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| troy_s | greets elkbuntu | 04:23 |
|---|---|---|
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| Winter-1 | hey | 07:17 |
| familyfriendly | yo | 07:17 |
| Winter-1 | but yea u want something great | 07:18 |
| familyfriendly | do you think we should still with the current colour scheme? | 07:18 |
| familyfriendly | vista and macos are going with more gunmetal looks | 07:19 |
| Winter-1 | well i like the sleek black and white but at the same time i think of color for ubuntu so we should bring both to the table | 07:20 |
| familyfriendly | well i guess the brown tones come from that fact ubuntu has allot to do with the notion "humanity towards others" | 07:20 |
| Winter-1 | yes | 07:21 |
| familyfriendly | so i def see a place for keeping the current scheme | 07:21 |
| Winter-1 | see i wish i had photoshop so i could do some mock-ups | 07:21 |
| familyfriendly | what kinda mock-ups are you thinking of? | 07:22 |
| familyfriendly | a while back i play with colours | 07:22 |
| Winter-1 | well i wanna go into PS and start making examples of what i want things to look like | 07:22 |
| Winter-1 | tthen from there i could start creating it | 07:22 |
| Winter-1 | but i want a plan | 07:22 |
| familyfriendly | what apps would you want to have as a starting point | 07:23 |
| familyfriendly | ? | 07:23 |
| Winter-1 | ? | 07:24 |
| familyfriendly | as far as mock-ups are concerned, like would you want to just start with a wallpaper ... that kind of thing | 07:24 |
| Winter-1 | i would start with windows and color and taskbar | 07:25 |
| Winter-1 | i dont like how ubuntu is laid out | 07:25 |
| familyfriendly | ok, by windows you mean windown border? | 07:25 |
| Winter-1 | yea | 07:25 |
| familyfriendly | ok | 07:26 |
| Winter-1 | border button layout etc | 07:26 |
| Winter-1 | i wish gnome would change over to the emerald theme engine | 07:29 |
| Winter-1 | or at least ubuntu | 07:30 |
| BHSPitLappy | yawn | 07:35 |
| Winter-1 | lol | 07:35 |
| BHSPitLappy | Winter-1, stop bitching about photoshop! | 07:35 |
| BHSPitLappy | name the task you're trying to do that hangs you up when you try it in gimp. | 07:36 |
| Winter-1 | i dunno i just cant use it | 07:36 |
| BHSPitLappy | that doesn't make sense to me, though | 07:36 |
| BHSPitLappy | they're so similarly used | 07:36 |
| BHSPitLappy | make something in inkscape, then | 07:37 |
| familyfriendly | i actually dont like beryl | 07:39 |
| Winter-1 | i do but dont | 07:39 |
| troy_s | familyfriendly: well i guess the brown tones come from that fact ubuntu has allot to do with the notion "humanity towards others" | 07:44 |
| troy_s | you would think so, but it has more to do with sepia -- it was a happy accident | 07:44 |
| familyfriendly | really | 07:47 |
| troy_s | according to sab, yes. | 07:47 |
| troy_s | although i would agree with you | 07:48 |
| troy_s | it 'works' for the reason you mention | 07:48 |
| troy_s | although the 'ubuntu design' front is non-existent, so it is pure fluke. | 07:48 |
| familyfriendly | lol | 07:48 |
| familyfriendly | yea i agree | 07:48 |
| troy_s | it is horribly unfortunate | 07:48 |
| troy_s | but again, that sort of thing starts at the top | 07:49 |
| troy_s | _cohesive_ art and design just simply isn't tackled in the free software community the way code is. | 07:49 |
| troy_s | i think it will get there, the more attention the basic mechanics get attention (read tools) | 07:49 |
| familyfriendly | someone in i think it stems fromt he fact that ubuntu is more of aggregatior of projects, so artwork, particularly icons are by nature inconsistant ... but i think default background and borders could do with some work. | 07:57 |
| BHSPitLappy | it works for me, but if it could produce the same appeal that Apple products are known to deliver, or that Vista is said to have, so much the better | 07:59 |
| troy_s | rather everything needs a fundamental design plan. | 07:59 |
| troy_s | BHSPitLappy: that isn't going to happen without a solid plan | 07:59 |
| BHSPitLappy | mmhmm | 07:59 |
| troy_s | BHSPitLappy: Apple's design team is given a _lot_ of power. | 08:00 |
| BHSPitLappy | I actually really liked the earth tones approach | 08:00 |
| troy_s | and they do their job. | 08:00 |
| troy_s | BHSPitLappy: relating to what? | 08:00 |
| troy_s | earth tones and ubuntu is a _NO BRAINER_ | 08:00 |
| BHSPitLappy | mmhmm... | 08:00 |
| troy_s | unfortunately, it will take apple and ms to do the bloody thing before sabdfl will believe it. | 08:00 |
| troy_s | everyone goes plastic, ubuntu should go earth. | 08:00 |
| BHSPitLappy | when I first switched to ubuntu, I was really pleased by the brownedness | 08:00 |
| troy_s | yep. it is a wonderful spectrum if you build on it. | 08:01 |
| familyfriendly | my main complaint is that the default ubuntu them is really chunky | 08:01 |
| troy_s | indeed ;) | 08:01 |
| BHSPitLappy | although I feel the shift from there to orange, as well | 08:01 |
| familyfriendly | i dont like plastic either | 08:01 |
| troy_s | i agree with you 100% plastic is passee | 08:01 |
| BHSPitLappy | very vibrant | 08:01 |
| troy_s | very very very done. | 08:01 |
| familyfriendly | murrine is a good starting point in my opinion, but with diff cooursa | 08:01 |
| BHSPitLappy | makes the computer less mechanical | 08:01 |
| troy_s | too gloss | 08:02 |
| troy_s | murrine is just another glossy engine | 08:02 |
| troy_s | dborg__ has a wonderful engine in place in Lua, hopefully it will get the deserved attention. | 08:02 |
| BHSPitLappy | it's really a tricky field, design. | 08:02 |
| troy_s | BHSPitLappy: couldn't agree with you more. although earth is generally not too vibrant -- more into the pastels. | 08:02 |
| troy_s | BHSPitLappy: everyone bikesheds about it, very few actually put the time in to study it. | 08:03 |
| troy_s | it seems everyone is an expert. | 08:03 |
| BHSPitLappy | troy_s, my wallpaper http://gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=48185 | 08:03 |
| familyfriendly | well i like the squareness of murrine, im not really a fan of the rounded edges | 08:03 |
| familyfriendly | anywas i have t go | 08:04 |
| familyfriendly | ciao | 08:04 |
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| BHSPitLappy | later... | 08:04 |
| troy_s | alas, i must too bed. | 08:05 |
| BHSPitLappy | you know what would be nice? | 08:05 |
| troy_s | BHSPitLappy: you should get involved with a theming project. | 08:05 |
| BHSPitLappy | if a teacher or professor of a good design class pitched ubuntu as an assignment | 08:05 |
| BHSPitLappy | we might get some good stuff out of that ;) | 08:05 |
| troy_s | wouldn't matter | 08:05 |
| BHSPitLappy | I'm aware | 08:06 |
| BHSPitLappy | I dunno what I could offer a theming project. | 08:06 |
| troy_s | i could probably rally some folks like that, but ultimately it is sab's aesthetics, and he doesn't really work within the same parameters that we should be. | 08:06 |
| BHSPitLappy | when I said "my wallpaper" I didn't mean it literally | 08:06 |
| troy_s | by theming i mean a project that works towards a goal. | 08:06 |
| troy_s | ah. | 08:06 |
| BHSPitLappy | yeah... | 08:06 |
| troy_s | well art and design needs more than folks who can push pixels or sketch. | 08:07 |
| BHSPitLappy | I pitched Edgy login/logout sounds | 08:07 |
| troy_s | it takes a full team with coding, sounds etc. | 08:07 |
| BHSPitLappy | they were latecomers, and I think sab wanted a different direction. | 08:07 |
| troy_s | i think we will eventually get there, but sabdfl needs to acknowledge that perhaps there are others out there who might handle the fort better than he. | 08:07 |
| BHSPitLappy | I'm adept at graphic art, but I'm more useful probably when it comes to music and composition. | 08:07 |
| troy_s | it might happen at some point. | 08:07 |
| BHSPitLappy | I was displeased with the edgy sound set. | 08:08 |
| troy_s | well the problem was that i was deeply interested in getting a 'sound department' going | 08:08 |
| BHSPitLappy | I have my share of nitpicks with the login/logout that was chosen | 08:08 |
| troy_s | and the takers were few. | 08:08 |
| BHSPitLappy | yeah | 08:08 |
| BHSPitLappy | I'm in the launchpad group | 08:08 |
| troy_s | unfortunately, when we developed a good deal of momentum | 08:08 |
| BHSPitLappy | in came the hammer? | 08:09 |
| troy_s | sabdfl decided to take the route he currently has. | 08:09 |
| BHSPitLappy | mmhmm. | 08:09 |
| troy_s | well the problem is that the entire system was designed around him | 08:09 |
| troy_s | to make decisions at checkpoints | 08:09 |
| BHSPitLappy | he's a fickle "leader". | 08:09 |
| troy_s | but alas, he simply doesn't know what to do. | 08:09 |
| troy_s | actually he is a damn bright guy with a great vision. | 08:09 |
| troy_s | that said, art and design aren't perhaps his suit. | 08:09 |
| troy_s | without sabdfl, Ubuntu would be zero. | 08:10 |
| BHSPitLappy | mmhmm | 08:10 |
| BHSPitLappy | and I'd be using mandriva or something else | 08:10 |
| troy_s | so for that, i utterly respect him. that said, i also share my component of disagreements with him. | 08:10 |
| BHSPitLappy | he is, after all, a human being. | 08:10 |
| troy_s | at some point, perhaps the tide will turn a little. | 08:10 |
| troy_s | indeed. | 08:10 |
| troy_s | anyways, nice chat. i must put the grey matter on a pillow. | 08:10 |
| troy_s | what is left of it. | 08:10 |
| BHSPitLappy | night | 08:10 |
| troy_s | night BHSPitLappy | 08:10 |
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| familyfriendly | yoyoy | 09:34 |
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| BHSPitLappy | yoyoyoyo | 10:13 |
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| lapo | yo | 10:55 |
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| coz_ | morning all | 05:21 |
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| TheSheep | http://morguefile.com/archive/?display=145617& | 05:43 |
| TheSheep | could make a nice wallpaper for ubuntu... | 05:43 |
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| troy_s | TheSheep: Little literal. | 08:47 |
| troy_s | and quite contrasty | 08:47 |
| troy_s | in terms of functionality | 08:47 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: I had a similar one on my desktop for the last week for testing | 08:51 |
| troy_s | It is a tad on the contrasty. Although it does play into savanna preference :) | 08:51 |
| troy_s | (That is probably at wikipedia if you don't know what it is) | 08:51 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: http://www.gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=41252 | 08:51 |
| troy_s | still too contrasty | 08:52 |
| troy_s | you should be able to move an icon or window across any area of the screen and have it legible / note window edges. | 08:52 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: that's why I mean -- it wans't bad on my eyes | 08:52 |
| troy_s | It is pretty | 08:52 |
| troy_s | but in terms of wallpaper might be heavy | 08:52 |
| troy_s | (just think about it plastered all over your walls in a home) | 08:52 |
| TheSheep | ah | 08:53 |
| TheSheep | maybe for login screen ;) | 08:53 |
| troy_s | I find that the analogy principle works well as you can quickly see how something gets a little 'heavy' when placed out of context and into another role | 08:54 |
| TheSheep | :) | 08:57 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: what do you think of those? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Desktop/Feisty/Incoming | 08:57 |
| troy_s | Opposite end of the spectrum in my opinion | 08:57 |
| troy_s | They communicate nothing. | 08:57 |
| troy_s | as they are basically a 'no desktop wallpaper' with a colour on them. | 08:58 |
| troy_s | Looks like josef is using metacity-2 extensions on the last screenshot | 09:00 |
| troy_s | metacity2 provides for six or seven buttons... too much in my opinion for a non power user. | 09:00 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: that's not metacity | 09:01 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: it's xfwm4 | 09:01 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: and the bottom one is Beryl | 09:01 |
| troy_s | the six buttons would be the window manager though | 09:01 |
| troy_s | iirc | 09:02 |
| troy_s | it should at least be handled by it... as per metacity2. | 09:02 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: beryl, xfwm4 and metacity are different window managers | 09:02 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: actually, beryl uses a separate 'window decorator' called emerald for handling window decorations | 09:03 |
| troy_s | does beryl handle all of the window managing however? | 09:03 |
| troy_s | i was under the impression that it was more on top of it. | 09:03 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: no, it's a window manager | 09:03 |
| troy_s | interesting. | 09:03 |
| troy_s | seems foolish to accomplish something that silly with an entire window manager when something like e17 does much of that functionality without hardware accell. | 09:04 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: the point was to use hw accel, not to accomplish all that ;) | 09:05 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: myself, I use a hw-accelerated window manager with all the special effects disabled -- just because it's faster and easier on the cpu | 09:05 |
| troy_s | indeed | 09:08 |
| troy_s | Well if you care, we can accomplish most of that (aside from the antialising with the active root window / subjects) | 09:08 |
| troy_s | with metacity | 09:08 |
| troy_s | metacity 2 allows for a power user setup with more buttons | 09:08 |
| troy_s | (like sticky, shade/unshade, etc.) | 09:09 |
| troy_s | TheSheep: Can you code? | 09:10 |
| troy_s | Namely python | 09:10 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: yes | 09:10 |
| troy_s | Awsome | 09:10 |
| troy_s | Have you ever coded a python applet? | 09:10 |
| troy_s | for the panel? | 09:10 |
| TheSheep | no, I only have a lot of experience with web apps, roguelike games and gtk | 09:10 |
| troy_s | Do you know python? | 09:11 |
| TheSheep | *some gtk | 09:11 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: yes | 09:11 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: http://sheep.art.pl <-- that's me | 09:11 |
| troy_s | I intend to use python for the panel applets for the countless reasons that make is viable. | 09:11 |
| troy_s | do you have the link for the applet tutorial in python? | 09:11 |
| troy_s | it would allow us to delve into interface issues without borking the rest of bun | 09:11 |
| TheSheep | http://www.pygtk.org/articles/applets_arturogf/ | 09:12 |
| troy_s | Hey another warhammer fan :) | 09:13 |
| troy_s | nice to see. | 09:13 |
| troy_s | (covers up his horribly geek side again) | 09:13 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: I'm more into necromunda actually... | 09:13 |
| TheSheep | http://www.gnome.org/~tvachon/doc/tutorial.html | 09:13 |
| troy_s | Great | 09:15 |
| troy_s | two steps basically -- the app syntax and the OAF file for the servers | 09:16 |
| TheSheep | troy_s: do you have any particular panels in mind? | 09:16 |
| troy_s | Well yes... | 09:16 |
| troy_s | let me pm you | 09:16 |
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| BHSPitLappy | yo, familyfriendly | 10:54 |
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| familyfriendly | howsit | 11:59 |
| BHSPitLappy | itsgood | 12:00 |
| familyfriendly | so is the art team active for feisty after edgy? | 12:01 |
| troy_s | No | 12:02 |
| troy_s | Not for the actual release anyways. | 12:02 |
| familyfriendly | hrmmm | 12:03 |
| troy_s | nature of the beast | 12:04 |
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