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| manchicken | Riddell: The only adept spec left in the C++ realm is the tooltip for the main repo indicator icon. | 01:17 |
|---|---|---|
| jjesse | evening | 01:18 |
| manchicken | Evening. | 01:18 |
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| mcquaid | sorry asking here, as I'm not getting much info in +1. the alternate cd install (herd2) just sits there indefinitely with a blue screen after selecting the keyboard. is there a workaround for this? | 01:36 |
| yuriy | manchicken: you're working on the feistyadeptchanges spec? are there any plans to do the adept-usability spec? | 01:38 |
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| Hobbsee | anyone interested in porting the usplash-switcher to QT? | 02:10 |
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| jdong | Hobbsee: no. gtk is technologically superior ;-) | 02:25 |
| === jdong puts on heavy-duty flamesuit | ||
| Hobbsee | pft | 02:26 |
| === Hobbsee defenestrates jdong | ||
| jdong | Hobbsee: nah, I've already uninstalled Windows on most my boxes | 02:27 |
| manchicken | jdong: I disagree with your gtk statement ^_^ | 02:27 |
| jdong | manchicken: good. now start arguing :) | 02:27 |
| manchicken | jdong: Qt has threading nicely built in, network protocols nicely built in, and it doesn't look like CDE puked all over my system ;) | 02:28 |
| jdong | O RLY? :D | 02:28 |
| manchicken | Really ^_^ | 02:29 |
| jdong | manchicken: the correct response is "YA RLY" | 02:29 |
| jdong | manchicken: sheesh haven't you ever had AOL buddies before :D | 02:30 |
| manchicken | jdong: I'm a different kind of smartass. My sincerest apologies. | 02:30 |
| jdong | alright, fine, apology accepted | 02:31 |
| manchicken | heh | 02:31 |
| manchicken | Are there any KDE conferences that go on in the USA? | 02:31 |
| manchicken | I think I may try to find a C++ conference. | 02:32 |
| manchicken | My boss wants me to do some training stuff... | 02:32 |
| manchicken | Like, formal training stuff. | 02:32 |
| manchicken | Just to "drive my personal career development." | 02:32 |
| jdong | Hobbsee: and if it makes you feel better deep down inside, I found yet another unmount dialog bug, but in GNOME :D | 02:36 |
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| Hobbsee | jdong: woot :P | 02:37 |
| Hobbsee | jdong: so make the GNOME pepole fix all of htem :P | 02:38 |
| jdong | lol | 02:38 |
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| jjesse | hello | 02:58 |
| jjesse | good evening Hobbsee | 02:58 |
| Hobbsee | hey jjesse! :D | 02:59 |
| Hobbsee | jjesse: i see you're a co-author! | 02:59 |
| jjesse | Hobbsee: of??? | 02:59 |
| jjesse | the ubuntu book? | 02:59 |
| Hobbsee | jjesse: official ubuntu book? | 02:59 |
| Hobbsee | yeah | 02:59 |
| jjesse | yeah | 02:59 |
| Hobbsee | :) | 02:59 |
| Hobbsee | well done | 02:59 |
| === Hobbsee saw it on the ubuntu stand at LCA open day | ||
| jjesse | thanks, i'm working on an update for feisty so feel free to email me any changes/additions you would like made | 03:00 |
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| Hobbsee | :) | 03:00 |
| nixternal | speaking of which, I still need to do jjesse :) | 03:01 |
| jjesse | yeah you | 03:01 |
| jjesse | nixternal: got my DSL hooked up so im now in the 21st century | 03:01 |
| nixternal | woohoo | 03:02 |
| nixternal | i was surprised to see you online tonight, and then i realised you must have gotten it already :) | 03:02 |
| Hobbsee | jjesse: yay!!!! | 03:02 |
| nixternal | hiya Hobbsee! | 03:02 |
| Hobbsee | hey nixternal | 03:02 |
| Hobbsee | ! | 03:02 |
| === nixternal just got in from school | ||
| nixternal | i had 4 classes today | 03:03 |
| nixternal | 8am to 8pm | 03:03 |
| nixternal | i am exhausted | 03:03 |
| Hobbsee | eek! | 03:03 |
| jjesse | yah i wasn't suposed to have it until tomorrow night | 03:03 |
| Hobbsee | where school is uni/college? | 03:03 |
| nixternal | yes Hobbsee | 03:03 |
| jjesse | wife loves the fact that i'm not kicking her off the computer | 03:03 |
| nixternal | hehe, my girlfriend is loving her cable modem, but she is rich so paying all that money isn't killing her | 03:04 |
| nixternal | anthrapology is going to be nuts. i think i have hitler for an instructor | 03:05 |
| nixternal | she said the only excused absense is your death | 03:05 |
| jjesse | wow that's crazy | 03:07 |
| Hobbsee | heh | 03:08 |
| nixternal | ya, my psych teacher is cool, my tech journalist instructor is cool, and my other instructor is cool, i forgot the clas | 03:08 |
| nixternal | oh, like saving a business from failure, thats what we will learn but I can't remember the name :) | 03:09 |
| canllaith | anthropology, you mean? :) | 03:09 |
| nixternal | what did i say? | 03:09 |
| canllaith | anthra :P | 03:09 |
| nixternal | doh | 03:10 |
| Jucato | hi Hobbsee, hi canllaith, hi nixternal, hi jjesse! | 03:10 |
| nixternal | hi | 03:10 |
| nixternal | Jucato: | 03:10 |
| nixternal | hi | 03:10 |
| Hobbsee | it's the famous canllaith!!! | 03:10 |
| Hobbsee | hey Jucato! | 03:10 |
| Jucato | yes, the ever so famous canllaith | 03:10 |
| Jucato | :) | 03:10 |
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| jjesse | hiya Jucato | 03:21 |
| jjesse | nixternal: are you able to create that debdiff for Riddell for kubuntu-docs? | 03:25 |
| nixternal | for Edgy? | 03:26 |
| === Jucato is reminded about his customizing kubuntu wiki... | ||
| jjesse | yeah, per the email converstation | 03:26 |
| nixternal | i think it will just contain the translations, making it a HUGE debdiff | 03:26 |
| jjesse | nixternal: ok, i jsut hope we can get that bug fixed | 03:26 |
| jjesse | kinda embarassing | 03:26 |
| nixternal | i think that is the only major bug for edgy docs | 03:27 |
| jjesse | yeah it is, but a prety major one i think | 03:27 |
| nixternal | there were a bunch of string boogs, but those won't get fixed | 03:27 |
| nixternal | alright, getting the source now, I need to get the edgy branch checked out as well | 03:28 |
| jjesse | ok | 03:28 |
| nixternal | another bug we could fix for edgy is the firefox start page with broken links | 03:28 |
| nixternal | but i don't think that one is all that major truthfully and would require a silly hack in order to fix it | 03:29 |
| nixternal | that is why i created a browser-startpage in /trunk/kubuntu as you have probably already noticed | 03:29 |
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| nixternal | jjesse: what was the status of the adept guide in edgy? was it broke? | 03:45 |
| === Jucato thinks there's a major communication problem in trying to guide how to enable/add multiverse in Adept... but none of it is the doc teams fault.. | ||
| nixternal | of course it isn't | 03:48 |
| nixternal | we are never at fault :) | 03:48 |
| Jucato | heheh :) | 03:49 |
| Jucato | I had a bunch of corrections/typos/suggestions for the Kubuntu Desktop Guide last month... I unfortunately lost them all | 03:49 |
| nixternal | don't worry, we have wiped away the desktop guide | 03:51 |
| nixternal | and for the SRU we are only doing translations and no string editing | 03:51 |
| Jucato | wiped away? | 03:51 |
| nixternal | no more desktop guide | 03:51 |
| Jucato | :O | 03:51 |
| nixternal | Topic Based Help | 03:51 |
| Jucato | ok good thing you told me... | 03:51 |
| nixternal | aka, system docs now | 03:51 |
| Jucato | I was about to re-read the whole thing | 03:51 |
| nixternal | there is so much work to be done yet | 03:52 |
| nixternal | i am so busy with school right now, i went from 6 solid Kubuntu/KDE days down to 2 maybe 3 | 03:52 |
| Jucato | I see... but what about printed copies/guides? | 03:52 |
| Jucato | heh of course, almost all of us have lives outside Kubuntu :) | 03:52 |
| nixternal | i didn't really :) | 03:53 |
| Jucato | unless you're lucky to be employed by Canonical :) | 03:53 |
| nixternal | jjesse: building new kubuntu-docs package now | 03:53 |
| nixternal | the new package might be easier to provide everything isntead of a debdiff :) | 03:53 |
| nixternal | im going to finish this and then im going to bed. i am getting to old | 03:54 |
| Jucato | aw :( | 03:54 |
| Jucato | no you're not | 03:55 |
| nixternal | i need to do some reading | 03:55 |
| Jucato | ok, let me not keep you from your education | 03:56 |
| Jucato | and good luck | 03:56 |
| nixternal | hehe | 03:57 |
| nixternal | I have Kubuntu work I have to finish first :) | 03:58 |
| Jucato | ok, then let me not keep you from your more important Kubuntu work :P | 03:58 |
| nixternal | well, there isn't much you can do when running pbuilder, so you can either talk to me or hold me, your choice :) | 03:58 |
| jjesse | nixternal: thanks | 03:59 |
| Jucato | read while running pbuilder? :P | 03:59 |
| nixternal | i read in bed, because 2 minutes after opening the book i am passed out :) | 03:59 |
| nixternal | i learn a lot that way | 03:59 |
| Jucato | lol | 03:59 |
| nixternal | jjesse: it will be building for a while, there are a ton of translations in Edgy that weren't in Dapper | 03:59 |
| jjesse | i bet ther was | 03:59 |
| nixternal | I had to tweak the Makefile, remove old directories (quickstart and quickguide), I removed the adept guide as well because it isn't built at all in the documentation | 04:00 |
| jjesse | good job | 04:01 |
| jjesse | maybe one day i can learn :) | 04:01 |
| nixternal | jjesse: I have really only recently started learning | 04:01 |
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| nixternal | so it isn't all that difficult if I can do it, that's for sure | 04:01 |
| nixternal | man, I started my leaning session for my diet this week. This is so hard to do because I am so used to taking in 5000+ calories a day | 04:02 |
| nixternal | and now I am cutting down to about 1750 to 2000 for the next month to 2 months | 04:03 |
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| nixternal | im starving, and i just had my last snack of the day | 04:04 |
| nixternal | argh | 04:04 |
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| === Topic for #kubuntu-devel: Welcome to #kubuntu-devel | Happy Newness! | Merge ! http://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html | https://features.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/feisty/+specs | Bugs! https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-team/+packagebugs | Please test KDE 3.5.6 on feisty | ||
| === Topic (#kubuntu-devel): set by Hobbsee at Fri Jan 19 08:18:37 2007 | ||
| yuriy | here it is http://blogs.ubuntu-nl.org/dennis/2006/09/13/more-fun-with-usplash/ | 04:46 |
| yuriy | having trouble compiling though... i got libgtk2.0-dev but it's complaining about not finding gtk.h... | 04:51 |
| Jucato | if only usplash itself was so easily customizable... | 04:52 |
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| yuriy | got it working. neat! | 05:16 |
| yuriy | jeez a qapplication template is as long as this whole program | 05:21 |
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| Tonio_ | aloha ! | 10:20 |
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| Jucato | hi Tonio_! hi kwwii! | 10:23 |
| kwwii | moin Jucato | 10:23 |
| Tonio_ | hey guys | 10:29 |
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| freeflying | Tonio_: hi | 10:35 |
| Tonio_ | hey freeflying | 10:37 |
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| Tonio_ | is someone there using kde 3.5.6 and kopete ? | 11:00 |
| Tonio_ | I just noticed a bug but I'd like to be sure it's not local problem | 11:01 |
| Jucato | Tonio_: I am, but not from Kubuntu :( | 11:01 |
| Tonio_ | ah... :) | 11:01 |
| Jucato | mine is from SVN | 11:01 |
| Tonio_ | okay, thanks but I need feedback from Riddell's packages ;) | 11:03 |
| Jucato | ah ok :) | 11:03 |
| kwwii | Tonio_: I am using edgy with 3.5.6, should I test something in kopete? | 11:04 |
| Tonio_ | yup | 11:04 |
| Tonio_ | when someone talks to you and kopete sits in the systray | 11:04 |
| Tonio_ | the notification yellow popup doesn't work here anymore | 11:05 |
| Tonio_ | I just get the icon blinking | 11:05 |
| Tonio_ | can you confirm ? | 11:05 |
| Jucato | hm... | 11:05 |
| Jucato | can I confirm? | 11:05 |
| Tonio_ | I tried to play with settings etc.... nothing works | 11:05 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: yup if you see the issue :) | 11:05 |
| Jucato | I think it's been filed in b.k.o | 11:05 |
| Tonio_ | and kwwii too | 11:05 |
| Jucato | yes I do :) | 11:05 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: I can't see the bug on that f*cking bts ;) | 11:06 |
| Tonio_ | is there a bug id ? | 11:06 |
| Jucato | hehe I'll look for the logs | 11:06 |
| Tonio_ | okay | 11:06 |
| Tonio_ | so that's confirmed thanks ;) | 11:06 |
| Tonio_ | I have a series of patches to apply to kde packages once 3.5.6 is released, so I'll do that then | 11:06 |
| Jucato | https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=140307 | 11:06 |
| Ubugtu | KDE bug 140307 in general "Kopete's balloon stops working with 3.5.6" [Critical,New] | 11:06 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: that's a known bug | 11:06 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay | 11:06 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: it's the reason 3.5.6 is delayed and not being released now | 11:07 |
| Tonio_ | looks like a kicker bug | 11:07 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: ah ? ;) | 11:07 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: try kicker from 3.5.5 to confirm | 11:07 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: good point, now they don't release with critical issues ? ;) | 11:07 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: yep I'm gonna do this | 11:08 |
| Riddell | others suggested it was kwin | 11:08 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: well hard to test with kicker 3.5.5 ans kwin 3.5.6 ;) | 11:09 |
| Riddell | why? | 11:09 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I'mm looking at the deps | 11:10 |
| Tonio_ | hum okay no deps on that point, I'm just reinstalling kicker | 11:10 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: bah I can't get the applets without changing the all kde..... pain... | 11:14 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: that's okay, I have old kicker and recent kwin | 11:21 |
| Tonio_ | argh the bug is still there | 11:21 |
| Riddell | try kwin from 3.5.5 | 11:23 |
| Riddell | then try kopete from 3.5.5 | 11:23 |
| Tonio_ | yes that's what I'm doing now | 11:24 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: the bug occurs in every combinason | 11:34 |
| Tonio_ | I replaced kicker, then updated kicker and replaced kwin, then updated kwin and replaced kopete | 11:35 |
| Tonio_ | I have the issue in any case | 11:35 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: sorry for the bad news ;) | 11:37 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I'll comment on the kubuntu bug | 11:37 |
| === Jucato wonders what causes the bug then... | ||
| Riddell | Tonio_: what if you downgrade to 3.5.5 kicker, kwin and kopete? | 11:44 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: testing ;) | 11:45 |
| === Tonio_ beleives Riddell really want him to break his config :) | ||
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: just tested | 12:11 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: and..? | 12:11 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I replaced kwin, kicker, kopete and due to deps, kdm, kdebase-data, kdebase-bin, kdesktop | 12:11 |
| Tonio_ | fails too, bug is there | 12:11 |
| Tonio_ | I would say that's kdelibs | 12:12 |
| Riddell | next thing to downgrade then :) | 12:13 |
| Tonio_ | argh | 12:13 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I just killed my all profile ;) | 12:13 |
| Riddell | the future of KDE depends on you! | 12:13 |
| Jucato | heh | 12:13 |
| raphink | hahahaha | 12:13 |
| raphink | you can do it Tonio! | 12:14 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: hum would that help ? downgrading the all kdelibs means downgrading everything..... | 12:14 |
| Tonio_ | okay testing... | 12:14 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: I'd say downgrade everything and get it working, then upgrade bits to see when it breaks | 12:14 |
| === Jucato cheers Tonio_ on | ||
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay so tracking this is the plan of the day ? | 12:15 |
| === Tonio_ suddenly remembers he has to go to the mall, get his car repaired and really, really needs to clean his appartment | ||
| Tonio_ | okay let's go :( | 12:16 |
| Tonio_ | 132 packages removed.......... | 12:17 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: reinstalling the all kde thing, version 3.5.5 | 12:22 |
| Tonio_ | if the problem occurs, I promiss to go kill myself immediately | 12:22 |
| Riddell | that's a bit harsh | 12:26 |
| Riddell | just take it out on the computer | 12:26 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: depends on my feeling at that moment :) | 12:26 |
| viviersf | Riddell, ive just seen release-proposed repositories for the first time, what exactly goes in there ? | 12:29 |
| Riddell | viviersf: it's for testing stable release updates | 12:32 |
| Riddell | we have a long and beurocratic process for SRUs now | 12:32 |
| Riddell | but in brief packages once approved go to edgy-proposed, they get tested by people and if there's no problems after a week they go to edgy-updates for everyone to use | 12:33 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay works with 3.5.5 | 12:33 |
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| Tonio_ | I'm upgrading kopete first, then kdelibs | 12:34 |
| Riddell | you probably can't do that | 12:34 |
| Tonio_ | no maybe kdelibs first | 12:34 |
| Riddell | worth a shot but | 12:34 |
| Tonio_ | well I'll try :) we'll see | 12:34 |
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| Tonio_ | upgrading this at the moment :kdelibs-data kdelibs4c2a | 12:36 |
| Riddell | make sure you're starting kopete from the command line | 12:36 |
| Riddell | else it'll use old libs | 12:36 |
| Tonio_ | well I'm reloading the all desktop everytime just to be sure | 12:36 |
| Riddell | that'll do it too :) | 12:36 |
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| Tonio_ | okay I'm on irc with kopete that'll be easier | 12:38 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: can you post a message in 5 seconds ? | 12:38 |
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| Tonio_ | now ! | 12:38 |
| Tonio_ | okay with new kdelibs it's okay | 12:39 |
| Tonio_ | upgrading kopete now | 12:39 |
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| viviersf | ah thanks Riddell | 12:44 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: hi | 12:45 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: works with kopete 3.5.6 and kdelibs 3.5.6 | 12:45 |
| Tonio_ | upgrading kwin now | 12:45 |
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| === Hobbsee waves | ||
| === Riddell surfs | ||
| Hobbsee | hey Riddell :) | 12:49 |
| === Hobbsee falls over | ||
| Hobbsee | Riddell: argh....what did they *do* to the desktop settings??? | 12:53 |
| Hobbsee | looks like they've massacred crystal! | 12:54 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: dist-upgrade again, I fixed that that night | 01:00 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: what hte heck did you do??? | 01:00 |
| === Hobbsee didnt know it was possible to make it so unshiny and so unpretty... | ||
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: I uploaded a bad version of kwincrystalrc | 01:02 |
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| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: I uploaded a bad version of kwincrystalrc | 01:04 |
| Tonio_ | should be okay in the latest kds | 01:04 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: it's still killed! | 01:04 |
| Mez | https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kubuntu-devel/2007-January/001530.html | 01:05 |
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| Hobbsee | Tonio_: ahh. that's better. i grabbed the feisty version | 01:08 |
| Hobbsee | s/feisty/edgy | 01:08 |
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| Tonio_ | can someone post a message please ? | 01:15 |
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| Hobbsee | Tonio_: heya! | 01:15 |
| Hobbsee | ooh, pink kde!!! | 01:15 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: failed when I upgraded kwin..... | 01:16 |
| Tonio_ | strange....... | 01:16 |
| Tonio_ | should be a dep of kwin then, or a combinason of issues.... | 01:16 |
| Tonio_ | kde 3.5.6 with kopete, kwin 3.5.5 bug is there | 01:16 |
| Tonio_ | kde 3.5.5 with kwin 3.5.6, bug is there........ nonsense :) | 01:17 |
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| gnomefreak | pink kde? | 01:17 |
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| Hobbsee | gnomefreak: yeah, was playing with themes | 01:17 |
| gnomefreak | ah | 01:17 |
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| Tonio__ | Riddell: I don't understand at all ;) | 01:19 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I lost my konversation historic, can you remind me the bug id please ? | 01:23 |
| === Hobbsee raises an eyebrow at https://launchpad.net/bugs/78811 | ||
| Ubugtu | Malone bug 78811 in kdebase "CAN'T UMOUNT REMOVABLE MEDIA" [Undecided,Needs info] | 01:25 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: yeah thats a pitty | 01:25 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: for example when you want to format a usb key with qtparted | 01:26 |
| Tonio_ | I'm really wondering if we should keep _Sime's patches if they are not improved for feisty.... | 01:27 |
| Tonio_ | they are resolving lots of issue, but creating many ones too | 01:27 |
| Hobbsee | indeed | 01:30 |
| Hobbsee | do they *really* solve much at all? | 01:30 |
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| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: they do resolve all gtk apps issues with medias | 01:35 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: that's a lot ;) | 01:35 |
| Hobbsee | ah yes, of course. | 01:35 |
| Tonio_ | but they create lots of other issues, with logout/login, with qtparted, with any app that requires that the media is unmounted | 01:36 |
| Tonio_ | it seems they don't work the same way on every machine | 01:36 |
| Tonio_ | I have a usb key that doesn't work anymore on my computer | 01:36 |
| Tonio_ | but works in /media | 01:36 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: we couldnt do along the lines of "if a non-kde app is using it, use /media, else use media:/" ? | 01:36 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: hard to do ;) | 01:36 |
| Hobbsee | or symlink /media to media:/ or something? | 01:37 |
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| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: but well as feisty is the latest kde3 based version of kubuntu, we have to consider it as an lts | 01:37 |
| Tonio_ | and in my opinion, we should rediscuss this | 01:37 |
| Hobbsee | yes - but what's the solution though? | 01:37 |
| Tonio_ | the point is that /media related issues are undocumented over the net | 01:37 |
| Hobbsee | yeah | 01:37 |
| Tonio_ | the /media:/ issues with gtk apps are | 01:37 |
| Tonio_ | media:/ sorry | 01:37 |
| Hobbsee | indeed | 01:37 |
| Tonio_ | so maybe it's better to let people with those issues since they can find help everywhere, on any board etc.... | 01:38 |
| Tonio_ | kde4 will correct those issues out of the box, that's the good point | 01:38 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: another issue is the naming of the desktop icons | 01:38 |
| Tonio_ | disk1 is really crappy | 01:38 |
| Tonio_ | kde native does a great translated naming | 01:39 |
| Hobbsee | woot :) | 01:39 |
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| Tonio_ | we should discuss this and vote at the next kubuntu-meeting | 01:39 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: so what does this "help" entail? | 01:39 |
| Tonio_ | it was interesting to test with edgy, now we have to debate this for a stable release | 01:39 |
| Tonio_ | which "help" are you talking about ? | 01:40 |
| Hobbsee | [23:38] <Tonio_> so maybe it's better to let people with those issues since they can find help everywhere, on any board etc.... <-- that help | 01:40 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: the fact that the standard kde issues are documented everywhere on the next board etc.... | 01:41 |
| Tonio_ | the kubuntu specific issues aren't | 01:41 |
| Tonio_ | that's a problem | 01:41 |
| Hobbsee | is there *any* way to fix both sets of issues? | 01:42 |
| Hobbsee | ah yes, true | 01:42 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: nope except improving the patches, but that's really hard job | 01:42 |
| Hobbsee | hrm | 01:43 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: the point is that all kubuntu apps, even openoffice deal correctly with media:/ | 01:43 |
| Tonio_ | only gnome apps fail | 01:43 |
| Tonio_ | well edgy was to test new things | 01:43 |
| Tonio_ | new we have to debate this and looks at the consequences | 01:43 |
| Hobbsee | right. patching all the gnome apps to behave isnt a solution, presumably | 01:43 |
| Tonio_ | my opinion is "get the patches improved or remove them" | 01:43 |
| Hobbsee | that would be mine as well | 01:44 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: the solution is kde4 ;) | 01:44 |
| Hobbsee | well, yeah. but that hasnt been released yet :) :P | 01:44 |
| Tonio_ | and honnestly I don't think _Sime will have time for this actually | 01:44 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: that's the problem, we have to decide which issues we want to have | 01:44 |
| Hobbsee | yes...he seems pretty busy | 01:44 |
| Tonio_ | to me, on the desktop part, for a normal usage, the old media:/ is less problematic | 01:44 |
| Tonio_ | only gtk apps are involved, that's it | 01:45 |
| Tonio_ | the new creates lots of issues on the standard desktop usage | 01:45 |
| Tonio_ | like formatting a drive with qtparted, crappy render on the desktop "icon names" | 01:45 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: another example, insert an audiocd and go to /media | 01:45 |
| Hobbsee | sorry to beat the horse repeatedly here, but is there *any* way of fixing the gtk apps, short of patching? | 01:46 |
| Tonio_ | then click on the cd -> blank folder | 01:46 |
| Hobbsee | yeah | 01:46 |
| === Hobbsee has noticed that | ||
| Tonio_ | that's why the desktop icon still uses audiocd:/ | 01:46 |
| === Hobbsee notes that you can probably type /media into gtk apps? | ||
| Tonio_ | but john doe will probably not figure and understand that | 01:46 |
| Hobbsee | yeah | 01:46 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: yes you can | 01:46 |
| Tonio_ | there are lots os issues like this one | 01:47 |
| Hobbsee | then lets pull the patches. | 01:47 |
| Tonio_ | to mount network shares too, doesn't work anymore | 01:47 |
| Tonio_ | and that causes another problem : | 01:47 |
| Tonio_ | all kde docs are broken due to those patches | 01:47 |
| Hobbsee | that's the only thing that's effected by pulling the patches? the gtk apps? or have i missed something? | 01:47 |
| Tonio_ | someone trying to do something according to the kde docs will stay locked on the computer | 01:47 |
| Hobbsee | yep | 01:47 |
| Tonio_ | mostly gtk apps issues yes | 01:48 |
| === \sh is now known as \sh_away | ||
| Tonio_ | some kde apps have problems with media:/ | 01:48 |
| Hobbsee | maybe put something in the kubuntu-specific notes about gtk needing to use /media instead of media:/ by typing it in - but i think we need to pull the patches | 01:48 |
| Hobbsee | oh? | 01:48 |
| Tonio_ | but that's generally a matter of patching the desktop file | 01:48 |
| Tonio_ | which we do | 01:48 |
| Hobbsee | ah | 01:48 |
| Tonio_ | in the current stage I would vote for removing them yes | 01:48 |
| Hobbsee | pity Riddell isnt around | 01:49 |
| Tonio_ | because to me feisty is an lts | 01:49 |
| Hobbsee | and it needs to work. | 01:49 |
| Tonio_ | feisty+1 will probably not be that mature | 01:49 |
| Hobbsee | heh, no. | 01:49 |
| Hobbsee | not if it's got kde 4.0 in there | 01:49 |
| Tonio_ | it'll have kde4 for sure, unless kde4 is a peace if shit :) | 01:50 |
| Hobbsee | hehe :) | 01:50 |
| Tonio_ | feisty+1 will be experimental | 01:50 |
| Tonio_ | edgy was experimental | 01:50 |
| Hobbsee | do we need to pull them now, or should we ask if anyone has some major gripe about them on the mailing list first? | 01:50 |
| === Jucato thinks they're expecting 4.0 to be at least a bit shitty if not shifty... | ||
| Tonio_ | so feisty is the only stable and mature version of kubuntu to be released between dapper and feisty+2 | 01:51 |
| Tonio_ | that's 18 month ! | 01:51 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: ouch. lets pull them - or go to the ML first? | 01:51 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: bah if _Sime didn't do better it's probably because the all kde structure is based on media:/ and ioslaves | 01:51 |
| Tonio_ | that's an horribly complicated thing o change....... | 01:52 |
| Hobbsee | yes....it's pretty much changing a core piece of kde | 01:52 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: I would say discuss on the meeting and decide... | 01:52 |
| Tonio_ | there is no emergency at the moment | 01:52 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: we dont have a time for the next meeting | 01:52 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: let's plan it :) | 01:52 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: it's just a fwe more weeks that we ahve for testing, and any regressions. | 01:52 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: bah it's okay | 01:53 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: the point is that we know what'll happen if we pull them | 01:53 |
| Tonio_ | standard kde behavior :) | 01:53 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: the other question is, do we pull the edgy version with a SRU, or jus tleave it? | 01:53 |
| Tonio_ | no surprise and no need to test, the issues are already well known | 01:53 |
| === Hobbsee is...wary of what this person will do, screaming over and over | ||
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: I'd say don't touch edgy | 01:53 |
| Hobbsee | ditto cimmo, if he sees it | 01:53 |
| Tonio_ | it's crappy, so let's focus on feisty | 01:53 |
| Hobbsee | fair enough | 01:53 |
| Tonio_ | the only thing I wanna fix on edgy is the knetworkmanager issue | 01:54 |
| Tonio_ | that's a pitty | 01:54 |
| Tonio_ | and the kwallet one too | 01:54 |
| Hobbsee | what was the kwallet one? | 01:54 |
| Hobbsee | yes...but putting thru SRU's is a bitch, so i dont do them :P | 01:54 |
| Tonio_ | looses passwords on session restore | 01:54 |
| Tonio_ | I have a patch for this | 01:54 |
| Tonio_ | I'm just waiting for 3.5.6 to put it in | 01:55 |
| Hobbsee | ah | 01:55 |
| Hobbsee | neat :) | 01:55 |
| Hobbsee | er...did we already have 3.5.6 edgy debs? | 01:55 |
| === Hobbsee looks | ||
| Tonio_ | not officials | 01:55 |
| Hobbsee | ah yes, right. not on kubuntu.org | 01:56 |
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| Tonio_ | we have to decide a date for the next meeting :) | 01:58 |
| Tonio_ | I'd like to propose a new kicker structure too | 01:58 |
| Hobbsee | what would it be? | 01:59 |
| Tonio_ | let me show you | 01:59 |
| === Jucato is curious.... | ||
| Tonio_ | http://tonio.homelinux.org/temp/capture5.png | 02:00 |
| Tonio_ | same space used, but desktop applet present, since lots of windows user complain they don't find the same in kubuntu | 02:00 |
| Tonio_ | and that's very usefull | 02:00 |
| Tonio_ | and I used the app launcher | 02:01 |
| Hobbsee | desktop applet? | 02:01 |
| Tonio_ | the left icon | 02:01 |
| Hobbsee | oh, show desktop? | 02:01 |
| Jucato | yeah | 02:01 |
| Tonio_ | yep | 02:01 |
| Tonio_ | and I used the app launcher | 02:01 |
| Hobbsee | those 6 little ones on the left - how did you make them go small? | 02:01 |
| Tonio_ | nobody knows that so we have to put it by default | 02:01 |
| Jucato | Quick Launcher | 02:01 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: I used the app launcher applet | 02:01 |
| Tonio_ | you can add whatever you want on it | 02:01 |
| Tonio_ | I just put all the power apps and that's it | 02:02 |
| Hobbsee | ahhh :) | 02:02 |
| Jucato | and reduced the virtual desktops to 2, right? | 02:02 |
| Hobbsee | so *that's* how they do it! | 02:02 |
| Tonio_ | nobody knows this applet which is a must have | 02:02 |
| Tonio_ | yep, that's enough for the common usage | 02:02 |
| Jucato | hm... | 02:02 |
| Jucato | wouldn't the quick launcher sort of (in some way) duplicate Katapult? | 02:02 |
| Hobbsee | no | 02:03 |
| Hobbsee | not really | 02:03 |
| Jucato | ok :) | 02:03 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: nobody knows katapult exist :) | 02:04 |
| Jucato | Tonio_: that's going to change, according to Mez, right? | 02:04 |
| Tonio_ | to me katapult is very usefull for apps I'm not using everyday | 02:04 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: we are going to rediscuss this on the next meeting | 02:04 |
| Tonio_ | I wanna enable the icon in the tray by default | 02:05 |
| Jucato | yes, please do :) | 02:05 |
| Tonio_ | so that people figure out it exists | 02:05 |
| Jucato | it's one of the ways you can "refresh" Katapult when you install a new app | 02:05 |
| Tonio_ | people that don't want the icon can remove it after installation | 02:05 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: true | 02:05 |
| Tonio_ | so what's your opinion on that new kicker structure ? | 02:05 |
| Hobbsee | argh. you cant actually move the kapp thingo | 02:05 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: no just right lick on the applet and add new app | 02:06 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: bah it works here | 02:06 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: yes, but once youv'e done work on it, you cnat actually move it down | 02:06 |
| Hobbsee | hwo'd you do it? | 02:06 |
| Tonio_ | I can slide an app from the kmenu to the launcher applet | 02:06 |
| Hobbsee | no, i mean move the launcher applet along the kicker | 02:06 |
| Jucato | er.. use the handles | 02:07 |
| Tonio_ | you can by clicking the little arrow on the left of the applet | 02:07 |
| Tonio_ | and configure it to "keep space" icons look better that way | 02:07 |
| Jucato | "Conserve space" (in English I think) | 02:07 |
| Tonio_ | you have a few kicker applets that you cannot move via right click, like the trash one | 02:07 |
| Hobbsee | ahhh... | 02:07 |
| Jucato | you can even set icon size :) | 02:07 |
| Tonio_ | the only universal way os the little arrow on the left of the applet | 02:08 |
| === Hobbsee prefers the not conserved space option, actually | ||
| Jucato | ditto Hobbsee | 02:08 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: yes sorry uncheck it ;) | 02:08 |
| Tonio_ | so yes, that applet is a killer and we should provide it by default in my opinion :) | 02:08 |
| Tonio_ | I hope you'll vote for me next meeting :) | 02:08 |
| Jucato | does a non-member's vote count? | 02:08 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: you know, i'd looked at that in the screenshots, and wondered how people got that effect... | 02:09 |
| Tonio_ | sure but not that much :) | 02:09 |
| Jucato | heh :) | 02:09 |
| Hobbsee | Jucato: why arent you a member yet? | 02:09 |
| Jucato | Hobbsee: funny you should ask that... | 02:09 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: yes, that's why I wanna provide that by default, so that people figure out what's possible | 02:09 |
| Hobbsee | :) | 02:09 |
| Jucato | someone asked me that exact same question last night... | 02:10 |
| Hobbsee | :) | 02:10 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: well technically the CC takes the decision, but of course of the all members want something different, that'll be debated ;) | 02:10 |
| Jucato | :) | 02:10 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: lock and logout buttons on there too would be good | 02:10 |
| Tonio_ | do you like my kicker arrangement ? | 02:10 |
| Tonio_ | hum on kicker ? | 02:11 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: any chance we coudl put rubbish in home:/ or something? | 02:11 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: that's already in the system applet | 02:11 |
| Jucato | I can't recall, but wasn the Trash can | 02:11 |
| Tonio_ | no duplicated please ;) | 02:11 |
| Jucato | rawr... | 02:11 |
| Jucato | the Trach icon on the desktop in Edgy? | 02:11 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: ahhh...that's the one i meant. | 02:11 |
| Hobbsee | the trash icon there has *always* annoyed me | 02:11 |
| Jucato | Hobbsee: where? desktop or panel? | 02:11 |
| Hobbsee | what's the point in having it there - most of the time, you dont want to clear the trash - why have it taking up screen space? | 02:12 |
| Hobbsee | panel.. desktop. either/both, actually | 02:12 |
| Jucato | heh | 02:12 |
| Lathiat | hobbsee: its to drag things too also | 02:12 |
| === neversfelde_ [n=chrman@nrbg-d9321241.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| Hobbsee | heya Lathiat :) | 02:12 |
| Lathiat | except i wonder how many people actually do that ;) | 02:12 |
| Lathiat | howdy | 02:12 |
| Tonio_ | http://tonio.homelinux.org/capture6.png | 02:12 |
| Jucato | you can drag on the desktop too, provided it's visible :) | 02:12 |
| Lathiat | I DEMAND USABILITY TESTING ;) | 02:12 |
| Hobbsee | Lathiat: ahhh...point. see, most people know about the "delete" key | 02:12 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: would you prefer this ? | 02:12 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: sure, i prefer 404'd images :P | 02:12 |
| Tonio_ | look on the right ;) | 02:12 |
| Tonio_ | http://tonio.homelinux.org/temp/capture6.png | 02:13 |
| Hobbsee | ahh yes, that looks better. | 02:13 |
| === neversfelde_ is now known as neversfelde | ||
| === Jucato thinks dragging to the trash applet is as unfamiliar to new users as pressing Ctrl+Alt+D... | ||
| Tonio_ | doesn't that duplicates a bit ? | 02:13 |
| Tonio_ | it's just on the bottom of kmenu..... | 02:13 |
| Jucato | good thing I'm not a member... I'd -1 the logout applet :) | 02:13 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: personnaly I prefer the trash applet on the left | 02:14 |
| Tonio_ | nearby the system applet | 02:14 |
| Tonio_ | but that's an ubuntu/kubuntu/xubuntu specific, we have to keep it on the right | 02:14 |
| Jucato | trash applet on the left? | 02:14 |
| Tonio_ | I'd -1 the logout applet too | 02:14 |
| Jucato | hehe unique :) | 02:15 |
| Tonio_ | well that can be discussed too, but we need something simple, since anyone has a different vision :) | 02:15 |
| Jucato | Hobbsee: I'd say that the logout applet on kicker is 1) a power user feature and 2) a GNOME "standard" (no GNOME bashing from me) | 02:15 |
| Hobbsee | indeed. it's something that i really miss in kde | 02:16 |
| Tonio_ | another one will want the file browser applet | 02:16 |
| Jucato | quick file browser? | 02:16 |
| Tonio_ | yup | 02:16 |
| Tonio_ | but please no ! | 02:16 |
| === gnomefreak wants | ||
| Hobbsee | haha | 02:16 |
| Jucato | heh soon our kicker will be corwded :) | 02:16 |
| === Hobbsee thwacks gnomefreak | ||
| Tonio_ | I use it, but that's not for the masse ! | 02:16 |
| gnomefreak | ;) | 02:16 |
| Tonio_ | bah wy not the 2 buttons | 02:16 |
| Tonio_ | kind of unify gnome/kde on ubuntu | 02:17 |
| Tonio_ | that's not that bad | 02:17 |
| Jucato | if Riddell agrees :) | 02:17 |
| Tonio_ | we have the trash on the right for the same reason so.... | 02:17 |
| === gnomefreak mad as crap with that damn docker still | ||
| Tonio_ | were is it on ubuntu ? | 02:17 |
| Jucato | bottom panel right | 02:17 |
| Tonio_ | right or left of the trash ? | 02:17 |
| === Hobbsee still cant really see the rationale on that trash, and dragging to trash | ||
| Jucato | err? | 02:17 |
| Tonio_ | the logout thing | 02:17 |
| Jucato | trash - bottom right, logut - top right | 02:18 |
| Jucato | logout even | 02:18 |
| Jucato | iirc | 02:18 |
| gnomefreak | thats right | 02:18 |
| Tonio_ | yeah that's a problem we only have one bar, better not put too many things on it, so logout/lock is maby too much | 02:18 |
| Tonio_ | http://tonio.homelinux.org/temp/capture5.png | 02:18 |
| Tonio_ | that's better ;) | 02:18 |
| Tonio_ | that also present all power apps instead of just konqueror/kontact | 02:19 |
| Tonio_ | amarok needs to be easilly accessible | 02:19 |
| Tonio_ | the content isn't the final of course, it is just the concept of using the launcher applet, | 02:19 |
| Tonio_ | killer and unknown thing | 02:20 |
| Hobbsee | i'm wondering about the kaffeine though - do you need it - if you are playing removable media, then it comes up anyway | 02:20 |
| Hobbsee | yeah | 02:20 |
| Tonio_ | no | 02:20 |
| Tonio_ | coulb be this in fact | 02:20 |
| === Jucato likes the fact that Konvi is there :) | ||
| Hobbsee | :) | 02:20 |
| Tonio_ | konqui, kopete, k3b, amarok | 02:20 |
| Jucato | but maybe Kopete instead of Konvi? | 02:20 |
| === gnomefreak didnt know konvi was popular | ||
| Tonio_ | I would say no | 02:20 |
| Tonio_ | k3b should be removed too | 02:20 |
| Hobbsee | Jucato: once kopete is started, it stays in the tray - no real need? | 02:20 |
| Jucato | true... | 02:21 |
| gnomefreak | Tonio_: k3b is widely used | 02:21 |
| Tonio_ | true ;) | 02:21 |
| Tonio_ | so like this ! | 02:21 |
| Jucato | but it's a quick launcher, a way to quickly launch apps | 02:21 |
| Hobbsee | gnomefreak: sure, but how often do you burn a cd? :P | 02:21 |
| gnomefreak | konvi over kopete IMHO | 02:21 |
| gnomefreak | Hobbsee: point | 02:21 |
| Tonio_ | hat's my point too | 02:21 |
| Tonio_ | kopete instead of konversatio | 02:21 |
| === Jucato is biased and would prefer konvi over kopete... but thinks more people are interested in IM than in IRC... | ||
| Hobbsee | does kopete usually start on startup? like, is there a setting for that? | 02:22 |
| Jucato | um nope it doesn't | 02:22 |
| Tonio_ | http://tonio.homelinux.org/temp/capture7.png | 02:22 |
| Jucato | unless it's saved in a session | 02:22 |
| Tonio_ | how about that ? | 02:22 |
| === gnomefreak perfers irssi over kopete or konvi | ||
| Tonio_ | can be gwenview too | 02:23 |
| Tonio_ | that's very usefull | 02:23 |
| Tonio_ | or digikam | 02:23 |
| Tonio_ | well any user can add what he wants after the installation | 02:23 |
| Tonio_ | the point is just showing the user the applet exists | 02:23 |
| gnomefreak | digikam == importer of photos from cam? | 02:23 |
| Tonio_ | that's the idea | 02:23 |
| Jucato | yep | 02:23 |
| Tonio_ | gnomefreak: yes | 02:23 |
| Jucato | but a bit more than that... | 02:23 |
| Tonio_ | the content is not important according to me | 02:23 |
| Jucato | I use it for photo/album organizing :) | 02:24 |
| gnomefreak | Tonio_: i like the idea of adding that than since alot of users use digi cams | 02:24 |
| Jucato | yeah, let's just basically tell them that such a feature exists, then let them customize :) | 02:24 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: that's it | 02:24 |
| Tonio_ | the default content is not the point | 02:24 |
| Jucato | gnomefreak: but,like Kaffeine, digikam could be launched when you plug in a camera, afaik | 02:24 |
| Tonio_ | that's the problem we also have with katapult | 02:24 |
| Tonio_ | it is there but who knows ? | 02:25 |
| gnomefreak | that would be better | 02:25 |
| Jucato | yeah, it's a problem seele had with katapult too :) | 02:25 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: true | 02:25 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: we need to change that | 02:25 |
| Jucato | she also had a problem of "what to do with katapult once launched" | 02:25 |
| Tonio_ | I discussed with Mez and we absolutly agree on that point | 02:25 |
| Tonio_ | we shouldn't hide the icon by default | 02:25 |
| Mez | ;) | 02:25 |
| Tonio_ | and let riddel hide it after installation since he hates systray icons :) | 02:26 |
| Jucato | lol | 02:26 |
| Mez | Tonio_, I see Riddell's POv | 02:26 |
| === Jucato loves systray icons... I'm weird that way | ||
| Mez | it's a notification area - whats it notifying you of | 02:26 |
| Tonio_ | true | 02:26 |
| Jucato | it notifies you that it exists... | 02:26 |
| Jucato | that it's running | 02:26 |
| Tonio_ | because I can't say a user "you wanna configure katapult ? | 02:27 |
| Tonio_ | okay let's do alt + space | 02:27 |
| Tonio_ | then ctrl + C | 02:27 |
| Jucato | you could also say the same for kmix | 02:27 |
| Tonio_ | sucks.... really ! | 02:27 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: exactly | 02:27 |
| Jucato | (besides, it's only GNOME that calls it notification area... we call it system tray) | 02:27 |
| Mez | Jucato, Riddell doesnt have kmix there either IIRC from when I was fiddling with his lappy | 02:27 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: I'm not even sure riddell uses the systray applet at all ;) | 02:28 |
| Jucato | Mez: we're unfortunately not blessed with Riddell's greatness... :( | 02:28 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell uses konsole + konqueror and that's it ;) | 02:28 |
| Mez | Tonio_, lol ... how did ou know ? | 02:28 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: I met him several times | 02:28 |
| Tonio_ | I think (unsure) he doesn't use contact for his mails | 02:29 |
| Tonio_ | but a command line thing | 02:29 |
| Tonio_ | don't recall the name... | 02:29 |
| Jucato | wow | 02:29 |
| Mez | Tonio_, I believe he uses mutt | 02:29 |
| Tonio_ | yes that's it | 02:29 |
| Jucato | a true blue, old-school Linux user :) | 02:29 |
| Tonio_ | well everybody can do what he wants, that's not the point | 02:29 |
| Tonio_ | but katapult has to fit in the systray as default option | 02:30 |
| Tonio_ | I would probably hide it, but the default hidden thing is a problem, really | 02:30 |
| Tonio_ | since any new user misses a true kubuntu unique feature | 02:30 |
| Tonio_ | my girlfriend uses kubuntu for 1 year now | 02:31 |
| Jucato | a very powerful true kubuntu unique feature | 02:31 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: I discussed with her 2 days ago, she didn't knew katapult at all | 02:31 |
| Tonio_ | I would even suggest that the popup at every boot should be there by default | 02:31 |
| Tonio_ | so that the user would test "alt + space" just to guess what it is | 02:31 |
| Tonio_ | then he can remove this if he wants | 02:31 |
| Tonio_ | it is important that the user is invited to perform an alt + space at the first boot, really | 02:32 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: no ? | 02:32 |
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| Tonio_ | then he can remove that easilly via the systray icon, and even hide the icon and that's it | 02:32 |
| === Mez shrugs | ||
| Tonio_ | we have to think like a newbie in front of kubuntu for the first time | 02:33 |
| === gnomefreak is still a newbie only been using ubuntu for a couple years | ||
| Jucato | lol | 02:33 |
| Jucato | one of Kubuntu's good images is being easy to learn/use for new Linux users. so let's try to keep that up :) | 02:34 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: bah concerning katapult, it is simply unvisible for the user actually | 02:36 |
| Tonio_ | invisible, sorry | 02:36 |
| Jucato | yeah | 02:36 |
| gnomefreak | Jucato: going too easy may cause drop in proformance no? | 02:36 |
| Jucato | gnomefreak: er.. not always :) | 02:36 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: concerning me you'll get the full support on the meeting :) | 02:36 |
| === gnomefreak likes unvisible more than in... | ||
| Mez | Tonio_, when is the meeting? | 02:37 |
| gnomefreak | makes more sense | 02:37 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: we have to plan it :) | 02:37 |
| Tonio_ | i'd say soon since we have lots of things to debate | 02:37 |
| Jucato | gnomefreak: since when did English make sense? :P | 02:37 |
| Tonio_ | I'd like next week on thursday | 02:37 |
| gnomefreak | ;) | 02:37 |
| gnomefreak | true | 02:37 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: start by adding your point there : https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Meetings | 02:38 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: I'll try to get a date defined today | 02:38 |
| Hobbsee | Tonio_: of the meeting? argh. | 02:39 |
| Tonio_ | Hobbsee: not today for the meeting | 02:39 |
| Tonio_ | today to define the date ;) | 02:39 |
| Mez | Tonio_, can it wait till thursday when I'[ve got my rrota so I can see when I'm available | 02:39 |
| Hobbsee | yes. argh | 02:39 |
| Hobbsee | Mez: ditto | 02:39 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: thursday next week :) | 02:39 |
| Tonio_ | we generally never plan a meeting before one week | 02:39 |
| Tonio_ | sure it can wait ;) | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | no problem | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | let's plan this on thursday | 02:40 |
| === Tonio_ is in love with kftpgrabber | ||
| Tonio_ | you all should try it ! | 02:40 |
| Jucato | heh :) | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | latest version kickass | 02:40 |
| === Jucato has it installed, but still uses Konqueror for quick, medium sized transfers | ||
| Tonio_ | Jucato: konqueror frezzes regularly when you want to upload/download a hudge file list | 02:41 |
| Tonio_ | like 100 or 200 files | 02:41 |
| === Hobbsee doesnt grab big files | ||
| Jucato | heh yeah... that's why I said medium sized :) | 02:42 |
| Mez | Tonio_, I dont know when I'm free until this thursday thoguh | 02:42 |
| Jucato | fortunately, I neither have the bandwidth nor the storage for that many files :P | 02:42 |
| Tonio_ | me neither, but lots of little files, that can happen like a phpscript | 02:42 |
| Tonio_ | a board like vbulletin | 02:42 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: okay so let's wait a bit, no emergency | 02:42 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: but please add your point | 02:42 |
| Jucato | I think there was a bug filed on that, iirc. came across it during the last bug weekend | 02:43 |
| Tonio_ | Jucato: bah vbulletin is 800k you know :) | 02:43 |
| Tonio_ | lots of very little files in fact | 02:43 |
| Jucato | O.O | 02:43 |
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| === Riddell wanders back and wonders what this systray suggestion is about | ||
| Jucato | heh :) | 03:47 |
| mhb | hi all | 03:53 |
| Jucato | hi mhb | 03:53 |
| mhb | Riddell: Tonio_ and Mez suggested having katapult icon in systray, at least last time they were suggesting that | 03:53 |
| Riddell | god no | 03:55 |
| nixternal | why would they want the icon in the systray? | 03:55 |
| Riddell | some people live in the systray | 03:56 |
| Riddell | they want everything in there | 03:56 |
| === mhb is with you two on that one | ||
| nixternal | I guess so, I can't stand having a filled up systray | 03:56 |
| Riddell | exactly | 03:56 |
| Jucato | 1) Many don't know Katapult exists, the popup notification only flashes for a very short time (and it doesn't flash if it's a saved session iirc) | 03:56 |
| nixternal | especially since I run a smaller than default Kicker, so my systray is on 1 line and not split | 03:56 |
| Riddell | if people don't know it exists, they won't miss it | 03:57 |
| nixternal | heh, that's true | 03:57 |
| Jucato | 2) without a system tray icon, there is no immediately apparent way to configure katapult. sometimes you have to manually run Configure katapult to sort of update it after installing a new program | 03:58 |
| nixternal | I know I have documented the Ctr+C keycombo after you Alt+Space to get into the configure menu | 03:58 |
| mhb | Jucato: 2) can be solved in the documentaion, isn't it? | 03:58 |
| nixternal | mhb: yes it is, I did it :) | 03:58 |
| Riddell | no, 2) should be solved with a UI fix | 03:58 |
| Jucato | how do you get immediately to the documentation? | 03:58 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: people that don't want it in the systray can remove it in the conf | 03:58 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: people that want it in the systray can add it in the conf | 03:58 |
| nixternal | Jucato: Mez creates a new package with the fixed Makefile :) | 03:58 |
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| mhb | nixternal: thanks for that, then | 03:59 |
| Jucato | nixternal: I mean, how do you immediately reach the documentation to know how to configure Katapult? you'd have to search through khelpcenter... | 03:59 |
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| Riddell | fix the katapult UI! don't add a systray applet | 03:59 |
| nixternal | Riddell: +1 | 03:59 |
| Riddell | add a bit to the UI that you click on to get a menu | 04:00 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I would agree on that point if we let the start popup | 04:00 |
| Tonio_ | that invites the user to perform an alt+space | 04:01 |
| nixternal | Riddell: add a bit to the Ubiquity slideshow as well letting users know about Katapult :) | 04:01 |
| Jucato | mabye Katapult's popup can be made to appear (a bit longer?) even when starting from a saved session | 04:01 |
| Riddell | nixternal: good plan (not that I see the slideshow happening for feisty) | 04:01 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: how about that : | 04:01 |
| Tonio_ | UI is fixed so that there is a configure option when you perform alt+space | 04:01 |
| Tonio_ | we let the popup by default | 04:01 |
| Tonio_ | then the user is invited to alt+space | 04:01 |
| Riddell | fix UI yes | 04:01 |
| Tonio_ | and can remove the popup if he wants | 04:01 |
| Tonio_ | how about that solution ? | 04:02 |
| Riddell | don't have an annoying popup, that's also annoying | 04:02 |
| nixternal | Riddell: argh, that means I have to do more Kubuntu documentation :) | 04:02 |
| Riddell | nixternal: what does? | 04:02 |
| nixternal | I am so glad you told me that, because I was not going to do any release notes what so ever | 04:02 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: as long as it can be removed very easilly when you perform the suggested icon ? | 04:02 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: lots of kubuntu are missing a super functionnality, that's a problem.... | 04:04 |
| Jucato | katapult is a great tool, why not let people know that it exists... (and how to use it) | 04:04 |
| Riddell | it's an advanced user tool | 04:04 |
| mhb | Jucato: I have never seen the popup when I first ran katapult | 04:04 |
| Riddell | same as alt-f2 | 04:04 |
| Tonio_ | to me as long as the popup is there and alt+space provide a configuration access, that's okay no ? | 04:04 |
| mhb | Jucato: and I have not needed it for a loong time (the configuration) | 04:04 |
| Jucato | mhb: maybe, but for example, it's currently the only way to sort of refresh katapult when new items are added to the K Menu | 04:04 |
| nixternal | back to school | 04:04 |
| Jucato | also, some people might want to turn off some of the catalogs | 04:05 |
| mhb | Jucato: yes, but not everyone | 04:05 |
| === Jucato didn't know/think that katapult was an advanced tool... | ||
| Jucato | mhb: same as not everyone having no need to configure it | 04:06 |
| nixternal | Jucato: msg me *testing something* | 04:06 |
| Jucato | lol | 04:07 |
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| Riddell | popups are also annoying | 04:08 |
| Jucato | just for a few seconds longer than the current duration... just enough to be read properly... | 04:08 |
| mhb | Jucato: that's one thing why people hate MS Windows | 04:10 |
| mhb | Jucato: because it shows popups for unnecessary things | 04:10 |
| mhb | Jucato: when the computer is interrupting me (with a popup, for example) it should need my concentration for a very good reason | 04:10 |
| Jucato | depends I guess if you consider informing the user about this feature unnecessary... | 04:11 |
| Jucato | um... the popup only displays for a few seconds on startup... | 04:11 |
| mhb | Jucato: only in such manner | 04:12 |
| Jucato | I doubt you'd be fully concentrated during that time... | 04:12 |
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| mhb | Jucato: katapult is not the most important part of the system, it's just a single part | 04:12 |
| mhb | Jucato: why should it get more attention that any other app? | 04:12 |
| mhb | Jucato: those are really useful too | 04:12 |
| Jucato | because those other apps are not like katapult, i.e. not needing attention, not needing a special way to activate, not having a special purpose like it | 04:13 |
| bddebian | Heya | 04:13 |
| mhb | Jucato: no need to argue about it now :o) | 04:14 |
| Jucato | even seele was a bit confused about this. she didn't know that it existed (or what it was) and how to use it, just basing on the gui and visual feedback... | 04:14 |
| mhb | Jucato: after all, I'm not the right person to convince | 04:14 |
| Jucato | heh :) | 04:14 |
| Jucato | I won't try to do anymore convincing... | 04:14 |
| === Jucato doesn't have the right to +1 anyway :) | ||
| mhb | Jucato: I'd say you have the right to vote, even if you're not part of the Council | 04:15 |
| === Jucato is not even a member | ||
| mhb | Jucato: even though only the Council votes count, I know :o) | 04:16 |
| apokryphos | I'm not sure popups would be the solution anyway | 04:16 |
| apokryphos | Jucato: being a member doesn't mean much :P | 04:16 |
| apokryphos | I think katapult should have it in its actual start-screen, but don't ask me how exactly that would be implemented ;-) | 04:16 |
| Riddell | Jucato: I'd welcome having a clickable help label next to the clickable menu on the UI that has a what's this type introduction to katapult | 04:17 |
| Riddell | anyway, main problem with katapult is lack of developers | 04:17 |
| Jucato | hm... | 04:18 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: I see your point of view, but my concern is how do people even know that katapult exists on a fresh install since it is invisible.... | 04:42 |
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| Riddell | Tonio_: same way people know about alt-f2 | 04:56 |
| === seaLne discovers what alt-f2 does | ||
| Riddell | :) | 05:00 |
| Riddell | I agree it's an issue, but I don't think annoying things that get in the way are the solution | 05:00 |
| Riddell | make KMenu->Run Command do something with katapult would be better | 05:00 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I have another option, how about that : | 05:00 |
| Riddell | although that would annoy the alt-f2 hardcore users | 05:01 |
| Tonio_ | UI is patched to give access to the conf, and gets a radio button to "disable popup at startup" | 05:01 |
| Tonio_ | and we enable the popup | 05:01 |
| Riddell | nooo | 05:01 |
| Riddell | no default annoying popups | 05:01 |
| Riddell | that's totally un-ubuntu | 05:01 |
| Tonio_ | so you want something that feets powerusers needs by default, and let the newbie unaware of what's going on ? ;) | 05:02 |
| Tonio_ | to me ONE configuration thing to do for the poweruser isn't that bad.... | 05:02 |
| Riddell | well it is a poweruser's tool | 05:02 |
| Tonio_ | hum... in a certain way yes | 05:02 |
| Riddell | normal users have the k-menu | 05:02 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: then we should patch kdebluetooth for it's popup too :) | 05:03 |
| Riddell | I've not noticed a popup from it | 05:03 |
| Tonio_ | you have a popup everytime you connect a bluetooth key | 05:03 |
| kwwii | but as long as certain programs which you install per gui are not startable in the menu, we need something else | 05:03 |
| Tonio_ | so if bluetooth is embedded, you get the popup at every startup | 05:03 |
| kwwii | so, if it doesn't show up in the menu, it does not show up in katapult either | 05:03 |
| Riddell | kdebluetooth is not embedded by default, it's hidden | 05:04 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: the icon yes, but not the menu :) | 05:04 |
| Tonio_ | not the popup sorry | 05:04 |
| Riddell | maybe that's not the case if you have bluetooth built in? | 05:04 |
| Tonio_ | maybe.... | 05:04 |
| Tonio_ | I get the popup with my bluetooth key everytime | 05:04 |
| Riddell | so it happens when you plug in your bluetooth dongle? | 05:05 |
| Tonio_ | yes | 05:05 |
| Tonio_ | it lets me know a bluetooth device has been found, just tested | 05:05 |
| Riddell | that's fine, it's useful feedback in reponse to an action | 05:05 |
| Tonio_ | but that's nice | 05:05 |
| Tonio_ | you have bluetooth embedded right ? | 05:05 |
| Riddell | I've never used bluetooth in my life | 05:06 |
| Riddell | someone really should test it in feisty to make sure it's still working :) | 05:06 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: hehe, so to what I know, kdebluetooth popups you ANYTIME a device is found | 05:06 |
| Tonio_ | even at startup | 05:06 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: just tested here it's okay | 05:06 |
| Riddell | groovy | 05:06 |
| Tonio_ | but the problem is I'm certain it popups you when you have embedded bluetooth | 05:06 |
| seaLne | yep confirmed | 05:07 |
| Riddell | kwwii: katapult only shows apps that are in the k-menu, that's where it gets its list from | 05:07 |
| Tonio_ | I would probably prefer to remove the popup and let the systray icon appear ONLY if a bluetooth device exists | 05:07 |
| Tonio_ | how about that solution ? | 05:07 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: that sounds sensible | 05:07 |
| Tonio_ | it's a standard one, that's the way windows and osx do | 05:07 |
| Tonio_ | I'll look at the config since I'm not sure that's feasible | 05:08 |
| kwwii | actually, kde does not have any rights to use that logo (check the webpage, they are really picky about that) | 05:08 |
| Riddell | kwwii: ? | 05:09 |
| kwwii | although suse is a member | 05:09 |
| kwwii | the bluetooth logo is closed source | 05:09 |
| Riddell | oh, bluetooth logo? | 05:09 |
| kwwii | yepp | 05:09 |
| Riddell | la la la | 05:09 |
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| Tonio_ | kwwii: stupid... | 05:21 |
| kwwii | :-) | 05:21 |
| kwwii | no, big business | 05:21 |
| Tonio_ | kwwii: heu, you talk about the K kind of bluetooth logo ? | 05:21 |
| kwwii | yepp | 05:21 |
| Tonio_ | who did that one ? suse ? | 05:21 |
| Riddell | the kdebluetooth author made it | 05:22 |
| Riddell | arguably it's a violation of copyright and/or trademark | 05:22 |
| Riddell | and arguably it isn't | 05:22 |
| Tonio_ | bah isn't kdebluetooth gpl licenced globally ? | 05:23 |
| Tonio_ | I don't see the point | 05:23 |
| Tonio_ | licences things are really annoying | 05:23 |
| Tonio_ | do we have any right to use the msn or aol logos in kopete ? ;) | 05:23 |
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| Tm_T | Tonio_: What logos? *whistle* | 05:27 |
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| Riddell | Tonio_: arguably they breach copyright and/or trademark, but yes, it's much the same issue | 05:28 |
| Riddell | and I go on the side of they don't | 05:28 |
| Tonio_ | sure | 05:30 |
| === Tonio_ tries to patch klibido for new command line arg | ||
| Tonio_ | hard for me | 05:31 |
| Riddell | to do what? | 05:33 |
| === manchicken likes the K-bluetooth icon. | ||
| === manchicken doesn't have anything bluetooth though. | ||
| Tonio_ | Riddell: to open a nzb file on the command line | 05:34 |
| Tonio_ | then I'll also provide a new kon search engine with the package | 05:34 |
| Tonio_ | so that you can use it the same way you use ktorrent | 05:34 |
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| Tonio_ | better integration in fact | 05:34 |
| Tonio_ | but generally not for legal stuff...... like ktorrent :) | 05:34 |
| manchicken | Riddell: While you're here, I need more stuff to do. | 05:34 |
| manchicken | Riddell: I'm getting bored without anything to do. | 05:34 |
| Riddell | oh, did Tonio_ upload that adept_batch patch? | 05:34 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: yes of course | 05:35 |
| manchicken | How will I have a weekend of hacking without anything to hack? *sob* | 05:35 |
| Riddell | groovy | 05:35 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I also patchd kss for more subsections | 05:35 |
| Tonio_ | that required to manage all kcm correctly | 05:35 |
| Tonio_ | I'll send the patch to sebas for revuing | 05:35 |
| manchicken | I'd like to stick with smaller stuff for a little while until I'm more comfortable with C++. | 05:36 |
| manchicken | My comfort level with the STL is low. | 05:36 |
| Riddell | hmm | 05:38 |
| Riddell | nothing c++ish comes to mind | 05:38 |
| Riddell | various python things do | 05:38 |
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| manchicken | Hmm... | 05:39 |
| Riddell | "Add changelog support to adept_updater." | 05:39 |
| manchicken | Oh, to give you a little blurb about what changed? | 05:40 |
| Riddell | "adept_installer should make use of the popularity data in the application .desktop files it reads." | 05:40 |
| manchicken | That would be nice. | 05:40 |
| manchicken | What is "popularity" data/ | 05:40 |
| manchicken | How popular it is? | 05:40 |
| Riddell | yes | 05:40 |
| manchicken | Like, how often it's run? | 05:40 |
| manchicken | Or how often it's installed? | 05:40 |
| Riddell | tail /usr/share/app-install/desktop/gtm.desktop | 05:41 |
| Riddell | X-AppInstall-Popcon=16 | 05:43 |
| Riddell | it's that bit | 05:43 |
| Riddell | gnome-app-install shows pretty stars to display how popular it is | 05:43 |
| Riddell | same thing in adept_installer would be cool | 05:43 |
| \sh | guys, did anyone saw this behaviour: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wine/+bug/79265 | 05:43 |
| Ubugtu | Malone bug 79265 in wine "WIne x-server crash on feisty" [Undecided,Needs info] | 05:43 |
| Riddell | and changelog support is to show the new entries from the file at changelogs.ubuntu.com for the package in adept_installer | 05:43 |
| === Riddell never used wine | ||
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| Riddell | update-tool already shows changelogs, I'm not sure of the UI but it's hidden by default | 05:43 |
| === manchicken doesn't use wine.... | ||
| manchicken | Riddell: Ahhh... | 05:44 |
| Riddell | changelog data is developer orientated, not intended for the user, but some people find it handy | 05:44 |
| manchicken | That could be neet. | 05:44 |
| Riddell | and it only shows the changelog entries since the currently installed version | 05:45 |
| manchicken | Well, maybe we could have a little question mark icon next to packages that have changelog data, and when you click it it loads it. | 05:45 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: can you remind me of the kopete bug ? I'll post comments according to my tests | 05:46 |
| Riddell | https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=140307 ? | 05:47 |
| Ubugtu | KDE bug 140307 in general "Kopete's balloon stops working with 3.5.6" [Normal,New] | 05:47 |
| Riddell | thanks Ubugtu | 05:47 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I would say that the bug is in kwin, since it happened when I upgraded kwin | 05:47 |
| Tonio_ | but I don't understand that it didn't work with kde 3.5.6 and kwin 3.5.5 | 05:47 |
| Tonio_ | that doesn't make sense to me.... | 05:47 |
| Riddell | lubos just said "r626522 (kdelibs). Oh, and it's no KWin bug. It's Kopete bug, basically." | 05:47 |
| manchicken | Riddell: I'm willing to implement features that go back upstream too if you need me to. I'd just like to stick with C++ for a little while until I'm a little more comfortable with it. | 05:49 |
| manchicken | Riddell: I do scripting languages all day long at work, I'm having a lot of fun playing with C++ ^_^ | 05:49 |
| Riddell | popularity can go upstream. not sure if debian has changelogs available but they may well do | 05:50 |
| manchicken | Righto. | 05:50 |
| manchicken | Do you have a spec for this, or is there any more information on it/ | 05:50 |
| Riddell | https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuFeistyAdeptChanges | 05:51 |
| Riddell | but mostly, look at gnome-app-install and upgrade-tool and copy that :) | 05:51 |
| manchicken | Ack, I didn't see it there. | 05:52 |
| manchicken | That's what I get for only looking at use cases ;) | 05:52 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: how about the repo manager, will that be done too ? | 05:55 |
| === Tonio_ can wait for 3.5.6 to come, he has so many things to test.... | ||
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| Tonio_ | talking about wine, shouldn't we associate .exe files to it when installed ? | 05:55 |
| Tonio_ | that would make sense in my opinion | 05:56 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: should do, the gnome author said a couple weeks ago he was working on making it more frontend independent, not sure if that's available yet or not | 05:56 |
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| manchicken | Riddell: I still don't think it's unreasonable to reinvent that wheel. The port is going to be painful. | 06:03 |
| manchicken | Very painful. | 06:03 |
| manchicken | At least from what I could see. | 06:03 |
| manchicken | Especially since I couldn't get Qt Designer to import those glade files. | 06:03 |
| Riddell | err, it won't import glade files | 06:05 |
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| Riddell | they need to be remade | 06:05 |
| manchicken | Yeah. | 06:05 |
| manchicken | That leads me to believe that it could be considerably difficult to port that software-properties program. | 06:06 |
| manchicken | It seems to me that it'd be easier to implement it in adept. | 06:06 |
| manchicken | But I'm merely a chicken on all of this stuff. ^_^ | 06:07 |
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| manchicken | Always scary when you get libc6 updates. | 08:11 |
| nixternal | no what is scary is the pasta they serve here at school | 08:13 |
| manchicken | Another reason to be glad I dropped out of college ;) | 08:13 |
| nixternal | haha | 08:14 |
| manchicken | I'm not a big fan of academia. Seeking knowledge for knowledge's sake just seems kinda boring to me. | 08:17 |
| manchicken | I'd much rather learn something in the course of solving a problem. | 08:18 |
| nixternal | that is what both of my courses are today pretty much | 08:19 |
| manchicken | That's cool. I know lots of folks who love school. I just never really did. | 08:19 |
| nixternal | i definitely don't love it, but it is free, so I am going to try and learn some new stuff | 08:20 |
| manchicken | Free makes a difference. | 08:20 |
| manchicken | I wouldn't mind taking some courses, but I have no interested in taking courses that graduation requirements dictate. | 08:20 |
| nixternal | ya, i had to take a couple of very basic programming courses at first which was nuts | 08:21 |
| manchicken | The college I went to tried to get me to take an ethics course. I went to it for the first few weeks and found that their ethics were in grave conflict with mine. | 08:21 |
| nixternal | same with a Linux course. Intro to Linux. I spent the whole class working on Kubuntu stuff | 08:22 |
| manchicken | Heh. | 08:22 |
| manchicken | I remember taking C as a highschool senior. | 08:22 |
| manchicken | I've been playing with C since I was 12. | 08:23 |
| manchicken | I ended up spending the whole 2 hour class correcting the prof and helping my classmates. | 08:23 |
| manchicken | Profs don't like to be corrected ;) | 08:23 |
| manchicken | That's why they should make sure their examples are correct BEFORE class. | 08:23 |
| nixternal | heh, when I was a highschooler you either took Basic, Data Processing, or you would learn assembly, cobol, and fortan in robotics shop | 08:23 |
| nixternal | 10 Print "HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA" | 08:24 |
| nixternal | 20 Goto 10 | 08:24 |
| manchicken | heh | 08:24 |
| nixternal | ;) | 08:24 |
| nixternal | basic loops rock | 08:24 |
| nixternal | thank god for scroll lock | 08:24 |
| manchicken | Mmm... global scope and spaghetti code ^_^ | 08:24 |
| nixternal | i am getting ready to do some spaghetti code it seems in my next class | 08:25 |
| manchicken | Mmm... spaghetti. | 08:25 |
| nixternal | nothing better than sitting in the cafe and listening to a 100 systems play the killer Windows startup music | 08:26 |
| manchicken | Nice. | 08:26 |
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| mhb | hi LongPointyStick :o) | 10:44 |
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| Dink | Is there an entry in launchpad for the adept manger ... upgrade wizard bug when you click on fetch updates ?? | 10:51 |
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| jeroenvrp | most original question of the day: can feisty allready be used for normal daily work (desktop)?! | 11:10 |
| jeroenvrp | in other words: should I upgrade? | 11:10 |
| gnomefreak | jeroenvrp: no | 11:14 |
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| jeroenvrp | gnomefreak: than I wont do it yet | 11:14 |
| gnomefreak | jeroenvrp: not anywhere near stable enough. | 11:14 |
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| jeroenvrp | thanks gnomefreak for your answers, I will follow the devolopment and wait for the right time to step in | 11:16 |
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