/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2006/12/28/#kubuntu-devel.txt

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=== Hobbsee pokes Riddell
HobbseeRiddell: you around, or on holidays?10:01
Riddellhi Hobbsee10:02
Riddellboth10:02
Hobbseeyay, you are here :)10:02
Hobbseeah10:02
Hobbseeso you'd probably prefer not to think about what i was going to ask you10:02
HobbseeRiddell: FYI:  [20:03]  <praetor> Hobbsee: i've almost finished the C++ part of the upgrader10:03
Riddellyeah, just found a /msg from him10:04
HobbseeRiddell: i'm assuming that you hadnt started it10:04
Hobbseeah :)10:04
Riddellno, I havn't10:04
Hobbseewhen are you officially back?10:04
Riddell3rd10:04
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HobbseeRiddell: OK.  in case you were wondering, i want to know about the feasibility of putting the big kde packages into bzr somehow, so that we can commit little fixes to them, instead of fixing a whole lot every once in a while, then finding a sponsor.10:05
RiddellHobbsee: I'm not convinced that would be any less hassle10:06
Riddellat least until no-more-source-packages happens10:06
HobbseeRiddell: hmmm, OK.10:06
RiddellI already have a copy in debian's SVN10:06
Riddelland it's a hassle to keep it up to date10:06
HobbseeRiddell: i guess with imbrandon here it's easier to get things uploaded, for those of us without upload privs10:06
Riddellwe do kubuntu-default-settings that way, and it's not uncommon for it to get out of sync10:07
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Hobbseetrue10:08
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fdovingRiddell: if anything gets out of sync it's because those who work with the packages don't sync it with the main bzr repo. I think having bzr/svn repos of debian/ dirs atleast, is a very good idea.11:15
fdovingi prefer getting the upstream source with debian/rules, for example, 'debian/rules get-orig-source', watchfiles and all.11:21
Riddellfdoving: you can't do that with mainline KDE, the source packages are kept hidden for a week before release11:31
fdovingwell, you can modify the debian/rules to 'cp /tmp/hidden/ ../tarballs' or something.11:32
Riddellwhat would be the point in that?11:33
fdovingit would be very handly later, after the release when things need to change.11:33
fdovingdebian does this with some of their debian/ dirs, i think it seems logical.11:36
Riddell.orig files don't change11:37
fdovingexactly.11:37
fdovingthat's why we don't want them in the svn/bzr repo.11:37
fdovingwe want a rules target to fetch it from upstream, when needed.11:38
Riddellor you can use apt-get source11:41
fdovingI can, actually 'dpatch-get-origtargz' does that, if it provides the correct orig.tar.gz it is used, if not, it's fetched from upstream with the info in debian/watch11:42
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Jucatomoin kwwii! :)11:42
kwwiimoin Jucato11:44
JucatoMerry Christmas and a Happy New Year! :D11:44
kwwiithanks :-)11:44
kwwiithe first one was successful, now for the second one :-)11:45
fdovingRiddell: If I have a working debian/watch, I can simply do 'dch -v newversion; debian/rules get-orig-source; svn-buildpackage', svn-buildpackage unpacks the tarball, and does it all. You can also use bzr-builddeb if you have a bzr repo.11:45
fdovingRiddell: that's when a new version of something is released. I don't have to browse to the projects webpage, find the link to the upstream tar.gz, download, rename, and all.11:46
fdovingfor kde it might not be that handy, because they keep it hidden..11:47
fdovingbut things do change in the packages after KDE release too.11:48
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=== rideout is back.
fdovingI'll go make waffles. bye.12:05
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bddebianHeya05:26
fdovinghi.05:26
bddebianHello fdoving05:27
fdovingso, you've finished christmas too? :)05:27
bddebianYeah, two days ago :'-(  :)05:27
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kwwiimhb: ping?06:19
pinheiroyea06:19
pinheiroexactly06:19
pinheiro :)06:19
kwwiimhb: can you point me to the webpage comparison you did for oxygen?06:21
kwwiiRiddell: ping?06:23
pinheirothe page is down06:25
pinheiroi just checked it06:25
pinheiroaparently i had it bookmarked06:25
kwwiiouch06:26
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kwwiiRiddell: when you have time, I would like to discuss the naming stuff06:59
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Riddellkwwii: I'm free07:20
Riddellpinheiro: it's moved to a new page07:20
kwwiiRiddell: can you send me the file you started? I want to start a spreadsheet with that info and other stuff07:21
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kwwiiRiddell: I am starting wikipages for oxygen07:22
kwwiiand some info would be nice, so putting everything in a spreadsheet seems like a nice start07:22
Riddellhttp://kubuntu.org/~jriddell/icon-spec/standard-names07:23
Riddell<standard-name> <kde3-name> <status>07:23
RiddellNEW is new use for an icon07:23
RiddellNONE is doesn't exist at all in kde 307:23
RiddellI was planning on starting to work it all out tomorrow07:24
kwwiicool, I'll be around for any help :-)07:26
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kwwiiRiddell: mainly, I want to start a wikipage with a bit of info first, I thought it might help to look at the content of that file to do so07:27
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n8k99kwwii: are you doing the kubuntu artwork for feisty?07:33
kwwiin8k99: not sure yet, but I'll help in any case ;-)07:38
n8k99kwwii: just wondering if you'd be heading up any efforts as I'd like to help contribute to the effort07:39
Riddellas often happens we have no idea what's happening07:40
Riddellbut we can console ourselves that, as far as I know, Ubuntu has even less idea07:41
kwwiin8k99: killer, we can use all the help we can get ;-)07:41
n8k99Riddell: did you mean ubuntu or canonical?07:42
Riddelln8k99: ubuntu, the 1 CD gnome distro07:48
n8k99Riddell: is that related to Kubuntu the 1 CD KDE distro ;-)07:48
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n8k99has anyone ever tried making kopete a kpart for kontact?07:53
mhbhi all07:55
kwwiihi mhb07:55
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mhbsorry that I missed the ping07:55
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Riddellmhb: could you give access to your database thing to kwwii and pinheiro08:00
Riddelln8k99: I doubt it.  when it's been suggested to danimo he's said it wouldn't be very useful08:01
n8k99I see08:01
mhbRiddell, kwwii : do you need something urgent from me?08:03
mhbRiddell: I see, sure08:03
kwwiimhb: was just working on the naming stuff, thought I'd talk to you about it too08:04
kwwiinothing pressing08:04
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mhbRiddell, kwwii: I'll be away for the next few days ( visiting my girlfriend's family ) so if you need anything from me, please tell me08:11
kwwiimhb: by the time you get back I will probably have something ;-)08:12
mhbkwwii: sure08:12
kwwiihave a good time08:12
mhbkwwii: thanks08:12
Riddellmhb will come back grumbling about the in-laws :)08:13
kwwiilol08:14
kwwiithe best way to avoid that, I have found is to invite everyone to your house...so they are all grumbling about you instead08:14
kwwiibtw. /me just created http://developernew.kde.org/Projects/Oxygen08:15
Riddelldo I want to read this tango thread on kde-artists?08:16
kwwiiRiddell: you do if you want a good laugh08:18
kwwiiI think they were trying to bait us just "little" bit08:18
Riddellkwwii: anything decided about the kde 4 widet style?08:19
Riddellwidget08:19
kwwiiRiddell: well, we are working on it :-) we are putting everything in playground/artwork/Oxygen for now08:20
Riddellanyone on feisty (plus w32codecs installed) around to test something?  what happens if you listen to a radio station from the bbc with it set to realplayer?  http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/08:20
mhbRiddell: well, when I selected "Open in standalone player" it offered Amarok and then crashed08:23
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Riddellnaw, not standalone, embedded, what happens?08:25
mhbRiddell: all I see is Settings link and Launch this in standalone player link and BBC logo08:27
mhbRiddell: in the popup that appears when I click on the Listen to...08:27
Riddellhmm08:28
Riddelltry settings and tell it reaplayer08:28
Riddellrealplayer08:28
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Riddellfroud!08:32
mhbRiddell: it works when I select WM08:32
mhbRiddell: kmplayer launches08:32
Riddellmhb: aye but that's not what I'm wanting to test :)08:32
froudRiddell: hey there08:32
mhbRiddell: I thought that. With realplayer I get a black screen where the menu should be.08:33
mhbRiddell: I may have an outdated system for a few days.Should I upgrade it all first?08:34
Riddellno08:34
mhbRiddell: by the way, I thought about suggesting a different widget style for Kubuntu Feisty ... Polyester, that is08:36
mhbRiddell: I wanted to know if you're totally against it; if not we could add it to the next meeting's agenda08:37
RiddellI'm pretty well against it08:38
Riddellbut feel free to add it08:38
mhbRiddell: thanks08:41
mhbn8k99: by the way, if you want to discuss Kubuntu artwork, you can join #ubuntu-artwork and we can chat there ... I *love* discussing artwork :o)08:43
n8k99mhb: gr808:44
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Tonio_hi everyone09:09
mhbhi Tonio_09:10
Tonio_sorry or not beeing there at the moment, I'm taking a little break for christmas and new year's day09:10
mhbenjoy09:10
Tonio_refreshing my brain and getting new ideas for ubuntu while playing with vista and osx :)09:10
Tonio_8 days without a linux computer in use, strange feeling for me ^^09:10
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jpatricksomeone tell me what the status on package updates is?09:13
Riddellnothing is going to happen until next year09:21
jpatricklovely09:21
Riddellwhat are you interested in?09:22
jpatrickupdating koverartist09:22
jpatrickgot a request by email and it fixes bug #6225909:23
UbugtuMalone bug 62259 in koverartist "Missing cd/dvd templates in /usr/share/apps/koverartist/cases" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/6225909:23
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kwwiiRiddell: mind if I post the info you have in that file on http://developernew.kde.org/index.php?title=Projects/Oxygen/namingSpec09:26
kwwii?09:26
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Riddellkwwii: not at all09:26
Riddellalthough the mediawiki format for tables is weird as hell as I remember09:26
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jpatrickhi raphink09:29
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jpetsokwwii: any specific todo for the previously-mentioned naming spec?09:46
kwwiin8k99: once I know what is up, I can answer that more defintely09:47
kwwiierm09:47
kwwiisorry09:47
jpetsoyea09:47
jpetsook, thx09:47
kwwiijpetso: yeah, we have to make it :-)09:47
n8k99kwwii: what is causing so much confusion? kde4?09:48
kwwiiwe need to figure out what we need and how to extend it09:48
jpetsokwwii: is it only for the icons in the Tango spec, or does it also include making up new names for existing icons?09:48
kwwiias well as how to change everything in code with script09:48
kwwiiwe will need new names as well09:48
jpetsook09:48
kwwiias you can see on that page09:48
jpetsokwwii: i meant, new like "we're out to extend the fd.o specification"09:49
jpetsokwwii: but i see this is in scope09:49
kwwiiwe will definitely need to extend it09:50
jpetsokwwii: i'll start with checking the current entries in the wiki page09:50
kwwiicool09:52
kwwiiwe need all the help we can get :-)09:52
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kwwiiubuntu-artwork is soooo useless10:03
nixternalheh10:03
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nixternalhiya Hobbsee!10:03
kwwiihi Hobbsee!10:03
nixternalhiya kwwii!10:03
kwwiigood morning or whatever10:03
kwwiihi nixternal10:03
kwwii:-)10:03
nixternalwe need some groovy graphics for documentation :)10:04
nixternalheader and footer10:04
Hobbseehey nixternal, kwwii!!!10:04
Hobbseeyeah, it's 8am :)10:04
nixternalyou have until march :)10:04
kwwiithe best way to accomplish that is to make a detailed idea of what you need and to submit it to the art team10:05
kwwii:p10:05
Hobbseehehe10:05
nixternalwe can do that im sure10:05
=== Hobbsee has a better way than that
mhbkwwii: heh10:05
Hobbseesay "i want it to look like this", then just attack the people with my Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  until it gets done!10:05
kwwiiHobbsee: say "ping kwwi until he does it" and i'll fly to AU just to find you10:05
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Hobbseekwwii: :P10:06
mhbkwwii: useless, you say? :o)10:06
Hobbseekwwii: way cool.  could be fun to meet up.10:06
crimsunyou kubuntu people are scary.10:06
kwwiihehe10:06
Hobbseeawww, poor crimsun10:06
n8k99crimsun: why are our eyes too close together or sumphin10:06
nixternalhaha10:06
crimsunI think it's the -lack- of eyes and overabundance of pointy sticks.10:07
Hobbseenah.  i think the Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  scares crimsun, and that's definetly in kubuntu ownership10:07
nixternalcrimsun: i wish you would stop living a lie and just come out with it already, you closet kubuntu ser10:07
nixternalerr s/ser/user10:07
Hobbseewho's missing eyes here?10:07
=== Hobbsee counts...1...2...3...yup, got the required number
crimsuneveryone, thanks to some pointy stick of doom?10:07
Hobbseei dont poke their eyes out....10:08
crimsunnixternal: I already do use it kthx10:08
nixternalhehe10:08
kwwiiif we would have known that you would show up with your damn pointy stick we would have hidden10:08
=== nixternal wants super loud sound on his laptop already :)
n8k99nixternal what do you wnat the header and footer to look like?10:08
Hobbseekwwii: haha.  kicked me out of the channel when i was still a lurker, yes?10:08
n8k99s/wnat/want10:08
=== Hobbsee hugs kwwii instead of attacking with the stick
kwwii;-)10:09
nixternaln8k99: i have no clue, something new and exciting of course, but i will leave that up to Riddell10:09
=== Hobbsee hopes kwwii doesnt really mind her stick
kwwiiHobbsee: just depends where you stick it :p10:09
nixternalhaha10:09
Hobbseehaha10:09
Hobbseewhere you dont want it to go, of course :P10:09
nixternaloh shat, im out of this one10:09
Hobbseeoh the possibilities raised by that statement...10:09
nixternalkwwii did grow up on the north side :)10:10
kwwiinow I should say something dirty10:10
Hobbseethe north side?10:10
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Hobbseekwwii: you could.   it'll probably hurt though.10:10
kwwiiI am into some pretty funky stuff10:10
mhbkwwii: so who and when will work on kubuntu-artwork-* specs?10:10
crimsunnixternal: as opposed to super not-loud sound?10:11
kwwiimhb: no idea yet10:11
kwwiierm10:11
kwwiirather, I have the specs done10:11
kwwiibut who will do the work is still up in the air10:11
nixternalyes crimsun10:11
mhbkwwii: you have?10:11
crimsunnixternal: I have no idea what that means.10:11
kwwiisure, for months10:11
mhbkwwii: I mean more than https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Specs/kubuntu-artwork-desktop10:11
Hobbseekwwii: i think we'll leave your private life hidden :P10:12
mhbkwwii: some specific guidelines, ideas10:12
kwwiihehe10:12
n8k99nixternal: did you recently get that machen?10:12
kwwiibeing married will turn any man into a semi-freak10:12
mhbkwwii: specifying what will remain/ what will change10:12
kwwii:p10:12
kwwiimhb: well, check the specs:-)10:12
mhbkwwii: I'm checking the wiki pages10:12
kwwiiyou could add one to use polyester10:12
mhbkwwii: I have added that to the meeting agenda10:13
kwwiilaunchpad would be a good place to start10:13
kwwiiwhich meeting?10:13
mhbnext Kubuntu meeting10:13
Hobbseekwwii: oh dear.  yes, these women people are terrible, i dont know how you stand us :P10:13
kwwiiwhy have I not recieved notice of a meeting?10:13
mhbkwwii: because there is not yet a date for it?10:13
kwwiihey now, I love my wife10:13
n8k99meeting?10:13
kwwiiand you can too for 19.9510:13
kwwiimhb: that would be a good reason10:14
mhbI've bought that and I love my girlfriend twice as much! I can only recommend kwwii's product!10:14
kwwiihehe10:14
Hobbseeyou cant run a meeting if i'm not there, again :P10:14
kwwiino doubt10:14
kwwiionce a year we should make meeting where Hobbsee can come10:14
n8k99Hobbsee:someone has to bring the pointy stick10:15
Hobbseekwwii: of course you do.  but us women are still crazy :P10:15
kwwiibut not much more than taht :p10:15
kwwiilol10:15
Hobbseekwwii: i make it to most of them.  just the last one i missed, being suddenly out of the state.  (i had about 4 days warning before, and it was too late to change the meeting)10:15
Hobbseehahahhaa10:15
Hobbseen8k99: indeed.10:15
Hobbseewho's up for writing the python code to port the upgrader over.10:16
Hobbsee?10:16
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kwwiiwheweweweweeheheheheh10:24
Hobbseehmmm?10:24
kwwiiand/or the sound of one hand clapping10:24
kwwii[22:14]  <Hobbsee> who's up for writing the python code to port the upgrader over.10:24
n8k99look Hobbsee you could poke me with the stick but the amount of python I know will get ya squat10:25
mhbHobbsee: usually it's the one who asks the question :o)10:25
kwwiilol10:26
mhbkwwii: by the way, it might be a good thing for the Kubuntu artwork to move slowly towards KDE4's Oxygen10:26
kwwiimhb: don't worry, we have secret plans for that10:26
mhbkwwii: good, good .o)10:26
n8k99secret plans! I love secrets!10:27
kwwiimhb: the info on the kde wiki is up to date, but we are going to work on it soon10:27
Hobbseemhb: my python's not very good.10:27
=== Hobbsee hacks away at some python code in the background
Hobbseen8k99: hehe, fair enough10:28
kwwiionce we have that done, we(kubuntu) are/is further than any other dist10:28
Hobbsee:)10:28
kwwiihehe10:28
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kwwiihttp://developernew.kde.org/Projects/Oxygen/namingSpec10:29
kwwiifeel free to work on it10:29
kwwiireally10:29
mhbkwwii: KDE4's gonna use emblems? yay!10:31
kwwiihaha10:31
kwwiino10:31
mhbaww10:31
kwwiithat is the f.d.o naming spec10:31
kwwiiuntil now kde does not use all of it10:32
kwwiialthough we extend it quite a bit10:32
mhbno emblems for KDE4? :(10:33
mhbI find them useful. But then, I find a lot of things useful.10:34
mhbthe Oxygen home folder icon looks kind of like a folder with an emblem10:34
kwwiiwe will have something like emblems but it will be used differently10:35
kwwiiprogramatically10:35
kwwiifunction bases10:35
kwwiibased10:35
kwwiifile-interaction based10:36
n8k99are there additional functions in katapault beside being a launcher?10:39
=== n8k99 sorry about the tangent
fdovingit can add up numbers, i've heard :)10:40
n8k99fdoving: how's that?10:41
n8k99oh I see10:41
fdovingthere is a catalog for it.10:42
Hobbseen8k99: + music + bookmarks, et10:42
Hobbseec10:42
fdovingthere is also a spelling thing.10:42
mhbI'd love Kontact integration for that :o)10:44
n8k99it'd be great if it could append notes within knotes10:44
Hobbseeooh, yeah :)10:44
n8k99if it did that- I might start using knotes!!10:46
fdovingcan't be hard to make.10:47
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apokryphosknotes? Bah. Basket :D10:48
Hobbsee+1 apokryphos.  then again, basket can import knotes10:49
apokryphosright. It's just nice+easy to throw things into, quick search for my long notes, and doesn't take up my desktop10:50
n8k99right. then you could alt + space append knote > which would end up in basket10:50
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jpetsokwwii: it seems the "edit_add" and "edit_remove" icons have been renamed to just "add" and "remove" in current kdelibs, but after you adding it to Oxygen as "add" vignoni has renamed it to its former name10:54
jpetsokwwii: which makes it inconsistent with current kdelibs and also the "remove" icon in Oxygen10:54
kwwiijpetso: it might very well be so, although I have not looked at it10:55
kwwiiI wrote that a few hours ago10:55
kwwiiso he has not reall looked at it yet10:55
jpetsokwwii: no, i mean Oxygen's actions/ SVN should be fixed10:55
Tonio_re10:56
Tonio_hi kwwiin, jpetso10:56
jpetsohi Tonio_10:56
apokryphosatm personally I'd get in kickoff and forget katapult :P10:56
apokryphosit does sums too :D10:56
Tonio_apokryphos: well I am just packaging it10:57
Tonio_apokryphos: but it is a pure pain to build it10:57
apokryphoshm, really? How come?10:57
Tonio_apokryphos: got something forking?10:57
Tonio_apokryphos: well I miss a header file and I am completly unable to find it10:57
apokryphosforking?10:58
kwwiijpetso: not sure I understand10:58
kwwiiTonio_: hey man10:58
kwwiiTonio_: merry christmas10:58
Tonio_apokryphos: forking what ?10:58
kwwiiTonio_: long time, no see10:58
kwwiiTonio_: how are you?10:58
Tonio_kwwii: yeah I took a break for the vacations :)10:58
apokryphosTonio_: "got something forking?" as in, what do you mean there?10:58
Tonio_kwwii: very nice, with my parents in nantes10:59
kwwiiTonio_: good for you, I hope it was nice10:59
Tonio_apokryphos: oups sorry, "working" was the good one :)10:59
Tonio_kwwii: it is yes, I'll stay there until 02/0110:59
jpetsokwwii: oh. er. i think i made an error. forget it for now, sorry.10:59
apokryphostm_t had it built some time ago IIRC, but he doesn't seem to be around lately10:59
jpetsokwwii: anyways, i wonder why there are no edit_add and edit_remove icons in kdelibs anymore11:00
jpetsomaybe they were never there and were living in another module11:01
jpetsoer, scrap that11:01
Tonio_apokryphos: kickoff requires kmenubase.h, which I couldn't find anywhere....11:02
kwwiijpetso: :-)11:02
kwwiinow you see11:02
jpetsokwwii: seems i'm slightly puzzled at the moment because there is a plus icon, but not a related minus icon11:03
jpetsokwwii: and the plus icon is named differently in kdelibs and in Oxygen11:03
kwwiiwell, that list is the first of such...so do no expect too much11:07
kwwiiwe still have a long way to go11:07
mhbthose battery/ac messages in Edgy/Feisty are provided by guidance-power-manager?11:11
mhbcan we make them translatable?11:13
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jpetsokwwii: i've reviewed the Action icons in the wiki, they should be ok now11:43
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kwwiijpetso: what did you change?11:47
jpetsokwwii: just a few things, the history is maybe best for the diffs: http://developernew.kde.org/index.php?title=Projects/Oxygen/namingSpec&action=history11:47
kwwiicool11:48
jpetsokwwii: seems i don't have an account, maybe i should get one11:48
kwwiimight hellp11:48
kwwiihelp11:49
kwwiianyway11:49
kwwiitime for bed11:49
kwwiisee you soon I hope11:49
jpetsokwwii: sure11:50
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