[12:17] <mpt> mdke, why is another tutorial Web site bad?
[12:18] <mdke> mpt: several reasons: first it demonstrates that someone was not interested in contributing to our work, and felt the need to establish a separate site. second, users looking for documentation will have to search yet another site.
[12:18] <mpt> Understood on the first, but as for the second, Google will get it all :-)
[12:18] <mpt> anyway
[12:19] <mpt> mdke, there are various kinds of people who are new to Ubuntu 7.04
[12:19] <mpt> * people who were last using Ubuntu 6.10
[12:19] <mdke> the search engine in yelp won't, and nor will the one on our website
[12:19] <mpt> * people who were last using 6.06
[12:19] <mpt> oh wait, we won't support that
[12:19] <mpt> So that'll be true for 7.10, but not for 7.04
[12:20] <mpt> LTS->LTS
[12:20] <mpt> and LTS-1 -> LTS
[12:20] <mpt> * people who have primarily been using Windows
[12:20] <mpt> * people who have primarily been using the Mac
[12:20] <mpt> * people who haven't really used computers before at all.
[12:21] <mdke> yes, agreed on all the others
[12:21] <mdke> one moment.
[12:21] <mdke> 23:28:24 < mpt> So that'll be true for 7.10, but not for 7.04
[12:21] <mdke> do you know something we don't?
[12:21] <mpt> No, this was discussed on ubuntu-devel@ iirc
[12:22] <mpt> it might not be 7.10, but whatever the next LTS is
[12:22] <mpt> the plan is to support LTS->LTS upgrading
[12:22] <mdke> yes, that's true. I thought maybe you had heard that 7.10 would be an LTS release
[12:23] <mpt> no, I haven't
[12:23] <mpt> I was just extrapolating
[12:24] <mdke> fine, carry on
[12:24] <mpt> So, I suggest a subcategory (or maybe just a page) for each of those
[12:26] <mdke> well, those coming from other versions of Ubuntu don't currently have any material available. but we could do it that way for the others
[12:26] <mpt> possibly the last three would all contain links to the same "Parts of the Ubuntu screen" page, aka "Desktop overview"
[12:26] <mpt> ugh, I'm not good at coming up with names when I'm still in bed
[12:29] <mdke> mpt: the only categories we have info for in fact are the last one, and the Windows one. On that basis, would you still propose just having two subsections, rather than something along the lines of my screenshot?
[12:29] <mpt> A-ha, that's a good way to shame me into writing them
[12:31] <mpt> I'll be more useful doing that than trying to reorganize the "Connecting to the Internet" section, anyway
[12:31] <mpt> oh, that reminds me
[12:31] <mdke> I tell you what. Get my latest updates to trunk/ubuntu/C/newtoubuntu, explore, and see what you come up with
[12:31] <mpt> ok
[12:31] <mpt> anyway
[12:31] <mpt> We have a structural problem
[12:31] <mpt> We are a bunch of writers who don't necessarily know about the things that need writing about
[12:32] <mpt> Meanwhile there are developers who know the answers, who never write anything
[12:32] <mdke> yes. Did you see my exchanges with mdz about that?
[12:32] <mpt> no, where was that?
[12:32] <mdke> well, about the latter problem
[12:33] <mdke> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2006-December/007459.html
[12:33] <mpt> One way to handle this would be a post to the forums
[12:33] <mpt> e.g. "Has anyone ever connected a hard disk by a COM port and got Ubuntu to read it? If so, how did you get it working?"
[12:34] <tonyyarusso> So many matthews.... :P
[12:34] <mdke> heh. Just searching the forums will sort that out
[12:34] <mpt> and include the answers
[12:34] <mdke> I was thinking about this in relation to "Common questions"; identifying common problems via surveys and such
[12:36] <mdke> heh
[12:36] <mpt> tonyyarusso, it's a conspiracy
[12:36] <tonyyarusso> mpt: of course.
[12:37] <mpt> but people who aren't named Matthew are still very welcome
[12:39] <mdke> not as welcome as those who are though
[12:40] <mdke> mpt: btw, in the newtoubuntu.xml doc there are lots of links, which are links to Gnome documents that I haven't yet added to the repository
[12:40] <mdke> so those won't work
[12:40] <mpt> Weren't they in the repository already?
[12:40] <tonyyarusso> hehe.  Probably more important is "Welcome are those with the time to do all the ubuntuy things they'd like to"
[12:41] <mdke> mpt: don't think so. In any case, I haven't added them because they might still change upstream
[12:41] <mpt> ok
[12:41] <mdke> tonyyarusso: you know there are another three Matthews aside from those just mentioned?
[12:41] <mdke> and probably loads more besides
[12:42] <mdke> it's cos we are a bit more intelligent than those with other names
[12:42] <tonyyarusso> mdke: I didn't; that's even more terrifying
[12:42] <mdke> either that or slightly less intelligent...
[12:42] <tonyyarusso> Anyway, I'll let you get back to what sounded like work.
[12:43] <mdke> no, work is much more boring
[12:43] <mdke> don't tell anyone I said that though
[12:43] <mpt> This is a simulation of work
[10:51] <nixternal> if htdig worked in Kubuntu the way it does in SuSE, then doing the TBH would be a breaze