[01:25] <vox754> I was wondering if this "laptop team" would provide additional support to the "ndiswrapper" project. The current developer has stated that he may do some serious job if he could work on 64 bit processor and multiple core machine.
[01:35] <vox754> Donations are always welcomed, but in this case the new hardware would be great help to develop better code, specially attending issues with SMP. I'm asking here because I think it is in the best interest of Ubuntu developers to support the ndiswrapper project which provides wireless access to countless users. With better networking support Ubuntu would benefit greatly.
[01:50] <vox754> The developer of ndiswrapper is a serious programmer, so you can guarantee he'll do his best with the new hardware. If the people in here are just users and don't have that much experience with what I'm talking, then you could perhaps redirect me to the right people. I think Canonical could back up the ndiswrapper project without problems.
[01:57] <vox754> caravena, hey are you part of the "laptop team"?
[01:57] <caravena> vox754: I create my report.
[01:57] <caravena> My report of my notebook.
[01:58] <vox754> do you know what it takes to get a laptop from Canonical?
[01:58] <vox754> caravena, is this channel any active?
[01:59] <caravena> vox754: jajaa
[01:59] <caravena> Yes
[01:59] <caravena> Active is channel.
[01:59] <caravena> 23 users...
[02:00] <vox754> caravena, seriouslly
[02:02] <vox754> caravena, I want to contact anyone that can donate a laptop or machine with amd64 and symmetric multi processor to the ndiswrapper project. I think Canonical can donate something like that. Are you familiar with ndiswrapper?
[02:03] <caravena> Yes
[02:03] <caravena> Ndisdwwapper very important
[02:03] <caravena> Chipset broadcom and others.
[02:04] <caravena> moment pliss searching contact
[02:07] <vox754> I've been talking to the developer and he says that a new hardware may allow him to improve things, specially for those with amd64 and smp. I think Ubuntu should definitely support an effort like this since this distribution is clearly aimed at desktop users, who want to see their hardware working flawlessly, without having to do a lot of things.
[02:08] <mjg59> Best that they avoid ndiswrapper, then
[02:09] <vox754> mjg59, ndiswrapper is actually very easy to set up... if the drivers are the correct ones. What experience do you have?
[02:10] <mjg59> That ndiswrapper bugs are effectively impossible for us to work on, and can expose themselves in a wide variety of different and painful ways that end up wasting significant portions of time
[02:12] <vox754> mjg59, are you experienced in programming? Or how do you know they are bugs?
[02:13] <mjg59> vox754: I'm a kernel developer
[02:14] <vox754> oh, that's good, then I guess you can do some serious work with the kernel and ndiswrapper
[02:14] <mjg59> I don't touch non-free code
[02:14] <vox754> which is...
[02:14] <mjg59> Pretty much anything that ndiswrapper loads
[02:16] <vox754> but ndiswrapper itself is free. Do you need to manipulate the proprietary drivers when working with ndiswrapper?
[02:16] <mjg59> Once proprietary drivers are running in kernel-space, they can interfere with any other aspect of the kernel.
[02:19] <vox754> interesting... Still, do you agree that ndiswrapper is an essential part for a lot of Ubuntu users?
[02:19] <mjg59> No, I'd prefer that we didn't ship it at all
[02:20] <vox754> interesting opinion
[02:20] <mjg59> It means that whenever someone hits a bug in a native (and supportable) Linux driver, they just move to ndiswrapper instead and the bug never gets fixed
[02:21] <vox754> oh... but what about those chipsets that lack native support?
[02:21] <mjg59> Sucks.
[02:22] <mjg59> There's only one, anyway
[02:22] <mjg59> Oh, I guess two if anyone's still stuck with Inprocomm stuff
[02:22] <vox754> mmm... I h a v e ... inpro...
[02:23] <vox754> .aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
[02:24] <vox754> no, but seriously, are most chipsets now supported?
[02:26] <mjg59> Yes
[02:28] <vox754> I tell you, I practically owe my Ubuntu to ndiswrapper. So I guess some of us still have to support it.
[02:32] <vox754> then what is the future of wireless devices, do you see any sudden increase in native support? what about each card that comes out? do they use standards now?
[05:32] <mjg59> Which brings the number of bugs I care about down to a managable number. Hurrah!
[05:32] <tritium> Gah, even the new 2.6.20-13 upload doesn't fix Atheros AR5212
[05:33] <tritium> I had high hopes for the new atheros driver
[05:34] <tritium> How are things, mjg59?
[05:34] <mjg59> Non-free drivers? Just say no.
[05:34] <tritium> Well, it's my work laptop (T43p).
[05:35] <tritium> mjg59: this might be a problem for laptop support on feisty