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mjg59BenC: Why do we suddenly have the linux-phc insanity?02:47
mjg59BenC: It provides the ability for people to fry their hardware in exceedingly nasty ways02:47
BenCmjg59: We don't02:49
mjg59    UBUNTU: speedstep-centrino: Include linux-phc built-in tables.02:49
mjg59    Bug: 6378902:49
BenCmjg59: All we have is the tables for speedstep-centrino02:49
mjg59Oh. No, you don't want that either.02:49
BenCnone of the sysfs twiddling is there02:49
mjg59There's four different sets of tables for dothans02:49
mjg59And no way of telling which one is correct02:50
mjg59Using the wrong one risks hardware damage02:50
BenCI thought each table was matched02:50
BenCat least that's the way I read it02:50
BenCwe had the tables in dapper/edgy02:50
mjg59BenC: No, it's matched on cpuid as far as I can tell - that's not sufficient02:52
mjg59There's a chance it'll either overvolt it (potential hardware damage) or undervolt it (potential instability)02:52
BenCmjg59: fuck, as it is now we have cpu's that are running hot to the point that user's can't even watch a video on youtube without it shutting down :/02:53
mjg59Their hardware is broken02:54
mjg59"fixing" it risks breaking other people's hardware02:54
BenCbut "it works on windows"02:54
mjg59The Windows vendor knows what CPU they shipped02:54
BenCand "linux-phc makes this work"02:54
BenCI hate this02:55
BenCI have to pick between two groups, but definitely the group that risks hw damage wins02:55
BenCI wonder if I can disable use of the tables by default02:59
BenCuse a kernel cmdline options to enable it02:59
BenCsounds like a plan02:59
BenCyeah, I've read the threads03:00
BenCwhich is why I yanked the sysfs twiddling03:00
BenCbut I though the tables were safe03:00
mjg59Check Arjan's message in that thread03:00
BenCmjg59: Gotcha03:04
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reitblattwhere is l-r-m-2.6.20-13?04:00
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tritiumHi BenC 04:11
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BenCdoko: I reproduced your gelic_net problem, I'll fix that for next upload06:09
BenCdoko: wow, I'm not sure...I think it might be caused by the last firmware update06:09
BenCdoko: reverting to an older kernel doesn't fix it06:10
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reitblattBenC: where's l-r-m-2.6.20-13 ?07:00
BenCreitblatt: last I checked it was on the build systems being processed07:01
tritiumreitblatt: I was able to download it.  (it built correctly)07:01
tritiumBut, Atheros support didn't improve.  Still no wireless networking for me with AR5212...07:02
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tritiumreitblatt: https://launchpad.net/+builds/+build/31359107:04
reitblattBenC, tritium: thanks07:10
mjg59BenC: That patch I sent you is kind of important - fixes a fairly major regression from edgy07:28
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=== Topic for #ubuntu-kernel: Ubuntu kernel development discussion ONLY | Kernel Wiki: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam | 2.6.20-13.21 Uploaded - If you aren't using it, then you risk your bugs not getting fixed. | BUG STATUS (2.6.20): 352 Open, 6 Unconfirmed, 6 Unassigned
=== Topic (#ubuntu-kernel): set by BenC at Sat Mar 24 21:30:43 2007
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glickhey reitblatt 08:47
glickhey has anyone here read the book linux device drivers third ed. ?08:48
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glickis anyone up?10:40
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tepsipakkiBenC: I searched lp but couldn't find a bug open about megaraid (PERC2/DC) not being fired up properly on boot. Installing Feisty beta went fine02:50
tepsipakkithat's a friend of mine reporting02:51
tepsipakkithe hd's weren't found on boot02:51
BenCtepsipakki: there was some problems with dapper, and pre-release edgy, but feisty should be ok02:51
BenCdapper requires the -security kernel to work, IIRC02:52
tepsipakkihe said that edgy didn't work either :/02:52
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tepsipakkibut I'll ask for more information02:57
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AlinuxOSBenC, well done, everything is perfect. Thank You!03:01
BenCAlinuxOS: np03:01
BenCAlinuxOS: I found the bug about 5 minutes after you logged off last week from our debug session :)03:01
BenCtepsipakki: so it works with feisty?03:01
BenCAlinuxOS: so you went a long way to helping me find it, thanks03:02
AlinuxOSBenC, so I've helped in something :)? 03:02
AlinuxOSBenC, great :) feel free to use my computers sources.. :)03:03
AlinuxOSalways happy to help you all guys.03:03
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tepsipakkiBenC: installation works, but on reboot the disks are not found03:09
BenCtepsipakki: I'm not sure how that can be...03:10
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tepsipakkiBenC: yep, doesn't make sense :)03:14
tepsipakkihum, there is no l-r-m for -13?03:17
reitblatttepsipakki: was uploaded several hours ago03:18
reitblatttry updating03:18
MithrandirI NEWed it this morning, iirc.03:18
tepsipakkiok, thanks03:19
tepsipakkithere were some bugs on nvidia "crashing" :)03:19
reitblattyeah, several of them03:19
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giriBenC: ping03:20
BenCgiri: pong03:20
giriBenC: hi, I am ndiswrapper developer03:20
BenCgiri: hey03:21
giriI notice that on Summer of Code 2007, ubuntu proposes to improve ndiswrapper installtion03:21
BenCgiri: It wasn't something I was aware of03:21
giriah, ok03:21
BenCI thought it was already pretty easy03:21
giriI have been trying to find out who to contact about it03:21
giriactually, I am proposing to improve stability of ndiswrapper03:22
giriesp with SMP03:22
giriwould you know if I should contact someone else about it?03:22
giriBenC: right now, ndiswrapper crashes with smp with certain drivers03:23
BenCgiri: For the driver installation, not sure03:24
BenCgiri: For making it more stable under smp, I can help03:25
giriBenC: actually, what I need is hardware (smp box, various cards to test)03:26
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girinot sure if soc2007 is the way to go about it03:27
girior some kind of sponsorship (either through ubuntu or through some other means) would be better?03:27
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giriBenC: sorry to repeat, but could you clarify how you and/or ubuntu can help?03:38
BenCgiri: me, I'm willing to test and channel bugs :)03:38
BenCgiri: Ubuntu, I'd have to talk to some folks03:38
giriBenC: ok, tia03:38
BenCgiri: Honestly, I think Ubuntu's more willing to sponsor people making opensource drivers, rather than ndiswrapper work, but I can find out03:39
giriBenC: yes, I am all to aware of ndiswrapper being smudgy03:40
giriBenC: in fact, that has been one of the major handicaps of this project03:40
BenCgiri: You're probably more than aware of the outside view of ndiswrapper by most of the kernel community :)03:40
giriBenC: I have spent _way too much time_ on ndiswrapper, with not much help from others (either materially or code contribution)03:41
giriBenC: talking of kernel community, I have a patch to fix an issue in kernel, but not in the mood for dealing with people ranting about ndiswrapper03:41
giriBenC: although patch has nothing to do with ndiswrapper03:42
giriBenC: if you are interested, the patch fixes __vmalloc to allocate memory in GFP_ATOMIC03:42
giriBenC: right now, if you use __vmalloc with GFP_ATOMIC, it will result in BUG_ON03:42
giriBenC: __vmalloc is used in couple of places in kernel03:43
giriBenC: coming back to ndiswrapper, if you could find if/how ubuntu can help, that will be great03:43
giriBenC: please let me know if anything works out - my address (pgiri@yahoo.com) should be in ndiswrapper project info03:44
tepsipakkiBenC: ok, a bit more info about that megaraid-issue: it's a Dell Poweredge 2400 and he has a mirrored disk pair and installed Feisty on them, LVM in between. Booting it makes drops it to busybox after local-premount, but I could see the megaraid being loaded _after_ that, and it fails03:44
tepsipakkiBenC: clarification; hw-mirrored disks, and LVM on top of that03:45
tepsipakkierr, s/makes //03:47
tepsipakkihe's doing an installation without LVM now03:48
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BenCtepsipakki: sounds more like a sw issue with the initramfs detecting the lvm and such03:53
tepsipakkithat could be it03:55
tepsipakkithere's also an error from modprobe right after local-premount03:55
tepsipakkibut I couldn't trace the source03:55
tepsipakkiit shows the usage of modprobe, so maybe a typo somewhere03:56
tepsipakkiBenC: it worked without LVM04:11
tepsipakkiso not a kernel issue04:11
BenCgiri: Will do, thanks04:12
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tritium_BenC: got the latest l-r-m updates this morning.  I'm using Atheros AR5212 at the airport :)04:30
BenCtritium_: sweet04:31
tritium_Many thanks!04:31
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tepsipakkiBenC: seems that the root-cause was that the megaraid was in I2O-emulation mode, not in "mass storage" mode :)05:03
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pochuhi all :) I don't know to which package set this bug, any idea? bug 9654506:44
pochuhi all :) I don't know to which package set this bug, any idea? bug 9654506:44
pochuis not ubotu here?06:45
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ivokspochu: you didn't have linux-386 installed before06:49
ivoksthis is a bug that's old as hoary06:50
pochunot my bug though :)06:52
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xipietotecoh...haven't submitted this as a bug yet...been to busy trying to fix my feisty install, but if someone else wants to. The kernel-386 packages for dist-upgrade do not point correctly to the -generic kernels, ergo, no kernel gets installed, but the config files for the kernel does....ergo...no booting. I had to chroot from the live cd into my hd, delete the -386 kernels, and install the -generic kernel08:34
xipietotecactually I had to download the -generic kernel directly from the packages site, and install it that way...couldn't use the repository method08:36
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thotzBenC: which is the main bug for the update from nvidia-glx (96xx) --> nvidia-glx (97xx) affecting some gforce users? could you tell me this. have we one?08:50
BenCthotz: Not that I know of08:51
BenCxipietotec: the -386 should point to -386, not -generic08:51
Mithrandirthotz: what do you mean?08:51
thotzBenC: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-restricted-modules-2.6.20/+bug/9643008:52
xipietotecBenC: I thought in feisty -386 had been merged with generic?08:53
BenCxipietotec: No, -686 and -k7 merged together into -generic08:53
BenCactually, -686, -686-smp, -k7 and -k7-smp have all merged into -generic08:53
xipietotecah, okay...bizzare, well anyways, for some reason I had to delete my -386 and install generic...because it did not install the latest -386 kernel when I dist upgraded08:54
anti_pop9755 doesnt support cards older than geforce FX series. and it doesnt seem to be possible to use the 9631 from nvidia.com with 2.6.20-1308:54
xipietotecinstalled the config for it, but not the kernel08:54
BenCxipietotec: Were you missing some linux-386 meta packages?08:54
BenCyou should at least have had linux-386 or linux-image-38608:54
thotzBenC: Do you know now what I mean?08:54
BenCxipietotec: There's no way to get the config without the image08:55
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BenCthotz: you mean a bug that others can be set as duplicate of, right?08:55
mjg59anti_pop: Issues with nvidia code generally have to go to nvidia08:55
BenCyeah, I'm not sure what people are wanting us to do here08:56
BenCnvidia dropped support, not us08:56
BenCwe can pretty much ship what they provide08:56
xipietotecBenC: I had configs and kernel images for earlier versions of the -386 kernel, but for the lastest version, ending in .20 or whatever, I had the config file, but no kernel image. Even trying to reinstall the kernel-image to rebuild my initrd wouldn't fix it (it would just hang after checking the root file system) so I had to delete all of them, and then I switched to -generic08:56
MithrandirBenC: they want us to ship three sets of nvidia drivers, not just two.08:56
BenCwe vary from that and we start making problems for us and users08:56
thotzBenC: yes -> http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=8166808:56
thotzBenC and http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=7560308:56
xipietotecoddly, even if I switched to the older versions of the -386 kernel image, I could not finish booting08:57
thotzBenC: 2 legacy drivers + 1 new driver = 3 drivers08:57
BenCNo, I know exactly what's going on, I just don't get why this is "Ubuntu better fix it" and not "nvidia better fix it"08:57
mjg59= more pain and misery08:57
anti_popcause its the new feisty kernel that doest work with the 9631 driver ?08:57
BenCwe provide the drivers as a courtesy to users, so they can get the most from their hw08:57
anti_pop-12 did08:57
BenCanti_pop: No, that's not it08:58
BenC9631 only worked with feisty kernel because I patched it08:58
anti_popi see08:58
BenCyou can get 9631 working with feisty if you hand patch it and build it08:58
BenCgoogle can show you this08:58
anti_popwell im a user not a developer and have no idea how to do this08:58
mjg59anti_pop: I recommend contacting nvidia08:59
BenCbut that doesn't lay the responsibility on our laps to make it work08:59
anti_popso if you once patched it, why didnt you use that patch for -13 too ?09:00
BenCwe're going above and beyond any other distro already, sticking our necks out to provide the drivers that nvidia makes available. Asking us to go further than that is a little much09:00
mjg59anti_pop: Because we're not shipping 963109:00
BenCanti_pop: the patch isn't for the kernel, it's for the nvidia driver09:00
thotzBenC: Sure. I still need a master bug for this. I would call it "Master" then. If you don't tell me, I can't help to make launchpad.09:00
BenCour kernel is perfectly fine09:00
anti_popso there is no support for geforce 4,3 on ubuntu ?09:00
BenCthotz: The one you pointed to is fine09:00
mjg59anti_pop: There is. Use the 7xxx series driver.09:00
anti_popi will not09:00
BenCanti_pop: There's no support for it in the driver we get from nvidia09:00
BenCanti_pop: If the driver nvidia ships doesn't work, we can't help it09:01
thotzthotz: ok, thanks. should i assign it to somebody? 09:01
BenCthotz: ubuntu-kernel-team, mark it confirmed and medium for now09:01
anti_popso concerning that bug, ubuntu will not have 9631 legacy ?09:01
BenCthotz: thanks09:01
mjg59anti_pop: Correct09:01
BenCanti_pop: nvidia is not maintaining drivers that support your card on linux09:01
BenCanti_pop: hence, we cannot do so either09:02
anti_popuntil yesterday they did09:02
thotzBenC: I can't set priority. Sorry...09:02
BenCanti_pop: if we ship the 9631 driver, we cannot ensure that it will remain secure over the lifetime of feisty, which means we open our users up to unsupported and possibly insecure code09:02
BenCanti_pop: I'd rather not have that hanging on my conscience09:03
BenCthotz: Ok, I'll get it09:03
anti_pophmm, but what would be the difference to the 7xxx legacy driver ?09:05
anti_popthis is supported, secure code09:06
mjg59anti_pop: Every extra set of binary-only drivers shipped adds to the support load09:06
mjg59anti_pop: This results in security updates taking longer, and increases the risk of extra issues being introduced09:07
mjg59anti_pop: The 7xxx drivers support your hardware. They will be shipped.09:07
thotzI still not understand why a 7xxx legacy works and a 9xxx legacy shouldn't work. But that's my own oppinion.09:08
mjg59thotz: Every set of binary-only drivers shipped adds to the suppotr load09:09
BenC7xxx driver is maintained by nvidia still09:09
mjg59thotz: This results in security updates taking longer, and increases the risk of extra issues being introduced09:09
BenCthey've been updating it and fixing issues in it09:09
thotzBenC: and the 9xxx legacy not?09:10
BenCthotz: No, nvidia supports 7xxx legacy driver and 9xxx tip driver09:11
BenCfor us to keep supporting new cards, and retain security fixes, we have to follow the latest in both those lines09:12
BenCwe are at nvidia's mercy as to whether or not they drop support for particular chipsets09:12
anti_popwhat does "tip" driver mean ?09:12
BenCthe 7xxx series legacy driver is a direct result of users, like you guys, complaing to nvidia, not Ubuntu, about losing support09:12
BenCanti_pop: It means the newest version of their driver09:12
BenC7xxx driver is a fork maintained to support older cards that they stopped supporting in the latest driver09:13
anti_popthey realease a 9631 legacy and dont maintain/support it ?09:13
BenCanti_pop: Yes, they support it until 9632 comes out, then you have to use that09:14
BenCeach time they release a new version, you have to update to the newer version if you want security and stability fixes09:14
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anti_popso there is only 1 real legacy driver (7xxx)09:15
anti_popso everyone with a nvidia card <FX who will install feisty fawn is forced to use this old legacy driver09:16
anti_popnot good imo09:16
BenCwhat's not good about it?09:17
BenCanti_pop: Is there something wrong with the 7xxx driver on those chipsets?09:17
anti_popfixed problems in updated drivers ?09:17
mjg59Which ones?09:17
BenCthe "fixed problems" are problems affecting cards > than the ones dropped09:17
BenC7xxx is maintained, let's not forget this09:18
xipietotecanti_pop: everyone who has a <FX card, who upgrades to any latest version of any distro out there, will have to use the 7xxx driver, because Nvidia dropped support for the chipset in *their* latest driver releases.09:18
BenChence using it isn't a problem09:18
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anti_popok, thanks for all this useful input09:18
BenCanti_pop: If you installed a linux distro today that didn't come with nvidia drivers, and went to nvidia's site to download them, you'd get the 7xxx driver09:18
anti_popwhat is the way to setup stuff like twinview with legacy driver ?09:19
BenCsame way as with the regular driver09:19
BenCit has a control panel and all09:19
anti_popnvidia-settings ?09:19
xipietotecanti_pop: don't like the state events? support nouveau09:20
anti_popi think i have to add a comment to that bug09:20
mjg59Please don't add comments to bugs unless they add new information09:21
anti_popi think most people dont know what the 7xxx legacy is09:21
anti_popand maybe the packages nvidia-glx and nvidia-glx-legacy should contain for which card they are09:22
anti_popon information09:22
anti_popsorry for my english09:22
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anti_popwell the legacy driver is not working here09:31
mjg59anti_pop: Please file a bug about it09:32
anti_popi have to make sure i didnt do something wrong first09:32
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alucardmy make-kpkg won't do anything, it just stops and says "nothing to be done" can anyone help me09:40
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alucardmy make-kpkg won't do anything, it just stops and says "nothing to be done" can anyone help me09:42
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ScottKIs this the best place to discuss network related kernel bugs? I'm specifically interested in [Bug 86742]  D-Link AirPlus DWL-G650 Wireless (rev.C) - Atheros AR5212 (rev 01) does not work in Feisty11:00
LureScottK: from earlier today:11:02
Lure[Mon Mar 26 2007]  [16:30:47]  <tritium_> BenC: got the latest l-r-m updates this morning. I'm using Atheros AR5212 at the airport :)11:02
BenCScottK: Make sure you have latest -13 kernel + lrm11:03
ScottKI do have the latest (-13 kernel).  11:03
JoseStefanrestricted modules11:04
ScottKOK.  I'll check that then.  Thanks.11:05
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lifelessBenC: ping11:14
BenClifeless: hey11:14
lifelessam I confused ? :). I thought you had previously been involved closishly with svn (and I know you're not sussman)11:15
BenClifeless: yeah, a few years ago I was doing a lot in regards to memory consumptions and stuff in svn11:15
BenCbut I'm only involved by name anymore11:16
lifelessthats cool11:16
lifelesswe have this bug (OT here) :) that would be nice to get someone at svn to care about.11:16
lifelessand I thought you might know who to prod to make that happen.11:16
BenCsussman is one11:17
lifelessit breaks the cscvs package's test suite.11:17
BenCdoesn't svn have a channel on freenode?11:17
lifelessit would suck to ship feisty broken though; if we dont get traction through regular channels soon, perhaps you could email sussman an introduction ?11:18
ScottKIt was lack of lrm that did it.  Installing that solved my problem.  Thank you very much Lure, BenC, and JoseStefan.  I'll update that bug.11:19
JoseStefanmake sure you have the meta package, so you can avoid that, dont remember the name right now11:20
BenCScottK: sudo apt-get install linux-generic11:21
BenCthat will keep things up-to-date11:21
BenCScottK: Please just set the bug to rejected or fix-released whichever you feel is appropriate11:21
ScottKBenC: Will do.  I'll also update the wireless wiki support page too.11:22
BenCScottK: for reference on that page, note we have madwifi 0.9.3 now11:22
BenClink to it's support page would probably make things a lot easier to maintain11:22
ScottKOK.  I'll take a look at that too.11:23
[g2] crimsun, around ?11:26
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ScottKBenC: Which "that page" - I don't think I was thinking the same page needed updating that you did?11:34
[g2] BenC, how crazy are things for the release ?11:35
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