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| Fujitsu | LaserJock: There was an import of [some project] 's bugs not long after we passed 100000, which bumped it by well over 1000. | 12:30 |
|---|---|---|
| ajmitch | zope3, silva | 12:30 |
| kiko | yeah, I think it was silva. | 12:31 |
| ajmitch | one of them | 12:31 |
| ajmitch | hey kiko | 12:31 |
| Fujitsu | silva is the one, I just forgot the name. | 12:31 |
| kiko | hey ajmitch! | 12:31 |
| Fujitsu | In fact, it was around 1700 bugs. So we've only had 800 real ones. | 12:34 |
| poolie | hi kiko | 12:36 |
| kiko | hey poolie | 12:36 |
| poolie | congratulations on the release | 12:36 |
| kiko | SteveA has told me things | 12:36 |
| kiko | thanks for saying that | 12:36 |
| kiko | how can I help you? | 12:37 |
| lifeless | silza and zope | 12:47 |
| kiko | silva. | 12:47 |
| lifeless | woops | 12:53 |
| lifeless | I thought zope was imported in the same time frame; and the z was a typo | 12:53 |
| kiko | I think zope was imported together with it, I just was fixing your typo. | 12:54 |
| lifeless | thank you | 12:55 |
| === owh [n=onno@optussatellitebintb.22bjipb002.optus.net.au] has joined #launchpad | ||
| owh | Greetings all. Sexy new look, looks lovely. | 01:00 |
| kiko | thanks for saying that owh | 01:00 |
| owh | I'm really impressed, looks almost lick-able :) | 01:01 |
| owh | Hey, just thought of a silly question. If I look at my "home page": https://launchpad.net/~onno-itmaze, it shows that I am "most active" in Ubuntu and Nedit. Now the former is true, the latter is not. I lodged one bug report. What's strange is that I'm working my butt off on dosfstools, which doesn't show up, doesn't show that I receive all bugs, or show any activity: https://launchpad.net/nedit, https://launchpad.net/dosfstools, | 01:04 |
| kiko | owh, what sort of work have you been doing on dosfstools? | 01:08 |
| owh | Tracking bugs, adding comments, looking for feedback, fixing source with sistpoty, adding myself as the bug contact, writing specs, you name it :) | 01:08 |
| === owh is currently on a crusade to fix the dirty flag :) | ||
| kiko | owh, that's unusual. you should have some karma registered for it at least | 01:09 |
| kiko | have you filed bugs, changed bug status, registered specs, etc? | 01:10 |
| owh | Yup. | 01:10 |
| owh | owh==onno-itmaze==OnnoBenschop | 01:10 |
| kiko | very odd | 01:10 |
| owh | I only noticed because I didn't think I'd done anything special to nedit, seems I was the fist to log a bug :) | 01:11 |
| owh | s/fist/first/ | 01:11 |
| owh | kiko: I wasn't sure how to actually log a bug, if that's what it is, in such a way that it ended up in the right place. | 01:15 |
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| kiko | owh, launchpad.net/launchpad/+filebug | 01:16 |
| owh | Yes, but as what? | 01:16 |
| kiko | sorry? | 01:16 |
| owh | Sorry, that wasn't that clear :-), let me try again... | 01:17 |
| owh | Describing the bug is fine, but, coming up with a descriptive subject was beyond me. I started with "Incorrect Karma", then "Home page shows incorrect participation", but neither felt correct. | 01:18 |
| owh | And I still don't really know if it is by design or not. | 01:18 |
| owh | Is my dosfstools activity bunched under Ubuntu? | 01:19 |
| kiko | maybe "My contributions to dosfstools are not recorded in karma" | 01:19 |
| kiko | ah! | 01:19 |
| kiko | is dosfstools a package? | 01:19 |
| kiko | if so, then yes it is | 01:19 |
| kiko | though you can get per-package karma by looking at ubuntu/+source/dosfstools | 01:19 |
| owh | Not sure what you mean by the question. | 01:19 |
| kiko | if it's a distribution package. | 01:19 |
| LaserJock | owh: if you are working on a package in Ubuntu it goes under Ubuntu | 01:20 |
| owh | Yes, but so is nedit. | 01:20 |
| owh | So, does that mean that nedit is using launchpad as their bug tracker, but dosfstools is not? | 01:20 |
| kiko | owh, you probably reported something against nedit upstream. | 01:20 |
| owh | I did, the bug was logged there and I linked the two. | 01:20 |
| kiko | right. | 01:22 |
| owh | I'm still unsure what distinguishes the two. I would think that each package would have the same home page as https://launchpad.net/nedit | 01:22 |
| kiko | no | 01:22 |
| kiko | upstream is upstream. a version packaged for a distribution is specific to that distribution. | 01:22 |
| kiko | upstream is what releases tarballs | 01:22 |
| kiko | packages are produced by the distribution team | 01:22 |
| kiko | at large | 01:23 |
| owh | So, https://launchpad.net/nedit represents upstream? | 01:23 |
| kiko | yes. | 01:23 |
| kiko | packages are all under ubuntu/+source | 01:23 |
| owh | But the content of that page does not at all show reality. The bug tracker for nedit has many more bugs. | 01:23 |
| owh | The only content inside the page is Ubuntu stuff. | 01:24 |
| kiko | not exactly | 01:24 |
| === mykas0 [n=me@bl6-205-202.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #launchpad | ||
| mykas0 | hi everyone | 01:25 |
| kiko | they are bugs originally reported against ubuntu, but which were found to be upstream issues. | 01:25 |
| mykas0 | is there any way to get the old Launchpad aspect? | 01:25 |
| kiko | nope. | 01:25 |
| mykas0 | :\ gosh, it is too complicated than the former one | 01:25 |
| owh | The same can be said for the dosfstools. The fact that we fixed bugs resulted in non-maintainer uploads. | 01:25 |
| owh | In fact, I'm not sure if the maintainer is still active. I've yet to receive any response. It is possible that they're snowed under. | 01:26 |
| kiko | owh, that's not recorded in launchpad at least; all that's recorded is that the ubuntu dosfstools packages had issues | 01:26 |
| kiko | this has nothing to do with package maintainership | 01:26 |
| kiko | upstream is upstream | 01:26 |
| kiko | distribution packages are completely separate | 01:26 |
| kiko | and you can push bugs from one to the other | 01:26 |
| kiko | https://bugs.launchpad.net/nedit/+bug/81103 | 01:27 |
| owh | So, how does that work where "upstream" doesn't appear to exist any more? | 01:27 |
| ubotu | Malone bug 81103 in nedit "nedit fails to launch with an X error" [High,Fix released] - Assigned to ville palo (vi64pa) | 01:27 |
| kiko | owh, in that case you have a "native package" | 01:27 |
| kiko | it's something of an oddity but there are some cases | 01:27 |
| kiko | I think casper is like this | 01:28 |
| owh | The friendly ghost? | 01:28 |
| kiko | the livecd building suite that ubuntu uses | 01:28 |
| owh | Ah, I only know of the ghost replacement (ghost script/pdf/ps, etc.) | 01:29 |
| kiko | so the dosfstools upstream has been abandoned? | 01:29 |
| kiko | https://launchpad.net/casper | 01:30 |
| owh | Well, I think it would be presumptuous for me to say yes, but it's beginning to look like that. | 01:30 |
| owh | It might well be that it's being maintained in a completely non-transparent way somewhere else and that I have not yet found that, but I'm not seeing anything that suggests that this is in fact the case. | 01:31 |
| owh | I don't know enough about how processes work within Ubuntu to make a final statement of fact about this. | 01:32 |
| owh | I think it would be completely inappropriate for me to do anything more than suggest what I just did. | 01:32 |
| kiko | owh, I'm not sure I understand you. do you understand that upstream has /nothing/ to do with Ubuntu? | 01:32 |
| owh | I do. | 01:32 |
| kiko | are you talking about the dosfstools package in ubuntu? | 01:33 |
| owh | What I mean is this. | 01:33 |
| kiko | or about the upstream project? | 01:33 |
| owh | No | 01:33 |
| owh | Yes | 01:33 |
| owh | I see no activity. | 01:33 |
| kiko | is there a website or mailing list? | 01:33 |
| kiko | I can't seem to find much about it | 01:33 |
| kiko | who's the original author? | 01:33 |
| owh | Well, nothing that I have seen that does anything. | 01:33 |
| owh | Well, the current maintainer is Roman Hodek. | 01:34 |
| owh | The code was written by several people. | 01:34 |
| owh | Gimmie a mo. | 01:34 |
| kiko | how do they do releases? | 01:34 |
| LaserJock | that assumes they have releases ;-) | 01:34 |
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| owh | The readme talks about v1 alpha and was last updated in 2004. The Changelog was updated in 2005, and talks about the current version, 2.11. | 01:36 |
| LaserJock | the last upstream release in Debian was in 2005 | 01:36 |
| owh | Yeah | 01:36 |
| owh | I suspect that Roman is also part of Debian. | 01:37 |
| LaserJock | so not necessarily dead :-) | 01:37 |
| LaserJock | but mostly dead | 01:37 |
| kiko | ai ai | 01:37 |
| owh | I'm seeing more and more bugs relating to it. | 01:37 |
| owh | What I'm still tracking down is if the bugs are related to the Kernel FAT support, or dosfstools. | 01:38 |
| owh | The code was designed in 1995 when HDD's were much smaller. DVD's didn't exist and 4Gb files were larger than most partitions. | 01:38 |
| LaserJock | in any case, I *think* upstream != LP upstream != Ubuntu package | 01:39 |
| owh | We've fixed several overflow errors, but there seem to be issues with file names and character encodings. | 01:39 |
| LaserJock | so karma can come by working in ubuntu or upstream in LP | 01:39 |
| owh | LaserJock: I think I understand that :) | 01:39 |
| kiko | there is no upstream dosfstools in launchpad, is there? | 01:39 |
| owh | Well, there is a page, but no content. | 01:39 |
| LaserJock | kiko: yes, there's a product for it | 01:40 |
| ubotu | New bug: #102652 in launchpad "Content-Encoding: gzip and Content-type: application/gzipped-tar" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102652 | 01:41 |
| LaserJock | upstream products still confuse me, but there's at least a product page for it | 01:41 |
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| owh | Heh, at least I don't feel so dumb any more :) | 01:42 |
| LaserJock | I just keep my head in Ubuntu | 01:42 |
| owh | That's what I thought I was doing, then I saw Nedit :) | 01:43 |
| owh | See, I should have just left well enough alone :) | 01:43 |
| LaserJock | owh: hehe, well you are the top contributor to nedit | 01:44 |
| owh | ROTFL | 01:44 |
| LaserJock | the *only* contributor | 01:44 |
| LaserJock | but still the top | 01:44 |
| LaserJock | ;-) | 01:44 |
| owh | Now if I had that status for dosfstools, it would be useful :) | 01:44 |
| === owh applies for s/nedit/dosfstools/ in launchpad with tongue firmly planted in cheek. | ||
| owh | FYI, the current "maintainer" page is here: http://www.hodek.net/maintain.html. The page was last updated Feb, 2006. The supposed current source for dosfstools is here: ftp://ftp.uni-erlangen.de/pub/Linux/LOCAL/dosfstools/, but that doesn't seem to respond. | 01:54 |
| owh | To my eye, the project seems abandoned. It appears as if Roman picked it up because it had been abandoned by the previous authors. | 01:55 |
| ubotu | New bug: #102658 in malone "In Feisty, Firefox goes black when playing MPEG in totem-mozilla" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102658 | 02:00 |
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| mpt | Goooooooooooooooooooooood afternoon Launchpadders! | 02:03 |
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| LaserJock | hi mpt | 02:43 |
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| === LaserJock goes to check his daily mpt bug spamming | ||
| ubotu | New bug: #102671 in blueprint "Blueprint lifecycle is expanded by default; looks collapsible but isn't" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102671 | 02:51 |
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| mpt | LaserJock, you get bugspam from me? why? | 03:04 |
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| ubotu | New bug: #102674 in launchpad-answers ""Support Tracker Janitor" is an out-of-date name" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102674 | 03:15 |
| ubotu | New bug: #102676 in malone "Bug comments use the phrase "$user said on $date"" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102676 | 03:26 |
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| Fujitsu | Is there a reason that a Malone search for [can-not-install] or [needs-packaging] in Ubuntu returns results that don't contain the search term? | 03:53 |
| kiko | Fujitsu, search is voodoo | 04:00 |
| Fujitsu | You don't say. | 04:01 |
| Fujitsu | So, um... is there any way to find those bugs, which are some of the more important ones? | 04:03 |
| kiko | there must be | 04:12 |
| kiko | but right now I am so sleepy I can't figure out how | 04:12 |
| kiko | mpt, help? | 04:12 |
| Hobbsee | hi kiko | 04:13 |
| kiko | hi Hobbsee | 04:13 |
| === Hobbsee hands kiko some coffee | ||
| kiko | you are a cruel person | 04:13 |
| kiko | and it is so hot here I am going to die | 04:13 |
| Hobbsee | why? | 04:13 |
| === Hobbsee has a Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - of course she's cruel! | ||
| kiko | if i drink coffee I will never manage to sleep | 04:13 |
| kiko | it is already very hard as it is | 04:13 |
| kiko | damned dna tests! now they have ullrich linked to puerto. sigh. | 04:14 |
| Hobbsee | heh | 04:15 |
| owh | kiko: What temperature are you experiencing? | 04:23 |
| kiko | like 38C | 04:23 |
| kiko | and it's 11:30pm | 04:23 |
| === owh is in Oz with some experience :) | ||
| owh | kiko: I'm guessing no wind. | 04:23 |
| kiko | yeah, something's broken in the climate here this year | 04:23 |
| kiko | it's always lovely in april | 04:24 |
| kiko | wtf is going on. | 04:24 |
| Fujitsu | It should be fine here, but it's like 13 outside. Melbourne has really annoying weather. | 04:24 |
| owh | Well, extremely cold shower will cool your body. Then wet a towel and lay that over the top of you. | 04:24 |
| kiko | heh | 04:24 |
| owh | Extra cooling in the form of a fan over the top of the towel :) | 04:25 |
| jsgotangco | 38C jeezzz | 04:25 |
| owh | I had 38C coming out of the cinema in Kalgoorlie last month, at 10:30 at night, it was an experience :) | 04:25 |
| Hobbsee | nice and warm | 04:25 |
| owh | kiko: What kind of roof do you have? | 04:26 |
| kiko | I don't know how you call this in english | 04:26 |
| owh | An extremely efficient cooling method is to install a sprinkler onto your roof, run it very slowly, the water evaporates, cooling the house dramatically. | 04:26 |
| owh | Of course it does assume access to water, which is not always the case. | 04:27 |
| === owh goes back to fixing bugs. | ||
| === kiko is now known as kiko-zzz | ||
| kiko-zzz | let me try these techniques.. | 04:29 |
| owh | PS, it does assume a humidity less than 100% :) | 04:33 |
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| owh | fabbione: Are you around? | 04:41 |
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| owh | NM | 04:48 |
| mpt | Fujitsu, Launchpad's search doesn't do multiple words well | 05:02 |
| mpt | can-not-install should find "can-not-install" and "can not install" and "can.not/install", but I guess it probably doesn't | 05:02 |
| mpt | but not find "not can install" | 05:03 |
| Fujitsu | I want [can-not-install] to find [can-not-install] , but apparently not. | 05:03 |
| mpt | Please report a bug | 05:03 |
| Fujitsu | Will do. | 05:03 |
| mpt | For bonus points, tweak your example URL so that the bug reports incorrectly returned will continue to be incorrectly returned even after they're fixed/rejected | 05:04 |
| Fujitsu | There are over 1000 returned, so that shouldn't be a problem... | 05:07 |
| ubotu | New bug: #102710 in malone "Unable to search for terms like [can-not-install] " [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102710 | 05:15 |
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| ubotu | New bug: #102714 in launchpad "Distrorelease package app pages should have consistent titles and headings" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102714 | 05:35 |
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| FunnyLookinHat | So the notifications I receive on new members joining my team have a URL in them that doesn't seem to be working... | 05:50 |
| FunnyLookinHat | for example: https://launchpad.net/~coloradoteam/+member/james-nococomp | 05:50 |
| FunnyLookinHat | Returns Page Not Found | 05:50 |
| FunnyLookinHat | Where is the correct place to bug report this? | 05:51 |
| thumper | https://launchpad.net/launchpad | 05:54 |
| thumper | FunnyLookinHat: ^^ | 05:54 |
| FunnyLookinHat | oh figures : P | 05:54 |
| FunnyLookinHat | awesome, it's been reported several times over : ) | 05:55 |
| === Starting logfile irclogs/launchpad.log | ||
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| === Topic for #launchpad: Welcome to the Launchpad 1.0 public beta | Next user meeting: Wed 11 April 2007, 20.00UTC | Next developer meeting: Thu 29 Mar 2007, 1400UTC (wiki:MeetingAgenda) | launchpad-users@lists.canonical.com (wiki:MailingLists) | Channel logs: http://tinyurl.com/72w39 | ||
| === Topic (#launchpad): set by mpt at Mon Apr 2 07:09:32 2007 | ||
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| LaserJock | anybody know what cprov's "normal" working hours are? | 06:07 |
| jml | LaserJock: 11:00-22:00 UTC | 06:09 |
| LaserJock | jml: excellent, thanks | 06:09 |
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| PWill | Just wanted to say I love the new Launchpad! | 06:14 |
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| ubotu | New bug: #102724 in launchpad "Timeline shows incorrect ordering of release numbers" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102724 | 06:31 |
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| jpsamara | Hi I don't know if this is the place to ask, but is there a launchpad like server application that is opensource? | 07:09 |
| LaserJock | the stuff that runs sourceforge is open source | 07:10 |
| LaserJock | that's about as close as I know of | 07:10 |
| thumper | jpsamara: launchpad will become opensource in due course | 07:10 |
| thumper | jpsamara: just don't ask when as I have no idea | 07:10 |
| jpsamara | I'll look into sourceforge, thanks.. I hope launchpad is opensourced... I think that webapps should be opensourced as well and I really like launchpad... | 07:12 |
| jsgotangco | LaserJock: i believe sourceforge is closed sourced now | 07:14 |
| jsgotangco | and there's the GForge fork | 07:14 |
| LaserJock | ah yes, that's what I meant | 07:14 |
| LaserJock | didn't know it was a fork | 07:14 |
| LaserJock | I thought that's what they called it :-) | 07:15 |
| jpsamara | thanks | 07:19 |
| ubotu | New bug: #102731 in launchpad "RCS import form has non-optional optional fields" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102731 | 07:20 |
| jpsamara | anyone know of a good distro management software? something to help manage a distro, when youre building one.... | 07:20 |
| jpsamara | i have seen T2 and LFS but not much | 07:20 |
| jpsamara | more | 07:20 |
| ubotu | New bug: #102732 in rosetta "Allow localization of icons, screenshots, etc" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102732 | 07:25 |
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| orospakr | hey, how does one push into a bzr tree hosted by LP? is ssh available? I can't find it documented anywhere, at least not without creating a project first. | 08:11 |
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| PWill | orospakr: not quite sure what you're asking, but i think you can just use the bazaar client: http://bazaar-vcs.org/ | 08:34 |
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| orospakr | PWill_: well, yes, but Bazaar supports multiple transports. | 08:35 |
| orospakr | some secure, some not. | 08:35 |
| PWill_ | i don't know much about bzr, i've always used svn | 08:36 |
| PWill_ | i'm sure if you can do it with bzr, you can do it with launchpad, though | 08:37 |
| Fujitsu | orospakr: If you look on the branch page on LP, it will give you a URL. | 08:38 |
| orospakr | ah, good idea. | 08:38 |
| Fujitsu | sftp://bazaar.launchpad.net/~someperson/someproduct/somebranch | 08:38 |
| orospakr | sweet. | 08:38 |
| orospakr | (hopefully they'll support bzr smartserver once smartserver stabilizes a bit) | 08:38 |
| jml | orospakr: we certainly intend to. | 08:39 |
| orospakr | I figured. ;) | 08:39 |
| spiv | orospakr: https://help.launchpad.net/BzrHowto | 08:39 |
| spiv | orospakr: also, https://code.launchpad.net/ and click the "Help" tab hidden on the top left side of the page. | 08:41 |
| orospakr | yeah, been there already. | 08:41 |
| orospakr | thanks guys. :) | 08:43 |
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| carlos | morning! | 08:46 |
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| glatzor | carlos: morning. could you take a look at this bug please: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-properties/+bug/97420 | 10:27 |
| ubotu | Malone bug 97420 in software-properties "software-properties-kde crashes in Turkish locale" [Undecided,Confirmed] | 10:27 |
| glatzor | carlos: we cannot locate the error cause | 10:28 |
| carlos | let me see | 10:28 |
| glatzor | could there be a problem in the translation anywhere? | 10:29 |
| glatzor | carlos: sorry, I have to leave now for work. | 10:30 |
| glatzor | see you | 10:30 |
| carlos | yeah, it smells like that | 10:30 |
| carlos | glatzor: don't worry, I will update the bug | 10:30 |
| carlos | glatzor: cheers | 10:30 |
| glatzor | thanks | 10:30 |
| glatzor | carlos: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-properties/+bug/102773 | 10:31 |
| ubotu | Malone bug 102773 in software-properties "l10n broken in the KDE frontend" [Medium,Unconfirmed] - Assigned to Jonathan Riddell (jr) | 10:31 |
| glatzor | there is also another l10n bug in this app | 10:31 |
| glatzor | but since it works for the gtk interface it doesn't seem to be caused by the translaiton | 10:31 |
| carlos | glatzor: I guess that one is just that language packs need more update | 10:31 |
| carlos | oh | 10:32 |
| carlos | maybe | 10:32 |
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| indraveni | mrevell, hi | 12:51 |
| indraveni | mrevell, thankyou for your help | 12:51 |
| indraveni | mrevell, today I received a mail from Elliot | 12:51 |
| mrevell | indraveni: Ah, glad to hear it! | 12:51 |
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| cprov | morning folks | 01:08 |
| G0SUB | indraveni | 01:10 |
| indraveni | G0SUB, yes | 01:10 |
| indraveni | cprov, good morning | 01:10 |
| G0SUB | indraveni: hello :) You form NRCFOSS-CDAC ? | 01:10 |
| indraveni | cprov, did you receive my mail? | 01:10 |
| G0SUB | from | 01:11 |
| indraveni | G0SUB, yes | 01:11 |
| cprov | indraveni: yes. I'm working on it right now. | 01:11 |
| indraveni | cprov, ok thankyou | 01:11 |
| indraveni | G0SUB, why? how do you know me? | 01:12 |
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| tjs | does this function as a launchpad newbie help channel? | 03:00 |
| matsubara | tjs: yes, what's up? | 03:02 |
| tjs | friend of mine works on launchpad, was bugging me to put one of my projects on there, we'll I've created a project and I skip on over to the 'code' tab to create a bzr repo, and all I see is a form which asks for an existing branch URL.. what if I want launchpad to host the whole thing? | 03:04 |
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| tjs | I have no existing branch url | 03:04 |
| mwh | you have to create a local bzr repo, then push it i think | 03:06 |
| tjs | ah | 03:06 |
| mwh | though i now entirely can't find the page which tells your the form of url to push to | 03:09 |
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| matsubara | tjs: you can find the instructions to upload a branch in the help panel, left hand side of the screen | 03:09 |
| mwh | ah, indee | 03:10 |
| tjs | aye, it says simply to use bzr push | 03:10 |
| mwh | d | 03:10 |
| tjs | where to push to? not stated, unless I'm on the wrong help tab | 03:10 |
| mwh | if you go to code.launchpad.net/yourproject , the help tab there has it | 03:11 |
| tjs | ah, I was on the register branch page | 03:11 |
| tjs | my bad | 03:11 |
| tjs | ah much more info, thanks :) | 03:11 |
| mwh | well, launchpad's bad too, imho | 03:11 |
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| === carlos -> lunch | ||
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| BjornT | it's time for this week's non-au reviewer meeting | 04:01 |
| BjornT | == Agenda == | 04:02 |
| BjornT | * Roll call * Next meeting * Queue status. * How are post-merge reviews of rs/trivial commits going? (BjornT for .eu) * Training up reviewers - to discuss (BjornT for .eu) * [fasttrack] (BjornT for .eu) * Doctest style guide (BjornT) | 04:02 |
| BjornT | who's here? | 04:02 |
| flacoste | me | 04:02 |
| salgado | me | 04:03 |
| salgado | * Next meeting | 04:04 |
| salgado | same time next week? | 04:05 |
| sinzui | mr | 04:05 |
| BjornT | sorry. yeah, same time next week. | 04:05 |
| sinzui | me | 04:05 |
| BjornT | == Queue status == | 04:05 |
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| BjornT | the queue looks quite good. | 04:06 |
| BjornT | there are only 5 open reviews | 04:06 |
| BjornT | 3 of them are older than 2 days old | 04:06 |
| salgado | I'm going to do my two today | 04:06 |
| BjornT | cool, that'd be great. | 04:06 |
| BjornT | i'm also going to do mine today. | 04:07 |
| d-arb | hi, who can I speak to about changing the email address i use to log into launchpad? | 04:07 |
| BjornT | == post-merge reviews and fasttrack == | 04:07 |
| BjornT | did you read the meeting summary from monday? | 04:08 |
| salgado | yep, I did | 04:08 |
| flacoste | yes | 04:08 |
| BjornT | it was proposed to add a [fasttrack=approver] tag for pqm | 04:08 |
| BjornT | that would mean that the branch could be landed without review, but it should still be reviewed after it has been merged | 04:09 |
| flacoste | yes, i think that's a good idea, there were quite a few non-trivial merge in the last 1.0 weeks | 04:09 |
| BjornT | what do you think of it? | 04:09 |
| flacoste | which should probably deserve a review | 04:09 |
| spiv | d-arb: https://launchpad.net/people/+me/+editemails | 04:09 |
| salgado | I like that idea too | 04:09 |
| BjornT | yeah, that was the general concensus at the last meeting as well. | 04:10 |
| kiko | consensus. I think it's a good idea. | 04:10 |
| BjornT | it allows branches to get landed quickly, while still keeping track of the review of the branch. | 04:10 |
| d-arb | spiv, the problem is i cannot remember the password for the email address I no longer have access to | 04:10 |
| BjornT | == Reviewer training == | 04:10 |
| d-arb | this is where those "What was your cat's favourite kitten toy" questions are good | 04:11 |
| BjornT | also discussed at the monday meeting was that we need more reviewers, but it's hard to find people that know enough of Launchpad to provide good reviews. | 04:11 |
| BjornT | do you have any suggestions how we can train new reviewers to get up to speed? | 04:12 |
| kiko | so let's think about a process to train promising reviewers | 04:12 |
| kiko | I think we should put together a process for it | 04:12 |
| kiko | maybe co-reviews for two weeks | 04:12 |
| kiko | then an evaluation | 04:12 |
| statik | I'd like to offer my experience here | 04:12 |
| kiko | and an outline document to guide the reviewer into what he should be looking at | 04:12 |
| kiko | we have an outline document I wrote, right? | 04:13 |
| BjornT | kiko: what do you mean by "co-review"? | 04:13 |
| salgado | we tried pre-reviews before, IIRC... the trainee does a first review and then one of the reviewers does an actual review, comparing with the previous one from the trainee | 04:13 |
| kiko | BjornT, an official reviewer plus an unofficial one | 04:13 |
| kiko | yes | 04:13 |
| salgado | kiko, are we talking about the same thing? | 04:14 |
| kiko | yeah | 04:14 |
| statik | salgado: I've used that process before and liked it, when trying to get developers more familiar with a large code base so that they could eventually qualify as reviewers | 04:14 |
| salgado | IMO, it was very time consuming, but mostly because at that time most of the diffs were quite big | 04:14 |
| === statik shuts up now | ||
| BjornT | kiko: ok | 04:14 |
| kiko | statik, no, please offer that experience, it's useful | 04:14 |
| BjornT | another variant of that is to have the new reviewer sending his review to an experienced reviewer for comments, before posting it to the list. | 04:15 |
| salgado | I think that with the current avg size of our diffs, it may work well | 04:15 |
| flacoste | kiko: as outline document we have TipsForReviewers, LaunchpadHackingFAQ and DesignChecklist | 04:15 |
| kiko | Tips For reviewers eh | 04:15 |
| flacoste | they could probably get a review to remove obsolete stuff | 04:16 |
| statik | kiko: so what I found was that for a large code base where there is a lack of experienced reviewers, the best way to get people that experience is to require them to start doing reviews. simply trying it, along with a checklist, and then looking over what the official review contained, helps devs make rapid progress in their reviewing ability | 04:16 |
| statik | I used to require every developer to review two bugs fixes for every bug they fixed - the ratio/quota may be totally different here, but the idea is that you explicitly encourage people to develop those skills | 04:17 |
| BjornT | kiko: do you remember where you wrote that outline? i also recall you writing something like that. | 04:18 |
| radix | http://twistedmatrix.com/trac/wiki/ReviewProcess | 04:19 |
| kiko | BjornT, isn't it TipsForReviewers? | 04:19 |
| radix | (as another example) | 04:19 |
| BjornT | kiko: TipsForReviewers doesn't really explain what the reviewer should look for in the diff. | 04:20 |
| kiko | humm | 04:20 |
| radix | the bullet point starting with "A reviewer must reject a set of changes in any of the following circumstances:" is a very helpful list, I've found | 04:20 |
| kiko | I recall having written something that said "Look for missing requirements" | 04:21 |
| statik | here is a draft of the MySQL code reviewers checklist http://forge.mysql.com/wiki/CodeReviewProcess | 04:23 |
| statik | I would love to see things like XSS and CSRF mentioned in a reviewers checklist | 04:24 |
| BjornT | ok, so we should definitely have a reviewers checklist, so that new reviewers can know what they should look for in a review. | 04:26 |
| BjornT | i'll give the mysql and twisted examples to lifeless | 04:27 |
| kiko | cool. | 04:27 |
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| BjornT | == Doctest style guide == | 04:28 |
| BjornT | in a review for ddaa, he asked me if the indentation style in doctests was documented anywhere. | 04:28 |
| BjornT | i couldn't find any document talking about how doctests should be structured, and we should have such a document. | 04:29 |
| BjornT | any volunteers for writing it? | 04:29 |
| salgado | any reason for it to be different than the actual source code? | 04:29 |
| flacoste | i put that on my todo list a while back | 04:29 |
| flacoste | after repeating several times the same comment regarding the pagetest and doctest style | 04:29 |
| flacoste | so I can definitively do it | 04:29 |
| BjornT | flacoste: cool, thanks! | 04:30 |
| salgado | can't we just say: use the same style we use for python code, but all python statements should be indented with 4 spaces? | 04:30 |
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| kiko | salgado, what about headings etc | 04:31 |
| kdefreak | hmm.... when running bzr push sftp://ryanakca@bazaar.launchpad.net/~ryanakca/kcypher/trunk , I get: | 04:31 |
| flacoste | there are also things to be said about the narrative style | 04:31 |
| salgado | well, that was just to answer ddaa's question about indentation | 04:31 |
| kdefreak | bzr: ERROR: Lock was broken while still open: LockDir(sftp://ryanakca@bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Eryanakca/kcypher/trunk/.bzr/branch/lock) - check storage consistency! ... what do I do? | 04:31 |
| flacoste | i.e. Death to "Test this", "check that"... | 04:32 |
| BjornT | yeah, the document should talk about how to write doctests in general, not just code style in test examples. | 04:32 |
| BjornT | salgado: it's not clear that the code examples should be indented by 4 spaces, but i think that makes the most sense. | 04:33 |
| BjornT | it'd be good to check what the majority of our doctest uses, though. | 04:33 |
| BjornT | == Other business == | 04:34 |
| BjornT | anything else? | 04:34 |
| matsubara | I have one BjornT | 04:34 |
| flacoste | BjornT: many uses 4, many uses 2 and some use none | 04:34 |
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| matsubara | I'd like to ask that asserts in the code should always have a message with what is being asserted. It helps group oops together and I can see in a glace what's going on | 04:34 |
| salgado | BjornT, right, that's why I suggested we should explicitely say that | 04:34 |
| matsubara | Oopses like this one: https://devpad.canonical.com/~matsubara/oops.cgi/2007-04-03/B166 | 04:34 |
| flacoste | matsubara: we already check that | 04:34 |
| salgado | matsubara, that's already a requirement. see AssertionsInLaunchpad | 04:34 |
| matsubara | ah great | 04:35 |
| matsubara | thanks | 04:35 |
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| matsubara | * Where it is totally obvious what the rationale is, the explanation string should be omited. | 04:36 |
| matsubara | well this part is the one I don't agree. having a explanation string helps group the oops together. | 04:37 |
| BjornT | i think it wouldn't hurt to always require an explanation message for this reason. | 04:37 |
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| === flacoste forgot that the explanation message was optional | ||
| flacoste | i always require it | 04:38 |
| BjornT | kiko, SteveA: would it be ok to change AssertionsInLaunchpad to always require a rationale, to help grouping oops? | 04:38 |
| kiko | sure. | 04:38 |
| kiko | include the rationale | 04:38 |
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| BjornT | ok, i'll change AssertionsInLaunchpad. | 04:40 |
| BjornT | meeting ended. thanks everyone! | 04:40 |
| kiko | enjoy | 04:40 |
| matsubara | thanks BjornT | 04:41 |
| salgado | thanks BjornT | 04:41 |
| flacoste | Thanks BjornT | 04:41 |
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| SteveA | I saw some code fly past in a review | 04:43 |
| SteveA | something like | 04:43 |
| SteveA | assert permission == 'zope.Public' | 04:43 |
| SteveA | permission = checkerPublic | 04:43 |
| SteveA | any idea where I saw that? | 04:44 |
| flacoste | SteveA: that was kiko's suggestion | 04:44 |
| flacoste | to one of my branch | 04:44 |
| flacoste | i declined the suggestion and simply remove the possibility to configure the permission | 04:44 |
| flacoste | i always use CheckerPublic | 04:44 |
| kiko | I didn't know what I was talking about | 04:44 |
| SteveA | ok. cos that's kind of a security risk | 04:45 |
| SteveA | in that if we ever run in -O mode | 04:45 |
| kiko | right | 04:45 |
| SteveA | (which oddly enough, the Zope 3 development people recommend :-/) | 04:45 |
| SteveA | and also have a more restrictive permission set | 04:45 |
| kiko | they must have access to a good dealer | 04:45 |
| SteveA | it will silently overwrite it | 04:45 |
| SteveA | the standard way to remove the ++debug++ namespace is to run with -O | 04:45 |
| SteveA | this means that most zope3 apps running in production are leaking their page template code | 04:46 |
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| carlos | cheers | 06:00 |
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| vittico | hi guys! | 07:27 |
| vittico | i wanted to ask just one simple question, is there anyway to make a local install of launchpad? | 07:27 |
| vittico | is there anyplace where i could download launchpad and run a local copy? | 07:28 |
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| LaserJock | vittico: no | 07:28 |
| vittico | LaserJock, ok.. :) thanks! sooo in order to use i must first register | 07:29 |
| vittico | and use the online version | 07:29 |
| LaserJock | yep | 07:29 |
| LaserJock | simple questions, simple answers :-) | 07:30 |
| vittico | :) thanks | 07:30 |
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| jenda | Hello | 07:39 |
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| === jenda waves at the familiar faces | ||
| jenda | Why is my hackergotchi totally stretched? https://launchpad.net/~jenda | 07:40 |
| jenda | Is it because I'm not really a hacker? Should I report it as a bug? | 07:40 |
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| jenda | (i know it wouldn't be if I resized the image to the size LP asks for, but it _should_ be able to keep it straight, shouldn't it?) | 07:41 |
| radix | New bug: jenda is not really a hacker | 07:41 |
| jenda | :) | 07:42 |
| LaserJock | jenda: I think there's already a bug report for that | 07:43 |
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| jenda | Good... | 07:44 |
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| jenda | kiko: damn, these canonical employees without cloaks... looks really bad ;) | 07:45 |
| jenda | And the idea of, for example, mneptok running around naked... | 07:45 |
| === jenda runs and hides | ||
| kiko | jenda, hey! am I the one blocking this from happening? | 07:48 |
| jenda | kiko: yes :) | 07:50 |
| kiko | jenda, don't say that! | 07:50 |
| jenda | kiko: all I need is one word from you and you have a cloak | 07:50 |
| kiko | jenda, one word | 07:50 |
| jenda | sweet :) | 07:50 |
| jenda | the format is canonical/*/primarynick | 07:50 |
| jenda | you can either leave it at canonical/kiko for everyone, or you can put more info in there. | 07:51 |
| kiko | jenda, I'd rather not everybody was marked as /kiko | 07:51 |
| jenda | hmm | 07:51 |
| kiko | I am a bit into myself but not that much | 07:51 |
| jenda | Well, i can manage that, i guess. | 07:51 |
| LaserJock | kiko: :-) | 07:52 |
| kiko | LaserJock! | 07:52 |
| jenda | kiko: basically, ... argh. | 07:53 |
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| jenda | kiko: basically, you will need to ask a staffer to add every single cloak, and you'll have to decide if you want something between @canonical and /kiko | 07:54 |
| jenda | I am one such staffer ;) | 07:54 |
| kiko | okay, let me privmsg you | 07:55 |
| === jenda lets kiko privmsg him | ||
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| Rinchen | jenda, don't beat up kiko to badly. I need him fit for work later. ;-) | 08:16 |
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| bahadunn | howdy | 08:50 |
| bahadunn | I try to use my email server but I get errors about TLS | 08:50 |
| bahadunn | setting up TLS connection from adelie.ubuntu.com[82.211.81.139] | 08:50 |
| bahadunn | SSL_accept:before/accept initialization | 08:50 |
| bahadunn | read from 080B6E38 [080C0528] (11 bytes => -1 (0xFFFFFFFF)) | 08:50 |
| bahadunn | SSL_accept:error in SSLv2/v3 read client hello A | 08:51 |
| bahadunn | initializing the server-side TLS engine | 08:51 |
| === mdke blinks | ||
| bahadunn | any ideas | 08:51 |
| bahadunn | ? | 08:51 |
| mdke | bahadunn: you might want another channel? | 08:51 |
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| bahadunn | never seen that before | 08:51 |
| bahadunn | ah ok | 08:51 |
| bahadunn | I was led to believe there might be administrators here from the webpages | 08:52 |
| bahadunn | I guess not though | 08:52 |
| bahadunn | sorry for the mistake | 08:52 |
| mdke | what task are you trying to do? | 08:52 |
| bahadunn | trying to register | 08:52 |
| mdke | for Launchpad? | 08:52 |
| bahadunn | ill email the ubuntu launchpad admins | 08:52 |
| bahadunn | yeah | 08:52 |
| mdke | ah, then perhaps you are in the right place, I thought you wanted help for your email server | 08:53 |
| bahadunn | no | 08:53 |
| bahadunn | I want to know why my server will not accept the mail from the launchpad | 08:53 |
| bahadunn | I want to fix it if it is a problem on my side so I can get mail from launchpad | 08:54 |
| bahadunn | or report it so it can be fixed on launchpad's side if it is a problem on that end | 08:54 |
| mdke | I see | 08:54 |
| mdke | well, I don't know what is causing the error. hang around and see if anyone else does. If not you can try mailing the launchpad-users mailing list | 08:54 |
| bahadunn | ok | 08:55 |
| bahadunn | thanks | 08:55 |
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| kiko | bahadunn, one option is joining #canonical-sysadmin and taking the matter up there | 09:15 |
| bahadunn | ok | 09:16 |
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| ubotu | New bug: #102796 in rosetta "Template update request doesn't shows up in import queue" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102796 | 10:41 |
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| ubotu | New bug: #43545 in rosetta ""need review" items not shown" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/43545 | 10:56 |
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