[01:16] <Burgwork> ajmitch: whiprush is at LUG meeting...
[01:16] <LaserJock> ?
[01:16] <Burgwork> stunned, apparently he is "finishing up some stuff"
[01:18] <LaserJock> some needs to stage an intervention :-)
[01:18] <sladen> that sounds like the Mafia!
[01:18] <Burgwork> the first rule of ...
[01:19] <imbrandon> :)
[01:19] <ajmitch> Burgwork: burning bridges?
[01:20] <Burgwork> no idea, as the lug is apparently still holding their meetings at his workplace
[01:22] <sladen> ./win 183
[01:22] <imbrandon> he still needs to be on irc / jabber now and then , because he dosent use the software we do dosent make him not a freind imho
[01:22] <imbrandon> but thats upto him i guess :)
[01:24] <zul> win 12
[01:24] <Burgwork> he talks to me on jabber a fair amount
[01:24] <imbrandon> i guess i just need to add him to my jabber list heh
[01:24] <Burgwork> geez, you people are terrible typists, zul and sladen
[01:24] <Burgwork> :)
[01:24] <imbrandon>  win 32134
[01:24] <imbrandon> :)
[01:24] <Burgwork>  win 4493038403484
[01:24] <ajmitch> ridiculous
[01:25] <Burgwork> it is 4:30 and I am at work
[01:25] <LaserJock>  win -30
[01:25] <imbrandon> lol
[01:25] <imbrandon>  win nullity
[01:26] <LaserJock>  /win > /dev/null
[01:26] <zul> Burgwork: sorry....dealing with a Kconfig :P
[01:26] <imbrandon> wow you still use kconfig ?
[01:26] <Burgwork> ouch
[01:26] <imbrandon> its a bug if its not in system settings
[01:26] <imbrandon> :)
[01:26] <zul> imbrandon: for porting xen yeah i do
[01:27] <imbrandon> ohhh i was thinking kcontrol /me headdesks
[01:27] <LaserJock> must be he hasn't had enough Mt. Dew today
[01:27] <imbrandon> hehe
[01:27] <imbrandon> i'm on pepsi today, out of dew and too lazy to goto the store tonight
[01:27] <zul> meh...mountain dew is disgusting
[01:28] <somerville32> That reminds me. I saw a picture of imbrandon with a mountain dew...
[01:28] <LaserJock> whenever I think of the borg or some bionic machine I always think of it running on Mt. Dew
[01:28] <imbrandon> probably on my blog ( or the same picture thats on my blog ) of the KDE crew at UDS
[01:28] <zul> heh thats nothing i seen him with a crack pipe for liking shakira
[01:28] <imbrandon> LOL
[01:29] <imbrandon> somerville32: http://www.imbrandon.com/misc/uds_mtv/kubuntu_uds_mtv.jpg
[01:29] <somerville32> Hmm...
[01:29] <somerville32> Who is the hot dude with the mountain dew?
[01:29] <Burgwork> 404
[01:29] <imbrandon> if you are refering to me and hot in the same sentance i hope your of the female gender :)
[01:30] <imbrandon> Burgwork: really?
[01:30] <imbrandon> wow
[01:30] <imbrandon> hold on
[01:30] <Burgwork> "The requested URL /misc/uds_mtv/kubuntu_uds_mtv.jpg was not found on this server."
[01:30] <imbrandon> Burgwork: http://mirror.imbrandon.com/misc/uds_mtv/kubuntu_uds_mtv.jpg
[01:30] <imbrandon> try that one
[01:31] <Burgwork> that works
[01:31] <imbrandon> yea, its a dns thing, i'm migrating to a new box, so somethings mught be screwy atm
[01:31] <imbrandon> mirror.* is the new box
[01:32] <zul> heh i like the jono pic
[01:32] <imbrandon> lol
[01:32] <imbrandon> yea, thats a blackmail pic :)
[01:32] <imbrandon> for susan
[01:33] <imbrandon> daniel holbach is in the bg too if you look real close
[01:33] <imbrandon> zul: ^
[01:33] <zul> heh i like the foreground better
[01:34] <imbrandon> :)
[01:34] <Burgwork> jono just doesn't do it for me, sorry
[01:34] <imbrandon> hahaha i think he means the legs :)
[01:35] <imbrandon> i have a few more pictures from UDS, i need to get them all uploaded i guess
[01:35] <somerville32> imbrandon: Indeed you do.
[01:39] <imbrandon> heh
[01:45] <somerville32> imbrandon: Were you able to get the box setup?
[01:46] <imbrandon> its what i'm waiting on dns for , here lemme get you an account on the old one for the time being
[01:46] <imbrandon> one sec
[01:47] <imbrandon> ok setup
[01:48] <imbrandon> somerville32: see query
[01:55] <allee> Can anyone check why my digikam_0.9.0~rc2-0ubuntu3 upload (1st after loooog time) does not show up on revu? 
[02:13] <minghua> allee: are you sure you uploaded to REVU instead of ubuntu official?
[02:13] <allee> minghua: yeap. 
[02:14] <minghua> Hmm, I don't know then
[02:14] <allee> minghua: i'm no motu so how can I upload to ubuntu official
[02:14] <minghua> you can, it will just be silently dropped
[02:14] <allee> heh never tried.  sounds like fun ;)
[02:17] <ash211> if anybody has the time, 2 bugs can be fixed with an easy repackaging
[02:17] <ash211> bug 2379 and bug 56436
[02:17] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 2379 in electricsheep "Screensaver uses only 1/4 of display size" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/2379
[02:17] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 56436 in electricsheep "Doesn't show up in gnome-screensaver list" [Undecided,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/56436
[02:18] <ash211> edit a .desktop file and change the location of a .desktop file
[02:18] <ash211> If I knew how to package, I'd do it myself
[02:20] <engla> ash211: are the bugs assigned to motu?
[02:20] <bddebian> Heya gang
[02:21] <ash211> don't think so
[02:21] <ash211> 2379 is, 56436 isn't
[02:21] <ash211> electricsheep is in universe
[02:21] <minghua> what's the point of assigning bugs to MOTU anyway...
[02:23] <engla> I don't know stuff. But I suppose bugs are only fixed when confirmed and assigned
[02:23] <ash211> they're both confirmed
[02:23] <ash211> think I should assign 56436 to MOTU  ?
[02:23] <LaserJock> are you a part of the no
[02:23] <LaserJock> sorry
[02:24] <LaserJock> that should have been just no
[02:24] <engla> probably not, that package is in main I think?+
[02:24] <LaserJock> don't assign bugs to people
[02:24] <ash211> no, electrcsheep is in universe
[02:24] <LaserJock> only subscribe
[02:25] <engla> LaserJock: sure about that?
[02:25] <LaserJock> yes
[02:25] <engla> ok
[02:25] <ash211> yes
[02:25] <ash211> [sry] 
[02:26] <_MMA_> LaserJock: Got a min? #ubuntustudio
[02:26] <ash211> both have MOTU subscribed to them
[02:27] <ash211> I guess I just wanted to get them into the logs so if somebody who can package saw them, they'd get fixed
[02:31] <somerville32> imbrandon, The server is off :/
[02:35] <ryanakca> why do I get these errors when pbuilding a package that uses kde.mk in rules: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/36713/
[02:38] <bddebian> That's an apt issue.  It shouldn't have anything to do with kde.mk
[02:38] <RAOF> ryanakca: Is it because you haven't updated your pbuilder recently enough, and it's trying to get an outdated version of that package?
[02:39] <ryanakca> RAOF: I just updated?
[02:39] <RAOF> ryanakca: So, no :)
[02:39] <allee> ryanakca: update you pbuild environment.  You package list refers to gettext 0.15.1..  but 0.16... is now in feisty
[02:40] <ryanakca> allee: reupdating... *twiddles*
[02:41] <ryanakca> allee: the only thing that isn't updated is this: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/36740/ 
[02:42] <bluefoxicy> ... o.o
[02:42] <bluefoxicy> wow, I got e-mail.
[02:43] <allee> ryanakca: well, that only lists pkgs that are already installed and out of date.  Important is that the pkg lists are updated, so next pbuild will try to install the lasted version of gettext  in the archive
[02:43] <ryanakca> ah, kk, thanks :)
[02:44] <allee> ryanakca: np
[02:44] <ryanakca> allee: while I'm at it, d'you know of a good example package for learning how to package something that uses cdbs + qmake-qt4?
[02:46] <allee> ryanakca: no I've not looked at qt4 or kde4 yet.  Maybe you should ask show to find all pkgs depending on qt4 and cdbs? (<- I don't know ;)
[02:47] <allee> s/depending/build-dep/
[02:48] <ryanakca> hmm...  apt-cache show <all packages> | grep qt4 | grep cdbs   ... except that would take forever, and I don't know how to show all packages...
[02:52] <ryanakca> apt-cache show `dpkg -l | awk command to display second collumn and join them` | grep qt4 | grep cdbs
[02:53] <bddebian> apt-cache rdepends qt4 might do you some good, though a depends doesn't necessarily == a build-depend
[02:54] <bddebian> You can use grepdctrl too but I can never remember the syntax
[02:54] <allee> ryanakca, bddebian: use apt-cache showsrc  <- 'we' are interested in build-deps not install depends
[02:55] <allee> bddebian: yeah, grep-dcrtl is a nightmare ;)
[02:56] <bluefoxicy> I have a question
[02:56] <bluefoxicy> I'm syncing with pax-utils-0.1.15 today
[02:56] <bluefoxicy> it's also in debian, maintained separately, by someone else.
[02:57] <bluefoxicy> my package uses cdbs; I don't know what theirs uses
[02:57] <bluefoxicy> do I have to release this as 0.1.15-0ubuntu1 or 0.1.15?
[02:57] <ryanakca> allee: bddebian: I think I should use: grep-dctrl -i qt4 -a cdbs
[02:58] <ryanakca> but what would be the filename?
[02:59] <allee> uhm, anyone can spot the error: I've digikam 0.9.0~rc1-1~ach0dapper2 installed.  I try to install showfoto 0.9.0~rc2-0ubuntu2~ach0edgy1 that has:  Replaces: digikam (<< 0.9.0~rc2~0).   Nevetheless dpkg -i fails because that showfoto has files also in digikam
[02:59] <ryanakca> what provides x includes? I'm searching threw the output of "apt-cache search x includes"... can't seem to find anything though
[03:00] <ryanakca> allee: is it because showfoto is trying to replace rc2, but only rc1 is installed?
[03:01] <allee> ryanakca: << rc2  should be true for rc1 too, right?
[03:01] <ryanakca> or wait, no, nevermind... no clue, sorry...
[03:01] <ryanakca> yeah
[03:01] <ryanakca> I just noticed :)
[03:03] <allee> nite, it's toooo late already
[03:04] <ryanakca> nite allee
[03:10] <bluefoxicy> yawn
[03:21] <joejaxx> Hello everyone
[03:21] <bddebian> Heya joejaxx
[03:22] <joejaxx> bddebian: hello
[03:22] <joejaxx> how are you today?
[03:23] <bddebian> OK thanks, you?
[03:23] <joejaxx> i am well
[03:24] <joejaxx> just looking over some of my projects
[03:26] <joejaxx> and planning some things
[03:26] <joejaxx> bddebian: i want to have a etch chroot :P
[03:26] <bddebian> Joy
[03:28] <joejaxx> lol
[03:28] <jdong> joejaxx: you don't need a hammer to break udev ;-)
[03:28] <ajmitch> not helpful
[03:28] <joejaxx> jdong: haha :P
[03:29] <jdong> how about break azureus
[03:29] <jdong> OH WAIT IT IS ALREADY BROKEN!
[03:29] <joejaxx> ajmitch: twofish?
[03:29] <joejaxx> jdong: haha!
[03:29] <jdong> and there still isn't a fix in edgy-proposed
[03:29] <jdong> ;-)
[03:29] <joejaxx> :P
[03:29] <jdong> I know we all hate java apps...
[03:30] <jdong> but I spent money on 4GB of RAM and Azureus can't use 3GB to download a 1-minute MP3 if it doesn't run....
[03:30] <joejaxx> jdong: not i :)
[03:30] <joejaxx> haha
[03:31] <Admiral_Chicago> imo, azureus isn't good at all
[03:31] <Admiral_Chicago> i hate java
[03:31] <joejaxx> do not*
[03:31] <joejaxx> :P
[03:31] <joejaxx> ajmitch: :)
[03:32] <joejaxx> Admiral_Chicago: you like python?
[03:32] <joejaxx> :(
[03:33] <jdong> sorry, I didn't mean to start a language war
[03:33] <Admiral_Chicago> joejaxx: i kinda do
[03:33] <joejaxx> Admiral_Chicago: oh ok
[03:33] <joejaxx> Admiral_Chicago: i have not coded in python
[03:33] <joejaxx> Admiral_Chicago: only c++ and java
[03:34] <Admiral_Chicago> joejaxx: java is slow and security blows
[03:34] <jdong> Admiral_Chicago: java is actually pretty fast once it starts running
[03:34] <Admiral_Chicago> all my viruses were in windows and 75% written in java
[03:34] <jdong> Admiral_Chicago: it's the initial JIT compile overhead
[03:34] <Admiral_Chicago> VB.net, java, beginning fortran
[03:34] <joejaxx> plugwash: c++!
[03:34] <joejaxx> :D
[03:34] <plugwash> must get arround to trying C++
[03:35] <joejaxx> anyone here ever learn pascal?
[03:35] <lupine_85> yep :)
[03:35] <joejaxx> lupine_85: :)
[03:35] <lupine_85> Object Pascal ftw!
[03:35] <plugwash> yes, the later borland variants are actually pretty nice
[03:35] <lupine_85> yeah
[03:35] <joejaxx> :D
[03:35] <lupine_85> there's a Free compiler for linux
[03:35] <lupine_85> www.freepascal.org
[03:35] <joejaxx> nice
[03:35] <plugwash> iso pascal by all accounts sucks
[03:36] <Admiral_Chicago> anyone know if Ktorrent uses XHTML or wahtever the engine is for Konquiu
[03:36] <lupine_85> and lazarus.freepascal.org if you miss delphi/kylix
[03:36] <jdong> Admiral_Chicago: KHTML
[03:36] <bddebian> Freepascal is in the archive isn't it?
[03:36] <jdong> Admiral_Chicago: it embeds a Konqueror
[03:36] <Admiral_Chicago> jdong: that's what i thought it did
[03:36] <lupine_85> !info fpc
[03:36] <plugwash> freepascals source is in the ubuntu archives, but no binaries
[03:36] <ubotu> Package fpc does not exist in any distro I know
[03:36] <lupine_85> fpc needs fpc to build, you see... :)
[03:36] <jdong> Admiral_Chicago: hey, it's an easy way to get a browsing component in a KDE app :D
[03:36] <plugwash> the buildd's can't build it because it is a self hosting compiler
[03:37] <lupine_85> since it's written in object pascal
[03:37] <bddebian> Hmm, I tried to build it once
[03:37] <jdong> Admiral_Chicago: their tracker communication uses kio/http too
[03:37] <jdong> Admiral_Chicago: in fact, it's almost completely built on the KDE stack
[03:37] <Admiral_Chicago> more importantly, i broke my candy cane :\
[03:37] <lupine_85> couldn't rules download the appropriate static compiler?
[03:37] <plugwash> lupine_85 technically sure it could, not sure if that would comply with ubuntu policy though
[03:37] <joejaxx> bddebian: i have officially installed debian :)
[03:38] <plugwash> you could also include the starting compiler in the source pacakge, again the only issue is policy
[03:38] <joejaxx> bddebian: well "installed"
[03:38] <lupine_85> idempotent builds and such? :)
[03:38] <plugwash> it seems like very few people can upload binaries to ubuntu
[03:38] <plugwash> freepascal already builds the compiler and main rtl 3 times as part of the standard build process
[03:39] <plugwash> and if the second and third compiler binaries don't match it is considered a failure
[03:39] <minghua> plugwash: ask in #ubuntu-devel (or the mailing list), maybe?
[03:40] <minghua> I don't see how to build a self-hosting compiler without some exception made
[03:40] <joejaxx> plugwash: just like gcc :)
[03:40] <lupine_85> and no fpc means no lazarus :(
[03:40] <lupine_85> that program is seriously cool
[03:41] <joejaxx> i should learn ada
[03:41] <lupine_85> still, you can just "alien" the official rpm s and it all "just works"
[03:41] <plugwash> if you wan't to try then sure go ahead, personally i've tried pushing before and largely failed
[03:42] <plugwash> the debian deps of freepascal should also install with no problems on ubuntu
[03:50] <rmjb> Hey guys
[03:50] <rmjb> and gals
[03:50] <rmjb> I got a build error email from launchpad about a pacakge I merged
[03:50] <joejaxx> nice there is an ada compiler
[03:51] <rmjb> from the log it looked like the build rules tried to remove apt and that cause a problem??
[03:51] <rmjb> can someone take a look at the log and correct me? it's not long
[03:52] <ajmitch> rmjb: ignore it, it's not your fault
[03:52] <plugwash> rmjb are you sure it was the build rules and not the build deps dependency resoloution?
[03:52] <rmjb> Building dependency tree...
[03:52] <rmjb> The following packages will be REMOVED:
[03:52] <rmjb>   apt* build-essential* g++* g++-4.1* libstdc++6* libstdc++6-4.1-dev*
[03:52] <plugwash> if it was the latter don't worry about it its a known issue with the feisty repositries
[03:53] <rmjb> I thought those packages would stay once debhelper is in the build deps
[03:53] <rmjb> but I guess something was going on today?
[03:58] <plugwash> the version of libstdc++ currently in the feisty repositries is uninstallable and it seems some even more core library is conflicting with older versions of libstdc++
[03:59] <plugwash> the result is a lot of stuff currently cannot be installed/upgraded without forcing some essential packages to be removed
[03:59] <plugwash> which apt will not do unless you proceed past a REALLY strong warning
[04:00] <bluefoxicy> hello?
[04:00] <rmjb> oh... so some manual tweaking of the build environments is needed in that case?
[04:01] <ajmitch> rmjb: yes, be patient & it will be fixed
[04:01] <jdong> bluefoxicy: Segmentation Fault. Signal 11 sent to pid 0: Attempted to raise rlimit_core 4096->0
[04:01] <jdong> ;-)
[04:01] <rmjb> no probs... just wanted to know if it was something I had to fix on my end
[04:01] <bluefoxicy> jdong:  rofl!  Did you ever get over to #pax this weekend?
[04:01] <rmjb> thanks for the info :)
[04:01] <bluefoxicy> also I need to know
[04:01] <plugwash> whats needed is waiting for the packages in question to be fixed, then the buildds should be able to be updated normally
[04:02] <bluefoxicy> do I need to label my package pax-utils-0.1.15-0ubuntu1 if there's a Debian pax-utils maintained separately?
[04:02] <rmjb> plugwash: and I guess the buildd admins will re-queue the failed builds
[04:03] <jdong> bluefoxicy: unfortunately no didn't get the chance
[04:03] <bluefoxicy> jdong:  nods
[04:03] <ajmitch> bluefoxicy: if you're adamant on maintaining a separate package, then yes
[04:03] <ajmitch> so the current feisty version is 0.1.13-0ubuntu1, not hard to change that to 0.1.15-0ubuntu1
[04:04] <bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  I have the just-released-5-minutes-ago version and don't feed debian because I'm not equipped to send them stuff
[04:04] <bluefoxicy> but yeah
[04:04] <bluefoxicy> I'll keep the versioning scheme then.
[04:04] <ajmitch> I see debian has a dfsg-free version
[04:04] <ajmitch> I wonder what licensing issues there were
[04:04] <bluefoxicy> dfsg-free?
[04:04] <ajmitch>  pax-utils | 0.1.13.dfsg.1-2 | http://apt-proxy sid/main Sources
[04:05] <ajmitch> the dfsg in the version indicates that the upstream tarball has been modified for licensing reasons
[04:05] <bluefoxicy> hmm.
[04:05] <bluefoxicy> oh
[04:05] <bluefoxicy> shit.
[04:05] <ajmitch>    * Remove original macho.h with Apple copyright but no license.
[04:05] <bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  I compared the versions, yes
[04:05] <bluefoxicy> the macho was removed in 0.1.15
[04:05] <ajmitch> oh good
[04:05] <bluefoxicy> I didn't know it was there before and uploaded it to edgy as-is, I should probably fix 0.1.13
[04:06] <ajmitch> interesting name for a header
[04:06] <bluefoxicy> not really.
[04:06] <bluefoxicy> MACH .o
[04:06] <ajmitch> I know the reason behind it
[04:06] <ajmitch> still an interesting name
[04:06] <rmjb> ajmitch: is this a debdiff? it looks off to me: http://librarian.launchpad.net/5186919/debdiff.diff
[04:07] <bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  this is why I don't maintain any other packages ;)
[04:07] <ajmitch> rmjb: it is, but a debdiff of 2 binary packages, not source packages
[04:07] <bluefoxicy> dpkg-buildpackage -s -S -rfakeroot
[04:07] <bluefoxicy> dammit tilda
[04:07] <rmjb> ah, okay I'll submit a correct source debdiff and subscribe universe sponsors
[04:08] <bluefoxicy> /usr/bin/fakeroot: 152: debian/rules: Permission denied
[04:09] <bluefoxicy> .......... needs to be executable
[04:11] <lupine_85> quick question... with version strings like <number>~<string>, if you have two packages where <number> is the same but <string> differs, how does apt-get determine which one to install? 
[04:11] <bluefoxicy> wtf do I dput again?
[04:11] <lupine_85> e.g. would 1.0~ann be overwritten by 1.0~bob ?
[04:16] <plugwash> i think past the tilde normal rules still apply
[04:16] <plugwash> but i'm not sure
[04:17] <lupine_85> all the sensible packages I've seen have <number>~<number><string>
[04:17] <lupine_85> which is sensible :)
[04:18] <plugwash> imo the best docs for this kind of thing is probablly the source
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  that's freaking weird.
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> I deleted macho.h and deleted #include <macho.h> from paxinc.h
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> then built a source package to look for what to fix
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> ....... it worked.  Binaries work.
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> wtf?
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> you can't just rip out headers and expect the program not to puke
[04:19] <plugwash> probablly only used on some platforms
[04:20] <plugwash> or no longer used but not actually ripped out
[04:20] <lupine_85> eh, I'll build and try to install and see what happens :)
[04:22] <bluefoxicy> well.  Uploading.  *shrug*
[04:22] <rmjb> Sp4rKy: are you here?
[04:29] <RAOF> lupine_85: You can use "dpkg --compare-versions" to check :)
[04:30] <RAOF> dpkg --compare-versions 1.0~ann lt 1.0~bob && echo "true"
[04:31] <RAOF> Returns true, so it seems lexographical is the way it works
[04:32] <lupine_85> cool :)
[04:33] <lupine_85> every time I think linux is missing something, it's really just that I don't know how to use my tools... :D
[04:33] <RAOF> Pretty much, yeah :)
[04:34] <jdong> RAOF: it is lexographical
[04:35] <rmjb> well that's for me for tonight
[04:35] <rmjb> see y'all
[06:38] <Laser_away> I don't suppose it would be considered a bad form to file a bug for something I want to fix in a SRU
[06:43] <Hobbsee> Laser_away: not if it needs fixing
[06:43] <Hobbsee> crimsun_: ping?
[06:43] <imbrandon> Laser_away: i would think it would be ok ( unless its just a wishlist feature or something )
[06:44] <imbrandon> but if its truely a bug
[06:44] <imbrandon> :)
[06:44] <Hobbsee> crimsun_: i've changed the mailing address to u-u-s, and fought LP.  i think you'd be able to subscribe to all bugs if you want.  or i could point the buglist at your email.  However, lots of fighting LP is involved in doing that.
[06:44] <Laser_away> imbrandon: it is, it's in Main but it's missing deps that supposedly make the package broken
[06:45] <imbrandon> ahh , yea
[06:46] <Laser_away> part of the problem I'm already doing an SRU for
[06:46] <brainsik> Laser_away: sounds good to me :-)
[06:46] <Laser_away> but I noticed that there was also another Debian bug that was easy to fix
[06:47] <Laser_away> brainsik: wahoo! just the man I was looking for
[06:47] <LaserJock> brainsik: I'm working on python-imaging
[06:47] <LaserJock> but I can't figure out how to reproduce it
[06:47] <brainsik> LaserJock: cool
[06:47] <brainsik> LaserJock: what do you mean?
[06:47] <LaserJock> well, I tried import sane and that loaded fine
[06:48] <LaserJock> I need to know how to break it :-)
[06:48] <brainsik> LaserJock: okay, the way it happened for me was that libjpeg62 wasn't installed
[06:49] <brainsik> if you are on a graphical system, that's pretty much not an option
[06:49] <brainsik> but i'm doing this on a barebone web server
[06:49] <LaserJock> brainsik: well what I need is a "this is how you break it" to show both that it's broken and that I can fix it
[06:50] <brainsik> 1) dpkg -r libjpeg62
[06:51] <jikanter> I am trying to verify my key for launchpad, and mutt seems to be unable to find my data.  Does anyone think they could send me their .muttrc?
[06:51] <brainsik> 2) load up python, then try and import the module
[06:52] <brainsik> LaserJock: let me get you a more concrete example
[06:54] <LaserJock> brainsik: ok, well I'm not sure how critical this is then because there are lots of apps that bring in libjpeg62
[06:54] <brainsik> LaserJock: well it broke my web app server
[06:54] <LaserJock> true, that's not nice
[06:55] <LaserJock> but for non-server installs it should be fine
[06:55] <LaserJock> I can run it by mdz and see if he thinks it's worthy of an SRU
[06:56] <LaserJock> same for psycopg
[07:02] <LaserJock> brainsik: ok, I'm off for tonight, I'll see what I can do tomorrow
[07:02] <brainsik> LaserJock: okay, i am generating an example, where should I send it
[07:03] <LaserJock> attach it to the bug report
[07:03] <brainsik> okay
[07:03] <brainsik> goodnight
[07:03] <LaserJock> also please explain that it affects server installs and broke you're webapp
[07:03] <LaserJock> I just need to "sell" it to the higher ups ;-)
[07:32] <jikanter> why would interdiff fail between two archives?
[08:24] <Fujitsu> m/win 5
[08:25] <lastnode> Burgundavia, ping
[08:30] <Burgundavia> lastnode: pong
[08:37] <lastnode> Burgundavia, pm?
[08:38] <Burgundavia> shoot
[09:21] <imbrandon> mmm sleep
[09:21] <imbrandon> gnight all
[09:52] <dholbach> good morning
[09:54] <somerville32> ...
[09:54] <somerville32> *hug
[09:54] <dholbach> ahhhh... better :-)
[09:54] <dholbach> how's it going?
[09:54] <somerville32> Pretty good. Just pulling another all nighter.
[09:56] <dholbach> hey proppy
[09:57] <proppy> hoy dholbach
[09:57] <proppy> receiving my macbook today
[09:57] <proppy> can't wait longer !
[09:58] <dholbach> hehe
[10:03] <elkbuntu> i want a mac... unfortunately i have neither the monies or the space
[10:05] <Lathiat> proppy: i hate waiting for thigns like that ;)
[10:08] <proppy> Lathiat: yep, waiting since 06/12
[10:08] <proppy> Lathiat: and according to the tracking page
[10:09] <proppy> Lathiat: 'Estimated Delivery Date	12 Dec 2006 (Subject to change)'
[10:09] <proppy> Lathiat: yesterday :(
[10:11] <Lathiat> heh
[10:11] <proppy> and i'm pretty sure yesterday it was ETA:  15/12
[10:23] <allee_> Can anyone check why my digikam_0.9.0~rc2-0ubuntu3 revu upload (1st after loooog time) does not show up on revu (after 8 hours)? 
[10:30] <Sp4rKy> hi there
[11:14] <stefg> Hi, anyone has info if there are backports of openoffice.org 2.1 and vlc 0.8.6 to dapper available somewhere? 
[12:15] <\sh> moins
[12:16] <\sh> guys, ubuntu-universe-sponsors team...I just got an mail from approved to deactivated
[12:16] <\sh> I didn't know that I was member of this team
[12:16] <azeem> I think every motu got put on that team when it was created
[12:17] <Fujitsu> ubuntu-dev got added a couple of days back, AFAIK.
[12:17] <proppy>  feisty sparc   Successfully built \o/ yeepee
[12:18] <Fujitsu> Indeed:
[12:18] <Fujitsu> Ubuntu Development Team   2006-12-12  Deactivated
[12:18] <dholbach> ubuntu-dev was a member
[12:18] <dholbach> it was fixed, so not everybody gets a mail about every universe sponsor request
[12:21] <StevenK> Yay, gcc-4.1 was fixed.
[12:22] <StevenK> That looked like fun. Chroot problem -> Failed to build (due to an apt problem) -> Sucessfully built
[12:35] <StevenK> Hrm. 
[12:35] <StevenK> Yay, gnome-session is hanging on poll().
[12:47] <StevenK> And yet, it still poll()'s. 
[01:21] <\sh> hmm...why is wine mentoined in the ubuntu weekly news...*mewonders*
[01:23] <Admiral_Chicago> i suppose some people find wine to be critical to their system running
[01:25] <\sh> well, 0.9.27 is on it's way ;)
[01:26] <Admiral_Chicago> i saw the UWN, i even did some feedback on it to -marketing
[01:27] <\sh> I don't read -marketing...do you have a web pointer to it?
[01:29] <sistpoty|uni> hi folks
[01:30] <Admiral_Chicago> \sh: it was in #ubuntu-marketing, just to clarify the point
[01:30] <Admiral_Chicago> err a point about the Kurdish LoCo
[01:32] <geser> doko: I overlooked your sync request for wireshark and did a merge. should i close the sync request?
[01:55] <Zic_> hi here, hi sistpoty|uni, I have uploaded the new menareants with your indications, except for the menareants-data, beacause the binary is very small ... It's wright, or a menareants-data is best ?
[01:55] <Zic_> I'm trying to pbuild my package in feisty (my last bug with feisty was fixed :))
[01:57] <sistpoty|uni> Zic_: sorry cannot check atm, I am at university right now
[01:57] <sistpoty|uni> Zic_: you should make a data package nonetheless, as it reduces space usage on the mirrors:
[01:58] <sistpoty|uni> Zic_: the difference is, that an arch:all package will need to be stored only once, where as an arch:any package needs to be stored for every architecture the package is being built on
[01:58] <Zic_> sistpoty|uni: ok, sorry :) I make the menareants-data so :)
[01:58] <sistpoty|uni> :)
[01:59] <Zic_> hmm, I don't know it, I understand now :)
[02:00] <Zic_> siretart: last, I don't see the difference between the arch:all and arch:any, thanks :)
[02:00] <Zic_> and good work to your university :>
[02:00] <sistpoty|uni> Zic_: thanks to you
[02:01] <sistpoty|uni> Zic_: btw.: is menarents only french? I wanted to test it yesterday, but I don't speak any french and was totally lost g
[02:03] <Zic_> hmm, MenAreAnts is only french for the moment I think :( But the programmer can translate it for a multi-language I think, beacause he maintains many multi-lang project :)
[02:04] <Zic_> For the button, it's simple, but I understand you for the next part of game :>
[02:04] <sistpoty|uni> exactly :)... a translation would really be uber-cool :)
[02:05] <Zic_> I'm french, so their is no problem huhu :) I have told the programmer for the translation :>
[02:06] <sistpoty|uni> cool... /me looks forward to play games... erm test packages for ubuntu of course g
[02:06] <Zic_> :)
[02:08] <Zic_> You cand find a manual here http://coderz.info/wiki/index.php?title=Men_Are_Ants:Manuel, but it's in french, You can translate it :) But it's know, automatic translation is very poor :>
[02:09] <Zic_> Screenshots are avaible too :)
[03:00] <pirast> hi, could anyone apply the debdiff in bug 75520 to the archive? thanks
[03:00] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 75520 in klogic "KLogic does not create a menu entry" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/75520
[03:03] <crimsun_> bug 75520
[03:04] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 75520 in klogic "KLogic does not create a menu entry" [Wishlist,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/75520
[03:11] <pirast> crimsun_, thx
[04:03] <msk> ping
[04:04] <sistpoty|uni> msk: Usage: ping <nick> <reason> :P
[04:04] <bddebian> Heya gang
[04:04] <sistpoty|uni> hi bddebian 
[04:04] <bddebian> Hi sistpoty|uni
[04:14] <Chandu> hi 
[04:14] <Chandu> which package is responsible for automatic  software upgrades in ubuntu
[04:16] <sistpoty|uni> Chandu: iirc it's update-manager
[04:16] <Chandu> sistpoty|uni, iirc is the package name 
[04:18] <sistpoty|uni> Chandu: no, iirc=if I remember correctly... the package name should be update-manger
[04:19] <Chandu> sistpoty|uni, ok ..fine ..thank you
[04:19] <sistpoty|uni> np
[04:40] <\sh> hmmm...I need to train some time for lpic-1 and eventually for lpic-2
[04:42] <sistpoty|uni> hey \sh, how are you doing?
[04:42] <\sh> fine :) and busy :)
[04:43] <allee> \sh: aah, that's why you answered yet ;)
[04:43] <allee> + have not
[04:44] <\sh> allee: I have to change something on the fai 3.1 packages...the fai chroot kernels are not backported for dapper...and I need to change it to the real fai kernels in dapper
[04:46] <allee> \sh: okay.  I'll ping you in case I find time tonight or tomorrow to try backporting for fai-kernel
[04:47] <\sh> allee: no kernel backporting...we need to change the kernel name in the fai 3.1 packages for dapper... and I surely want it in a "canonical" way...because many people are using self made install kernels
[04:47] <\sh> install kernels as in "fai chroot kernels"
[04:49] <allee> \sh: sorry I mean  not backporting the kernel but fai-kernel, i.e. trying fai-kernel config with whatever in in dapper security repo  (at least that was what I did with merging 2.10.5 to dapper)
[04:50] <allee> \sh so you have fai-kernel pkgs?  Only fai  control and simple config needs to be adapted?
[04:55] <\sh> allee: nope...I'm using a self made kernel...just because of some drivers we need for our raid controllers
[04:59] <chillywilly> why isn't there a better squid packages in edgy?
[04:59] <chillywilly> packaged*
[04:59] <chillywilly> squid3 is in debian
[05:06] <zul> interesting mysql has dropped support for debian
[05:24] <Czessi> Hi, any MOTU has time to review a package?
[05:24] <Adri2000> Czessi: it's a new package$?
[05:24] <Adri2000> -$
[05:25] <chillywilly> anyone have an idea why squid qould stop logging afte upgrading to edgy?
[05:25] <chillywilly> would*
[05:25] <Czessi> Adri2000: New for universe, in revu it has some reviews
[05:27] <Czessi> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3760
[05:33] <Adri2000> Czessi: your package seems fine but I can't do anything, I'm not a motu :)
[05:34] <Czessi> Adri2000: Thanks, I'll try it later
[06:59] <lfittl> anybody willing to review raopplay (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=3764)?
[07:00] <dothebart> hy.
[07:01] <dothebart> afaik ubuntu flushes /var/run on reboot, right?
[07:01] <lfittl> yep
[07:01] <dothebart> how is one supposed to have subdirs? with init scripts?
[07:02] <lfittl> you mean subdirs in /var/run? they would be created by the init scripts, yes
[07:02] <geser> yes, init scripts should recreate dirs in /var/{lock,run}/
[07:02] <dothebart> tnx.
[07:44] <palski> There are three +1 for sru #73780, what happens next? It is assigned to me, but I'm not able to upload or anything
[07:45] <LaserJock> palski: did you have a MOTU sponsor the SRU?
[07:46] <palski> No, actually I'm not sure what do you mean by that but I guess, no
[07:47] <LaserJock> I thought a MOTU was supposed to sponor an sru from a non-MOTU
[07:47] <palski> hmmm, three motus have acked the SRU
[07:48] <LaserJock> well, I think you need 2 acks from the SRU team
[07:48] <LaserJock> let me go check
[07:49] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: you need 3 acks from sru, and these are present.
[07:49] <sistpoty|uni> palski: you should get the package uploaded to -proposed and subscribe ubuntu-archive then (to let the package in)
[07:49] <LaserJock> sistpoty|uni: right, but palski can't upload
[07:50] <palski> only motus are able to do that?
[07:50] <sistpoty|uni> palski: yep
[07:50] <LaserJock> sistpoty|uni: I'm a little concerned because the current SRU is not really what we agreed upon
[07:51] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: in what way?
[07:52] <LaserJock> sistpoty|uni: we said that it was uploaded to -proposed first, then acked by motu-sru
[07:52] <LaserJock> and we said that a MOTU had to ack non-MOTU sru requests
[07:53] <LaserJock> because they have to upload for them anyway
[07:53] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: a motu still needs to do the uploading and thus give an ack
[07:53] <LaserJock> sistpoty|uni: but that's a bit silly to me if it's already gotten 3 acks from motu-sru
[07:53] <LaserJock> either the last ack from motu-sru should upload
[07:54] <LaserJock> or the MOTU ack should come before motu-sru to weed out "bad" ones
[07:54] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: that would of course be preferable
[07:55] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: we (motu-sru) usually don't testbuild packages, but rather look at the diffs
[07:56] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: so it should be the duty of every sponsor to see if the package he/she uploads is in buildable state (and if it works as promised)
[07:56] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: that's then an implied ack ;)
[07:57] <LaserJock> sistpoty|uni: then I think that should come before the motu-sru team
[07:58] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: and for the time, when motu-sru gives the ack, we agreed upon before the upload to -proposed (in private discussion between sru-team), since that's the logical place to sort out errors
[07:58] <LaserJock> but that wasn't what was discussed before
[07:58] <LaserJock> so I'm a little confused about how the SRU process was developed
[07:59] <LaserJock> anyway, it's up to you guys I guess, but you might want to sort of clear up what happens for non-MOTUs
[07:59] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: I guess there was some confusion caused due to the fact that we had proposals, one being https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/SRU
[07:59] <sistpoty|uni> (which I favored(
[08:00] <LaserJock> i.e. I would assume most MOTUs would think that if the sru team had approved it then it was ready to just upload
[08:00] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: eeks, that impression really shouldn't happen
[08:00] <ajmitch> morning 
[08:00] <sistpoty|uni> hi ajmitch
[08:00] <LaserJock> sistpoty|uni: yeah, that's an issue imbrandon, ajmitch, Fujitsu, lifeless, and I spent at least an hour hammering out a process
[08:00] <LaserJock> and then it just got dropped or something
[08:01] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: I thought actually it was the one at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/SRU, wasn't it?
[08:01] <ajmitch> well, the process was hammered out & then went to the list for further tuning
[08:01] <LaserJock> sistpoty|uni: yes, look at the Comments section
[08:01] <ajmitch> did the SRU page not get cleaned up for the final process?
[08:01] <LaserJock> I don't know
[08:01] <imbrandon> moins all
[08:02] <LaserJock> but it it's sort of an inbetween
[08:02] <sistpoty|uni> hi imbrandon 
[08:02] <imbrandon> heya sistpoty|uni 
[08:02] <LaserJock> the main part of MOTU/SRU says nothing for non-MOTUs
[08:03] <ajmitch> my fault :)
[08:03] <LaserJock> it just says "Once you have uploaded the package, subscribe the ubuntu-archive team ..."
[08:03] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock, ajmitch actually I only saw the why/when/how section was already in place (but still a proposal)... 
[08:03] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock, ajmitch: I personally added only some cosmetics (e.g. need 3 acks)
[08:04] <imbrandon> still a proposal? i thought dholbach put some holy penguin pee on it ? man this is silly how nothing seems to ever be "finished" after weeks of talking and such
[08:05] <ajmitch> imbrandon: it was agreed on
[08:05] <LaserJock> well, I'm not really complaining (I think MOTU-ack before SRU will give SRU better diffs to look at, but that's up to them) but I still think we need to explicetly address non-MOTUs
[08:05] <dholbach> imbrandon: where did you get the idea I had anything holy on me?
[08:05] <imbrandon> hehe
[08:05] <sistpoty|uni> imbrandon: no. actually I put my holy pee on it :P... it was still listed as "a proposal" when I first saw it
[08:06] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: do you think we'd need to make the non-motu part more clear?
[08:06] <LaserJock> yes I do
[08:06] <imbrandon> i'm not really complaining either but we realy need to get that council going so we can at VERY LEASTE get some clear guidelines on things
[08:07] <imbrandon> :)
[08:07] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: I don't object. could you add it kindbeg
[08:07] <LaserJock> yep
[08:08] <imbrandon> woot looks link dns propigated , i can put those scripts on crons now
[08:08] <ajmitch> strange, linode don't setup ubuntu with an admin group, or a 2.6 kernel
[08:08] <sistpoty|uni> well, sorry if I stepped on someones foot with the sru-thingy... I guess I wrote 3 or 4 times to the ml asking about that very process until I considered that I should create facts
[08:08] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: thanks
[08:08] <imbrandon> ajmitch: what was that other script you asked about too in the comments, was it in irc or on the comments of my blog
[08:08] <ajmitch> imbrandon: no idea
[08:08] <ajmitch> it was more than 10 minutes ago, so I've forgotten
[08:09] <imbrandon> hehe
[08:09] <imbrandon> still need some hosting ?
[08:10] <ajmitch> well it's for some zope/plone projects
[08:10] <LaserJock> sistpoty|uni: nah, not toes stepped on, we just had too many proposals flying about
[08:10] <ajmitch> current provider is shutting down any day now, friend in melbourne registered a linode setup
[08:11] <imbrandon> ajmitch: ahh ok well if there is anything i can do lemme know
[08:11] <imbrandon> i probable could add the libs etc to the ubuntu box
[08:11] <imbrandon> if needed
[08:12] <imbrandon> sistpoty|uni: hehe yea what LaserJock said, no toes broken, i was / am just suprised it hasent been "finished" as of yet i guess :)
[08:12] <LaserJock> sistpoty|uni: and you made the change suggested by sfflaw?
[08:12] <ajmitch> imbrandon: yeah, it's just for a project I'm a part of, not just a personal project :)
[08:12] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: the tag, yes
[08:13] <LaserJock> I'm going to clear out the Comments section then
[08:13] <LaserJock> they always make a policy look half-baked :-)
[08:14] <imbrandon> :)
[08:15] <sistpoty|uni> LaserJock: great, thx :)
[08:15] <imbrandon> ugh the feed changed urls when i moved server
[08:15] <imbrandon> hrm
[08:15] <imbrandon> wonder why
[08:16] <sistpoty|uni> oh, so late already... damn I'm missing stargate atlantis :(
[08:17] <sistpoty|uni> cya later
[08:21] <zul>  hey ajmitch 
[08:21] <LaserJock> imbrandon, ajmitch : check out 3. on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/SRU
[08:23] <LaserJock> ajmitch: does it make sense for a non-DD to do a NMU? I guess it might
[08:28] <imbrandon> LaserJock: #3 looks ok
[08:28] <imbrandon> to me
[08:29] <imbrandon> and yea me as a non-DD have done nmu's
[08:29] <imbrandon> :)
[08:29] <LaserJock> hmm
[08:29] <LaserJock> somebody filed a NMU bug in a package I maintain in Debian
[08:29] <LaserJock> kinda odd, but whatever
[08:30] <imbrandon> i would personaly stop uploading if the process became as hard as debian
[08:30] <imbrandon> imho
[08:31] <LaserJock> well, I just thought it was odd
[08:31] <LaserJock> I took over the ITP after the guy tried for a year to get it in
[08:31] <imbrandon> brb gonna grab some food and shower , back in ~45 minutes
[08:31] <imbrandon> hehe yea
[08:31] <LaserJock> and then as soon as a new upstream version comes out files a NMU bug
[08:31] <imbrandon> i took over an itp like that
[08:32] <imbrandon> infact i need to check on that
[08:32] <ajmitch> LaserJock: he did an NMU for a new upstream version?
[08:32] <LaserJock> well, he didn't actually do it as he's not a DD
[08:32] <LaserJock> but he filed an NMU bug
[08:32] <LaserJock> yes
[08:33] <LaserJock> I've just been waiting until after etch is released
[08:33] <imbrandon> 2009?
[08:33] <imbrandon> lol j/k
[08:34] <allee> NMU for non-DD is okay, but a new version is a wishlist (of course a wishlist can contain a patch ;)
[08:35] <LaserJock> imbrandon: "when it's ready"
[08:35] <zul> yeah 2010 a debian odeyse
[08:36] <LaserJock> stink, he changed a bunch of my packaging too
[08:36] <LaserJock> and added in 4 new patches
[08:37] <imbrandon> wow thats not a nmu thats a hijack
[08:37] <LaserJock> seems so
[08:37] <ajmitch> LaserJock: if you need something sponsored...
[08:37] <LaserJock> debian bug #402893
[08:37] <Ubug2> Debian bug 402893 in gausssum "gausssum: NMU (2.0.1-0.1)" [Normal,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/402893
[08:38] <ajmitch> you can just get a new version uploaded
[08:38] <LaserJock> ajmitch: no, azeem is my sponsor, I was just waiting until the general "slush" was over in Debian before I did a new upstream release
[08:39] <azeem> oh, Li Daobing
[08:39] <azeem> he's been interested in that chemistry stuff for years
[08:39] <LaserJock> yeah, he sent me and upstream his "NMU" then filed a bug
[08:39] <ajmitch> hi azeem 
[08:39] <azeem> LaserJock: I think the most productive thing would be to add him to debichem group-maint post-etch
[08:40] <azeem> hi Andrew!
[08:40] <azeem> LaserJock: who signed the upload?
[08:40] <LaserJock> it's not uploaded
[08:40] <LaserJock> he just filed a bug
[08:40] <azeem> ah, misunderstood
[08:40] <LaserJock> yeah, it was a bit confusing to me too
[08:40] <azeem> oh, he works for Google now
[08:41] <LaserJock> he didn't file it as a normal wishlist "New upstream release" bug
[08:41] <azeem> or what is pkg-newedit.googlecode.com
[08:41] <LaserJock> azeem: you think, I just wondered if he was using them for a svn repo
[08:41] <azeem> LaserJock: or maybe that, I dunno
[08:42] <azeem> LaserJock: well, I'd respond saying that etch is frozen and that we should all collaborate on this and the other chemistry stuff post-etch, dunno
[08:42] <jdong> speaking of where is that edgy-proposed Azureus upload....
[08:43] <jdong> while true; do ping Fujitsu "Please upload Azureus to edgy-proposed"; sleep 5; done
[08:43] <LaserJock> azeem: is bodr still not in Debian?
[08:44] <azeem> ugh
[08:44] <azeem> maybe not :-/
[08:44] <LaserJock> I just wondered
[08:44] <azeem> I didn't see the NEW purge coming in November, or else I would've worked harder on some more NEW packages
[08:46] <azeem> gotta run, laters
[09:05] <LaserJock> hmm, is alioth down?
[09:13] <poningru> anyone know whats going on with the xgl stuff
[09:13] <jdong> poningru: investigating at the moment
[09:14] <jdong> some sort of nvidia-glx breakage happened with the recent kernel update
[09:14] <jdong> still trying to figure out if it's a ubuntu problem
[09:14] <jdong> or a user problem
[09:14] <poningru> hmm
[09:14] <jdong> but even people installing nvidia drivers by binaries and disabling nvidia-glx + lrm nvidia.ko are bitten
[09:14] <jdong> and that's how I would expect to do a safe binary nvidia install
[09:14] <jdong> I'm currently talking to three people experiencing the issue trying to figure out what's wrong
[09:15] <jdong> so far it seems like the kernel module actually loads
[09:16] <zorglu_> just to undertstand "waht is going on with xgl ?" = "currently broken" ?
[09:17] <zorglu_> i ask because i got many people having 'weird trouble' with opengl on helping channels
[09:18] <jdong> zorglu_: it appears like today's kernel update caused nvidia 3d drivers to fail for many
[09:18] <jdong> poningru: are you experiencing this?
[09:18] <jdong> I need people to provide me with some debugging info
[09:18] <jdong> how is their nvidia driver installed
[09:18] <jdong> what version
[09:18] <jdong> what error(s)
[09:19] <zorglu_> jdong: what should i tell them ? wait a bit and update later ? any known work around ?
[09:19] <LaserJock> is this in Edgy?
[09:20] <jdong> LaserJock: yes
[09:20] <jdong> zorglu_: where are people having this problem
[09:20] <jdong> zorglu_: can you put me in contact with a few?
[09:21] <jdong> zorglu_: as of now I still can't identify why people are experiencing this
[09:21] <zorglu_> jdong: just now, i got one guy on #kubuntu scipper, having trouble, not sure it is related, he is having ati
[09:21] <zorglu_> jdong: i got 2 others before
[09:22] <jdong> ATI having trouble?
[09:22] <jdong> hold on, let me reboot
[09:22] <zorglu_> jdong: the guy has trouble, not sure it is related. it may be a beginner trying to install for the first time
[09:25] <zorglu_> after investigation, the ati trouble was just a first timer. if i got one with nvidia issue from today, i will link you, jdong
[09:25] <dholbach> night fellas
[09:25] <ajmitch> night daniel
[09:25] <jdong> can't reproduce fglrx having issues
[09:26] <jdong> xgl+beryl still functional
[09:26] <dholbach> night andrew
[09:26] <jdong> what channel was the guy having trouble in?
[09:26] <zorglu_> it is on #kubuntu, but it was a first timer
[09:26] <zorglu_> after investigation, the ati trouble was just a first timer. if i got one with nvidia issue from today, i will link you, jdong <- seen this one ?
[09:27] <jdong> ok
[09:27] <jdong> thanks man
[09:27] <zorglu_> np
[09:47] <ajmitch> since by the time people finish discussing it, friday will be gone :)
[09:47] <phanatic> good evening
[09:47] <ajmitch> hi
[09:47] <phanatic> hey ajmitch 
[09:47] <LaserJock> ajmitch: that is one way of settling it
[09:48] <ajmitch> LaserJock: then I'll probably end up missing it
[09:48] <LaserJock> I was going to say maybe we need to just do it twice
[09:49] <zorglu_> jdong: i got yuma on #kubuntu which had a working 915gm working yesterday, failling today, but he say he has not updated in between
[09:49] <jdong> zorglu_:  915gm failing?
[09:49] <jdong> that's really strange
[09:50] <jdong> what kind of errros
[09:50] <zorglu_> jdong: yep, unsure it is related, but the 'was working yesterday, failed today' seems close
[09:50] <jdong> hmm
[09:50] <zorglu_> dunno the error it said 'it was broken for good' :)
[09:50] <brainsik> Would it be considered a bug if a package required removing ubuntu-minimal due to conflicting with one of ubuntu-minimal's dependencies?
[09:52] <imbrandon> ajmitch: my thoughts exactly
[09:52] <LaserJock> brainsik: I wouldn't think so if it was an accurate confilct
[09:53] <brainsik> LaserJock: hmm. okay. it seems like you should never cause ubuntu-minimal to be removed since it's considered a requirement for upgrading between releases.
[09:53] <LaserJock> yep, but that's what happens when you have confilcts
[09:53] <imbrandon> brainsik: so is *-desktop 
[09:53] <imbrandon> but thats dosent change it if its a legit conflict
[09:53] <brainsik> imbrandon: i assume that's not true for servers
[09:54] <imbrandon> the only tiome that becomes a problem is if you want it in a default install
[09:54] <brainsik> okay, i'm just wary of giving the user ways to break their upgrade paths.
[09:54] <imbrandon> brainsik: true, but you dident say servers, if you are going by whats required by an upgrade success *-desktop is :)
[09:55] <imbrandon> brainsik: lets take away dpkg then :) ( just teasin )
[09:55] <LaserJock> brainsik: btw, got ok on moving forward on SRUs
[09:55] <imbrandon> i see your point, and probably should be looked at to see if it can be done a diffrent way, but as far as a "bug" i dont think it qualifies
[09:55] <brainsik> imbrandon: i meant, specifically by installing a package
[09:56] <brainsik> LaserJock: yay!
[09:56] <imbrandon> :)
[09:56] <LaserJock> perhaps tasks can handle that sort of situation better
[09:56] <LaserJock> but with metapackages a dep is a dep and a conflict is a conflict
[09:57] <brainsik> imbrandon: part of this questioning is that i used debian from slink - sarge without ever having a problem upgrading between releases. but the dapper -> edgy upgrade was a nightmare for many.
[09:57] <LaserJock> if you want to install a conflicing package you have to get rid of the other and all the packages that dep on it
[09:58] <imbrandon> brainsik: sure, but given all the alternatives for default programs out there that can remove a metapackage it would be insane to call that a bug
[09:58] <imbrandon> i see ytour point and agree somewhat but i still dont think its a "bug"
[09:58] <LaserJock> it's not a "bug" it's a "feature" :-)
[09:58] <imbrandon> lol
[09:59] <brainsik> imbrandon: hmm. i see your point as well. but ubuntu-minimal is not just any package.
[09:59] <LaserJock> well, the idea behind them is to have a standard set of packages
[09:59] <brainsik> why is there a need for ubuntu-minimal? there isn't a debian-minimal.
[09:59] <imbrandon> i mean removeing oo.o and putting koffice in its place breaks upgrades from dapper->edgy but still not a bug, just means we need to work on the upgrade process not "fix" koffice :)
[10:00] <LaserJock> if you install a conflicting package you are breaking the standard set of packages
[10:00] <LaserJock> this is one area where Ubuntu and Debian differ
[10:00] <imbrandon> right, there isnt a "standard set of supported packages" in debian past debootstrap, in ubuntu there is
[10:01] <imbrandon> and ubuntu-* meta packages define the levels of those
[10:01] <imbrandon> be it minimal , desktop , whatever
[10:01] <LaserJock> one of Ubuntu's strategies is to focus on a set of apps rather then the whole lot, that's why we have Main and Universe
[10:01] <brainsik> interesting. it seems, as it is, that structure makes things more brittle.
[10:01] <LaserJock> it can at times
[10:02] <imbrandon> brainsik: it can be, but makes the things that are supported more solid imho
[10:02] <brainsik> imbrandon: i see that too.
[10:02] <imbrandon> also if this package was in main it would be a bug
[10:02] <imbrandon> but being in an unsupported not on by default repo
[10:03] <imbrandon> its diffrent
[10:03] <brainsik> interesting. thanks for your comments, i'm still trying to get a hang of how debian and ubuntu are different and how to manage my expectations since i'm coming from debian.
[10:03] <imbrandon> :)
[10:03] <imbrandon> brainsik: dont worry i came from suse ( long before this novel vs ms feasico ) and had TONS of questions not even knowing debian at first :)
[10:04] <gnomefreak> is there an easy way to apply a patch without having to rebuild package?
[10:04] <brainsik> imbrandon: :) in some ways it may be easier to do the bigger jump. then you don't keep thinking you know how it all works already. :)
[10:04] <jdong> gnomefreak: ha! openoffice devs would pay millions for that!
[10:05] <gnomefreak> lol
[10:05] <gnomefreak> so the patches devs leave on bugs are for record only before they apply it?
[10:05] <jdong> right
[10:05] <Fujitsu> Or for people to apply before they're uploaded.
[10:05] <jdong> the patches are for us  to apply and test
[10:06] <gnomefreak> ah ok
[10:06] <Fujitsu> Which is generally a good thing, because there was a > two month gap between me isolating the patch for #43150 and it being uploaded to dapper-updates.
[10:07] <imbrandon> well brainsik i might be out of line saying this a tad, but coming from the "outside" i only see the similarities in debian/ubuntu on a purely tecnical package level, everything else especialy processes are very diffrent
[10:07] <imbrandon> imho
[10:08] <brainsik> imbrandon: thanks, i'll definitely keep that in mind. for sure, the community process is quite different.
[10:09] <Fujitsu> I am revolted.
[10:10] <jdong> Fujitsu: speaking of azureus to edgy-proposed?
[10:10] <jdong> ;-)
[10:10] <Fujitsu> Hahah, yes, I should probably do that.
[10:10] <jdong> thanks man
[10:11] <Fujitsu> Had work and other stuff lately, unfortunately.
[10:11] <imbrandon> Fujitsu: i must be missing something
[10:12] <imbrandon> i dont see anything "bad" he is saying
[10:12] <Fujitsu> The whole Beryl-by-default still being alive.
[10:12] <Fujitsu> That is saddening.
[10:12] <jdong> imbrandon: he's saying that beryl will be default
[10:12] <jdong> apparently some people are really averse to that
[10:13] <crimsun_> If it must be, then please, compiz really. For the love of small ponies. Really.
[10:13] <imbrandon> i doubt beryl will make default from what i've seen , if ANYTHING it will be compiz at this point 
[10:13] <Fujitsu> I agree with crimsun_.
[10:13] <Fujitsu> Although I'd prefer it to all be optional, default off.
[10:13] <imbrandon> crimsun_: right right, do it for the ponies
[10:13] <LaserJock> as long as I can easily turn it off and we don't get flooded with bug reports (yeah, right) I'm ok with it I think
[10:13] <crimsun_> embrace the imminent bug flood.
[10:14] <crimsun_> compiz is, barring the issues that corey has raised, surprisingly "usable."
[10:14] <jdong> well, spontaneous segfaults on exit was the theme for edgy, why not startup for feisty?
[10:14] <jdong> ;-)
[10:14] <imbrandon> well i really dont know what the fuss is , beryl cant even make it into the repos atm :)
[10:15] <LaserJock> but compiz is in
[10:15] <imbrandon> yes
[10:15] <Fujitsu> er? I saw beryl-settings there yesterday.
[10:15] <jdong> is there a freenode /dev/null equivalent?
[10:15] <imbrandon> Fujitsu: unless someone packaged 0.1.3 other than me and uploaded ( very possible )
[10:15] <jdong> I need to vent some words about the nvidia fiasco today
[10:16] <Fujitsu> Which NVIDIA fiasco?
[10:16] <LaserJock> is it really broken by our updates?
[10:16] <jdong> Fujitsu: lots of 9xxx nvidia users are complaining that today's kernel update broke X
[10:16] <Fujitsu> Ooh, fun.
[10:16] <imbrandon> btw since i havent had time to post it on the fridge yet, some of you might wanna read http://behindubuntu.org/interviews/BenCollins/
[10:16] <jdong> LaserJock: it's not broken by a 100% pure official nvidia setup
[10:16] <ryanakca> I take it that this is because of messed up source code? http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/36888/
[10:16] <jdong> but it seems like all non-official methods of 9640
[10:17] <jdong> 9631* rather
[10:17] <jdong> are messed
[10:17] <jdong> i.e. compile 9631 on old linux-image
[10:17] <jdong> update
[10:17] <jdong> borked
[10:17] <crimsun_> jdong: fixed by recompiling upstream by hand?
[10:17] <ryanakca> jdong: ouch
[10:17] <jdong> crimsun_: oui
[10:17] <jdong> crimsun_: one person fixed it simply by a depmod -ae
[10:17] <jdong> crimsun_: he was an anomaly though; 
[10:17] <jdong> (modprobe was looking in blacklisted volatile/ for a nonexistent nvidia.ko)
[10:17] <crimsun_> if it was fixed by recompiling, it's possible there's a missing ABI bump.
[10:17] <jdong> crimsun_: that's what I was suspecting
[10:18] <jdong> but I haven't been able to find enough people to confirm
[10:18] <jdong> it seems to mostly happen with 9631
[10:18] <jdong> 9640 emerges unscathed
[10:18] <crimsun_> oh, so 9640 is fine regardless?
[10:18] <jdong> crimsun_: one user tells me that
[10:19] <jdong> right now there doesn't seem to be enough info / problem reports to figure out exactly what are the circumstances of the breakage
[10:19] <imbrandon> ssh brandon@tiber
[10:19] <imbrandon> grr
[10:19] <jdong> it doesn't seem to be as widespread a breakage as our dapper fun :)
[10:19] <LaserJock> password:
[10:19] <imbrandon> lol ssh FTW
[10:19] <imbrandon> ssh key
[10:19] <imbrandon> too
[10:19] <LaserJock> darn
[10:19] <jdong> lol
[10:20] <jdong> LaserJock: don't joke about that. I've been scammed by a phony getty login prompt before
[10:20] <imbrandon> heh dont wory i'm getting on there to steal your mdt scripts
[10:20] <jdong> hence where the heck is our SaK
[10:20] <imbrandon> LaserJock: ^^
[10:20] <LaserJock> fine, be that way
[10:20] <imbrandon> hehe
[10:21] <imbrandon> i just cant rember what ones i had to grab before
[10:21] <imbrandon> lol
[10:21] <LaserJock> stealing all my goodies, just don't drop any crumbs on the way out
[10:21] <ajmitch> hello crimsun_ 
[10:22] <crimsun_> 'lo ajmitch 
[10:22] <imbrandon> LaserJock: it was the stuff in your ~/motuscience right >
[10:22] <imbrandon> ?
[10:22] <LaserJock> yeah, that's my cron-o-matic stuff
[10:22] <imbrandon> yea
[10:22] <imbrandon> i'm trying to set it back up on voyager
[10:25] <LaserJock> :(
[10:25] <gnomefreak> imbrandon: do you happen to have beryl for feisty repo?
[10:25] <LaserJock> and a shell-script pond
[10:25] <LaserJock> and takes a nap
[10:25] <gnomefreak> lol FunnyLookinHat 
[10:25] <gnomefreak> Fujitsu: even
[10:25] <imbrandon> gnomefreak: nope
[10:25] <sistpoty> re... damn, no sg antlantis today... not my day so far *g*
[10:26] <gnomefreak> ok ty imbrandon 
[10:26] <LaserJock> sistpoty: bummer dude
[10:26] <sistpoty> *g*
[10:27] <FunnyLookinHat> ?
[10:27] <Fujitsu> Damnit.
[10:27] <FunnyLookinHat> i always get random pings
[10:27] <crimsun_> sistpoty: but you heard that Jewel Staite (Kaylee in Firefly/Serenity) is joining SGA in season 4, no? :)
[10:27] <imbrandon> crimsun_: yea i seen that somewhere
[10:27] <imbrandon> so is some of the sg-1 cast
[10:27] <imbrandon> ( amanda tapping iirc )
[10:28] <sistpoty> crimsun_: no, not yet... (and I really wonder when season 4 might get broadcast in germany, we're still at the beginning of season 2)
[10:28] <imbrandon> of sg-1 and sga
[10:28] <jdong> ok, it rings slightly suspicious that no experienced linux users can report or reproduce kernel module breakage so far
[10:28] <jdong> and the beginners I've talked too all have configurations that would give me a heart attack looking at
[10:29] <Fujitsu> jdong: eg?
[10:29] <crimsun_> jdong: good. I'd trust our kernel team. :)
[10:29] <sistpoty> hey, LaserJock, nice work for the sru-page, thx!
[10:30] <jdong> Fujitsu: modprobe is looking in really funny locations for nvidia.ko; libGL.so.1 symlinks not existing ....
[10:30] <LaserJock> I find it strangely disturbing that crimsun knows more about TV shows then I do :/
[10:30] <jdong> Fujitsu: etc etc etc
[10:30] <LaserJock> sistpoty: np
[10:30] <Fujitsu> Fun.
[10:30] <jdong> crimsun_: of course I trust you guys
[10:31] <jdong> crimsun_: it's just curiousity prompts me to figure out what the heck is going on
[10:32] <crimsun_> LaserJock: I don't. amazon.com spammed me with gateworld.net news.
[10:32] <imbrandon> heh
[10:32] <crimsun_> I don't have a tv, so knowing about tv shows is kinda difficult.
[10:35] <ajmitch> sistpoty: so, time to make a decision on the motu meeting
[10:35] <ajmitch> otherwise friday will pass us by
[10:35] <sistpoty> ajmitch: actually I'd be inclined to wait another 12 hours... but I'll count votes right now ;)
[10:36] <sistpoty> (once I've finished marking emails as read, which I read whilst at uni *g*)
[10:36] <ajmitch> heh
[10:36] <ajmitch> did giskard's email get to the list?
[10:36] <ajmitch> for some reason he replied to mine, agreeing for friday
[10:37] <jdong> ha! yes! got an experienced beryl guy to reproduce it!
[10:37] <jdong> finally I might have some enlgihtening info
[10:37] <LaserJock> crimsun_: thank goodness, I was feeling pretty bad
[10:37] <sistpoty> ajmitch: are you trying to get more friday votes? *g* (no didn't make it=
[10:38] <jdong> crimsun_: ok, here's what appears to be happening....
[10:38] <jdong> this ONLY happens with 9631, 9640+ are unaffected
[10:38] <jdong> Xorg.0.log reports that it can't find the NVIDIA kernel module and borks out
[10:38] <jdong> but dmesg, lsmod both show the kernel module initializing
[10:39] <crimsun_> ajmitch: yes, his did. https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-December/001053.html
[10:39] <ajmitch> sistpoty: yes, I am :)
[10:39] <jdong> crimsun_: so are there any security updates that could've affected the behavior of how the nvidia userland would interface with its module?
[10:39] <ajmitch> sistpoty: I'm working on wednesday, friday is fine for me (saturday morning here)
[10:40] <sistpoty> ah, k
[10:40] <LaserJock> wednesday is less then ideal for me
[10:41] <LaserJock> I will perhaps be 500 miles into the Christmas drive home at that time
[10:41] <LaserJock> and I somehow doubt I'll get wifi in the middle of the Idaho
[10:42] <crimsun_> LaserJock: you're totally hardcore, though, and you'll be ircing over your cell phone.
[10:43] <LaserJock> crimsun_: I don't think my cellphone will even work there, maybe
[10:43] <crimsun_> I have faith in one-third of the MOTU trinity.
[10:43] <bddebian> :'-(
[10:43] <crimsun_> oh, sorry, didn't mean to omit bddebian and imbrandon.
[10:44] <sistpoty> ajmitch, LaserJock: both dates have same number of votes (from votes I got by mail) ... *g*
[10:44] <LaserJock> I just sent in mine
[10:44] <ajmitch> sistpoty: great, friday it is! ;)
[10:45] <sistpoty> ok, make it so :)
[10:45] <LaserJock> seriously, maybe we should have 2 meetings fairly close to each other, I'm sure we have lots of things to go over
[10:45] <ajmitch> the powers of persuasion
[10:45] <LaserJock> I'd personally like to see one right after the TB to confirm the MOTU Council
[10:46] <ajmitch> we need to find out the quickest way of setting up the MOTU council
[10:46] <sistpoty> LaserJock: same here... whereas I'd even would like to discuss MOTU Council a little bit on the next meeting, but I guess dholbach might kill me then
[10:46] <ajmitch> sistpoty: he won't kill you, it'll help to clarify expectations
[10:46] <ryanakca> I take it that this is because of messed up source code? http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/36888/
[10:47] <imbrandon> woot LaserJock got the scripts working 
[10:47] <sistpoty> ajmitch: well, I was thinking even a little bit further: s.th. like setting up an interim council, as I think that might really help us get back to full speed again
[10:47] <imbrandon> sistpoty: +1
[10:48] <imbrandon> if its gonna be any length of time we need one
[10:48] <LaserJock> sistpoty: well, do we know who we are reccommending be the MOTU Council?
[10:48] <ajmitch> not yet
[10:48] <LaserJock> why not just have them be the interim council until it's formalized
[10:48] <LaserJock> I'm sure dholbach knows
[10:48] <ajmitch> depends what the interim council will do
[10:48] <ajmitch> if it's just the normal stuff like TODO lists, etc
[10:48] <ajmitch> that'll be fine
[10:49] <imbrandon> probably anything the normal council will do but not the memberships
[10:49] <imbrandon> like TODO's
[10:49] <LaserJock> yeah, no approvals of memebers/MOTUs
[10:49] <imbrandon> yea
[10:49] <imbrandon> brb mt dew run
[10:49] <sistpoty> ajmitch: it couldn't make ubuntu-members/motu's yet... but imo we have also some problems with getting just a final ack/rej for stuff in question
[10:49] <sistpoty> (e.g. sru-policy)
[10:49] <ajmitch> yeah
[10:50] <ajmitch> I thought we had come to an agreement on sru-policy, to be honest
[10:50] <LaserJock> just direction, guidance, something to get people behind
[10:50] <ajmitch> and I didn't know that we had other stuff pending
[10:50] <jdong> would any part of the kernel upgrade procedure zap usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers/nvidia_drv.o?
[10:50] <jdong> it appears missing on all the broken nvidia people
[10:50] <jdong> but they swear it all worked before the update
[10:51] <sistpoty> ajmitch: well, some kind of... but then the discussion reappeared (where I was involved in) on the ml... with a final mail from me (two weeks later, when sru's had already been handled) asking about further objections
[10:52] <sistpoty> and so was it then... but things like this will reappear soon enough imo, that ppl. have good ideas but wait until they get an ack from somewhere, which doesn't happen atm.
[10:52] <ajmitch> sometimes I don't think we need agreement, but to just make a decision
[10:52] <ajmitch> so finalise the sru policy if you haven't already :)
[10:53] <ajmitch> people will agree with it, I'm sure
[10:53] <sistpoty> :)
[10:54] <LaserJock> we just need direction and quick decisions
[10:54] <ajmitch> we tend towards too much discussion for some things, and not enough for others :)
[10:55] <LaserJock> we've gotten bogged down in confusing docs, slow responses, and unclear/changing policies
[10:55] <ajmitch> go forth & rule with an iron fist
[10:55] <giskard> ajmitch, ops
[10:55] <sistpoty> ajmitch: good decision *g*, but that's only 4, so we'd definitely ajmitch as number 5
[10:56] <ajmitch> sistpoty: nah, prince holbach needs his place
[10:56] <LaserJock> dude, that reminds me
[10:56] <ajmitch> giskard: it's ok, I bounced it to the list
[10:56] <sistpoty> hehe
[10:56] <LaserJock> I was at this department store with my wife shopping
[10:57] <LaserJock> and we were looking for something for my neices
[10:57] <LaserJock> and in this pile of color books, etc. there was a DVD of the first 20 episodes of He-Man
[10:57] <ajmitch> hah
[10:57] <ajmitch> did you buy it?
[10:57] <LaserJock> nah
[10:57] <ajmitch> aw
[10:57] <LaserJock> it was like $16
[10:57] <ajmitch> you should have
[10:58] <LaserJock> and I just couldn't really think of any compelling reason to buy it
[10:58] <LaserJock> plus my wife was there so she would tease me about it
[10:59] <ajmitch> that's not fair
[10:59] <LaserJock> but on the front was He-Man riding that cat thing (can't remember the name) and it brought back some memories
[11:01] <LaserJock> anyway ...
[11:01] <LaserJock> so do we have a list of things that need to be taken care of ASAP?
[11:01] <LaserJock> there's no use in having a interim council if they aren't going to do anything
[11:03] <ajmitch> battlecat!
[11:03] <LaserJock> oh yeah
[11:03] <sistpoty> :)
[11:03] <ajmitch> LaserJock: todo lists, whipping people to do merges, etc
[11:03] <sistpoty> exactly...
[11:03] <ajmitch> sistpoty is doing a great job keeping people up to date about sru
[11:03] <LaserJock> yeah, sru seems ok
[11:03] <ajmitch> communication of stuff to UWN authors
[11:04] <imbrandon> re
[11:04] <ajmitch> hey imbrandon :)
[11:04] <LaserJock> I've seen a few times now that Scott isn't so pleased with our merge progress
[11:04] <ajmitch> yeah
[11:04] <ajmitch> we've been slacking
[11:04] <ajmitch> making MOTUs aware of the various deadlines
[11:04] <sistpoty> thx ajmitch, I guess I learned that from my gf (social worker) which means  95% of the time to represent stuff that you've done, because you get no funds otherwise
[11:04] <ajmitch> maybe deciding on some of the freeze dates for universe
[11:04] <LaserJock> I think the whole merge lock thing is holding back some work
[11:05] <ajmitch> anything that doesn't require TB or CC delegation
[11:05] <LaserJock> and merges.ubuntu.com not being updated
[11:05] <ajmitch> LaserJock: yes, but it can be annoying finding out that a merge you were working on was done, by looking on feisty-changes
[11:05] <sistpoty> LaserJock: yes, I'd like to talk about the lock thing on the meeting as well
[11:05] <ajmitch> I've had stuff that I was doing taken, with no notification
[11:06] <sistpoty> thx crimsun_ for the dosemu merge btw :)
[11:06] <ajmitch> by 'working on', I mean I had the package ready to upload & was just wanting to ask mvo about something :)
[11:06] <LaserJock> mhm
[11:06] <imbrandon> LaserJock: got the scripts working on voyager http://voyager.imbrandon.com/mdt/feisty/kde.html
[11:07] <LaserJock> Perhaps what we need to do is have weekly goals for MOTU
[11:07] <imbrandon> now just to refine the package list
[11:07] <ajmitch> LaserJock: that's the plan
[11:07] <ajmitch> we agreed on that at UDS
[11:07] <ajmitch> imbrandon: useful
[11:08] <LaserJock> haha, what a tiny list ;-)
[11:08] <tsmithe> anyone wanna revu asoundconf-gtk?
[11:08] <ajmitch> I think I've got most of my zope merges done
[11:09] <sistpoty> date for motu-meeting is now fixed :)
[11:09] <ajmitch> yay
[11:09] <ajmitch> thanks
[11:09] <ajmitch> what day did you choose?
[11:09] <LaserJock> uh oh
[11:10] <imbrandon> day/time ?
[11:10] <crimsun_> LaserJock: mind punting that merge page to the ubuntu-motu list?
[11:10] <sistpoty> ajmitch: friday
[11:10] <LaserJock> crimsun_: which merge page?
[11:10] <crimsun_> LaserJock: script that has updated merge status?
[11:11] <imbrandon> crimsun_: the mdt ones like i just ran ?
[11:11] <crimsun_> imbrandon: sure
[11:11] <imbrandon> ahh ok yea, after i refine the packages it looks at to split out universe/main 
[11:11] <imbrandon> etcv
[11:11] <imbrandon> etc*
[11:12] <LaserJock> yeah, I used to do that
[11:12] <LaserJock> http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/versions/unimultiverse-all.html is a start
[11:12] <imbrandon> those arent on crons though are they ?
[11:12] <LaserJock> yeah
[11:12] <imbrandon> e.g. the ones on tiber
[11:13] <imbrandon> ohhh mdt got installed ?
[11:13] <LaserJock> yeah
[11:13] <imbrandon> err updated on tiber
[11:13] <imbrandon> nice
[11:13] <imbrandon> hehe
[11:13] <LaserJock> it's just older
[11:13] <LaserJock> it doesn't have the patch that Fujitsu/I did
[11:15] <LaserJock> well, I can make a script that produces "Outdated in Ubuntu" and "Outdated in Ubuntu, but Ubuntu has local changes" for Universe/Multiverse
[11:15] <sistpoty> geser: damn, couldn't you have shouted for the date a little bit earlier? (I just missed your mail, sorry)
[11:15] <ajmitch> sistpoty: thanks for dropping me in it :)
[11:16] <sistpoty> hehe
[11:16] <ajmitch> 9am saturday morning for me
[11:16] <ajmitch> not too bad
[11:17] <sistpoty> ok, seems like we'd need to get this to fridge-calendar as well. anyone got a clue?
[11:17] <geser> will there be a log of the meeting?
[11:17] <ajmitch> there's an editors mailing list, I think
[11:17] <imbrandon> let me know the date/time and i'll add to to the fridge now
[11:17] <ajmitch> geser: always
[11:18] <ajmitch> ah, imbrandon Has The Power
[11:18] <crimsun_> wiki/MOTU/Meetings clarified
[11:18] <imbrandon> is Friday, 12/15/06, 20.00 UTC correct ?
[11:19] <ajmitch> 15/12/06, for the rest of the world
[11:19] <imbrandon> heh
[11:19] <sistpoty> ajmitch: really, I thought I'd have the date/month not wrong this time... :(
[11:20] <ajmitch> sistpoty: hm?
[11:20] <sistpoty> mom... looking for my (un)famous bug
[11:21] <sistpoty> ajmitch: just look at bug #33203
[11:21] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 33203 in launchpad "poll: dates are not properly validated" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/33203
[11:21] <imbrandon> ok ajmitch sistpoty crimsun_ , added to the fridge calendar
[11:21] <sistpoty> thx imbrandon
[11:21] <imbrandon> please check to make sure i ddient typo
[11:22] <ajmitch> thank you
[11:22] <imbrandon> np
[11:22] <ajmitch> it should appear in the #-meeting topic soon then
[11:23] <imbrandon> yea, when Seveas bot runs the cron to update ( every 15 minutes ? )
[11:23] <Seveas> 60
[11:23] <crimsun_> sistpoty: while you're editing MOTU/Meetings, would you please add "Decide universe UVF/FF dates" to the agenda?
[11:23] <imbrandon> ahh :)
[11:23] <Seveas> or run @topic in there to force an update
[11:24] <sistpoty> crimsun_: oops, sorry, just forgot about the tab with the lock *g+
[11:24] <sistpoty> crimsun_: will do
[11:24] <crimsun_> sistpoty: thanks :)
[11:25] <sistpoty> crimsun_: np... please recheck ;)
[11:27] <imbrandon> i'll be about ~15 minutes late btw to it ( not that it should make a diff )
[11:27] <imbrandon> ( the meeting )
[11:28] <imbrandon> because thats right when i'm driving home hehe
[11:28] <imbrandon> but no biggie
[11:29] <ajmitch> imbrandon: just connect from work & drive home later :)
[11:29] <imbrandon> yea thats probably what i'll do
[11:29] <imbrandon> specialy now that i wont be sshing to my home box and lag like i did in the UbuntuOpenWeek talks
[11:29] <imbrandon> lol
[11:31] <imbrandon> wow a debian proper story hit digg
[11:32] <ajmitch> about etch?
[11:32] <imbrandon> no titled "debian: server yes - desktop no" but suprisingly a upbeat story
[11:33] <imbrandon> you can pretty much sum the whole article up with , its a great server but quote .....
[11:33] <imbrandon> Mind you, I'm 100 percent convinced that I could have successfully created a completely satisfactory configuration of a Debian GNU/Linux desktop... given enough patience, that is. But frankly, I've got too many more-pressing things to do with my time than reinvent the Ubuntu/MEPIS/Freespire wheel ;-)

[11:33] <ajmitch> heh
[11:35] <imbrandon> ugh i hate ftp, i hate it even more that i have to setup an ftp server
[11:35] <imbrandon> ( for a friend )
[11:36] <imbrandon> is there a simple to configure ftp server in universe?
[11:36] <crimsun_> vsftpd 
[11:36] <imbrandon> cool thanks
[11:37] <sistpoty> imbrone, that I really liked was openftpd (you can completely control it via site-commands), but the project is long dead now and I never came around to make sane packages from it
[11:38] <sistpoty> s/imbrone/imbrandon/
[11:38] <imbrandon> :)
[11:38] <imbrandon> this is just a one off for a buddy, so hopefull vsftpd will be fine
[11:38] <imbrandon> looks good so far
[11:39] <imbrandon> personaly i just use sftp built into sshd
[11:39] <imbrandon> when i need it
[11:39] <imbrandon> or scp
[11:39] <crimsun_> sistpoty: tidied. I rearranged some ordering.
[11:42] <sistpoty> crimsun_: nice...
[11:43] <sistpoty> crimsun_: oh, you seem to have made "review process" (aka revu vs. bzr) to "review sru process" *g*... I'll fix this
[11:44] <crimsun_> sistpoty: ok, I wasn't sure which it was.
[11:45] <sistpoty> I guess this meeting might get quite long again
[11:45] <LaserJock> com'on tiber, push ... push
[11:46] <LaserJock> "Scotty... we .. need .. more .. power!"
[11:48] <LaserJock> tiber FTW!
[11:48] <LaserJock> http://tiber.tauware.de/~laserjock/motutodo/multiverse.html
[11:49] <LaserJock> http://tiber.tauware.de/~laserjock/motutodo/universe.html
[11:51] <sistpoty> nice!
[11:51] <LaserJock> should I drop the first category?
[11:52] <LaserJock> it's not useful for merges but shows what packages we've modified
[11:54] <LaserJock> crimsun_: ^^ ?
[11:55] <sistpoty> LaserJock: yay, get rid of it please :)
[11:58] <crimsun_> yeah, I support killing that first section
[12:04] <LaserJock> crimsun_ & sistpoty : reload http://tiber.tauware.de/~laserjock/motutodo/universe.html
[12:04] <sistpoty> LaserJock: great!
[12:05] <sistpoty> LaserJock: the small font gives the impression, that there isn't that much left to do :)
[12:05] <LaserJock> haha
[12:05] <LaserJock> not like a wiki page
[12:06] <sistpoty> *g*
[12:08] <LaserJock> sistpoty: cron'd and ready to fly
[12:08] <sistpoty> yeeehaa!
[12:10] <sistpoty> LaserJock: you speak french, don't you?
[12:11] <LaserJock> no, sadly
[12:11] <LaserJock> very little
[12:11] <LaserJock> I can count to 10 and silly things like that
[12:11] <sistpoty> LaserJock: maybe better than nothing (me)
[12:11] <LaserJock> but UDS-Paris showed me how little I knew
[12:11] <jdong> LaserJock: I can too! uno, dos, ....
[12:11] <LaserJock> French jdong 
[12:11] <LaserJock> ;-)
[12:11] <jdong> LaserJock: same thing
[12:11] <sistpoty> LaserJock: I'm looking for a download link for menareants, that should be somewhere at http://coderz.info/wiki/index.php?title=Men_Are_Ants
[12:11] <LaserJock> just more gutteral
[12:12] <sistpoty> and I don't understand a word :(
[12:12] <Adri2000> sistpoty: download = tlcharger ;)
[12:12] <jdong> unus, duo, tres, quattuor.....
[12:12] <sistpoty> Adri2000: ah, thx!