[12:14] <kent> pochu: we went from a more anarchistic community with meritocrasy (spelling?) to a more formal group with elected people, economy etc.  Personally I think we did that in a wrong way, but even so.. we have a bit of a mess to solve.  but nothings is impossible.  :)
[12:15] <pochu> kent: yes, we the spanish community also are having some problems
[12:16] <pochu> but I think we shouldn't talk about this on the -devel channel. Join #ubuntu-locoteams and we speak there
[12:16] <pochu> ;)
[12:16] <kent> pochu: ok.
[12:28] <slomo_> keescook: not useful... the unit tests require a configure flag which enables code that should not be in distribution packages... configure even warned about them last time i checked ;)
[12:28] <keescook> slomo_: oh!  that's unfortunate.
[12:29] <keescook> I had assumed it was just a check for building the tests or not.  :(
[12:29] <slomo_> keescook: yes... but otherwise the test suite seems to be really good ;) 
[12:29] <keescook> it actually changes the binaries?
[12:29] <slomo_> just not useful for packages
[12:29] <slomo_> yes
[12:29] <keescook> dang
[12:29] <slomo_> it enables additional asserts and other stuff
[12:31] <keescook> well, this'll just be another use-case for doing package tests.  :)
[12:32] <keescook> (and, you can ignore my email...)  :)
[02:57] <dosnlinux> would this be a good place to ask about why certain scripts do what they do? like why /etc/acpi/lid.sh checks the ac adapter before unthrottling xscreensaver
[09:04] <dholbach> good morning
[09:13] <iwj> http://www.pseudorandom.co.uk/2006/cthubuntu.png
[09:14] <tsmithe> eh?
[09:14] <fabbione> iwj: LOL
[09:14] <tsmithe> :( /me doesn't get it
[09:15] <Burgundavia> tsmithe: do you know what cthulu is?
[09:15] <Burgundavia> iwj: http://www.warbard.ca/temp/CthulhubuntuLogo.png
[09:15] <tsmithe> nope
[09:16] <Burgundavia> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cthulhu
[09:16] <iwj> I think the pseudorandom one is more in the authentic touchy-feely Ubuntu style.
[09:17] <Keybuk> seb128: tomboy keeps crashing :-(
[09:17] <Burgundavia> iwj: latter is my brother, bored one evening
[09:17] <seb128> slomo_: tomboy keeps crashing apparently :p
[09:18] <seb128> Keybuk: slomo_ maintains it
[09:19] <Burgundavia> iwj: last line of http://www.linux.com/article.pl?sid=06/12/14/2027244
[09:29] <seb128> ogra: new gnome-power-manager tarball to package
[09:29] <ogra> finally !
[09:29] <seb128> yeah
[09:29] <ogra> thanks :)
[09:30] <seb128> grab it while it's hot ;)
[09:30] <seb128> np
[09:30] <seb128> ogra: 
[09:30] <seb128> http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-power-manager/2.17/gnome-power-manager-2.17.90.tar.gz
[09:30] <ogra> heh, already there :)
[09:30] <seb128> k
[09:37] <slomo_> Keybuk: that's good ;) works fine for me though.... if you have it as panel applet please run it from a terminal with "tomboy --panel-applet" and then add it to the panel again... and then put everything from the terminal into a bugreport... i'll look at it later today
[09:37] <Keybuk>  Multiple document element was detected.  Line 12, position 17.
[09:37] <Keybuk> it keeps saying that
[09:38] <slomo_> hm
[09:38] <Keybuk> (plus running that doesn't show it on the panel :p)
[09:38] <slomo_> did you use the bullet-point feature?
[09:39] <Keybuk> yes
[09:39] <Keybuk> quite extensively
[09:40] <slomo_> Keybuk: ok... upstream told me that there seems to be a bug with this feature that generates broken xml files for the notes sometimes... and nobody could reproduce it :/ there should be instructions on how to fix it by hand on the tomboy mailinglist...
[09:40] <slomo_> Keybuk: it's at least a known bug that is on top of their todo lists :)
[09:40] <Keybuk> do you have a link?
[09:41] <Keybuk> (e.g. to the mailing list!)
[09:42] <slomo_> Keybuk: http://lists.beatniksoftware.com/pipermail/tomboy-list-beatniksoftware.com/2006-December/000067.html
[09:46] <Keybuk> slomo_: thanks
[09:46] <Keybuk> that fixes it
[09:53] <lifeless> mvo: http://people.ubuntu.com/~robertc/possible-conflicts.txt - look for tuxtype
[09:53] <mvo> lifeless: ah, nice!
[09:54] <lifeless> yeah, but its still buggy :(
[09:54] <mvo> oh? how so?
[09:54] <lifeless> look for tuxtype :)
[10:34] <desrt> pitti; hello
[10:34] <pitti> hey desrt 
[10:34] <desrt> pitti; there's a small problem in feisty related to that patch i hacked up
[10:35] <pitti> desrt: the macbook one?
[10:35] <desrt> turns out that the feisty kernel (dapper didn't do this) clobbers the backlight register on resume from sleep
[10:35] <desrt> sets it to all-zeros
[10:36] <lifeless> BenC: are you benc@u.c ?
[10:36] <desrt> no idea why -- but it will need to be fixed too
[10:36] <BenC> lifeless: bcollins@u.c
[10:37] <desrt> BenC; i don't suppose you've seen any reports of this yet?
[10:37] <ogra> seb128, g-p-m will be problematic :( the functions we apply the libpam-foreground patch to is just vanished ... no mention in the changelog or something :(
[10:37] <desrt> [just quickly if you have so i can avoid fighting launchpad for info] 
[10:37] <seb128> ogra: you know upstream, right? ;)
[10:37] <ogra> yes, i mailed him and i'm in #hal ...
[10:38] <seb128> ok, wait to get a reply from him probably then
[10:38] <ogra> but still, it seems there is no replacement for gpm_manager_is_policy_timout_valid() at all ...
[10:38] <seb128> that will be easier that way
[10:38] <seb128> there is a new gnome-screensaver to package if you want ;)
[10:38] <ogra> heh, yes ... i wanted to update the new default saver as well ... thats good
[10:39] <lifeless> BenC: thanks
[10:39] <tfheen> mvo: about ; https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/popularity-contest/+bug/51149 what with the last comment?
[10:39] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 51149 in popularity-contest "popularity-contest does not work out of the box" [High,In progress]  
[10:40] <mvo> tfheen: reading it now
[10:40] <tfheen> mvo: also, as you can see ubuntu-archive isn't subscribed.
[10:42] <mvo> tfheen: subscribed the ubuntu-archive team. libnfsidmap2 needs the same priority as libnfsidmap1. can you do it? or should I write a bugreport?
[10:42] <tfheen> mvo: I can just change that
[10:43] <mvo> tfheen: that would be good, thanks
[10:43] <mvo> it confuses the upgrade
[10:44] <tfheen> fixed.
[10:45] <mvo> thanks!
[10:47] <dholbach> ogra: new gnome-power-manager and new gnome-screensaver
[10:47] <mvo> tfheen: it will be in the archive with the next archive update?
[10:47] <tfheen> mvo: yes.
[10:47] <ogra> dholbach, see backlog :P 
[10:48] <dholbach> ok
[10:54] <fabbione> hmm
[10:55] <fabbione> seb128, dholbach: Package: libgnomevfs2-0 -> Depends: libgamin0 | libfam0
[10:55] <fabbione> did you two say that we don't use gamin anymore?
[10:55] <desrt> pitti; vbetool is a workaround to the problem.  vbetool is still broken on macbook, though, due to incorrect sequencing of the startup scripts in rc2.d
[10:55] <seb128> fabbione: we don't, gam_server should not be running
[10:55] <desrt> pitti; choose your poison :)
[10:55] <seb128> fabbione: the problem is inotify doesn't work everywhere
[10:55] <fabbione> seb128: ok so why do I get the "end from FAM server connection" error from libgamin0 ?
[10:55] <seb128> fabbione: and when inotify doesn't work it fallbacks to gam_server then
[10:56] <fabbione> feh
[10:56] <fabbione> ok
[10:56] <seb128> because you use NFS where inotiy doesn't work?
[10:56] <fabbione> i guess i will have to go back hacking idiotify
[10:56] <pitti> desrt: (sorry, in a meeting, will catch up later)
[10:56] <desrt> pitti; no prob.  i'll write some more info into the bug
[10:56] <desrt> cheers
[10:56] <fabbione> seb128: it did work from breezy and broke only recently
[10:57] <seb128> fabbione: maybe a new bug in the gnome-vfs gam code, that needs debugging
[10:57] <fabbione> seb128: yeah somewhere
[10:58] <tfheen> mvo: hmm, but your upload doesn't disable compression, does it?
[10:58] <tfheen> hm
[10:58] <tfheen> it does.
[11:00] <ogra> seb128, how do the volume control hotkeys work, arent they supposed to use the backend i selected as default for the mixer applet ? 
[11:01] <seb128> ogra: no, the device selection is to the sound capplet
[11:01] <seb128> that's not the one from the applet
[11:01] <ogra> hmm, so i cant change the hotkey backend at all ? 
[11:01] <ogra> ah, sorry
[11:02] <ogra> yay, works :)
[11:02] <ogra> seb128, thaks
[11:02] <ogra> +n
[11:03] <seb128> np
[11:06] <tfheen> crimsun: I'm rejecting your curl upload, it's not been approved by the SRU team.
[11:17] <cjwatson> mvo: do you know what the comments from Mr Canis on that bug are about?
[11:17] <cjwatson> mvo: (the popcon bug)
[11:17] <mvo> cjwatson: yes, I commented about it. I was asking him what the exact error was
[11:17] <cjwatson> ok, thanks
[11:18] <cjwatson> let the bug know if it needs to be changed, obviously
[11:18] <mvo> cjwatson: the feisty version works well so far
[11:25] <lifeless> keescook: Zak says hi
[11:25] <lifeless> (your clone)
[11:46] <tfheen> mvo: why have you uploaded two update-managers with the same version number?
[11:47] <mvo> tfheen: probably a mistake. both to edgy-proposed? why does the archive not reject them then? are they identical?
[11:47] <tfheen> mvo: yes, both to -proposed.
[11:48] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 63132 in fuse "fuse-utils 2.5.3-2.1ubuntu3  installation (edgy) crashes in post installation phase" [Undecided,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/63132
[11:49] <tfheen> ogra: "does not work in edgy" => SRU.  "New version with shiny feature" => backport.
[11:49] <ogra> tfheen, does not work in edgy if i compiled my own kernel too ? 
[11:49] <ogra> we dont support monolithic kernels, so i'm a bit ambivalent
[11:49] <Mithrandir> it's not appropriate for a backport; it's a bug fix, not a shiny, new feature.
[11:50] <ogra> ok
[11:50] <Mithrandir> cjwatson: there's a kernel in -proposed; we should just accept it, assuming the version number is sane-ish?
[11:53] <Mithrandir> mvo: they're the same; I'll reject the newest one.
[11:53] <mvo> Mithrandir: thanks and sorry
[11:54] <Mithrandir> mvo: np.  IMO, soyuz shouldn't allow you to upload two entries with the same version to a queue.
[11:58] <pochu> Mithrandir: I don't know if you know this, but the latest updates have broken my wireless
[11:58] <pochu> Just to notice you about this
[11:58] <cjwatson> Mithrandir: yes, per https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
[11:58] <Mithrandir> pochu: "the lastest updates"?
[11:58] <pochu> yesterday ones
[11:58] <pochu> this morning I have boot and it doesn't work
[11:59] <pochu> I'm with the wire
[11:59] <cjwatson> at the very least you need to state what release you're running
[11:59] <Mithrandir> pochu: which distro are you running?
[11:59] <pochu> Feisty, of course
[11:59] <pochu> yep, I know it's development
[11:59] <Mithrandir> well, file a bug, then
[11:59] <pochu> oh well
[11:59] <pochu> thanks
[12:01] <sfllaw> pitti: Ping?
[12:01] <sfllaw> pitti: Does apport log the architecture?
[12:02] <pitti> sfllaw: yes, in Uname:
[12:02] <sfllaw> Ah yes.
[12:03] <sfllaw> I see now.
[12:23] <Mithrandir> cjwatson,mvo : we need to discuss an SRU procedure for app-install-data{,-commercial}
[12:24] <mvo> Mithrandir: yes, if we could do that today, that would be great. only "app-install-data-commercial" is affected
[12:24] <mvo> cjwatson: ---^
[12:24] <Mithrandir> mvo: well, if we for some reason would want to update the normal one, the same procedure would probably be followed.
[12:24] <mvo> right
[12:27] <cjwatson> Mithrandir: after lunch?
[12:39] <Mithrandir> cjwatson: sure
[12:53] <seb128> Mithrandir: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/81108 is most likely a duplicate, on what package should I look for the bug? ;)
[12:53] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 81108 in Ubuntu "machine doesn't restart when pressing enter after cd eject on live session or install" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[12:56] <Mithrandir> seb128: casper.
[12:56] <Mithrandir> and it's a dupe, yes.
[12:56] <seb128> thank you
[02:07] <jwendell> !info firefox
[02:14] <gpocentek> Mithrandir: is it possible to get thunar out of new? it has a new binary package (thunar-doc)
[02:28] <cjwatson> gpocentek: we'll have pitti do that in a moment
[02:29] <gpocentek> cjwatson: great, thanks, and thanks pitti :)
[02:57] <erdinc> hi everyone
[02:57] <erdinc> crimsun you got a sec?
[02:57] <Hobbsee> erdinc: contentless ping warning
[02:58] <erdinc> is there anyone who is using vlc?
[02:59] <Hobbsee> sounds like a #ubuntu type question - please see the /topic
[02:59] <erdinc> not exactly
[03:00] <Hobbsee> might help if you actually asked it, too
[03:00] <erdinc> in ubuntu vlc has a static link to ffmpeg or dynamic?
[03:00] <Hobbsee> dunno, sorry
[03:01] <erdinc> I checked redhat fedora and suse all made as static link to ffmpeg
[03:01] <erdinc> anyway thanx
[03:01] <erdinc> sorry to disturb
[03:02] <ogra> erdinc, crimsun is on US time ... might be a bit early for him
[03:02] <erdinc> :) I saw he is away for 9hours :)
[03:03] <erdinc> I'll come at night to ask again thank you all
[03:36] <saispo> how can i debug debian-installer please ?
[03:41] <cjwatson> saispo: more information please
[03:41] <cjwatson> saispo: also, #ubuntu-installer
[03:42] <pitti> gpocentek: I did your sync (my first one, yay :) )
[03:42] <pitti> gpocentek: erm, s/sync/new/
[03:42] <gpocentek> pitti: thanks and congrats :)
[03:42] <saispo> hi cjwatson :)
[03:45] <jdong> cjwatson: can you do a quick backport for me.... bug 80642.... due to Flash 9 becoming final all flash 9 beta packages will no longer work
[03:45] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 80642 in edgy-backports "please backport  flashplugin-nonfree_9.0.31" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/80642
[03:45] <jdong> (adobe removed the flash9beta tarball from their download servers; installing will result in a wget error)
[03:48] <Mithrandir> jdong: sounds like an SRU candidate to me.
[03:48] <cjwatson> Mithrandir: there's already a backport
[03:48] <Mithrandir> oh, ok
[03:48] <jdong> Mithrandir: flash7 in edgy/dapper still work
[03:48] <jdong> (I think)
[03:48] <cjwatson> jdong: just apper, or edgy too?
[03:48] <cjwatson> er, dapper
[03:48] <jdong> cjwatson: both
[03:48] <cjwatson> only dapper seems to be approved
[03:48] <Mithrandir> I was about to add that as extra condition.
[03:48] <jdong> cjwatson: really? I just hit the approval button on both....
[03:49] <jdong> edgy was approved earlier in the discussion
[03:49] <cjwatson> there's no approved comment for edgy
[03:49] <jdong> yeah, first comment, edgy was approved
[03:49] <cjwatson> oh, duh
[03:49] <cjwatson> sorry, missed that
[03:50] <jdong> no problem :)
[03:50] <cjwatson> I don't know what bug states reliably represent backport approval
[03:50] <jdong> cjwatson: I use in progress to represent approval
[03:50] <jdong> of course that doesn't preclude anyone else from hitting the in progress button....
[03:50] <cjwatson> yeah, that's why I look for comments from a member of ubuntu-backporters
[03:50] <cjwatson> although I could use the activity log, granted
[03:55] <cjwatson> jdong: done
[04:06] <Mithrandir> StevenK,siretart : could either of you look at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/spampd/+bug/76861 please?
[04:06] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 76861 in spampd "[SRU]  spampd 2.30" [Undecided,In progress]  
[04:13] <bddebian> Heya
[04:23] <GNUro> Hi!
[04:24] <siretart> Mithrandir: +1
[04:25] <Mithrandir> siretart: can you note it in the bug log too?
[04:25] <Mithrandir> siretart: and thanks. :-)
[04:33] <Mithrandir> hurrah, edgy-proposed down to one entry (which we need to decide on a policy for)
[04:34] <crimsun> Mithrandir: hmm, I thought https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/curl/+bug/73447/comments/4 was the approval.
[04:34] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 73447 in curl "SRU Request to fix Curl Segfault" [Low,Confirmed]  
[04:36] <Mithrandir> crimsun: I must have been asleep, let me recheck
[04:39] <Mithrandir> crimsun: accepted
[04:39] <crimsun> Mithrandir: thank you
[04:43] <cjwatson> Mithrandir: so where's this archive admin greasemonkey script of yours?
[04:48] <Mithrandir> cjwatson: http://err.no/src/pasteandmark.user.js and you want to patch greasemonkey with http://err.no/patches/greasemonkey_GM_fromClipboard.diff too
[04:51] <Mithrandir> alt-shift-[qwertyuio]  to open/close tasks, alt-shift-p to paste clipboard, mark as fix released, assigned to you (in the open task).  Alt-shift-s to submit the form.
[04:54] <Keybuk> meh; can't get FreeDOS to work :-/
[04:55] <ogra> why do you want that ?
[04:55] <_ion> Are you going to replace autoexec.bat with upstart?
[04:55] <Keybuk> to update my laptop's bios
[04:55] <_ion> ;-)
[04:55] <mjg59> Keybuk: How are you trying to get it to work?
[04:56] <Keybuk> mjg59: usb disk, formatted as a bootable hard disk -- it boots the freedos kernel and hangs
[04:56] <mjg59> Just dump a freedos image in /boot and then set grub up to boot it using memdisk
[04:57] <Keybuk> memdisk?
[05:00] <mjg59> Part of isolinux
[05:00] <mjg59> Uh, syslinux
[05:00] <mjg59> You boot memdisk as the kernel, give it a floppy image (1.44 or 2.88) as an initrd, and then it does magic
[05:00] <Keybuk> does it have to be 1.44 or 2.88 ?
[05:01] <mjg59> It emulates floppy access, so I doubt bigger will work
[05:01] <mjg59> But I haven't seen a BIOS update that won't fit on a 1.44MB floppy yet
[05:01] <Keybuk> I guess I just need command.com and kernel.sys ?
[05:03] <Keybuk> what does root have to be?
[05:04] <mjg59> And a boot sector oh neve rmind
[05:05] <ogra> Mithrandir, cjwatson, could one of you approve python-ltsp ? i have some people wanting to contribute that poke me all the time ...
[05:06] <Mithrandir> ogra: I'm doing -proposed and -updates, I might do source new afterwards.
[05:06] <ogra> that'd be cool, thanks 
[05:13] <Keybuk> mjg59: sweet, that worked.  thanks
[05:13] <mjg59> Winning
[05:13] <Mithrandir> dapper-proposed emptied out.
[05:13] <Keybuk> . o O { if only you could flash your bios from vmware }
[05:14] <mjg59> Hm.
[05:14] <mjg59> Keybuk: Some time, we should really provide a package for doing that sort of thing magically
[05:14] <Keybuk> yea
[05:15] <Keybuk> I found an evil perl script to turn a file/block device into a "bootable" dos image
[05:15] <Keybuk> it used nasm
[05:16] <mjg59> ...
[05:16] <mjg59> Oh, that makes sense
[05:18] <Keybuk> dosemu wasn't being helpful, it either complained that I couldn't use a "whole disk image" or would only boot from it
[05:18] <lifeless> qemu perhaps 
[05:18] <mjg59> lifeless: Does qemu provide hardware-level access?
[05:18] <mjg59> Keybuk: I'd be very scared indeed if vmware let you flash your bios
[05:18] <mjg59> Certain issues of what virtualisation actually means...
[05:18] <Keybuk> I find it kooky that this laptop has a CPU that provides virtualization features
[05:19] <lifeless> mjg59: no
[05:19] <mjg59> lifeless: Not likely to be helpful for bios upgrades, then :)
[05:19] <lifeless> mjg59: but being a machine emulator should boot rather better I'd expect
[05:20] <mjg59> dosemu can pass io port access through to the hardware
[05:20] <mjg59> So there's actually a reasonable chance of it working
[05:20] <mjg59> Also a reasonable chance of it bricking your hardware
[05:20] <Keybuk> dosemu didn't work directly because it was in protected mode
[05:20] <Keybuk> and also wasn't helpful for trying to make a bootable image
[05:34] <neuralis> mjg59: by the way, have you had reports of strange EC lockups after resume in HP's newish business-series laptops?
[05:43] <\sh> dear gnome main devs, I have to say, gnome looks awesome in feisty...:) 
[05:43] <ogra> \sh, where exactly ? 
[05:44] <\sh> ogra, the control center is quite cool...
[05:44] <ogra> argh
[05:44] <ogra> not really imho 
[05:44] <\sh> I like it, feels like the kde-systemsettings now
[05:45] <ogra> yes
[05:45] <ogra> and its slowing you down a lot
[05:45] <ogra> like KDE
[05:45] <Riddell> how does it slow you down?
[05:46] <ogra> Riddell, in the former variant i could just quickly click on the item i needed ... now i have to wait until a window pops up and then i have to search for the item
[05:46] <ogra> menus are simply faster 
[05:46] <Riddell> hasn't that been in upstream gnome for ages as default?
[05:46] <ogra> additionally i have a lot of stuff in the system tools menu (due to edubuntu and ltsp) 
[05:47] <ogra> so my control center is horribly full
[05:47] <\sh> Riddell, i never used gnome upstream 
[05:47] <ogra> Riddell, it was dropped for usability reasons in gnome 2.2 or so ...
[05:47] <ogra> it was there in the beginning of the 2.x seriaes
[05:47] <ogra> but after the first usability study they disabled it ... 
[05:48] <\sh> the only thing which I don't understand is this addressbook panel plugin, and I don't like evolution, because it's too slow when I work with my imap server. tbird is much faster, so is kmail
[05:49] <Riddell> ogra: I see, thanks
[05:50] <sfllaw> Mithrandir: Ping?
[05:50] <sfllaw> Mithrandir: Can you look at bug 59946?
[05:50] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 59946 in xubuntu-system-tools "Admin tools require admin group membership" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/59946
[05:51] <sfllaw> Mithrandir: It seems like gnome-nettool hasn't been accepted into edgy-proposed.
[05:58] <Mithrandir> sfllaw: doesn't seem to have been uploaded.
[05:58] <sfllaw> pitti: Ping?
[05:58] <sfllaw> pitti: In #59946 (see above) you seem to have touched lots of packages.
[05:59] <pitti> sfllaw: right
[05:59] <sfllaw> pitti: Are gnome-panel, gnome-applets, gnome-netstatus, gnome-nettool, gnome-system-tools, and gnome-nettool the only ones?
[06:00] <pitti> sfllaw: system-tools-backends too
[06:00] <sfllaw> pitti: Because it looks like gnome-nettool isn't in edgy-proposed because you didn't upload it.
[06:01] <sfllaw> Yes, that too.
[06:01] <pitti> sfllaw: gnome-nettool was broken before already, we could do that separately (seb128 did that patch)
[06:03] <sfllaw> So I don't have to test that gnome-nettool works correctly?
[06:03] <sfllaw> And if so, can we have a bug number that will be SRUed?
[06:06] <sfllaw> pitti: ?
[06:06] <pitti> sfllaw: yes, and yes
[06:06] <pitti> seb128: you mentioned that there already was a bug about gnome-nettool?
[06:07] <Riddell> mvo: able to look at konsole with me for a sec?
[06:18] <ogra> Riddell, as QT guy, what do you think about replacing scribus in main with scribus-ng ? 
[06:19] <Riddell> ogra: what's scribus-ng?
[06:20] <ogra> the 1.3 version afaik
[06:20] <ogra> the one we have in main is 1.2
[06:20] <Riddell> right.  I believe it's pretty stable, but I'd want to ask the scribus people if they'd get annoyed if we did that
[06:20] <ogra> but 1.3 is already nearly a year old ... 
[06:20] <ogra> ok
[06:21] <Riddell> unfortunately I've forgotten the password to the top secret scribus developers channel
[06:22] <Riddell> we could just have both packages in the archives
[06:22] <ogra> we do already
[06:22] <ogra> but we shouldnt have both in main
[06:22] <ogra> i just asked in #scribus
[06:22] <Riddell> I see
[06:36] <keescook> lifeless: heh.  tell him "hi" for me too.  :)  I chatted with him briefly at LCA
[07:18] <\sh> gnomefreak, ping...do you know if #74887 happens in dapper, edgy or feisty? :)
[08:34] <LaserJock> is there a time where MIRs and promotions to Main stop happening? I'm guessing maybe FF
[08:40] <somerville32> The MIR I filed weeks ago has yet to be reviewed, lol
[09:06] <visik7> hi
[09:22] <gnomefreak> \sh_away: its edgy i havent tested it on feisty since im using ff3.0 on feisty.
[10:07] <siretart> enrico: around? I'd like to talk to you about python-debian
[10:10] <enrico> siretart: hi
[10:10] <enrico> siretart: let's talk
[10:11] <siretart> sure! :)
[10:11] <siretart> feisty has bzr 0.14 now, and I'd like to have bzr-buildpackage updated 
[10:11] <siretart> unfortunately, it depends on python-debian_0.1.1, which is not in debian yet
[10:12] <siretart> enrico: what are your plans about python-debian in the short term?
[10:12] <enrico> wow, really?
[10:12] <enrico> it's in experimental atm
[10:12] <enrico> just two days ago I posted to the list proposing to upload in unstable
[10:12] <enrico> no reply so far afaik
[10:14] <enrico> it's in experimental because it was uploaded during the etch freezish, where the idea was "only upload to unstable what's for etch"
[10:14] <enrico> siretart: if you can pull it from exerimental into feisty, I'd say you can do it
[10:14] <siretart> enrico: that's fair enough. feisty is currently not in freeze, and I'd like to have something usable there
[10:15] <siretart> enrico: the package from experimental is in feisty since some days now, but it seems I need something newer for james' 0.14 branch
[10:17] <enrico> siretart: oh
[10:17] <siretart> enrico: I'd really appreciate an upload to unstable. we neededn't request a sync to testing, so etch should be safe for python-debian
[10:18] <enrico> siretart: I'll post to the list again saying that we have another reason for unstable
[10:19] <siretart> enrico: does python-debian 0.1.1 include python-deb822?
[10:19] <enrico> siretart: it should
[10:19] <siretart> that'd be cool
[10:20] <siretart> okay, subscribed to both mailing lists
[10:21] <enrico> siretart: I admit I still haven't figured out what's the purpose: dato had something in mind, but he is now on extended leave
[10:22] <siretart> enrico: I hope he's doing better now, or in the mean time...
[10:39] <siretart> enrico: would you please ping me on irc when python-debian hits debian (no matter if unstable or experimental)
[10:39] <siretart> enrico: I'd like to merge it into feisty
[10:39] <enrico> siretart: I might not remember in this period
[10:39] <enrico> siretart: but if you subscribed to the list, you should see it
[10:40] <siretart> enrico: already done. okay
[10:42] <enrico> siretart: thanks
[12:01] <Evaso2> i was starting a discussion on debian about this release method http://wiki.debian.org/LivingSystem
[12:02] <Evaso2> do u think that could be used also for ubuntu instead of time based release?
[12:06] <LaserJock> Evaso2: interesting idea, kinda needs more development (the wiki page is a bit confusing). However, I would think it would be harder business users and people offering support
[12:07] <LaserJock> how would you propose going about radical changes?
[12:07] <Evaso2> LaserJock... sorry it is only a very rought wiki stub
[12:07] <LaserJock> sometimes you can just incrementall approach a change
[12:08] <Evaso2> it was started by me moths ago (i'm not native english) 
[12:08] <Evaso2> and was modified by StephenKeeling
[12:08] <Evaso2> on 2006-03-28
[12:09] <Evaso2> Support is not a problem
[12:09] <LaserJock> if you have a constantly moving target it would be I should think
[12:09] <LaserJock> what "daily" snapshot do you support?
[12:10] <Evaso2> LaserJock the policy will be oriented at a slowly upgrade
[12:10] <ajmitch> but you haven't said why it's not a problem
[12:10] <LaserJock> Debian/Ubuntu today could be different than Debian/Ubuntu 3 months from now
[12:10] <Evaso2> it is so slowly that almos all users could follow "stable" updates
[12:10] <LaserJock> how do you support that?
[12:11] <Evaso2> so u support the actual system that all customers must to follow
[12:11] <LaserJock> so you are relying on people constantly updating to the latest "stable"
[12:12] <Evaso2> yes it is a kind of advanced concept of backport to security
[12:12] <LaserJock> so what happens when, for instance, Debian switches from python2.3 to python 2.4
[12:12] <Evaso2> there could be introduced with the right polices to stable a trasaction system of dependecies like in DBMS