ff this one too
[08:10] <rexbron> as things may be differn
[08:11] <zorglu_> currently im stuck in understanding how to produce the .deb :)
[08:11] <rexbron> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto, might give you an idea
[08:11] <zorglu_> rexbron: do you know a simple statically compiled programm which already got a .deb ? i could look at it and copy
[08:12] <rexbron> ubuntu is based on sources
[08:12] <zorglu_> rexbron: i already read this one :) pbuilder is installed
[08:12] <zorglu_> rexbron: well my programm is based on source too :)
[08:12] <rexbron> you create a source package and then ubuntu's build machines will compile it from source
[08:12] <zorglu_> ok
[08:13] <rexbron> I am kind of newbish at packaging and proably know less than you
[08:13] <rexbron> but I will try my best to help you figure out any problems,
[08:13] <zorglu_> if so, you really dont know a lot :)
[08:13] <rexbron> lol
[08:14] <rexbron> quick question, have you installed autotools-dev or listed it as a build dependancy?
[08:14] <rexbron> zorglu_: quick question, have you installed autotools-dev or listed it as a build dependancy?
[08:15] <zorglu_> nope, but my compilation doesnt use ./configure
[08:15] <zorglu_> aka autotools stuff
[08:15] <rexbron> but it is listed as a build dependacy
[08:15] <zorglu_> well i can install it :)
[08:16] <rexbron> if it does not need it, then remove the build dep
[08:16] <rexbron> what toolchain are you using to compile it
[08:16] <zorglu_> good one :)
[08:16] <zorglu_> the building go further now :)
[08:16] <rexbron> good
[08:16] <zorglu_>  /usr/bin/dpkg-buildpackage: line 175: fakeroot: command not found
[08:17] <zorglu_> so i miss this package too :)
[08:17] <rexbron> apt-cache policy fakeroot
[08:17] <rexbron> could you post the result of that command
[08:17] <zorglu_> just installed it
[08:18] <zorglu_>   Installed: 1.5.6ubuntu2
[08:18] <zorglu_>   Candidate: 1.5.6ubuntu2
[08:18] <rexbron> now or before?
[08:18] <zorglu_> just now, it wasnt there
[08:18] <rexbron> ok so you have it
[08:18] <rexbron> ok
[08:18] <rexbron> lets try again
[08:19] <zorglu_> well currenlty it is trying to build my programm
[08:19] <rexbron> so far so good
[08:19] <zorglu_> but i havent told it how to
[08:19] <rexbron> hmm?
[08:19] <brainsik> is there a python packaging team? i can't find any reference to one.
[08:19] <zorglu_> make[1] : glib-config: Command not found <- so i got this kind of weird stuff
[08:19] <rexbron> brainsik: I do not know, try contacting the python maintainer
[08:20] <zorglu_> rexbron: to compile my stuff, one need to use command like "make -f Makefile.static myprogname-static"
[08:20] <brainsik> i've found a second python package with critical dependencies missing from it. and i'm getting concerned there is a larger problem here.
[08:20] <zorglu_> rexbron: and i dont know where to put those kind of stuff, im guessing in the 'rules' stuff, but i dont get it :)
[08:20] <rexbron> brainsik: would you consider fileing a bug against it
[08:21] <brainsik> i am
[08:21] <rexbron> zorglu_: debian/rules is where you put the information on how to compile your program
[08:21] <rexbron> zorglu_: what toolchain are you using
[08:22] <rexbron> as that affects what kind of rules file you need
[08:22] <brainsik> i am
[08:22] <zorglu_> rexbron: not sure of what you mean my toolchain, i use make and g++ :)
[08:22] <rexbron> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Packaging/Kubuntu?action=show&redirect=KubuntuPackagingGuide#head-d06acad1c46b4212504b21730b1c1170af18f9ff
[08:22] <rexbron> look at the section about designing a rules file
[08:23] <zorglu_> ok will reread it:)
[08:24] <rexbron> zorglu_: have you published the app?
[08:25] <rexbron> zorglu_: also, is this for ubuntu or kubuntu et. al
[08:25] <zorglu_> nope, the plan is 1. make package to get it easily installable 2. send it a few people 3. see how they react 4.fix and loop to 2 5. release :)
[08:25] <zorglu_> yep it is for ubuntu, well if they are ok with it
[08:27] <rexbron> you might want to check out the ubuntu packaging guide then
[08:27] <rexbron> as I am not sure is the kubuntu one is different
[08:28] <zorglu_> yep, but when this kind of thing gonna start to be relevant i will have done a huge step forward :)
[08:28] <rexbron> zorglu_: http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
[08:28] <rexbron> is the main packaging guide for ubuntu
[08:29] <brainsik> Is launchpad.net the place to put bugs? It's really unclear. Especially since ubuntu ships with "reportbug", which as far as I can tell sends an email to a list where it gets held in moderation forever.
[08:29] <imbrandon> brainsik: yea LP is the place for bugs
[08:31] <zorglu_> rexbron: well written doc :)
[08:31] <rexbron> yes it is
[08:32] <rexbron> zorglu_: have you packaged your app for debian?
[08:32] <zorglu_> rexbron: nope i run ubuntu so i will try to package for this one first :)
[08:32] <jdong> anyone up for a quick-and-easy fix for me? :D
[08:32] <jdong> flexbackup in feisty
[08:33] <jdong> the build script uses a bashism
[08:33] <jdong> {path1,path2}
[08:33] <rexbron> zorglu_: cool
[08:33] <zorglu_> rexbron: i think i will start all over with this doc :)
[08:33] <jdong> though I don't understand how it built in Feisty
[08:34] <jdong> feisty still uses dash, right?
[08:34] <rexbron> read the packaging from scratch to get a good idea of how it works and then maybe look into debhelper
[08:34] <rexbron> zorglu_: also, are you running fiesty on that machine?
[08:35] <zorglu_> rexbron: nope, got 2 boxes running dapper, i will try to builder a dapper package and then will see about using pbuilder to build for latter version
[08:35] <zorglu_> rexbron: yep it is much more organized that the other docs i read :)
[08:36] <rexbron> zorglu_: I would think that you would package it for fiesty as that is the next release, and you can not get your program into the dapper repos
[08:38] <zorglu_> i plan to build the package for dapper and up, if it is not possible to be in the official repository, i will run it on mine
[08:38] <zorglu_> some people still run dapper :)
[08:38] <rexbron> hmm, I do not know if that is adviseable
[08:38] <rexbron> zorglu_: I runn dapper as a server at home
[08:38] <zorglu_> rexbron: why not ?
[08:39] <rexbron> point being is, shoot for inclution in fiesty first IMO,
[08:39] <rexbron> as the use of 3rd party repos is really unsupported
[08:39] <imbrandon> it can always be backported
[08:39] <rexbron> trur
[08:39] <rexbron> true
[08:40] <rexbron> imbrandon: I think that the package that I was taking about being synced needs to be merged
[08:40] <zorglu_> ok :) anyway being included in ubuntu repository is not for today :))))) i still have to produce a .deb and to see how the code work :)
[08:40] <rexbron> and that is a bit over my head
[08:40] <rexbron> zorglu_: thats true
[08:40] <proppy> ++
[08:48] <Adri2000> LaserJock: don't forget to re-review homebank please! :)
[09:05] <zorglu_> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide is really well written, it answer a lot of questions i had. congrats :)
[09:07] <LaserJock> zorglu_: thanks, hopefully it will get even better
[09:10] <shawarma> Does anyone know anything about ntfs-3g?
[09:39] <zorglu_> naive question: apparently when building package it is important to be root at some places and to workaround this, there is a fakeroot, i dont understand why one needs to be root to build a package ? any idea ?
[09:43] <zorglu_> q. about the required target in the 'debian/rules' makefile, only 'build' 'clean' and 'binary' are required, correct ?
[09:46] <brainsik> zorglu_: regarding fakeroot, i believe you need it so that the right perms get set on certain files. i.e., when a package installs, the files generally need to be chowned root, the fakeroot package can set enough of the environment up so that when the files get packaged they'll have the right perms.
[09:47] <brainsik> i think :)
[09:47] <zorglu_> ok :)
[09:48] <brainsik> i know people have had trouble with fakeroot, i'm not sure what the policy is on using it if you are uploading official packages.
[09:50] <Sp4rKy> siretart: revu works :)
[09:50] <Sp4rKy> siretart: no, it worked :|
[09:50] <Sp4rKy> i really don't understand what's wrong
[09:50] <Sp4rKy> it works, and just a refresh, and it doesn't :|
[09:51] <malex> Can Debian python packages built for the new python policy (using python-central and python-support) be installed on edgy without modifications?
[09:52] <ademan> lol that thread in the ubuntu-motu mailing list spelled "merges" wrong
[09:57] <zorglu_> dpkg-buildpackage -S -rfakeroot -> parsechangelog/debian: error: badly formatted trailer line, at changelog line 5
[09:58] <zorglu_> and my line 5 is "-- Captain Packager <packager@coolness.com>  Wed,  5 Apr 2006 22:38:49 -0700"
[09:58] <zorglu_> aka the one direct from the http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-scratch.html
[09:58] <zorglu_> any suggestion ?
[10:02] <zorglu_> got it :)
[10:02] <zorglu_> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-scratch.html <- in the file example there is a missing 'space' just before the -- and this confuse the parser
[10:14] <LaserJock> zorglu_: is it still there?
[10:14] <LaserJock> I fixed that a while ago
[10:15] <LaserJock> could be doc.ubuntu.com hasn't rebuilt for a while
[10:15] <zorglu_> yep still there :)
[10:16] <TheMuso> woohoo! THe ubuntu-devel list will be a lot quieter! :)
[10:16] <LaserJock> I hope so
[10:16] <Adri2000> hey LaserJock 
[10:18] <Fujitsu> Morning, LaserJock.
[10:18] <Adri2000> ahhh Fujitsu hi! :)
[10:18] <Fujitsu> TheMuso: Yeah! Finally :)
[10:18] <Fujitsu> Hi Adri2000.
[10:18] <TheMuso> So do I. I don't intend to join the -devel-discuss list.
[10:19] <Adri2000> Fujitsu: I was looking for you about homebank, did it build fine finally? :p
[10:19] <Fujitsu> Hm, I cannot remember. :S
[10:19] <TheMuso> Out of all the mailing lists I am on, ubuntu-devel usually has taken the longest to get through, as I don't want to miss good threads/good bits of info.
[10:19] <jdong> could a MOTU with some spare time consider https://bugs.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/flexbackup/+bug/75042
[10:19] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 75042 in flexbackup "[patches]  LZMA support, bashism in debian/rules" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[10:19] <jdong> thanks
[10:20] <Adri2000> Fujitsu: I did a new upload (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3706) with a man page
[10:20] <TheMuso> jdong: Have you considered subscribing the ubuntu-universe-sponsors team?
[10:21] <jdong> TheMuso: no, didn't know that even existed :D
[10:21] <TheMuso> jdong: I'd subscribe them, which means someone is likely to give it a look over at some point.
[10:21] <TheMuso> What I usually do is subscribe them as soon as I have put all necessary info into the bug report. Do this quickly enough, and the people on that team will receive a copy of the bug via email when you do.
[10:21] <jdong> thanks for the tip
[10:22] <TheMuso> No problem.
[10:22] <gnomefreak> we stay subscribed to -devel list no matter what we choose right?
[10:24] <Fujitsu> MoM is being rather slow with the whole updating thing at the moment.
[10:24] <Fujitsu> Like, I uploaded matplotlib well over 24 hours ago, but it's still on the list.
[10:25] <TheMuso> Fujitsu: heh
[10:25] <LaserJock> well, I'm pretty sure it isn't run all that often
[10:26] <Fujitsu> Last time I heard, it was 6-hourly.
[10:26] <LaserJock> oh, I didn't know it was that often
[10:27] <zorglu_> ls /var/cache/pbuilder/result/hello_2.1.1-1_i386.deb <- wow im proud :)
[10:27] <Fujitsu> It was, although it sometimes explodes on something, so doesn't update.
[10:28] <LaserJock> I liked it much better in dapper :/
[10:30] <jdong> crap
[10:31] <jdong> lzma in debian seriously changed
[10:31] <jdong> grr
[10:31] <Burgwork> gnomefreak: yes
[10:31] <gnomefreak> Burgwork: ty
[10:31] <Burgwork> you just won't be able to post unless you are a motu, dev or have climbed Mount Doom and survived
[10:32] <LaserJock> how do they know if it's a dev?
[10:32] <Burgwork> via LP
[10:32] <Burgwork> going to sync the lists out of LP each day
[10:32] <LaserJock> umm, and going by name?
[10:32] <Burgwork> email, I believe
[10:33] <LaserJock> which one? :-)
[10:33] <LaserJock> I guess any
[10:33] <TheMuso> I'd guess they'd check it against your subscription to the list
[10:33] <Burgwork> the perferred, I would gather
[10:34] <LaserJock> what I'm saying is what if you subscribed with an email that isn't the preferred (or even on LP)?
[10:34] <LaserJock> seems like that would cause a problem
[10:34] <TheMuso> I haven't really read the spec myself.
[10:36] <Fujitsu> I've had two seperate archive admins say they would do the maxima thingy `later today' over the past week, yet nothing has happened :(
[10:37] <Sp4rKy> hi Fujitsu LaserJock 
[10:37] <Sp4rKy> please, i've just install my REVU website
[10:38] <Sp4rKy> but now i would know how i can add admin & users to it ?
[10:38] <Sp4rKy> maybe you can help me ?
[10:38] <LaserJock> Sp4rKy: no clue, email siretart
[10:39] <joejaxx> LaserJock: what whould you say the minimum i should make / whould be
[10:39] <Sp4rKy> hi joejaxx 
[10:39] <joejaxx> LaserJock: on a ubuntu server install
[10:39] <joejaxx> Sp4rKy: hello
[10:39] <Sp4rKy> how are you ?
[10:39] <Sp4rKy> LaserJock: k
[10:39] <LaserJock> joejaxx: what do you mean?
[10:40] <Fujitsu> joejaxx: Depends what other trees you have filesystems for.
[10:40] <joejaxx> well i want to have / and /home
[10:40] <joejaxx> home taking up the most of course
[10:40] <LaserJock> oh
[10:40] <joejaxx> but i want to have room on / for ubuntu to grow
[10:40] <Fujitsu> Use LVM :)
[10:40] <LaserJock> how much do you have total?
[10:40] <Fujitsu> That way there is really room to grow.
[10:41] <joejaxx> Fujitsu: yes but i still have to specify some sort of partitioning schema
[10:41] <joejaxx> LaserJock: 110GB
[10:41] <joejaxx> plus another 36.9 if i can get this fourth drive working
[10:41] <LaserJock> that'a fair amount
[10:42] <LaserJock> *that's
[10:42] <joejaxx> i really want  / to a minimum though
[10:42] <LaserJock> most everything will be in /home?
[10:42] <joejaxx> yes
[10:42] <LaserJock> I'd say 3-5 GB then
[10:42] <joejaxx> ok 5gb it is :D
[10:43] <joejaxx> thanks LaserJock and Fujitsu 
[10:43] <joejaxx> first time using lvm
[10:43] <joejaxx> manually
[10:44] <Fujitsu> If you're using LVM, leave a lot of free space in the volume group, that way you can expand partitions when they get full.
[10:44] <joejaxx> uh lool
[10:45] <joejaxx> hmm i think i selected the wrong option
[10:47] <joejaxx> hmm
[10:47] <joejaxx> i wonder if i should have a swap partition
[10:47] <joejaxx> this server has 2gb of ram
[10:49] <Fujitsu> Yes, you probably should.
[10:49] <joejaxx> how big?
[10:49] <joejaxx> 1.5 times the amount of ram?
[10:49] <Fujitsu> Unsure...
[10:49] <Fujitsu> What is the server going to be used for?
[10:50] <joejaxx> building cd/dvd images and vmware farming
[10:50] <LaserJock> lots of ram sounds good there
[10:50] <Fujitsu> Because of your lack of RAM, a fair bit of swap is probably a good idea.
[10:51] <joejaxx> what is a fair bit of swap?
[10:51] <joejaxx> 3.5gb?
[10:51] <Fujitsu> Maybe 2gb, maybe more.
[10:53] <joejaxx> i will set it to 3.5
[10:53] <Fujitsu> You've got a fair bit of disk space, so why not :)
[10:55] <joejaxx> so right now i have it like this
[10:55] <joejaxx> 5gb
[10:55] <joejaxx> bah
[10:55] <joejaxx>  /root 5gb
[10:55] <joejaxx>  /home 100.7
[10:55] <joejaxx> swap 3.5
[10:55] <LaserJock> although I wouldn't think you would really want to be swapping that much
[10:55] <joejaxx> :\
[10:56] <Fujitsu> I wouldn't advise making home that big at the start, because you're stuffed if / fills up.
[10:57] <joejaxx> i will set home to 70gb
[10:57] <joejaxx> since i have to copy over 30gb of vmachines to it anyway
[10:58] <joejaxx> now what about swap?
[10:58] <LaserJock> heh, that really just doesn't sound fun at all
[10:58] <joejaxx> on this laptop it has 1.25gb of ram and a 1.55gb swap partition
[10:58] <LaserJock> well, more swap can't hurt you I don't think
[10:58] <LaserJock> so 3.5 is probably fine
[10:59] <joejaxx> oh ok
[10:59] <joejaxx> i will shrink the home though
[11:01] <joejaxx> oh shoot
[11:01] <joejaxx> i did this wrong
[11:02] <joejaxx> i am just going to do it regular
[11:02] <poningru> keescook: bwhahahaahhahaa
[11:02] <poningru> awesome hackergotchi
[11:02] <keescook> poningru: :)
[11:03] <poningru> if you need any of the gitsac or other series let me know
[11:03] <poningru> I have all the dvds
[11:03] <joejaxx> oh maybe i did not
[11:04] <keescook> poningru: nah, I've got 'em too.  been watching the slowly
[11:04] <keescook> *them
[11:05] <poningru> frack that I went through an entire gits marathon
[11:05] <poningru> didnt sleep for like 2 days
[11:13] <joejaxx> Fujitsu: are you still there?
[11:13] <joejaxx> Fujitsu: why is each of the lvm partitions flagged as f or bootable
[11:13] <Fujitsu> joejaxx: Yes.
[11:13] <Fujitsu> The physical or logical volumes?
[11:14] <joejaxx> logial
[11:14] <joejaxx> they all have the "f" flag
[11:14] <Fujitsu> I don't know...
[11:14] <joejaxx> how does it know which one to boot lol
[11:15] <Fujitsu> It doesn't boot off LVM.
[11:16] <Tmob> anyone know how to get error status of from $(shell test -z /tmp/somelink ) in make?
[11:19] <shawarma> Tmob: Could you provide a bit more context? What are you trying to achieve?
[11:19] <brainsik> Tmob: not off-hand, but a brief perusal of a ./configure script might have an example
[11:20] <shawarma> brainsik: a ./configure script is a shell script.
[11:20] <shawarma> brainsik: ...not a makefile.
[11:20] <Tmob> shawarma, hey buddy.. hows it goign
[11:20] <joejaxx> Fujitsu: yeah i just saw that
[11:20] <joejaxx> now i have to restart the server which is going to take forever
[11:20] <Tmob> shawarma, well for example in a make file you have:
[11:20] <shawarma> Tmob: This is probably a silly question, but do I know you?
[11:21] <shawarma> Tmob: I don't recall your nick.
[11:21] <Tmob> http://pastebin.ca/272322
[11:22] <Tmob> shawarma, i'm the guy you helped with xfce-verve-plugin
[11:22] <Tmob> i use T` as my alias on my desktop
[11:22] <Tmob> shawarma, with the verve-focus getting removed automatically, etc..
[11:23] <Tmob> shawarma, i think we finally let Gloubiboulga figure the fix out.. heh
[11:24] <Tmob> slight correction in the code.. http://pastebin.ca/272326
[11:26] <shawarma> Tmob: Oh, the geek formerly known as T`. :-)
[11:26] <Tmob> haha
[11:26] <Tmob> Tmob is the mobile close of T`
[11:26] <shawarma> Tmob: Thanks for losing that annoying backtick. It's a pain to type on this keyboard.
[11:26] <Tmob> tab completion?
[11:27] <shawarma> Yes, but T` was at the very end of a loooong list of nicks beginning with 't'.
[11:27] <shawarma> So annoying as it was to type, tab completing to it was more annoying.
[11:28] <Tmob> oh really.. i thought symbols get the first priority
[11:28] <shawarma> Tmob: Depends on the locale.
[11:29] <Tmob> shawarma, any idea on the make return errno?
[11:29] <shawarma> Tmob: Well, about your makefile: I'd probably short circuit it. Like so:
[11:30] <shawarma> Tmob: Oh.. No, that won't work.
[11:30] <shawarma> Tmob: :-)
[11:30] <Tmob> haha
[11:31] <shawarma> Tmob: Ah, yes, here's something:
[11:31] <shawarma> $(shell [ -h ${MY_SYM} ]  && echo success || echo failure)
[11:31] <Tmob> ah i like that
[11:32] <joejaxx> imbrandon: have you tried using the poweredge's tape back up on ubuntu?
[11:32] <Tmob> i guess just echo 1 is enough.. if its empty then its failure
[11:32] <Tmob> thanks sharms 
[11:32] <Tmob> grr.. shawarma 
[11:32] <sharms> no no, your welcome
[11:32] <shawarma> Tmob: Yes, I supposed you'd want to do that. The success/failure thing was just for illustrative purposes. :-)
[11:33] <shawarma> sharms: :-D
[11:34] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: way to go, good job of poking ;-)
[11:34] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: 4th time this week :(
[11:34] <LaserJock> I think the Herd1 freeze might have been some of it
[11:34] <Fujitsu> Quite possibly, yes.
[11:34] <Fujitsu> Oooh, very low visibility around here... Evil bushfire smoke.
[11:35] <Fujitsu> The bushfires are like 500km away, but it looks like really thick fog... :S
[11:37] <joejaxx> Fujitsu: i got it :D
[11:37] <joejaxx> 150 for /boot
[11:37] <joejaxx> 150mb
[11:37] <joejaxx> the rest fothe vg
[11:37] <joejaxx> then setup the lvs inside the vg
[11:38] <Fujitsu> Yep, that sounds about right.
[11:38] <joejaxx> it is kind of like what i use for the os that controls the central network storage
[11:38] <Tmob> shawarma, are you good at embedded __asm__ in gcc by any chance?
[11:39] <Tmob> i am having some weird error from gcc's optimizer .. it things it doesn't have enough register or something to execute my code..
[11:39] <joejaxx> Fujitsu: i thought i did something wrong before because the debian installer was squaking at me
[11:42] <joejaxx> Fujitsu: so i am going to have to add another lvm vg when i add another physical drive 
[11:43] <joejaxx> that should be interesting
[11:43] <Fujitsu> No.
[11:43] <Fujitsu> You add another physical volume, then extend the volume group over it.
[11:44] <plugwash> it just seems to be putting your data at more risk to me (since if either drive fails its going to be difficult to recover the volume group)
[11:45] <joejaxx> i will probably end up having to redo it anyway
[11:45] <joejaxx> once i get the fourth drive i am going to raid5 it anyway
[11:45] <joejaxx> right now it is on Raid 0
[11:45] <plugwash> btw does lvm allow you to move a volume between volume groups without downtime
[11:46] <Fujitsu> Yay, gcl is finally in -updates.
[11:46] <Fujitsu> plugwash: Not between volume groups, AFAIK.
[11:46] <Fujitsu> You'd have to dd, I think.
[11:46] <joejaxx> i need to find out where i can buy a 144gb 4mm tape
[11:47] <joejaxx> i do not think they sell tapes that high of a capacity at the normal stores
[11:47] <joejaxx> :(
[11:47] <Fujitsu> That's a /low/ capacity tape.
[11:47] <joejaxx> 144GB?
[11:47] <Fujitsu> Yes.
[11:50] <joejaxx> do you know where i can purchase oenfi only see 72/36
[11:50] <joejaxx> one i*
[11:50] <shawarma> Tmob: Well, you can always toss the code somewhere so I can look at it.
[11:52] <Tmob> shawarma, http://pastebin.ca/272165
[11:52] <joejaxx> Fujitsu: or 36/72 rather
[11:53] <Tmob> shawarma, and the error is: 
[11:53] <Fujitsu> I have no idea at all.
[11:55] <Tmob> http://pastebin.ca/272382
[11:55] <Tmob> i put everything in one post.. code + error on compile
[12:11] <brainsik> Does anyone know why there isn't any mention on the main ubuntu page of the dappery-edgy upgrade problems a lot of people are experiencing?
[12:12] <plugwash> brainsik didn't most if not all of those turn out to be caused by dodgy third party repositries/tutorials?