[12:36] <kamikaze> re all
[12:37] <kamikaze> i have somme question
[12:37] <kamikaze> i would like to use with ubuntu 6.10 my dongle usb wifi wg111 v2
[12:38] <kamikaze064> re all
[12:38] <kamikaze064> there is someone
[12:38] <kamikaze064> on the channel
[12:38] <kamikaze064> ?
[12:39] <mdke> kamikaze064: this isn't a support channel, try #ubuntu or http://www.ubuntu.com/support
[12:39] <kamikaze064> ok
[12:39] <kamikaze064> thanks
[12:39] <Hobbsee> kamikaze064: FYI, you'll have to use ndiswrapper for that.  but see #ubuntu
[01:59] <Mez> I'm thinking of making a backport of gstreamer0.10.11 to edgy... does anyone here have any major concerns ?
[01:59] <Mez> (this is to backport jokosher)
[03:19] <mdz> Mez: it's used by an awful lot of other packages
[03:19] <Mez> mdz: I know that - but I've spoken to the gstreamer guys and basically their respone was
[03:19] <Mez> "well we all use it - and if it doesnt work - we've done something wrong"
[03:20] <Mez> it's a point version change, and the API hasnt changed... 
[03:20] <mdz> Mez: they use it on edgy?
[03:20] <Mez> mdz: yeah
[03:20] <Mez> 0.10.11 on edgy
[03:20] <mdz> oh, that's encouraging then
[03:20] <Mez> indeed :D
[03:20] <Mez> I mean - everythings backporting fine
[03:21] <Mez> the main problem i see is python-gstreamer0.10 - which i'm going to test with serpentine etc
[03:22] <Mez> but apparently, the gstreamer devs are using 0.10.11 on edgy with no adverse effets (in fact - htye'vepurposely coded it to make sure that it isnt a problem)
[03:37] <Chipzz> Mez: the "purposely coded it to make sure that it isnt a problem" is imho a rather silly argument in se. I can think of only one project that's silly enough to introduce new or destablizing features in stable releases (the linux kernel :P), but most projects try to avoid introducing bugs. The thing with bugs is that most of them are created by accident. ;)
[03:38] <Chipzz> but the argument about the developers using it theirselves IS a pretty good one though ;)
[03:39] <Mez> Chipzz, lol
[03:39] <Mez> well I'm currently uploading locally backported debs ;)
[03:41] <Chipzz> but I doubt the kernel matters a lot for the vast majority of users (those with not bleeding new hardware) anyway :)
[03:42] <Chipzz> both of my laptops happened to work out of the box anyway (except for the nvidia/suspend crap), and little has changed since I installed them (both initially breezy installs)
[03:43] <Chipzz> only thing that did change for me was a fix in ipw2[12] 00 drivers that made rmmod'ing/modprobing the drivers on iwconfig essid unnecesary :)
[03:49] <Mez> hmm
[03:51] <cr3> how can I determine more or less the number of milestones released per year?
[05:09] <somerville32> I get a kernel panic when I upgrade network-manager :(
[05:48] <wasabi_> I hate the gnome control center, by the way.
[06:54] <tepsipakki> rodarvus: ping?
[06:54] <tepsipakki> rodarvus: bug 67487 seems to have a fix in upstream, maybe we could get it in feisty (and as it seems, edgy too)?
[06:54] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 67487 in xserver-xorg-driver-ati "[regression] [rv280]  black screen and console freeze when X starts - drm lockup" [Unknown,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/67487
[07:09] <Treenaks> tepsipakki: upstream should fix #20283 .. that's been in there since 2005-08
[07:10] <Treenaks> at least
[07:11] <tepsipakki> hmm, I don't suffer from that
[07:12] <tepsipakki> but the bug I mentioned... marked a number of dri freezes as duplicates until I understood that there were two (possibly unrelated) issues :)
[07:13] <tepsipakki> I used fglrx until now, but since the new version doesn't support radeon8500 anymore and tv-out isn't used so gave the free driver a go
[07:13] <Treenaks> tepsipakki: apparently, it's a video bios parsing issue.. but I haven't had a reply from upstream since october
[07:14] <tepsipakki> there was 6.6.3 in early october, but no new releases since
[07:14] <Treenaks> exactly
[07:14] <Treenaks> every cool kid is now hacking nouveau, instead of fixing at
[07:14] <Treenaks> ati
[07:15] <tepsipakki> and I thought I could run compiz :)
[07:15] <Treenaks> I can.. but my screen looks like this: http://foodfight.org/zut/ati-breakage.ogg
[07:17] <tepsipakki> hmm, nothing there?
[07:17] <tepsipakki> my ff shows a blank page
[07:18] <Treenaks> tepsipakki: it's an ogg/theora video
[07:18] <Treenaks> try totem
[07:18] <tepsipakki> wget works
[07:18] <Treenaks> ok :)
[07:19] <tepsipakki> eww.. funky :)
[07:20] <Treenaks> tepsipakki: yeah.. and it's not a hardware failure -- fglrx and The Other OS work
[07:20] <tepsipakki> naturally
[07:27] <fabbione> cjwatson: am I right that on cdrom installation, no matter what cdrom the machine is using the CD is mounted in /cdrom ? also.. do you have a good example on how to write preseedable stuff in d-i?
[07:29] <fabbione> Hobbsee: ping?
[07:30] <Hobbsee> fabbione: semipong?
[07:30] <fabbione> Hobbsee: i met the debian maintainer for kommando a couple of days ago and he was wondering when are you going to merge the new release he did a couple of weeks ago...
[07:30] <fabbione> Hobbsee: nothing more.. nothing less :)
[07:31] <Hobbsee> fabbione: what was his nick?
[07:31] <fabbione> Hobbsee: IRC nick.. pulsim or something like that...
[07:32] <Hobbsee> fabbione: will look when i get off the phone.
[07:32] <fabbione> thanks
[07:32] <Hobbsee> :)
[08:00] <fabbione> Mithrandir: you didn't accept glibc for -updates yet, did you?
[08:44] <Hobbsee> fabbione: you must be meaning pulsing
[08:54] <fabbione> Hobbsee: yes possibly..
[08:59] <Hobbsee> fabbione: done :)
[08:59] <Hobbsee> recently, anyway
[09:01] <fabbione> Hobbsee: yes i noticed it was not on MoM
[09:01] <fabbione> probably MoM is not running
[09:02] <Hobbsee> fabbione: likely.  rather stupid, that
[09:02] <fabbione> Hobbsee: MoM needs love once in a while
[09:04] <fabbione> doko: is there any chance that you can give me info about #78968 ?
[09:09] <dholbach> good morning
[09:11] <_ion> Hi
[09:11] <Amaranth> morning
[09:17] <Mez> cjwatson: ping regarding backports
[09:22] <Mithrandir> fabbione: no, I haven't yet.
[09:23] <fabbione> Mithrandir: ok thanks.
[09:27] <Mez> Mithrandir, unless you know about the backports process?
[09:28] <Mithrandir> Mez: if you can phrase a question, I can try to answer it.
[09:29] <Mez> Mithrandir, 2 questions
[09:29] <Mez> 1) is it possible to backport already superceded packages from feisty to edgy
[09:29] <Mez> 2) do backports currently buld against backports
[09:30] <Mithrandir> no and no, ttbomk.
[09:30] <Mithrandir> hmm, or maybe they're built against backports.
[09:30] <Mez> I rememebr there was a rather large debate about it ;)
[09:30] <Mithrandir> but in general, I'll turn down requests to backport important libraries and such.
[09:31] <Mez> Mithrandir, does that include gstreamer ?
[09:31] <Mithrandir> Mez: I would need to decide on that.  I'm not sure.
[09:32] <Mez> Mithrandir, fair enough
[09:32] <Mez> well the discussion is on ubuntu-devel, unless you want me to CC you ?
[09:32] <Mithrandir> nah, I can go look at it.
[09:32] <Mithrandir> just haven't really had time for email lately.  Too much archive administration work.
[09:32] <Mez> kk... well am writing a nice email right now
[09:33] <dholbach> Mez: please don't backport the cvs version of base
[09:34] <Mez> dholbach... well, I'm poking people right now...
[09:34] <Mez> we *might* be able to get 0.10.11 
[09:34] <Mez> (not CVS)
[09:35] <dholbach> hmhm
[09:35] <Mez> dholbach, CC'd
[09:38] <Mez> is ubuntu-devel restricted now ?
[09:38] <Mez> (the mailing list)
[09:40] <Mithrandir> yes.
[09:40] <Mithrandir> as you'd know if you'd read ubuntu-devel-announce. :-P
[09:41] <Mez> Mithrandir, had my mail server bouncing emails for 2 months
[09:41] <Mez> Mithrandir, I'm just wondering why it's letting in my "non-ubuntu" email address
[09:41] <Mez> I guess it uses LP (or emails were harvested from there)
[09:43] <LaserJock> act
[09:44] <LaserJock> bah, needs a / :/
[09:53] <cjwatson> fabbione: /cdrom> correct
[09:54] <cjwatson> fabbione: er, nearly any bit of d-i is a reasonable example of how to do preseeding in its own way
[09:55] <cjwatson> fabbione: just avoid doing db_set without first checking if db_fget $question seen returns false
[09:56] <cjwatson> Mez: it uses LP, but it's hand-moderated anyway
[09:56] <cjwatson> rather than just rejecting
[09:56] <cjwatson> AFAIK backports builds against backports, but Adam Conrad would be the authoritative reference for that
[09:57] <dholbach> morning cjwatson
[09:58] <fabbione> cjwatson: ok thanks.
[09:58] <Mithrandir> cjwatson: if not, backporting libraries wouldn't make much sense, especially not if the new libs had a new soname.
[10:03] <webben> what does ubuntu uses to parse SVG? is there some reason Cairo's libsvg wasn't needed, or even included in the repositories?
[10:03] <cjwatson> Mithrandir: right
[10:03] <webben> that's this thing: http://cairographics.org/libsvg
[10:04] <Mez> cjwatson, so no chance of building against stuff thats already been superceded in feisty ?>
[10:05] <cjwatson> webben: I think we generally use librsvg from GNOME
[10:05] <fabbione> hey BenC 
[10:05] <cjwatson> Mez: well, it could be done if necessary, but our standard backport tool doesn't support it
[10:05] <BenC> yo
[10:05] <dholbach> hey BenC
[10:05] <webben> cjwatson, ah thanks
[10:05] <cjwatson> I'd be a bit concerned about doing that since obviously fixing bugs is going to be a pain
[10:05] <BenC> hey dholbach
[10:06] <Mez> dholbach, did the 0.10.11 (non CVS) version cause those problems for you
[10:06] <cjwatson> webben: (not sure what Kubuntu uses)
[10:06] <webben> cjwatson, I was just off to find out, thanks :)
[10:06] <dholbach> Mez: I'm just asking the folks in #gstreamer what could cause this
[10:06] <Mez> cjwatson, I see your point, but as far as I'm concerned, I'd be happy, it builds quire nicely... however, daniel pointed out some issues with the current feisty version
[10:06] <dholbach> Mez: I don't know what's causing the problems
[10:07] <Mez> dholbach, I saw :D
[10:08] <Mez> dholbach, if it isn't the new gstreamer, would your opinion on backporting it change ?
[10:09] <dholbach> Mez: you asked me for my opinion - I wouldn't backport anything until jokosher worked fine for me - because 0.1 *works fine* on edgy right now - I wouldn't like to mess it up
[10:10] <Mez> dholbach, fair opinion :D
[10:10] <dholbach> and since gstreamer affects a lot more applications than jokosher, I'd be extra careful
[10:10] <Mez> dholbach, hence why I'm doing a lot of testing :D and why I'm consulting with gstreamer devs, and asking lots of people rather than just syaing
[10:11] <Mez> "yeah, works fine, backport it"
[10:11] <Mez> as I said, I'm happy rto just host it in my own apt-repo :D
[10:25] <coyctecm> synaptic crashes when I try to lock packages
[10:25] <coyctecm> I think it's a know bug
[10:25] <coyctecm> And what's the status of amd64 bootsplash? It's still grey...
[10:33] <cjwatson> that reminds me, I should upload usplash
[10:33] <cjwatson> not sure whether amd64 is fixed in there, but it can't hurt (much!) to try
[10:34] <cjwatson> I know the fix is known, but it's not clear to me whether it's been checked in
[10:42] <coyctecm> ok
[10:42] <cjwatson> mjg59 would know for sure
[10:52] <seb128> Mithrandir: around?
[10:52] <Mithrandir> seb128: You sent me a contentless ping.  This is a contentless pong.  Please provide a bit of information about what you want and I will respond when I am around.
[10:54] <seb128> Mithrandir: I've uploaded a new tracker with fixed debian/copyright, the orig tarball has still no LGPL text though, is that ok if that will be fixed with next upstream version? Or should I repackage the orig with a COPYING.LIB? Or better to wait for next version?
[10:54] <Mez> Mithrandir, where did you get the contentless ping script from?
[10:54] <tepsipakki> does usplash support svg pictures? In UWN #8 it was reported to do so, but looking at the code it isn't clear to me
[10:54] <tepsipakki> s/pictures/artwork/
[10:55] <neuralis> Mez: he wrote it; http://err.no/personal/blog/tech/2006-10-10-12-05_contentless_pings.html and there's an x-chat port somewhere.
[10:55] <seb128> Mez: he wrote it I think
[10:55] <Mez> seb128, sweet :P I know lots of people who wnat that
[10:56] <Mithrandir> Mez: I wrote it.
[10:57] <Mithrandir> seb128: Please repackage the orig.tar.gz.
[10:57] <Mez> Mithrandir, you should release it
[10:57] <seb128> Mithrandir: ok, please reject the upload I just did then
[10:57] <neuralis> Mez: i gave you a link.
[10:57] <Mez> neuralis, I'm blind today
[10:58] <Mithrandir> Mez: http://err.no/src/contentless_ping.pl you mean?
[10:58] <Mithrandir> seb128: will do.
[10:59] <Mez> Mithrandir, indeed
[10:59] <Mithrandir> seb128: sorry about having to be so picky, but licences are serious business.
[11:00] <seb128> Mithrandir: no problem, I don't like licences problems much but I totally understand ;)
[11:01] <Mithrandir> dholbach: colorblind looks interesting. :-)
[11:02] <dholbach> Mithrandir: interesting as in how?
[11:03] <Mithrandir> dholbach: as in I am red-green colour blind and if I can run something which turns problematic combinations into nonproblematic ones, that'd be useful.
[11:04] <Mithrandir> dholbach: I don't know if anything uses it yet, but I imagine what a theme engine using it could do..
[11:04] <dholbach> Mithrandir: gnome-mag makes use of it already and we'd like to build it with it - but it's just experimental parts of it that are unfortunately not exposed to the user
[11:04] <dholbach> Mithrandir: upstream is very responsive and a very nice guy - so if you have crazy ideas, I'm sure he'd listen
[11:07] <dholbach> Mithrandir: gracias for reviewing it
[11:08] <Mithrandir> dholbach: np, simple package.
[11:11] <seb128> Mithrandir: fixed tracker uploaded
[11:14] <Mithrandir> seb128: great, I'll get to it soon
[11:15] <seb128> Mithrandir: thank you
[11:38] <Mithrandir> cjwatson: aren't intel macs supposed to be getting grub2?
[11:39] <cjwatson> well, that had been the plan, but I found out that the state of grub on Intel Macs was much better than I'd previously thought
[11:40] <cjwatson> if this patch works, that should be about it
[11:40] <cjwatson> don't mind switching to grub2 later if it also works, but this is most expedient
[11:42] <cjwatson> NEAT
[11:42] <cjwatson> it works
[11:42] <Mithrandir> ok, cool
[11:43] <cjwatson> so theoretically gptsync probably isn't even needed, but that's a problem for another day
[11:54] <Mez> does it REALLY matter if something doesnt have man pages in the package
[11:54] <_ion> Usually yes.
[11:55] <Mez> this thing doesnt come with man pages
[11:55] <Mez> has no --help output
[11:55] <Mez> has nothing
[11:55] <Mez> oh wait
[11:55] <Mez> it has a html filr
[11:57] <cjwatson> whatever you do, don't override that lintian warning. If you don't want to write a man page, then just upload it with the lintian warning still there.
[11:58] <Mez> cjwatson, no problem - will it be rejected if theres no man pages ?
[11:58] <cjwatson> no
[11:58] <cjwatson> not by us anyway
[11:58] <cjwatson> it's still a bug though
[11:58] <Mez> cjwatson, I know - it's a major PITA though
[11:59] <Mez> none of the commands take command line arguments
[11:59] <cjwatson> *shrug*
[11:59] <Mez> lol :D
[11:59] <StevenK> Debian's view has always been, "We'd prefer if it had manual pages, but it doesn't require them."
[11:59] <BenC> I hate programs like that
[11:59] <_ion> Well, the commands probably *do* something.
[11:59] <_ion> How about explaining it in the man pages? :-)
[11:59] <StevenK> I agree with BenC, too, for what it's worth.
[11:59] <cjwatson> I'm not really interested in how much of a pain it is - I just want the warning not to be overridden, because people are picking up that idea from somewhere and it's wrong
[11:59] <BenC> with the exception of things like cat, programs should produce a usage with no args
[11:59] <Mez> _ion, if i could write man ages, I would
[12:00] <StevenK> Mez: *roff isn't hard. :-)
[12:00] <Mez> BenC, I agree :D
[12:00] <cjwatson> it's a pity nobody's bothered to write pages and pages of documentation on how to write man pages, isn't it?
[12:00] <cjwatson> and example files and stuff
[12:00] <BenC> cjwatson: File a bug :)
[12:00] <StevenK> cjwatson: Geez, bitter much? :-P
[12:00] <cjwatson> BenC: (I have written such documentation, personally)
[12:00] <Mez> cjwatson, lol :P I f I could only find that copy of LXF where they taught you how to write them
[12:00] <Mithrandir> cjwatson: yeah, man(7) doesn't exist.
[12:01] <cjwatson> or /usr/share/doc/man-db/examples/
[12:01] <BenC> cjwatson: It's part of Debian's stuff isn't it?
[12:01] <Mithrandir> they're all figments of your imagination
[12:01] <StevenK> Ahhh, now I remember that cjwatson is the man-db maintainer.
[12:01] <cjwatson> BenC: yeah, I maintain man-db
[12:01] <BenC> cjwatson: ick...sorry to hear that :)
[12:02] <Mez> learn one thing at a time and try to change it
[12:02] <cjwatson> hey, I like it
[12:02] <Mez> I'm still learning english
[12:03] <BenC> Mez: groff is easier than english...so I've heard :)
[12:03] <Mez> BenC, but i've always been taught to learn one thing at a time
[12:03] <Mithrandir> dholbach: for your decibel upload, you didn't really add a copy of the GPL to the upload, did you?  Or am I blind?
[12:03] <dholbach> Mithrandir: I added it to debian/ iirc
[12:04] <StevenK> Mez: If that's the case, you'd never learn packaging, which teaches multiple concepts at once.
[12:04] <Mithrandir> dholbach: oh, confirmed, I'm blind
[12:04] <Mez> and i REALLY dont want to be spouting .TH GREETING .SH hello
[12:04] <dholbach> *phew* I questioned MY sanity
[12:04] <Mez> StevenK, I see pacakging as one thing
[12:04] <Mez> lol
[12:06] <Mez> cjwatson, is it ok to override
[12:06] <Mez> E: nostromo: maintainer-script-calls-init-script-directly postinst:24
[12:06] <StevenK> Mez: Use invoke-rc.d
[12:06] <Mez> StevenK, I know - I do
[12:07] <cjwatson> you should use lintian-info to find out more
[12:07] <Mez> cjwatson: in my case - I do the following
[12:07] <Mez> http://rafb.net/p/6eAQFO44.html
[12:07] <Mez> (check for invoke-rc.d and f it's not there, call /etc/init.d
[12:07] <cjwatson> it is not OK to override messages from lintian unless it is a special case that isn't worth hardcoding in lintian
[12:08] <Mithrandir> Mez: why are you trying to restart udev?
[12:08] <cjwatson> if you use invoke-rc.d when it's available, that's fine and you can override the message - but as Mithrandir says
[12:08] <cjwatson> use dh_installudev instead
[12:08] <Mez> Mithrandir, because I'm installing udev rules
[12:08] <Mez> cjwatson, never come across that one
[12:08] <cjwatson> you have now
[12:08] <cjwatson> you don't need to restart udev in Ubuntu, but do in Debian
[12:08] <Mithrandir> Mez: yes, and?  udev watches its rules directory and reloads on the fly.
[12:09] <cjwatson> dh_installudev does the right thing
[12:09] <Mithrandir> cjwatson: that's because the udev policy in Debian is crack. :-)
[12:09] <Mez> Mithrandir, it didnt for me ;)
[12:09] <cjwatson> then you've done it wrong
[12:09] <cjwatson> or there is a udev bug
[12:09] <Mithrandir> Mez: if you install files directly to the rules directory, it does.
[12:09] <cjwatson> in any case you should not restart udev in Ubuntu
[12:09] <cjwatson> if you aren't using dh_installudev, you've almost certainly got it wrong. There are several subtleties.
[12:10] <Mez> cjwatson, cool :D thanks for pointing that one to me :D
[12:10] <cjwatson> you're welcome
[12:10] <cjwatson> hmm, actually dh_installudev doesn't seem to restart udev in Debian
[12:11] <cjwatson> so if I remember correctly and that's still needed there, you'll have to take care of that in packages intended for Debian users
[12:11] <Mithrandir> I'd call that a bug in dh_installudev in Debian, then.
[12:11] <cjwatson> probably ...
[12:12] <Mez> so - should i keep the postinst or not ?
[12:12] <cjwatson> not, for Ubuntu
[12:13] <Mez> cjwatson, cool
[12:14] <mneptok> cjwatson: you going to be active for the next ... say ... 4 hours or so? (not at all urgent)
[12:17] <cjwatson> mneptok: yeah
[12:21] <mneptok> cjwatson: cool. i'll ping you from home in a bit re: bug consolidation and closure
[12:22] <cjwatson> mneptok: ok
[12:46] <jwendell> doko, good morning. around?
[12:49] <dholbach> jwendell: he's off to meet a python guy - he'll be back in an hour or two or something
[12:50] <jwendell> dholbach, do you know if there is any firefox packager here?
[12:50] <dholbach> jwendell: at the moment we're a bit maintainerless
[12:50] <ogra> we have a team ... 
[12:51] <dholbach> jwendell: iwj took care of that a while ago, the last uploads were done by keescook and doko
[12:51] <ogra> its just forming ... 
[12:58] <mneptok> ooo! an alaisd. :)
[12:58] <seb128> lunch time, bbl
[01:00] <alaisd> am i allowed to print to STDOUT?
[01:02] <_ion> Nope, the new legislation forbids it. If you're caught, your name will be added to the list of people who have done that, and you have to report yourself to neighbours and schools near your house.
[01:03] <alaisd> aw well, forking to the background then
[01:05] <jwendell> dholbach, firefox is a monster... debian diff does not reside in debian dir only...
[01:17] <cjwatson> jwendell: that is true of many packages and is perfectly standard practice
[01:21] <jwendell> cjwatson, yes, i understand, i'm talking this because i'm a novice in debian builds...
[01:28] <jwendell> is there any way for lsdiff work on <package>.diff.gz? or does it only work on unzipped files?
[01:30] <jwendell> sorry, got the answer (-z)
[02:04] <giskard> ciao *
[02:07] <Mithrandir> NEW empty.
[02:07] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: *\o/*
[02:08] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: woot!!!
[02:10] <ogra> Mithrandir, what about enabling me to work again by finally promoting pulse ?
[02:10] <ogra> now that you dont ahve anything to do anymore :P
[02:44] <Ng> mdke: about?
[02:48] <jwendell> dholbach, help me: i want to test a fix for firefox; i've done apt-get source. I want to modify configure.in, which was already modified by debian diff
[02:48] <jwendell> dholbach, how to do this?
[03:02] <Mithrandir> sfllaw: you're aware that bash is Essential and dependencies on it are not needed?
[03:02] <Mithrandir> sfllaw: re https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/oprofile/+bug/69455
[03:02] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 69455 in oprofile "[SRU]  for oprofile, edgy-updates: bashism in oprofile's opcontrol script prevents user from setting any events" [Unknown,Fix released]  
[03:04] <dholbach> jwendell: just change configure.in again - afaik firefox doesn't use a patchsystem
[03:04] <dholbach> jwendell: if you change configure.in just make sure you run autoconf again - and remove autom4te.cache/ - it shouldn't show up in the diff
[03:06] <Mithrandir> crimsun: I've rejected your updated oprofile upload to edgy-proposed; reasoning is in the bug report.
[03:11] <sfllaw> Mithrandir: True.  I have no idea what I was thinking at the time.
[03:11] <Mithrandir> sfllaw: I suspect it was your evil twin or something. :-)
[03:12] <sfllaw> Mithrandir: For some crazy reason, I thought we had made dash Essential.
[03:13] <Mithrandir> sfllaw: dash is priority: required
[03:15] <sfllaw> Mithrandir: Yeah, I looked at it again.
[03:18] <Mithrandir> doko: any particular reason why you have uploaded two versions of eclipse to edgy-proposed, with the same version number?
[03:18] <Mithrandir> doko: also, if you want archive admins to take action on requests, subscribing ubuntu-archive is a good plan. :-)
[03:18] <\sh> who has a clue about the sparc buildds? :)
[03:18] <doko> Mithrandir: hmm, maybe I forgot that I did upload? ;-)
[03:19] <Mithrandir> doko: 'k, they're supposed to be the same?
[03:19] <zul> \sh: fabbione probably
[03:19] <Mithrandir> \sh: what are you wondering about?
[03:19] <doko> Mithrandir: yes
[03:20] <Mithrandir> doko: I'll reject the oldest one, then.
[03:20] <doko> Mithrandir: ok
[03:21] <\sh> fabbione: if you have time could you check this buildlog: http://librarian.launchpad.net/5776033/buildlog_ubuntu-feisty-sparc.kmymoney2_0.8.5-1build1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz and tell me what could I do to prevent the bus error? :)
[03:24] <Mithrandir> \sh: that's probably fixed in a recent gs upload, I'll give it back and see if it works.
[03:24] <Mithrandir> \sh: but it fails on ppc too
[03:24] <\sh> Mithrandir:yes, broken build-deps
[03:24] <\sh> Mithrandir:on ppc that is
[03:24] <Mithrandir> yeah, just retried it
[03:25] <\sh> Mithrandir:cool thx :)
[03:29] <crimsun> Mithrandir: thanks. I wasn't quite sure how to progress given the conflicting info between Policy and Simon's comment. Thanks for clarifying.
[03:30] <Mithrandir> crimsun: np.
[03:32] <sfllaw> crimsun: Yeah, I was just crazy.
[03:32] <sfllaw> crimsun: Feel free to look me up on IRC if that happens.
[04:01] <jdong> cjwatson: many thanks for your hard work clearing backports queue!
[04:02] <cjwatson> you're welcome
[04:03] <cjwatson> sorry it was overdue
[04:10] <wasabi> Mithrandir: sorry about my idiotic NEW upgrades. I've been mentally out to lunch the last few weeks.
[04:10] <wasabi> s/upgrades/uploads/
[04:10] <wasabi> see, i can't even type what i'm thinking.
[04:15] <bddebian> Heya
[04:44] <dholbach> heno: should we add that <sourcepackage> tag to the clue files?
[04:45] <heno> dholbach: I think so, yes
[04:45] <heno> will it be optional?
[04:45] <dholbach> hmhmmh, that'd mean reading all packages/ files first
[04:45] <dholbach> i don't have a solid opinion yet :)
[04:46] <heno> me neither
[04:46] <heno> what was the use case for it again? local files for testing out stuff?
[04:47] <dholbach> what about this: if no special -r flag (or whatever it will be) is used, we rely on <name>.info files, else the <sourcepackage> xml tag will be considered
[04:47] <dholbach> yeah exactly
[04:47] <heno> it's useful if you tell bh to use that file, while if you only give it the package name then the clue file should have that name imo
[04:48] <heno> yep
[04:48] <dholbach> like that you can also 'accumulate' say evolution clues over a bunch of files (including the 'officially packaged' ones)
[04:48] <heno> right
[04:49] <dholbach> ok: so only read all specificied clue files, if -r is used, then rely on <sourcepackage>
[04:49] <dholbach> i'll let   bugxml -s   add that tag also
[04:49] <dholbach> (we had to rename -sa)
[04:49] <heno> the question is should bugxml create the official ones or secondary ones?
[04:50] <heno> you can always cut and paste the content to the official one later
[04:50] <dholbach> it shouldn't matter... bugxml can't write to /usr/share/bughelper/packages anyway - or did I overlook something?
[04:51] <heno> you're right. would the local files contain only one package or could I have my_clues.info with 5-6 packages, each identified by the source tag?
[04:52] <heno> dholbach: ^
[04:52] <dholbach> i'd prefer to have them separated, but we can also agreggate them if need be
[04:53] <heno> I guess we are getting into areas of personal workflow taste. How hard is it to change this stuff later
[04:53] <dholbach> once we'll have masses of people committing to ./bughelper/packages we'll also have less conflicts if we don't sum up all clues to one big xml file
[04:53] <heno> (point being that we should pick a route and go with it)
[04:53] <dholbach> I don't think it's going to be hard - it'll just mean that we have to parse one giant file instead of being able to pinpoint to one single file based on the source package name
[04:54] <heno> oh, I wasn't suggesting the official clues be all in one file, just my personal ones
[04:54] <dholbach> we'd have to change the xml format a bit
[04:55] <dholbach> i'll think about it... as you said: it's good to decide this early
[04:55] <heno> yeah, don't bother. Better to just make a directory and stick secondary files in there (locally) with the same name as the official
[04:56] <dholbach> I think that'd fit well into the spec like discussion we had yesterday about OrganisingClueFiles
[04:56] <heno> ~./bughelper/clues
[04:56] <dholbach> heno: I think it's easier to do that, because bugxml -s already does that for you - it adds clues to packages/<sourcepackage>.info
[04:57] <heno> right
[04:57] <dholbach> we could use BUGHELPER_LOCAL_CLUES_DIR :-)
[04:57] <dholbach> i'll write something up in BugHelper/Dev in a bit
[04:57] <dholbach> now that I reviewed all patches and wait for people to reply
[04:58] <heno> cool
[04:58] <dholbach> https://launchpad.net/bughelper/+milestone/0.1 looks quite good, if you ask me
[04:59] <dholbach> I think I just fixed 79150 too
[05:00] <dholbach> heno: if you have a good test case for bug 79150 let me know - I'm just trying -A ubiquity
[05:00] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 79150 in bughelper "Don't dupe on multiple finds" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/79150
[05:02] <heno> dholbach: a large number of ubiquity bugs do this. the traceback is in the original post and is repeated in the syslog
[05:04] <heno> dholbach: this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/52228 would do it if you searched on File "/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/ubiquity/frontend/kde-ui.py", line 524, in progress_loop 
[05:04] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 52228 in ubiquity "Installer crashed" [Medium,Confirmed]  
[05:04] <heno> say
[05:07] <dholbach> heno: ok, thanks
[05:32] <mako> mdke: we need to decide if by-hand authentication for coc signing is important enough that we want to implement it.. i get maybe one request a month.. maybe two, the vast majority of those people end up making keys anyway when i suggest it
[05:32] <mako> mdke: so i sort of think it's probably not worth the trouble
[05:48] <seb128> iwj: around? how does the gnome-app-install codec API works? there is no --help nor manpage for it
[05:49] <seb128> iwj: "gnome-app-install --codec=0.10:decoder-audio/mpeg" is supposed to be correct?
[05:50] <iwj> seb128: Yes.
[05:51] <iwj> The wiki spec is the documentation.
[05:51] <iwj> Sorry about the lack of --help; that's because there's not a proper option parser in g-a-i because python sucks.
[05:51] <iwj> seb128: I take it that gnome-app-install --codec=0.10:decoder-audio/mpeg didn't do what you wanted ?
[05:52] <seb128> the wiki has --codec=theora as example
[05:52] <seb128> no
[05:52] <seb128> $ gnome-app-install --codec=0.10:decoder-audio/mpeg
[05:52] <seb128> no suitable application
[05:52] <seb128> that's ii  gnome-app-install        0.3.6                    GNOME Application Installer
[05:52] <iwj> (Although I'm not sure whether there's anything for decoder-audio/mpeg.  What package are you expecting it to offer and does it have a .desktop file anywhere?)
[05:52] <seb128> and there is a .desktop for gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly listing decoder-audio/mpeg
[05:53] <iwj> Hmm, must be broken then.
[05:53] <seb128> /usr/share/app-install/desktop/gstreamer-ugly.desktop
[05:54] <seb128> ok
[05:54] <iwj> Err, gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly is in universe and not whitelisted.
[05:55] <seb128> is there a way to say that I want to use universe?
[05:55] <iwj> Yes, there's a file in /etc you can edit.
[05:57] <iwj> No, apparently the components whitelist is in gconf.   /apps/gnome-app-install/mime-whitelist-components, default is just `main'.
[05:58] <dholbach> iwj: bughelper now uses optparse - i can send you an example if you like
[05:58] <iwj> ian@anarres:~ $ time python -c 'import optparse'
[05:58] <iwj> real    0m3.885s
[05:58] <iwj> ian@anarres:~ $ time python -c 'import optparse'
[05:58] <iwj> real    0m0.143s
[05:58] <iwj> Too slow!
[05:59] <iwj> (That's on my Athlon 2GHz.)
[05:59] <dholbach> ok... maybe somebody ports popt or something to python *shudder* :-)
[06:02] <seb128> iwj: ok, with universe whitelisted it works better
[06:02] <iwj> Oh, good.
[06:02] <seb128> hum, it crashes though
[06:02] <seb128> Traceback (most recent call last):
[06:02] <seb128>   File "/usr/bin/gnome-app-install", line 212, in <module>
[06:02] <seb128>     sys.argv, as, transient_for)
[06:02] <seb128>   File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/AppInstall/AppInstall.py", line 252, in __init__
[06:02] <seb128>     self.search_entry.set_text(self.activation_style.searchString())
[06:02] <seb128>   File "/usr/bin/gnome-app-install", line 115, in searchString
[06:02] <seb128>     def searchString(self): return self._codecs.join(' ')
[06:02] <seb128> AttributeError: 'list' object has no attribute 'join'
[06:03] <iwj> Right, well, the right answer is to whitelist those packages we're prepared to do minimal security support for, as described in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SuggestedPackagesForFiletypesSpec under Security Considerations.
[06:03] <seb128> I've not used a transient-for
[06:03] <seb128> I'm just playing with g-a-i from the command line atm
[06:03] <cjwatson> is anyone fixing update-app-install, or should I?
[06:03] <iwj> cjwatson: How is it broken ?
[06:04] <iwj> seb128: Oh, ffs, that's the stupid Python 'delimiter'.join([list] ) thing again.
[06:04] <cjwatson> er, the error message is upstairs and I'm not, but it crashes on start with some python module it doesn't know about
[06:04] <cjwatson> haven't looked into it yet
[06:04] <seb128> iwj: that's not going to be done today anyway, libgimme-codec need main promotion and pitti is not around, let's do that monday at the distro sprint
[06:05] <iwj> update-app-install worked when I left it IIRC.  I can believe that seb128's bug escaped my testing though.
[06:05] <iwj> seb128: Right.
[06:05] <cjwatson>    File "/usr/sbin/update-app-install", line 17, in <module>
[06:05] <iwj> cjwatson: If this all can wait I think it'll be much easier when we're all together.  Is it blocking you now ?
[06:05] <cjwatson>      from AppInstall.CoreMenu import *
[06:05] <cjwatson>  ImportError: No module named AppInstall.CoreMenu
[06:05] <iwj> cjwatson: Freaky.  Probably not my fault, either :-).
[06:05] <cjwatson> not blocking me, I just noticed the crash log right after an Intel Mac install
[06:06] <iwj> cjwatson: Right.  Fair enough.
[06:06] <cjwatson> looked like python2.5 breakage maybe
[06:06] <iwj> cjwatson: You might like to mention that one to mvo.
[06:07] <cjwatson> I shall, thanks
[06:08] <cjwatson> iwj: bizarre, it works when I rerun it. I'll have to dig through logs ...
[06:09] <iwj> cjwatson: Urgle.
[06:37] <rexbron> hello,
[06:37] <rexbron> where can I find information on why a source package was rejected from the NEW queue?
[06:37] <rexbron> there are no bugs filled against the source package
[06:38] <cjwatson> the admin doing the reject normally sends a mail to the uploader and ccs ubuntu-archive
[06:38] <cjwatson> what package?
[06:38] <cjwatson> there can be no bugs filed (not filled) against the source package until it is in the archive
[06:39] <_MMA_> cjwatson: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/feisty/+queue?queue_state=4&queue_text=murr
[06:39] <_MMA_> Thats what rexbron is referencing.
[06:40] <cjwatson> From: Tollef Fog Heen <tfheen@canonical.com>
[06:40] <cjwatson> To: Andrew Hunter <andy.hunter@rogers.com>
[06:40] <cjwatson> Subject: murrine rejected
[06:40] <cjwatson> Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 11:54:03 +0100
[06:40] <cjwatson> Message-ID: <87lkjzmgms.fsf@thosu.err.no>
[06:41] <rexbron> ok ty
[06:41] <rexbron> silly me
[06:41] <cjwatson> (for those watching: incorrect debian/copyright)
[06:42] <_MMA_> Thanx cjwatson.
[07:24] <mdke> mako: seems sensible
[07:26] <mdke> elmo: major hugs
[07:26] <Mithrandir> mdke: -docs accepted today, btw.  I was just blind or diff was playing games with me or something..
[07:27] <elmo> mdke: eh - if you mean ubuntu-it, Ng did all the work
[07:27] <mdke> Mithrandir: saw it, thanks :)
[07:27] <mdke> elmo: I'll hug him separately
[07:28] <mdke> elmo: since you're here and he isn't, is it ok to add users for the other people I mentioned? 
[07:28] <mdke> oh, some are there already as separate users
[07:35] <elmo> mdke: still need me to do anything?  otherwise, I need to duck out
[07:36] <mdke> elmo: if you can yeah. the server directories are owned by root
[07:36] <elmo> duh
[07:38] <mdke> thanks
[07:46] <elmo> mdke: I have to duck out, if you need anything more, best followup to RT for now
[07:46] <mdke> elmo: fair enough, thanks. Have a good weekend
[07:48] <allee> doko: any idea why digikam fails to dyn. loading <name.so> libgphoto2 plugins in dapper and still in debian sid? Edgy and feisty are okay.   
[07:50] <allee> doko: http://bugs.debian.org/390703  http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=125696 
[07:50] <Ubugtu> Debian bug 125696 in ssh "on a fresh install sshd_config can't talk with older version" [Unknown,Closed]  
[07:50] <ogra> Seveas, ^^^^^^^^^ intresting Ubugtu bug
[07:51] <allee> doko: sorry http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=396249
[07:51] <Ubugtu> Debian bug 396249 in libgphoto2-2 "libgphoto2-2-dev needed" [Important,Closed]  
[09:29] <Mithrandir> doko: should I remove gcc-4.0 from the archive?
[10:08] <Mithrandir> ogra: you're aware that pulse will now ftbfs due to a missing MIR for libasyncns?
[10:08] <ogra> meh, no
[10:08] <ogra> hmm, pitti didnt see that either ... 
[10:09] <ogra> i'll add the MIR tomorrow, doesnt seem like i'll get it reviewed before the weekend anyway
[10:09] <Mithrandir> sure, no hurry.
[10:10] <giskard> MIR?
[10:10] <ogra> well, i'd like to have it off the table ...
[10:10] <Mithrandir> ogra: *shrug*, I have enough other stuff to do this weekend.
[10:10] <ogra> its trivial but took me half the dev cycle already
[10:10] <ogra> well, me too indeed
[10:10] <Lure> giskard: Main Inclusion Report
[10:11] <Mithrandir> ogra: there's no reason why a main promotion should take more than a week or so, even when not fast-tracked.
[10:13] <ogra> Mithrandir, it were only three days since i added the dep, thats fine ... i had and still have other probs with pulse tat i didnt expect ...
[10:16] <gnomefreak> are we expecting to see gnome 2.18 this month? gnome has 2.18 beta1 release on jan 22nd. or are we gonna wait for a more stable release
[10:17] <mdke> gnomefreak: we always get new gnome releases, no?
[10:17] <Nafallo> gnomefreak: devel always have the latest gnome, no?
[10:17] <mdke> generally on the *same day*
[10:17] <Nafallo> mdke: :-)
[10:17] <Nafallo> mdke: same hour ;-)
[10:17] <mdke> heh, that would be insane
[10:18] <gnomefreak> mdke: Nafallo i know we will get it but i dont know if its around the same day or do we wait for a more stable 2.18 release
[10:18] <Nafallo> mdke: well. we ARE talking about seb and daniel ;-)
[10:18] <tepsipakki> gnomefreak: 2.18 will be released in March
[10:18] <mdke> gnomefreak: we've had every 2.17 release as soon as the tarballs were out, I haven't heard any rumours that that will stop happening
[10:18] <Nafallo> gnomefreak: the two mentioned always package everything all the time. they are like packaging-monkeys :-)
[10:19] <Nafallo> or worse even :-)
[10:19] <Nafallo> but I helped them with a package yesterday! *proud* ;-)
[10:21] <bddebian> heh
[10:26] <tepsipakki> put seb and daniel hitting 'debuild -S' for an infinite amount of time, and you'll end up with a package including the entire works of Shakespeare, no?
[10:26] <LaserJock> haha
[10:28] <tepsipakki> mm, but would it be distributable? :)
[10:34] <Kw4k> http://www.visitallday.com/default.asp?partner=Kwak
[10:38] <Nafallo> tepsipakki: that's up to Mithrandir ;-)
[11:45] <jdong> random community process question: what governance body handles the revocation of Ubuntu membership? the CC?
[11:46] <mdke> jdong: there isn't a policy for that. But yeah, it would be the CC if it ever came up
[11:46] <mdke> jdong: it would be sad if that were needed
[11:47] <jdong> mdke: ok, cool. It was a purely hypothetical question to help me template some forum policies.....
[11:53] <crimsun> cjwatson: ping, do -metas ({k,x,}ubuntu-meta) need to distribute a COPYING, or is simply using ubuntu-meta's debian/copyright sufficient for ubuntustudio-meta?
[11:55] <mdke> crimsun: you got any time?
[11:56] <mdke> crimsun: thought we might go through some audio troubles
[12:05] <crimsun> mdke: hi.
[12:06] <mdke> crimsun: fancy it?
[12:06] <crimsun> sure, awaiting details.
[12:06] <mdke> crimsun: I can file a bug if you prefer