[12:28] <mpt> Prognatus, looking at https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu there are quite a few "blueprints" proposed that really should be bug reports
[12:28] <mpt> so merely moving all Wishlist bug reports to Blueprints wouldn't entirely fix the problem
[12:29] <mpt> e.g. <https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/synaptic-show-download-error-details>, <https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/user-belong-to-games>, <https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/windows-focus>
[12:34] <Prognatus> mpt: Ok
[12:44] <mpt> spiv, bug 6283, nag, nag
[12:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 6283 in launchpad "Disabling the account thru Wiki causes more harm than good. That option should be nuked." [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/6283 - Assigned to Andrew Bennetts (spiv)
[01:07] <PCGenie> Hi there... 
[01:07] <PCGenie> Who do i contact if i would like to translate ubuntu into my own language?
[01:08] <pochu> PCGenie: which language?
[01:08] <PCGenie> Faroese
[01:08] <PCGenie> Could be interesting ;)
[01:08] <pochu> PCGenie: isn't there a team for that language yet?
[01:09] <PCGenie> I actually don't really know
[01:12] <PCGenie> I have been using Ubuntu linux on my new desktop for a couple of months and i am really interested in contributing
[01:17] <mpt> PCGenie, one moment
[01:21] <mpt> PCGenie, https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/dapper/+lang/fo
[01:21] <mpt> if you want to get started right away
[01:21] <PCGenie> Yup ;) ... i will try to get other people with me to... 
[01:23] <mpt> I can't tell whether there's an official translation team for Faroese
[01:23] <mpt> carlos or danilos will be able to help you with that.
[01:24] <sabdfl> how do i see the queue for a distrorelease?
[01:25] <PCGenie> Faroe Islands aren't so big.. Microsoft is dominating here ;( - I think Ubuntu is much more social and it fits to me.
[01:28] <PCGenie> There are at least two Faroese translators 
[01:28] <pochu> PCGenie: you're not alone :D
[02:00] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92404 in malone "Every bug comment has its own entry in Google" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92404
[02:05] <jml> ddaa: hello
[02:07] <lifeless> sabdfl: what do you mean queue for distrorelease? do you mean pending builds ?
[02:07] <ddaa> jml: hey
[02:08] <poolie> hello ddaa, sabdfl
[02:09] <sabdfl> lifeless: no, i meant new uploads
[02:30] <bluefoxicy> Questions
[02:30] <bluefoxicy> 1)  Are bounties coming back
[02:30] <bluefoxicy> 2)  Are you going to have fund-bounties, i.e. I can contribute $50 and he can contribute $100 and someone in Europe can throw in 30euro and Paypal can convert it all to <target currency>
[02:31] <bluefoxicy> 3)  Multiple-person bounties and per-unit-work bounties, like if there's a major spec everyone who contributes N unit of work (decided on by a committee of independent developers of said project) gets a divy of the bounty, first-come first-serve
[02:50] <ddaa> well, since nobody is replying...
[02:51] <ddaa> bluefoxicy: I do not believe that any firm decision has been taken regarding bounties
[02:51] <ddaa> they are a complicated problem, technically, socially, and legally
[02:51] <bluefoxicy> ddaa:  nods.  Was gonna throw some stuff at them earlier to see if I could get some cash; now I'm thinking the other way.
[02:52] <lifeless> jamesh: ping
[02:52] <bluefoxicy> hehe, we could have a philosophical discussion on that I'm sure
[02:52] <ddaa> I'd like that, but I do not really know what I'm talking about, and I'm quite busy.
[02:52] <bluefoxicy> (although, strictly speaking, in the US you can make it someone's responsibility to file the money on their taxes; I get paid by LWN once in a while, no W2s)
[02:52] <bluefoxicy> nods, I wasn't serious :P
[02:53] <bluefoxicy> (although I do know someone who pays for college selling exploits.. I calculated at one time that the library he's got stocked up was worth about 3.8 million dollars o_o)
[02:54] <bluefoxicy> anyway, out.
[02:55] <ddaa> selling sploits a good business I guess
[02:56] <ddaa> the kiddies might get caught using them, but they'd rather take credit instead of admitting they just paid for them...
[03:01] <jml> ddaa: I guess it depends on the price of being caught.
[03:01] <ddaa> the thing is I really believe that the kind of people to buy this stuff would not admit to it
[03:02] <ddaa> and also, I'm not even sure selling sploits is illegal... though with the current crazy US laws, I would not be so sure...
[03:02] <ddaa> after all, it's very much educational material
[03:04] <ddaa> they might call it "a device to break into a locked property" and apply organized crime laws, or something insane like this
[03:07] <piedoggie> what are the advantages and disadvantages of using launch pad to host a project's bzr repository
[03:09] <ddaa> advantage: free, unlimited space, backups, better launchpad integration
[03:10] <piedoggie> I just filed a bug on feisty and it was really easy
[03:10] <ddaa> makes it easy to give write access to other people
[03:10] <piedoggie> very impressive
[03:10] <ddaa> disadvantage: creating new branches is still slow (need to upload all the branch contents)
[03:11] <ddaa> also, if launchpad goes down for some reason, it will take some work for people to upload their branches again to another place
[03:11] <ddaa> that's all
[03:11] <piedoggie> in other words, the only reason to stick with your own hosting is if you are a control freak.
[03:12] <ddaa> pretty much
[03:12] <ddaa> unless your project is big and you find the upload time for new branches too painful
[03:12] <piedoggie> I must admit I am a control freak and that I run my own mail server and mailing lists and web hosting just because I've been burned too many times by others.
[03:12] <ddaa> (but then we'll fix that, too)
[03:13] <piedoggie> But I've also been burned by source Forge and savanna
[03:13] <piedoggie> so I'm a little bit cautious trusting another "free" site
[03:13] <ddaa> the difference is that with bzr, you normally have a copy of your branches locally
[03:13] <piedoggie>  exactly
[03:13] <ddaa> unless you go out of your way, so you're not being locked down
[03:14] <piedoggie> I have my official branch out on launchpad, my private working branch that I control backups of on one server here, and then as many copies I need on internal machines
[03:14] <piedoggie> makes synchronization a bit of a pain but I can cope
[03:14] <ddaa> the big disadvantage of setting up a mirror branch instead of a hosted branch
[03:14] <ddaa> is that launchpad needs to poll the remote branch
[03:14] <ddaa> and there's no easy way yet to ask it to poll NOW.
[03:15] <piedoggie> actually there is
[03:15] <ddaa> hu...
[03:15] <ddaa> tell me...
[03:15] <piedoggie> you treat launchpad as your primary source so you pull and push from the primary image
[03:15] <thumper> ddaa: what are you doing up?
[03:15] <piedoggie> your authoritative local copy is a branch of the launchpad image
[03:15] <ddaa> right, in this case it's a hosted branch as far as launchpad is concerned
[03:16] <ddaa> matter of perspective
[03:16] <ddaa> thumper: fucked up my biorythms again
[03:16] <piedoggie> you use the local copy as the primary source for everyone else in your workgroup
[03:16] <ddaa> got work to do
[03:16] <piedoggie> thanks ddaa
[03:16] <thumper> piedoggie, don't do that
[03:16] <piedoggie> why not?
[03:17] <thumper> well, it's ok if all the other users are local to you
[03:17] <thumper> but what if they're not?
[03:17] <thumper> if you want the authoritive copy elsewhere, use a mirrored branch
[03:17] <piedoggie> But then don't we have a polling issue?
[03:17] <ddaa> thumper: I do not see the problem with doing it as he says
[03:17] <thumper> ddaa: as I said, if everyone is local, then its fine
[03:17] <piedoggie> Sorry, didn't mean to be controversial
[03:18] <thumper> piedoggie, don't worry, me and ddaa often have controversial chats
[03:18] <ddaa> he's a fucking kiwi-lime and I'm fucking froggy
[03:19] <thumper> ddaa: lack of sleep is inteferring with your language
[03:19] <ddaa> not lacking sleep, woke up at 2pm
[03:19] <piedoggie> I was proposing two levels of star networks style feeds
[03:19] <ajmitch> it's entertaining, though
[03:19] <ddaa> one hour earlier than yesterday
[03:19] <piedoggie> ddaa, you sound like Miss Piggy (for a rude analogy)
[03:20] <thumper> here's an idea ddaa, set the alarm for 10am and go to bed now
[03:20] <thumper> that'll sort you out
[03:20] <thumper> otherwise you might miss the lp meeting
[03:20] <piedoggie> *and* sit in a really bright sunlight first thing in the morning
[03:20] <piedoggie> treat your sleep pattern as jet lag
[03:20] <ajmitch> trying to find bright sunlight here could be a slight problem
[03:21] <ddaa> I spend too much time on IRC
[03:21] <piedoggie> working in the bunker again?
[03:21] <thumper> ddaa: *no*...
[03:21] <ddaa> people get the idea that I have the time to sit in bright sunlight...
[03:21] <piedoggie> A window will do
[03:21] <thumper> ddaa: and the normal term is kiwifruit not a kiwi-lime
[03:22] <piedoggie> as will very bright full spectrum light bulbs
[03:22] <ddaa> pah, you spent 8 years in London
[03:22] <ddaa> you've some some lime now
[03:22] <thumper> or if you listen to the marketing, zespri
[03:22] <thumper> ddaa: so what's a whole lime?
[03:23] <ddaa> someone who's born in UK?
[03:23] <thumper> really?
[03:23] <thumper> odd, we just called them poms
[03:23] <ddaa> thumper: call SteveA "limey", he'll answer you
[03:23] <piedoggie> the only Kiwi I now is someone who lived around the world and goes by the name of warthog
[03:24] <thumper> not *gasp* "the warthog"
[03:24] <piedoggie> not sure.  He used to do web design
[03:24] <thumper> no really, I have no idea who you're talking about
[03:25] <piedoggie> that's okay.  So it won't mean anything when I tell you he has two children and to commemorate the birth of his second child, I wrote a story about her
[03:25] <ddaa> piedoggie: "warthog" is folk slang for "Canonical employee"...
[03:25] <ddaa> that's an origins tale...
[03:27] <piedoggie> have you ever looked up the definition of canonical?  I would say as an adjective, two of them fit
[03:28] <ddaa> 2 : conforming to a general rule or acceptable procedure
[03:28] <ddaa> 4 : reduced to the canonical form <a canonical matrix> 
[03:29] <ddaa> Right?
[03:29] <piedoggie> yes.
[03:29] <ddaa> Did not realize about the first one before.
[03:29] <ddaa> I thought it was only about the second one, and the various ways it's overused in techno jargon
[03:30] <piedoggie> Although, I like to think This one works as well: conforming to orthodox or recognized rules; "the drinking of
[03:30] <piedoggie>         cocktails was as canonical a rite as the mixing"- Sinclair
[03:30] <piedoggie>         Lewis [syn: canonic, sanctioned] 
[03:31] <piedoggie> and as much as we love to ping on marketing folks are having buzzwords that are overused into zero content, we are no better
[03:31] <jml> ddaa: which dictionary are you looking at?
[03:31] <piedoggie> http://dict.die.net/canonical/
[03:32] <piedoggie> now here's the problem I would love to see someone solve but I haven't quite figured out how to do it either.
[03:33] <ddaa> jml: http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/canonical
[03:33] <piedoggie> I lose keys.  It doesn't matter how many times it back them up, I forget passphrases, lose copies, find old ones when I'v switch to the new one.  It just is not fun
[03:33] <piedoggie> when you want keys to work in a matrix of machines, the problem gets worse
[03:34] <piedoggie> I would love to have some sort of authentication system that could query a two factor ID system on my laptop (token plus passphrase, a single passphrase) and decide whether to permit me entrance to a system
[03:35] <ddaa> piedoggie: I think you are being wildly offtopic
[03:35] <piedoggie> because without something like this, I am destined to re-create and redistribute keys on a quarterly basis.  I can no longer have a PGP key because all of my e-mail addresses are registered on the key servers
[03:35] <piedoggie>  maybe I am but here's why it's appropriate
[03:35] <piedoggie> keys are used to access launch pad
[03:36] <piedoggie> accessing launchpad for multiple machines means you have to have the same private key distributed over multiple machines
[03:36] <ddaa> hu?
[03:36] <piedoggie>  let's say you have five machines
[03:36] <ddaa> you mean for bugmail that needs gpg-signed emails?
[03:36] <piedoggie> all accessing launchpad for our repository
[03:37] <ddaa> I'm not even sure it requires that...
[03:37] <piedoggie> that's what the instructions told me
[03:37] <ddaa> for branches you only need ssh keys
[03:37] <piedoggie>  right
[03:37] <piedoggie>  but for every machine you wish to access launch pad from, you have to have the same private key or replicate the registration process for every machine
[03:37] <ddaa> the solution some people use is to carry their key on a usb dongle
[03:38] <ddaa> and never copy it on the hard drive
[03:38] <piedoggie> that works in some circumstances
[03:38] <piedoggie> I should warn you I've lost dongles and their content (not necessarily at the same time)
[03:38] <piedoggie> yes, I'm a walking disaster zone.  I have broken more products than I care to think about.  :-)
[03:39] <piedoggie> I have made product managers cry
[03:39] <piedoggie> the USB drive works fine if I'm connecting via my laptop.  Let's say I'm using to other machines either of which I can gain physical access to
[03:40] <piedoggie> I don't expect a solution.  It's just one of the classic logistics problems when using cryptographic keys for authentication
[03:40] <ddaa> you can probably use a signing agent in those cases
[03:40] <ddaa> never done it, but it probably exists
[03:40] <ddaa> just forward the signing to your local system
[03:41] <ddaa> tests passed, back to coding
[03:41] <piedoggie> across address translation firewalls?  ssh-agent works really well but not across security perimeters 
[03:41] <piedoggie> I'll take this question to the openssh folks and see what they have to say.  It's an interesting problem
[03:42] <piedoggie> thank you again for your help
[03:42] <piedoggie> with the decision on launch pad
[04:00] <Ubugtu> New bug: #86248 in loggerhead "Loggerhead cannot view any commit that had a binary file in it (dup-of: 91686)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86248
[04:08] <lifeless> piedoggie: ssh -A
[04:09] <piedoggie> yes.  I know about agent
[04:09] <lifeless> thats agent forwarding, not just agent
[04:09] <lifeless> it solves 'Let's say I'm using to other machines either of which I can gain physical access to'
[04:09] <piedoggie> if you need to access your machine a, b, and c is
[04:09] <piedoggie> sorry, speech recognition errors
[04:09] <piedoggie> I knew about agent forwarding.  I use it all the time
[04:10] <lifeless> jamesh: ping
[04:10] <jamesh> lifeless: pong
[04:10] <piedoggie> it's but if you that three machines all independent from one another, how do you manage keys?
[04:10] <lifeless> jamesh: can you please please please please rollout the pending reviews patch today ?
[04:10] <piedoggie> uptake is up with the openssh folks and report back
[04:11] <lifeless> piedoggie: I dont see independence mattering, but I may just not understand
[04:11] <piedoggie> that's okay.  I'll try to generate a better description of the problem for when I report back
[04:11] <lifeless> jamesh: also, how is marks branch coming along?
[04:12] <lifeless> jamesh: I'm pinging you about that as we agreed on Monday
[04:26] <jamesh> lifeless: okay.  new pending-reviews code rolled out.  I haven't finished Mark's branch yet.
[04:27] <lifeless> jamesh: Thanks!. How far through do you think you are ?
[04:31] <lifeless> back in an hour
[04:31] <jamesh> lifeless: about a third of the way
[04:33] <lifeless> spiv: dont forget - two reviews to do today!
[04:33] <lifeless> jamesh: ok, keep at it!
[05:30] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92435 in launchpad-bazaar "codebrowse search returns "500 Internal error"" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92435
[06:50] <LaserJock> kiko: you around?
[06:52] <lifeless> LaserJock: wrong time for kiko, late in his evening
[06:52] <LaserJock> lifeless: yeah, I'm roughly the same TZ, but usually he's kiko-zzz or something when he's asleep
[06:53] <lifeless> k
[07:40] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92443 in launchpad "Clicking "Choose..." doesn't do anything in Safari" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92443
[08:17] <indraveni> kiko, hi
[08:41] <stub> thumper: Is the only reason Branch.visibility exists for performance? If so, you are prematurely optimizing
[08:43] <stub> And I'd rather not have it denormalized unless we can demonstrate it is actually a problem
[08:45] <carlos> morning
[08:51] <thumper> stub: it makes the queries much more simple, and makes branch access checks not look at either the product or project
[08:52] <thumper> I'd say code simplicity is a good reason
[08:52] <thumper> simplicity and clarity
[08:52] <stub> Not for breaking db normalization, and I don't think it will make the code or queries simpler (the one I'm looking at now for you is more complex because of it!)
[09:21] <mdke> carlos: hiya! kubuntu-docs is still on the old templates. Is that likely to be fixed soon? There is lots to translate so we want the translators to get going asap
[09:21] <carlos> yeah, I will try to have it done today, I was waiting for the import queue to be cleared a bit more
[09:23] <mdke> I hope that the latest feisty package has all the templates, if not we may have to upload them manually
[09:23] <carlos> ok, I will ping you once I do that so you can check it, but I guess is just a matter of having the list of templates you already gave me, right?
[09:24] <mdke> carlos: hope so! And for ubuntu-docs there are still a few templates missing
[09:26] <carlos> mdke: right
[09:46] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92456 in malone "Apport should be able to add tags to new bug reports" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92456
[09:53] <mdke> carlos: I need another favour - can you remove the template "switching" in ubuntu-docs, it's my mistake
[09:53] <carlos> mdke: sure
[09:54] <carlos> mdke: done
[09:54] <mdke> carlos: thanks a lot
[09:55] <carlos> mdke: btw, how's that you didn't upload .po files?
[09:55] <carlos> mdke: are all those templates completely new?
[09:57] <mdke> carlos: yeah. Some of them have old strings from the old "desktopguide" template
[09:57] <carlos> I see
[09:57] <mdke> we kinda split things up into lots of templates
[09:58] <carlos> I know that, but I was expecting more translation reusing
[09:58] <carlos> that's all
[09:58] <mdke> carlos: I don't know how.
[09:58] <carlos> mdke: If it's just a split
[09:59] <carlos> taking old desktopguide's .po files and doing msgmerge with hte new set of .pot files would give you .po files reusing everything that is already translated so translators doesn't need to do that manually based on suggestions in Rosetta
[10:00] <mdke> I guess it's possible to do a script which could do that
[10:00] <carlos> yep
[10:01] <mdke> can you tell me what the exact msgmerge command would be?
[10:06] <mdke> gtg to work, will try and grab you later
[10:26] <carlos> mdke: sorry, my dsl went down
[10:27] <carlos> >carlos< msgmerge old_pofile.po newtemplate.pot -o new_template_pofile.po
[10:27] <carlos>  old_pofile.po are the Edgy desktopguide's .po file
[10:27] <carlos>  newtemplate.pot is one of the new templates for Feisty
[10:27] <carlos>  and new_template_pofile.po will be the output with the list of messages that are reused from Edgy
[10:27] <carlos>  mdke: you don't need a new ubuntu-docs upload, give me a tarball with hte same layout you use inside ubuntu-docs and I will import it manually
[10:27] <carlos>  same for kubuntu-docs
[11:12] <pochu> mrevell: https://beta.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-es :-)
[11:12] <pochu> mrevell: thanks!
[11:13] <mrevell> pochu: Hey! Did kiko help you out?
[11:13] <pochu> mrevell: yep, and matsubara :)
[11:13] <mrevell> pochu: Excellent, my thanks to both of them. 
[11:14] <mrevell> pochu: Glad it's all sorted.
[11:14] <pochu> yep :)
[11:26] <statik> moin
[12:09] <bac> morning statik 
[12:09] <statik> hi bac!
[12:11] <LaserJock> doh!
[12:12] <LaserJock> stupid US time zone change
[12:16] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: What has it done now?
[12:16] <LaserJock> I got up at 4am local time for the Launchpad meeting
[12:17] <LaserJock> but I think I'm an hour early
[12:17] <Fujitsu> You are.
[12:17] <Fujitsu> A little unfortunate.
[12:18] <LaserJock> and I went to bed at 12am :/
[12:18] <LaserJock> oh well
[12:25] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92484 in launchpad-bazaar "Support for Branch Format 6" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92484
[12:27] <SteveA> hi LaserJock
[12:27] <SteveA> Launchpad meeting is in about 30 mins
[12:27] <LaserJock> hi SteveA 
[12:27] <SteveA> we'll probably have the next meeting a couple of hours later
[12:27] <LaserJock> yeah, PST -> PDT killed me
[12:28] <LaserJock> that'd be awesome for me
[12:28] <SteveA> as we have a lot more of the launchpad team in westerly timezones now
[12:36] <bac> in rocketfuel the top-level makefile specifies PYTHON_VERSION=2.4.  feisty only installs 2.5.  building LP fails due since it can't find the 2.4 header files.  
[12:36] <bac> is the correct solution to change the makefile to point to 2.5 or to install 2.4?
[12:37] <Fujitsu> bac: I'd like to see you try to run Zope on 2.5.
[12:37] <Fujitsu> (you'll need 2.4)
[12:37] <bac> ok
[12:37] <bac> haven't gotten to the running part, just trying to build still.  thanks for the heads-up!  
[12:38] <bac> 2.4 it is
[12:38] <jamesh> bac: sounds like the launchpad-dependencies package needs updating
[12:39] <bac> ah, i've got python2.4 but not python2.4-dev
[12:42] <bac> jamesh: yep, launchpad-dependencies only depends on python-dev.  needs to be changed to python2.4-dev
[12:42] <jamesh> bac: I'm filing a bug now, and will assign it to Etienne
[12:43] <bac> thanks!
[12:43] <Fujitsu> That's not still our problem, is it? (ie. it's out of Ubuntu repos?)
[12:43] <jamesh> Fujitsu: we have a separate apt repo that has some packages that depend on all the required stuff
[12:43] <jamesh> Fujitsu: so it is a Canonical problem rather than an Ubuntu problem
[12:44] <Fujitsu> I know it used to be in multiverse.
[12:44] <jamesh> yeah
[12:45] <jamesh> didn't really make sense there
[12:45] <jamesh> both from the perspective of the intended audience, and the process for rolling out updates
[12:46] <bac> jamesh: where does one file a bug against launchpad-dependencies?
[12:47] <jamesh> bac: against launchpad-development-infrastructure
[12:47] <bac> thanks
[12:47] <jamesh> bac: assign them to Etienne
[12:47] <bac> ok
[12:50] <stub> Launchpad meeting 10 mins
[12:56] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92487 in launchpad-development-infrastructure "updates required for launchpad-dependencies package" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92487
[01:00] <kiko> oi
[01:00] <kiko> me
[01:00] <kiko> up to date
[01:00] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92490 in malone "Commment should be comment" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92490
[01:00] <kiko> didn't start work on +translate this week yet
[01:00] <barry-away> morning
[01:00] <jamesh> kiko: slow down
[01:01] <kiko> DONE: landed popup, fixing bug 42480, cleaning up trees, code reviews
[01:01] <kiko> etc
[01:01] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 42480 in malone "Report a bug about product that doesn't use Malone should include link to product's official bug tracker" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/42480 - Assigned to Christian Reis (kiko)
[01:01] <danilos> kiko: haha
[01:01] <statik> kiko: I need some of whatever you are drinking
[01:01] <kiko> here, have some
[01:01] <kiko> hey Hobbsee 
[01:01] <carlos> hmm
[01:02] <stub> Launchpad meeting!
[01:02] <jamesh> it probably contains some additive that is only found in the Amazon
[01:02] <carlos> btw, weren't we supposed to change the meeting time?
[01:02] <stub> Who is here? SteveA said he was probably going to be late
[01:02] <spiv> me
[01:02] <carlos> me
[01:02] <mpt> me
[01:02] <BjornT> me
[01:02] <bac> me
[01:02] <danilos> me
[01:02] <kiko> ME
[01:02] <cprov> me
[01:02] <salgado> me
[01:02] <matsubara> me
[01:02] <sinzui> me
[01:02] <jamesh> me
[01:02] <kiko> barry-away, utc+dst = utc
[01:02] <barry-away> carlos: SteveA said no change for this week
[01:03] <carlos> oh, I didn't see that part
[01:03] <statik> me
[01:03] <jamesh> have we updated Launchpad's timezone database for the US changes?
[01:03] <mrevell> me
[01:03] <flacoste> me
[01:03] <kiko> jamesh, no!
[01:03] <barr1> kiko: i meant utc + dst =? wtf time am i supposed to wake up for this thing :)
[01:03] <stub> jamesh: US dst changes have been in there for over a year I believe
[01:03] <SteveA> hi
[01:03] <SteveA> I' here now
[01:03] <sinzui> barr1: sleep gives yo cancer
[01:03] <poolie> me
[01:04] <stub> me
[01:04] <barr1> sinzui: sleep is a corportists plot
[01:04] <poolie> /nick very special guest
[01:04] <jamesh> barr1: daylight saving snuck up on us over here, and started 12 days after being finalised: first time in 15 years
[01:04] <kiko> hey poolie!
[01:04] <kiko> nice bzr packet
[01:04] <Fujitsu> jamesh: I love the WA government.
[01:04] <poolie> thanks kiko
[01:04] <stub> = Agenda ==   * Roll call  * Agenda  * Next meeting  * Activity reports  * Actions from last meeting  * Oops report (Matsubara)  * Bug report (mpt)  * Bug tags  * Production and staging (Stuart)  * Launchpad 1.0 status reports  * Sysadmin requests ----  * Upgrade bzr and run bzr upgrade on working trees. (SteveA)  * Next meeting at 14:00 UTC (SteveA)  * A top user-affecting issue (mrevell)  * Launchpad buzz report (mrevell)  * (other it
[01:05] <kiko> mrevell, are you going to mention the war against font sizes? :)
[01:05] <stub> I have no idea if we are missing people - too many new people (!)
[01:05] <kiko> where's bigjools 
[01:05] <mrevell> kiko: I was planning to raise it, yes :)
[01:05] <kiko> or tom?
[01:05] <bigjools> here :)
[01:05] <kiko> is thumper around?
[01:05] <stub> We are missing ddaa - anyone from the bzr/lp group?
[01:06] <cprov> bigjools: yay, say ME ;)
[01:06] <kiko> stub, well, poolie's here
[01:06] <lifeless> I have an item for other stuff, but I'll be asleep by the time you get to it. The item is, 'admin requests should go to the answer tracker'. I'm seeing a lot of 'please delete my account' requests, and the users are saying the FAQ tells them to contact an admin. Now we have answers, this is wrong.
[01:06] <kiko> jml?
[01:06] <jamesh> thumper CC'd me on his 3 sentances
[01:06] <jamesh> if ddaa doesn't make it
[01:06] <kiko> lifeless, afaik I get a lot of tracker items for me
[01:06] <kiko> to clean up stuff
[01:06] <stub> Next meeting: Still underdiscussion by SteveA I believe, so stay tuned.
[01:07] <poolie> stub: i'll act in the role of bzr/lp contact
[01:07] <lifeless> kiko: I've had 4 emails in the last 3 work days
[01:07] <SteveA> stub: there is an agenda item about the next meeting
[01:07] <kiko> youre popular
[01:07] <lifeless> kiko: or is that 3 in 5, something like that.
[01:07] <lifeless> kiko: in deed.
[01:07] <stub> Activity reports: Who is cool, who isn't?
[01:07] <SteveA> 1400 UTC next thursday
[01:07] <kiko> me cool
[01:07] <stub> me cool
[01:07] <mrevell> stub: I'm slack and will catch up after meeting.
[01:07] <spiv> me cool
[01:07] <cprov> me cool
[01:07] <matsubara> me cool
[01:07] <statik> I'm behind, will catch up after the meeting
[01:07] <jamesh> I'm behind
[01:07] <bac> cool
[01:07] <lifeless> kiko: anyhow, I think the FAQ needs updating, because emailing lp admins direct is *not* the right ting to tell people to do.
[01:07] <BjornT> up to date
[01:08] <lifeless> ciao, gnight.
[01:08] <flacoste> cool
[01:08] <barr1> cool
[01:08] <bigjools> cool
[01:08] <sinzui> cool
[01:08] <SteveA> crap
[01:08] <danilos> cool
[01:08] <danilos> (though batched cool ;))
[01:08] <kiko> lifeless, I don't particularly have a problem with it -- it's stuff i need to do anyway
[01:08] <stub> carlos, SteveA, kiko?
[01:09] <kiko> what stub?
[01:09] <carlos> I'm behind
[01:09] <stub> activity
[01:09] <mpt> up to date
[01:09] <SteveA> 12:07 < kiko> me cool
[01:09] <SteveA> 12:08 < SteveA> crap
[01:09] <lifeless> kiko: I dont have a problem with tracker items. I have a problem with people emailing me directly.
[01:09] <stub> Hmm... this agenda is old. I was fine last week I think.
[01:09] <lifeless> kiko: because it puts burden on one member, not on the team.
[01:09] <stub> SteveA and jamesh repeat offenders
[01:09] <mpt> stub, I forgot to update that section, sorry
[01:09] <kiko> lifeless, I'm the only one that does anything about them anyway!
[01:09] <lifeless> kiko: because when I'm busy or travelling they will get a low quality of service.
[01:09] <salgado> cool
[01:10] <lifeless> kiko: you dont do anything for the ones that *email me*.
[01:10] <lifeless> kiko: which is exactly my point.
[01:10] <kiko> lifeless, those simply don't get done at all :-)
[01:10] <stub>  * Actions from last meeting
[01:10] <kiko> I'm trolling, silly
[01:10] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92492 in launchpad "Resources should probably be served with no last-modified date and a content based etag" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92492
[01:10] <stub>  * '''SteveA''' to talk with '''mpt''' and '''stub''' about changing the time of the Launchpad meeting
[01:10] <stub> I think that is either done or still underway
[01:10] <kiko> lol
[01:11] <kiko> are there any other possibilities? :)
[01:11] <SteveA> stub: done.
[01:11] <stub>  * '''jamesh''' and '''BjornT''' to agree on a proper fix to the problem of unregistered subscribers to imported bug reports
[01:11] <jamesh> gar.  I didn't send out the email.  But we did agree
[01:11] <stub> ACTION ITEM: Email to be sent describing agreed fix to the problem of unregistered subscribers to imported bug reports
[01:12] <stub>  * Oops report (Matsubara)
[01:12] <matsubara> Today's oops report is about bugs 86171 and 92164
[01:12] <Ubugtu> Bug 86171 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/86171 is private
[01:12] <matsubara> Both private bugs.
[01:12] <matsubara> SteveA: bug 92164 is assigned to you. Bjorn reported it, but couldn't reproduce locally anymore, today we had a oops with a similar traceback as Bjorn's one. Could you take a look?..
[01:12] <Ubugtu> Bug 92164 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/92164 is private
[01:12] <matsubara> spiv: good progress in bug 86171?
[01:12] <SteveA> matsubara: yes, I'm working on it
[01:12] <spiv> matsubara: well, I figured out the bug that was stopping me from writing a test case.
[01:12] <matsubara> cool, thanks SteveA 
[01:12] <spiv> Or rather, the weird behaviour, not exactly a bug.
[01:13] <kiko> why is my nick blue!?
[01:13] <lifeless> kiko: so, I'm really gone now. ciao
[01:13] <kiko> lifeless, can't take a troll eh? night!
[01:13] <matsubara> spiv: right, so a fix for it is underway?
[01:13] <spiv> Yes, it's underway.
[01:13] <matsubara> cool, thanks spiv.
[01:13] <matsubara> I'm done stub
[01:14] <kiko> I want to point out that matsubara is studying to be a ninja
[01:14] <stub>  * Bug report (mpt)
[01:14] <kiko> so if you don't fix his bugs it is likely he can kill you
[01:14] <kiko> be forewarned
[01:14] <mpt> There are 2195 known bugs in Launchpad without released fixes. The first seven of them by importance are:
[01:14] <mpt>  * Bug #30602 (Timeout errors in +translate), Critical, In Progress, kiko
[01:14] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 30602 in rosetta "Timeout errors in +translate" [Critical,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/30602 - Assigned to Christian Reis (kiko)
[01:14] <mpt> kiko, now that we're no longer swamped by other timeouts, did you measure the effect of danilos' change that you mentioned last week?
 didn't start work on +translate this week yet
[01:14] <kiko> we did see improvements, yes
[01:14] <kiko> we're down to about 100 timeouts a day
[01:15] <mpt> That's an improvement? ouch
[01:15] <mpt>  * Bug #46982 (Need to support KDE like plural forms), Critical, Confirmed, danilos
[01:15] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46982 in rosetta "Need to support KDE like plural forms" [Critical,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/46982 - Assigned to   (danilo)
[01:15] <kiko> and I think it's now at the point where we can do a small improvement to fix things
[01:15] <mpt> danilos, any progress on this since you've taken it over from carlos?
[01:15] <kiko> it used to be around 500 a day
[01:15] <danilos> mpt: not really, carlos has been busy with feisty opening, which means his firefox work was delayed
[01:15] <mpt> kiko, ok, that is an improvement, thanks for the update
[01:16] <mpt> danilos, so you're waiting for carlos to finish the Firefox work?
[01:16] <mpt>  * Bug #84326 (/+search, /products, /people, etc obscure search field and should have tabs), Critical, In Progress, mpt
[01:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 84326 in launchpad "/+search, /products, /people, etc obscure search field and should have tabs" [Critical,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84326 - Assigned to Matthew Paul Thomas (mpt)
[01:16] <carlos> yep
[01:16] <mpt> I'm working on this, a bit delayed by Feisty etc, but I'll get it done over the next couple of days.
[01:16] <carlos> mpt: he's blocked on me right now
[01:16] <mpt> ok
[01:17] <mpt>  * Bug #85519 (Appserver leaving 'IDLE in transaction' connection open on launch), Critical, Confirmed, stub
[01:17] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 85519 in launchpad "Appserver leaving 'IDLE in transaction' connection open on launch" [High,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85519 - Assigned to Stuart Bishop (stub)
[01:17] <mpt> stub, anything to report?
[01:17] <mpt>  * Bug #86171 (private), which matsubara already mentioned
[01:17] <Ubugtu> Bug 86171 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/86171 is private
[01:17] <stub> As you can see, the status has changed and the priorty lowered
[01:18] <SteveA> I have a question
[01:18] <mpt> ... in the past 15 minutes :-) I love it when that happens
[01:18] <mpt>  * Bug #90384 (private), Critical, Confirmed, jamesh
[01:18] <Ubugtu> Bug 90384 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/90384 is private
[01:18] <SteveA> if a bugfix lands on beta, is that "fix released"?
[01:18] <kiko> mpt, well, you could omit the status and just wait for Ubugtu 
[01:18] <mpt> jamesh, any progress on that this week?
[01:18] <kiko> SteveA, no, it's fix committed.
[01:18] <SteveA> I think we should define "lands on beta" as fix released
[01:18] <stub> mpt: More like the last 15 seconds :)
[01:18] <mpt> SteveA, only if the bug only ever occurred in beta.
[01:18] <jamesh> mpt: nope.  I'll look at it in the coming week
[01:19] <mpt> Otherwise people experiencing the bug on production won't find it when they search.
[01:19] <SteveA> as anyone using the bug tracker to look into a launchpad bug is probably using beta anyway
[01:19] <jamesh> mpt: that's what product series targetting should give us
[01:19] <mpt> SteveA, from the past week I think that the branch-specific bugs are about 50% production-only, 50% beta-only
[01:20] <mpt> and finally
[01:20] <mpt> Bug #44 (Translations should be searchable), High, Confirmed, danilos
[01:20] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 44 in rosetta "Translations should be searchable" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/44 - Assigned to   (danilo)
[01:20] <Kmos> :)
[01:20] <danilos> need to clear up with stub if I can start working on that
[01:20] <mpt> danilos, are you able to start on that while waiting for carlos to do the Firefox stuff? :-)
[01:20] <Kmos> that is an important bug
[01:21] <stub> We can start looking at that now
[01:21] <carlos> yeah, with new postgres it should be unblocked
[01:21] <danilos> mpt: I sure am, if postgres 8.2 upgrade went smoothly
[01:21] <kiko> carlos, danilos: have you ever managed to use google to search translations?
[01:21] <danilos> mpt: so, based on above comments, yes :)
[01:21] <stub> But I think it needs someone (me probably) to do experiments with the new tsearch first, and if me not i the next few weeks.
[01:21] <mpt> SteveA, but that's just my impression from being subscribed to launchpad-bugs
[01:21] <danilos> kiko: just for *some* things (i.e. it didn't index everything)
[01:22] <carlos> kiko: I did a couple of tries, and it's not too user friendly, but, it works
[01:22] <mpt> kiko, we now have a bug reported about Google searching of translations disclosing people's e-mail addresses. Unintended consequences...
[01:22] <kiko> carlos, can you find me an example?
[01:22] <Kmos> kiko: google are slowly to update translations
[01:22] <mpt> danilos, that's excellent news
[01:22] <stub> mpt: Done?
[01:22] <mpt> That's all SteveA, thanks
[01:22] <Kmos> if i need to change yesterday translation
[01:22] <mpt> or stub, even
[01:22] <carlos> kiko: the main problem is the mix of pofile +translations and person +translations
[01:23] <stub>  * Bug tags
[01:23] <kiko> mpt, even when people have chosen not to disclose them? that's a bug.
[01:23] <stub> carlos, kiko: Other channel or later please
[01:23] <SteveA> motu
[01:23] <danilos> mpt: as for email disclosing, I think that's what KDE and GNOME (well, I am certain about them :) status pages do as well
[01:23] <kiko> carlos, ship me a URL
[01:23] <kiko> SteveA, +1
[01:23] <SteveA> the motu tag has been proposed
[01:23] <SteveA> meaning "Particularly affecting MOTU work "
[01:23] <kiko> I am +1 on it, if only because it will help LaserJock coordinate with us
[01:23] <SteveA> examples:
[01:24] <SteveA> https://beta.launchpad.net/malone/+bug/79671
[01:24] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 79671 in malone "Allow +filebug?field.tags=... URLs for pre-setting tags" [High,Fix committed]   - Assigned to Bjrn Tillenius (bjornt)
[01:24] <kiko> yeah
[01:24] <SteveA> https://beta.launchpad.net/malone/+bug/3797
[01:24] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 3797 in malone "Bug mails should explain why the person is getting emailed." [High,Confirmed]   - Assigned to Bjrn Tillenius (bjornt)
[01:24] <LaserJock> \o/
[01:24] <SteveA> I'm +1
[01:24] <stub> Any neighs?
[01:24] <BjornT> i think i motu tag would be good.
[01:24] <cprov> +1
[01:24] <danilos> who will be using those tags except the MOTU team?
[01:24] <SteveA> I think the tag name is sufficently concise and descriptive
[01:25] <bigjools> neighs?  we have horses here?
[01:25] <SteveA> danilos: launchpad management
[01:25] <SteveA> danilos: in setting priorities etc.
[01:25] <kiko> errr
[01:25] <kiko> why is google indexing edge?
[01:25] <kiko> stub, SteveA: should edge be indexed?
[01:25] <stub> kiko: That would be a missing robots.txt and a bug
[01:25] <kiko> aieeee
[01:25] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92497 in launchpad "Need a test to ensure Launchpad actually starts up" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92497
[01:25] <SteveA> googlhttps://edge.launchpad.net/robots.txt
[01:25] <danilos> SteveA: ok, then I am not a negative for 'motu' tag
[01:26] <SteveA> motu tag is accepted
[01:26] <stub>  * Production and staging (Stuart)
[01:26] <stub> Production db has been happy. No more crashes, further increasing my suspicion that the crashes where triggered by bulk tsearch2 updates. I will test on Carbon when I have more time.
[01:26] <stub> Production db load is nearly half what it was before the migration.
[01:26] <stub> Next step on quick-and-easy performance enhancements is to switch our tsearch2 indexes from GIST to GIN, which means slower inserts but much faster reads.
[01:26] <stub> Beta went down for a short while because I committed some code affecting startup without testing it locally. We will add a test to stop this happening again if it isn't too traumatic (Bug 92497)
[01:26] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 92497 in launchpad "Need a test to ensure Launchpad actually starts up" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92497
[01:26] <stub> edge will soon become another beta branch, with restrictions, for SteveA to do some testing.
[01:26] <stub> staging updates have been disabled to test a patch from salgado. Just waiting on the code to exist.
[01:26] <SteveA> I'll talk to the admins about robots.txt on edge
[01:26] <stub> Tom Haddon has started as ops admin. We should get him to these meetings once the time is more US friendly.
[01:26] <stub> ACTION ITEM: Steve Alexander: I'll talk to the admins about robots.txt on edge
[01:26] <danilos> stub: what's the status of bug 90309 in relation to production? is it fix released?
[01:26] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 90309 in launchpad "poexport-queue.txt test disabled" [High,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90309 - Assigned to   (danilo)
[01:26] <kiko> thanks SteveA 
[01:27] <stub> danilos: Not really, but I'll close that bug anyway.
[01:27] <SteveA> kiko: spads is seeing to it right away
[01:27] <danilos> stub: ok, thanks
[01:27] <SteveA> stub: completed alrady
[01:27] <stub> Any prod queries, or moving on?
[01:28] <stub> 5
[01:28] <stub> 4
[01:28] <stub> 3
[01:28] <stub> 1
[01:28] <stub>  * Launchpad 1.0 status reports
[01:28] <BjornT> Malone 1.0:
[01:28] <BjornT> malone-essential-docs: No progress since last week. bjornt still to send an e-mail to matthew r describing what information the different sections should contain in more detail.
[01:28] <flacoste> AnswerTracker: all 1.0 stuff completed, tt-db-rename in stub's review queue to land once database patch freeze is over, tt-rename-url is waiting for roll-out of beta to production.
[01:28] <mpt> UI 1.0: Nothing major this week, just bug fixes.
[01:29] <danilos> Rosetta 1.0 weekly report: firefox import/export: no progress, oo import/exportnot started, essential docs not started, TranslationImportContinuityThreshold not started, UI stuff: bug 79674 (small progress), helptexts (in progress, https://launchpad.canonical.com/RosettaTemplatesThatNeedHelp)
[01:29] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 79674 in rosetta "List translatable upstreams on separate page, sample on front page" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/79674 - Assigned to   (danilo)
[01:30] <cprov> Soyuz 1.0: nothing special apart of normal bug fixing, nascentupload-cataclysm and custom-processor-consolidation pending-review.
[01:30] <stub> That everyone?
[01:30] <stub> Nothing from bzr this week looks like
[01:31] <stub>  * Sysadmin requests
[01:31] <jamesh> ddaa prepares it, and he isn't here
[01:31] <SteveA> why isn't ddaa here?
[01:31] <jamesh> I don't know
[01:31] <SteveA> spiv: are you here?
[01:31] <SteveA> jml: ?
[01:31] <SteveA> thumper: ?
[01:31] <stub> I should have got a european to call ddaa
[01:31] <SteveA> there should be someone here from the launchpad-bzr team
[01:32] <SteveA> I'll call ddaa now
[01:32] <spiv> I am here.
[01:32] <poolie> SteveA: i'll do that, what 
[01:32] <poolie> oh, or spiv can
[01:32] <SteveA> kiko, stub: https://edge.launchpad.net/robots.txt  <--- fixxed
[01:33] <spiv> But I don't have a report prepared about bazaar.
[01:33] <SteveA> mpt: do we need to ask google to re-index edge now?
[01:33] <stub> I think we see if ddaa can get here
[01:33] <SteveA> spiv: ok, we'll ask ddaa to email it later.
[01:33] <kiko> thanks SteveA xxx
[01:33] <poolie> SteveA: what do you want to know about bzr?
[01:33] <SteveA> poolie: about launchpad-bazaar
[01:33] <SteveA> but, all 1.0 goals are complete
[01:33] <SteveA> so we can move on
[01:33] <stub> No sysadmin requests
[01:33] <stub>  * Upgrade bzr and run bzr upgrade on working trees. (SteveA)
[01:33] <jamesh> SteveA: googlebot checks the robots.txt about once a day
[01:34] <poolie> briefly: tim is working on private branches so that launchpad users can use more features
[01:34] <poolie> jml some bits and pieces; jamesh on codebrowse
[01:34] <mpt> SteveA, I don't know
[01:34] <carlos> wow, we will be able to sue launchpad services to develop launchpad (finally!)
[01:34] <carlos> s/sue/use/
[01:34] <carlos> :-P
[01:35] <SteveA> ok
[01:35] <SteveA> so, everyone
[01:35] <SteveA> please upgrade to the latest bzr available in the lpdebs apt repository
[01:35] <SteveA> which is...
[01:35] <Kmos> SteveA: with this
[01:35] <Kmos> User-agent: *
[01:35] <Kmos> Disallow: /
[01:35] <SteveA> Bazaar (bzr) 0.15.0candidate2
[01:35] <Kmos> it works for all search engines
[01:35] <SteveA> and then run:
[01:35] <SteveA>   bzr upgrade
[01:35] <SteveA> inside any working trees you use
[01:35] <Kmos> dont need the other ones
[01:36] <ddaa> hullo
[01:36] <SteveA> then notice if
[01:36] <SteveA> 1. there are any problems
[01:36] <SteveA> or
[01:36] <SteveA> 2. there are any speed increases
[01:36] <jamesh> Kmos: the other ones allow those crawlers to use the site
[01:36] <SteveA> and report back to poolie, cc launchpad list about it
[01:36] <SteveA> it's worth reporting even if there are no problems
[01:36] <poolie> thanks very much
[01:36] <carlos> SteveA: I guess we should do a push first to prevent any data lose...
[01:36] <barr1> can we run bzr upgrade once in a repo?
[01:36] <SteveA> and if there is no speed increase
[01:36] <spiv> barr1: it's per working tree
[01:36] <poolie> this is a big milestone for us, and hopefully you'll like the speedup
[01:36] <SteveA> we hope for no problems, and a speed increase.
[01:36] <Kmos> jamesh: sorry.. don't see it :)
[01:36] <barr1> spiv: cool
[01:37] <SteveA> you only ever need to run bzr upgrade once per working tree
[01:37] <poolie> barr1: there's no change to the default repo format
[01:37] <poolie> so doing just 'bzr upgrade' in your repo will do nothing 
[01:37] <barr1> poolie: cool, thx
[01:37] <stub>  * Next meeting at 14:00 UTC (SteveA)
[01:37] <SteveA> do not play with other "bzr upgrade" commands
[01:37] <poolie> if you specify a format you may make something that pqm can't read yet
[01:37] <poolie> so, as steve says :)
[01:37] <LarstiQ> carlos: any committed revisions are totally safe, the working tree upgrade doesn't touch them
[01:37] <carlos> ok
[01:37] <jamesh> so any new branches or working trees bzr creates are safe though
[01:38] <salgado> I guess it's fine to upgrade a tree which has uncommitted changes?
[01:38] <LarstiQ> carlos: of course, I think the new working tree format is safe also ;)
[01:38] <carlos> ok
[01:39] <poolie> salgado: yes, should be fine
[01:39] <kiko> man this is a confusing meeting
[01:39] <stub> So meeting time is changing to be US friendly. Anything else to add SteveA?
[01:39] <barr1> SteveA: synaptic says bzr getting upgraded to 0.15~rc2-0ubuntu1  is that the right version?
[01:39] <SteveA> nothing to add.
[01:39] <kiko> yay for 14:00 UTC
[01:39] <poolie> salgado: would be good to test and let us know just in case you hit something
[01:39] <SteveA> barr1: yes
[01:39] <kiko> it is the future
[01:39] <spiv> I assume I won't be required to attend at that time?
[01:39] <barr1> SteveA: thanks
[01:39] <SteveA> poolie: I'm testing that now
[01:39] <jamesh> kiko: the next meeting usually is :)
[01:39] <salgado> poolie, will do in a second
[01:39] <kiko> poolie, I ran into a bug with rc0 commit or something bug rc2 fixed it.
[01:39] <barr1> 1400 utc == yay
[01:39] <SteveA> spiv: the "lauchpad-bazaar team sends an envoy" rule is in effect
[01:40] <kiko> jamesh, 14:00 UTC is always the future, mein freund
[01:40] <ddaa> yay!
[01:40] <spiv> SteveA: great.  Just double-checking :)
[01:40] <SteveA> stub: please call the meeting to order ;-)
[01:40] <ddaa> I'm usually awake by this time...
[01:40] <kiko> an envoy or a convoy?
[01:40] <stub> Its an order!
[01:40] <stub>  * A top user-affecting issue (mrevell)
[01:40] <mrevell> Yesterday's Launchpad user meeting raised the issue of font size and colour on Launchpad 1.0. The complaint was that Launchpad's text is useful and important, so its readability should not come second to aesthetics.
[01:40] <SteveA> kiko: a cowboy!
[01:40] <mrevell> mpt - is this something I could discuss with you, to get a good answer to give to our users?
[01:41] <kiko> we have way too many of those
[01:41] <mpt> mrevell, no, I don't have a good answer
[01:41] <stub> LP != zombo
[01:41] <jamesh> other than making the text a darker grey or black?
[01:42] <mrevell> mpt: Okay :) Could we at least swap a couple of emails to see if we could fix the text's readability?
[01:42] <mpt> These are bug 82344 and bug 87471
[01:42] <Ubugtu> Bug 82344 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/82344 is private
[01:42] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 87471 in launchpad "Grey text is unnecessarily difficult to read" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/87471
[01:42] <mrevell> mpt: Or, I should say, produce a case fo rit.
[01:42] <mpt> mrevell, that would be great
[01:42] <mrevell> mpt: Okay, thanks
[01:42] <stub>  * Launchpad buzz report (mrevell)
[01:43] <mrevell> I've posted the buzz report to the launchpad ML. A couple of good news stories in it.
[01:43] <stub> Back to reports, do you have a 1.0 status report available to paste ddaa?
[01:43] <kiko> salgado, do you think it really makes sense to display the entire team summary on ~foo's page?
[01:43] <ddaa> nope, not much new here
[01:43] <stub>  * Three sentences
[01:44] <salgado> kiko, eh?
[01:44] <jamesh> ddaa: are you going to paste thumper's sentances?
[01:44] <mpt> DONE: bug fixes, Feisty and postgresql upgrades
[01:44] <mpt> TODO: layout mechanics, OneZeroBugPage, marketing material
[01:44] <mpt> BLOCKED: no
[01:44] <mrevell> DONE: OEM sprint, revised Launchpad leaflet, buzz report, user support.
[01:44] <mrevell> TODO: 1.0 microsite, doc spec.
[01:44] <mrevell> BLOCKED: no.
[01:44] <salgado> DONE: Landed final bits of PillarGotchis, StructuralObjectPresentation refactoring, some shipit work and code review
[01:44] <salgado> TODO: More shipit, SOP refactoring, code review and random fixes
[01:44] <salgado> BLOCKED: No
[01:44] <carlos> DONE: Import queue babysitting, discussed a solution for OO.org translations problems introduced by translation-toolkit, prepared script to get rid remaining '' and '' chars in our database, work on the announcement of Feisty translations, OpenWengo support. native Firefox support.
[01:44] <carlos> TODO: Finish approval of Feisty templates. Firefox support.
[01:44] <carlos> BLOCKED: No
[01:44] <matsubara> DONE: triage, small bug fix (broken link in malone front page), updated scripts to generate weekly puller report
[01:44] <stub> DONE: PostgreSQL 8.2 upgrade
[01:44] <matsubara> TODO: report oops bugs (today's report), more triage.
[01:44] <matsubara> BLOCKED: no
[01:44] <stub> TODO: OpenID
[01:44] <stub> BLOCKED: No
[01:44] <bac> DONE: work on file mgmt (upload/download) research and spec, feisty update, Zope 3 training
[01:44] <bac> TODO: Work with Elliot to finish file mgmt spec, bug watch research for customer lead
[01:44] <bac> BLOCKED: No
[01:44] <barr1> DONE: bug-90118, mbox mailer, launchpad testing, mm/lp design
[01:44] <barr1> TODO: mm/lp milestones and phases
[01:44] <barr1> BLOCKED: none
[01:44] <ddaa> jamesh: yes
[01:44] <spiv> DONE: bzr smart server, reviews, progress on bug 86171
[01:44] <spiv> TODO: reviews, bzr, bug 86171
[01:44] <spiv> BLOCKED: no
[01:44] <Ubugtu> Bug 86171 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/86171 is private
[01:44] <jamesh> DONE: code review, codebrowse fixes (handling binary files, don't redirect in a loop on failures), LP performance investigation, get rid of /@@/user icon usage.
[01:44] <jamesh> TODO: code review, script runtime logging, bug import
[01:44] <jamesh> BLOCKED: no
[01:44] <BjornT> DONE: code reviews. fixed various bugs. landed some reviewed branches.
[01:44] <BjornT> TODO: code reviews. make it possible for apport to add tags while filing
[01:44] <BjornT> bugs. more bug fixes.
[01:44] <BjornT> BLOCKED: no
[01:44] <danilos> DONE: ooo migration script, dist-upgrade to feisty, bug fixing, poimport speed-up discussion, some import herding, poimport speed-up cherry-picked
[01:44] <danilos> TODO: ooo migration script, lots of bugfixing, licensing, helptexts
[01:44] <danilos> BLOCKED: no
[01:44] <flacoste> DONE: edgy update, sprint
[01:44] <flacoste> TODO: sprint, reviews, feisty upgrade
[01:44] <flacoste> BLOCKED: no
[01:44] <statik> DONE: working with customers, working on filedownloads, recruiting
[01:44] <statik> TODO: the same, with more cowbell. prepare for london sprint
[01:44] <statik> Blocked: no
[01:44] <cprov> DONE: finished nascentuplod-catclysm and custom-processor-consolidation (other branches ready for review), Julian guidance.
[01:44] <cprov> TODO: fix to remove old archives (warty/hoary and EOF breezy)
[01:44] <cprov> BLOCKED: no
[01:44] <sinzui> Done: Bug-78669
[01:44] <sinzui> TODO: Bugs 65945, 75485, 75487, 34050, spec
[01:44] <sinzui> Blocking: GPG key added to PQM for bug 78669 and trivial patches
 DONE: working on private branches, small gui fixes, branch batch size increase
 TODO: private branches, dbschema refactoring
 BLOCKED: email notifications still awaiting complete-branch-revisions
[01:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 65945 in launchpad-answers "Add a "Support contact of" report to the Person context " [Low,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/65945 - Assigned to Curtis Hovey (sinzui-is)
[01:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 75485 in launchpad-answers "In the 'Request Support' page display the list of supported languages" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/75485 - Assigned to Curtis Hovey (sinzui-is)
[01:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 75487 in launchpad-answers "Add a 'Unsupported Requests' report" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/75487
[01:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 34050 in launchpad-answers "Unable to retarget support request" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/34050
[01:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 78669 in launchpad-answers "automatic resolve text is impersonal." [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/78669
[01:44] <bigjools> DONE: bug fixes
[01:44] <bigjools> TODO: more bug fixes
[01:44] <bigjools> BLOCKED: no
[01:45] <SteveA> DONE: management, recruitment, zserver->twisted, performance improvements
[01:45] <SteveA> TODO: more of the same
[01:45] <SteveA> BLOCKED: no
 DONE: Fixed that intermittent test failure. Got automatic bugbranch linking _almost_ ready to go.
 TODO: Docstrings & review process for bugbranch linking. Talk w/ ddaa, thumper and folks about what to do.
 BLOCKED: No (but getting complete-revisions-landing landed would sure be nice)
[01:45] <stub> ddaa: Do you understand what is blocking complete-branch-revisions?
[01:45] <stub> That a DB patch?
[01:45] <flacoste> sinzui: lifeless replied to say that he added your key
[01:45] <ddaa> stub: review niggles
[01:45] <stub> ok
[01:46] <stub> MEETING OVER! Almost ON TIME!
[01:46] <ddaa> DONE: stuff
[01:46] <sinzui> flacoste: I saw, but have not cofirmed
[01:46] <ddaa> TODO: more
[01:46] <mrevell> thanks every
[01:46] <ddaa> BLOCKED: coffee
[01:46] <stub> BEER!
[01:46] <stub> NEKID CHIX!
[01:46] <carlos> ;-)
[01:46] <barr1> sleep, er coffee
[01:47] <ddaa> stub: thailand's growing on you, I see
[01:47] <stub> ddaa: That is a rash
[01:47] <bigjools> need to be careful, some of the chix are not chix ;)
[01:47] <kiko> DONE: landed popup, fixing bug 42480, cleaning up trees, code reviews
[01:47] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 42480 in malone "Report a bug about product that doesn't use Malone should include link to product's official bug tracker" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/42480 - Assigned to Christian Reis (kiko)
[01:48] <danilos> there was no keep/bag/change section, and I wanted to change matsubara the ninja for the kiko the cowboy (to get matsubara cowboy, kiko ninja ;))
[01:48] <kiko> TODO: reviews, land branches, etc
[01:48] <kiko> BLOCKED: no
[01:48] <kiko> danilos, I hear you escaped a close call with destiny and a knife!
[01:48] <danilos> kiko: heh, so you figure I should watch myself? :)
[01:48] <danilos> kiko: yeah, the ninja saved my ass
[01:49] <ddaa> I mean bed
[01:49] <kiko> barry, you own that nick? maybe you should just ghost this impostor
[01:49] <jamesh> danilos: everyone knows that ninjas are chinese, so matsubara is the ninja
[01:50] <Spads> (Japanese)
[01:50] <barry> kiko: i have constant problems w/freenode and my nick.  every once in a while i have to release/recover
[01:50] <bac> matsubara: i'll get you those slide today
[01:50] <bac> er, slides
[01:50] <kiko> barry, you just need to nuke this loser when you pop in. a cool /nickserv ghost barry pw 
[01:50] <matsubara> bac: thank you!
[01:50] <SteveA> barry: use irssi, so you're always on irc
[01:50] <kiko> Spads, no, ninjas are chinese. pizzas are what's from japan.
[01:51] <SteveA> thanks for running the meeting stub
[01:51] <salgado> This is a checkout. The branch (file:///home/salgado/devel/repo/canonical/launchpad/foo/) needs to be upgraded separately.
[01:51] <kiko> irssi is for losers!!!
[01:51] <Spads> kiko: My bad!
[01:51] <barry> kiko: thanks, will try that!
[01:51] <SteveA> Spads: did you see what Kmos said about the robots.txt ?
[01:51] <salgado> poolie, I guest that's expected (^)?
[01:51] <danilos> kiko: pizzas are from US, and the main ingredient is the ketchup!
[01:51] <barry> SteveA: yeah, i should try irssi again
[01:51] <kiko> I hear the menage a trois is from france
[01:52] <danilos> but, with the mention of pizzas and ninjas in the same sentence, I naturally come to think of ninja turtles
[01:52] <Kmos> SteveA: it's explained by jamesh 
[01:52] <SteveA> thanks Kmos 
[01:52] <stub> salgado: staging is now running the new code
[01:52] <Kmos> :)
[01:52] <salgado> great, thanks stub!
[01:53] <poolie> salgado: that's correct, though maybe a bit unclear in this case
[01:53] <poolie> you don't want/need  to upgrade the branch
[01:53] <salgado> right, that's what I thought
[01:53] <Kmos> there will be a section for translating launchad ui ?
[01:53] <Kmos> *launchpad
[01:54] <kiko> Kmos, probably not. probably not
[01:54] <Kmos> :(
[01:54] <salgado> Spads, staging has been updated with the code needed to test that RT I filed
[01:54] <LarstiQ> bac: oh cool, you're working on a sf download area thingy?
[01:55] <danilos> kiko: isn't allowing LP UI translation one of the long-term "plans"?
[01:55] <salgado> stub, any chance of getting it cherry picked in production today or tomorrow?
[01:55] <bac> yeah, statik and i are working on the spec
[01:55] <kiko> danilos, how would it help? people will then start reporting bugs in chinese
[01:55] <stub> salgado: It is just code, no? That should be fine. Add details to the wiki.
[01:55] <Kmos> kiko: http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fbeta.launchpad.net
[01:55] <Kmos> :)
[01:55] <salgado> stub, already added. (and yes, it's just code. :-)
[01:56] <LarstiQ> danilos: is OOo entirely switching to rosetta?
[01:56] <danilos> kiko: how about answer tickets, translations, project pages?
[01:56] <SteveA> well... project pages is interesting
[01:56] <kiko> danilos, that would be even worse! translating english when you can't even read english!!
[01:56] <SteveA> what language will people describe their project in?
[01:56] <LarstiQ> lojban!
[01:56] <SteveA> of course
[01:57] <danilos> kiko: we can (and should) implement a feature to translate from other language... we are almost there anyway (with "make suggestions from" feature), and with removal of altid on firefox branch
[01:58] <danilos> LarstiQ: I don't know about official OOo policy, but we'll make it entirely possible to use Rosetta for OOo translations; and I'd be more than glad to integrate with their build procedures as well
[01:59] <LarstiQ> danilos: cool
[02:01] <danilos> kiko: if eg. Spanish translation is complete, I don't see a reason why wouldn't someone be able to say "Translate this from Spanish"
[02:02] <Fujitsu> Then you have a sort of Chinese whispers problem.
[02:02] <danilos> Fujitsu: which is?
[02:02] <ddaa> phunny, here we call that "arab telephone"
[02:03] <Fujitsu> danilos: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_whispers
[02:05] <danilos> Fujitsu: this is limited to length 2 (only the "biggest" languages will be used as a base, and they'll usually be based on English directly), and it will already happen with any non-gettext translations (eg. Firefox, OpenOffice.org which use non-English IDs and where English text can change "underneath" the translation)
[02:06] <Fujitsu> OK, that's not so bad.
[02:07] <Fujitsu> Is language derivative support planned?
[02:07] <carlos> LarstiQ: not that I know
[02:07] <carlos> Fujitsu: we talked about that, but nothing defined yet
[02:08] <Fujitsu> carlos: Thanks.
[02:08] <danilos> Fujitsu: the thing is that I've heard of requests by some African translation teams where translators only know French, or of some South American (Indian languages) translators who only know Spanish, so I think it can actually be good as well, not just "not so bad" :)
[02:08] <Fujitsu> Now, I must head off to bed. Thanks danilos, carlos.
[02:08] <danilos> Fujitsu: sure, good night :)
[02:08] <Fujitsu> danilos: I was trying to think of cases where it'd be useful. That's a good one.
[02:10] <carlos> LarstiQ: we are working on adding native OO.org support in Rosetta
[02:10] <LarstiQ> carlos: what does that entail?
[02:10] <carlos> and we will be happy to offer Rosetta as a way to do translations officially for OO.org, but as far as I know, nothing has been agreed
[02:10] <carlos> LarstiQ: no .po file format required to translate OO.org
[02:11] <carlos> although we will support that too
[02:11] <carlos> you will be able to import/export GSI files
[02:11] <kiko> danilos, I don't like that so much because of the chinese whispers effect
[02:12] <kiko> Hobbsee, how's beta treating you?
[02:12] <danilos> kiko: read up above on what I think about chinese whispers, and why is it not a problem ;)
[02:12] <Hobbsee> kiko: er...next question?  SteveA was looking at data, etc, 24 hours ago
[02:13] <danilos> kiko: you can also design this in way where you show both English and a translation
[02:13] <kiko> Hobbsee, wow, we totally spoke across each other there. 
[02:13] <Hobbsee> kiko: taking about 20 seconds to load pages, but yeah.  it's better than it was.
[02:14] <kiko> Hobbsee, there's a lot of SSL handshake overhead that I can't figure out 
[02:14] <Hobbsee> kiko: it wouldnt surprise me
[02:20] <xerxas> Hi all 
[02:20] <xerxas> Howcome my karma goes up and down ? 
[02:21] <xerxas> it was under 1000 yesterday, I didn't make any action on launchpad yesterday 
[02:21] <xerxas> it's 1008 today 
[02:21] <xerxas> but It was 1200 one week ago 
[02:24] <kiko> xerxas, have you seen the karma calculation page on help.launchpad.net?
[02:24] <xerxas> no
[02:25] <xerxas> going to look at it 
[02:25] <kiko> so that's a good place to start. ;)
[02:27] <kiko> Hobbsee, the 20 seconds you mention is total page load time, though?
[02:27] <kiko> Hobbsee, how long until you get enough content to start breathing again?
[02:27] <Hobbsee> kiko: no, 20 is where it starts to be usable.  sometimes 18-19.  takes 22-23 seconds to finiish loading everything
[02:27] <Hobbsee> but it was better on a new profile, which was odd.
[02:28] <kiko> Hobbsee, interesting. it takes about 4s for me for a bug page
[02:28] <kiko> Hobbsee, have you used live http headers to check how much content you are reloading?
[02:28] <Hobbsee> nope
[02:28] <kiko> that might be helpful -- I find 20s way too much
[02:32] <kiko> Hobbsee, it might be that you're not caching something that you should.
[02:32] <kiko> Hobbsee, oh, one sec though -- are you talking about shift-reload, or just following a link?
[02:33] <Hobbsee> kiko: could be, could be anything.  right now, i'm rather too tired to do much of anything.  it's a following link, from a firefox window that has opened LP in the past, ie, the cache has not been cleared.
[02:34] <Hobbsee> maybe not in that session
[02:34] <Hobbsee> doesnt seem to make that much of a difference
[02:35] <kiko> Hobbsee, okay. a livehttpheaders log would be helpful to me. but I guess it can wait until you've caught enough zs 
[02:36] <Hobbsee> kiko: would help if you'd tell me hwo to do such a thing, or point me at a webpage for it.  
[02:36] <kiko> Hobbsee, hmm. and saran wrap to keep the vegemite off the keys?
[02:37] <matsubara> Hobbsee: http://livehttpheaders.mozdev.org/ and http://www.getfirebug.com/
[02:37] <kiko> http://livehttpheaders.mozdev.org/ is the extension you want
[02:37] <kiko> I think it's better than firebug for this purpose
[02:37] <matsubara> Hobbsee: both very useful tools to profile web pages.
[02:37] <kiko> anyway
[02:38] <kiko> there's Tools->Live HTTP Headers
[02:38] <kiko> you clear
[02:38] <kiko> then load the page
[02:38] <Hobbsee> kiko: heh.  
[02:38] <kiko> the log will tell you what's going on over the wire
[02:38] <kiko> it's interesting if you've never seen it before
[02:38] <kiko> sure
[02:38] <kiko> we're not going anywhere 
[02:38] <Hobbsee> heh
[02:39] <Hobbsee> run awya!  run away!
[02:39] <kiko> it's such an exciting stage!
[03:00] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92518 in rosetta "Kopete translations are not used, because source package has changed" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92518
[03:20] <janttsu> how can i remove my account?
[03:27] <SteveA> kiko: remember the bugs in firebug and livehttpheaders
[03:27] <SteveA> kiko: that it incorrectly shows .js and .css being reloaded
[03:27] <SteveA> statik: call in 3 mins?
[03:28] <statik> SteveA: you bet
[03:44] <kiko> SteveA, livehttpheaders doesn't have a bug. firebug does.
[03:46] <SteveA> really?  okay
[03:47] <kiko> yes, really
[03:55] <janttsu> can't an account be removed from launchpad?
[03:57] <Kmos> janttsu: https://answers.launchpad.net/
[03:58] <janttsu> ok so i can't
[03:58] <ddaa> janttsu: not at the moment
[03:58] <ddaa> you can clear all your personal details
[04:03] <pipe> hi all
[04:20] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92540 in launchpad-answers "It needs a space on person icon and text next to it" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92540
[04:43] <piedoggie> I went to launch pad this morning to try and register for a hosted branch but couldn't find out how to do that.  What's the secret handshake?  :-)
[04:47] <pochu> piedoggie: maybe this little tutorial can help you: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bzr
[04:47] <piedoggie> that's a really nice FAQ.  Has been linked to by the bzr folks?
[04:48] <kiko> that's a good question!
[04:48] <kiko> ddaa, has it?
[04:48] <kiko> hey mpt are you awake?
[04:48] <LarstiQ> not really
[04:48] <piedoggie> this was solved many of my getting started questions a few months ago
[04:49] <ddaa> not linked
[04:49] <ddaa> was not even aware of it before
[04:49] <ddaa> not sure if we should actually link to it...
[04:49] <LarstiQ> or assimilate it
[04:49] <ddaa> we've got enough trouble telling people that launchpad is not just for ubuntu...
[04:50] <pochu> piedoggie: I'm happy it helps you :)
[04:50] <pochu> dholbach pointed my there this morning :)
[04:50] <ddaa> besides, the code front page should already tell you all about creating a hosted branch
[04:50] <piedoggie> that was my next question.  I was wondering if it was okay to put up a general package on launch pad
[04:50] <ddaa> and we plan to make it just damn obvious
[04:50] <LarstiQ> piedoggie: what do you mean with a general package?
[04:50] <ddaa> radio-button in the addbranch form...
[04:51] <pochu> ddaa: you're right, LP is not just for Ubuntu... but that doesn't mean Ubuntu can't have a Bzr/LP tutorial for us :)
[04:51] <piedoggie> duh.. there is on the code page.  Obvious in hindsight
[04:51] <ddaa> piedoggie: there's a bug open to have it on the product's page but there are some problem with this...
[04:51] <piedoggie> what I meant by general package is one that is not embedded in a deb and destined for ubuntu
[04:52] <ddaa> 1. we do not want to display it all the time
[04:52] <ddaa> so it has to be in the help panel that nobody looks at anyway
[04:52] <pochu> ddaa: can't it be in code.lp.net/ ?
[04:52] <ddaa> 2. it should not pretend not to know what is the user and product
[04:52] <phanatic> piedoggie: that's called a product in lp
[04:52] <ddaa> pochu: actually code.beta.lp.net
[04:52] <pochu> this morning I wanted to learn it, and the first place I looked was there
[04:53] <ddaa> phanatic: actually, we should all call them "projects" now.
[04:53] <ddaa> Re 2: but there's a policy against dynamic help text
[04:53] <phanatic> ddaa: thanks for the note
[04:53] <piedoggie> when I look to register a product, it looked like it was only for products off-site and not hosted
[04:53] <ddaa> so I'm sort of unable to make any decision about this help text on the product code page
[04:54] <LarstiQ> ddaa: projects and project groups, right?
[04:54] <ddaa> LarstiQ: yes
[04:54] <LarstiQ> piedoggie: what gave you that impression? It's not the intent afaik
[04:55] <pochu> ddaa: can the help panel have it's own arrows to navigate through it?
[04:55] <ddaa> See bug 72977
[04:55] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 72977 in launchpad-bazaar "Instructions for hosting branches should be on product Code page" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/72977 - Assigned to David Allouche (ddaa)
[04:55] <pochu> ddaa: actually, you have to go to the right arrows to do it, which are a little far ;)
[04:55] <ddaa> pochu: I do not understand what you suggest
[04:55] <pochu> ddaa: in code.beta.lp.net, click the help button
[04:55] <ddaa> yes, so?
[04:55] <piedoggie> it probably would be a good idea if I walked through the registration process was someone else watching and seeing where I make mistakes.
[04:55] <pochu> ddaa: and the text is longer than the page (at least in my monitor)
[04:56] <ddaa> nobody does it because it's empty on most pages
[04:56] <piedoggie> That way we could capture info necessary to make the changes for better usability
[04:56] <ddaa> pochu: that's weird, it's pretty narrow
[04:56] <pochu> ddaa: I mean to have a side bar with their arrows if the content is larger than the screen
[04:56] <ddaa> pochu: anyway, that's a launchpad styling bug, it's mpt turf
[04:57] <Seveas> Ubugtu should no longer report old bugs as new, unless they are reassigned from a non-launchpad product to a launchpad product or suddnly no longer private
[04:57] <pochu> mpt: around? :)
[04:57] <ddaa> pochu: unlikely
[04:57] <ddaa> it's like 5am at his place
[04:57] <pochu> oh, where is him?
[04:57] <pochu> australia?
[04:57] <ddaa> .nz
[04:57] <pochu> oups :)
[04:57] <pochu> I'll ping him tonight then :)
[04:58] <pochu> ddaa: thanks anyway :)
[04:58] <ddaa> pochu: best to file a bug
[04:58] <pochu> ddaa: ok, then I'll do both
[04:58] <ddaa> make a screenshot, and keep it aside, after you got mpt attention, you can make the bug private and attach the screenshot
[04:59] <ddaa> you should not attach the screenshot to a non-private bug
[04:59] <ddaa> mh... actually, just make it private from the start
[04:59] <ddaa> using the "complicated bug-fiing form" that's linked from the first page of the guided bug filing thing
[04:59] <ddaa> and attach the screenshot
[05:00] <ddaa> launchpad devels will be able to see it anyway
[05:00] <pochu> ok, will do :)
[05:00] <pochu> though I think it's understandable, if I explain it well, so maybe there is no need to attach an screenshot
[05:00] <ddaa> you're call
[05:01] <ddaa> picture == thousand words
[05:01] <pochu> hehe
[05:01] <Kmos> Seveas: nice
[05:02] <LaserJock> who'd be the best dev to talk to about librarian?
[05:02] <ddaa> jamesh, spiv, celso, flacoste should all be conversant with it
[05:03] <LaserJock> k
[05:03] <pochu> ddaa: do you do anything, appart of point us to other devs? :p
[05:03] <LaserJock> I'm trying to figure out some possible solution to group source package files together
[05:03] <ddaa> yes, tell other dev what I would like them to do for me :)
[05:03] <pochu> hehe
[05:04] <ddaa> lot of work actually, because I have a lot of very complicated ideas
[07:25] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92586 in launchpad-development-infrastructure "developer packages missing" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92586
[08:30] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92602 in launchpad "Translation is 100% and it has strings to review" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92602
[09:11] <bdmurray> matsubara: 1 out of 3 response now seem to be those empty gzip files for me
[09:13] <matsubara> bdmurray: I couldn't reproduce it here. does it happen with another browser (other than firefox)?
[09:13] <bdmurray> matsubara: I'll give another browser a try
[09:15] <matsubara> bdmurray: also if you can send us a log of livehttpheaders, similar to the one that chris jones attached to the bug report, it might help.
[09:16] <bdmurray> matsubara: okay, keescook is also noticing it
[09:18] <mdz> I just tried to load https://launchpad.net/bugs/92620 and Firefox told me it was a "BIN file" and offered to download it
[09:18] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 92620 in gaim "gaim crash" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[09:18] <mdz> a second try worked, though
[09:20] <bdmurray> mdz: I have been getting those a lot
[09:20] <mdz> bdmurray: the empty gzip files you mention above?
[09:20] <mdz> it's definitely not just you
[09:20] <bdmurray> mdz: right kees has seen them too
[09:21] <pochu> same here with firefox
[09:21] <pochu> though it happens less with LP beta
[09:21] <bdmurray> I'm kind of testing with konqueror now
[09:21] <matsubara> mdz: it's bug 89194 and doesn't seem to be reliably reproducible
[09:21] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 89194 in launchpad "LP (regular and beta) sending gzipped, zero byte replies" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/89194
[09:22] <pochu> bdmurray: are you using the beta, or the productive LP?
[09:22] <mdz> beta
[09:22] <LarstiQ> the beta is productive too ;)
[09:24] <bdmurray> pochu: the production
[09:24] <pochu> LarstiQ: :)
[09:27] <LaserJock> hmm,there seems to be a lot of safari related bugs with the UI
[09:30] <keescook> re: 89194> I actually just got a "Proxy Error" error during a POST, too.  Is there a local proxy running on production LP?
[09:36] <bdmurray> I got a gzipped file with content just a minute ago and added it to the bug
[09:48] <LaserJock> I've got a Beta advanced bug search question
[09:49] <LaserJock> bug 70628 seems to indicate that I could put in a bug contact in the advanced search field
[09:49] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 70628 in malone "Allow searching for a bug contact's bugs" [High,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/70628 - Assigned to Bjrn Tillenius (bjornt)
[09:49] <LaserJock> and I should get out the list of *all* bugs that the team is a bug contact for
[09:50] <LaserJock> but it seems to only filter on +subscribedbugs
[09:52] <Fujitsu> That works fine for me.
[09:52] <Fujitsu> (ie I get around 180, not 30)
[09:55] <BjornT> LaserJock: what do you put in the bug contact field?
[09:56] <LaserJock> motuscience
[09:56] <LaserJock> BjornT: Fujitsu and I figured it out
[09:56] <LaserJock> I was at ~motuscience/+subscribedbugs
[09:56] <LaserJock> so it just filtered on those
[09:56] <BjornT> ah, right.
[09:56] <LaserJock> I assumed since I was in ~motuscience/ it'd pick up all the ~motuscience bug-contact bugs
[09:59] <LaserJock> wahoo, that's much better (or worse depending on how you look at it)
[09:59] <LaserJock> I went from 10 bugs to 181
[10:00] <Fujitsu> LaserJock: It looks a bit less hopeless if you filter to universe only. That gets rid of *tex*, gnumeric, and gcalctool.
[10:00] <LaserJock> Fujitsu: right
[10:00] <Fujitsu> It's nice to finally be able to see the list of bugs we need to fix!
[10:00] <LaserJock> yes
[10:01] <LaserJock> wahoo
[10:01] <LaserJock> and you can specifcy the tag, etc.
[10:02] <Fujitsu> Yep.
[10:02] <Fujitsu> It'll be better once you can specify an absence of a tag.
[10:02] <LaserJock> now we need that -tag bug of yours
[10:02] <LaserJock> ;-)
[10:02] <Fujitsu> (and once we've tagged bugs properly)
[10:03] <Fujitsu> Anyway, thankyou muchly for this feature, BjornT.
[10:03] <LaserJock> yes
[10:04] <LaserJock> in an entirely manly way of course ;-)
[10:05] <BjornT> you're welcome :)
[10:05] <Fujitsu> Hi mrevell.
[10:05] <LaserJock> BjornT: you've allowed us to do away with a nice LP screenscraping cron job :-)
[10:07] <BjornT> good to hear :)
[10:07] <mrevell> hi Fujitsu
[10:07] <mrevell> Rinchen: ping
[10:08] <Rinchen> pong wrong channel :-) 
[10:08] <Rinchen> but I'm good
[10:08] <mrevell> Rinchen: I'm back :)
[10:08] <Rinchen> mrevell, yes would still like to chat with you sir
[10:09] <mrevell> Rinchen: Okay, cool. Let me move into the other room.
[10:09] <Rinchen> mrevell, skype ok? I can ring you when you are ready or, I can call your house.
[10:13] <poningru> skype--
[10:13] <poningru> ekiga ftw
[10:21] <mpt> kiko, if it's 4am and I'm "Away (zzz)", probably not :-)
[10:21] <kiko> bah
[10:30] <Ubugtu> New bug: #92634 in rosetta "There is no possibility to translate Ubuntu in Belarusian Latin language with Rosetta" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92634
[11:31] <mpt> Goooooooooooooood morning Launchpadders!
[11:31] <mpt> !
[11:32] <AlexLatchford> :)
[11:35] <jam> weird
[11:35] <jam> EWRONGCHAN
[11:48] <jml> thumper: re bug 90493
[11:48] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 90493 in launchpad-bazaar "List of branches view focus defaults to "Show branches with status of" pulldown" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90493
[11:49] <thumper> jml: yeah?
[11:49] <thumper> I was just going to reject it :)
[11:49] <jml> thumper: part of the problem is that when you scroll down inside the pulldown, then tab out, the listing changes
[11:50] <thumper> jml: again working as designed
[11:50] <jml> thumper: I think the design has flaws.
[11:50] <thumper> probably not what you want to hear though
[11:50] <ddaa> would be better if the listing was changed by pressing ENTER
[11:50] <jml> rather than an onblur event
[11:51] <ddaa> in this context, TAB probably means "oops, did not mean it"
[11:51] <ddaa> but then you'd need to restore the popup to the previous value...
[11:51] <thumper> if you turn off javascript you get a submit button :)
[11:51] <ddaa> thumper: you do not really want to play the silly game.
[11:52] <thumper> jml: it seemed like a good idea at the time
[11:53] <jml> thumper: it's obviously not a huge deal, just a minor annoyance that happens every time I go to that page.
[11:57] <kiko> mpt, I am fixing bug 3797, and I would like constructive feedback on the messages sent to the end-user
[11:57] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 3797 in malone "Bug mails should explain why the person is getting emailed." [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/3797 - Assigned to Christian Reis (kiko)
[11:57] <kiko> mpt, I would like to send you an updated test file and you reply to me with what you'd like to see changed
[11:57] <kiko> how about that?
[12:01] <Kmos> How about to block websites to open images hosted in launchpad.net (like avatar), it will reduce bandwidth and machine load
[12:01] <kiko> Kmos, block which websites?
[12:02] <Kmos> all websites from getting images from LP
[12:02] <ddaa> usually, users get images from LP...
[12:02] <Kmos> like.. i see somewhere someone to use the avatar hosted in launchpad
[12:02] <Kmos> like this https://librarian.launchpad.net/4860624/avatar_s.png
[12:02] <Kmos> refuse external pages to get images
[12:03] <Kmos> only internal server can open it
[12:03] <kiko> Kmos, our speed problem is not bandwidth or server load, though..
[12:03] <kiko> it's SSL handshaking and caching
[12:03] <kiko> for the most part anyway
[12:03] <Kmos> kiko: ahh
[12:03] <ddaa> and occasionally database contention
[12:03] <ddaa> we've got a great solution to deal with load problems...
[12:04] <ddaa> we add more machines
[12:04] <ddaa> and regarding bandwidth
[12:04] <ddaa> launchpad is like a sub 1% fraction of the traffic to the DC
[12:05] <kiko> ddaa, well, that doesn't handle DB load. but anyway..
[12:05] <ddaa> I've got a problem with my fingers pressing ctrl-q all the time...
[12:10] <lifeless> kiko: db is not really loaded; we have more issues with lock contention than cpu or disk bandwidth
[12:11] <kiko> lifeless, I think the rosetta stuff is related to load though