[03:41] <danimo> heya!
[03:41] <danimo> imbrandon: hey, are you up dude?
[03:41] <imbrandon> yup
[03:42] <imbrandon> wasup?
[03:42] <danimo> imbrandon: did you read my blog?
[03:42] <imbrandon> not in a little bit
[03:42] <danimo> imbrandon: about the password lineedit?
[03:42] <imbrandon> nope got a direct link>? ( i'm at work )
[03:42] <danimo> imbrandon: oh, sure
[03:42] <danimo> imbrandon: how do I rebuild a package btw?
[03:43] <danimo> imbrandon: dpkg-buildpackage odesn't work
[03:43] <imbrandon> apt-get source -b <packagename>
[03:43] <danimo> imbrandon: I fetched and patched those
[03:43] <danimo> ah, -b!
[03:44] <imbrandon> ahh then just "debuild" if you get errors then "apt-get build-dep <packacge>" first
[03:44] <danimo>  /usr/bin/dpkg-buildpackage: 212: debian/rules: Permission denied
[03:44] <imbrandon> if you have a patched version
[03:44] <danimo> http://daniel.molkentin.de/blog/index.php?/archives/59-Password-shadowing-Pimp-My-Plastique.html
[03:44] <imbrandon> add sudo
[03:44] <danimo> imbrandon: isn't there fakeroot for that?
[03:46] <imbrandon> sure if the file perms are set correctly on the source
[03:46] <imbrandon> you probablty "sudo apt-get source blah" instaead of "apt-get source blah"
[03:47] <imbrandon> thus the need for it later also
[03:47] <danimo> imbrandon: seems like there is no rules directory
[03:47] <imbrandon> rules isnt a directory
[03:47] <imbrandon> its a file in the debian/ dir
[03:47] <danimo> yeah
[03:47] <danimo> sorry
[03:47] <imbrandon> :)
[03:47] <danimo> it's there
[03:48] <danimo> and I can access it as user
[03:48] <imbrandon> right but can you execute it as a user
[03:48] <imbrandon> its a makefile
[03:48] <danimo> ah
[03:49] <danimo> imbrandon: yes, make -f debian/rules works
[03:49] <danimo> hmm, but returns with an error
[03:49] <imbrandon> humm, you got me then
[03:49] <imbrandon> nice post, is that patch for the kde3 version >?
[03:49] <danimo> imbrandon: damn
[03:49] <danimo> imbrandon: nope, but i just created one :)
[03:50] <danimo> imbrandon: I want to test it on the stable binaries before pushing it into the branch
[03:50] <danimo> imbrandon: it will make kdm look _a lot_ nicer
[03:50] <danimo> imbrandon: plus i patched it into kstyle, so all KDE styles can profit from it
[03:50] <imbrandon> cool
[03:50] <danimo> imbrandon: but it's all no help if I cannot build the damn thing
[03:51] <danimo> imbrandon: I could send you the patch of course
[03:51] <danimo> imbrandon: if that is of any use
[03:51] <imbrandon> :)
[03:51] <imbrandon> well you should be able to build just fine with sudo, but how ever you want to do it :)
[03:51] <imbrandon> i can build it in a clean pbuilder, erm no i cant not for another ~3 hours
[03:51] <imbrandon> heh
[03:52] <danimo> imbrandon: well, after I start the build, I'll go to sleep anyway
[03:52] <danimo> pbuilder, yeah right
[03:52] <imbrandon> ( some reason i cant ssh into my build box atm )
[03:52] <danimo> I remember that I used pbuilder the last time
[03:53] <imbrandon> yea , thats rthe best way
[03:53] <imbrandon> the*
[03:53] <danimo> imbrandon: I just deleted the kdelibs-3.5.5 dir and will unpack it from source
[03:54] <danimo> imbrandon: can I then just move the patch into the patch dir and rebuild?
[03:54] <imbrandon> yup
[03:54] <danimo> cool, trying that now
[03:54] <imbrandon> brb one sec, gonna grab a cup of coffee
[03:58] <imbrandon> re
[03:59] <danimo> imbrandon: how do I build with pbuilder?
[03:59] <imbrandon> "pbuilder build file.dsc"
[03:59] <danimo> imbrandon: so far I untarred the orig sources and applied the patches
[03:59] <imbrandon> ahh ok
[03:59] <imbrandon> well
[03:59] <imbrandon> applied them how, did you run "debuild -S -sa" afterwords
[03:59] <imbrandon> ?
[03:59] <danimo> imbrandon: don't I have to add my patch to the debian patches first?
[04:00] <imbrandon> yes well
[04:00] <imbrandon> ok here is what you do from start to finish
[04:00] <danimo> imbrandon: I just added a kubuntu_63_password_noasterisk.diff to the patches dir
[04:00] <imbrandon> apt-get source <package>
[04:00] <imbrandon> cd <package>
[04:00] <danimo> check
[04:00] <danimo> check
[04:00] <imbrandon> add the diff to debian/patches
[04:01] <danimo> imbrandon: first apply the patch I assume?
[04:01] <imbrandon> no
[04:01] <danimo> imbrandon: the debian diff, that is
[04:01] <imbrandon> no
[04:01] <imbrandon> just add it to the directory
[04:01] <imbrandon> dont applie it
[04:01] <danimo> but the patches dir does not exists before
[04:01] <imbrandon> err apply it
[04:01] <danimo> imbrandon: I didn't apply the patch itself
[04:01] <danimo> but I had to apply kdelibs_3.5.5-0ubuntu3.diff.gz
[04:02] <imbrandon> err no apt-get source <package> should have done that for you
[04:02] <imbrandon> and there is a patches dir in kdelibs
[04:02] <imbrandon> thats what i'm saying i think you tried to untar something by hand
[04:02] <danimo> imbrandon: maybe
[04:02] <imbrandon> and you shouldent do that
[04:02] <danimo> imbrandon: I deleted the source dir
[04:02] <danimo> but anyway
[04:02] <imbrandon> ok here get your diff and put it somewhere safe
[04:03] <danimo> applying the diff manually should get me there, too, right?
[04:03] <imbrandon> then rm -rf what you have already done and make a new working temp dir we can work in thats empty
[04:03] <imbrandon> no
[04:03] <danimo> ah
[04:03] <imbrandon> it qwill mess the build system up
[04:03] <imbrandon> ok so you have the diff in like ~/
[04:03] <imbrandon> and make a ~/working
[04:04] <imbrandon> that is empty
[04:04] <danimo> ok
[04:04] <imbrandon> cd ~/working
[04:04] <imbrandon> apt-get source kdelibs
[04:04] <danimo> yes, I have done that just now
[04:04] <imbrandon> it should apply the diff.gz and unzip the source dir for you
[04:04] <imbrandon> so DONT do that manualy
[04:04] <danimo> now it applies the diffs automatically
[04:04] <danimo> ok
[04:04] <imbrandon> right
[04:04] <danimo> works now
[04:05] <imbrandon> ok so now cd to the unpacked dir it made
[04:05] <imbrandon> and add your diff to the debian/patches
[04:05] <danimo> done
[04:05] <imbrandon> then run "debuild -S -sa -us -uc" it will make a new *.dsc for you
[04:05] <imbrandon> once thats done ( only takes a few seconds )
[04:05] <imbrandon> lemme know
[04:06] <danimo> ok
[04:06] <imbrandon> ok now "cd .."
[04:06] <danimo> wait, it's still working
[04:06] <imbrandon> ahh ok
[04:07] <danimo> imbrandon: still creating the diff
[04:07] <imbrandon> yea , on large packages it can take like 30 to 45 seconds or so
[04:07] <imbrandon> depends on the speed of you comp
[04:07] <danimo> imbrandon: I am beyond that. but then again it's building on a sincle core centrino
[04:08] <imbrandon> ahh :) yea give it a some extra time :)
[04:08] <danimo> single even
[04:08] <danimo> dpkg-source: warning: file debian/patches/kubuntu_48_cups12_cupsdconf.diff has no final newline (either original or modified version)
[04:09] <danimo> heh
[04:09] <imbrandon> no biggie
[04:09] <danimo> right
[04:09] <danimo> just wondering why this is actually worth a warning
[04:09] <danimo> ok, worked
[04:09] <imbrandon> debian packageing is anail at times :)
[04:09] <danimo> imbrandon: done
[04:09] <imbrandon> ok now
[04:09] <imbrandon> cd ..
[04:09] <danimo> done
[04:09] <imbrandon> then "pbuilder build the_new_.dsc"
[04:10] <danimo> pbuilder kdelibs*..dsc
[04:10] <imbrandon> pbuilder build ...... but yea
[04:10] <danimo> imbrandon: permission denied
[04:10] <imbrandon> sudo pbuilder build ....
[04:10] <danimo> imbrandon: sude doesn't work either
[04:11] <danimo> E: failed to find /var/cache/pbuilder/base.tgz, have you done <pbuilder create> to create your base tarball yet?
[04:11] <imbrandon> ahhh yes you need to run pbuilder create if you havent before
[04:11] <danimo> ok
[04:11] <imbrandon> when thats done then do it again
[04:11] <imbrandon> ( just the last part )
[04:12] <danimo> why do I expect another heap of wasted disk space after that?
[04:12] <danimo> :\
[04:12] <imbrandon> nah only like 150mb
[04:12] <imbrandon> or so
[04:12] <danimo> I only have like 870MB spare
[04:12] <danimo> imbrandon: but I'm glad my provider upgraded me to 3MBit/s :)
[04:12] <imbrandon> heh you can delete it once your done ( jusy rm /var/pbuilder/base.tgz
[04:12] <imbrandon> )
[04:13] <danimo> so the packages come here quickly
[04:13] <imbrandon> :)
[04:13] <danimo> imbrandon: thanks for the help man
[04:13] <danimo> imbrandon: I think I get along from here
[04:13] <danimo> actually I should really go to bed now
[04:13] <danimo> it's past 4 am here
[04:13] <imbrandon> np
[04:13] <imbrandon> :)
[04:14] <imbrandon> rember too it will put the resulting *.deb files in /var/pbuilder/result/
[04:14] <imbrandon> alot of people forget that
[04:14] <imbrandon> but anyhow, sleep well
[04:15] <danimo> well, I'll wait until I can start the process
[04:15] <danimo> but thanks for the hint
[04:25] <danimo>  -> extracting base tarball [/var/cache/pbuilder/base.tgz] 
[04:25] <danimo>  -> creating local configuration
[04:25] <danimo> hostname: Unknown host
[04:25] <danimo> imbrandon: any idea what that means?
[04:31] <imbrandon> no idea
[04:31] <imbrandon> it can probably be safely ignored
[04:31] <imbrandon> never seen it before though
[04:37] <danimo> imbrandon: it breaks afterwards
[04:39] <danimo> imbrandon: I went with dpkg-buildpackage, which seems to work
[05:09] <manchicken> Hey, how goes it?
[05:10] <manchicken> I'm looking for some small tasks that need doing.
[05:10] <manchicken> I'm not looking to become the world's greatest contributor, but I'm interested in helping as much as I can.
[05:10] <nixternal> how come lsb-release shows Ubuntu and not Kubuntu
[05:10] <nixternal> wasabi manchicken !
[05:11] <manchicken> Not much homie.
[05:12] <nixternal> i was in tinley all day for my nephews bday party..im exhausted
[05:12] <manchicken> Fun.
[05:13] <manchicken> I tossed kubuntu on my other box today.
[05:13] <nixternal> are you up on Debian packaging at all? I know there are a bunch of merges yet to be done
[05:13] <nixternal> yay kubuntu
[05:13] <nixternal> im gonna install it on a few machines tomorrow if possible
[05:14] <nixternal> as for the coding stuff that needs to be done, probably get in touch with Riddell (who is +01:00 i believe)
[05:17] <manchicken> I just want a few things to look into.
[05:19] <manchicken> Are you switching to fawn?
[05:22] <manchicken> Or is it Feisty?
[05:24] <nixternal> feisty
[05:24] <nixternal> The Feisty Fawn to be exact
[05:25] <nixternal> 7.04, which is due 04=April and the 7=2007
[05:25] <manchicken> To upgrade, do you just change edgy to fawn in sources.list?
[05:26] <abattoir> manchicken: feisty(not fawn), the adjective is generally what is used
[05:26] <abattoir> hi nixternal
[05:27] <manchicken> Righto.
[05:27] <abattoir> manchicken: i assume you know the risks that are associated w/ running a dev. release...
[05:27] <nixternal> hiya abattoir
[05:27] <manchicken> abattoir: Yup.
[05:27] <abattoir> ok then :)
[05:28] <manchicken> I'm hoping I can help without moving in that direction.
[05:28] <manchicken> Or I could just dual-boot.
[05:28] <nixternal> abattoir: this guy is part of a team who wrote their own file system in a day at someones house ;) nerds i tell ya
[05:28] <abattoir> haha
[05:28] <nixternal> well, it was the Chicago GLUG
[05:29] <manchicken> Yeah, it was.
[05:29] <nixternal> i quit using Kopete for Bitlbee
[05:29] <manchicken> That's unfortunate ;)
[05:29] <nixternal> heh
[05:29] <nixternal> so i ahve seen...there is a new theme on kde-look that is pretty sharp
[05:30] <manchicken> I contributed a VERY little bit to gaim and a small bug-fix to qt4.
[05:30] <nixternal> im waiting for my qt4 book now
[05:30] <manchicken> I'm just looking for something very small to do.
[05:30] <nixternal> i will take my new python book to bed tonight and start reading
[05:30] <nixternal> otherwise i will show up to a Chicago GLUG event and look stupid..which i am sure will happen anyways
[05:31] <manchicken> heh
[05:31] <nixternal> i gotta get back into coding..i quit coding totally in 1998 pretty much..i did some vb and very little c++ for control automation system
[05:31] <manchicken> I prefer Perl above all of the procedural scripting languages.
[05:32] <manchicken> Perl-Qt is letting me down though :(
[05:32] <manchicken> It doesn't have all of the network facilities implemented.
[05:32] <nixternal> shoot, i have a hard enough time working some stupid sed scripts
[05:32] <manchicken> Wuss ;)
[05:33] <manchicken> heh
[05:33] <nixternal> hehe
[05:33] <manchicken> Either way, your contribution of CDs has been quite influential.
[05:33] <nixternal> why thank you
[05:33] <manchicken> No, thank you.
[05:33] <manchicken> ^_^
[05:33] <nixternal> i have some more to give out tomorrow..hopefully installing some Kubuntu
[05:33] <manchicken> My wife is digging Kubuntu over SuSE.  I'm glad.
[05:33] <nixternal> last event I installed Kubuntu on some old ladies computer
[05:34] <manchicken> I didn't want to have to manually maintain a SuSE build when they go into GPL3 violation.
[05:34] <nixternal> i ta a linux class, and they are all in their 50's and up
[05:34] <manchicken> I honestly think Kubuntu is to a point where folks could just install it and go.
[05:34] <nixternal> i have yet to run into a problem with it
[05:34] <manchicken> I had the machine completely rebuilt after 1.5 hours.
[05:35] <nixternal> except last night, some guy had a system with a kubuntu dvd and it didn't install the ati drivers correctly
[05:35] <manchicken> It only took that long because I had to manage config changes with the backups.
[05:35] <nixternal> so i did the no-no and set him up with binaries
[05:35] <manchicken> I won't touch the proprietary drivers.
[05:37] <nixternal> ah well..i need to crash..got the lug event at CoD tomorrow early..plus im exhausted
[05:37] <manchicken> What now?
[05:37] <manchicken> There's an event tomorrow?
[05:37] <nixternal> so keep an eye out for Riddell, Lure, tonio, Toma, seele, seele, since they are all KDE people..maybe they can hook you up
[05:37] <nixternal> ya
[05:37] <nixternal> 10am to 4pm - CoD SRC 1544
[05:38] <manchicken> What is that?
[05:38] <manchicken> (nobody tells me this stuff)
[05:39] <nixternal> College of DuPage LUG, Linux Fest
[05:39] <manchicken> Ah.  Fun.
[05:40] <manchicken> My wife's downstate tomorrow.
[05:40] <manchicken> I'll probably spend the whole afternoon at GameCrazy.
[05:40] <manchicken> heh
[05:41] <nixternal> hehe
[05:43] <manchicken> You'd think that with all of the free software projects out there that there'd be something that didn't require complex build and runtime environments.
[05:47] <imbrandon> nixternal: goto bed
[05:47] <imbrandon> :)
[05:48] <imbrandon> ( and you forgot me in your list homie, /me feels leftout ) just kidding
[05:50] <manchicken> imbrandon: Hey, are you on the kopete team?
[05:50] <manchicken> I know I've seen you somewhere else before.
[05:50] <crimsun> he's on the blame list, yes.
[05:50] <manchicken> Fun.
[05:50] <imbrandon> i'm a kubuntu core dev ( i mostly mess with konversation , amarok and mythtv but i touch alot of stuff )
[05:50] <imbrandon> hehe
[05:51] <manchicken> imbrandon: I'm looking to get into kubuntu development.
[05:51] <imbrandon> yea "the blame list"
[05:51] <imbrandon> manchicken: rockin
[05:51] <manchicken> imbrandon: Hopefully something that doesn't require some insanely complicated build environment.
[05:51] <manchicken> IIRC, you helped point me towards the SMS port for kopete4
[05:51] <manchicken> heh
[05:51] <imbrandon> hahaha kde and != insane build environment in the same sentance
[05:51] <manchicken> That was a blur.
[05:51] <imbrandon> possibly heh
[05:52] <manchicken> Well, the tricky part of kopete development is that I had to set up qt4, dbus, and kde4.
[05:52] <imbrandon> thats easy in edgy and feisty now :L)
[05:52] <imbrandon> s/L//
[05:52] <manchicken> It took me longer to set up the build environment than it did to implement my meta-contact addition and SMS port.
[05:52] <imbrandon> heh yea
[05:53] <manchicken> Well, and I couldn't really use my additions either.
[05:53] <imbrandon> setting up my dev machines often takes me days to get all the tweaking right on a freash build
[05:53] <imbrandon> fresh*
[05:53] <manchicken> It'd be nice to actually get to add my itch-scratching changes into a form I can use daily.
[05:53] <imbrandon> but the good part it it only has to be done once :)
[05:54] <imbrandon> sure
[05:54] <manchicken> So is there any package that needs a hand that you are aware of that would meet my criteria?
[05:54] <imbrandon> hrm for the moment merges are toping the list of "needs to be done" and its good experince
[05:54] <manchicken> I can do merges.
[05:54] <imbrandon> and often not terribly hard
[05:55] <manchicken> Hey, I asked to help, I didn't ask to be a rock-star ^_^
[05:55] <imbrandon> manchicken: you know where the merges page is ?
[05:55] <imbrandon> heh
[05:55] <manchicken> Is it in the topic?
[05:55] <imbrandon> yup, i would grab something from the universe list that tickles you and try ti out
[05:56] <imbrandon> me and crimsun and the others in #ubuntu-motu and here will be glad to help/point you in the right directions'
[05:56] <manchicken> I would like to help with main as much as possible.
[05:56] <manchicken> It seems like there's a lot of support in universe.
[05:56] <imbrandon> honestly both sides need love in the kde house
[05:56] <manchicken> Then I'll see if there's a KDE thing that looks like fun.
[05:57] <manchicken> I'm going to stick to KDE stuff.
[05:57] <manchicken> Since I'm familiar with the guts.
[05:57] <imbrandon> but yea it was only a sugestion feel free to grab a main package too, just you have to be more carefull with those that no one else is working on it already
[05:58] <imbrandon> smoke time bbiab
[06:38] <manchicken> Okay, I can't find any mergest to do.
[06:38] <manchicken> merges*
[06:40] <Hobbsee> manchicken: oh?  merge-o-matic seems to be down, too
[06:41] <manchicken> Well, I've got merge-o-matic, but everything's taken.
[06:41] <Jucato> Hobbsee!!!!!
[06:41] <Hobbsee> hey Jucato!
[06:41] <Hobbsee> manchicken: yes, seems to be broken.  is superkaramba/karamba up to date?
[06:42] <manchicken> I'm just looking for a bunch of small tasks to satisfy my desire for application of ADD in programming form.
[06:42] <manchicken> It's in kdeutils, right?
[06:42] <manchicken> tonio@ubuntu.com did that merge, it's green.
[06:43] <Hobbsee> oh right, so it is the latest, or needs more merging?
[06:44] <manchicken> If green means up to date, then it's latest.
[06:44] <Hobbsee> it's a measure of importance on mom - if it's the latest, it's not there
[06:45] <manchicken> Ah.
[06:45] <manchicken> So should I email tonio before trying to do anything on it?
[06:46] <Hobbsee> he's not here - just do it
[06:47] <manchicken> Is there an RTFM for how merges are done?
[06:48] <manchicken> And are these against the edgy or feisty repo?
[06:48] <Hobbsee> feisty
[06:48] <manchicken> (I'm guessing we're merging the core project latest stable with the repo)
[06:48] <Hobbsee> there's the REPORT there
[06:49] <Hobbsee> we're merging debian sid with the development version of ubuntu, ie feisty
[06:49] <manchicken> Ah.
[06:49] <manchicken> So I just grab the source deb and spend some quality time in ediff?
[06:49] <manchicken> debs*
[06:51] <Hobbsee> ah, no, it's not in kdeutils - its' a separate package
[06:51] <Hobbsee> oh wait, it's there too?
[06:51] <manchicken> Is feisty too terribly unstable, or should I just work against feisty independently?
[06:51] <Hobbsee> you need to work on feisty, not edgy, all the time anyway
[06:51] <Hobbsee> however, you dont exactly need to run it to build things for it
[06:52] <manchicken> Well I need a stable environment.
[06:52] <Hobbsee> check out !pbuilder for how to do that
[06:52] <manchicken> Is feisty stable enough for regular use?
[06:52] <Hobbsee> run a feisty pbuilder for edgy
[06:52] <Hobbsee> not really
[06:52] <Hobbsee> well ,i found it wouldnt boot on tuesday, while i was away
[06:52] <manchicken> Hmm...
[06:52] <manchicken> How would you recommend I do this then?
[06:52] <Hobbsee> you want to run a pbuilder
[06:53] <manchicken> xen?
[06:53] <Hobbsee> !pbuilder
[06:53] <ubotu> pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
[06:53] <manchicken> Interesting.
[06:53] <Hobbsee> vmware server also seems to run nicely, if you wanted to use the whole environment
[06:53] <Hobbsee> very - you can have multiple ones :)
[06:53] <manchicken> I'd prefer not to run vmware if I can get away with it.
[06:53] <Hobbsee> just use a pbuilder then
[06:53] <Hobbsee> or dual boot
[06:55] <Hobbsee> :)
[06:55] <manchicken> What is pbuilder then?
[06:55] <manchicken> Ooh, jails like?
[06:55] <manchicken> That's neat.
[06:56] <Hobbsee> yep
[06:56] <manchicken> So it really is jails-like?
[06:56] <manchicken> So I could totally make a jail for kde4, too?
[06:56] <Hobbsee> yeah, it's a full system
[06:57] <Hobbsee> ah....yeah, i guess...ish
[06:57] <manchicken> That's so insanely cool.
[06:57] <Hobbsee> you have to add extra bits to be able to run GUI programs out of the chroot though
[06:58] <manchicken> Does that wiki cover it?
[06:58] <Hobbsee> not currently
[06:59] <manchicken> He went to bed.
[06:59] <Hobbsee> he'll see it when he wakes up :)
[06:59] <manchicken> Groovy.
[06:59] <Hobbsee> what type of things can you program?
[06:59] <manchicken> Anything given enough time.
[07:00] <manchicken> I've done GUI stuff, web stuff, and a little bit of elisp before.
[07:00] <manchicken> But I'm willing to learn ^_^
[07:00] <manchicken> I just need an excuse.
[07:00] <manchicken> I've contributed to Kopete.
[07:01] <Hobbsee> ooh, which bit?
[07:01] <manchicken> I did the kde4 port for their SMS plugin.
[07:01] <nixternal> who keeps beeping me? ;)
[07:01] <Hobbsee> nice!
[07:01] <manchicken> I don't know if it works (I don't have any SMS accounts) but it compiled and linked and didn't crash ^_^
[07:01] <nixternal> i forgot to turn the speakers off, i heard BEEP, BEEP, BEEP
[07:01] <manchicken> heh
[07:01] <crimsun> well, there are a couple dozen debdiffs that keep beeping nixternal
[07:02] <manchicken> heh
[07:02] <nixternal> oooh
[07:02] <crimsun> oh wait, are those the couple dozen that I had to review? ;)
[07:02] <nixternal> hahaha
[07:02] <manchicken> No, I don't use kopete for irc ;)
[07:02] <manchicken> (proudly)
[07:02] <Hobbsee> haha, no, kopete sucks for irc
[07:02] <nixternal> IRSSI for IRC
[07:02] <Hobbsee> manchicken: you could always add the support for /me in kopete, as it is in konversation, xchat, gaim, etc
[07:02] <manchicken> I like konversation.
[07:02] <Hobbsee> konversation++
[07:02] <Hobbsee> it sucks less than all the other clients :P
[07:03] <nixternal> Konversation is nice. probably my favorite GUI client
[07:03] <manchicken> I actually like konversation.
[07:03] <manchicken> I can't say that for any of the other clients.
[07:03] <nixternal> Superkaramba is fun
[07:03] <manchicken> Yeah.
[07:03] <nixternal> i have tweaked my own little System Monitor widget
[07:04] <Hobbsee> i mean, it's scripting kinda sucks, as it's so different, so it's rather annoying for channels like #ubuntu with kicking spammers....but otherwise it's good :)
[07:04] <manchicken> It could use a Perl plugin.
[07:04] <manchicken> ^_^
[07:04] <Hobbsee> my trouble is that it doesnt use chanserv.py which is an xchat script :P
[07:06] <nixternal> http://nixternal.ubuntu-rocks.org/stuff/screeny.png
[07:06] <nixternal> i love the wallpaper pinhero (nuno) did
[07:07] <Hobbsee> nice :)
[07:07] <Hobbsee> only edgy?  wuss :P
[07:08] <nixternal> it's better than the blinking lights that chase each other and install viruses, like the ones on Windows ;p
[07:08] <nixternal> Hobbsee: i have 7.04 on the other box, not my main work box
[07:08] <nixternal> noooo, not ready especially when they break udev once a week
[07:08] <Hobbsee> ahh
[07:08] <Hobbsee> haha
[07:09] <nixternal> i used the pbuilder wiki page and have a pbuilder environment now for dapper, edgy, feisty, and i will do an unstable as well when i get some time
[07:09] <manchicken> How do you actually use pbuilder?
[07:09] <manchicken> Just ssh into an image or something?
[07:09] <nixternal> pbuilder build *.dsc
[07:10] <nixternal> what all it does is still beyond me...but i have a different chroot environment (thanks imbrandon) so I can test build each package
[07:10] <Hobbsee> or pbuilder login
[07:10] <manchicken> So is it just chroot or does it actually work like a jail with virtualization and all that fun stuff?
[07:10] <Hobbsee> to actually get inside it
[07:10] <Hobbsee> manchicken: it is a chroot
[07:11] <Hobbsee> manchicken: well..it's slightly longer than that
[07:11] <nixternal> and then i use vmware to test my packages (cuz lord knows (ask crimsun the ubuntu god) i am good at breaking stuff)
[07:11] <Hobbsee> manchicken: there's a base image, which gets copied, and extracted out - so you can login to it, or build with it, etc
[07:12] <Hobbsee> manchicken: and it will use the extracted image, do what you want, until you exit it (if you've used login) or after it's built (if you've used build), leaving the base tarball intact, and deletes the directory it was working in
[07:12] <Hobbsee> manchicken: it's basically a thing that will give you a new chroot each time you use it
[07:12] <manchicken> But it runs nothing on boot unless I tell it to, right?
[07:12] <Hobbsee> of course
[07:12] <manchicken> Okay, cool.
[07:12] <manchicken> vmware isn't that nice.
[07:12] <manchicken> I'm just trying to figure out how to get a build environment set up without killing my stable system.
[07:13] <Hobbsee> and like standard chroots, it wont let you get to your outside system from it, but you can get from your outside system into it
[07:13] <nixternal> heh, someone on planet ubuntu blogged about our chicago patent office shooter
[07:13] <manchicken> I've gotta use this build for work ;)
[07:13] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:13] <nixternal> manchicken: join the crowd on that one...imbrandon probably went through it more times then he ever wanted to with me
[07:13] <nixternal> and i still have no idea what im doing
[07:13] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[07:14] <nixternal> i just get lucky every now and then and someone uploads a package for me ;p
[07:14] <Hobbsee> manchicken: heard of debootstrap?
[07:14] <manchicken> Nope.
[07:14] <Hobbsee> manchicken: apt-cache show debootstrap | grep Description
[07:14] <Hobbsee> hrm, that's not much help
[07:15] <Hobbsee> !chroot
[07:15] <ubotu> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot use this to build 32 bit environments on a 64 bit box
[07:15] <manchicken> So can chroot images destablize your existing build?
[07:15] <nixternal> https://help.ubuntu.com/   <-- also have the Packaging Guide, which is a huge help
[07:16] <Hobbsee> manchicken: nope.  it's only in a directory of your standard build
[07:16] <manchicken> Cool.
[07:16] <manchicken> Does it execute its own kernel image, etc?
[07:16] <Hobbsee> and that page doesnt actually tell you what a chroot is, as such
[07:17] <Hobbsee> dunno on tha tone
[07:17] <manchicken> I should go to bed soon.
[07:17] <manchicken> I'll let this pbuilder finish.
[07:17] <Hobbsee> all it does is give you another / in the directory you tell it to, with a minimum system below, so you can build things
[07:17] <Hobbsee> or do whatever you want with it
[07:17] <manchicken> Ah.
[07:18] <manchicken> That's nice.
[07:18] <Hobbsee> yup
[07:18] <manchicken> So it's a great way to hack feisty while running edgy.
[07:18] <Hobbsee> however, the problem with that, is that once you modify that min system, it's modified, and now unclean, right?
[07:18] <manchicken> Can you execute GUI stuff?
[07:18] <manchicken> Yeah.
[07:18] <manchicken> Dirty dirty chroot
[07:19] <Hobbsee> if you bindmount .Xauthority and .ICEauthority, iirc
[07:19] <Hobbsee> pbuilder is one step better than that - it takes a compressed version of the clean chroot, and doesnt let you modify it
[07:19] <Hobbsee> however, it extracts it, keeping the compressed version in tact, and lets you login to that, or do whatever you want with that
[07:20] <Hobbsee> and deletes it when you quit out of hte pbuilder
[07:20] <Hobbsee> does that make a bit more sense?
[07:20] <manchicken> Ah, so you have to make your diffs each time you're done?
[07:20] <manchicken> Just a note, I may be too stupid to understand this right now.
[07:20] <Hobbsee> hrm - no?
[07:20] <Hobbsee> for developing
[07:20] <Hobbsee> nah, you wont be
[07:21] <Hobbsee> for developing, you do the package in your home directory or whatever, make all the changes you want to
[07:21] <Hobbsee> then dpkg-buildpackage -sa -S -rfakeroot it
[07:21] <Hobbsee> which gives you the source
[07:21] <manchicken> Interesting.
[07:21] <nixternal> don't forget to sign it
[07:21] <manchicken> Is this stuff wikied somewhere/
[07:21] <Hobbsee> *that's* where the pbuilder comes in - you throw the source at the pbuilder, and it tries to build it
[07:22] <nixternal> https://help.ubuntu.com/6.10/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
[07:22] <nixternal> or
[07:22] <nixternal> https://help.ubuntu.com/6.10/pdf/ubuntu/C/packagingguide.pdf
[07:22] <Hobbsee> shoudl be there in those two somewhere
[07:22] <Hobbsee> but youv'e got konvi - there are logs :P
[07:22] <nixternal> logs are good
[07:22] <nixternal> ok, bed for real, i gotta get up early and get my Linux Fest game face on
[07:23] <nixternal> red eyed and walking sideways
[07:23] <nixternal> g'nite all
[07:23] <Hobbsee> manchicken: if you've got the sources, pbuilder builds the binaries to go with them - that's all it does - saves you building the binaries on your own system, and getting all the build deps
[07:23] <manchicken> Ah...
[07:24] <manchicken> So pbuilder takes my binaries into the image, and that image is always clean?
[07:24] <Hobbsee> yes
[07:24] <manchicken> e.g. configs are reset each time, data files are reset each time?
[07:24] <Hobbsee> exactly
[07:24] <Hobbsee> it's a new image each time
[07:24] <manchicken> Ooooh...
[07:24] <manchicken> that's sexy.
[07:24] <Hobbsee> yup :)
[07:24] <manchicken> This is all GPL'ed stuff?
[07:24] <Hobbsee> of course
[07:25] <manchicken> I'm going to have to tell the CM folks at work about this.
[07:25] <Hobbsee> haha
[07:25] <manchicken> they keep on screwing around with portage horsecrap.
[07:25] <Hobbsee> only works for debian systems though
[07:25] <Hobbsee> heh
[07:25] <manchicken> Portage is nice for releasing stuff, but for a staging box, this is just too sexy.
[07:25] <manchicken> I don't know how you could possibly get a more ideal test environment...
[07:26] <manchicken> Though it does seem a bit complicated.
[07:26] <Hobbsee> you understand it eventually
[07:26] <Hobbsee> has it finished working yet?
[07:26] <manchicken> I'm doing a sudo pbuilder create --distribution feisty
[07:27] <Hobbsee> yep
[07:27] <Hobbsee> has it finished creating yet?
[07:27] <manchicken> It froze at bzip2...
[07:27] <manchicken> I restarted it.
[07:27] <Hobbsee> you followed the stuff in !pbuilder so you can build universe stuff too, i assume?
[07:27] <manchicken> I've gotta go to bed or I'll end up rm -rf'ing in a drowsy daze....
[07:28] <manchicken> Yeah.
[07:28] <Hobbsee> the standard pbuilders only know about packages in main, not universe
[07:28] <Hobbsee> cool
[07:28] <Hobbsee> it just means it's downloading it
[07:28] <manchicken> I've been following that verbatim pretty much.
[07:28] <Hobbsee> cool :)
[07:28] <manchicken> Okay, bed time for Senor Chicken.
[07:28] <Hobbsee> you didnt need to kill it - it was just downloading
[07:28] <Hobbsee> haha
[07:28] <Hobbsee> see you tomorrow :)
[07:28] <manchicken> Later.
[08:23] <Hobbsee> mhb: how'd the dist-upgrades go between edgy and feisty, btw?
[09:50] <allee> moin Lure
[09:52] <Hobbsee> hey allee, Lure and mhb
[09:52] <mhb> Hobbsee: good morning
[09:53] <mhb> (here)
[09:53] <allee> Hobbsee: slowly. We all just woke up ;)
[09:53] <Hobbsee> mhb: how'd the dist-upgrades go between edgy and feisty, btw?
[09:54] <fdoving> hi.
[09:54] <Hobbsee> hey fdoving
[09:55] <mhb> Hobbsee: I haven't made the dist-upgrade yet ... but now I have some time, so let's do it! :o)
[09:55] <mhb> Hobbsee: ask me in an hour :o)
[09:58] <Hobbsee> hehe :)
[09:58] <Lure> hi Hobbsee, Lure
[09:58] <mhb> what's that?
[09:59] <Hobbsee> Lure: nice :)  10.2 presumably?   wonder what opensync is
[09:59] <Lure> mhb: sync tool for PIM vs. phone and stuff: http://en.opensuse.org/OpenSync
[09:59] <Lure> Hobbsee: yes, 10.2
[09:59] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[09:59] <mhb> Lure: sounds interesting
[10:00] <Lure> kickoff is also nice, just have to get used to - but it needs some bugfixing (keyboard control is not consistent)
[10:00] <Lure> all, in all - 10.2 looks quite nice
[11:01] <danimo> Lure: problem is that both reside in branches
[11:02] <danimo> Lure: and only suse builds them
[11:20] <mhb> Hobbsee: it seems I have to format the partition I want to use as root and I have no place to backup my files here so I'll dist-upgrade when I get home (tomorrow)
[11:20] <Hobbsee> mhb: okay
[11:21] <Riddell> Hobbsee: you poked?
[11:22] <Hobbsee> Riddell: yeah.  got anything you'd like manchicken|away to do in particular?  seems he's a coder in various languages, looking to help out
[11:23] <Riddell> make system settings use tabs?  fix various thing in adept?
[11:23] <Lure> Riddell: tabs in sys settings?
[11:24] <Riddell> or something
[11:24] <mhb> General/Advanced behaves a lot like tabs
[11:24] <Riddell> but they're buttons, and people get confused
[11:24] <Lure> mhb: true, now I recall discussion on uds with seele
[11:25] <Riddell> manchicken|away: welcome along
[11:25] <Riddell> hi neversfelde
[11:25] <Lure> btw, I really like our sys settings - just used yast this morning and it is so confusing
[11:25] <mhb> Riddell: wouldn't that mean an extra bar?
[11:25] <Lure> everything is there, just hard to navigate... ;-(
[11:25] <Riddell> ah, neversfelde is a kubuntu.de type
[11:26] <neversfelde> Hello
[11:26] <Riddell> mhb: could well do, but maybe there's some way of putting the tabs along side or within the toolbar
[11:27] <Hobbsee> Riddell: if you were going to do that, may as well have kept kcontrol with it's search bar
[11:28] <Hobbsee> Lure: +1
[11:28] <neversfelde> I'd like to have a look at your diskussions in this channel. is it o.k.?
[11:29] <Hobbsee> sure
[11:30] <neversfelde> thanks
[11:30] <Hobbsee> we may not be on topic though :P
[11:30] <Lure> Hobbsee: ;-)
[11:31] <Hobbsee> for some on topic stuff...a chroot would work, wouldnt it?
[11:31] <Riddell> Hobbsee: hardly, there would be no change from current except for replacing buttons that act like tabs with tabs
[11:32] <Riddell> no, I'm not sure either
[11:32] <Riddell> but buttons-that-act-like-tabs are a major usability problem, so its worth investigating something else
[11:33] <Hobbsee> as to why, i dont know - none of the rest of kde is
[11:34] <freeflying_> Riddell: there has a gui tool for set up Input Method in fedora named im-chooser, you may have a look
[11:37] <Lure> Riddell: what about something similar as konq. sidebar?
[11:37] <Riddell> freeflying_: what does it do other than run im-switch?
[11:37] <Riddell> Lure: mmm, maybe, I'm not a fan of vertical sidebar tabs though
[11:38] <Lure> Riddell: me neither, just that it is useful if you want to hide something ;-)
[11:38] <freeflying_> Riddell: it use its own scripts like im-switch
[11:39] <Hobbsee> vertical sidebar tabs....oh right, like epiphany has
[11:39] <Hobbsee> blergh, yeah
[11:39] <Lure> Riddell: if you look at konq tab, there is already a button (new tab) - if this could be extended for other buttons/controls for sys settings (overview/back, search...)
[11:40] <Riddell> worth investigating, although I seem to remember the API only accepts a button there, not a general widget
[11:41] <Lure> Riddell: and we could also put hit number in tab title, e.g. "General (1)" and "Advanced (0)" - or is this too subtle
[11:43] <Riddell> hard to say without trying it
[11:44] <Lure> Riddell: problem is that tab would resize...
[11:45] <Lure> Riddell: we could have them minimal size or something though
[11:45] <Riddell> yep
[11:49] <Riddell> oh and if someone wants to package qt 4.2.2...
[11:50] <Riddell> we miss imbrandon for that sort of thing, a man with fast build machines
[11:50] <Hobbsee> where's imbrandon?
[11:50] <Lure> Hobbsee: got a job
[11:51] <Hobbsee> oh right
[11:51] <Lure> Hobbsee: but he is still around, just less time
[11:51] <Hobbsee> i think
[11:51] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[11:55] <Hobbsee> Fetched 333MB in 34s (9603kB/s)
[11:55] <Hobbsee> nice :)
[11:55] <apokryphos> :O
[11:55] <apokryphos> sweet
[12:03] <Hobbsee> mhb: doesnt look too bad to dist-upgrade
[12:03] <Hobbsee> apokryphos: local mirror attached to that machine.  it's not mine
[12:04] <mhb> Hobbsee: cool
[12:05] <Hobbsee> but that's only in a chroot
[12:05] <Hobbsee> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/36233/ for one
[12:09] <Hobbsee> come to think of it, i wish i'd left this as a chroot
[12:10] <Hobbsee> mhb: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/36236/ is the only major error so far.  and wodim is requiring interaction
[12:12] <mhb> Hobbsee: good to know
[12:12] <Hobbsee> solved by an apt-get -f install
[12:12] <Hobbsee> and that's it
[12:13] <Hobbsee> better than edgy :P
[12:13] <mhb> Hobbsee: I decided to do a dist-upgrade myself right now (cause I don't have 1485kB/s at home :o)
[12:13] <Hobbsee> hehe
[12:13] <Hobbsee> do it on a proper system, not a chroot
[12:15] <Hobbsee> !info coreutils edgy
[12:15] <ubotu> coreutils: The GNU core utilities. In component main, is required. Version 5.96-5ubuntu4 (edgy), package size 1334 kB, installed size 8804 kB
[12:15] <Hobbsee> !info coreutils feisty
[12:15] <Hobbsee> !info coreutils feisty
[12:15] <mhb> Hobbsee: yep, doing it like that (on a proper system)
[12:54] <el> Riddell, Lure: you were talking about the syssettings general/advanced stuff. what i originally had in mind was a toolbar-like navigation bar like here: http://www.uni-koblenz.de/~soma/patterns/Review/MainNavigation
[12:55] <el> the problem with tabs is that they don't work with the other navigation elements in sys settings
[12:55] <el> as there is no vertical navigation widget in kde so far, maybe a modified toolbar would work?
[12:56] <el> the problem is that even in a toolbar, exclusive options aren't visualised in a good way...
[12:57] <Hobbsee> el: there's only one major problem with that - what if you dont know which section you want?
[12:57] <Hobbsee> hey |toma|
[12:58] <|toma|> hi Hobbsee
[12:58] <el> hey Hobbsee - you mean if the setting you're looking for is in general or advanced?
[12:58] <Hobbsee> that too
[12:58] <toma> Hobbsee: we tried to rearrange the meeting, but we failed to get a dat for this year
[12:59] <Hobbsee> was meaning whcih component it was
[12:59] <toma> date
[12:59] <Hobbsee> toma: fair enough.  i didnt give much notice, i'm afraid - not that i had any
[12:59] <Hobbsee> well, much
[12:59] <el> Hobbsee, which component?
[01:00] <toma> Hobbsee: okay, next one should be early in the new year
[01:00] <Hobbsee> el: personal, L&F, Comp Admin...
[01:01] <el> Hobbsee, usually you don't look for sections, but you want to change sth specific in the settings
[01:01] <Hobbsee> true
[01:01] <Hobbsee> assuming you know where it is.  but i see yourpoint
[01:01] <el> Hobbsee, so you scan the sections and try to figure out where it is
[01:01] <Hobbsee> yeah
[01:01] <el> Hobbsee, but there is a search, too
[01:01] <Hobbsee> accessible by keyboard
[01:02] <el> Hobbsee, but line edits in toolbars are accessible by the keyboard, no>
[01:02] <el> ?
[01:02] <Hobbsee> el: line edits?
[01:02] <el> Hobbsee, at least comboboxes are
[01:02] <el> Hobbsee, search fields
[01:03] <Hobbsee> why isnt the keyboard focused there by default?
[01:03] <el> Hobbsee, keyboard navigation in systemsettings doesn;t work at all, unfortunately
[01:03] <Hobbsee> yes.  sucky.
[01:03] <el> that was one of the tasks for edgy, but wasn;t implemented (not enough time..)
[01:04] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[01:04] <el> :-|
[01:04] <Hobbsee> hey danimo
[01:04] <danimo> moin!
[01:04] <el> hey danimo
[01:04] <danimo> hi Hobbsee, el!
[01:05] <danimo> a nicely patched kubuntu: http://developer.kde.org/~danimo/screenies/kdm_input.png
[01:05] <Hobbsee> patched how?
[01:05] <Riddell> the password field
[01:05] <el> dots instead of *
[01:06] <danimo> yepp
[01:06] <Hobbsee> oh right
[01:06] <Riddell> just a qt configure switch?  or something more?
[01:06] <danimo> Riddell: no,see patch linked http://daniel.molkentin.de/blog/index.php?/archives/60-KStyle-Pimped.html
[01:07] <danimo> Riddell: rename it kubuntu-63-whatever.patch and put it into kdelibs/debian/changes
[01:07] <danimo> Riddell: builds just fine for me on edgy
[01:07] <danimo> Riddell: Ideally I want to have it in 3.5.6
[01:07] <danimo> Riddell: I just need SadEagles OK
[01:08] <Riddell> patch KStyle link broken
[01:08] <danimo> really?
[01:09] <danimo> Riddell: fixed
[01:09] <danimo> Riddell: I broke it during an update
[01:09] <Riddell> looks like a small enough patch
[01:09] <danimo> yepp
[01:09] <danimo> Riddell: It's really simple
[01:09] <Riddell> if you send me a debdiff I can upload to feisty
[01:10] <danimo> Riddell: I really want to push it into 3.5.6
[01:10] <danimo> Riddell: if that fails, we can still go for that option
[01:11] <Riddell> yeah, but we want it now!
[01:12] <danimo> Riddell: I can't do a debdiff
[01:13] <danimo> Riddell: can't you do it quickly?
[01:13] <danimo> Riddell: otherwise you'll have to wait a couple of hours
[01:13] <Hobbsee> danimo: i'll do it
[01:13] <Riddell> yay Hobbsee!
[01:13] <danimo> Hobbsee: yay!
[01:13] <Riddell> danimo: I'm busy editing the dot
[01:22] <danimo>  Hobbsee: "this"?
[01:23] <Hobbsee> kdelibs
[01:24] <danimo> ah
[01:24] <danimo> Hobbsee: I got upgraded to 3MBit/s now :)
[01:24] <danimo> Hobbsee: for the same price
[01:25] <Hobbsee> nice!
[01:25] <Hobbsee> right, done
[01:27] <danimo> Hobbsee: they said they wouldn't do that usually, but it seems I saved their ass because I reported a subtle but annoying annormality in their network that could have caused severy problems if detected a bit later.
[01:29] <Hobbsee> Riddell: http://buntudot.org/people/~hobbsee/kdelibs.debdiff
[01:29] <Hobbsee> danimo: heh
[01:48] <danimo> Hobbsee: oh, it's not only kdm
[01:48] <danimo> Hobbsee: it's KDE-wide
[01:48] <danimo> Hobbsee: as long as you use a KDE style
[01:48] <apokryphos> Riddell: some people really do seem to hate distro posts on the dot; even some are on righteous crusades about this. Crazy.
[01:49] <danimo> Hobbsee: you might want to change the description in the diff :)
[01:49] <Hobbsee> oh
[01:50] <apokryphos> never thought I'd get this much stick for that post :P
[01:50] <apokryphos> nevermind, though. For every person complaining there's at least two saying they want such distro posts.
[01:50] <Riddell> apokryphos: it's curious, nobody has complained in the past, but in the last month it seems to be the fashion
[01:50] <Riddell> probably we're just not posting enough news in general
[01:51] <apokryphos> could be. Also, the releases haven't been that far apart, so some people might get the wrong impression
[01:51] <Hobbsee> danimo: so it's any password box?
[01:54] <danimo> Hobbsee: yepp
[01:54] <danimo> Hobbsee: ideally at least
[01:54] <Hobbsee> gotcha
[01:54] <danimo> Hobbsee: I have tested the patch for almost a day now
[01:55] <Hobbsee> :)
[01:55] <danimo> Hobbsee: and so far I haven't encountered a kde app that did not make use of it
[01:55] <Hobbsee> :)
[01:55] <danimo> Hobbsee: it would be something very wicket
[01:55] <Hobbsee> danimo: for all kde apps, or all apps?
[01:55] <danimo> Hobbsee: kde apps, I can't do magic :)
[01:56] <Hobbsee> haha
[01:56] <danimo> Hobbsee: but gnome uses that character for a long time
[01:56] <danimo> Hobbsee: even kpasswordedit uses it correctly
[01:57] <danimo> Hobbsee: so no needs to worry
[01:57] <Hobbsee> nice :)
[01:59] <Hobbsee> Riddell: danimo updated
[02:00] <Riddell> two secs...
[02:00] <Hobbsee> 1...2...
[02:00] <Hobbsee> Riddell: TIME'S UP!!!!
[02:00] <Hobbsee> :P
[02:00] <Hobbsee> *DING*
[02:04] <Riddell> ok, looking
[02:07] <Hobbsee> :)
[02:07] <Riddell> Hobbsee: uploaded
[02:08] <Hobbsee> :D
[02:08] <Hobbsee> thanks Riddell
[02:09] <toma> any motu's who want to approve bug 75229 ?
[02:09] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 75229 in Ubuntu "Please sync Mailody 0.2.0-1 from debian experimental" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/75229
[02:11] <Riddell> toma: done
[02:12] <toma> Riddell: thnxs
[02:33] <manchicken> This kinda sucks.
[02:34] <Riddell> manchicken: what's that?
[02:34] <manchicken> `sudo pbuilder create --distribution feisty` keeps hanging on bip2...
[02:34] <manchicken> 99% [25 Packages bzip2 0] 
[02:36] <manchicken> I'm just trying to set up a build and test environment right now so that I can help you all out with some merges.
[02:37] <manchicken> Setting up a build environment for a distribution is (understandably) a hell of a lot more complicated than I initially thought ^_^
[02:37] <manchicken> But that's cool.  If I can set up kde4 build environments, I can set up this one.
[02:38] <manchicken> It's been sitting at that line for a while, too.
[02:39] <manchicken> I left this thing around 00:29.
[02:40] <manchicken> Riddell: If you're looking for a hyper hacker who likes to bounce around from program to program fixing various things, then I don't think you'll find anybody with a shorter attention span than myself ;)
[02:40] <manchicken> (I just scrolled up to conversation around 04:23)
[02:41] <Riddell> we certainly are
[02:41] <Riddell> if pbuilder is doing funny things, you can also just do a chroot
[02:41] <manchicken> I think it's actually doing something though.
[02:41] <Riddell> mkdir feisty; sudo deboostrap --variant=buildd feisty feisty/
[02:42] <manchicken> gzip is hitting my CPU rather hard....
[02:42] <manchicken> I'm wondering if there's some massive archive that's just been decompressing this whole time.
[02:43] <manchicken> So Adept is python, is it not?
[02:44] <Riddell> no, it's C++
[02:44] <manchicken> Ah..
[02:44] <manchicken> Groovy.
[02:44] <manchicken> Is it fully using KDE internals or just Qt?
[02:44] <Riddell> fully KDE
[02:44] <manchicken> Groovy.
[02:44] <manchicken> Did you know that Perl-Qt has almost all of Qt in it except for networking stuff?
[02:44] <manchicken> What a bloody disappointment.
[02:44] <manchicken> Anyway....
[02:45] <manchicken> I've gotta teach my youth group today, and when I get back I'm going to set up a build environment or kill something trying.
[02:45] <Riddell> people still use Perl?
[02:45] <manchicken> Use it all the time ^_^
[02:45] <manchicken> Almost as much as Emacs.
[02:46] <manchicken> Although I do get paid to use it ^_^
[02:46] <manchicken> I actually have the making of a pretty neat little podcast app written in Perl-Qt... until I found out that QHttp stuff isn't implemented.
[02:46] <manchicken> At first I tried using LWP, but LWP doesn't thread well.
[02:47] <manchicken> So I figured I'd try taking advantage of multi-threaded Qt.
[02:47] <manchicken> No such luck.
[02:47] <manchicken> I tried everything I could, and Qt just sat there with its thump up the rumph.
[02:48] <bddebian> Heya
[02:48] <manchicken> When I looked at the actual calls it was making, it made every call properly except for QHttp calls.  No QHttp calls were being made.  That made me a sad panda.
[02:48] <manchicken> Anyway, I think I've proven my lack of attention span.
[02:48] <manchicken> I believe I'm on the ubuntu-devel list, is there another list you'd like to see me on?
[02:55] <manchicken> No, pbuilder is definately hanging.
[02:55] <manchicken> That was my backup process that was doing the gzip.
[02:59] <manchicken> Ack, I had edgy in my /etc/pbuilder/apt.config/source.list, but was telling it to build feisty.
[02:59] <nixternal> kubuntu-devel :)
[02:59] <manchicken> Mornin'
[03:00] <nixternal> that it is, and an early morning at that
[03:00] <nixternal> do you goto sleep?
[03:00] <Hobbsee> hey nixternal
[03:00] <manchicken> Sometimes.
[03:00] <nixternal> hiya Hobbsee
[03:01] <nixternal> i think some mickey'd's is in order for this morning
[03:01] <manchicken> Very nice.
[03:02] <nixternal> so today I become president of the CoDLUG..time to make changes and take the internet and mailing list from the old prez asap, cuz its current condition is hopeless
[03:10] <Lure> Riddell: knetworkconf asks for version on start -> we need to add Feisty to the list to fix auto detect. Will you do it or should I prepare debdiff?
[03:12] <manchicken> WHY does pbuilder hate me?!
[03:12] <manchicken> It's still hanging on bzip2.
[03:13] <nixternal> hmmm...mine made it past bzip on an update so far
[03:14] <nixternal> i will see here when it goes to Get it
[03:14] <manchicken> I would presume us.archive.ubuntu.com
[03:15] <nixternal> no, for pbuilder i use just archive.ubuntu.com
[03:15] <nixternal> that could be the issue as well, it may not have sync'd up yet with the us archives
[03:15] <manchicken> I have archive.ubuntu.com in there, but it's going to us.archive.ubuntu.com
[03:16] <manchicken> MIRRORSITE=http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu
[03:16] <nixternal> ya, i had the issue before as well...trying to remember how i fixed it
[03:17] <manchicken> Should I uncomment the COMPONENTS line?
[03:17] <nixternal> how about in the apt.config, does the sources.list point to archive.ubuntu.com as well?
[03:18] <manchicken> That may be it.
[03:18] <manchicken> They're all us.archive
[03:18] <nixternal> i think i changed that, and possibly had to recreate the env
[03:18] <manchicken> I'll try that.
[03:19] <nixternal> APTCONFDIR="/var/cache/pbuilder/feisty/apt.config/"
[03:19] <manchicken> us.archive.ubuntu.com has never given me trouble for my normal use... oh well.
[03:19] <nixternal> in pbuilderrc i have that as well
[03:19] <nixternal> i have had issues with us.archive in the past
[03:22] <nixternal> heh, in kde-look.org, clipart > highest rated, my Powered by Kubuntu image is #5 still
[03:23] <nixternal> also, for packaging and what not, the main channel is #ubuntu-motu  alot of super smart packagers that can answer everything...don't let them know i sent you though, im sure they are sick of me already :)
[03:32] <Riddell> Lure: go ahead
[03:43] <manchicken> IT FINISHED!
[03:43] <manchicken> Sweet.
[03:46] <manchicken> Ooh, that's nice.
[03:49] <manchicken> Okay, now I just need to figure out how to get it to include X and K.
[05:04] <Lure> Riddell (or any other core-dev): knetworkconf fix for feisty: http://lure.homelinux.net/kubuntu/kdeadmin.debdiff
[05:17] <Riddell> manchicken|away: pbuilder will include what you tell it to with build-deps when you pbuild the package
[05:19] <Riddell> Lure: uploading
[05:19] <Riddell> I'll put it into KDE SVN too
[05:20] <Lure> Riddell: ok
[05:20] <Riddell> thanks Lure
[05:35] <Lure> Riddell: any idea why so many icons in Lost&Found + 2x Settings menu entries?
[05:39] <Riddell> Lure: no idea, it needs looking into
[05:39] <Riddell> all the lost+found are kcontrol modules, something isn't excluding them
[05:55] <Lure> marseillai_: to be in universe instead of multiverse?
[05:57] <marseillai_> lure perhaps but in this case it should be in multiverse too WITH this support and this is the case for several applications. currently i'm trying to convert .mov files in .flv files and i never have sound on my .flv files
[05:57] <marseillai_> and when i look ubuntu forum i often found people with this problem
[05:57] <marseillai_> and the only solution i found is to recompile ffmpeg
[05:58] <marseillai_> i think that adding multiverse repo should give me this support
[05:58] <Riddell> probably siretat's doings
[05:59] <Lure> s/siretat/siretart/
[06:06] <marseillai_> you was speaking to me ?
[06:06] <Riddell> yes
[06:06] <Riddell> but look in the changelog to find out
[06:07] <marseillai_> Riddell: but it's not possible to have a program in too repo? one in universe without lame support ? and one in multiverse with?
[06:09] <Riddell> no, but it can be split
[06:09] <Riddell> depends on what else is in ffmpeg, I don't the details
[06:27] <Czessi> Riddell: Hi, I updated the Klear package and commentated your notes http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3713
[06:52] <Riddell> Czessi: compiling
[06:59] <Riddell> Czessi: advocated!  http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3713
[06:59] <Riddell> find someone else to advocate it and we can get it uploaded
[07:00] <Czessi> Riddell: Thanks! I'll take a look at ubuntu-motu
[07:12] <Lure> Riddell: K-menu mess is not us big on my desktop (dist-upgraded from edgy): only Settings->HP LIP Toolbox
[07:12] <Lure> Riddell: but no Lost&Found there...
[07:35] <danimo> Czessi: what's so great about klear?
[07:36] <danimo> Czessi: so far kaffeine always showed to be better
[07:40] <manchicken> Riddell: Okay, so how do I control that?
[07:40] <manchicken> Is there a doc or wiki I can follow?
[07:40] <manchicken> nixternal gave me a PDF, I'll check there.
[08:01] <manchicken> So do I have to install all dependencies into pbuilder manually?
[08:01] <manchicken> Or do I pbuilder login and apt-get things?
[08:03] <Lure> manchicken: no, pbuilder build will install required dependencies
[08:06] <manchicken> Lure: Well none of the KDE stuff is installed in this feisty pbuilder image.
[08:06] <manchicken> How do I control that?
[08:06] <Lure> manchicken: it will get installed when you build first kde package (and then it will be cached)
[08:06] <manchicken> Ah.
[08:06] <manchicken> That's nice.
[08:06] <manchicken> So I gotta get a .dsc?
[08:06] <Lure> manchicken: pbuilder only keeps minimal root
[08:07] <manchicken> That's nice.
[08:07] <Lure> manchicken: yes, you pass .dsc to build option
[08:07] <manchicken> So can one ssh into a pbuilder to forward X or will it work with an already running X instance?
[08:07] <manchicken> Before you wonder, yes, I am clueless.
[08:08] <Lure> manchicken: pbuilder does not need X - it just does build in CLI and will give you .deb
[08:08] <Lure> manchicken: no problem, I was clueless too when I started ;-)
[08:08] <manchicken> Right, but if I'm working on a KDE program that I don't want to pollute or update an existing program, how do I isolate it in a pbuilder instance and still be able to run it?
[08:08] <manchicken> I would RTFM if I could find one ^_^
[08:09] <manchicken> I got a minimal feisty pbuilder image that I can pbuilder login into... but that's where the disconnect is.
[08:09] <Lure> Riddell: it seems that kdeadmin did not build on i386/amd64 due to lilo :-( https://launchpad.net/+builds/+build/284062
[08:10] <Lure> manchicken: did you follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto ?
[08:11] <manchicken> Yup.
[08:11] <Lure> manchicken: you do not need to login, just run build
[08:12] <manchicken> right, but if I've already got kopete installed, and I want to make a change in the feisty version of it but not have it pollute my edgy install, how do I do that?
[08:12] <manchicken> I need a stable system.
[08:18] <Lure> you can do the change on source, do debuild -S to build source package, build with pbuilder
[08:19] <Lure> this will not damage your stable system, the only issue is how to test
[08:19] <manchicken> And then install into chroot?
[08:19] <Lure> for this you would probably need chroot environment
[08:19] <Lure> manchicken: yes, I do not know if pbuilder can be abused for this
[08:19] <manchicken> You know of a good chroot tut?
[08:20] <manchicken> Well, if pbuilder pops out a .deb, and chroot can install debs, then that sounds like a great way to do things.
[08:20] <Lure> manchicken: this might help https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot
[08:20] <Lure> manchicken: and other links on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources
[08:21] <manchicken> Cool.  thanks.
[08:21] <Lure> manchicken: if you have chroot, you do not need pbuilder
[08:21] <manchicken> So then why do people run pbuilder?
[08:21] <Lure> manchicken: it is still nice to have pbuilder, as it will ensure it builds on clean system (like official buildd systems)
[08:21] <Lure> manchicken: chrooted environment can also get crafted in time...
[08:32] <manchicken_> Stupid wifi....
[08:48] <ryanakca> Lure: would apt sigsev'ing be a security vulnerability? seeing that people can't (to my knowledge, unless you comb threw all the repos and compare versions with local ones) upgrade their system to install any security fix?
[08:48] <manchicken> Have you ever had any trouble doing this on wireless?
[08:49] <Lure> ryanakca: it might - the problem is that you seems to be one of the rare cases with this problem...
[08:49] <manchicken> Okay, it seems that when I try to debootstrap my wireless goes crazy.
[08:49] <manchicken> Has anybody else experienced this?
[08:50] <mhb> hi all
[08:50] <mhb> oh, I hate waiting one extra hour on a train
[08:51] <ryanakca> Lure: yeah... so... check the box in the bug report?
[08:52] <ryanakca> mhb: hmm... trains have internet?
[08:52] <Lure> ryanakca: I think it is not required, as it is not wide-spread bug....
[08:52] <mhb> ryanakca: not even a power outlet here :OI
[08:53] <ryanakca> Lure: kk... and should I put all the backtraces and straces into a tarball, or upload individually?
[08:53] <ryanakca> mhb: lol... so I take it you aren't on the train :)
[08:53] <mhb> ryanakca: no, I'm back home
[08:53] <mhb> ryanakca: I was on the train for 5 hours
[08:54] <ryanakca> kk... *thinks they should have internet on trains*
[08:54] <ryanakca> mhb: sounds fun... busyness trip? or an early holiday? (I could use one of those :D )
[08:54] <mhb> ryanakca: weekend with my girlfriend
[08:55] <ryanakca> ah
[08:55] <manchicken> Nobody?  No ideas on the wifi thing?
[08:55] <mhb> I see Feisty has problems with encoding, just like *every* Ubuntu alpha 1 CD I've tested :o)
[08:56] <Lure> manchicken: it can be the load on the interface triggering this, no idea what else could be the cause...
[08:57] <manchicken> Hmm...
[08:59] <manchicken> Okay, now it's magically working....
[08:59] <manchicken> Beautiful.
[09:08] <manchicken> Ooh, this chroot thing looks like it may be quite simple
[09:12] <ryanakca> Lure: bug 75273
[09:12] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 75273 in apt "Apt constantly sigsevs on edgy" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/75273
[09:29] <manchicken> Sweet.
[09:29] <manchicken> I got mychroot working.
[09:32] <fdoving> chrooting is nice. :)
[09:33] <manchicken> I'm digging it.
[09:33] <fdoving> pbuilder is also cool.
[09:37] <manchicken> pbuilder may be cool, but right now I need a development environment where I can run stuff.
[09:39] <fdoving> then it's not what you want.
[09:45] <manchicken> Ooh, this is so sexy.
[09:45] <manchicken> Okay, now that I have a build environment....
[09:46] <manchicken> Is there one thing I could apt-get that would pull over all default kubunt packages?
[09:47] <fdoving> yes, kubuntu-desktop
[09:47] <manchicken> Man, #kubuntu is maddening.
[09:47] <manchicken> heh, that'll take up some space.
[09:47] <manchicken> Almost 1.5GB
[09:48] <fdoving> fully blown kubuntu system :)
[09:48] <manchicken> Yeah.
[09:49] <manchicken> Now, if I'm running something like dcop in chroot, will it conflict with my normal base install?
[09:49] <manchicken> (which reminds me, I haven't restarted K since yesterday's edgy update)
[09:50] <manchicken> this is so insanely cool.
[09:50] <manchicken> This means that KDE4 people could hack kde4 without having to fight with multiple directories and all of that stuff.
[09:51] <manchicken> Although I'm sure that this is already being done, but that I'm just not used to it ^_^
[09:52] <manchicken> I suppose I'm just easily impressed.
[09:57] <fdoving> dcop can be run inside the chroot without conflicting with the rest, yes.
[09:57] <fdoving> the tmp dirs with the sockets don't crash.
[10:34] <manchicken> Riddell: Okay, so I think I have a build environment set up.
[10:35] <manchicken> Riddell: Got a task needs doing?
[10:44] <mhb> who did the new guidance-power-manager icons?
[10:45] <mhb> I mean those in Feisty
[10:45] <manchicken> Check the blame.
[10:47] <Lure> mhb: kwwii
[10:47] <mhb> Lure: hmm... I liked the older ones more
[10:48] <Lure> mhb: tell this to him and sebas when around
[10:48] <mhb> Lure: will do
[10:48] <Lure> mhb: I am fine with both ;-)
[10:53] <Riddell> manchicken: know how to merge packages?
[10:54] <Riddell> manchicken: take your pick http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.htm
[10:54] <Riddell> http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
[10:54] <Riddell> anything beginning with a k :)
[10:54] <manchicken> Just some time in ediff, right?
[10:55] <Riddell> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/MOTU/Merging
[10:55] <Lure> Riddell: seen kdeadmin build failed dues to lilo...
[10:55] <Riddell> Lure: oh, foo.  not much we can do about that, unless you want to fix lilo I guess
[10:55] <manchicken> Riddell: You said something about adding tabs to kde-systemsettings.
[10:55] <Riddell> manchicken: yes please
[10:55] <Lure> manchicken: or fix adept
[10:55] <Riddell> manchicken: people get confused because we have buttons that act like tabs
[10:56] <Riddell> Lure: lets start him off simple :)
[10:56] <manchicken> Yeah.
[10:56] <manchicken> I can see that.
[10:56] <Riddell> manchicken: tabs widgets may not be the best replacement though, see the link that el posted earlier for more ideas
[10:56] <manchicken> Okay, I'll get on this.
[10:57] <manchicken> Is it using the designer or just straight C++?
[10:57] <Riddell> manchicken: just play around with whatever layouts you can come up with and post some screenshots
[10:57] <mhb> katapult's not working for me on feisty after dist-upgrade ... tried to remove katapultrc, but no luck
[10:57] <Riddell> manchicken: just straight c++ I think
[10:57] <manchicken> Okie dokie.
[10:57] <Riddell> mhb: works for me, sure you have it running?
[10:58] <Lure> mhb: working here (herd 1 clean) and on my desktop (edgy -> feisty)
[10:58] <mhb> Riddell: tried to start it from the cmdline, reports no errors but won't start either
[11:00] <mhb> I had some trouble with katapult in Edgy, it turned out to be a configuration problem, but now the config file is gone and the problem's still there
[11:00] <manchicken> Later man.
[11:00] <Lure> mhb: you are using non-english?
[11:00] <mhb> Lure: yep
[11:00] <Lure> mhb: I think Tonio fixed something in katapult for this - maybe that is missing in edgy
[11:00] <Lure> s/edgy/feisty
[11:01] <mhb> Lure: hmm ... could be
[11:01] <Lure> there was SRU
[11:01] <mhb> Lure: so you're using english desktop?
[11:01] <Lure> mhb: yes
[11:02] <mhb> Lure: does Slovenian characters work well for you in Feisty?
[11:02] <Lure> mhb: I do not use slovenian characters ;-)
[11:03] <mhb> Lure: not at all? Wow
[11:03] <Lure> 
[11:03] <Lure> they work
[11:03] <Lure> mhb: I have english keyboard, most of my work is in english - so I do not care much about rare occasions when I need them ;-)
[11:05] <mhb> Lure: ok, thanks for the info (some of the Czech ones don't, that's why I asked)
[11:05] <manchicken> Is there a way to kill all chrooted apps, or tell the difference between the chrooted versions and the normal versions?
[11:05] <Lure> manchicken: I do not thnk so...
[11:06] <Lure> mhb: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/+source/katapult/+changelog
[11:06] <Lure> mhb: * Add kubuntu_07_work_with_non_english.diff closes 48103
[11:06] <Lure> mhb: maybe this patch is missing in feisty version
[11:07] <mhb> Lure: thanks, I'll check later
[11:07] <mhb> goodnight
[11:09] <fdoving> nite.
[11:09] <Lure> nite
[11:17] <manchicken> Okay, kde-systemsettings is using designer stuff it seems.
[11:24] <Lure> Riddell: all kubuntu spec are still "Pending approval": https://blueprints.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/feisty
[11:24] <Lure> Riddell: how do we get them approved?
[11:26] <manchicken> Err,  no it isn't.
[11:35] <jjesse> why are we congrating Tonio and Raphink
[11:35] <jjesse> acordig to the topic
[11:37] <Lure> jjesse: they are both getting married
[11:37] <jjesse> ah
[11:38] <manchicken> Marriage is fun.  Congrats certainly are in order.
[11:48] <manchicken> Nice...
[11:48] <manchicken> kde-systemsettings won't compile from apt-get.
[11:49] <manchicken> Just doing `apt-get source kde-systemsettings --compile` fails.
[11:50] <ryanakca> manchicken: it sigsev?
[11:52] <manchicken> Naw.
[11:52] <manchicken> Compile fails.
[11:52] <ryanakca> drats...
[11:53] <manchicken> Ah.
[11:53] <manchicken> I haven't recompiled it.
[11:54] <manchicken> Just installed feisty.
[11:58] <ryanakca> ooh, fun
[11:58] <ryanakca> manchicken: it work?
[11:58] <ryanakca> well... I'll ask you tommorow :)
[12:00] <manchicken> apt-get works
[12:00] <manchicken> But I still can't get kde-systemsettings to compile.
[12:06] <manchicken> It's the configure script.
[12:06] <manchicken> How does one regenerate that script?
[12:06] <ryanakca> no clue...
[12:07] <ryanakca> what about apt-get install kde-systemsettings       instead of recompiling it?
[12:07] <manchicken> I'm trying to work on it ^_^
[12:07] <manchicken> The binary works just fine ^_^
[12:09] <manchicken> But binaries aren't much good for hacking