/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2007/01/17/#edubuntu.txt

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=== Topic for #edubuntu: Order: http://shipit.edubuntu.org || Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu || http://www.edubuntu.org | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuWiki | MEETING: every Wednesday see http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuMeetingAgenda | edgy (6.10) is released ! grab it while its hot ! http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/edgy/ | Upgraders see: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuLTSPUpgradeNotes
=== Topic (#edubuntu): set by Seveas at Sun Nov 26 18:00:58 2006
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cbx33ping ogra sent you a mail....10:01
cbx33comments please when yo uare available10:01
cbx33I need a little guidence before I can continue10:01
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willvdlola12:39
highvoltage'ola12:41
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juliuxhi, can somebody test something with the ltsp-build-client skript?01:38
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cbx33ping ogra01:43
ogracbx33, pong01:50
ograjuliux, whats wrong ?01:51
cbx33ogra: did you get my mail?01:51
ogracbx33, yep01:51
cbx33cool01:51
cbx33does it look ok?01:51
ogracbx33, the idea was to have something like an SCP class we can import into either kind of frontend01:51
cbx33oh01:51
cbx33that's how I've done it01:52
cbx33but then01:52
juliuxogra, if i run the ltps-build-client with the --mirror option and i added my mirror with the name and not the ip, i get an error that it can resolve the name01:52
cbx33how will that work if we're aiming for this multiple server control01:52
ograthe class should only provide the functions ...01:53
ograwhat i mean is that you dont need an scp-backend ... but import the class into some kind of frontend .... be it curses, gtk or kde01:54
cbx33ok01:54
ogralook how Amaranth did it in  willow01:54
cbx33yeh i've done that....01:54
Amaranthoops01:54
Amaranthogra: what's wrong with willowng in feisty?01:55
cbx33ogra: so....thats fine01:55
ograi'm doing something similar to ltsp-manager atm01:55
cbx33but01:55
cbx33how is the multiple server control going to work?01:55
Amaranthother than the broken error pages01:55
=== Amaranth might look at that today
ograyou will have a server tool that attaches to the class ....01:55
Amaranthand at least poke the gconf bits to make epiphany use it01:55
ograto which you connect over the network01:56
cbx33ah right01:56
cbx33hmmm01:56
cbx33so we need to setup a port for it to communicate over etc01:57
ograactually thats only another frontend but reading and writing is done from the net01:57
cbx33and design a protocol?01:57
ograno01:57
ograwe have ssh01:57
ograas the spec describes ...01:57
cbx33yeh, I kinda got lost a little....sorry01:57
cbx33I don't want to make the same mistake as I did last time01:57
cbx33if you remember01:58
ograwell, much of that was caused by the poor spec01:58
cbx33so01:58
cbx33how will the new gui01:58
cbx33contact the server backend on a remote server?01:58
ograwhat i want to be able to do is have a script like that:01:58
ogra#!/usr/bin/python01:59
ograimport SCPClass01:59
ograuserlist=SCPClass.list_users()01:59
ograprint userlist01:59
cbx33yes that's how I've done it02:00
ogranow i can call the above script via ssh and will get the userlist returned02:00
cbx33oh i see02:01
cbx33ok....02:01
cbx33so....how is that script called?02:01
ograpick a name :)02:01
ograi really dont care ...02:01
cbx33where does the script reside02:01
cbx33or is it dynamically generated?02:01
ograthats the script you write as network backend ...02:02
Amaranthoh, the config GUI is broken :/02:02
cbx33surely then I'd need many of these scripts?02:02
highvoltageogra: I once asked a colluege what a host name should be for a machine, and he said "Pick a scientist", and I made the hostname 'pickascientist', so be careful what you tell people with little sleep :p02:02
ogracbx33, nope ... just make one and add switches02:02
cbx33heheh02:02
cbx33ogra: ok02:02
cbx33that's what I thought02:02
cbx33excellent02:02
cbx33ok that's that sorted02:03
cbx33I'll be working on that tomrorow02:03
cbx33I think I can implement that without too much trouble02:03
ograwhat i wanted to point out is that most if not all SCP related stuff should just be importable as a class or module02:03
cbx33yes02:03
cbx33it is02:03
ograi'm fine with keeping the old name in the backends btw ...02:04
cbx33I'll send you the source if you're interested in what I've done so far....02:04
cbx33right ok02:04
ograjuliux, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/7248202:04
ograi havent fixed that one yet02:04
cbx33oh and where is our docs for how to update a thinclient nfs root?02:04
cbx33ogra thanks again for all the help.....did my recommendations of what I can and can't do seem reasonable?02:05
ograis the documentation ? beyond the release notes/upgrade notes ?02:05
juliuxogra, thxs02:05
ogracbx33, well, why do you think the screen locking will be complicated ?02:05
cbx33the gui implementation won't02:05
ograthat should be one function and another button ... not more02:05
cbx33but I'm talking abotu the backend02:06
cbx33the vnx11 stuff02:06
ograneither the backend ...02:06
juliuxogra, the funny thing is if i use de.archive.ubuntu.com then everything is ok, but if the dns entry is in /etc/hosts it fails02:06
ograthe screen locking has nothing to do with vnc02:06
cbx33oh02:06
cbx33screen locking no02:06
cbx33that could be a dbus call to the exec function to run the lock program right?02:06
ograits only a call to gnome-screensaver-command --lock02:06
cbx33but....02:07
cbx33it can't be caled as the user02:07
ograwhy ?02:07
cbx33else they'll be able to unlock02:07
ograthats fine02:07
cbx33but isn't that pointless?02:07
ograno02:07
ograwell, you culd set the gconf key if you urgently want them locked out ...02:07
cbx33explain02:07
ografor now i'm fine with the option to block access ... if you teach and someone starts typing after you locked you knw he tries to unlock02:08
cbx33ok02:08
ograif you have a better idea then feel free ...02:08
cbx33we'll implement like that for now02:08
cbx33do you want unlock too?02:09
ograif possible, yes02:09
ograthat might need a script killing the g-ss daemon and restarting it ...02:09
ogra(not sure g-ss-command has an overriding function for the lock)02:10
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cbx33hmmm02:11
cbx33would killing the gss not work?02:12
=== cbx33 will try a few ways
cbx33for now locking is most important02:12
ograkilling would indeed work, but is ugly02:13
cbx33in what way?02:13
cbx33we kill the clients session right?02:13
ograno, you kill gnome-screensaver and start it again ... that will unlock ...02:13
cbx33oh02:14
ograit doesnt touch the running session02:14
Amaranth  -d, --deactivate           If the screensaver is active then deactivate it (un-blank the screen)02:14
cbx33no i meant to log them out02:14
Amaranthgnome-screensaver-command -d02:14
cbx33we kill their session02:14
ograAmaranth, not sure it works with locked screens02:14
ogracbx33, why would you want to lock them out if you just want to unblank02:15
ogras/lock/log/02:15
Amaranthogra: it does02:15
Amaranthgnome-screensaver-command -a && sleep 10 && gnome-screensaver-command -d02:15
ograah, cool02:15
Amaranththat works02:15
ogracbx33, ^^^02:15
cbx33excellent02:15
ograso just call gnome-screensaver-command --lock/--deactivate02:16
cbx33ok excellent02:16
Amaranththere is no --lock02:16
ogra(use the long options in the script, so a coder doesnt need to look them up in the manpage)02:16
Amaranthit's -a/--activate02:16
cbx33ok02:17
cbx33there is no manpage02:17
cbx33is there?02:17
ograogra@edubuntu:~/python-ltsp$ LANG=C gnome-screensaver-command --help|grep lock02:17
ogra  -l, --lock                 Tells the running screensaver process to lock the screen immediately02:17
ograAmaranth, ^^02:17
cbx33yup works a treat02:17
cbx33gnome-screensaver-command -l && sleep 10 && gnome-screensaver-command -d02:17
Amaranthah02:17
Amaranth--activate probably won't do it if you've got something calling inhibit02:18
ograright02:18
Amaranthand --lock says "screw that, we're locking down" :)02:18
Amaranthisn't all of this just a wrapper around the dbus api?02:18
cbx33it would be nice to have02:18
cbx33-l <password>02:18
cbx33hehe02:18
ograwell, then you need to hack pam02:19
cbx33screw it02:19
cbx33at least for now anyway02:19
cbx33;)02:19
cbx33I have too much else to worry about02:19
cbx33i thought about running it as another user...02:19
cbx33but that probably wouldn't work would it02:19
ograthat gets very tricky02:19
cbx33yeh02:19
ogradbus wont like it and yu need to fiddle around with xauth02:20
cbx33ok we'll stick with this for now02:20
cbx33yeh02:20
cbx33assistance applet will be ok, just need to possibly implement a seperate part of the bus02:21
cbx33so that clients can write back to it02:21
ogrado you have our priority list we made last meeting ?02:21
cbx33for SCP?02:21
ograi thought the applet was low prio02:21
cbx33no, I was at BETT, will go checking for minutes02:21
cbx33ok02:21
cbx33good02:22
cbx33;)02:22
ogracbx33, you and me had a 1h meeting where we went over the spec, remember ?02:22
cbx33oh02:22
cbx33yes...sorry02:22
ograway before BETT02:22
cbx33i thought you meant edubuntu meeting02:22
ogranope02:22
ograbtw02:22
ograwillvdl, ping02:22
willvdlogra pong02:23
ograwillvdl, i wont be able to make the meeting tonight, can you run it ?02:23
willvdlsure.02:23
ograRichEd is still at LCA ... so it might be pretty quiet anyway .... artwork and doc centric02:23
willvdlRichEd also away at LCA so I guess it's an SCP, doc and artwork meeting :)02:23
willvdlsnap02:24
cbx33because I don't have it here, it's at home....what bits are of high priority02:24
ograright ...02:24
ogranot sure what kind of tech stuff rodarvus wants to tell though02:24
Amaranth@now Chicago02:24
UbugtuCurrent time in America/Chicago: January 17 2007, 07:24:3302:24
ogracbx33, i dont have it here either, will need to dig the logs ...02:24
Amaranthmeh, it's supposed to show the next meeting02:24
Amaranth@schedule Chicago02:24
Amaranthi give up02:25
cbx33ok02:25
Amaranthwhat time is the meeting?02:25
ograAmaranth, tonight at 20:00 UTC02:25
Amaranth4pm local time then02:25
ograwe always have alternating 12:00 and 20:00 UTC02:25
ograevery wed.02:25
Amaranthyeah, i don't make it to enough meetings to remember that :)02:25
cbx33ogra, ok I'll do server/multiple blank/lock, generalisation and filtering02:27
cbx33as top priority02:27
ograis there a difference between multiple/single ?02:27
ograi wouldnt think so02:27
cbx33not really02:27
ograright02:27
ograthat should be based on the selection02:28
cbx33hmm02:28
cbx33yeh02:28
cbx33so the calls to the functions, instead of importing and using locally will be routed to ssh02:28
cbx33if you're on multiple02:28
cbx33for now, we're just administrating one remote server right?02:28
cbx33or the local one02:29
ograyes, for feisty thast enough ... but the opportunity for more needs to be there02:30
cbx33well, yes, that'll require some rewriting02:30
ograthe frontend should have the opportunity to switch between servers (at least at some point) so that should be prepared in your code02:30
cbx33switching between servers will be implemented02:30
cbx33should be in feisty02:30
ogragreat02:31
cbx33but administering multiple servers from one gui was what I was thinking02:31
ograthat will need a new gui design02:31
ograwhich we should do in feisty+102:31
cbx33ok02:32
cbx33so...02:32
cbx33are we going to get vnc in this version?02:32
ogranot sure, .... if i find the time for it ...02:33
cbx33ok02:33
cbx33people were very keen for that at BETT ;)02:33
cbx33if I have the time I will look into it02:33
ograte script is described in the old spec ... feel free to try to write it if you want02:33
cbx33heh, i will02:34
ograsince x11vnc has no initscript which could clash with a self written one, you can as well copy one in place by yourself02:35
ograwhich should solve the x11vnc issue02:35
cbx33ooooo.....k....02:35
cbx33so basically....we need to...02:36
cbx33start the x11vnc02:37
cbx33and then in the gui...connect to that vnc session02:37
cbx33http://tocm.blogspot.com/2005_11_01_archive.html - look at the top post02:39
ograthats nice02:41
cbx33yeh02:42
ogratry to find that code02:42
cbx33but there's no link to anything02:42
ogramail him ?02:42
cbx33no email address02:42
cbx33oh ang on02:42
cbx33nope02:42
cbx33what do you think i'd look for if I were to do it from scratch02:43
ogratry with a comment ... the blog has a comment space02:45
cbx33ok02:45
ograad he seems active in LKML02:46
cbx33cool02:46
cbx33I'll give him a contact02:46
cbx33anthony.printf at codemonkey.scanf.ws minus syscalls02:48
cbx33hahaha02:48
ograhttp://lbpp.sourceforge.net/02:48
ogramight be the same guy02:48
cbx33ok mailing now02:50
cbx33http://virt-manager.et.redhat.com/codestructure.html02:52
ograthats for xen ?02:53
ograor vmware ?02:53
ograuh, ugly, it abuses vnc2swf02:54
cbx33yes02:54
cbx33i saw that too02:54
cbx33http://virt-manager.et.redhat.com/screenshots/guest-console.png02:54
cbx33actually I don;t know if it is as bad as we thought02:56
cbx33oh02:56
cbx33yes it is02:56
Amaranthwhat? they use gtkmozembed and vnc2swf?03:22
cbx33mozembed isn't in the vnc viewer03:23
cbx33but vnc2swf maybe03:23
cbx33though I can find no mention of swf in the rfb.py and vnc.py03:23
cbx33think I may giv this a go03:25
cbx33seems like it may be fairly easy to implement as a first test anyway03:26
cbx33what ya think ogra worth a shot?03:29
cbx33library seems fairly complete from that virt-manager thing03:29
ograas long as you dont need any universe stuff do what you want ...03:30
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cbx33well....I can just copy the code out can't I?03:31
ograif its not packaged anywhere in ubuntu, yes03:32
cbx33cool03:33
cbx33I will look03:33
cbx33can't see it anywhere03:33
cbx33so I'll just rip out the code for the python vnc and try it out03:33
cbx33;)03:33
ograbut keep an eye on it ... if its packaged once we shouldnt duplicate the code, then you need to depend on it03:33
cbx33yeh03:34
g333k_workhello, is it possible configure autologin un edubuntu?03:45
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ogra_g333k_work, thats the third day you are asking it ... the answer didnt change: yes, via gdm but then you loose local device support03:55
ogra_ldm doesnt have autologin yet03:56
ogra_(patches accepted though)03:56
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yamamawhat is edubuntu ??04:02
cbx33ogra: dude, I have just ran a vnc session inside a python widget04:04
cbx33I hacked up their code a bit04:05
cbx33and...well....it works04:05
g333k_workogra, noup... I realized that ubuntu edgy + ltsp 5 use LDM, and is not possible to do the autologin thing :(04:12
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ograg333k_work, only if you use gdm ... but since we dont support unencrypted connections by default in ltsp5 in ubuntu there is no work gone into localdev support yet04:20
sbalneavMorning all04:20
ograhi sbalneav04:20
sbalneavHey ogra!04:20
cbx33ogra: ok it works.....but the resize isn't implemented04:20
cbx33for the frame buffer04:21
ogracbx33, hmm, so no tiled overview yet then...04:21
cbx33not yet04:21
ograthats fine for a start04:21
cbx33yeh04:21
cbx33but I want that tiled overview04:21
cbx33this code is pretty slick04:21
cbx33but most of the code has04:22
cbx33raise NotImplementError04:22
cbx33grrr04:22
cbx33I mean t's possible that I can hack up the code to get it to work04:22
ogradtrask was very keen on getting it in.. but if we cat make it in time we simply cant ...04:23
ogras/cat/cant/04:23
cbx33hmm...so basically.....we need to read in the screen and resize....that's pretty intensive04:23
ograit doesn tneed to be realtime ...04:24
cbx33no....I know04:24
ograthe tiles can be screenshots04:24
cbx33taken every 10 secs or so04:24
cbx33basically I don't know enough about the technology to do it04:24
cbx33but04:24
cbx33I'm willing to try and learn04:24
cbx33  def resize_screen(self, width, height):    raise NotImplementedError04:24
ograyou use a nonblocking child process ...04:25
cbx33yeh that's not the issue04:25
ogracool would be to have an effect like a tooltip on mouse over that shows the realtime screen in a frameless popup in a suitable size ...04:26
ograbut i suspect that will slow down everything04:26
cbx33flippin eck ogra give us a chance04:27
willvdl:)04:29
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cbx33ogra: managed to resize the window.....but not rescale it04:37
cbx33can vnc viewer request a size fomr the server?04:37
cbx33doesn't look like it04:42
cbx33bbl04:48
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cbx33ogra, I think I've isolated a section of code I can use05:37
cbx33I don;t know how performance will be, but we'll have to see that later ;)05:38
LaserJockhi cbx3305:43
cbx33hey LaserJock05:44
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Laser_awaycbx33: jabber07:25
cbx33Laser_away, bbiab dude07:28
cbx33dinner07:28
Laser_awaynp07:28
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cbx33ogra, I've done it07:56
cbx33seriously07:56
cbx33I have a 3 second updating screenshot07:56
cbx33that is resized07:56
cbx33took about 2 hours to research and hack up07:56
cbx33I'll send you a demo07:56
LaserJockcbx33: bbl08:00
cbx33LaserJock,08:00
cbx33hi08:00
cbx33oh08:00
cbx33you........dang it08:00
cbx33I'm here now08:00
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juliuxcbx33, no meeting today?08:18
cbx33yup08:21
cbx33in 40 mins08:21
cbx33willvdl is charing08:21
cbx33chairing08:22
cbx33as ogra isn't able to attend08:22
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cbx33hey willvdl08:35
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willvdlhey08:59
highvoltageahoy08:59
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willvdledubuntu meeting?09:01
willvdl========Edubuntu Meeting =========09:03
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stormchas3rits been awhile since i set edubuntu server up.  Can you guys please point me in the right direction on configuring the server to accept thin clients and all?09:53
willvdlstormchas3r, www.edubuntu.org/gettingstarted10:03
stormchas3rty10:04
stormchas3rhas much changed in 6.10 for the server side?10:05
cbx33nope10:06
cbx33dhcp is dopne for iirc10:06
LaserJockcya cbx3310:07
cbx33nn LaserJock #10:07
stormchas3ro wow, its been awhile cbx33, remember me?10:08
bddebianLaserJock: I shouldn't have an issue updating an edubuntu install to a "normal" install should I?10:31
LaserJockheh10:33
LaserJockit's basically a normal install +10:33
bddebianAye10:34
LaserJockyou did an LTSP server install?10:35
bddebianNo, just a Edgy Live -> Install10:35
LaserJockoh10:36
LaserJockthen yeah, it's darn near the same thing10:36
bddebianOK10:36
LaserJockinstall ubuntu-* and remove edubuntu-* and you pretty much have it10:36
bddebianGot it, thanks man10:38
pips1willvdl: hullo10:58
willvdlpips1, good to have you back10:58
pips1what time friday?10:58
willvdlI am UTC+2 i think, you?10:59
pips1UTC+110:59
pips1morning or afternoon?10:59
willvdlmorning or afternoon?10:59
pips1heh10:59
willvdlsnap :)10:59
pips1morning11:00
willvdlmorning is best11:00
willvdlmy 12 is your 11am? or earlier?11:00
pips1correct11:00
pips110 UTC then?11:00
willvdlgoo for you?11:00
pips1yep11:01
willvdlexcellent11:01
willvdljust want to chat wiki/website11:01
pips1ok, I'll talk to you fri 10 UTC, here11:02
pips1see you then!11:02
willvdlciao11:03
pips1it was an informative meeting... I will want to know more about your/doc-team thoughts too11:03
willvdlcool. there are a lot :)11:03
pips1regarding the whole categorisation/name spaces thing..11:04
pips1ok, got to go, cu11:04
=== willvdl [n=will@196.207.32.235] has left #edubuntu ["Leaving"]
nixternalogra: sorry to here about Fred. I know the feeling as I just lost my dog after 11 years on Thanksgiving Day. It is tough, but at least his suffering is over. My thoughts and prayers are with you!11:25
ograthanks a lot11:25
nixternalthat is 3 dev pooches in a row, first jono, then me, and now you :(11:26
nixternalit sucks big time11:26
nixternalmy mom picked up another pooch, or devil I should say, he can never be a replacement, but he did help a little with the grieving process11:26
ograwell, it wasnt really unexpected ... 16 is very old and i said goodbye since months already11:27
nixternalya, he gave you 16 good years though, that is awesome11:27
ograyeah11:27
nixternalholly was 11 when she went11:27
ograthats early ...11:28
ograbut if the body doesnt want anymore you can hardly do anything11:28
nixternala little early yes, but they think she was born with a heart condition, she was about 2 to 3 years early for a malteze11:28
ograhe still didnt want to go ... the vet had to give an extra shot which is very unusual she said ... but he would have starved to death if i wouldnt have decided it now ...11:29
nixternalwow, definitely a fighter then. our dog was eventually going to do the same thing with starvation11:30
nixternalshe wouldn't eat for anything, and wouldn't even eat her favorite, chicken and ham11:30
nixternalor a mcdonald's french fry for that matter11:30
ograas weak as he was he did his round through the garden with me, even 30mon before i had to give him the sleeping pills11:30
nixternalgave you one last walk, that's cool11:31
ograyeah, fred stopped eating last friday ...11:31
ograand nothing could convnce him ....11:32
nixternalya, same exact here11:32
nixternalwell, now there are 3 new friends where ever they go after life on earth, but I can guarantee holly is being a prissy little one and not wanting to play :)11:33
ograyeah11:34
nixternalthe only thing holly played with was my cat, and would play around with my pitbull every now and then when feeling frisky11:34
ografred only played with his mom ... he never got why he should play with humans or other dogs11:34
nixternalthe new dog and the pitbull aren't friends yet, the little dog wants to eat the pitbull11:35
nixternalya, our new dog plays with everyone and everything, holly didn't play much except if the kids were around11:36
nixternali have a 100+ pound pit bull that is terrified on a 5 pound yorkshire terrier11:36
nixternalcrazy11:37
ograyeah11:37
nixternalwhen the little one comes around, the pitbull will jump on a couch or bed because he knows nikki the little one can't get up there and get him11:37
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LaserJockogra: will there be re-evaluation of specs at the sprint next week?11:59
LaserJocklike last time11:59

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