=== PWill [n=paul@cpe-24-208-190-43.columbus.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === rrittenhouse [n=tad@cpe-76-188-35-66.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === BHSPitLappy [n=steve-o@adsl-65-69-152-153.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === elkbuntu [n=melissa@ubuntu/member/elkbuntu] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [04:23] greets elkbuntu === familyfriendly [n=matthew_@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === Winter-1 [n=joe@c-67-164-219-40.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [07:17] hey [07:17] yo [07:18] but yea u want something great [07:18] do you think we should still with the current colour scheme? [07:19] vista and macos are going with more gunmetal looks [07:20] well i like the sleek black and white but at the same time i think of color for ubuntu so we should bring both to the table [07:20] well i guess the brown tones come from that fact ubuntu has allot to do with the notion "humanity towards others" [07:21] yes [07:21] so i def see a place for keeping the current scheme [07:21] see i wish i had photoshop so i could do some mock-ups [07:22] what kinda mock-ups are you thinking of? [07:22] a while back i play with colours [07:22] well i wanna go into PS and start making examples of what i want things to look like [07:22] tthen from there i could start creating it [07:22] but i want a plan [07:23] what apps would you want to have as a starting point [07:23] ? [07:24] ? [07:24] as far as mock-ups are concerned, like would you want to just start with a wallpaper ... that kind of thing [07:25] i would start with windows and color and taskbar [07:25] i dont like how ubuntu is laid out [07:25] ok, by windows you mean windown border? [07:25] yea [07:26] ok [07:26] border button layout etc [07:29] i wish gnome would change over to the emerald theme engine [07:30] or at least ubuntu [07:35] yawn [07:35] lol [07:35] Winter-1, stop bitching about photoshop! [07:36] name the task you're trying to do that hangs you up when you try it in gimp. [07:36] i dunno i just cant use it [07:36] that doesn't make sense to me, though [07:36] they're so similarly used [07:37] make something in inkscape, then [07:39] i actually dont like beryl [07:39] i do but dont [07:44] familyfriendly: well i guess the brown tones come from that fact ubuntu has allot to do with the notion "humanity towards others" [07:44] you would think so, but it has more to do with sepia -- it was a happy accident [07:47] really [07:47] according to sab, yes. [07:48] although i would agree with you [07:48] it 'works' for the reason you mention [07:48] although the 'ubuntu design' front is non-existent, so it is pure fluke. [07:48] lol [07:48] yea i agree [07:48] it is horribly unfortunate [07:49] but again, that sort of thing starts at the top [07:49] _cohesive_ art and design just simply isn't tackled in the free software community the way code is. [07:49] i think it will get there, the more attention the basic mechanics get attention (read tools) [07:57] someone in i think it stems fromt he fact that ubuntu is more of aggregatior of projects, so artwork, particularly icons are by nature inconsistant ... but i think default background and borders could do with some work. [07:59] it works for me, but if it could produce the same appeal that Apple products are known to deliver, or that Vista is said to have, so much the better [07:59] rather everything needs a fundamental design plan. [07:59] BHSPitLappy: that isn't going to happen without a solid plan [07:59] mmhmm [08:00] BHSPitLappy: Apple's design team is given a _lot_ of power. [08:00] I actually really liked the earth tones approach [08:00] and they do their job. [08:00] BHSPitLappy: relating to what? [08:00] earth tones and ubuntu is a _NO BRAINER_ [08:00] mmhmm... [08:00] unfortunately, it will take apple and ms to do the bloody thing before sabdfl will believe it. [08:00] everyone goes plastic, ubuntu should go earth. [08:00] when I first switched to ubuntu, I was really pleased by the brownedness [08:01] yep. it is a wonderful spectrum if you build on it. [08:01] my main complaint is that the default ubuntu them is really chunky [08:01] indeed ;) [08:01] although I feel the shift from there to orange, as well [08:01] i dont like plastic either [08:01] i agree with you 100% plastic is passee [08:01] very vibrant [08:01] very very very done. [08:01] murrine is a good starting point in my opinion, but with diff cooursa [08:01] makes the computer less mechanical [08:02] too gloss [08:02] murrine is just another glossy engine [08:02] dborg__ has a wonderful engine in place in Lua, hopefully it will get the deserved attention. [08:02] it's really a tricky field, design. [08:02] BHSPitLappy: couldn't agree with you more. although earth is generally not too vibrant -- more into the pastels. [08:03] BHSPitLappy: everyone bikesheds about it, very few actually put the time in to study it. [08:03] it seems everyone is an expert. [08:03] troy_s, my wallpaper http://gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=48185 [08:03] well i like the squareness of murrine, im not really a fan of the rounded edges [08:04] anywas i have t go [08:04] ciao === familyfriendly [n=matthew_@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has left #ubuntu-artwork [] [08:04] later... [08:05] alas, i must too bed. [08:05] you know what would be nice? [08:05] BHSPitLappy: you should get involved with a theming project. [08:05] if a teacher or professor of a good design class pitched ubuntu as an assignment [08:05] we might get some good stuff out of that ;) [08:05] wouldn't matter [08:06] I'm aware [08:06] I dunno what I could offer a theming project. [08:06] i could probably rally some folks like that, but ultimately it is sab's aesthetics, and he doesn't really work within the same parameters that we should be. [08:06] when I said "my wallpaper" I didn't mean it literally [08:06] by theming i mean a project that works towards a goal. [08:06] ah. [08:06] yeah... [08:07] well art and design needs more than folks who can push pixels or sketch. [08:07] I pitched Edgy login/logout sounds [08:07] it takes a full team with coding, sounds etc. [08:07] they were latecomers, and I think sab wanted a different direction. [08:07] i think we will eventually get there, but sabdfl needs to acknowledge that perhaps there are others out there who might handle the fort better than he. [08:07] I'm adept at graphic art, but I'm more useful probably when it comes to music and composition. [08:07] it might happen at some point. [08:08] I was displeased with the edgy sound set. [08:08] well the problem was that i was deeply interested in getting a 'sound department' going [08:08] I have my share of nitpicks with the login/logout that was chosen [08:08] and the takers were few. [08:08] yeah [08:08] I'm in the launchpad group [08:08] unfortunately, when we developed a good deal of momentum [08:09] in came the hammer? [08:09] sabdfl decided to take the route he currently has. [08:09] mmhmm. [08:09] well the problem is that the entire system was designed around him [08:09] to make decisions at checkpoints [08:09] he's a fickle "leader". [08:09] but alas, he simply doesn't know what to do. [08:09] actually he is a damn bright guy with a great vision. [08:09] that said, art and design aren't perhaps his suit. [08:10] without sabdfl, Ubuntu would be zero. [08:10] mmhmm [08:10] and I'd be using mandriva or something else [08:10] so for that, i utterly respect him. that said, i also share my component of disagreements with him. [08:10] he is, after all, a human being. [08:10] at some point, perhaps the tide will turn a little. [08:10] indeed. [08:10] anyways, nice chat. i must put the grey matter on a pillow. [08:10] what is left of it. [08:10] night [08:10] night BHSPitLappy === familyfriendly [n=matthew_@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === familyfriendly [n=matthew_@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [09:34] yoyoy === familyfriendly [n=matthew_@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has left #ubuntu-artwork [] === elkbuntu_ [n=melissa@ppp244-252.lns3.syd6.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [10:13] yoyoyoyo === familyfriendly [n=mmcg069@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === wedderburn [n=andrew@d220-238-221-94.dsl.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === wedderburn [n=andrew@d220-238-221-94.dsl.vic.optusnet.com.au] has left #ubuntu-artwork [] === familyfriendly [n=mmcg069@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has left #ubuntu-artwork [] === familyfriendly [n=matthew_@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === lapo [n=lapo@host102-254-static.189-82-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [10:55] yo === familyfriendly [n=matthew_@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has left #ubuntu-artwork [] === familyfriendly [n=matthew_@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === PWill [n=paul@cpe-24-208-190-43.columbus.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === KaiL [n=KaiL@p548F6681.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === dborg_ [n=daniel@e182057228.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === bersace [n=bersace@did75-13-82-243-217-90.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === bersace [n=bersace@did75-13-82-243-217-90.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === dborg__ [n=daniel@e181162157.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === coz_ [n=coz_@pool-151-201-27-176.pitt.east.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [05:21] morning all === coz_ [n=coz_@pool-151-201-27-176.pitt.east.verizon.net] has left #ubuntu-artwork ["Leaving"] [05:43] http://morguefile.com/archive/?display=145617& [05:43] could make a nice wallpaper for ubuntu... === rrittenhouse [n=tad@cpe-76-188-35-66.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === nixternal [n=nixterna@ubuntu/member/nixternal] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === andreasn [n=andreas@h101n1fls31o839.telia.com] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === lizardking [n=lizardki@host182-121-dynamic.17-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === msikma [n=Msikma@s55933ad4.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === coz_ [n=coz_@pool-151-201-27-176.pitt.east.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === coz_ [n=coz_@pool-151-201-27-176.pitt.east.verizon.net] has left #ubuntu-artwork ["Leaving"] === PseudoPlacebo [n=Placebo@user-0ceveb4.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [08:47] TheSheep: Little literal. [08:47] and quite contrasty [08:47] in terms of functionality [08:51] troy_s: I had a similar one on my desktop for the last week for testing [08:51] It is a tad on the contrasty. Although it does play into savanna preference :) [08:51] (That is probably at wikipedia if you don't know what it is) [08:51] troy_s: http://www.gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=41252 [08:52] still too contrasty [08:52] you should be able to move an icon or window across any area of the screen and have it legible / note window edges. [08:52] troy_s: that's why I mean -- it wans't bad on my eyes [08:52] It is pretty [08:52] but in terms of wallpaper might be heavy [08:52] (just think about it plastered all over your walls in a home) [08:53] ah [08:53] maybe for login screen ;) [08:54] I find that the analogy principle works well as you can quickly see how something gets a little 'heavy' when placed out of context and into another role [08:57] :) [08:57] troy_s: what do you think of those? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Desktop/Feisty/Incoming [08:57] Opposite end of the spectrum in my opinion [08:57] They communicate nothing. [08:58] as they are basically a 'no desktop wallpaper' with a colour on them. [09:00] Looks like josef is using metacity-2 extensions on the last screenshot [09:00] metacity2 provides for six or seven buttons... too much in my opinion for a non power user. [09:01] troy_s: that's not metacity [09:01] troy_s: it's xfwm4 [09:01] troy_s: and the bottom one is Beryl [09:01] the six buttons would be the window manager though [09:02] iirc [09:02] it should at least be handled by it... as per metacity2. [09:02] troy_s: beryl, xfwm4 and metacity are different window managers [09:03] troy_s: actually, beryl uses a separate 'window decorator' called emerald for handling window decorations [09:03] does beryl handle all of the window managing however? [09:03] i was under the impression that it was more on top of it. [09:03] troy_s: no, it's a window manager [09:03] interesting. [09:04] seems foolish to accomplish something that silly with an entire window manager when something like e17 does much of that functionality without hardware accell. [09:05] troy_s: the point was to use hw accel, not to accomplish all that ;) [09:05] troy_s: myself, I use a hw-accelerated window manager with all the special effects disabled -- just because it's faster and easier on the cpu [09:08] indeed [09:08] Well if you care, we can accomplish most of that (aside from the antialising with the active root window / subjects) [09:08] with metacity [09:08] metacity 2 allows for a power user setup with more buttons [09:09] (like sticky, shade/unshade, etc.) [09:10] TheSheep: Can you code? [09:10] Namely python [09:10] troy_s: yes [09:10] Awsome [09:10] Have you ever coded a python applet? [09:10] for the panel? [09:10] no, I only have a lot of experience with web apps, roguelike games and gtk [09:11] Do you know python? [09:11] *some gtk [09:11] troy_s: yes [09:11] troy_s: http://sheep.art.pl <-- that's me [09:11] I intend to use python for the panel applets for the countless reasons that make is viable. [09:11] do you have the link for the applet tutorial in python? [09:11] it would allow us to delve into interface issues without borking the rest of bun [09:12] http://www.pygtk.org/articles/applets_arturogf/ [09:13] Hey another warhammer fan :) [09:13] nice to see. [09:13] (covers up his horribly geek side again) [09:13] troy_s: I'm more into necromunda actually... [09:13] http://www.gnome.org/~tvachon/doc/tutorial.html [09:15] Great [09:16] two steps basically -- the app syntax and the OAF file for the servers [09:16] troy_s: do you have any particular panels in mind? [09:16] Well yes... [09:16] let me pm you === familyfriendly [n=matthew_@125-236-130-37.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [10:54] yo, familyfriendly === frognu [n=frognu@ANancy-157-1-125-149.w90-6.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [11:59] howsit [12:00] itsgood [12:01] so is the art team active for feisty after edgy? [12:02] No [12:02] Not for the actual release anyways. [12:03] hrmmm [12:04] nature of the beast