[08:05] <nysosym> good mornign :D
[08:06] <darkmatter> hi nysosym
[08:08] <darkmatter> nysosym, jimmac updated the industrial cursors http://jimmac.musichall.cz/themes.php?skin=7
[08:08] <nysosym> hi darkmatter, how are u? :D
[08:08] <darkmatter> they look awesome on my gnome
[08:08] <darkmatter> :)
[08:08] <darkmatter> I'm ok... sick.. but alive enough to work on my themme ;)
[08:08] <nysosym> wow clean and stylish, try it out :D
[08:08] <darkmatter> *theme
[08:09] <darkmatter> nysosym, http://jimmac.musichall.cz/weblog.php/Artwork/TangoBlender.php <--- thats slick too
[08:11] <nysosym> yes, very very good :D
[08:11] <nysosym> thx for info ;
[08:11] <nysosym> ;)
[08:12] <darkmatter> I'm going to fetch the latest devbuild sources later :D
[08:23] <darkmatter> nysosym, my theme has a new overall color... it looks quite nice (though I need to soften the gradient on the tool/menu png
[02:55] <lizardking> hi
[03:03] <lizardking> I made a logo for OranSun theme
[05:04] <troy_s> lizardking: Where is it?
[05:06] <lizardking> troy_s: It is not so much
[05:07] <lizardking> troy_s: http://www.flickr.com/photos/iac_lizardking/382710211/
[05:09] <troy_s> I think the ubuntu font has a lot to be desired...
[05:09] <troy_s> Use modata, it is far more stylish and the character spacings are far superior.
[05:09] <troy_s> The ubuntu font is awkward for a number of reasons, not the least being spacing issues, tail heights, drops, etc.
[05:12] <lizardking> troy_s: modata? where i find it?
[05:17] <lizardking> troy_s: look at this, friend. https://answers.launchpad.net/oransoda-look/+ticket/3553
[05:42] <troy_s> lizardking: look in fonts
[05:42] <troy_s> i can't remember the full title
[05:49] <troy_s> lizardking: MgOpen Modata is the offical name.
[06:02] <lizardking> troy_s:  thanks friend!sudo aptitude install ttf-mgopen
[06:02] <troy_s> lizardking: you should have it already -- I think it is in the default install.
[06:02] <troy_s> lizardking: it is a far superior font.  it _should_ be the bloody ubuntu title, but instead they choose to use that kludgy looking monster.
[06:03] <lizardking> troy_s: eheheh
[06:04] <troy_s> lizardking: Typeset masters are rare.  It truly is a craft like everything else.
[06:08] <troy_s> PingunZ: How's things friend?
[06:13] <PingunZ> troy_s, fine .. but I've got to eat now :)
[06:13] <PingunZ> later
[06:19] <alefteris> hi kwwii :) did you merged my branch on feisty-gdm-themes?
[06:20] <kwwii> alefteris: nope, I think dholbach will do that
[06:20] <alefteris> ok :)
[06:20] <kwwii> I'm asking him now
[06:21] <alefteris> also, is the artwork team involved with the redesign of the ubuntu website?
[06:22] <kwwii> yes, it should be
[06:24] <kwwii> your gdm changes will be merged soon ;-)
[06:25] <alefteris> thanks
[06:25] <alefteris> so there are people working on the website artwork it right now?
[06:46] <kwwii> not that I know of
[06:46] <kwwii> I do know that any changes need to be agreed upon by those above
[06:47] <kwwii> ok, I gotta go
[06:56] <PingunZ|fooood> alefteris, where can I see your gdm changes ?
[06:57] <alefteris> PingunZ, https://code.launchpad.net/~alefteris/+branch/feisty-gdm-themes/fix.bug70829
[06:58] <alefteris> its just a simple replacement of Bitstream Vera with the alias Sans
[07:02] <PingunZ> oh
[07:09] <PingunZ> hi darkmatter :)
[07:09] <darkmatter> hi PingunZ
[07:09] <PingunZ> darkmatter, wohoo
[07:10] <PingunZ> darkmatter, screenies ?
[07:10] <darkmatter> wanna _teaser_ hehe?
[07:10] <PingunZ> yeah
[07:12] <darkmatter> http://img506.imageshack.us/my.php?image=teasereh2.png
[07:12] <darkmatter> *hides*
[07:13] <darkmatter> :P
[07:13] <TheSheep> doesn't look too impressisve >_<
[07:13] <darkmatter> haha
[07:14] <TheSheep> darkmatter: next time post a vertical gradient :)
[07:14] <alefteris> i like it :)
[07:14] <darkmatter> thats why its a teaser... like I'd actually show an unscaled/uncropped screenie :P
[07:14] <darkmatter> TheSheep, lol
[07:16] <darkmatter> alefteris, the current alpha preview build is #f4f4f4 for the bg and the overall color in the base pixmaps. I thought a nice honey-ish color would look better :)
[07:18] <darkmatter> PingunZ, I started work on an actual panel (no screenies though, trying to balance the pixmaps first)
[07:18] <darkmatter> it looks "buttonless"
[07:19] <darkmatter> but not in the typical manner
[07:19] <PingunZ> darkmatter, ok
[07:19] <PingunZ> darkmatter, you what I'm going to ask ;)
[07:19] <darkmatter> lol
[07:20] <alefteris> darkmatter, are you talking about the website redesign? what is Glory exactly?
[07:21] <PingunZ> Meet, morningglory gtk theme
[07:21] <darkmatter> PingunZ, the "buttons" are basically arrows next to the list title.... kinda... only the active task has a more button like feel... now if I can just figure out how to have the pathbar use different buttons than the toolbar
[07:21] <PingunZ> pixmap engine .. best theme ever
[07:21] <PingunZ> alefteris, http://pingunz.googlepages.com/morningglory.jpeg
[07:21] <PingunZ> alefteris, that's a mod of darkmatter's morningglory
[07:22] <darkmatter> alefteris, MorningGloey is a 'live mockup' (theme)... to prototype the widget design for the engine for the Glory project
[07:22] <darkmatter> *MorningGlory
[07:22] <PingunZ> alefteris, http://www.gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=52050
[07:22] <alefteris> like oasis?
[07:24] <alefteris> it looks so flat :P
[07:24] <PingunZ> it's clean
[07:25] <darkmatter> hmmm.... not really... as a whole... the project is a desktop extension... the theme engine will actually be dynamic
[07:26] <darkmatter> and yeah... its a wee flat atm... but its going to be staying clean.. just a little snazzier
[07:26] <darkmatter> but no glassy crap... ;)
[07:27] <darkmatter> PingunZ, you seen jimmacs redo of the industrial cursors yet?
[07:28] <alefteris> talking about those? http://jimmac.musichall.cz/weblog.php/Artwork/SizeMatters
[07:29] <darkmatter> yup
[07:30] <darkmatter> nicely done too
[07:30] <darkmatter> I'm currently using the black as default on my sys (gdm too)
[07:35] <PingunZ> darkmatter, shush .. I'm reading :)
[07:35] <darkmatter> :P
[07:35] <darkmatter> reasing shmeading
[09:07] <troy_s> alefteris: it is too hard to develop for the website when there is still no guiding design principle.
[09:07] <troy_s> further, redoing it is a complete waste of time until such a plan is in place.
[09:08] <TheSheep> troy_s: have you seen the documents about redoing gnome.org?
[09:09] <troy_s> No... not yet.
[09:09] <troy_s> ?
[09:09] <TheSheep> troy_s: want a link? :)
[09:09] <TheSheep> it's the first time I've seen such an operation
[09:10] <troy_s> Sure
[09:10] <troy_s> Love to see it.
[09:12] <TheSheep> looking for it :/
[09:17] <troy_s> damn you
[09:17] <TheSheep> the live.gnome.org seems down :(
[09:19] <troy_s> Its chuggy as hell... I just pulled a page or two from it a few moments ago
[09:21] <TheSheep> still lodading for me >_<
[09:21] <TheSheep> troy_s: well, the docs are there :)
[09:21] <troy_s> Its coming slowly
[09:21] <troy_s> VERY slowly
[09:27] <troy_s> gnome live is REALLY chuggin
[09:27] <troy_s> TheSheep: Have you looked at some of the Topaz work?
[09:28] <troy_s> It is quite interesting, but again a million different things ... no 'top' level view other than the rather astute mock by jdub (Jeff Waugh)
[09:30] <TheSheep> it's mostly technology showoff, right?
[09:34] <troy_s> No
[09:34] <troy_s> actually
[09:34] <troy_s> It is actually very much like the thinking we were discussing
[09:34] <troy_s> Waugh's idea of 'egoless' computing is interesting -- very much akin to what I believe for interface design --
[09:35] <troy_s> get rid of the connotations of applications and sixteen thousand icons
[09:35] <troy_s> and simplify it down to something like 'Read Email"
[09:35] <troy_s> etc.
[09:40] <TheSheep> Rasking wanted to get rid of applications entirely
[09:40] <TheSheep> but what would you "sell" then? ;)
[09:40] <TheSheep> Raskin
[09:40] <troy_s> Well it is rather ironic that the application layer is almost heading back to the very early command line days...
[09:40] <troy_s> the functionality is what is important
[09:40] <troy_s> the branding is completely irrelevant.
[09:41] <troy_s> Click on a piece of mail, your viewer initiates
[09:41] <TheSheep> it's needed in the middle, for the transition
[09:41] <troy_s> Click on an email address, your sender initiates
[09:41] <TheSheep> like how you need imaginary numbers to solve some equations
[09:41] <troy_s> Click on a doc, your editor intitiates.
[09:42] <kwwii> hi all
[09:42] <kwwii> howdy troy_s
[09:42] <kwwii> so....things are a-changing
[09:43] <kwwii> I do not have to run everything by mark before submitting...the only requirement is that once I submit something I have to keep working down that same path, not change things again and again in totally different directions
[09:45] <troy_s> Lol
[09:45] <troy_s> Wow... that's a helluva big step
[09:45] <troy_s> That's great news really.
[09:46] <troy_s> If a solid plan of attack can be devised.
[09:46] <kwwii> yepp
[09:47] <kwwii> there is little time left for feisty, but it is a step in the right direction
[09:47] <troy_s> Feisty was an abortion to start with.
[09:47] <troy_s> I don't think it is an issue.
[09:47] <kwwii> if we can get this out the door and prove that we can get things done, then we can certainly use the time after feisty for more ambitious plans
[09:49] <troy_s> kwwii:  I think the problem is that moving to a 'top down' approach is going to require a little bit of planning as well as some solid process (which we can really push forward this term)
[09:49] <kwwii> very true
[09:49] <troy_s> Namely getting the knowledge of bzr in place and that nightmare process of figure out how we are going to make packages buildable
[09:50] <troy_s> The rest is easy
[09:50] <kwwii> yepp
[09:50] <troy_s> Relatively speaking of course...
[09:50] <kwwii> lol
[09:50] <kwwii> yeah
[09:50] <kwwii> the thing is that we cannot do anything really radically new since there is little time left
[09:50] <troy_s> I still hold fast to the notion that as a design club, we need to identify the basic two components before we even consider the work.
[09:50] <troy_s> Radical I don't think is really required.
[09:51] <kwwii> I would really like to prove that we can get a solid theme done before the beta
[09:51] <troy_s> Just some good solid foundation pouring... carry on from where Edgy left off...
[09:51] <troy_s> Hell we have people using Bzr now, etc.
[09:51] <kwwii> exactly, my idea as well
[09:51] <troy_s> THAT alone was a huge step
[09:51] <troy_s> And remember
[09:51] <troy_s> @ paris we had exactly 17 people on the art team
[09:51] <troy_s> have a look now
[09:51] <troy_s> lol
[09:52] <troy_s> The bigger picture will require some thinking though -- as to the extent of the design
[09:52] <troy_s> Is it website?
[09:52] <troy_s> Packaging?
[09:52] <troy_s> Etc?
[09:52] <troy_s> If not, the design would be a little different
[09:52] <troy_s> kwwii what are your thoughts on 'theme
[09:53] <troy_s> ubuntu version 1.0 has the icons locked (plus or minus dave twiddles if paid for)
[09:53] <troy_s> clearlooks window look
[09:53] <troy_s> etc.
[09:53] <troy_s> kwwii what were you thinking of for targets for the theme?
[09:54] <kwwii> sorry, had to make a drink
[09:54] <troy_s> yah my coffee is fricking cold.
[09:55] <kwwii> I think that for now the scope of this work should stick to the OS themeing
[09:55] <troy_s> kwwii -- how come the oxygen folder icon changed from the more elegant one earlier?
[09:55] <kwwii> we can slowly spread our wings once we prove we can fly
[09:55] <troy_s> kwwii -- the os themeing though is rather difficult to touch.
[09:55] <troy_s> as we are hitch pinned by the gdm
[09:55] <troy_s> etc.
[09:56] <kwwii> well, we have changed that soo many times, and mainly we change it to satisfy other peoples wishes
[09:56] <kwwii> I would leave the GDM almost as-is
[09:56] <troy_s> kwwii -- the gdm hasn't changed since inception
[09:56] <troy_s> lol
[09:56] <troy_s> I don't mind leaving everything
[09:56] <troy_s> in fact, get rid of the wallpaper and make it a grad.
[09:56] <troy_s> hell... that is banal enough to appease even the most opinionated.
[09:56] <troy_s> lol
[09:57] <kwwii> here was what I was going to change: the usplash-improve on the progress bar, logo work; gdm-logo work; desktop splash-make it fit the desktop; desktop wallpaper
[09:57] <troy_s> oh shit that reminds me
[09:57] <troy_s> is there an issue with amd64 usplash?
[09:57] <kwwii> there should be since the pics included are 256 colors
[09:57] <troy_s> as the greyscale is stuck
[09:57] <kwwii> but nobody has complained
[09:57] <troy_s> Lord.
[09:57] <troy_s> You are kidding?
[09:57] <kwwii> nope
[09:57] <kwwii> no shit
[09:57] <troy_s> Goes to show you how much people really care.
[09:58] <kwwii> lol, yeah
[09:58] <troy_s> I really think that Who did a fantastic job on the logo
[09:58] <kwwii> do you think we should set up a meeting to talk about this
[09:58] <troy_s> aside from the fact that i still disagree with the rather minor issue regarding that gloss curve.
[09:58] <kwwii> I do not want to change the logo, just moce it forward
[09:58] <kwwii> move
[09:59] <kwwii> I redrew it in inkscape and played around with making it simpler, etc.
[09:59] <troy_s> possibly, but that would limit who can participate, and that seems to have problems
[09:59] <troy_s> Yes
[09:59] <kwwii> so, you do or do not like the curve?
[09:59] <troy_s> who's svg work is nightmarish :)
[09:59] <troy_s> I loved Who's logo since he presented it in brainstorming
[09:59] <kwwii> you should see nuno's, it is the same stuff
[09:59] <troy_s> my only thought was that to
[09:59] <troy_s> effectively _really_ integrate with the rest of the 'anchors' the curve should probably span across the entire logo
[10:00] <troy_s> as opposed to that rather "graceful curve to inelegant transfer curve to linear to curve"
[10:00] <troy_s> more like the  default curve on all the icons.
[10:00] <troy_s> So that there is a feeling of 'oneness' with the rest of the system... but I was shot down by the Ubuntu deathstar as frank would say.
[10:00] <kwwii> lol
[10:01] <troy_s> If you look at the folder, the warnings, etc... they all share the same curvature.
[10:01] <kwwii> true
[10:01] <troy_s> lower left to upper right...
[10:01] <kwwii> acutally that is a good idea
[10:01] <troy_s> at NO point in the entire system
[10:01] <troy_s> does the curve head twisty or straight.
[10:01] <kwwii> I played around with the text part more than the circular device
[10:01] <troy_s> (like osx)
[10:01] <troy_s> also, kwwii -- the weighting that jane posted regarding the 'grids'
[10:02] <troy_s> is a little skewed
[10:02] <troy_s> Do you remember that email?
[10:02] <kwwii> yeah, that is true as well
[10:02] <kwwii> it seems to me that the logos were made for one purpose, and now they want to use them for everything
[10:02] <kwwii> not a very proffesional branding, if you ask me
[10:02] <troy_s> Have you been plucking around with the weighting of the units?
[10:02] <troy_s> Meaning
[10:02] <troy_s> the weight of the logo (for centering etc)
[10:02] <troy_s> and the weight of the text?
[10:03] <troy_s> they seem to place the text slightly lower than the mid span of the logo
[10:03] <troy_s> which is odd...
[10:03] <kwwii> actually, all I played around with was using the same curve, basically, and using different gloss idea
[10:03] <kwwii> s
[10:03] <kwwii> one second, I'll find a link
[10:03] <troy_s> and on a minor note, the side ball on the log seems to be included in the 'weight' of the centering
[10:03] <kwwii> http://sincecera.de/UbuntuLogo3c.png
[10:04] <troy_s> which is also not quite right-- the side ball on the logo doesn't affect the gravity of the logo, hence the center of gravity remains in the centre of the circle... not the linear divide of the size
[10:04] <troy_s> looking
[10:04] <troy_s> dns lookup failure
[10:04] <troy_s> no sincecera.de
[10:04] <kwwii> oops
[10:04] <kwwii> sinecera.de/UbuntuLogo3c.png
[10:04] <troy_s> lol
[10:05] <troy_s> works
[10:05] <troy_s> hold.
[10:05] <kwwii> nothing remarkable there, I think
[10:05] <troy_s> u using imagemagick for montaging?
[10:05] <kwwii> nope, that is one big inkscape file
[10:05] <troy_s> fecking slow pull for me.
[10:05] <troy_s> lord
[10:05] <troy_s> lol
[10:05] <troy_s> well you did the one adjustment that i suggested
[10:05] <troy_s> on the gloss curve
[10:06] <troy_s> either A) make the curve an art nouveau style swoop
[10:06] <troy_s> or b) make it a singular curve as per the icons
[10:06] <troy_s> you did (a) and it is immediately more polished looking.
[10:06] <kwwii> actually a curve going up might work very well
[10:06] <kwwii> I like the 3rd column, bottom best
[10:06] <troy_s> i don't have the whole thing yet
[10:07] <troy_s> my thought was that the n curve most closely matches the icons
[10:07] <troy_s> your 2nd version top row shows that nouveay style curvature...
[10:07] <troy_s> nouveau
[10:07] <kwwii> although the ones with the curve at the bottom look kinda like a planet is rising in the background (thought that might appeal to sabdfl)
[10:08] <darkmatter> kwwii, the logo's looking good
[10:08] <kwwii> the one point that sabdfl made was that many of them seem too blocky to fit with the circular device
[10:08] <kwwii> it is very hard to get the same 3d effect on the circular device as on the black text
[10:08] <kwwii> darkmatter: thanks :-)
[10:09] <troy_s> well ignore sabdfl
[10:09] <troy_s> he really is clueless
[10:09] <kwwii> oh, I think he is going to let me go and see what I come up with
[10:09] <troy_s> and all you will do is redo the mistake i did - end up compromising to the point of really defeating the purpose.
[10:09] <troy_s> good.
[10:09] <kwwii> and after he said my biggest fault in edgy kubuntu was not building the community enough I think it would be funny as shit if we did feisty as a community ;-)
[10:09] <darkmatter> third from left... those are petty sharp looking
[10:10] <troy_s> kwwii building a community has a bunch of issues...
[10:10] <troy_s> you need to give and take
[10:10] <kwwii> darkmatter: yeah, sabdfl and I both liked those better
[10:10] <troy_s> as he did with savages work on the sound
[10:10] <kwwii> troy_s: you don't have to tell me that ;-)
[10:10] <troy_s> but the problem is that he is SOoo fucking destination oriented that he doesn't understand the value of accepting minor blobs along the way
[10:10] <darkmatter> lol
[10:10] <troy_s> just keep looking to the bigger picture
[10:11] <troy_s> as opposed to frantically pounding away on the minor details of an icon stroke
[10:11] <kwwii> somehow I think that the email I sent (the long one, responding to the community comment) somehow got through
[10:11] <nysosym> hi there
[10:11] <kwwii> howdy nysosym
[10:11] <troy_s> the community element means also trusting that perhaps, possibly, just maybe
[10:11] <darkmatter> hi nysosym
[10:11] <troy_s> that there are people out there with enough intelligence and capability
[10:12] <troy_s> to drive things through
[10:12] <troy_s> just POSSIBLY
[10:12] <troy_s> for me from those samples
[10:12] <troy_s> the standout is the 3rd column 2nd from bottom i think
[10:12] <kwwii> cool, so everyone agrees on the 3rd row
[10:12] <troy_s> although 2nd column
[10:12] <kwwii> that is good
[10:12] <nysosym> what's up? :D
[10:12] <kwwii> erm
[10:12] <troy_s> top is probably even better in some way
[10:13] <troy_s> the underlight is a nice twist
[10:13] <troy_s> although i do like the refinement you did on the curve...
[10:13] <kwwii> has who been around lately?
[10:13] <troy_s> it is an apparently minor detail, but that logo needs to coexist against the icons and such...
[10:13] <kwwii> yeah, true
[10:14] <kwwii> or did he run for the hills?
[10:14] <troy_s> and dropping the osx reflection attempt is also wise
[10:14] <troy_s> it is just too sterotypical and cliched at this point.
[10:14] <troy_s> who is studying engineering at cambridge
[10:14] <kwwii> I think that something like that fits better to the circular device's 3d-ness
[10:14] <troy_s> lol
[10:14] <kwwii> so I'll have to fly to england and pin him down :p
[10:15] <troy_s> sorry and i meant 2nd column 2nd row
[10:15] <troy_s> you should use montage so you can label the bloody things you stinker
[10:15] <kwwii> good point
[10:15] <troy_s> montage -monitor -frame 1 -label %f *.png graphic_study.jpg
[10:15] <troy_s> ;)
[10:16] <troy_s> imagemagick rocks.
[10:16] <kwwii> thanks for the command, I'd have taken a few minutes to get that right
[10:16] <nysosym> what is the topic here? :D
[10:16] <troy_s> hrm... that third column is interesting with the inverted grad... it is rather echoing of an eclipse
[10:17] <kwwii> nysosym: we are talking about artwork for feisty
[10:17] <troy_s> I would say keep pushing with that 3rd column 2nd from bottom direction.
[10:17] <nysosym> kwwii, nice, any previews?
[10:17] <troy_s> or 3rd column bottom too
[10:17] <troy_s> as that again fixes the bloody curve issue
[10:18] <darkmatter> Trae, yup... I agree... thats the best looking imho
[10:18] <kwwii> the 3rd column bottom was sabdfl favotire
[10:18] <kwwii> nysosym: http://sinecera.de/UbuntuLogo3c.png
[10:18] <troy_s> kwwii: I would probably nerf the whiting on the red too -- it is pulling it heavy into pink
[10:18] <kwwii> troy_s: yeah, good point
[10:18] <troy_s> who has a wonderful bit of colour work in the original in that regard.  an elegant mixing of lighter hues without heading into value
[10:19] <kwwii> troy_s: I made a simpler version of the logo too, it appealed to me well...I'll have to find it and post something tomorrow
[10:19] <troy_s> So assuming running with that
[10:19] <kwwii> man, he does stuff that is sooo complicated
[10:19] <troy_s> kwwii yes --
[10:19] <darkmatter> the dark in the middle of the bottom one looks to glossy
[10:19] <troy_s> far easier paths to get to the destination
[10:19] <darkmatter> in column 3
[10:19] <troy_s> but he 'sketches' in inkscape
[10:19] <troy_s> hence the problems
[10:19] <troy_s> i sketch on paper, scan and pull splines
[10:20] <troy_s> means less complexity in the source
[10:20] <kwwii> yeah
[10:20] <kwwii> I sketch in inkscape too
[10:20] <nysosym> kwwii, thx, i think the logo on the right sight bottom is the best :)
[10:20] <kwwii> and afterwards I figure out what I did and redraw the whole thing
[10:20] <troy_s> kwwii so GDM is the same (although i would suggest trying to sneak that rounded svg in for a base instead of the rectangle under the logon)
[10:21] <troy_s> kwwii yeah i did that in rough (about 20 mins) and sab got all 'this is diff that is diff etc'
[10:21] <troy_s> so i gave up
[10:21] <troy_s> i was trying to get towards a clean code version
[10:21] <kwwii> troy_s: I'll add an svg in gdm if I can figure out how without too much work
[10:21] <troy_s> So lets assume final logo gets into usplash, gdm
[10:21] <kwwii> those xml files are nasty
[10:21] <troy_s> kwwii it is one line
[10:21] <troy_s> actually, they are VERY shitty code
[10:22] <troy_s> i had them totally cleaned up
[10:22] <troy_s> there are worthless lines in there too
[10:22] <kwwii> I haven't really looked into the gdm xml yet
[10:22] <troy_s> it prevents people from fixing the bugs
[10:22] <troy_s> its deadly simple... one line
[10:22] <kwwii> but I know the kubuntu version is nasty
[10:22] <kwwii> that is why I gave it up last time
[10:22] <kwwii> I wanted to round the entry box
[10:22] <troy_s> i think i have it somewhere...
[10:22] <troy_s> yep
[10:22] <troy_s> tried that
[10:22] <troy_s> lol
[10:23] <troy_s> it just fits better with the roundings on the other elements.
[10:23] <troy_s> hell, look at the logo
[10:23] <kwwii> and as far as the wallpaper goes, until now I have been going in the same direction as edgy, only softer
[10:23] <troy_s> well unless sab is going to sign off on it
[10:23] <troy_s> now
[10:23] <kwwii> sure, rounded boxes are a must with the rounded font
[10:23] <troy_s> you are doomed
[10:23] <troy_s> just put a bloody grad in
[10:23] <troy_s> even then, he will bikeshed
[10:23] <kwwii> lol
[10:24] <troy_s> Make the whole fecking desktop middle 18% grey
[10:24] <darkmatter> lol
[10:24] <troy_s> That would communicate perfect design.
[10:24] <kwwii> http://sinecera.de/drawing1.png is kinda the same as edgy but different
[10:24] <troy_s> We could call it iKea
[10:24] <troy_s> although i must say, ikea's design of late is very solid.
[10:24] <kwwii> hehe
[10:25] <troy_s> at least they are using organics :)
[10:25] <troy_s> is this the middle ripple?
[10:25] <troy_s> you might as well be shouting beep and boop at me to type to 0s and 1s
[10:25] <troy_s> its SLOOOOOW
[10:25] <kwwii> hrm, it is fast here
[10:25] <kwwii> funny
[10:25] <troy_s> TCP == Tin Can Protocol
[10:25] <kwwii> ;-)
[10:26] <darkmatter> just dont call Glory iKea (if I can manage to get enough done to pull a screenie today)... or ya get a big fat aero on your desktop ;)
[10:26] <kwwii> darkmatter: ;-)
[10:26] <troy_s> the great irony of the edgy cycle was the wall he chose in the end.
[10:26] <troy_s> brutal.
[10:27] <kwwii> yeah, I kinda thought anything I make would be at least as good as that
[10:27] <troy_s> darkmatter: I am of the lineage that solid design and artwork makes a clear and present statement.
[10:27] <darkmatter> troy, aye... I liked the aqua-ish one better
[10:27] <darkmatter> it actual fit with the overall "human" look
[10:27] <troy_s> darkmatter: If you can look back at a design and say "wow that looks dated" you really did your job -- as it means you clearly identified the contemporary stylings and integrated them.
[10:28] <darkmatter> yup
[10:28] <troy_s> kwwii:  There were probably 10 independent desktop walls that were at least as good as that or better.
[10:28] <troy_s> he just didn't follow the dev
[10:28] <kwwii> I can imagine
[10:28] <troy_s> he decided to sit down at the last possible minute and try to steer things
[10:28] <troy_s> like a fool.
[10:28] <nysosym> damn so many interesting topics here, and i must go to bed in the next half hour... :-(
[10:28] <troy_s> as opposed to paying close attention to the checkpoints along the way.
[10:29] <troy_s> kwwii: It stalled out for me, but that was the one I saw earlier I think...
[10:29] <troy_s> kwwii:  Well suited for that GDM... in fact, just go with the grads.
[10:29] <troy_s> lol
[10:29] <darkmatter> troy_s, its amazing how much inspiration a cursor set can be... bashing out elements atm. I think this ones going to actually hit "beta" status
[10:29] <troy_s> "Ubuntu -- Welcome to the Barren Desert"
[10:30] <troy_s> "Ubuntu -- The Look of 'Meh'"
[10:30] <troy_s> lol
[10:30] <troy_s> We could design marketing phrases.
[10:30] <troy_s> On a serious note, I think that is 1000000 times better than the one he chose for Edgy kwwii
[10:30] <troy_s> (the one you just posted)
[10:30] <darkmatter> pale honey-ish and blackish/chocolaty bits for contrast.
[10:31] <troy_s> kwwii -- is that curve centre punched?
[10:31] <kwwii> troy_s:  hehe, that is not hard
[10:31] <troy_s> My only thought might be to slide to into Phi.
[10:31] <kwwii> troy_s: not sure I know what you mean by centre punched
[10:31] <troy_s> Just to give it a TEENY amount of life
[10:31] <troy_s> Is it symmetrical?
[10:32] <kwwii> horizonatlly yes, vertically no
[10:32] <troy_s> It actually gets a lot of mileage out of the grads.
[10:32] <troy_s> Try dumping the centre of gravity on vertical and horizontal phi just for a test...
[10:33] <troy_s> as in
[10:33] <troy_s> use yer eyeball to figure out roughly where its centre of gravity is, and plop it on 61.8%
[10:33] <troy_s> see if magic hapens
[10:33] <troy_s> happens
[10:33] <troy_s> It looks close to phi vertically
[10:33] <troy_s> try it on phi horizontal as well.
[10:34] <alefteris> i like the colors iand the grads n the wallpaper but i thing the bright figure stands out to much...
[10:34] <kwwii> troy_s: good idea
[10:34] <kwwii> alefteris: bright figure? you mean the middle pinkish part?
[10:34] <alefteris> yeas
[10:35] <troy_s> kwwii:  See... LOL
[10:35] <troy_s> it never fails.
[10:35] <kwwii> I think that troy_s is right about moving the gradient a bit
[10:35] <kwwii> hehe, yeah
[10:35] <troy_s> not so much the grad
[10:35] <troy_s> the curve white swoop
[10:36] <troy_s> the brightest part is almost spot on phi
[10:36] <kwwii> ahhh, now I get you
[10:36] <troy_s> just take the centre of gravity of it (roughly now seems like it is in the middle of the horizontal) and slide it probably right(?) to 61.8
[10:36] <troy_s> good old davinci
[10:36] <kwwii> basically that pic is several huge circles (some with gaussian blur) on top of a simple gradient
[10:37] <troy_s> kwwii on the whole, i think it is probably top notch
[10:37] <troy_s> kwwii yeah it has some very interesting grads working for it.
[10:37] <nysosym> i think the "wave" in the middle should have more contrast, like a fold in cloth
[10:37] <troy_s> ideally you should ship the svg with the package
[10:37] <nysosym> with the light from bottom right
[10:37] <kwwii> I intend to ship all svgs with this stuff
[10:37] <troy_s> because sab is in the dark on svg... he seems to think that the render is different on different platforms ... lol.
[10:37] <kwwii> it took me hours to find things from edgy
[10:37] <troy_s> kwwii I will say that if you SVG gdm, and it gets complicated, the logon time increases, which is unfortunate.
[10:38] <troy_s> kwwii -- yep  -- if we can put the shit into the source files on bzr we are winning
[10:38] <troy_s> by we i mean YOU  lol.
[10:38] <troy_s> as you are the only authorized packager.
[10:38] <kwwii> oh, I think we will still use the png files, but having an svg for reference, future work, etc. is important
[10:38] <troy_s> exactly
[10:38] <kwwii> lol, I am going to make dholbach package all this
[10:38] <troy_s> but what i was suggesting
[10:38] <troy_s> was that you actually INCLUDE the svg
[10:38] <nysosym> hi andreasn
[10:38] <troy_s> in the distribution
[10:38] <troy_s> because if you have a massive high res monitor
[10:39] <troy_s> you at least have an OPTION
[10:39] <troy_s> (as are a few of the bug complaints)
[10:40] <troy_s> kwwii: That wall is very evocative of a satin sheet eh?
[10:40] <nysosym> yes i have here an 1920x1200 resolution and the default wallpapers look a little bit blurry :-/
[10:40] <troy_s> kwwii: Just noticed it.
[10:40] <troy_s> nysosym: Exactly.
[10:41] <kwwii> troy_s: good point about the resolution
[10:41] <troy_s> kwwii:  Well you kill four or five 'bugs' by doing that.
[10:41] <kwwii> I kinda thought it looks like thighs and the pink in between
[10:41] <kwwii> lol
[10:41] <kwwii> after I made it, that is
[10:42] <nysosym> svgs use much more memory as an png, but a option to render my pngs self would be very nice :)
[10:42] <troy_s> kwwii:  And you provide people with current technology at least ;)
[10:42] <kwwii> since everyone else seems to see porn in everything I make, I've started looking
[10:42] <troy_s> nysosym: Having the svg would give you the option
[10:42] <troy_s> nysosym: technically, they shouldn't use anything
[10:42] <troy_s> nysosym: Because as everywhere in gnome those svg's get rendered then pooped out.
[10:42] <kwwii> people shouldn't know about what they are using
[10:42] <troy_s> Once they are rendered, they are just a raw byte sequence.
[10:43] <nysosym> troy_s, hmm crazy, but when i start gnome a svgs use much more time to load as the same picture in png
[10:43] <troy_s> kwwii:  Now you are _really_ evolving as an artist if you start thinking like that porn statement ;)
[10:43] <troy_s> lol
[10:43] <troy_s> nysosym: Yes... that was what I was saying
[10:43] <kwwii> :D
[10:43] <troy_s> nysosym: The time is the GDM going "Oh its an svg -- let's render it"
[10:43] <troy_s> just like rendering a frame in blender
[10:43] <troy_s> SVG is plaintext xml that is verted to a sequence of pixels.
[10:44] <troy_s> So it _does_ use up cycles when you initially cache them
[10:44] <kwwii> with gaussian blur it takes forever
[10:44] <nysosym> ok :)
[10:44] <troy_s> kwwii Yeah inkscape hasn't optimzed the blur alg yet.
[10:44] <troy_s> kwwii not to mention that there are about 1600303040322 different blur algs to pick from.
[10:44] <kwwii> it took me two hours to render that pic
[10:45] <troy_s> ?!!!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
[10:45] <kwwii> no shit
[10:45] <troy_s> That's just fecked.
[10:45] <kwwii> yepp
[10:45] <nysosym> troy_s, another option is to have pngs in very high resolution for every aspect ratio :D
[10:45] <kwwii> I thought my computer was b0rked
[10:45] <troy_s> Something MUST be wrong there.
[10:45] <troy_s> nysosym: Or just give out one SVG and let it render.
[10:45] <kwwii> well, in the final .45 it works better/quicker
[10:45] <troy_s> kwwii That's bananas.
[10:45] <troy_s> kwwii yeah i was going to say, try a newer checkout.
[10:45] <troy_s> lol
[10:46] <troy_s> i know when they first put blur in it was complete bork
[10:46] <kwwii> turns out, it was a known bug
[10:46] <troy_s> it has been getting better and better.
[10:46] <kwwii> they screwed something up and it was not clipping the unnecesary parts
[10:46] <nysosym> troy_s, sure, good option for skilled peoply, but many users wan't render a new picture
[10:47] <troy_s> nysosym: I meant just let the comp render it... ;)
[10:47] <nysosym> troy_s, did u try xara extreme, i think it hase an awesome blurry alg. :D
[10:47] <kwwii> nysosym: it would render it the first time you login and cache that pic for future use
[10:47] <troy_s> nysosym: The only issue is with the initialize times.
[10:48] <troy_s> kwwii: Reconciling that bloody tan against the Ubuntu default icon orange is something only a braindead zombie can fathom.
[10:48] <kwwii> nysosym: xara is amazing, but it does not save svgs
[10:48] <troy_s> kwwii: Xara rocks... there is an svg plugin but it isn't mature.
[10:48] <troy_s> kwwii: and the fact that the cdraw lib isn't open yet.
[10:48] <kwwii> yeah
[10:48] <kwwii> I finally have an i386 to really run it and test it
[10:48] <troy_s> kwwii: But the more i use inkscape, the more i can say that it is a pretty damn good tool.
[10:48] <kwwii> it seems that they have stopped development for the time being though
[10:48] <nysosym> troy_s, yes, the export in svg doesn't work, its a know bug and will be removed in the next update :)
[10:49] <troy_s> kwwii: Really?
[10:49] <kwwii> once you bang your head against inkscape enough it rocks
[10:49] <kwwii> troy_s: yeah, I read something on the xara webpage
[10:49] <troy_s> kwwii: I am going to show some work done in inskcape done off of a photo soon... it might surprise you.
[10:49] <kwwii> saying something like "we are concentrating on the commercial version for now"
[10:49] <troy_s> *sigh*
[10:49] <nysosym> kwwii, no question, i love inkscape but xara is a lot faster espacially with zoomed pictures
[10:50] <kwwii> heck, xara just renders much faster
[10:50] <troy_s> nysosym: I think largely because it uses an optimized drawing lib.
[10:50] <darkmatter> nice... that hack worked
[10:50] <troy_s> nysosym: Where inkscape doesn't tweak with that to keep development working.
[10:50] <troy_s> if you made a custom rendering lib change every time you made a change, it makes it pretty darn hard to keep coordinated i would think.
[10:51] <kwwii> it would take hours to build and be hell to debug
[10:52] <troy_s> So what else is there?
[10:52] <nysosym> troy_s, sure, btw. which time do u have? :D
[10:52] <troy_s> nysosym: 1:53
[10:52] <troy_s> ;)
[10:52] <nysosym> am or pm?
[10:52] <troy_s> kwwii: Let me track down that gdm line change.
[10:52] <troy_s> nysosym: PM
[10:52] <kwwii> troy_s: killer, thanks man
[10:53] <nysosym> troy_s, nice ^^, i have 11:00 PM :D
[10:53] <troy_s> We really should clean up that fecking code but I'll leave that tweak until there are more people on the packaging team.
[10:53] <troy_s> It is _very_ stinky
[10:53] <kwwii> ;-)
[10:53] <kwwii> that is why I did not want to mess with it unless I know I have time
[10:54] <troy_s> It is very easy to clean
[10:54] <troy_s> but hell... it isn't even well commented.
[10:54] <troy_s> Hrm... Maybe I'll do that tonight and ship you the changes
[10:54] <troy_s> I'll bzr branch it for you and you can have a look at it.
[10:54] <kwwii> troy_s:  that would be great
[10:54] <troy_s> Okie?
[10:54] <troy_s> Try to save you a bit of work.
[10:54] <nysosym> ubuntu should have a little option to manage many timezones in the same time, like hover my clock and some defined clocks rising up :D
[10:55] <troy_s> Ok... must run to pick up my girlie.
[10:55] <nysosym> troy_s, have fun ;)
[10:55] <troy_s> nysosym: That is about a 15 minute python applet friend ;)
[10:55] <darkmatter> nysosym, hacked isolated theming for the slab and its extensions into one of the older Glory builds as a test.... sweetly enough it worked :)
[10:56] <nysosym> troy_s, sure, but there is one problem, i can't write any python code :D
[10:57] <kwwii> see you troy_s
[10:57] <nysosym> yes troy_s have a nice day :)
[10:58] <kwwii> about time for bed here
[10:59] <nysosym> yes here too :D
[10:59] <nysosym> anyone knows a good texas holdem game for linux :D
[10:59] <kwwii> erm
[10:59] <kwwii> bed
[11:00] <kwwii> nysosym: nope, but if you find one, let me know
[11:00] <nysosym> kwwii, i thinking on u ;)
[11:00] <kwwii> ;-)
[11:01] <nysosym> kwwii, see you, have a good bed time :D
[11:01] <nysosym> gn8 guys!
[11:01] <kwwii> yeah, see you tomorrow nysosym
[11:01] <nysosym> kwwii, sure ;)
[11:50] <Linkmasta23> hi