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| mpt | Gooooooooood afternoon Launchpadders! | 04:01 |
|---|---|---|
| === ..[topic/#launchpad:mpt] : Launchpad users and developers - Next developer meeting: Thu 15th Feb 2007, 1200UTC (wiki:MeetingAgenda) | launchpad-users@lists.canonical.com (wiki:MailingLists) | Channel logs: http://tinyurl.com/72w39 | ||
| === ..[topic/#launchpad:mpt] : Launchpad users and developers | Next developer meeting: Thu 15th Feb 2007, 1200UTC (wiki:MeetingAgenda) | launchpad-users@lists.canonical.com (wiki:MailingLists) | Channel logs: http://tinyurl.com/72w39 | ||
| Hobbsee | afternoon mpt!!! | 04:06 |
| ajmitch | hi mpt | 04:08 |
| LaserJock | hi mpt | 04:10 |
| mpt | hello hello hello | 04:12 |
| mpt | oh, Hobbsee, I owe you an e-mail message | 04:12 |
| Hobbsee | mpt: you do? fun :) | 04:12 |
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| Burgundavia | kiko: can I get into the test of the new UI? | 04:59 |
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| carlos | morning | 08:45 |
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| === ..[topic/#launchpad:mrevell] : Fix-it Friday! | Launchpad users and developers | Next developer meeting: Thu 15th Feb 2007, 1200UTC (wiki:MeetingAgenda) | launchpad-users@lists.canonical.com (wiki:MailingLists) | Channel logs: http://tinyurl.com/72w39 | ||
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| gnomefreak | is it me or does karma seem to drop 200+ points no matter how many bugs/comments you do/make? | 11:17 |
| ajmitch | nope | 11:25 |
| ajmitch | my karma is still going up | 11:25 |
| gnomefreak | i made 20+ comments/uploads hell 10 to one bug and mine dropped 200+ points | 11:27 |
| === ajmitch had his karma go up by > 1000 by opening a few bugs | ||
| ajmitch | ewll, 'a few' being 40+ | 11:28 |
| carlos | gnomefreak: it would be that you did a lot of work a year ago | 11:35 |
| carlos | so the amount expired is higher than the amount earned | 11:35 |
| gnomefreak | carlos: couldnt have been i wasnt a triager a year ago i didnt start until around may/june | 11:36 |
| gnomefreak | april == earliest | 11:37 |
| carlos | hmm, no idea then. Not all actions give you the same amount of karma | 11:37 |
| carlos | when did you last check your karma? | 11:38 |
| gnomefreak | a little while ago | 11:38 |
| carlos | we recently dropped a lot of karma | 11:38 |
| gnomefreak | carlos: i already emailed stub about that | 11:38 |
| carlos | due a bug we had in launchpad that was given much more karma than it should | 11:38 |
| carlos | ok | 11:38 |
| gnomefreak | it has been dropping ever since that | 11:38 |
| gnomefreak | doesnt matter what i ddo on LP | 11:38 |
| carlos | it decreases over time, but if you keep doing things, it shouldn't affect you so much | 11:39 |
| carlos | gnomefreak: you will need to wait for stub's answer | 11:39 |
| gnomefreak | it dropped almost/if not exactly 200 points over night | 11:39 |
| ajmitch | you probably just have to work harder :) | 11:40 |
| gnomefreak | https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/19552 | 11:40 |
| Ubugtu | Malone bug 19552 in firefox "Crash after firefox is opening a new window (when it should open the new URL in the same window/tab) - No More Crash Report Please!" [High,Needs info] - Assigned to Mozilla Team (mozillateam) | 11:40 |
| gnomefreak | read that than tell me how much harder lol | 11:40 |
| gnomefreak | i spent better part of day with that bug | 11:41 |
| ajmitch | sure, but karma can't measure how hard a bug is :) | 11:41 |
| gnomefreak | i know but your talking around 10 uploads/comments just on that bug | 11:42 |
| gnomefreak | not including the other bugs i did | 11:42 |
| gnomefreak | ever since the karma dropped from 1.3 mill to 10049 it has been on a steady decline | 11:43 |
| === cprov-out is now known as cprov | ||
| Ubugtu | New bug: #84167 in rosetta "Please do not export new languages after distro release for langpack-o-matic" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84167 | 11:45 |
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| ByronFortescue | Hello there, | 11:47 |
| ddaa | hello | 11:47 |
| === neversfelde [n=chrman@nrbg-4db44719.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #launchpad | ||
| ByronFortescue | I am subscribed to the Ubuntu Artwork Launchpad, but I get a lot of e-mails on subjects and posts I am not really interested by, I only want to get email about posts I posted in myself, is there any way to get this done? | 11:48 |
| ByronFortescue | And if not, how can i deactivate the subscription to all these messages? | 11:49 |
| stub | https://help.launchpad.net/KarmaAdjustmentsJan07 and https://help.launchpad.net/KarmaCalculation should explain everything | 11:51 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: what's the page of this Ubuntu Artwork team? | 11:51 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: is that it https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art + | 11:52 |
| ddaa | s/+/?/ | 11:52 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: I do not have all the elements | 11:53 |
| ddaa | like, you are not telling me what kind of mail you are receiving, etc. | 11:53 |
| ByronFortescue | ddaa: yes its that one | 11:53 |
| ByronFortescue | allright, well, I just got myself an account there, I posted in one thread, and the next thing, I get all these e-mails about other topics.. | 11:54 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: so I guess you actually want to get some permissions associated with being a member of this team, but you do not want to receive any of the email sent to that team? | 11:54 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: this is NOT a forum, and NOT a mailing list | 11:54 |
| ddaa | this is a team | 11:55 |
| ddaa | it gives permission to do things in launchpad | 11:55 |
| ByronFortescue | ddaa: allright, clears it a bit up, thank you.. ^_^ | 11:55 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: so what you are saying is not helping me understand what is your problem | 11:55 |
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| ByronFortescue | ddaa: Well, I was just wondering if there was a way to just get e-mail about posts I am subscribed to instead of all the posts | 11:57 |
| ddaa | what post are you talking about? | 11:57 |
| ddaa | You do not post to a team! | 11:57 |
| ddaa | Show me one of those "posts" | 11:58 |
| ByronFortescue | https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/human-cursors-theme/+bug/83886 | 11:59 |
| Ubugtu | Malone bug 83886 in human-cursors-theme "whishlist: new release" [Undecided,Confirmed] - Assigned to Ubuntu Artwork Team (ubuntu-art) | 11:59 |
| ByronFortescue | It's more like bug posting and responding to it.. | 11:59 |
| ddaa | okay, let me have a look | 12:00 |
| ddaa | so this i a bug | 12:00 |
| ddaa | this bug is assigned to "ubuntu artwork team" | 12:01 |
| ByronFortescue | yes | 12:01 |
| ddaa | all comments to a bug cause an email to be sent to subscribers AND the assignee | 12:01 |
| ddaa | the assignee is an "implicit subscriber" | 12:02 |
| ddaa | makes sense so far? | 12:02 |
| ByronFortescue | yes | 12:02 |
| === niemeyer [n=niemeyer@200-171-140-32.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #launchpad | ||
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: why do you need to be part of this team? | 12:02 |
| ddaa | Honest question, is there any technical reason you need to be part of team? | 12:03 |
| ByronFortescue | ddaa: It was just out of mere interest I joined it, to see if I could help a hand here and there | 12:03 |
| === jamesh [n=james@200-171-140-32.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #launchpad | ||
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: so, if you leave the team, you will still be able to do anything you want to do? | 12:03 |
| ByronFortescue | So I understand that if I want to get rid of the subscription, I have to get out of this team | 12:03 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: right, I do not know the purpose of this team. To me, it looks like its main purpose is to broadcast emails. | 12:04 |
| ByronFortescue | ddaa: no, but I understand I cannot edit these preferences myself | 12:04 |
| ddaa | What "preferences" are you thinking of? | 12:04 |
| ByronFortescue | well, which bugs I get e-mailed to me.. | 12:05 |
| Ubugtu | New bug: #84170 in launchpad "Karma calculation is buggy" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84170 | 12:05 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: you will be emailed about all bugs that are assigned to this team. | 12:05 |
| ddaa | It looks to me like it is the whole point of this team. | 12:05 |
| ByronFortescue | yes, I understand | 12:05 |
| ByronFortescue | I did not quite get that at first, so there's where the misconception is prolly ^_^ | 12:06 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: if membership of this team is used for something else | 12:06 |
| ddaa | you can ask an administrator of the team to set a "contact address" for the team. | 12:06 |
| ByronFortescue | no it's not | 12:06 |
| ByronFortescue | ok | 12:06 |
| ByronFortescue | thank you for your help and time ddaa | 12:06 |
| ddaa | such as a mailing list | 12:06 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: you are welcome, sorry for losing a bit of my temper earlier. | 12:07 |
| ByronFortescue | ddaa: It's allright, I understand it can seem a bit of a silly question from your point of view :) | 12:07 |
| ByronFortescue | bye bye! | 12:07 |
| ddaa | ByronFortescue: I guess maybe you should suggest | 12:07 |
| ddaa | to an admin of the team to explain this in the team decription. | 12:08 |
| ByronFortescue | ddaa: yeah good idea.. | 12:08 |
| ByronFortescue | allright, i'll be on my way then | 12:08 |
| ByronFortescue | sayonara | 12:08 |
| ddaa | Thank you | 12:08 |
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| === ddaa grumbles | ||
| ddaa | we really need more transparency in bug email | 12:12 |
| Fujitsu | ddaa: Most certainly. | 12:13 |
| ddaa | something that says "You received this email because you are a member of team Ubuntu Artwork. This team is the assignee of this bug. To stop receiving such email, you can leave the Ubuntu Artwork team." | 12:14 |
| ddaa | BjornT: I take it there's already a couple dozen duplicate bugs filed about this? | 12:14 |
| BjornT | ddaa: there are a few bugs about this, yes. the first step will be to at least give some way of finding out why you got an e-mail, for example using the To header, or a custom header. but something more obvious will probably be added later. | 12:18 |
| ddaa | BjornT: any chance this could be acted upon, like... in the next month? | 12:19 |
| ddaa | I know this has been in the plans for like a year. | 12:19 |
| ddaa | I do not want to see myself losing my temper again on an unsuspecting user... | 12:20 |
| BjornT | ddaa: the first step, yes. i'll probably do that one as a FiF. | 12:20 |
| Fujitsu | ddaa: I can see why you did, though. | 12:21 |
| BjornT | as for the second step, i'm not sure when i'll get around to it. | 12:21 |
| ddaa | Fujitsu: no excuse, this guy was just clueless, and subscribed to the team because he thought he wanted to help. | 12:21 |
| ddaa | he was not even being silly or having an attitude, just confused and making too many assumptions | 12:22 |
| Fujitsu | I suppose so. | 12:22 |
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| ddaa | BjornT: you know we've got the Mailman guy in, maybe you could use him for that :) | 12:23 |
| ddaa | I think that's like smack in the middle of what he's here for. | 12:23 |
| BjornT | ddaa: yeah, the second step is basically transforming the structured headers into unstructured text, so it shouldn't be that hard :) the main problem is not to bloat the notifications too much. | 12:25 |
| ddaa | Yep, I see how that can be tricky. But that's the sort of thing where barry may have useful insights. | 12:25 |
| BjornT | although, when you join a team, you should probably be given the option whether to receive mail. that's where mailman could be useful. | 12:26 |
| ddaa | BjornT: dunno... for some teams, receiving emails is the whole point of the team. | 12:27 |
| Fujitsu | BjornT: Having such an option would be really nice. | 12:27 |
| ddaa | But I guess maybe we should separate the "I'm a part of the Team, yeah!", from "I'm actually giving a shit"... | 12:27 |
| stub | barry will need to get his hands dirty in the email system at some point, as we need a bounce processor and the simplest way for us to do that is to poach the relevant code from mailman (license permitting) | 12:29 |
| ddaa | in other words... belonging to a team seem to give some users a warm feeling, and maybe that should be separated from the email traffic. | 12:29 |
| ddaa | stub: Mailman is GPL, right? | 12:29 |
| stub | I think so, yes. | 12:29 |
| ddaa | GPL covers only distribution. Launchpad is not being distributed (yet?)... | 12:30 |
| ddaa | mh... | 12:30 |
| stub | Although as the bounce processor will be a separate system, license is probably irrelevant. | 12:30 |
| ddaa | okay I see the problem. | 12:30 |
| ddaa | BjornT: I think we need more _and_ less than just transliterating the headers. | 12:32 |
| === Fujitsu is not impressed at ddaa for thinking about such license-workarounds. | ||
| ddaa | Fujitsu: it's not a workaround. The implication of the GPL to web services is a well discussed subject. | 12:32 |
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| ddaa | there was actually leaked early draft of the GPLv3 that had some clauses to consider web serving as distribution. | 12:33 |
| Fujitsu | I see an article from late 2005 mentioning such a thing. | 12:34 |
| ddaa | The fact that it was withdrawn is an implicit acknowledgment that private software, such as web services, is outside the bounds of the GPL. | 12:35 |
| ddaa | I'm pretty sure that Eben Moglen would phrase that in a much more eloquent way, he being Eben Moglen, but he'll basically agree. | 12:36 |
| jamesh | ddaa: there is an optional clause where GPLv3 code can provide a "method of downloading the source to this program" that can't be removed | 12:36 |
| ddaa | *nod* I can see how they put that in to make some stakeholders happy | 12:37 |
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| ddaa | but I wish they would cut down the number of optional clauses to a minimum. Simplicity is the biggest advantage of the GPL. | 12:37 |
| jamesh | there are a bunch of optional extras in the GPLv3 | 12:38 |
| stub | Heh.... simplicity is the reason I use MIT :) | 12:38 |
| jamesh | the LGPL essentially becomes an additional permission to GPLv3, rather than its own license | 12:38 |
| jamesh | which simplifies things a bit | 12:38 |
| ddaa | jamesh: I think optional extras are going to be a problem. | 12:39 |
| jamesh | ddaa: the base license was fairly strict about what sort of extras were allowed, last I checked | 12:39 |
| ddaa | stub: MIT is not copyleft. Copyleft is very healthy economically. | 12:39 |
| Fujitsu | GPL options... Sounds nasty. | 12:39 |
| jamesh | ddaa: the GPLv2 has similar options | 12:40 |
| ddaa | Fujitsu: do not worry, there's no "chromed RMS statuette" option that I know of. | 12:40 |
| jamesh | for example, if you have an interactive GPL'd program with a "warranty" or "license" command, you can't patch those out and distribute the result | 12:40 |
| Fujitsu | Hahah. | 12:40 |
| Fujitsu | jamesh: True. | 12:41 |
| jamesh | (there is nothing requiring interactive programs to have those style of commands though) | 12:41 |
| ddaa | jamesh: I think this sort of option is okay, as those commands can be normally hidden, and the license or warranty cannot be changed anyway. | 12:42 |
| ddaa | so it's not really changing the terms of distribution in any practical way, except for forcing the presence of a few KB of text. | 12:42 |
| ddaa | s/terms of distribution/terms of use/ | 12:43 |
| Ubugtu | New bug: #84168 in linux-meta (main) "Inapplicable security update (linux-2.6.17-11 in edgy) (dup-of: 83976)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84168 | 12:50 |
| Ubugtu | New bug: #84174 in linux-meta (main) "last linux-image-generic package is broken (dup-of: 83976)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84174 | 12:51 |
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| Ubugtu | New bug: #68201 in gnome-orca "No translations for gnome-orca" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/68201 | 01:20 |
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| ddaa | matsubara: hey | 01:34 |
| ddaa | you know you can _change_ the product of a bug report | 01:34 |
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| Ubugtu | New bug: #84016 in linux-source-2.6.17 (main) "Unmet dependency in metapackage linux-image-generic (dup-of: 83976)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84016 | 01:35 |
| Ubugtu | New bug: #84035 in Ubuntu "cannot upgrade kernel (dup-of: 83976)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84035 | 01:35 |
| Ubugtu | New bug: #84182 in linux-source-2.6.15 (main) "k7 kernel update - broken dependency (dup-of: 83976)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84182 | 01:35 |
| matsubara | ddaa: yes, why? | 01:35 |
| ddaa | so for bugs like bug 84071, you need not reject on launchpad and open on ubuntu/gaim | 01:36 |
| Ubugtu | Malone bug 84071 in gaim "Crash while drag the scroll bar" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84071 | 01:36 |
| ddaa | so we need not get bugspam about random problem that people first reported on launchpad | 01:36 |
| ddaa | or maybe you are doing it intentionally, for some reason that escapes me... | 01:36 |
| ddaa | I'd still like to be able to delete bug reports, so this sort of thing can be fixed post hoc... | 01:38 |
| matsubara | ddaa: yes I did intentionally so the bugsquad can take a look at it and investigate further. If they discover it's a problem on gaim upstream they'll do the right thing | 01:38 |
| ddaa | matsubara: okay, but why keep the "launchpad" bug report? | 01:38 |
| Fujitsu | ddaa: You can't assign a product task to a distro package, AFAIK.. | 01:39 |
| ddaa | duh | 01:39 |
| ddaa | BUG | 01:39 |
| Fujitsu | ? | 01:39 |
| ddaa | I consider this a bug, and I'm going to file it | 01:39 |
| Fujitsu | Sounds like a good idea. | 01:40 |
| matsubara | already reported ddaa | 01:40 |
| salgado | ddaa, I think it's already filed | 01:40 |
| ddaa | I'll just make a dupe to annoy the malone guys into fixing it | 01:40 |
| matsubara | ddaa: there's no reason to keep the launchpad report. since gaim doesn't use malone officially I didn't even try to re-assign from launchpad product to gaim product. | 01:41 |
| ddaa | matsubara: sure, but we cannot get rid of it | 01:41 |
| matsubara | ddaa: just re-assigned | 01:42 |
| matsubara | I thought it wouldn't let me. | 01:42 |
| ddaa | weird | 01:42 |
| matsubara | I'll do that from now on. thansk for the tip | 01:42 |
| ddaa | I guess maybe you should not be allowed to... | 01:43 |
| ddaa | BjornT: hey | 01:43 |
| Fujitsu | ddaa: Why not? | 01:43 |
| ddaa | Fujitsu: because you cannot file bugs on a product that does not use Malone officially | 01:43 |
| ddaa | the only thing you should be allowed to do is set a bugwatch to the official bugtracker, as I understand it | 01:43 |
| Fujitsu | It is useful to track the status in Malone anyway. | 01:43 |
| ddaa | that's what a bugwatch is for | 01:44 |
| Fujitsu | (as the number of bugtrackers supported by a bugwatch is limited) | 01:44 |
| BjornT | hi ddaa | 01:44 |
| Fujitsu | And some upstreams don't even have a bugtracker. | 01:44 |
| ddaa | BjornT: people are not allowed to file bugs on products that do not have the use-malone flag set | 01:44 |
| ddaa | BjornT: but it's possible to move a bug report (bugtask) from another product to a product that does not have the use-malone flag set | 01:45 |
| ddaa | BjornT: is this a bug? | 01:45 |
| Fujitsu | If that behaviour is changed, it will make life harder for a lot of people. | 01:45 |
| BjornT | ddaa: yeah, that's a bug, it has even been filed. | 01:46 |
| Fujitsu | Having to manually track the status of a bug just because LP doesn't support the bugtracker, or there is no bugtracker, is just stupid. | 01:46 |
| === ddaa thinks there are too many annoying fileds bugs on malone | ||
| === ddaa is very grumpy today, for some reason | ||
| ddaa | https://bugs.launchpad.net/gaim/+bugs | 01:47 |
| ddaa | bah... | 01:48 |
| ddaa | matsubara: okay, let's just have it as you said | 01:48 |
| BjornT | ddaa: those gaim bugs are ok, since they have an ubuntu task as well. if there's only one bugtask, it shouldn't be possible to reassign it to a product that doesn't use Launchpad to track their bugs, though. | 01:52 |
| ddaa | mkay, makes some sense | 01:53 |
| ddaa | the point is not to have bugs that nobody is looking after | 01:53 |
| === carlos -> lunch | ||
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| not-kiko | oi | 02:12 |
| not-kiko | SteveA: you called? | 02:12 |
| not-kiko | cprov: hey. | 02:12 |
| ddaa | not-kiko: what's up with your nicknames anyway? | 02:12 |
| cprov | not-kiko: hey | 02:12 |
| === ddaa is now known as ddaa-grumpy | ||
| cprov | not-kiko: no good news for me ? | 02:13 |
| not-kiko | cprov: I should be the one asking for good news!!! | 02:13 |
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| not-kiko | cprov: is mdz around? | 02:14 |
| cprov | not-kiko: then, I guess, better comments don't represent any. | 02:14 |
| cprov | not-kiko: probably yes, pitti and cjwatson also are in #soyuz | 02:15 |
| Ubugtu | New bug: #84187 in adept (main) "Adept Update Manager fails to install 2.6.17-11 (dup-of: 83976)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84187 | 02:16 |
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| not-kiko | I doubt mdz is around actually | 02:27 |
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| Ubugtu | New bug: #84160 in update-manager (main) "Updates that cannot be ticked are displayed (dup-of: 83976)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84160 | 02:55 |
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| Ubugtu | New bug: #84210 in launchpad "Naming Consistencies in sections." [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84210 | 03:55 |
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| Ubugtu | New bug: #84203 in linux-meta (main) "Depends: linux-image-2.6.17-11-386 but it is not installable (dup-of: 83976)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/84203 | 04:36 |
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| Burgwork | kiko: did you get my ping from yesterday? | 07:51 |
| kiko | Burgwork, yes. please apply to https://launchpad.net/~launchpad-beta-testers/ | 07:53 |
| Burgwork | kiko: will do | 07:54 |
| jamesh | you aren't trying to join so you'll have something to post on your weblog, right? | 08:01 |
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| rainglasz | When in a translation screen, i very often have to scroll horizontally (unless the messages are very short). Is this regarded normal? (Firefox 2, 1024x768) For me, its nagging. | 08:37 |
| not-kiko | rainglasz: it shouldn't be the case. can you ping us about it next week, when carlos, danilos and jamesh will be on a sprint? | 08:42 |
| rainglasz | ok | 08:44 |
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| not-kiko | yay! jamesh! | 08:50 |
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| w_ | Hello, got a question, someone changed the topic of a support request and it needs to be changed back, how can I find out what it was named before? | 12:01 |
| w_ | or I guess it would be called the summary | 12:02 |
| w_ | it was https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/totem/+ticket/3126 | 12:08 |
| w_ | I found the old summary in my email archives, but in case I didn't have that, how would I have seen the history of the edits made to a support request? | 12:09 |
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