[01:38] <pochu> lifeless: do you have a moment?
[01:38] <lifeless> pochu: maybe
[01:39] <pochu> lifeless: it's about this: https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+ticket/3790
[01:39] <pochu> lifeless: a Launchpad dev told me I had to talk to a launchpad admin
[01:39] <pochu> lifeless: if you can review it :)
[01:39] <pochu> lifeless: the user is ke|p 
[01:39] <pochu> ke|p: ping?
[01:40] <ke|p> HI
[01:40] <ke|p> i'm
[01:43] <lifeless> hi
[01:43] <lifeless> how are you sure the current kelp has never used launchpad ?
[01:43] <pochu> lifeless: at last in the last year, no?
[01:43] <pochu> lifeless: its karma page doesn't show any action
[01:44] <pochu> lifeless: also there is no upload, no package...
[01:44] <pochu> packages*
[01:44] <LaserJock> pochu: maybe they just use it for wiki stuff?
[01:45] <lifeless> its entirely possible the account is there to allow them to edit the ubuntu wiki
[01:45] <pochu> LaserJock: can we check it?
[01:45] <spiv> Although changing the launchpad name will not affect their wiki access.
[01:46] <pochu> spiv: right :)
[01:47] <LaserJock> still seems a little heavy handed to just remove/move an LP id without the owner's consent
[01:47] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: when it has no email with it?
[01:47] <LaserJock> well, does that mean it's not a real person?
[01:47] <pochu> lifeless: is possible to have a LP account without an email?
[01:47] <lifeless> they are active
[01:47] <lifeless> they've last logged in in jan
[01:48] <lifeless> so not very active, but certainly not idle.
[01:48] <lifeless> I'm not going to change their name. You can ask them to change their name, so you can change it... but their email has a local portion of 'kelp'
[01:49] <lifeless> so I think that this is a conflict on their preferred handle, which happens - sorry.
[01:49] <pochu> lifeless: I can't contact him, since there is no email address there
[01:49] <pochu> lifeless: np
[01:49] <lifeless> they have it set to hide email address's
[01:49] <pochu> :S
[01:50] <pochu> lifeless: ty anyway :)
[01:51] <pochu> is there any way to see a wiki.ubuntu.com profile?
[01:51] <lifeless> ke|p: you could change your name (via +edit) to kelp1 or something
[01:52] <ke|p> mmm ok, it's a possibility
[01:53] <pochu> not the best, though
[01:53] <pochu> hehe
[01:53] <lifeless> well
[01:53] <pochu> but that's better than nothing :)
[01:53] <lifeless> I'm sure the other kelp would say the precise same thing
[01:53] <lifeless> unfortunately we can't really have two people at ~kelp :)
[01:53] <pochu> :)
[01:55] <pochu> lifeless: are special characters (as "|") allowed in launchpad accounts?
[01:55] <lifeless> dont think so, we require a subset of ascii that is easy to read over a e.g phone line, without confusion
[01:56] <lifeless> so no capticals
[01:56] <lifeless> alphanumeric
[01:56] <lifeless> '-'
[01:56] <lifeless> some few others
[01:57] <pochu> ah, ok :)
[01:57] <lifeless> try something whack, it will tell you ;)
[01:58] <ke|p> thanks lifeless 
[02:00] <lifeless> np, hope you find something you are happy with
[02:01] <mpt> Gooooooooooooooooood afternoon Launchpadders!
[02:01] <LaserJock> mpt!
[02:01] <LaserJock> :-)
[02:03] <pochu> mpt: hi :)
[02:03] <ajmitch> mpt!
[02:07] <Hobbsee> hey mpt!
[02:11] <ke|p> and,,, lifeless, can you give me the mail to contact with and ask him if he is using LP? it's possible?
[02:12] <lifeless> ke|p: no, hes chosen not to disclose his email address's to anyone, and thats his privilege.
[02:13] <ke|p> oks, sorry, i'm new in LP
[02:13] <ke|p> thanks
[02:13] <lifeless> you can see his wikiname I think, you could try getting in contact with him via the wiki
[02:13] <lifeless> leave a message on his wiki-page
[02:14] <ke|p> I think he don't have wiki page, mmm
[02:14] <ke|p> has :p
[02:19] <ke|p> lifeless, this is the mickey25's wiki page, this page doesn not exist yet
[02:19] <ke|p> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Mickey25
[02:40] <mpt> If he had a wiki page, he'd probably be using Launchpad :-)
[02:47] <ke|p> mpt, this wiki page doesn't exist and i can't contact whit him
[02:53] <ke|p> can I do anything else?
[02:54] <Lathiat> ke|p: i think your pretty stuck
[02:56] <ke|p> ok, sorry
[03:40] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86624 in launchpad "Help panel is sometimes invisible in Safari" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86624
[04:20] <Ubugtu> New bug: #28326 in xserver-xorg-video-i810 "i810 Xv crashes after suspend -> infinite resprawn" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/28326
[04:35] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86633 in launchpad-bazaar "Beta frontpage says we import git repositories -- we don't" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86633
[06:32] <pochu> night everybody!
[06:35] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86643 in launchpad "Implement mouseover/mousedown effects for buttons" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86643
[06:48] <jml> I'm trying to file a bug for the version of python-mechanize in feisty
[06:49] <jml> on some pages, the "Bugs" tab isn't clickable, but the colours and fonts are the same as if it was clickable.
[06:51] <jml> ahh, that's a known bug. (bug 82212)
[06:51] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 82212 in launchpad "milestone views in beta have unclickable tabs" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/82212
[08:53] <carlos> morning
[10:13] <sabdfl> mrevell_: lp beta team is shaping up nicely
[10:13] <sabdfl> glad to see it expanding
[10:13] <mrevell_> sabdfl: Yeah, we're getting quite a bit of interest now.
[10:13] <sabdfl> once the UI passes my basic smell test I'll work the rolodex
[10:13] <mrevell_> sabdfl: And everyone's happy not post screenshots.
[10:13] <mrevell_> sabdfl: Cool
[10:15] <LaserJock> the beta-by-default is getting me to use it more :-)
[10:15] <mrevell> LaserJock: You pinged me last night. Sorry, I got into a call. How can I help?
[10:17] <sabdfl> SteveA: how diverged is our zope from mainline?
[10:30] <LaserJock> mrevell: -> pm if you haven't seen it already
[10:31] <mrevell> LaserJock: I've replied. Hmm, perhaps my auto-registration didn't work
[10:35] <mpt> SteveA, still available
[10:51] <SteveA> sabdfl: our zope is on the mainline, but it near to the last release, rather than the current tip of the mainline
[10:53] <sabdfl> just wondering if we can use the distro package rather than our own branch?
[10:54] <sabdfl> SteveA: we're all going to switch to feisty on beta day, lp devs included, please will you nominate someone to get things ready for that?
[10:54] <sabdfl> so it's not a big panic day?
[10:54] <sabdfl> i've had to tweak a few things (mainly making python2.4 more explicit)
[10:55] <sabdfl> postgres8.2 requires a few tweaks
[10:55] <sabdfl> they are in my mentorship branch if anyone wants to look
[10:58] <SteveA> sabdfl: does the sound work for people using feisty?
[10:58] <SteveA> communicating by voice is important, and we don't have hardware voip phones
[10:59] <sabdfl> SteveA: now that's exactly the sort of bug the distro teamwill want to hear about
[11:00] <SteveA> it'll also cause problems getting work done on the launchpad team
[11:00] <SteveA> so, I'd encourage people to use a livecd install, check sound works
[11:00] <SteveA> and if not, file bugs, and not upgrade
[11:01] <sabdfl> SteveA: sorry, we've had a long discussion about this
[11:01] <sabdfl> if we worked for a company that USED ubuntu that would be fine
[11:02] <sabdfl> but we need all the testing feedback we can
[11:02] <sabdfl> it was a compromise to wait till beta as it is
[11:02] <SteveA> you seriously want people to upgrade if they have established that sound doesn't work?
[11:02] <sabdfl> i would have gone with feature freeze
[11:02] <sabdfl> yes
[11:02] <sabdfl> because they will find other things that don't work too
[11:02] <sabdfl> and those bug reports are important
[11:03] <sabdfl> they've every right to ask the distro team to prioritise stuff that affects them, perhaps tag and track them accordingly
[11:07] <sabdfl> SteveA: is there any way for an executing python script to go into interactive mode?
[11:07] <sabdfl> the equivalent of python -i?
[11:07] <sabdfl> want to make it so I can just run ./harness.py in lib/canonical/database
[11:07] <SteveA> sabdfl: I'm in an interview...
[11:08] <sabdfl> ok
[11:28] <carlos> SteveA: I'm using Feisty in my home server, which I use to play movies and yes, sound works
[11:33] <sabdfl> SteveA: something like a sound bug is very machine-specific, generally not across all systems
[11:41] <SteveA> sure.  I installed feisty on a girlfriend's computer.  she was so pleased with it she came around with some wine and cooked for me.
[11:42] <SteveA> I didn't tell her the install was a breeze :-)
[11:45] <lifeless> SteveA: lol
[12:00] <sabdfl> stub around?
[12:00] <sabdfl> dayem
[12:01] <sabdfl> s/"bones heal and chicks love scars"/"ubuntu rocks and chicks love capable geeks"/
[12:09] <cprov> good morning !
[12:23] <SteveA> sabdfl: I don't know how to put a python script into interactive mode other than using +i.  There may be a way.  I'd do it using this as the first line:
[12:23] <SteveA> #!/usr/bin/python2.4 -i
[12:24] <SteveA> or #!/usr/bin/env python2.4 -i
[12:24] <jamesh> you can only include one argument on a #! line
[12:24] <SteveA> that way, you'll be able to execute ./harness.py and have it work
[12:24] <jamesh> iirc
[12:24] <SteveA> jamesh: I just tried out the first example
[12:25] <SteveA> maybe it's one of those useful non-standard bash things
[12:25] <jamesh> there seems to be "make harness" in the toplevel too
[12:25] <jamesh> SteveA: well, the #! line gets interpreted by the kernel
[12:25] <jamesh> bash isn't involved
[12:25] <SteveA> wow
[12:26] <SteveA> mpt: ping
[12:26] <mpt> (SteveA: In case I'm not here right now, tell me about what you want, and I'll reply when I'm available.)
[12:26] <SteveA> mpt: ping
[12:26] <mpt> (SteveA: In case I'm not here right now, tell me about what you want, and I'll reply when I'm available.)
[12:26] <SteveA> cool
[12:26] <SteveA> mpt is a robot
[12:26] <SteveA> mpt: I want a voice call.
[12:34] <sabdfl> SteveA, jamesh: thank you! harness mod worked perfectly
[12:35] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86679 in launchpad "tabs not clickable (beta)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86679
[12:38] <cbx33> forgive me if this comment causes a stir.  I just was using the beta LP in IE6, yes I know where was firefox :p but I was on a friends machine updating a bug report.....
[12:38] <cbx33> however, I found it very bug ridden
[12:38] <cbx33> is it likely to be fixed to be compatible? - I just feel that we always moan at prop companies for not making things compatible....then we do the same :S
[12:41] <jamesh> cbx33: please report bugs about the problems you encounter
[12:46] <cbx33> jamesh ok cool
[01:14] <cprov> stub: hi, did you have time to check the archive-rework DB patch ?
[01:15] <stub> cprov: No - looks like a big one. I suspect I've seen it before though.
[01:15] <cprov> stub: yes, you're right the basics have been already discussed
[01:16] <cprov> stub: but we would like to know your opinion about a strategy to land it in a short-term
[01:16] <cprov> stub: maybe w/o the code (with suitable default values)
[01:20] <stub> cprov: I thought the email said post-feisty?
[01:42] <aamachu> hi
[01:42] <aamachu> I am sri ramadas
[01:42] <aamachu> i was recently approved with membership of Ubuntu
[01:42] <bac> aamachu: hello
[01:43] <aamachu> can some help me in getting @ubuntu.com email id
[01:43] <aamachu> bac, Hi
[01:45] <ddaa> aamachu: I suggest you ask on the IRC channel of your local ubuntu community
[01:47] <aamachu> ddaa, Thanks
[02:09] <cprov> stub: sorry, power outage over here
[02:10] <cprov> stub: yes, I mentioned "post-feisty" for opening the feature in production, but having the DB in place before it would be nice.
[02:13] <stub> cprov: It needs to land with code updates though, doesn't it? A load of NOT NULL columns with no defaults.
[02:14] <jamesh> part of the problem is that archive-rework contains two fairly independent changes
[02:14] <cprov> stub: that's the point, maybe you could help us to modify the DB patch to set proper default values, so it could be landed w/o the code
[02:15] <jamesh> (a) the soyuz queue table renaming, and (b) the archive columns
[02:15] <jamesh> if we were just doing (b), it could probably get rolled out with a default value of whatever Ubuntu's archive is
[02:16] <jamesh> in fact, for (b) the webapp code could remain unchanged, since it never creates rows that are picking up an archive column
[02:17] <stub> We can force Ubuntu's archive to be 1 (it already will, but we should do it explicitly)
[02:17] <jamesh> but (a) is more problematic, especially since we'd need to update both production and beta
[02:18] <stub> Then it is just a case of setting DEFAULT=1 on the relevant columns, and remove them when we need to land PPA to confirm everything is indeed being set correctly.
[02:18] <stub> Do you want a call or do this via IRC?
[02:19] <jamesh> an evil idea of how to handle (a) without updating the webapp is to leave the tables as they are and create updatable views with the new table names
[02:19] <jamesh> or vice versa
[02:21] <jamesh> stub: I don't have my headset handy, so it might be easy to stay on IRC
[02:22] <sabdfl> in pagetests where i am swapping between users, do i need to do anything to switch user other than a new round of:
[02:22] <sabdfl>   browser.addHeader("Authorization", "...")
[02:22] <sabdfl>   browser.open('http://...')
[02:22] <sabdfl> ?
[02:22] <cprov> stub: to be honest, I don't really see much advantage in spending time land the DB patch only, basically because the migration procedure is very simple.
[02:23] <stub> jamesh: I have already done that with the RevisionNumber table
[02:23] <jamesh> okay
[02:23] <sabdfl> put differently, i have a test that seems to be failing, and when i look at the browser.contents it's because the person logged in is not the person I put in the addHeader, it's the person from the tests above that
[02:23] <stub> But I agree with cprov that we are best of waiting until the code is ready to land. I see little advantage to landing the db work early
[02:24] <jamesh> stub: one nice bit is that these tables are only updated by the soyuz code rather than the webapp, so it doesn't necessarily have to be an updatable view
[02:25] <stub> jamesh, cprov: If data migration time is a problem, give me the output run with \timing. The UPDATES in particular can be made more efficient.
[02:25] <cprov> jamesh: not really, $distrorelease/+queue modifies DRQ table.
[02:25] <jamesh> cprov: ah.  forgot about that bit ...
[02:25] <stub> (UPDATE FROM rather than UPDATE and a subselect
[02:26] <cprov> stub: the entire patch takes about 25 minutes in mawson, IIRC
[02:26] <sabdfl> jamesh: ^ w.r.t. switching users in a page test?
[02:26] <cprov> stub: on a snapshot of 16th Jan
[02:27] <jamesh> sabdfl: usually it is best to create a new Browser object
[02:27] <cprov> stub: so, it's probably worth to improve performance.
[02:27] <jamesh> sabdfl: addHeader() doesn't replace old headers
[02:27] <sabdfl> aha
[02:27] <sabdfl> that would do it
[02:28] <sabdfl> so is "browser" just a useful starting one that's there at the beginning of each pagetest?
[02:28] <jamesh> stub: fyi: for the rosetta migration scripts, we found we could do "ALTER TABLE foo ADD COLUMN bar, ADD COLUMN baz", which was faster than two alter table calls
[02:28] <jamesh> sabdfl: yep
[02:30] <sabdfl> it's ok to overwrite it with a new "browser"? browser = Browser()?
[02:30] <jamesh> sure.  It is just a variable
[02:30] <sabdfl> cool, thanks
[02:31] <stub> cprov: Ok. The two queries on https://devpad.canonical.com/~andrew/paste/fileydwo9l.html and should show you how to update the other UPDATEs.
[02:31] <stub> jamesh: Huh. I didn't realize you could do that :)
[02:31] <cprov> stub: very nice, thank you
[02:31] <stub> As long as it isn't PostgreSQL 8.2 specific yet
[02:32] <jamesh> stub: well, I have 8.1 on my box so it can't be 8.2 specific :0
[02:33] <jamesh> stub: you can add or remove as many columns or constraints as you want in a single alter table call
[02:33] <stub> excellent. I purged 8.1 testing update procedures so can't test atm :)
[02:33] <jamesh> and adding two columns seemed approximately as fast as adding one column
[02:34] <stub> It would be - the time is rewriting every row in the db I think, and it wouldn't matter how much has changed (only the change in width of the data)
[02:36] <jamesh> of course, in the rosetta case, the "create a new table then rename" strategy turned out to be even faster
[02:40] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86701 in malone "the X-launchpad-bug header is missing information, why I got the mail" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86701
[02:42] <ddaa> Service notice
[02:42] <ddaa> We have some disruption in the branch hosting service at the moment.
[02:43] <ddaa> You are still able to upload data to launchpad with sftp, but updates are not published to the http side
[02:44] <ddaa> I'm on it, and will deploy a temporary fix within the day.
[02:44] <ddaa> All my flattest apologies for the inconvenience.
[03:26] <Ubugtu> New bug: #30369 in malone "malone frontpage should have search option" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/30369
[03:29] <ddaa> Service notice
[03:29] <ddaa> The problem with the branch hosting service has been resolved.
[03:30] <ddaa> Now, you should be able to enjoy less than 2 minutes of latency between an upload to sftp and the publication of the data to http.
[03:31] <ddaa> I will poke the database to do a final run on all branches, so those which where modified this morning will be updated.
[03:35] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86714 in malone "Don't display "(upstream)" for products in bug listings" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86714
[03:45] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86716 in malone "Too much detail in bug listings portlets" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86716
[03:50] <sabdfl> well done ddaa
[03:51] <ddaa> sabdfl: still some work to do for SteveA demo
[03:51] <ddaa> the branch scanner still needs improvement
[03:51] <ddaa> but it's getting there :)
[03:52] <ddaa> Service notice: all hosted branches have been updated. Everything is back in line now.
[03:53] <sabdfl> we need an effective trigger mechanism, so when one thing happens it can trigger something else
[03:53] <sabdfl> without creating security holes
[03:53] <sabdfl> that way, it can cascade out nicely
[03:53] <ddaa> sabdfl: the dogfooding work will help this
[03:54] <ddaa> since we need an xmlrpc interface to do the branch-scanning remotely
[03:54] <ddaa> we'll be able to do it from vostok
[03:54] <ddaa> mh
[03:55] <ddaa> yeah, the plan is to have people upload to a smart server so 1. we can write directly to the public data 2. we have a handy hook to update the database through xmlrpc after the branch is updated
[03:56] <ddaa> the xmlrpc protocol will need a bit of tuning to be efficient, but once that's done, that can be as fast as materially possible.
[04:19] <sabdfl> in other words, they push and voila, it's available, and seconds later it's in the UI too? perfect.
[04:19] <ddaa> that's the idea
[04:19] <ddaa> as usual, the devil's in the details
[04:25] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86737 in launchpad-bazaar "lib/canonical/authserver/client/twistedclient.py has no tests" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86737
[04:31] <cbx33> what does fix commited actually mean?
[04:31] <cbx33> a fix has been commited to a bzr branch?
[04:31] <ddaa> for launchpad, it means that the fix was committed on the mainline
[04:31] <cbx33> ddaa mainline?
[04:31] <ddaa> and will be put online on the next major upgrade
[04:32] <cbx33> so if I'm an upstream author of a pacakge
[04:32] <ddaa> cbx33: the main branch used for launchpad development, called rocketfuel
[04:32] <cbx33> and I've just fixed the bug
[04:32] <cbx33> and pushed the bzr branch to lp
[04:32] <ddaa> cbx33: ha, I guess that's a matter of policy for your project
[04:32] <cbx33> ok
[04:32] <ddaa> what _we_ use for
[04:32] <cbx33> well then it's commited ;)
[04:32] <ddaa> is to mark that the fix was committed on the branch that's used to make releases
[04:33] <ddaa> most projects have a trunk, or "official" main branch of some sort
[04:33] <cbx33> yeh
[04:33] <ddaa> cbx33: in launchpad parlance, that would typically be the branch of the "development focus" series.
[04:33] <cbx33> i spoke in here earlier about bugs with L and Ie6
[04:33] <cbx33> and was told to make bug reports
[04:33] <cbx33> s/L/LP
[04:33] <cbx33> i know, i know, yuk IE6
[04:34] <cbx33> i was usig a friends machine and needed to make a few bug comments
[04:34] <cbx33> the experience was not pleseant
[04:34] <ddaa> cbx33: the ubuntu philosophies says that people with disabilities should have equal access to the information.
[04:34] <cbx33> my feelings exactly
[04:34] <ddaa> I think that IE6 can be considered a disability for all practical purposes :)
[04:34] <cbx33> so you want me to bug everything I find
[04:34] <cbx33> indeed it can
[04:35] <ddaa> cbx33: filing bugs (as long as they are actual, useful bug reports) is the surest way to get traction on what you want to get fixed.
[04:36] <ddaa> nagging the relevant people sometimes help as well, but it's not like we spend our twiddling our thumbs...
[04:36] <ddaa> * not like we spend our days
[04:37] <cbx33> of course
[04:37] <cbx33> that's why i didn't know if IE6 was a known bug
[04:37] <cbx33> personally I use FF so i don't care about IE6
[04:37] <ddaa> so do I
[04:38] <cbx33> I'm just thinking of the ubu philosophy as you put it
[04:39] <ddaa> OTOH, if you cannot reproduce the problem, you may not be the best person to file the bug...
[04:41] <cbx33> well my wife uses IE so maybe i still can
[04:41] <cbx33> and we have ie6 at work
[05:22] <sabdfl> cbx33: mpt is the person to bug
[05:22] <cbx33> ok sabdfl, thanks, not sure how high up it was on the LP list of priorities
[05:24] <cbx33> when i get a chance I'll try to bug report some of the errors I saw
[05:26] <sabdfl> cbx33: i guess there are a few big items that affect every page
[05:26] <sabdfl> can't open the beta properly till it works in IE6&7
[05:27] <sabdfl> mpt & SteveA: IE compatibility is a perfect Brilliant job
[05:28] <cbx33> sabdfl, right, I'll start bugging, the biggest I saw was the help pullout
[05:28] <cbx33> it was already pulled out....and on clicking it flewdown to the bottom of the page...but still pulled out
[05:28] <cbx33> I'll bug em in a sec
[05:28] <cbx33> working on tcm fixing right now ;)
[05:29] <cbx33> should I assign the bugs in LP to anyone in particular?
[05:30] <sabdfl> mpt
[05:30] <Louie`> Hello, how do I deactivate mails from launchpad when I have reported a bug
[05:31] <cbx33> ok will do.....thank you for the info sabdfl 
[05:33] <Louie`> I got alot of unimportant mails every day
[05:35] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86757 in malone "bug page includes product details portlet, but user can't expand it" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86757
[05:36] <ddaa> Louie`: you say that you reported a bug, but you do not want to receive any mail concerning this bug?
[05:39] <Louie`> ddaa thats correct.
[05:39] <ddaa> Louie`: check the bug page, there should be a portlet (a little box on one side) listing the subscribers
[05:39] <ddaa> that should list your name
[05:40] <ddaa> then you should be able to unsubscribe from the bug, by clicking "Unsubscribe" in the second portlet on the left column.
[05:41] <ddaa> though, fire-and-forget bug reporting is not exactly a good practice...
[05:42] <ddaa> people working on the bug often post comments on the bug asking questions to the bug reporter, and if they are not answered, the bug just gets ignored.
[05:43] <Louie`> Sorry but Im unable to answer questions about buggs Ive reported. Im trying to give a good story about what I did to get the bug comming up
[05:44] <ddaa> Louie`: I'm not the right person to apologize to :)
[05:44] <ddaa> I'm just a launchpad hand.
[05:44] <Louie`> ;] 
[05:44] <Louie`> ddaa hmmz, chall I press my name in the upper right corner of the screen and then press bugs or just push it on the start page?
[05:45] <sabdfl> Louie`: the bug is unlikely to get fixed if you, or someone else affected by it, won't read email related to it
[05:45] <ddaa> Louie`: the url of the bug page is in every bug mail
[05:45] <ddaa> just click on it from your mail client
[05:45] <Louie`> ddaa oh, thanks, Ill take a look right now
[05:45] <sabdfl> if you don't care about it enough to read mail, the devs are unlikely to care enough to look at it
[05:46] <jamesh> Louie`: sometimes there will be a piece of information that you don't consider important about the bug report, but the developer does
[05:46] <jamesh> Louie`: if they can't contact you, they may not be able to solve the bug report
[05:46] <jamesh> furthermore, you won't know when the problem has been fixed
[05:47] <jamesh> that's the rationale for subscribing the reporter
[05:48] <jamesh> (of course, in some cases it may make sense to unsubscribe from a bug you reported, and that is possible)
[05:48] <Louie`> thanks alot
[05:50] <ddaa> jamesh: is there any reason why bugmail does not have a "two clicks to unsubscribe" link?
[05:50] <ddaa> like "To stop receiving mail about this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/etc/foo/bar/+unsubscribe
[05:54] <jamesh> ddaa: I don't think we've got stable unsubscribe links, which is one reason ...
[05:54] <jamesh> actually, the unsubscribe link should work even if the package changes product
[05:54] <jamesh> so that isn't a reason
[05:54] <jamesh> probably worth bringing up on the list
[05:55] <ddaa> jamesh: care to do it?
[08:01] <mpt> ddaa, see bug 3797
[08:01] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 3797 in malone "Bug mails should explain why the person is getting emailed." [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/3797 - Assigned to Bjrn Tillenius (bjornt)
[08:01] <ddaa> mpt: slightly different I guess
[08:01] <ddaa> mpt: we sometimes get people here who just want to stop receiving mail
[08:02] <ddaa> and either know, or do not care, why they were receiving it
[08:02] <ddaa> really, what they are looking for is an "unsubscribe" link in the email.
[08:02] <mpt> yes
[08:02] <ddaa> and of course, it should Just Work
[08:03] <ddaa> duh... this email is too long for me to read at the moment
[08:03] <mpt> well, not quite
[08:03] <mpt> It should link to a page containing a button that Just Works
[08:03] <ddaa> I trust you to preach the gospel of no-nonsense UI :)
[08:03] <ddaa> mpt: yes
[08:03] <ddaa> mpt: what I meant by "two clicks unsubscribe"
[08:03] <ddaa> one to get to the page
[08:03] <ddaa> one to confirm
[08:04] <mpt> yah
[08:04] <ddaa> s/this email/this bug/
[08:07] <sabdfl> mpt: you up early, or late?
[08:12] <mpt> sabdfl, early :-)
[08:26] <sabdfl> alrighty then
[08:26] <sabdfl> mpt: i thought i was spend the evening making [trivial]  text changes etc
[08:26] <sabdfl> is there a branch of yours I can start with so as not to conflict with any similar changes from you?
[08:26] <sabdfl> or are you all landed up?
[08:27] <lsproc> Is there any member of the launchpad team who can give me a hand?
[08:29] <mpt> sabdfl, all landed up at the moment
[08:30] <sabdfl> lsproc: ask away, will help if we can
[08:30] <lsproc> sabdfl, Im new to launchpad, so when I was adding a release, I kinda messed it up a bit
[08:30] <sabdfl> no worries
[08:31] <sabdfl> that part of the system isn't very clear
[08:31] <lsproc> I have 2 releases called 1.0a1, so its hard to tell the difference, and one just isn't meant to be there :P
[08:31] <sabdfl> what do you need fixed?
[08:31] <sabdfl> project?
[08:31] <lsproc> hang on
[08:32] <lsproc> https://launchpad.net/swishcms/swishnews/1.0a1 << thats the one that shouldnt be there
[08:33] <lsproc> https://launchpad.net/swishcms/swishcontent/1.0a1 << and that should become SwishCONTENT 1.0a1, so its easier to tell the difference when others DO come
[08:33] <sabdfl> is there actually a swishnews release?
[08:33] <lsproc> not yet
[08:34] <lsproc> thats something i am planning
[08:34] <sabdfl> i'm trying to understand things here
[08:34] <sabdfl> do you actually have TWO products?
[08:34] <lsproc> just one, the other is in planning
[08:34] <sabdfl> a productseries is like a "major version"
[08:34] <sabdfl> right
[08:34] <sabdfl> hmm
[08:34] <sabdfl> we need to clean this up
[08:34] <lsproc> yeah
[08:35] <sabdfl> our fault
[08:35] <sabdfl> what would you call the whole group of products?
[08:35] <lsproc> well
[08:35] <sabdfl> swishcms?
[08:35] <lsproc> yeah
[08:35] <sabdfl> ok
[08:36] <sabdfl> and then you have one product called swishcontent
[08:36] <lsproc> yes
[08:36] <sabdfl> and one called swishnews?
[08:36] <sabdfl> are there ANY releases of either?
[08:36] <lsproc> there is one release called 1.0a1 of swishcontent
[08:36] <lsproc> there are no releases of swishnews
[08:36] <lsproc> adding that was accidental
[08:36] <lsproc> but it will come in the future
[08:37] <sabdfl> what does swishcontent do?
[08:38] <lsproc> its kinda like a wiki, but people dont collaborate on it, its just done by admins
[08:43] <sabdfl> sweet jesus, there's a crasher in the code to edit the details of a release
[08:43] <sabdfl> sigh
[08:43] <lsproc> ?
[08:44] <sabdfl> ok
[08:44] <sabdfl> here is the structure i am creating
[08:46] <sabdfl> give me a paragraph of text describing the overall project?
[08:46] <lsproc> content or cms?
[08:46] <sabdfl> cms
[08:47] <lsproc> SwishCMS is a collection of scripts designed to make running a website quicker and easier. It is made up of a variety of subprojects that can all be linked together.
[08:47] <lsproc> all i can think of just now :)
[08:47] <sabdfl> homepage?
[08:47] <lsproc> http://swishcms.berlios.de
[08:48] <sabdfl> https://beta.launchpad.net/swishcms
[08:48] <sabdfl> that's a "project group"
[08:49] <sabdfl> it can include multiple products
[08:49] <sabdfl> https://beta.launchpad.net/swishcontent
[08:49] <sabdfl> that is the first product
[08:49] <lsproc> ok
[08:49] <sabdfl> in the first product, there are two series
[08:49] <sabdfl> think of a series as a "major branch"
[08:49] <sabdfl> or "branch of a stable release series"
[08:49] <lsproc> ok
[08:50] <sabdfl> there are TWO series
[08:50] <sabdfl> one represents trunk
[08:50] <sabdfl> mainline
[08:50] <sabdfl> the other, 1.0
[08:50] <lsproc> ok
[08:50] <sabdfl> you should connect the dots in bzr
[08:50] <lsproc> and trunk is the one in bazaar
[08:50] <sabdfl> right now, they are probably the same branch in bazaar
[08:50] <lsproc> anyway
[08:50] <sabdfl> when you are ready to make your first 1.0 release, and split trunk and ongoing 1.0  development, they diverge
[08:50] <sabdfl> make sense?
[08:51] <lsproc> yes
[08:51] <sabdfl> then you have a branch for 1.0, from which you make any updated 1.0.x releases
[08:51] <sabdfl> and continue development on trunk
[08:51] <lsproc> aha
[08:51] <sabdfl> when you are gearing up for 2.x
[08:51] <sabdfl> you create a 2.0 series
[08:51] <sabdfl> make a bazaar branch
[08:51] <sabdfl> and voila
[08:51] <lsproc> ok
[08:52] <lsproc> right
[08:52] <sabdfl> what does swishnews do?
[08:53] <lsproc> ever heard of cutenews?
[08:53] <sabdfl> nup
[08:53] <lsproc> well
[08:53] <lsproc> its essentially a news script written in php
[08:53] <sabdfl> news like a blog, or rss feed?
[08:53] <lsproc> general news
[08:53] <lsproc> http://cutephp.com/
[08:54] <lsproc> they put it much better :)
[08:58] <sabdfl> https://beta.launchpad.net/swishcms
[08:58] <sabdfl> ok, both products are there now
[08:59] <lsproc> i cant access the beta site :/
[09:00] <sabdfl> take out the beta. from the URL
[09:00] <lsproc> ok
[09:00] <sabdfl> there is a bug in LP that prevents me from renaming one of those releases
[09:00] <lsproc> so is it fixed now?
[09:00] <sabdfl> roughly
[09:01] <lsproc> is it possible to get rid of the 1.0a1 under https://launchpad.net/swishcontent/trunk?
[09:03] <sabdfl> that's the bit that's blocked by a bug
[09:03] <sabdfl> i'm just looking to see if this bug is filed already
[09:03] <lsproc> ok
[09:03] <sabdfl> or if i should file a new one
[09:05] <sabdfl> https://bugs.beta.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/4750
[09:05] <sabdfl> it's private, but i can see it
[09:05] <lsproc> can i access it on the public one?
[09:07] <jamesh> lsproc: the bug is marked private.
[09:07] <lsproc> jamesh, ok
[09:08] <lsproc> sabdfl, so is everything done that can be done for now?
[09:08] <sabdfl> yup
[09:08] <lsproc> ok
[09:08] <lsproc> many thanks :)
[09:09] <sabdfl> i will subscribe you to that bug
[09:09] <sabdfl> when it gets fixed, you will know
[09:09] <lsproc> ok
[09:09] <sabdfl> and then you can ask for the release to be renamed
[09:09] <lsproc> ok
[09:09] <lsproc> thanks
[09:13] <lsproc> sabdfl, you seem to have control over swishnews
[09:14] <sabdfl> fixed
[09:14] <lsproc> thanks
[10:05] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86846 in malone "7.04 Feisty Herd4: Can not prepare mount points "/", "/boot", "swap"  during the installation with live cd" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86846
[10:05] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86849 in launchpad "zope.testbrowser open() fails with relative URL" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86849
[10:10] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86851 in malone "7.04 Feisty Herd4: gparted: constantly mounting partitions" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86851
[10:31] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86861 in launchpad "SinglePopupWidget only works with vocabulary registered by name" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86861
[11:29] <jml_> bug 39464 says a fix has been committed
[11:29] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 39464 in malone "Where's the bug reporter?" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/39464 - Assigned to Brad Bollenbach (bradb)
[11:29] <jml_> but afaict, there's been no activity on the bug since May 2006
[11:30] <mpt> Gooooooooooooood morning Launchpadders!
[11:31] <jml_> mpt: hi
[11:33] <mpt> jml_, it was slightly in the pre-1.0 design (by moving "Bug details" from the left side of the page to the right), but the 1.0 design made it even worse than originally (by collapsing the portlet by default). I'll re-fix it shortly.
[11:33] <mpt> It was fixed slightly, I mean.
[11:33] <jml> mpt: are you planning on fixing it fully by moving the name of the reporter to be next to the text of the initial report?
[11:34] <mpt> No, next to the bug number
[11:34] <jml> hmm.
[11:35] <mpt> Putting it very close to the description would be misleading, because descriptions can be edited by others
[11:35] <jml> yeah.
[11:35] <jml> my other question was about putting a record of those edits near the description :)
[11:36] <jml> I can see how that might get cluttered. otoh, I really like knowing who wrote the text that I'm reading, particularly if they use the first person.
[11:37] <mpt> jml, https://launchpad.canonical.com/BugHistory
[11:40] <mpt> which I nag BjornT about every six months or so :-)
[11:40] <jml> mpt: heh
[11:40] <jml> well, I've added some comments to 39464
[11:41] <jml> thanks.
[11:51] <Ubugtu> New bug: #39464 in malone "Where's the bug reporter?" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/39464
[12:00] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86884 in launchpad ""Uses Bugs", "Doesn't use Translations" etc doesn't make sense" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86884