[01:11] <willvdl> gnight
[01:53] <elmo40> well, that edgyDVD.torrent is dead :/
[01:54] <elmo40> guess i will use d4x to grab the .iso
[01:54] <LaserJock> yeah, I bet there aren't enough people to keep the Edubuntu torrents very fast at all
[01:54] <elmo40> i am at 10%
[01:54] <elmo40> been like that for 5hrs :\
[03:02] <wist_> hi guys... i dont know if it's the right thing to do or the right place to ask but....... After installing Edubuntu to my HD it just crashes everytime the Updates notification pops up
[03:02] <wist_> PIII 500 MhZ 456 MB RAM , 40 GB HD
[03:03] <wist_> isntalled from the live cd.. i need to do something here... just dont know what..
[03:03] <LaserJock> yikes, that's not good
[03:03] <LaserJock> I'd actually ask #ubuntu as it's probably a generic problem (not Edubuntu specific) and they have a lot more people
[03:04] <wist_> :) thats a start, thanks .
[03:12] <matsavhalev> hi guys, once i have set up edubuntu for ltsp, is there a way to change/add the feature to boot an install cd? whatever i change still gives me ltsp :-)
[03:13] <LaserJock> on a client?
[03:13] <LaserJock> or on the server?
[10:25] <cbx33> Thanks ogra
[10:25] <cbx33> awesome work
[10:26] <cbx33> got two secs to discuss one point?
[11:17] <ogra> indeed
[11:17] <edubuntugirl> ogra: by the way, cbx33 told me to tell you 'I'm off for the night....please mail me...if you get the book chapter looked at...Ican then look at it tomrorow morning on the way to work' 12 hours, 8 minutes and 33 seconds ago (on Tue Feb  6 00:09:26 2007)
[11:17] <ogra> cbx33, ^^
[11:18] <cbx33> yeh I got it
[11:18] <ogra> she was faster :)
[11:18] <cbx33> no no I've already started looking at it
[11:19] <cbx33> I wondered if yo ucould spare me a few minuetes in a sec
[11:19] <ogra> sure
[11:19] <cbx33> just to go over one or two points
[11:19] <cbx33> hang on lemme boot up the laptop
[11:20] <cbx33> oh yeh...right 1) mounting proc in the chroot
[11:21] <cbx33> i don't think I've ever done that....
[11:21] <ogra> a bunch of packages require it ...
[11:21] <cbx33> ahh right ok cool
[11:21] <cbx33> that's fine
[11:22] <cbx33> 2) my blabberings about the server configs
[11:22] <ogra> one vs two NICs ?
[11:22] <cbx33> yeh
[11:22] <cbx33> see i used to use a one NIC + alternative DHCP server setup
[11:24] <ogra> sure, thats fine
[11:24] <cbx33> and the reason why i was saying about connecting to a private subnet
[11:24] <cbx33> is so that people can't bypass the edubuntu server to gain access to the network
[11:24] <ogra> what i complained about was the "edubuntu as a gateway"
[11:24] <cbx33> using like a live cd for example
[11:25] <cbx33> i thought this was more of an advantage
[11:25] <ogra> it's a secuzrity feature that we dont route the client network
[11:25] <cbx33> but....i'm probably wrong ;)
[11:25] <ogra> the two NIC setup is our declared and desired default
[11:25] <cbx33> but in a way the edbuntu server does act like a firewall/gateway
[11:26] <ogra> in that setup you dont have any routing between client network and LAN
[11:26] <cbx33> unless the clients are not booting from the edubuntu server
[11:26] <ogra> if you use a single NIC setup
[11:26] <ogra> you can indeed let the clients be on the internet directly
[11:27] <cbx33> oh i see
[11:27] <cbx33> i think
[11:27] <cbx33> are you saying....
[11:27] <ogra> why shouzld the clients not boot from the edubuntu server in the two NIC setup, there is nothing in the way
[11:27] <cbx33> Internet -> NIC1 -> Edubuntu server -> NiC2 -> Switch -> Clients
[11:27] <ogra> you have a dedicated network and a dedicated dhcpd
[11:28] <ogra> right
[11:28] <ogra> NIC2 is owned by the edubuntu server alone
[11:28] <cbx33> so basically you do have a seperate private subnet
[11:28] <cbx33> on NIC2
[11:28] <ogra> right, thats the default setup since edgy
[11:28] <cbx33> maybe it was just my wording
[11:28] <cbx33> that's what I was saying in that first bit
[11:28] <ogra> if yor setup differs from it you get  a warning from ltsp-client-builder during install
[11:29] <cbx33> that the "other card is usually connected to a private subnet of the network"
[11:29] <cbx33> NIC2 is connected to a switch connecte to just LTSP clients
[11:29] <ogra> right
[11:29] <cbx33> so where is my wording wrong?
[11:29] <ogra> but in no scenario you use edubuntu as a gateway (at least by default)
[11:29] <cbx33> ok
[11:30] <cbx33> if I remove the word gateway is that better?
[11:30] <ogra> "Using Edubuntu as the primary gateway requires the server machine to have two network interface cards. "
[11:30] <cbx33> I'll put using edubuntu in the recommend configuration requires/.....
[11:30] <ogra> try to explain why we use two NICs etc
[11:30] <cbx33> and take out primary gateway
[11:30] <cbx33> I will
[11:30] <cbx33> ok thanks
[11:30] <ogra> and indeed, avoid the term gateway :)
[11:30] <cbx33> hehe
[11:30] <cbx33> sorry
[11:31] <cbx33> i didn't mean gateway like that
[11:31] <cbx33> but yes
[11:31] <ogra> no, its fine
[11:31] <cbx33> I sholdn't have used it
[11:31] <ogra> there might come setups where we need to route the clients
[11:31] <ogra> in the future
[11:31] <cbx33> and the xres question was not in the build chroot
[11:31] <ogra> but for now i'd like to sell it as an additional security feature
[11:31] <cbx33> and the xres question was not in the build chroot
[11:31] <cbx33> it was in the general setup
[11:31] <ogra> ah, good
[11:31] <ogra> else debconf would have been broken
[11:32] <cbx33> hehe
[11:32] <cbx33> sorry
[11:32] <ogra> it's explicitly told to not ask
[11:32] <cbx33> thanks for the chroot reinforcement
[11:32] <cbx33> in the kernels section
[11:32] <ogra> yeah, thats important
[11:32] <cbx33> ;)
[11:32] <ogra> its complicated enough to muddle it up
[11:32] <juliux> cbx33, for alle the network are nice pictures in web https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWiring perhap it help
[11:32] <cbx33> yes
[11:33] <cbx33> now
[11:33] <ogra> juliux, these are not printable in a book ... the quality is rather web ...
[11:33] <cbx33> did I get the localdevices section all wrong
[11:33] <ogra> and i dont have bigger originals of them
[11:33] <cbx33> ogra: I will be putting diagrams
[11:33] <ogra> right
[11:33] <juliux> ogra, i will create new ones in the next days, i need some for a poster for the expos
[11:33] <cbx33> but they are likely to be redrawn by publishers
[11:34] <cbx33> is my local devices section all wrong ogra ?
[11:34] <ogra> no, the localdev section is fine, but missing information :)
[11:34] <cbx33> oh ok
[11:34] <cbx33> I'll read
[11:35] <ogra> how do i switch it on on a normal ubuntu, what has to be done additionally in edubuntu
[11:35] <cbx33> I'l probably leave that out
[11:35] <cbx33> and point to a wiki
[11:36] <cbx33> as this is meant to be generally about edubuntu
[11:36] <ogra> well, the "add the user to the fuse group, the user manager has a special option for it" would be nice, else you wont have local devices at all
[11:37] <cbx33> ahhh yes
[11:37] <cbx33> so you need that for edubuntu too?
[11:37] <ogra> (not adding the users to the fuse group by default is also a security feature you can point out)
[11:37] <ogra> yes, thats all thats needed in edubuntu
[11:38] <ogra> in ubuntu you have to enable it in the lts.conf additionally, which edubuntu has by default
[11:39] <ogra> (just read the wiki ;) )
[11:39] <cbx33> ok
[11:39] <cbx33> I will
[11:39] <cbx33> sorry about the troubleshooting ltsp
[11:39] <cbx33> :p
[11:40] <cbx33> the dhcp-server status
[11:40] <cbx33> heheh
[11:40] <cbx33> i guessed....to be checked later on
[11:40] <cbx33> thanks for the commands
[11:40] <ogra> in the future we'll have little tools based on python-ltsp for that ;)
[11:40] <cbx33> nice
[11:41] <cbx33> for the window managers
[11:42] <cbx33> obviously once they are installed...the dropdown stuff applies right?
[11:42] <cbx33> kubuntu-desktop
[11:42] <cbx33> ?
[11:42] <ogra> it always applies
[11:42] <ogra> you always have a "default" and a "gnome" session
[11:42] <cbx33> ahh yes
[11:42] <ogra> where default points to gnome in that case indeed
[11:43] <ogra> if you install xfce, kubuntu or xubuntu desktop they will appear there ... whatever you installed last will be the default
[11:43] <cbx33> ok
[11:43] <cbx33> does ldm askyou if you want to make the one you just changed to default?
[11:44] <ogra> no
[11:44] <ogra> it's not gdm :)
[11:44] <ogra> (yet :P )
[11:44] <cbx33> hehe
[11:45] <cbx33> ok so ... arey ouhappy for what I have to be the first draft if I make the changes you requested?
[11:45] <ogra> sure
[11:45] <cbx33> is it ok?
[11:45] <ogra> yep
[11:45] <cbx33> how would you rate it?
[11:45] <cbx33> think it'l be good for edubuntu?
[11:46] <ogra> it's good user doumentation, and indeed i think it will be good :)
[11:48] <cbx33> ogra: cool eat well....last thing....is there anything missing from the chapter...and that's it I'm done THANK YOU SO MUCH
[11:48] <cbx33> you are a LEGEND
[12:51] <ogra> cbx33, you didnt add ${python:depends} to thin-client-manager-gnome (pycentral dependency is still missing), the copyright file is still missing the dates, cheap_plugin still has an underscore in its name (python naming policy)
[12:53] <ogra> cbx33, and i still have the wrong glade file ...
[12:53] <ogra> nothing changed ....
[12:54] <ogra> ogra@edubuntu:~/packages/thin-client-manager-0.5.0$ sudo student-control-panel
[12:54] <ogra> Traceback (most recent call last):
[12:54] <ogra>   File "/usr/bin/student-control-panel", line 740, in <module>
[12:54] <ogra>     base = ControlPanel()
[12:54] <ogra>   File "/usr/bin/student-control-panel", line 95, in __init__
[12:54] <ogra>     self.share.connect("clicked", lambda w: self.make_share(treeselection))
[12:54] <ogra> AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'connect'
[12:56] <cbx33> WHAT?
[12:56] <cbx33> I changed all that
[12:56] <cbx33> do you have the right email?
[12:56] <cbx33> that's not right
[12:57] <ogra> i have your last email
[12:57] <ogra> the one where i picked the book chapter out as well
[12:57] <cbx33> no
[12:58] <cbx33> i sent you one yesterday
[12:58] <ogra> oh, right
[12:58] <ogra> heh, sorry
[12:58] <ogra> what is thin-client-manager_0.5.0.tar.gz ?
[12:58] <cbx33> you obviously havn't eaten enough
[12:59] <cbx33> thought that was autogenerated by my debuild
[12:59] <ogra> i rarely eat before 4pm :)
[12:59] <ogra> it shouldnt, else something with the package is wrong
[12:59] <cbx33> ok....ignore it then
[12:59] <ogra> i'll check ... dont worry
[12:59] <cbx33> go for the orig...
[12:59] <cbx33> that's always right
[01:00] <cbx33> did I tell you....my school is seriously considered a switch to linux
[01:01] <ogra> no, thats nice :)
[01:02] <cbx33> yeh
[01:03] <cbx33> Yikes......Dell are only shipping Vista now
[01:03] <cbx33> it's only been out a few days
[01:03] <cbx33> would have thought they would offer both options for a while
[01:03] <cbx33> as Vista still has _a lot_ of problems
[01:03] <RichEd> cbx33: tell your school that w2000 -> vista is a migration, and not an upgrade
[01:04] <RichEd> so if they have to migrate, why not migrate to an open future, free of licence fees or licence admin and the whims & financial needs of a US monopoly
[01:04] <ogra> cbx33, using ${python:depends} requires that you run dh_python in your rules file
[01:13] <cliebow> cbx33:yeah saw the same thing at bestbuy and circuit city..bend over and embrace visigoth...errr vis ta
[01:15] <cbx33> ogra: sorry
[01:16] <cbx33> Je suis stupide
[01:17] <ogra> hmm, wait, that doesnt help dh_python is deprecated ...
[01:18] <ogra> should rather be dh_pysupport and a Build-Dep-Indep:
[01:18] <cbx33> ah yes...think i saw that when i was creating...the debianpolicy
[01:18] <cbx33> ah i seee
[01:24] <ogra> bah, blind me ...
[01:24] <ogra> pycentral does it ... if you spell right ...
[01:24] <ogra> ${python:depends} needs to be ${python:Depends} indeed
[01:25] <cbx33> ahhh sorry
[01:26] <cbx33> did you wanna make any changes and send it back to me....or did you want me to make the changes?
[01:26] <ogra> if i dotn discover bigger stufgf i'm fine with making small changes
[01:26] <ogra> i'm not done yet :)
[01:27] <cbx33> hehehaha
[01:27] <cbx33> i know
[01:27] <ogra> hrm
[01:27] <ogra> what about the python2.4-dbus dep ?
[01:27] <ogra> can we switch to 2.5 ?
[01:27] <cbx33> i would think so
[01:27] <cbx33> what do we do about previous versions?
[01:27] <cbx33> is there a python-dbus?
[01:28] <ogra> yep
[01:28] <cbx33> maybe we could use that
[01:29] <ogra> right
[01:30] <ogra> does tcm-backend need to depend on pessulus ?
[01:30] <ogra> heh, no it depends on python-tcm thats sufficient
[01:30] <cbx33> umm....well....the backend should provide pessulus over ssh -X
[01:31] <ogra> the backend runs wwhere ?
[01:32] <ogra> ltsp server or client session ?
[01:32] <cbx33> ltsp server
[01:32] <ogra> well, thats totally pointless to discuss ... :)
[01:32] <ogra> no matter where you install it, python-tcm is a dep ;)
[01:33] <ogra> and python-tcm pulls in all we need (dbus, pessulus)
[01:33] <cbx33> yes
[01:33] <ogra> ok, looks better now
[01:39] <ogra> look, a gui :)
[01:39] <ogra> sadly its crashing over and over
[01:40] <ogra> lots of ps errors
[01:42] <cbx33> oh yeh it will do
[01:42] <cbx33> john doesn;t exist as a user
[01:42] <cbx33> neither does pete
[01:42] <cbx33> I did say that to you
[01:43] <cbx33> cos the userlist function is hacked
[01:43] <ogra> well, there is some other wonky stuff going on as well
[01:45] <ogra> did you test and develop on a feisty system ?
[01:45] <ogra> there is a lot of buggy stuff going on, tcm interacts with apport all the time
[01:46] <cbx33> yes i have tested an run on a feisty system
[01:47] <ogra> the "end process" button still shows in all windows
[01:47] <cbx33> yeh that's on my list
[01:48] <cbx33> I'll look into the apport thing tonight
[01:48] <ogra> did you think about how to create the ssh user and his keys ?
[01:48] <cbx33> no.....seeing as it's not my strong point I thought I'd ask you about it
[01:48] <ogra> might be triggered by a vnc backtrace i see all the time
[01:48] <cbx33> ahhh
[01:49] <cbx33> quite possibly
[01:49] <ogra> tcm must work without vnc running on the client ...
[01:49] <ogra> so please add error handling there
[01:49] <cbx33> it should do
[01:49] <cbx33> i will run over that again
[01:49] <ogra> Traceback (most recent call last):
[01:49] <ogra>   File "/usr/bin/student-control-panel", line 244, in new_vnc
[01:49] <ogra>     self.vnc[(a)]  = VNC(self.wTree, users[a] [2] , port, passw)
[01:49] <ogra>   File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/studentcontrolpanel/vnc.py", line 610, in __init__
[01:49] <ogra>     self.window = gtk.glade.XML("/home/pete/vnctest/vncview.glade")
[01:50] <cbx33> YIKES
[01:50] <cbx33> that path was fixed in my latest upload
[01:50] <ogra> if it cant establish a connection, just make it quiet ... as a goodie you could present a default pic in the preview
[01:50] <cbx33> no no, it's failing cos it's looking for the vncview.glade file in my home dir
[01:51] <ogra> something like a cracked display or so ...
[01:51] <ogra> ah
[01:51] <cbx33> it was an early hack that I changed yesterday
[01:51] <ogra> right
[01:51] <cbx33> it's now in the /usr/share/student-control-panel
[01:51] <cbx33> lemme check that
[01:51] <ogra> the "connect to desktop" button needs to go from the process window as well
[01:52] <ogra> (trivial glade hack)
[01:52] <ogra> yeah, apport seems not to care for the ps errors, but for the vnc traceback ...
[01:53] <cbx33> yes
[01:53] <cbx33> if you want to modify to test it's at the bottom of the vnc.py file in the usr/lib
[01:53] <cbx33> just after the VNC class edfinition
[01:53] <cbx33> it slipped through
[01:53] <cbx33> sorry
[01:54] <ogra> whats that connect/disconnect button in the toolbar ?
[01:54] <ogra> the most left one
[01:54] <cbx33> that will be for the remote server
[01:54] <ogra> (apart from being a redundant button)
[01:54] <cbx33> will bring up a dialog
[01:54] <ogra> ah, that will need another icon
[01:55] <ogra> having two disconnect buttons with the same icon is a bit conbfusing
[01:55] <cbx33> yes
[01:55] <cbx33> i know
[01:55] <cbx33> icons are my last point
[01:55] <ogra> but thats a feisty+1 feature anyway, just hide it for now
[01:55] <cbx33> oh is it...
[01:55] <ogra> and make it switched on constantly
[01:55] <cbx33> it's done
[01:56] <ogra> did you test it extensively with say 10 ltsp servers ?
[01:56] <cbx33> no....
[01:56] <cbx33> i don;t have that kind of resources
[01:56] <ogra> and where is the dialog you were talking about :)
[01:56] <cbx33> for the remote server?
[01:56] <ogra> lets do it right and keep it for feisty+1
[01:56] <cbx33> not done yet... :p
[01:56] <cbx33> it would just be an ip
[01:57] <ogra> the parts that are done are awesome already, dont get aucght by featuritis
[01:57] <cbx33> ok
[01:57] <ogra> *caught
[01:57] <cbx33> :(
[01:57] <ogra> meh
[01:57] <cbx33> I'll remove it...
[01:57] <ogra> *c a u g h t
[01:57] <ogra> just the guoi item ....
[01:57] <ogra> dont remove the code
[01:57] <cbx33> if you check out the ltcm.py file in /usr/lib you'll see that it's mostly in there
[01:57] <cbx33> yeh i know what you mean
[01:57] <cbx33> each call to the backend has a "remote" alternative
[01:57] <cbx33> if an ip is passed
[01:58] <ogra> yep, saw that
[01:58] <ogra> lets concentrate on the features we actually can test ...
[01:59] <cbx33> ok
[01:59] <ogra> and that are likely to be perfect in the release
[01:59] <cbx33> tested the user groups thingy?
[01:59] <ogra> not yet
[01:59] <ogra> i need to revert your static userlist first ...
[01:59] <ogra> for now i'm fine ...
[01:59] <cbx33> heh
[02:00] <ogra> the package looks ok with my minor changes
[02:00] <ogra> i'll send you the debdiff and upload ...
[02:00] <ogra> oh, one thing ...
[02:00] <cbx33> ok
[02:00] <cbx33> what's that
[02:00] <cbx33> I gotta shoot off for a while
[02:00] <ogra> lets agree that we use the ubuntu versioning scheme with the new version
[02:00] <cbx33> sure
[02:00] <ogra> makes it easier for debian to adopt it
[02:00] <cbx33> if you can explain it to me
[02:00] <cbx33> I'll use it
[02:00] <ogra> 0.5.0 is your upstream version
[02:01] <ogra> 0.5.0-1 would be the first debian package of it (if its non native liek ours)
[02:01] <cbx33> gtg....will read when i get back
[02:01] <ogra> 0.5.0-0ubuntu1 would be a first ubuntu package of an app
[02:02] <ogra> because 0.5.0-1 is bigger than 0.5.0-0ubuntu1 a package from the same source built in debian would override ours
[02:02] <ogra> makes syncing easy etc
[02:03] <ogra> oh, and one last thing, please be more wordy in your changelog entries ...
[02:03] <cbx33> thanks ogra
[02:03] <cbx33> ok
[02:03] <ogra> you did a lot of changes ....
[02:04] <ogra> one line doesnt suffice for that :)
[02:04] <cbx33> ok
[02:04] <ogra> i'll add up stuff before the upload ...
[02:48] <cbx33> ogra: I'l get that fixed tonight when i get home from work
[03:26] <sbalneav> Morning all
[03:26] <cbx33> hey sbalneav
[03:27] <jsgotangco> yo!
[03:28] <cbx33> yo yo jsgotangco
[03:29] <juliux> hi sbalneav jsgotangco
[03:29] <sbalneav> Hello hell
[03:29] <sbalneav> hello
[03:29] <jsgotangco> hey you guys how are you doing
[03:29] <sbalneav> whoops, fingers aren't working yet.
[03:29] <sbalneav> Need more coffee.
[03:45] <willvdl> coffee, that's what's wrong with me today. I ran out of coffee
[03:48] <willvdl> hey jsgotangco, quick question?
[03:49] <jsgotangco> go ahead
[03:49] <willvdl> on wiki there are 2 spots where handbook/cookbook were managed
[03:49] <willvdl> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/EdubuntuCookbook
[03:49] <willvdl> which redirects to help.u.com
[03:49] <willvdl> and https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuHandbook
[03:49] <willvdl> presumably one must be deprecated?
[03:50] <jsgotangco> willvdl: honestly, my brain is fried at the moment for all these issues i have at home and myself so I can't even remember that
[03:50] <willvdl> okie, I'll read both, figure out which is most recent and delete the other
[03:51] <jsgotangco> im sorry
[03:51] <willvdl> no worries
[03:52] <jsgotangco> its just that so many things are on my mind at the moment
[03:52] <jsgotangco> and IRC is the best place to escape
[03:52] <jsgotangco> :)
[03:52] <willvdl> that's what oyu thought...mwuhahaha
[03:52] <willvdl> you need to join #escapism, not #edubuntu
[03:52] <jsgotangco> lol
[03:53] <willvdl> or change your nick
[03:53] <jsgotangco> or #marriage-counselling or something
[03:53] <willvdl> perhaps #my-dog-died-recently
[03:53] <willvdl> darn, it's too hot here for me to think straight either
[04:05] <march> Hi@all
[04:14] <accuser> anyone deployed edubuntu into a primary school?
[04:48] <cliebow_> 3-5..
[05:08] <cbx33> ping ogra_ how do you specify usb printers in lts.conf
[05:08] <cbx33> or sbalneav for that matter :p
[05:08] <sbalneav> Ummm,
[05:08] <sbalneav> should be... (gimme a sec)
[05:09] <cbx33> cos paraller is /dev/lp0
[05:09] <cbx33> right
[05:09] <sbalneav> I think it's /dev/usb/lp0
[05:09] <cbx33> anywhere to make sure
[05:09] <cbx33> it's for the edubuntu chapter in the officilal ubuntu boook
[05:10] <sbalneav> I can check at home tonight.  It depends on where Ubuntu's udev puts usb printers.  I don't have one here, but at home I do.
[05:10] <cbx33> ok cool
[05:10] <cbx33> thanks sbalneav
[05:10] <cbx33> sbalneav, ooh can I ask yo uanother question
[05:11] <sbalneav> Sure.
[05:11] <cbx33> in the lts.conf file
[05:11] <cbx33> you do something like
[05:11] <cbx33> [00:4C:69:73:61:00] 
[05:11] <cbx33>     PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/lp0
[05:11] <ogra_> its /dev/usblp0
[05:11] <cbx33> ogra_, you rock thanks dude
[05:11] <sbalneav> ah
[05:11] <ogra_> no additional slashes
[05:11] <sbalneav> there we go.
[05:11] <cbx33> the 9100
[05:11] <cbx33> etc...
[05:12] <cbx33> that's permachine right?
[05:12] <ogra_> no
[05:12] <sbalneav> Right.
[05:12] <cbx33> so you can have 9100 on one ip
[05:12] <cbx33> and 9100 on another ip?
[05:12] <ogra_> right
[05:12] <sbalneav> yes
[05:12] <cbx33> thanks guys
[05:12] <ogra_> but it counts up with every additional PRINTER_n_DEVICE
[05:12] <cbx33> yes
[05:12] <cbx33> on each machine
[05:13] <cbx33> now sound edgy ogra_
[05:13] <ogra_> right
[05:13] <cbx33> SOUND=True for dapper
[05:13] <cbx33> is that needed for edgy too?
[05:14] <ogra_> sure
[05:14] <ogra_> even though edgy will also understand Y
[05:14] <cbx33> right
[05:14] <cbx33> thanks I'll leave it as that then
[05:14] <cbx33> but feisty it's default right?
[05:14] <ogra_> but just keep it at True :)
[05:14] <cbx33> of course
[05:15] <cbx33> less confusing
[05:15] <ogra_> not sure yet if i want to ship a default lts.conmf
[05:15] <cbx33> ahh...
[05:15] <cbx33> ok I'll keep it as you have to modify lts for now
[05:15] <ogra_> its default in edubuntu
[05:15] <ogra_> but not in ltsp
[05:15] <cbx33> ahh
[05:15] <cbx33> I only really care about edubuntu at the moment
[05:15] <ogra_> ah, right
[05:15] <ogra_> we have it in hthe default file since edgy
[05:16] <cbx33> ahh
[05:16] <ogra_> look yourself ;)
[05:16] <cbx33> thought so
[05:16] <cbx33> sorry ogra_
[05:16] <cbx33> :# - embarrased
[05:19] <cbx33> ogra_, where i use the lp_server name in the chapter....should I use lp_server/jetpipe ?
[05:19] <cbx33> cos we don't use lp_server now do we
[05:19] <ogra_> no, we dont
[05:19] <cbx33> I explained the difference above
[05:19] <ogra_> dont make it to public
[05:19] <ogra_> (the old name i mean)
[05:19] <cbx33> oh ok
[05:20] <cbx33> I'll just use jetpipe
[05:20] <ogra_> sbalneav, btw ...
[05:20] <cbx33> do we yet have a print charging system for edubuntu LTSP?
[05:20] <cbx33> that is something our school would be extremely interested in
[05:20] <cbx33> maybe I'll have to write one
[05:20] <ogra_> cups ?
[05:20] <ogra_> it should write proper logs
[05:20] <cbx33> cool
[05:20] <cbx33> but does it limit printing based on how much they have used?
[05:21] <ogra_> on the server you still run cups ... jetpipe is only piping jetdirect stuff to /dev/lpsomething
[05:21] <cbx33> true...sorry I'm pretty fried it's been a long day
[05:22] <cbx33> ogra_, is this valid
[05:22] <cbx33> [00:4C:69:73:61:00] 
[05:22] <cbx33>     PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/lp0
[05:22] <cbx33>     PRINTER_1_DEVICE = /dev/usblp0
[05:22] <ogra_> yes
[05:22] <cbx33> hehehe
[05:23] <cbx33> how do you suggest people get the mac address from the client?
[05:27] <cliebow_> cbx33:you mean without watching syslog?
[05:31] <cbx33> cliebow, heheh yeh
[05:35] <cbx33> arrggghh
[05:35] <cbx33> attack of the caravena
[05:36] <willvdl> you were attacked by a Spanish caravan?
[05:38] <cbx33> heh
[05:43] <cbx33> IP=192.168.16.5 ; ping -c1 $IP | grep "NULL"; arp -a | grep $IP
[05:43] <cbx33> that sufficient for getting the mac of a running ip ogra_ ?
[05:43] <billy_idle> c you
[05:44] <ogra_> i think so ...
[05:44] <cbx33> seems to work ok here
[05:46] <ogra_> cbx33, tcm is in ...
[05:46] <cbx33> w00t
[05:46] <cbx33> universe or main?
[05:46] <cbx33> did you make all the changes?
[05:46] <ogra_> i did make a bunch of them
[05:47] <cbx33> thank you...I really do owe you
[05:47] <ogra_> but now you can work directly on the package
[05:47] <cbx33> fantastic
[05:47] <cbx33> that makes it a lot easier
[05:47] <cbx33> did you even update my changelog entry?
[05:47] <ogra_> yes
[05:48] <ogra_> meh, we were missing an empty SCP package ... for the transition
[05:48] <cbx33> ?
[05:48] <cbx33> oh for upgraders?
[05:48] <ogra_> yep
[05:48] <ogra_> ok, now SCP is gone ...
[05:49] <cbx33> did you fix the vnc vncview file path error?
[05:49] <ogra_> Accepted:
[05:49] <ogra_> thin-client-manager 0.5.0-0ubuntu1 was ACCEPTED.
[05:49] <ogra_>         Component: main Section: misc
[05:49] <ogra_> nope ...
[05:49] <cbx33> ok
[05:49] <ogra_> i count that as general bugfixing
[05:49] <cbx33> ah right ok
[05:49] <cbx33> so assume you fixed just pacakging issues
[05:49] <cbx33> I have a printout of our convo
[05:49] <ogra_> the *feature* is there, we just need to fix the bugs in it :)
[05:49] <cbx33> so i will fix any other issues you mentioned
[05:49] <cbx33> :)
[05:50] <cbx33> thank you again ogra_
[05:50] <cbx33> I know it took valuable time to look at that today
[05:50] <cbx33> and the book
[05:50] <cbx33> you rock
[05:50] <ogra_> and really, dont try to do everything, concentrate on the most important stuff, what we dont get this release, we'll get next one ...
[05:51] <cbx33> ok
[05:51] <cbx33> I don't want to dissapoint
[05:51] <cbx33> I'll get the most important stuff done
[05:51] <ogra_> if you have time left to do extra stuff, fine ...
[05:51] <cbx33> ok
[05:51] <ogra_> but set priorities :)
[05:51] <ogra_> for yourself i mean ...
[05:51] <cbx33> meh 195.248.38.80 is down
[05:51] <cbx33> archive.ubuntu.com
[05:52] <cbx33> you deserve it
[05:52] <cbx33> making the changes to book now
[05:52] <cbx33> tcm is for later on
[05:52] <cbx33> so ogra_ we're good for FF now?
[05:52] <ogra_> 195.248.90.35 is up :)
[05:52] <cbx33> hehe
[05:52] <ogra_> archive.ubuntu.com
[05:52] <ogra_> not at all
[05:52] <cbx33> I need to fix up and working for Thursday
[05:52] <ogra_> edubuntu auth server/client are looking bad ...
[05:52] <cbx33> ok
[05:53] <cbx33> no no i meant TCM
[05:53] <ogra_> fat clients wont happen without it
[05:53] <cbx33> anything I can do? - says the man who's already pushing it :)
[05:53] <ogra_> so all i have to show this time might be sound, tcm and 2cds
[05:53] <cbx33> get me a job there and I can finish everything up
[05:53] <cbx33> haha
[05:53] <ogra_> i'm trying to get ltsp-manager done though
[05:53] <cbx33> ogra_, do we have an edubuntu specific roadmap?
[05:54] <ogra_> willvdl wanted to make one once ...
[05:54] <cbx33> i think it's good idea
[05:54] <ogra_> but i think that didnt happen yet
[05:54] <ogra_> soemthing for the educon :)
[05:54] <cbx33> but not now obviously
[05:54] <willvdl> well, the technical roadmap is handled well by the sprints, dev summits and launchpad
[05:55] <cbx33> and we need to split up tasks....and make that more visible
[05:55] <cbx33> willvdl, is it all documented in one place?
[05:55] <cbx33> willvdl, got time for a little chat?
[05:55] <willvdl> cbx33, if you know how to use LP then yes :)
[05:55] <ogra_> willvdl, well, then we need a roadmap generator that makes us a roadmap from the html of the spec page ;)
[05:56] <ogra_> something for UDS ;)
[05:56] <cbx33> willvdl, what d'ya need
[05:56] <willvdl> ogra_, is there a real need for that? I mean will be automatic but it will still need ot be built
[05:56] <ogra_> well, you build it once
[05:56] <ogra_> and paste it to a website
[05:56] <cbx33> oh sorry willvdl
[05:56] <ogra_> "desired features"
[05:56] <cbx33> i didn't get what ya meant
[05:56] <cbx33> is it possible to track those changes
[05:57] <cbx33> and also....what can we break down for the community
[05:57] <willvdl> hang on, two threads :)
[05:57] <ogra_> "for status overviews please see the specific spec pages on LP"
[05:57] <cbx33> thanks ogra_
[05:57] <willvdl> ogra_, there is probably a good case for a nice formatted easy to read overview that is simply pulled from LP
[05:57] <cbx33> i think if we can pull all relevant info together on a wiki page
[05:58] <ogra_> willvdl, thats what i mean ... if i remember yxou and RichEd in the beginning, such a page would have been valuable
[05:58] <willvdl> The hard part is pulling in the "informational" specs on docs/marketing etc.
[05:58] <cbx33> of course
[05:58] <willvdl> yeah, RichEd mentioned something like that
[05:58] <ogra_> anyway, break ... bbl
[05:58] <cbx33> but once it's done initially it means it _should_ just need updating
[05:58] <cbx33> see ya ogra_
[05:59] <willvdl> it will work for the technical specs
[06:00] <willvdl> cbx33, have a look at https://wiki.edubuntu.org/Edubuntu/Wiki/SiteMap
[06:00] <willvdl> it is a WIP for the wiki at least to use the wiki more than the www
[06:00] <willvdl> and point to all the spin-off projects
[06:00] <willvdl> like doc-team, marjeting-team, esa
[06:01] <cbx33> cool
[06:01] <willvdl> it's jsut a start as it's quite hard to do :)
[06:01] <cbx33> do we generally have people in charge of speficic areas?
[06:01] <willvdl> but our community page etc needed updating
[06:01] <cbx33> it would be nice after the meeting on a wednesday, to have each...section leader, update what's needed to be updated etc
[06:01] <cbx33> so people know what's going on and can help out
[06:02] <willvdl> that's tricky too
[06:02] <willvdl> considering that docs are handled by the doc-team
[06:02] <willvdl> etc.
[06:02] <willvdl> ah, wait I get you
[06:02] <willvdl> hmmm. nice idea
[06:03] <cbx33> do you see what i mean
[06:03] <willvdl> yes
[06:03] <cbx33> and then there is a one stop portal
[06:03] <cbx33> for what's needed to be done
[06:03] <cbx33> what has been done
[06:03] <willvdl> have a look at that sitemap and tell me if the structure makes sense to you
[06:03] <cbx33> yes it does
[06:04] <cbx33> perhaps
[06:04] <willvdl> I'm not convinced it will work properly
[06:04] <cbx33> we could split it down into the sections of the meeting
[06:04] <willvdl> It is geared around "how to contribute" and then ships you off somewhere else
[06:04] <cbx33> i revolve around that myself
[06:04] <cbx33> if we had a page with
[06:04] <cbx33> Tech/Artwork/Docs/Community etc
[06:04] <cbx33> as a small nav at the top
[06:04] <willvdl> as opposed to "how to contribute" and "this is what we are doing"
[06:05] <willvdl> like the original community page
[06:05] <cbx33> people could click on that and see the curent status of what we're doing
[06:05] <cbx33> hmmm
[06:05] <cbx33> i see your point
[06:05] <willvdl> I'm going to work on it again tonight.
[06:06] <willvdl> I need to e.g. move doc stuff to doc-team and then link to there from our roadmap
[06:06] <cbx33> hmm yes
[06:07] <willvdl> I also need a quick break. very hot
[06:07] <cbx33> hehe
[06:07] <cbx33> it's cold here
[06:07] <cbx33> like only a few degrees
[06:09] <willvdl> 30 at least here and it's 19:00
[06:16] <highvoltage> willvdl: according to the gnome applet, its' 24C atm :)
[06:16] <highvoltage> (but it feels closer to 30C)
[06:18] <cbx33> ltsp-build-client --extra-mirror=http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu feisty universe
[06:19] <cbx33> is that the correct syntax for building a chroot with univer added?
[06:21] <Laser_away> willvdl: pingy pingy
[06:21] <cbx33> hey LaserJock
[06:21] <LaserJock> hi Pete
[06:22] <LaserJock> is oli around?
[06:23] <willvdl> highvoltage, your gnome applet is not in SMW :)
[06:23] <LaserJock> cbx33: I see lots of TCM activity in the backlog
[06:23] <willvdl> LaserJock, pongy pongy
[06:23] <cbx33> yup it's in
[06:23] <LaserJock> willvdl: did you get an answer about Edubuntu Cookbook vs Edubuntu Handbook in the wiki?
[06:23] <cbx33> oli is around he's just on a break right now
[06:24] <willvdl> ah, no
[06:24] <cbx33> LaserJock, ^^ is that the right syntax for the build client do you know?
[06:24] <LaserJock> willvdl: Edubuntu Cookbook was started first, and then the Edubuntu Handbook was started seperately later
[06:25] <LaserJock> I kept the old material around because there was a decent amount of material
[06:25] <willvdl> yip, realise that but I'm not sure about the "relevance" of the stuff that is in help.u.c
[06:25] <cbx33> pardon me but...does KEduca actually do anything when you select a test from the servers?
[06:25] <LaserJock> cbx33: I don't know about syntax
[06:25] <LaserJock> still morning for me
[06:26] <LaserJock> ;-)
[06:26] <LaserJock> willvdl: well, if the Handbook gets done I almost think we should wipe both from the wiki
[06:26] <willvdl> LaserJock, we all spoke at some length not so long ago about doing stuff on wiki vs docbook
[06:26] <willvdl> and I still don't know what is the best course of action...
[06:27] <LaserJock> sure
[06:27] <LaserJock> but I think starting from a clean slate at least would be good
[06:27] <cbx33> ++
[06:27] <willvdl> is there stuff on the wiki that is not in the docbook?
[06:27] <cbx33> possibly
[06:27] <LaserJock> I don't know
[06:27] <cbx33> why not export and save all pages somewhere
[06:27] <LaserJock> that's the problem
[06:27] <cbx33> :p
[06:27] <willvdl> OK, I'll check tonight and make a report on it
[06:28] <cbx33> wow you're brave willvdl
[06:28] <LaserJock> outdated and incomplete help is about as bad as no help at all
[06:28] <willvdl> I just don't have the time to actually contribute to the docbook at the moment.
[06:28] <willvdl> but I can make a few wiki pages pointing folks to how to contribute :)
[06:28] <LaserJock> mhm
[06:29] <willvdl> I just with that Help Wiki Wuality Assurance spec would get taken seriously
[06:30] <LaserJock> well, it is taken seriously
[06:30] <LaserJock> just not enough man power to get anywhere fast, IMO
[06:30] <willvdl> meaning I can see some real problems coming in when we have dapper, edgy and feisty swirling about
[06:30] <willvdl> and one handbook for instance
[06:31] <cbx33> yes
[06:31] <highvoltage> willvdl: heh
[06:31] <cbx33> willvdl, I have already hit that
[06:31] <cbx33> with the book chapter
[06:31] <willvdl> how?
[06:31] <willvdl> meaning you have already experienced that?
[06:31] <cbx33> writing some different versions of methods to handle diffrent verions of edubuntu
[06:32] <cbx33> right well....i think willvdl that this hits upon what we were talking about earlier
[06:32] <cbx33> hi highvoltage
[06:32] <LaserJock> we should have a wiki page that gives a table of LTSP features and what versions of Edubuntu have them
[06:32] <willvdl> docbook has some "context" tag thingy that would work
[06:32] <cbx33> LaserJock, mostly, how to enable/enabled by default too
[06:32] <willvdl> then when you build it each release, you jsut specify what "contexts" to build in
[06:33] <LaserJock> that sounds somewhat overly complicated
[06:33] <LaserJock> why not branch for each version of Edubuntu
[06:33] <willvdl> it's in the Qual Assur spec
[06:34] <LaserJock> for docbook?
[06:34] <willvdl> yip.
[06:35] <LaserJock> HelpWikiQualityAssurance does say anything about docbook
[06:35] <LaserJock> *doesn't
[06:35] <LaserJock> just Moin
[06:35] <willvdl> hmmm, where did I read it then...
[06:36] <LaserJock> maybe in one of Matthew East's other brain bender specs ;-)
[06:37] <willvdl> Sean Wheller is quite a fan of the idea as well
[06:37] <LaserJock> I bet
[06:38] <LaserJock> not that I'm particularly against it
[06:38] <LaserJock> I just think we've got a lot of other things that need fixing
[06:38] <willvdl> but I guess you're right, branches would suffice
[06:38] <willvdl> it depends on how the Handbook is going to be distributed
[06:39] <cbx33> bbl
[06:40] <LaserJock> right now we can't even make pdfs right so I'm a little less concerned about branching vs context building
[06:41] <willvdl> pdfs are a lesser concern IMO
[06:41] <LaserJock> well, it depends
[06:41] <LaserJock> branching works quite well
[06:42] <LaserJock> though it is would probably be a little bit more managment
[06:42] <willvdl> only problem with branching is that there is then less tendency to update older docs
[06:42] <LaserJock> having a PDF that people can print that looks profession is important for me
[06:42] <willvdl> and onyl work on current ones
[06:43] <LaserJock> hmm, I'm not sure about that
[06:43] <willvdl> true. seperate issues though butI'm with you on the manpower thing
[06:43] <LaserJock> branching allows you to fix things in older docs without messing with the current ones
[06:43] <LaserJock> I could see the context thing as getting pretty complicated
[06:43] <willvdl> yeah but you'll be less likely to do so since it's branched
[06:43] <LaserJock> which is a good thing
[06:44] <willvdl> agreed. would need full-time management
[06:44] <LaserJock> you don't want "stable" documentation to be constantly changing
[06:44] <willvdl> yeah. point
[06:45] <LaserJock> there are pros and cons
[06:45] <willvdl> hmmm.
[06:45] <LaserJock> if the context thing worked well and there weren't a lot of differences it'd probably be nice
[06:45] <willvdl> I need to have a solid look at the handbook tonight
[06:45] <LaserJock> but if you are rewriting large chuncks each release ...
[06:45] <willvdl> I don't even know if it currently builds
[06:46] <LaserJock> I think nixternal's keeping track of it ok, he built an edubuntu-docs package
[06:46] <willvdl> awesome
[06:46] <willvdl> must remember to pat him on the back
[06:48] <willvdl> LaserJock, the other thing that is at the back of my mind is what the scope/aim of the handbook is suposed to be
[06:48] <willvdl> I can't help thinking that most relevant info should be in an install-guide and in upstream help
[06:50] <LaserJock> yes, well that's the nature of a Handbook
[06:50] <LaserJock> I think I'd rather see something more along the lines of TBH that integrates into the Ubuntu documentation
[06:50] <willvdl> exactly. it aims to reinvent certian wheels but at the same time I can see the definite need for it
[06:50] <willvdl> or that
[06:51] <LaserJock> on the other hand, it *is* useful as a PDF or HTML guide
[06:51] <LaserJock> where people can get all the info from one source
[06:51] <LaserJock> print it out
[06:51] <LaserJock> whatever
[06:51] <willvdl> especially since it is likely to be most useful as an install-guide and first-time-configuration-guide
[06:52] <willvdl> but if it's TBH then you can build it to look how you want
[06:52] <LaserJock> well, kinda
[06:53] <LaserJock> I don't think the doc team will be creating PDF or HTML versions of the docs anymore
[06:53] <LaserJock> we are basically sacraficing online versions to get TBH on the user's computer
[06:54] <LaserJock> in the end the goal is to reintroduce the contents of the help into the help wiki
[06:54] <LaserJock> so help.u.c will be all wiki
[06:55] <willvdl> yeah, I know.
[06:55] <willvdl> I'm not sure I like it though
[06:55] <willvdl> it means that the info is in yelp, fine, but also on the wiki
[06:55] <willvdl> which means people will want to edit it
[06:56] <willvdl> the reverse process doesn't work
[06:56] <LaserJock> well
[06:57] <LaserJock> at first the pages from yelp will be immutable I imagine
[06:57] <LaserJock> and then once Moin->docbook is finished then docs will be written/maintained in the wiki
[06:57] <LaserJock> and then shipped as docbook
[06:58] <willvdl> it just seems ... odd. are there not other collaborative tools (like gobby) for editing rather
[07:01] <willvdl> hmm feeding time. bbl
[07:29] <cbx33> ogra I still can't get my client to build
[07:29] <cbx33> is my line ^^^ ok?
[07:58] <willvdl> eek. too many handbooks :)
[08:07] <cbx33> hehehahah
[08:07] <cbx33> sorry willvdl
[08:07] <cbx33> :p
[08:09] <LaserJock> willvdl: at some point you just have to take the best one and archive the rest ;-)
[08:12] <nixternal> who said my name? :)
[08:12] <LaserJock> me
[08:13] <LaserJock> willvdl was wondering how edubuntu docs were doing
[08:13] <LaserJock> nixternal: did you just put the handbook into your new edubuntu-docs package?
[08:13] <nixternal> no
[08:14] <nixternal> handbook, about edubuntu, release notes, and the school advocacy guide
[08:14] <LaserJock> no Ubuntu material though
[08:14] <nixternal> I may have forgot to add that in the changelog
[08:14] <LaserJock> ?
[08:14] <nixternal> no Ubuntu material
[08:14] <nixternal> Ubuntu-docs are installed by default it seems with Edubuntu
[08:14] <LaserJock> I think we need to replace that
[08:15] <nixternal> well, I think the Ubuntu-docs should stay seeing as it will be GNOME specific, especially with the topic based help
[08:15] <LaserJock> yes, but it blows away all our docs in doing so
[08:15] <nixternal> if we remove Ubuntu-docs then we can just add the topic based stuff to the Edubuntu package
[08:15] <LaserJock> exactly
[08:16] <LaserJock> for now, I think it might be easier to tweak Ubuntu's yelp frontpage to add in the Edubuntu material
[08:16] <nixternal> already done
[08:16] <LaserJock> and include the TBH stuff in edubuntu-docs (replace ubuntu-docs)
[08:16] <nixternal> at least the Edubuntu shows up on the Yelp frontpage
[08:16] <LaserJock> does the Ubuntu material?
[08:16] <nixternal> yes
[08:16] <nixternal> both do
[08:17] <nixternal> it is rather sloppy, but nothing much that a little bit of hacking can't fix
[08:17] <LaserJock> hmm, have you got your package somewhere, I'd like to test that out
[08:17] <nixternal> ya, one sec
[08:17] <LaserJock> sloppy works for me as long as it works even a little bit ;-)
[08:17] <cbx33> are we getting the latest version of scribus in ubuntu?
[08:17] <cbx33> 1.3|
[08:17] <nixternal> http://www.nixternal.com/docs/edubuntu/feisty-package/
[08:17] <cbx33> we're lagging behind with 1.2.5
[08:18] <LaserJock> isn't that scribus-ng
[08:18] <nixternal> heh, I downloaded it from the Scribus page
[08:18] <LaserJock> ?
[08:18] <nixternal> yes
[08:18] <crimsun> LaserJock: Pete can't read, that's all.
[08:18] <nixternal> they have the Police Academy here at the university today
[08:19] <nixternal> so there are a bunch of wannabe cops roaming around
[08:19] <crimsun> cbx33: you're an MOTU; you _know_ how to use apt-cache search
[08:19] <cbx33> true
[08:20] <nixternal> haha
[08:20] <nixternal> sorry, didn't mean to laugh at you :)
[08:20] <nixternal> I have been in school for 2 hours now, and we have gotten 3 inches of snow in the mean time
[08:20] <nixternal> my drive home is going to be horrible
[08:22] <LaserJock> nixternal: blame it on all that global warming :-)
[08:23] <nixternal> shush, no such thing!
[08:23] <cbx33> nixternal, cool
[08:23] <LaserJock> nixternal: the other thing is if we want to ship the docs we need to get it into Main
[08:23] <cbx33> I only asked cos the default installed scribus in edubuntu is clearly 1.2.5
[08:23] <cbx33> That's all
[08:24] <nixternal> LaserJock: I will leave that up to you, I am not worthy
[08:24] <cbx33> i thought there was a newer one.  Sorry for my lack of reading abliities :(
[08:24] <LaserJock> I think there was something about replacing scribus with scribus-ng because 1.2 isn't going to be getting bug fixes, etc.
[08:24] <LaserJock> nixternal: *I* am not worthy
[08:24] <LaserJock> this stinkin' Feature Freeze deadline is killing me
[08:25] <nixternal> hah, you and crimsun are the closes to be legal entities of GODDOM
[08:25] <nixternal> was that a Bushism?
[08:25] <LaserJock> bah
[08:25] <crimsun> I ain't no stinking thing
[08:25] <cbx33> LaserJock, anything I can do?
[08:25] <crimsun> LaserJock's the MOTU rep to #launchpad _and_ a member of the MOTU trinity
[08:25] <nixternal> I can blame my poor typing on the lag I am experiencing on the school wifi > home server
[08:25] <cbx33> the MOTU trinity?
[08:26] <LaserJock> but crimsun's the one that does all the work so ...
[08:26] <crimsun> grunts do all the work while deities bask
[08:26] <LaserJock> cbx33: perhaps, I'm just trying to get MIRs in
[08:26] <nixternal> hah
[08:26] <nixternal> crimsun: well get to basking
[08:26] <crimsun> sorry, too busy being a grunt
[08:26] <LaserJock> lol
[08:28] <nixternal> heh
[08:28] <nixternal> crimsun: I think I found a new audio bug though
[08:28] <LaserJock> nixternal: ewww, the yelp frontpage is a tad nasty
[08:29] <nixternal> LaserJock: yes, I said that up ^^
[08:29] <cbx33> i read that as a tad tasty then
[08:29] <nixternal> crimsun: remember I told you about the mute button lighting up properly (which I never knew I had)?
[08:29] <LaserJock> nixternal: do you think you can work with mdke to get that worked out?
[08:29] <nixternal> well if I mute it, shutdown/reboot, when I come back in the system is still muted, but the led isn't lit
[08:30] <nixternal> LaserJock: if I have to :)
[08:30] <nixternal> sure I can
[08:30] <nixternal> I need to learn more than the KDE side truthfully
[08:30] <nixternal> I mean GNOME needs so much help, I figured I would learn it a little bit more :)
[08:31] <nixternal> OH, btw, The main KDE Educational leader, is an avid lover of Edubuntu I found out recently while talking to her
[08:31] <LaserJock> yep
[08:31] <LaserJock> Marie I think is her name?
[08:31] <nixternal> Yes
[08:31] <nixternal> I am helping her with the KDE 4 Educational documentation and hopefully working in strigi and some new help center
[08:32] <LaserJock> nixternal: I think you might want to change the versioning of your edubuntu-docs package
[08:32] <crimsun> nixternal: hardware boog.
[08:32] <crimsun> nixternal: we're obviously saving state correctly; bios isn't.
[08:33] <cbx33> stoopid bios
[08:33] <nixternal> heh
[08:33] <nixternal> I bet it works correctly in Windows :)
[08:36] <willvdl> LaserJock, nixternal: just catching up on a page or two back. Is the idea to have Edubuntu contain edubuntu-docs.deb but not ubuntu-docs.deb?
[08:36] <nixternal> LaserJock: I will be back at about 23:00 UTC. I gotta get my butt to class
[08:36] <nixternal> willvdl: yes
[08:36] <LaserJock> willvdl: we have to figure that out
[08:36] <willvdl> and then build edubuntu-docs.deb to include the TBH stuff
[08:37] <nixternal> merge some of the stuff from Ubuntu docs into Edubuntu docs
[08:37] <willvdl> makefile issue, nothing more?
[08:37] <LaserJock> well ...
[08:37] <nixternal> we need major, and I mean major help with content for the Handbook as well
[08:37] <LaserJock> mostly
[08:37] <willvdl> excluding content
[08:37] <LaserJock> we need to rework the yelp frontpage to work for Edubuntu
[08:38] <nixternal> alrighty, Im heading off to class, I will be back at home 17:00 Chicago Standard Time :)  23:00 for you UTC'ers
[08:38] <willvdl> lemme rephrase, to drop ubuntu-docs for Edubuntu would jsut require a tweaked makefile right?
[08:38] <nixternal> of course my server will be logging you talking bad about me
[08:38] <willvdl> we don't use your name when we do that
[08:38] <willvdl> we have hand-signals
[08:38] <nixternal> haha
[08:38] <LaserJock> willvdl: we also need to tweak the yelp frontpage to make it Edubuntu specific, but yeah
[08:39] <willvdl> OK. I'm working now on merging the 3 cookbooks
[08:39] <willvdl> and can hopefully make a patch before edubuntu-meeting
[08:41] <cbx33> nice
[08:41] <LaserJock> nixternal: make sure to use versioning that's consistent with the current edubuntu-docs package. In fact, you should have the changelog, etc. from that
[08:53] <nixternal> alrighty, back in class
[08:53] <nixternal> LaserJock: I will redo it when I get home
[08:54] <nixternal> this class is warm
[09:05] <willvdl> crap my docbook skills are seriously rusty. can't even remeber how to include from other docs
[09:22] <bddebian> Heya
[09:31] <swimmerino88> hello...can somebody help me?I have a little problem
[09:31] <LaserJock> please give us your problem and we'll see if we can help
[09:34] <cberl1> Hi folks.  Got a bit of a problem that I need help figuring out:  I ran into Kernel Panic today, and I'm not sure how to get data about what happened.  Can anyone point me in the right direction?  I'm on Edgy, and all up to date.
[09:35] <stgraber> you should be able to get the log of the kernel panic in your /var/log/syslog file
[09:35] <swimmerino88> ok in mi computer I have ubuntu...now i have installed all the desktop ubuntu-kubuntu-edubuntu-xubuntu...I have two problem...the first one is that ubuntu doesn't work!after the login appear a window which tell me that there is a bug.I saved the file and the other problem is that edubuntu isn't in my sessions in the login!
[09:36] <cberl1> stgraber: Okay, so I should check the syslog.x file that matches the time of the panic?
[09:36] <stgraber> yes
[09:36] <cberl1> Okay, then what do I do with it?  :)
[09:37] <stgraber> check what's written just above it
[09:37] <stgraber> if you are lucky you'll easily see what module is involved
[09:37] <cberl1> Okay, I'll start there.  Thanks!
[09:38] <stgraber> Once the module name found, you'll be able to find if the bug is already reported on https://launchpad.net
[09:38] <stgraber> if not, you'll be able to file a new bug
[09:40] <cberl1> stgraber: What if I don't find anything in the syslog about the kernel panic?
[09:41] <stgraber> can you paste this part of the syslog to a pastebin ?
[09:41] <swimmerino88> LaserJock: this is the text that I saved http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4461/
[09:41] <cberl1> Sure -- I'll send you the appropriate timeframe and post the link here.
[09:43] <swimmerino88> please...nobody have my problem???
[09:44] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: Edubuntu essentiall replace Ubuntu
[09:44] <LaserJock> they both use Gnome
[09:44] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:so i have to install or ubuntu or edubuntu?
[09:45] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: well, it's all there
[09:45] <LaserJock> it's just a matter of artwork mostly
[09:45] <LaserJock> what is it that you want to change?
[09:46] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:No I don't wanto to change..I'd like only tu use all the ubuntus
[09:46] <LaserJock> you are
[09:46] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:what?
[09:47] <LaserJock> it's just that Ubuntu and Edubuntu are a little mixed together, they aren't completely independent in a sense
[09:47] <cberl1> stgraber: Okay, I've posted a filtered version to http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4464/ (without the client kernel messages mixed in)
[09:47] <cberl1> stgraber: if you want the full thing, with what's going on with the clients as well, I'll repost
[09:48] <cberl1> stgraber: Basically, I got a call at about 9:15am telling me the server was down.  I arrived at 10am and tried to diagnose -- server was non-responsive so I rebooted it.
[09:50] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:ok but I have the same problem too.Now I will remove edubuntu-desktop...so I will have ubuntu-kubuntu an xubuntu,like before...but when I enter in ubuntu,after the login appear a window!an I can't work!it says that I have to save this file...I saved it but i can't work,becauste this windows appear,and appear and appear lots of times...this is the message-> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4461/ can you help me?
[09:52] <cberl1> stgraber: One thing I think I filtered out was nbdswap activating -- which is something odd, because I have that disabled in my lts.conf (I'll post to same link)
[09:52] <stgraber> cberl1: It's weird, you don't really have any useful information in your syslog ...
[09:53] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: ok, try moving aside your Gnome config. mv ~/.gnome2 ~/.gnome2_bak and relogin
[09:53] <stgraber> it's like if your server just had a power cut and was rebooted one hour after ...
[09:53] <stgraber> no module error of any kind before the reboot ...
[09:53] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:can you send to me the termila's command please?
[09:54] <cberl1> stgraber: I'll post the whole thing for that timeframe -- my feeling is it may be linked to the nbdswap...
[09:55] <cberl1> Try this:  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4465/
[09:55] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: mv ~/.gnome2 ~/.gnome2_bak
[09:57] <swimmerino88> LaserJock: ok i did it...now i will relogin
[09:59] <stgraber> cberl1: It's possible but the boot of this .0.240 station isn't different from any other
[09:59] <stgraber> and we don't have any error message ...
[10:01] <cberl1> stgraber: True, but according to my lts.conf, no client should even be using nbdswap...
[10:01] <cberl1> Unless I have the syntax for that wrong?
[10:01] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:nothing it doesn't work
[10:02] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: what happens if you reinstall edubuntu-desktop?
[10:02] <swimmerino88> LaserJock: at the moment I remove edubuntu
[10:03] <stgraber> cberl1: I can't find an up to date list of lts.conf parameters ...
[10:03] <LaserJock> why? I mean it might have taken some things with it that caused the problem
[10:03] <LaserJock> or did the problem already exist before you removed edubuntu-desktop?
[10:03] <stgraber> I know that I had some problem with parameters that exists in LTSP and not in Edubuntu
[10:03] <cberl1> stgraber: Okay, I'll do some digging here.
[10:03] <stgraber> but the latest list I can find is breezy's one :)
[10:04] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:what do you want?that i reinstall it?
[10:04] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: can you try reinstalling edubuntu-desktop
[10:04] <cberl1> stgraber: Somehow I think that one may be a bit dated...
[10:05] <swimmerino88>  LaserJock:and what do i have to do with ubuntu-desktop?
[10:07] <swimmerino88>  LaserJock:ok this is installed and now?with ubuntu desktop???
[10:08] <LaserJock> don't do anything to ubuntu-desktop
[10:08] <LaserJock> just see if you can log in
[10:09] <swimmerino88> ok i will relogin now
[10:09] <cberl1> stgraber: What would this do:  if [ -n "$NBD_SWAP" ] ;then  (found in /etc/init.d/ltsp-client-setup)
[10:12] <stgraber> if $NBD_SWAP is defined do ...
[10:12] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:It works but without panels only the desktop
[10:13] <cberl1> Yay!  I think I found a bug!  :)
[10:13] <cberl1> if NBD_SWAP is defined (true or false) it enables it!
[10:13] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:it says tu me that there is a pannel working already
[10:13] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: weird, what version of Ubuntu is this?
[10:13] <swimmerino88> swimmerino88:edgy
[10:13] <stgraber> cberl1: can you paste the content of that script ?
[10:14] <stgraber> cberl1: I don't have edubuntu installed at home for the moment
[10:14] <cberl1> stgraber: Sure.  Just one moment...
[10:15] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: ah, ok, in a termianl type killall gnome-panel
[10:16] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:ok now you think that it will work?
[10:17] <LaserJock> it *should*
[10:19] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:and if we do a thing?the file that i saved is called gnome-pannel bug...is there a file in the system called with this name?if is yes...can you copy to me it?and then I will copy it?
[10:20] <cberl1> stgraber: Sorry for the delay.  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4470/
[10:20] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: that was a bug repot
[10:20] <LaserJock> report
[10:22] <swimmerino88> ok
[10:22] <swimmerino88> i will relogin
[10:23] <stgraber> cberl1: it will only be loaded if $NBD_SWAP is defined, I don't see the problem (except some formating mistakes)
[10:25] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:nothing it doesn't work!:(
[10:25] <LaserJock> you can't log in?
[10:25] <LaserJock> or still no panels?
[10:26] <cberl1> stgraber: That is the problem.  :)  I've got it defined as "False", so it gets set as "on"; defining it makes it true.
[10:26] <cberl1> stgraber: Which is fine, I'll edit my lts.conf to take it out.  If I still get panic, then I've narrowed a problem source, at least.
[10:27] <stgraber> in the worst case you can still do : NBD_SWAP="" just before the if
[10:27] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:i can login,but when te desktop appears there is the windows for the bug reports
[10:27] <stgraber> but that's not a good way to do :)
[10:28] <cberl1> stgraber: True, but I think undefining it for now is fine.  I'm going to test for a while and see if that's it.  I'll post a new syslog if I keep getting kernel panic errors.  Strange that it doesn't put any info in the log, though.
[10:28] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: have you tried rebooting?
[10:29] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:yes!!!
[10:29] <LaserJock> swimmerino88: weird, you can try making another user and logging in as them to see if it's a config problem
[10:30] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:I'm thinking to remove ubuntu-dektop
[10:30] <LaserJock> that won't fix it I don't think
[10:31] <LaserJock> ubuntu-desktop and edubuntu-desktop are almost the same
[10:31] <swimmerino88> LaserJock:yes!for it i want to remove one
[10:31] <cberl1> Well, thanks.  I'll check back in if problems recur.