=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:ubotu] : Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 12 Apr 20:00 UTC: MOTU | 12 Apr 20:00 UTC: Development Team | 12 Apr 21:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 13 Apr 20:00 UTC: Forum Council | 17 Apr 15:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 17 Apr 20:00 UTC: Community Council | ||
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pitti | hi | 10:56 |
---|---|---|
fabbione | yo | 10:56 |
BlueT_ | :) | 10:57 |
dholbach | hiya | 10:57 |
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mdz_ | it seems that about half the keyboard shortcuts in xchat close the application or a tab | 10:57 |
seb128 | mdz_: use the other half then :p | 10:58 |
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mdz | cjwatson,Keybuk: is everyone here who's expected? | 10:59 |
heno | here | 11:00 |
Riddell | hi | 11:00 |
asac | i am here ... in case i am expected ;) | 11:00 |
kwwii | hi | 11:00 |
iwj | Hello everyone ... | 11:00 |
mvo | hello | 11:00 |
doko | seems to be a slow start today =) | 11:01 |
cjwatson | BenC said he wanted to be here, but he may have keeled over with exhaustion | 11:01 |
Keybuk | mdz: yes | 11:01 |
fabbione | it's also 3/4am there | 11:01 |
cjwatson | everyone else is here | 11:01 |
cjwatson | fabbione: he was aware of that | 11:01 |
mdz | fabbione: 5, but wasn't expecting him at this meeting | 11:02 |
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pitti | I saw him an hour ago | 11:02 |
mdz | BenC: good morning | 11:02 |
fabbione | here he is | 11:02 |
cjwatson | 00:47 <BenC> would this meeting be opportune time to discuss the kernel upload? | 11:02 |
cjwatson | 00:47 <cjwatson> I certainly won't hold it against you if you aren't there, as long as I have all the information needed to represent kernel interests | 11:02 |
cjwatson | 00:47 <cjwatson> yes | 11:02 |
cjwatson | 00:47 <BenC> then I'll make it | 11:02 |
cjwatson | aha | 11:02 |
BenC | good morning | 11:02 |
mdz | so, welcome everyone. thanks for being available even though this was a bit last-minute | 11:02 |
mdz | the release is creeping up on us, and I think we're a little bit behind where we ought to be right now, so it seemed wise to get everyone together to go over the outstanding issues | 11:03 |
mdz | Keybuk and Mithrandir have been reviewing our progress | 11:03 |
mdz | Keybuk: would you give an overview of where we stand? | 11:04 |
Keybuk | Current status is that the release candidate images prepared yesterday had several problems with them | 11:04 |
Keybuk | notably things like the "About Ubuntu" menu option being missing | 11:04 |
pitti | #105593 :( | 11:04 |
Keybuk | and /etc/lsb, /etc/issue, etc. all being wrong | 11:04 |
pitti | ^ is the worst one I found | 11:05 |
seb128 | about ubuntu, launchpad integration have been fixed yesterday | 11:05 |
seb128 | bug #105593 | 11:05 |
Mithrandir | seb128: and accepted into the archive this morning. | 11:05 |
Keybuk | we also haven't performed several of the steps leading to the candidate, including hardware certification testing | 11:05 |
seb128 | Mithrandir: rock on | 11:05 |
Keybuk | fabbione: I believe you've got that started now? | 11:05 |
mdz | (incidentally, is anyone else having trouble with firefox stalling for a very long time at "Connecting to launchpad.net..."?) | 11:05 |
ubotu | Malone bug 105593 in restricted-manager "claims that nvidia is in use on live system" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/105593 | 11:05 |
fabbione | Keybuk: yes already started. we got only one bug so far | 11:05 |
Keybuk | mdz: yes, problem is at LP end | 11:05 |
seb128 | mdz: yeah, it's really really really slow since yesterday :/ | 11:06 |
fabbione | Keybuk: i think Marc has almost completed the first round | 11:06 |
mdz | pitti: the lrm change fixes the immediate problem, right? | 11:07 |
asac | mdz: what do you mean by stalled? like no redraw of ui ... or just waiting for server? | 11:07 |
pitti | mdz: right, there are actually two problems | 11:07 |
pitti | (1) r-m warns you about non-free drivers being in use, taints kernel, prone to raise political discussions | 11:07 |
pitti | (2) as soon as an user actually enables nvidia, it is going to break their X because of ABI incompatibility (except if they have a very *very* new card which is not supported by nvidia-glx) | 11:07 |
mdz | asac: I did some packet level debugging which I posted to the launchpad list; let's talk about it later | 11:07 |
asac | mdz: k | 11:07 |
pitti | mdz: thus we would break many X.orgs instead of showing off compiz&co for nvidia users :( | 11:08 |
Mithrandir | pitti: but the lrm fix in the queue fixes this, right? | 11:08 |
pitti | right | 11:08 |
pitti | it's not built yet, though | 11:08 |
Mithrandir | I'm driving the publisher by hand now | 11:09 |
pitti | but I saw that the source is in the archive | 11:09 |
pitti | 'no builds recorded' instead of 'needs build', hmm | 11:09 |
mdz | fabbione: is there any estimate of how long the cert tests will take | 11:10 |
fabbione | mdz: Marc is working hard to catch up. he promised to be as fast as he can, but no numbers for an ETA | 11:10 |
fabbione | mdz: i expect at least another day | 11:10 |
pitti | so, we have the l-r-m problem, the hwdb notification, about ubuntu menu items, lsb; we can probably live with any single one of them, but all together look really bad IMHO | 11:10 |
mdz | fabbione: I think it is irrelevant for now; either there will be no problems discovered and we can release, or there will be problems and we'll need to delay | 11:11 |
fabbione | mdz: as i said.. one bug found so far in n-m already reported by other people. I will be able to tell you more in a few hours when Montreal wakes up | 11:12 |
fabbione | mdz: i didn't know about the meeting till this morning, otherwise i would have gathered more info | 11:12 |
seb128 | pitti: hwdb and about ubuntu are supposed to be fixed now, no? | 11:12 |
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pitti | seb128: right, should be in the archive | 11:13 |
mdz | fabbione: bug number? | 11:13 |
Mithrandir | seb128: they are, if you run apt-get update. | 11:13 |
seb128 | Mithrandir: ok, just making sure because pitti listed them | 11:13 |
Mithrandir | note however that ubuntu-docs still have "feisty fawn" in them in some places. | 11:13 |
fabbione | mdz: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/105688 | 11:13 |
pitti | seb128: argh, no, hwdb-client is still the old one | 11:13 |
Mithrandir | (with the version numbers, mind, so it's less bad) | 11:13 |
ubotu | Malone bug 105688 in network-manager "NetworkManager applet shows No network connection when there is a network connection (dup-of: 105234)" [Undecided,Needs info] | 11:13 |
ubotu | Malone bug 105234 in network-manager "Netowrk manager says disconnected but is connected and working" [Medium,Confirmed] | 11:13 |
seb128 | that's network-manager change is confusing a lot of users | 11:14 |
seb128 | that network-manager change | 11:14 |
Mithrandir | seb128: but it's confusing them rather than leaving them with broken networks. | 11:14 |
sladen | NM is teh rock. | 11:14 |
pitti | seb128: red herring, drescher has the new hwdb-client, so that's fixed as well | 11:14 |
ogra | sladen, the rock we all get buried under ? | 11:14 |
seb128 | Mithrandir: how hard would it be to display no icon when it's not used? | 11:15 |
Mithrandir | seb128: probably doable. I'll look into it. | 11:15 |
seb128 | would be great | 11:15 |
ogra | seb128, it already does that if i shut down my WLAN (but keep the static iface up) | 11:15 |
ogra | as soon as i load the bcm module again, its back | 11:15 |
ogra | so juat abusing that function could probably work | 11:16 |
cjwatson | Mithrandir: could the n-m bug be due to your most recent change? | 11:16 |
Mithrandir | cjwatson: yes, and while the confusion isn't intentional, it is behaving correctly. | 11:17 |
Mithrandir | so we need to address the confusion. | 11:17 |
cjwatson | Mithrandir: is there an explanation in the bug of the confusion? | 11:17 |
seb128 | cjwatson: network-manager does the right thing, it says there is no network configured though | 11:17 |
seb128 | which means is not managing any | 11:18 |
Mithrandir | what seb says. | 11:18 |
seb128 | but have an icon saying "no network configured" confuses users | 11:18 |
cjwatson | the bug above only has confused comments from users, AFAICS | 11:18 |
cjwatson | it needs an authoritative comment from somebody who understands what is going on | 11:18 |
seb128 | because there is a network configured and working | 11:18 |
heno | I tested it with my father. He was slightly confused, but shrugged when the network worked anyway | 11:19 |
Mithrandir | there seems to be a real bug related to the "disable networking" menu item, I need to investigate what's the problem there. | 11:20 |
fabbione | wouldn't be possible to change the string to match reality? | 11:20 |
fabbione | like: "hey dude.. i can't manage your setup. kthxbye" | 11:20 |
Mithrandir | fabbione: it would break translations, but otherwise that's a possibility. | 11:20 |
fabbione | we can always unbreak them with langpacks update | 11:20 |
fabbione | it's probably the less intrusive change we can do | 11:21 |
heno | yes, the string is more confusing than the icon | 11:21 |
fabbione | dunno how many langs that string is translated, but i am pretty sure we can fix the major ones within the team | 11:21 |
seb128 | fabbione: what's wrong with hiding the icon when there is nothing to manage? | 11:22 |
seb128 | that doesn't break any string | 11:22 |
heno | 'Please replug your network cable' would work, because that 'fixes' it for the session :) | 11:22 |
mdz | heno: how does that fix it? | 11:22 |
pitti | seb128: but you'd lose the menu entry for static configuration or enabling wlan, etc. | 11:22 |
fabbione | seb128: nothing.. you need to change code and possibly add other regressions | 11:22 |
iwj | BenC: Is bug 99648 the same as bug 53268 ? | 11:22 |
cjwatson | heno: sounds more specific than the problem in fact indicates? | 11:22 |
mdz | this isn't the time to think about redesigning the UI | 11:22 |
seb128 | pitti: can you enable wlan when there is not connexion managed? | 11:22 |
ubotu | Malone bug 99648 in linux-source-2.6.20 "MMC/SD memory card reader does not work" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/99648 | 11:22 |
ubotu | Malone bug 53268 in hal "On Thinkpad X60s and Z60 SD card reader doesn't work" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/53268 | 11:22 |
heno | mdz: if you unplu and replug ethernet it behaves as expected until you reboot | 11:23 |
pitti | seb128: if you disabled it before, then you'll be in that situation | 11:23 |
mdz | it seems there is a genuine issue, but we ought not rush in a poorly thought out change | 11:23 |
mdz | heno: why? I thought in this situation, n-m was ignoring the interface | 11:23 |
pitti | disabling wlan temporarily should not cause the icon to go away | 11:23 |
heno | I think it ignores it bacause the network is brought up during boot, before n-m | 11:23 |
heno | if you 'let n-m find it' it's happy | 11:24 |
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mdz | heno: but if it's already being managed by ifupdown, that would result in confusion (like two dhclients) | 11:25 |
Mithrandir | mdz: except the fact that network-manager kills it as part of its startup. | 11:26 |
Mithrandir | void nm_system_kill_all_dhcp_daemons (void) | 11:27 |
Mithrandir | { nm_spawn_process ("/usr/bin/killall -q dhclient"); | 11:27 |
Mithrandir | } | 11:27 |
mdz | ... | 11:27 |
heno | Mithrandir: so when it does that it should also set a flag so it remembers to check for an active network later | 11:27 |
mdz | what a piece of work | 11:27 |
fabbione | Mithrandir: and it doesn't always work because sometime we spawn dhclient3 | 11:27 |
Keybuk | Mithrandir: isn't it dhclient3? | 11:28 |
ogra | Mithrandir, could you call that nm_system_kill_all_dhcp_client ?? | 11:28 |
Mithrandir | fabbione: we can kill those too. | 11:28 |
Mithrandir | ogra: no. | 11:28 |
fabbione | Mithrandir: we should | 11:28 |
ogra | Mithrandir, thats confusing :) | 11:28 |
Mithrandir | ogra: I'm not going to change the name of NM-internal interfaces. | 11:28 |
fabbione | ogra: no you can't. the nm backends export a standard API towards the rest | 11:28 |
cjwatson | Mithrandir: n-m ubuntu5 was a further fix for the problem with people with manually configured interfaces having trouble with n-m claiming they were offline, yes? | 11:28 |
Treenaks | what if n-m only manages one of several DHCP interfaces? | 11:29 |
ogra | Mithrandir, oh, i thought it was a new function ... ignore me :)= | 11:29 |
Mithrandir | cjwatson: it was a revert to the ubuntu3 behaviour, except we don't claim to be offline if there are disabled devices available. | 11:29 |
cjwatson | Mithrandir: remind me, was there a bug about that? | 11:30 |
Mithrandir | and then the applet is patched to check both the online/offline status and the number of devices managed. If the number of managed devices is zero, it goes into "we are offline" mode. | 11:30 |
Mithrandir | cjwatson: yes, it broke LTSP setups for instance. | 11:30 |
Mithrandir | let me find the bug # | 11:30 |
cjwatson | we should have a policy that late changes must have a bug# referenced in the changelog | 11:31 |
ogra | cjwatson, it hogged static interfaces that are configured in /e/n/i and teared them down because NM allows only one iface to be up | 11:31 |
Keybuk | Mithrandir: why do you kill dhclient, rather than invoke ifdown? | 11:31 |
fabbione | Keybuk: that's what upstream does in all backends IIRC | 11:32 |
fabbione | Keybuk: you don't want to call ifdown because the interface might be in use for nfs mounts | 11:32 |
fabbione | Keybuk: just take over the dhcp process | 11:32 |
Keybuk | redhat don't have something quite like our ifup though | 11:32 |
Mithrandir | Keybuk: I believe that code is either from upstream or from you, I haven't written it. | 11:32 |
Keybuk | since ifdown won't work for that interface after you kill its dhclient | 11:32 |
Mithrandir | cjwatson: 100021 | 11:32 |
cjwatson | thanks | 11:33 |
cjwatson | BenC: are you still awake? | 11:34 |
fabbione | am i still connected? | 11:37 |
seb128 | fabbione: yes | 11:37 |
fabbione | thanks | 11:37 |
mvo | fabbione: no | 11:37 |
Mithrandir | I could make it use the connected icon and change the tooltip if there are manual devices, would that be good enough? | 11:41 |
ogra | sounds like | 11:41 |
ogra | as long as it doesnt *always* show the connected icon then at least :) | 11:41 |
Mithrandir | ogra: it'll always show it if you have manually configured devices. | 11:42 |
heno | Mithrandir: by manual, do you mean eth0 or static IP? | 11:42 |
ogra | thats fine | 11:42 |
ogra | heno, static ip and auto in /e/n/i | 11:42 |
heno | this problem occurs with dhcp too | 11:42 |
heno | which is the most common for basic users | 11:43 |
Mithrandir | heno: anything not managed by NM. | 11:43 |
ogra | you mean if /e/n/i is empty ? | 11:43 |
heno | ok, that will work then | 11:43 |
ogra | then it shouldnt happen ... | 11:43 |
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cjwatson | so we have a possible proposal to skip release candidate and release Herd 6 instead | 11:44 |
cjwatson | at this point, if we have to delay release candidate, there'll be very little time to squeeze in validation | 11:44 |
mdz | we need to hear from Ben about these kernel bugs | 11:45 |
mdz | the changes which are proposed are too intrusive for 7 days before release | 11:45 |
cjwatson | so Herd 6 would be a much-less-validated set of images | 11:45 |
mdz | so if the problems are truly showstoppers, then we are looking at a delay of the release | 11:45 |
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fabbione | what kind of delay we are talking about? | 11:45 |
fabbione | one week? two weeks? | 11:45 |
mdz | today was the first I had heard of these issues | 11:45 |
mdz | fabbione: unknown | 11:45 |
cjwatson | HPA has been on the table for some time and Ben has tested the patch on his array of non-HPA hardware | 11:46 |
mdz | fabbione: this change is proposing to switch to an entirely different IDE driver for a huge proportion of Intel based systesm | 11:46 |
mdz | (bug 96857) | 11:46 |
cjwatson | the PIIX thing I think we should drop | 11:46 |
ubotu | Malone bug 96857 in linux-source-2.6.20 "Feisty Beta: debian-installer does not mount cdrom" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/96857 | 11:46 |
mdz | so we have: | 11:47 |
mdz | kernel issues: we will have a talk with Ben when he wakes up and review those | 11:48 |
mdz | network-manager: Keybuk is looking over the patches and doing some further analysis | 11:48 |
mdz | what else is on the table? | 11:48 |
fabbione | server installer issues: Keybuk is on it already. bug #105623 | 11:48 |
ubotu | Malone bug 105623 in devmapper "udev rules missing from udeb" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/105623 | 11:49 |
mdz | certification: we will await results, and have to decide on whether to delay if there are problems | 11:49 |
mdz | (fabio tracking) | 11:49 |
mdz | fabbione: this is a showstopper? | 11:49 |
mvo | I would like to add additional sanity checking into the release upgrader for python, but that should not be controversal I hope? | 11:49 |
fabbione | mdz: for RC no (would be enough a release note). For final yes | 11:49 |
Mithrandir | fabbione: fwiw, it just worked fine for me. | 11:50 |
mdz | fabbione: note that there is unlikely to be an RC unless we delay | 11:50 |
fabbione | Mithrandir: it works.. it only takes ages to work.. so if you don't look at it and go back after a while you don't even notice | 11:50 |
Mithrandir | fabbione: ok. | 11:50 |
fabbione | Mithrandir: it's about waiting 3 minutes for each devmapper device to be created | 11:51 |
mdz | mvo: for the CDs? | 11:51 |
fabbione | mdz: yeah of course.. | 11:51 |
cjwatson | just adding those rules to the udeb stands a good chance of breaking the partitioner. I'd veto that. | 11:51 |
cjwatson | (because it would bring LVs/whatever up by default which the partitioner isn't expecting) | 11:51 |
mvo | mdz: having it on the CD is a bonus, but if its available online that should be fine | 11:51 |
fabbione | cjwatson: they are the exact same rules that lands in the installed system | 11:51 |
cjwatson | fabbione: the installed system is different in important ways | 11:52 |
doko | mdz: bug 105642, bug 105828 | 11:52 |
cjwatson | release note and point release if we can get the change tested. It's annoying, but fixing it is very risky | 11:52 |
ubotu | Malone bug 105642 in linux-source-2.6.20 "kernel panic starting edubuntu dvd in live mode with VGA" [High,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/105642 | 11:52 |
ubotu | Malone bug 105828 in Ubuntu "wrong keyboard layout after LTSP chroot install" [Undecided,Unconfirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/105828 | 11:52 |
Mithrandir | while it's annoying, I don't think it's a showstopper either. | 11:52 |
fabbione | cjwatson: i think Keybuk can tell you more about the status | 11:53 |
mdz | doko: you are saying that these are showstopper bugs? | 11:53 |
cjwatson | fabbione: I've already spoken with Scott about this. | 11:53 |
fabbione | cjwatson: ok | 11:53 |
cjwatson | keyboard layout> totally not release-critical. dpkg-reconfigure console-setup | 11:53 |
ogra | mdz, i'm not yet sure 105828 is a valid one, i havent seen it in any installs here | 11:53 |
doko | mdz: well, a kernel panic for the default install? IMO rc for the final; the edubuntu install not. | 11:53 |
ogra | mdz, doko and i are still investigating | 11:54 |
mdz | doko: I'm asking you; you just gave bug numbers without context | 11:54 |
ogra | doko, the panic doesnt happen witjh the CD here | 11:54 |
mdz | doko: a kernel panic under what circumstances? | 11:54 |
ogra | mdz, framebuffer | 11:54 |
ogra | it immediatley dies if it tries frambuffer stuff | 11:54 |
ogra | i.e. directly after gfxboot | 11:55 |
doko | mdz: 105642: insert the edubuntu amd64 dvd, let it boot alone. | 11:55 |
ogra | it either is specific to dokos HW or to the DVD | 11:55 |
ogra | i dont see it on two different machines with the CD | 11:55 |
doko | ogra: I can recheck with another DVD, but not other hardware | 11:55 |
Mithrandir | I can check it here once I finish downloading the edubuntu dvd | 11:56 |
heno | I have the Edubuntu DVD, I'll check too | 11:57 |
mdz | surely this is not specific to edubuntu | 11:57 |
ogra | doko, i find it weird that you have so many bugs i dont see anywhere else ... | 11:57 |
mdz | if it is, it's even less potentially serious | 11:57 |
ogra | especially the keyboard thing i see no technical way how that could happen | 11:57 |
mdz | it's easy enough to test, should not be hardware-specific | 11:58 |
cjwatson | I'm burning an Ubuntu amd64 DVD now | 11:58 |
ogra | mdz, still i'm missing a logical explanation how a setting in a chroot can influence a confiog file on the host system | 11:59 |
cjwatson | ogra: it's not release-critical. please worry about it later | 11:59 |
cjwatson | we do not have time to get into extensive research regarding non-release-critical problems | 11:59 |
ogra | cjwatson, well ... having all edubuntu installs with US keyboard is something i'd see as RC | 11:59 |
cjwatson | I disagree | 11:59 |
cjwatson | you can reconfigure it trivially, and furthermore you already said it's not happening to you | 12:00 |
ogra | 80% of your users are non english | 12:00 |
cjwatson | unless you feel that your testing is in some way inadequate? | 12:00 |
ogra | not really ... it worked the last releases :) | 12:00 |
cjwatson | I'm not dismissing doko's problem, but I do think that it is not something to delay release for | 12:01 |
ogra | if i start seeing it too i'd consider it for edubuntu | 12:01 |
ogra | but i dont (yet ?) so this discussion is pointless | 12:02 |
mdz | ok, so we have a current direction for each of the outstanding issues I mentioned | 12:03 |
mdz | last call for other issues we need to be aware of for release | 12:03 |
pitti | bug 104602? | 12:04 |
mdz | we are in a delicate state right now, and it's important to know how serious it is | 12:04 |
ubotu | Malone bug 104602 in sysvinit "root password visible at emergency console" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/104602 | 12:04 |
pitti | can be fixed in a security update as well, though | 12:04 |
fabbione | ah so i was not the only one | 12:04 |
fabbione | that's also with upstart | 12:04 |
pitti | it's an usplash bug really | 12:05 |
Mithrandir | mdz: were you able to reproduce the NM resume from hibernate problem? | 12:05 |
pitti | it's not a release blocker, but important IMHO | 12:05 |
fabbione | mdz: there is a bug in multipath-tools but i already uploaded the fixed version. it's not worth more discussion here. | 12:05 |
Keybuk | pitti: we don't set root passwords by default, and you have to be at the console anyway | 12:06 |
kwwii | not a show stopper, but I was hoping to finish a usplash/CD install pic for Xubuntu | 12:06 |
Keybuk | definitely not stopping the show ;) | 12:06 |
mdz | pitti: definitely a serious issue which should be fixed | 12:06 |
mdz | pitti: but I think it can be a security update | 12:06 |
cjwatson | CD install images can go in very late, usplash less so | 12:06 |
kwwii | is that still possible? | 12:06 |
pitti | I agree, but you wanted to be aware of important issues, so I thought I'd mention it | 12:06 |
mdz | pitti: thanks | 12:06 |
kwwii | cjwatson: in any case, it should be done by tomorrow at the latest - if it is too late, so be it | 12:07 |
mdz | if you don't have a release-critical task to work on, please join #ubuntu-bugs | 12:08 |
mdz | and help keep an eye out for unexpected issues as they arise | 12:08 |
mdz | if you discover something which looks serious, please talk to Colin, Scott or myself | 12:09 |
mdz | there will be further communication about the kernel, certification and other outstanding issues as it is available | 12:09 |
pitti | so, will we get new RC images? | 12:09 |
fabbione | or Herd-6? | 12:09 |
fabbione | what's the consensum now? | 12:09 |
pitti | well, it's just a name | 12:09 |
mdz | we will get new daily builds | 12:09 |
mdz | it is unknown whether we will delay the release or not | 12:09 |
mdz | and that will determine the plan for remaining milestones | 12:10 |
cjwatson | I do not feel we should have a release candidate at this point | 12:10 |
fabbione | pitti: well herd-6 will involve a new RC set | 12:10 |
cjwatson | unless the release is delayed | 12:10 |
mdz | there is no point doing a full validation test of an RC at this point when there are known blockers | 12:10 |
cjwatson | pitti: herd-6 => not a complete round of validation | 12:10 |
mdz | has everyone done at least one test of each of their assigned ISOs? | 12:11 |
mdz | please confirm | 12:11 |
=== fabbione did | ||
pitti | confirm | 12:11 |
mvo | yes | 12:11 |
Riddell | yes | 12:11 |
=== dholbach did too | ||
pkl_ | pkl: yes | 12:11 |
asac | confirm | 12:11 |
cjwatson | I will have done in about one minute when I reboot | 12:11 |
mdz | heno: are you able to tell if any tests were outstanding? | 12:11 |
Mithrandir | server, not the kubuntu amd64 dvd yet (since cdimage was excessively slow yesterday) | 12:11 |
fabbione | mdz: https://www.stgraber.org/ubuntu/isotesting has a pretty good overview | 12:12 |
heno | mdz: https://www.stgraber.org/ubuntu/isotesting | 12:12 |
pitti | https://www.stgraber.org/ubuntu/isotesting shows quite a number of (0)s | 12:12 |
asac | oh wait ... not yet finished ... will finish later today | 12:12 |
heno | netboot is undertested and DVDs | 12:12 |
iwj | doko: Thanks for doing those dvd tests btw. | 12:12 |
heno | and upgrades, I'm doing some of those now | 12:13 |
iwj | Err, dholbach I mean. | 12:13 |
iwj | Duh. | 12:13 |
mdz | heno: please review with cjwatson and determine whether we need to push some specific cases | 12:13 |
doko | iwj: they were assigned to me :) | 12:13 |
dholbach | iwj: np | 12:13 |
heno | right | 12:13 |
mdz | ok, we've taken long enough with this meeting, let's reconvene later once we've filled in some of the unknowns | 12:13 |
mdz | adjourned, thanks all | 12:13 |
iwj | doko: Were they ? heno said he was going to give them to me but as it was I didn't get the iso downloaded in time. | 12:13 |
dholbach | thanks | 12:13 |
mvo | ogra: I can do a round of edubuntu upgrades tests for you if you want | 12:13 |
=== asac leaves in a hurry | ||
asac | thanks | 12:13 |
kwwii | thanks | 12:13 |
dholbach | bye asac | 12:14 |
ogra | mvo, appreciated | 12:14 |
=== mvo prepares another tea | ||
doko | iwj: just the edubuntu amd64 dvd | 12:14 |
pitti | Mithrandir: hm, without RC being decided, when would be a good time to upload new langpacks? | 12:15 |
highvoltage | you guys rock. | 12:16 |
Mithrandir | pitti: after RC | 12:16 |
pitti | Mithrandir: right, but now it's not even clear when or whether that will be | 12:16 |
fabbione | pitti: i'd say we keep RC mode until they decide and go from there | 12:16 |
Mithrandir | pitti: true. I'd like to do the current set of images first at least. | 12:16 |
fabbione | i see little point in pushing more atm | 12:16 |
pitti | Mithrandir: right | 12:17 |
pitti | Mithrandir: it can't happen before tomorrow midday anyway | 12:17 |
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Simira | @schedule Oslo | 02:38 |
ubotu | Schedule for Europe/Oslo: 12 Apr 22:00: MOTU | 12 Apr 22:00: Development Team | 12 Apr 23:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 13 Apr 22:00: Forum Council | 17 Apr 17:00: Kernel Team | 17 Apr 22:00: Community Council | 02:38 |
Simira | what's the difference between "Ubuntu development team" and "Development team" | 02:38 |
Simira | ? | 02:39 |
Riddell | they can both go | 02:39 |
Simira | but the difference? | 02:43 |
Riddell | one is old and obsolete, the other is merely obsolete | 02:44 |
Treenaks | Riddell: so what's New and Hot? | 02:45 |
Simira | right | 02:45 |
nixternal | @schedule chicago | 02:46 |
ubotu | Schedule for America/Chicago: 12 Apr 15:00: MOTU | 12 Apr 15:00: Development Team | 12 Apr 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 13 Apr 15:00: Forum Council | 17 Apr 10:00: Kernel Team | 17 Apr 15:00: Community Council | 02:46 |
nixternal | argh, who booged up the fridge? | 02:46 |
Riddell | Treenaks: like I say, they can both go, the meeting has happened | 02:47 |
Treenaks | Riddell: oh like that | 02:49 |
Treenaks | Riddell: I thought someone had changed the project's organisational structure without telling anyone ;) | 02:49 |
jsgotangco | @schedule manila | 02:50 |
ubotu | Schedule for Asia/Manila: 13 Apr 04:00: MOTU | 13 Apr 04:00: Development Team | 13 Apr 05:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 14 Apr 04:00: Forum Council | 17 Apr 23:00: Kernel Team | 18 Apr 04:00: Community Council | 02:50 |
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:ubotu] : Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 12 Apr 20:00 UTC: MOTU | 13 Apr 20:00 UTC: Forum Council | 17 Apr 15:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 17 Apr 20:00 UTC: Community Council | 18 Apr 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 19 Apr 15:00 UTC: Development Team | ||
nixternal | there fixed :) | 02:53 |
Simira | @schedule Oslo | 02:53 |
ubotu | Schedule for Europe/Oslo: 12 Apr 22:00: MOTU | 13 Apr 22:00: Forum Council | 17 Apr 17:00: Kernel Team | 17 Apr 22:00: Community Council | 18 Apr 14:00: Edubuntu | 19 Apr 17:00: Development Team | 02:53 |
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teaker1s | . | 08:24 |
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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:ubotu] : Current meeting: MOTU | Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 13 Apr 20:00 UTC: Forum Council | 17 Apr 15:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 17 Apr 20:00 UTC: Community Council | 18 Apr 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 19 Apr 15:00 UTC: Development Team | ||
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dholbach | might be a bit late for the meeting | 09:54 |
=== somerville32 is here. | ||
sistpoty | hi dholbach and somerville32 | 09:55 |
somerville32 | hey : ) | 09:55 |
Adri2000 | hi | 09:55 |
ScottK | Hello. | 09:56 |
lionel | hi | 09:56 |
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ajmitch | well, agenda is fairly empty, noone's here | 10:02 |
Toadstool | hi everybody | 10:02 |
ajmitch | hi | 10:02 |
sistpoty | let's get started, shall we? | 10:02 |
ajmitch | oh good, sistpoty is awake ;) | 10:02 |
sistpoty | hehe | 10:03 |
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sistpoty | (partly awake... got up before 10am, new record *g*) | 10:03 |
=== ajmitch was awake sometime around 5am | ||
Adri2000 | 10am, wow! :p | 10:03 |
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dholbach | ok | 10:04 |
ajmitch | dholbach! | 10:04 |
dholbach | is the agenda new? | 10:04 |
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dholbach | hey ajmitch | 10:04 |
ajmitch | do we have anything to talk about? | 10:04 |
dholbach | the charter's on there | 10:04 |
sistpoty | erm.. that item was left over from the last agenda | 10:04 |
ajmitch | apart from the release, and gutsy | 10:04 |
dholbach | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Meetings | 10:04 |
dholbach | ok | 10:04 |
dholbach | I have only one small item: | 10:04 |
ajmitch | release freeze? | 10:04 |
dholbach | the motu-uvf team needs to clean out all bugs and get things uploaded or rejected properly | 10:05 |
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dholbach | and we should do that RSN | 10:05 |
ajmitch | ok | 10:05 |
dholbach | we have quite a bunch hanging in a limbo state | 10:05 |
=== ajmitch waits for LP | ||
dholbach | that's all I can see for now | 10:05 |
ajmitch | there don't seem to be that many on the assigned bugs page | 10:06 |
dholbach | subscribed? | 10:06 |
dholbach | the less the better | 10:06 |
=== ajmitch has mainly been looking at the assigned bugs | ||
ajmitch | LP is slow enough as it is :) | 10:06 |
dholbach | what else? is there any use having another universe hug day before release? | 10:07 |
dholbach | nice to get LP cleaned up and patches submitted for either release or for SRUs, but will we have time for that? | 10:07 |
ajmitch | are we going to have a freeze in the last week? | 10:07 |
ScottK | We could have a reject all the left over breezy bugs day next week! | 10:07 |
sistpoty | erm... sorry, I'm a little slow today. I can't see any subscribed bugs of motu-uvf? | 10:08 |
dholbach | ajmitch: i suppose so | 10:08 |
ajmitch | sistpoty: it could be LP failing again :) I just got proxy errors trying to view bugs | 10:08 |
dholbach | ScottK: sounds good, but that's something we can clean up after release :) | 10:08 |
sistpoty | ajmitch: maybe... it only tells me: "There are currently no open bugs." (with the +subscribedbugs page) | 10:09 |
ScottK | OK. I may get started ahead of time. | 10:09 |
dholbach | sistpoty: ok, seems there are only ten | 10:09 |
sistpoty | ah, k | 10:10 |
ajmitch | of those that are in limbo - sysv_rc_bootsplash, wxwidgets2.8, texmacs | 10:10 |
dholbach | ajmitch, siretart, slomo, crimsun and I will take a look at them | 10:10 |
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dholbach | anything else we should discuss before release? | 10:11 |
rmjb | any adjustments in the way MOTU work for gutsy? | 10:11 |
ajmitch | targetting the rc bugs list still? | 10:11 |
sistpoty | we did have the idea of a harder freeze, with *all* uploads needing to be approved by motu-uvf... are we doing this right now actually? | 10:11 |
ajmitch | dholbach: make that 8 on the uvf list | 10:11 |
dholbach | rmjb: that we'll discuss after release - atm we'll focus on the release | 10:12 |
=== Lutin_ is now known as Lutin | ||
rmjb | dholbach: ok | 10:12 |
ajmitch | ok to reject wxwidgets2.8 uvfe? | 10:12 |
dholbach | rmjb: but if you have suggestions, it'd be nice to hear about them - the mailing list might be good to discuss things there | 10:12 |
dholbach | ajmitch: ok | 10:12 |
dholbach | ajmitch: thanks | 10:12 |
dholbach | sistpoty: atm, all uploads get reviewed and checked by the archive admins - dunno how they decide if they wave them through or not | 10:13 |
siretart | hi folks - sorry for being late | 10:13 |
sistpoty | huhu siretart | 10:13 |
ajmitch | it'd be best to clarify things with the archive admins then if they ask | 10:13 |
dholbach | hey siretart | 10:13 |
ajmitch | hey siretart | 10:13 |
dholbach | ajmitch: yeah | 10:13 |
sistpoty | dholbach: so it's just regular uploading from the motu pov, right? | 10:13 |
dholbach | atm, yes | 10:14 |
sistpoty | ok | 10:14 |
dholbach | not sure if it's going to change in the remaining 7 days | 10:14 |
dholbach | I feel most of us have been quite conservative with their fixes | 10:14 |
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dholbach | ie small unmetdeps fixes, etc | 10:14 |
sistpoty | not quite sure if it's worth the overhead... *shrug* | 10:14 |
sistpoty | (to change policy now) | 10:15 |
dholbach | yeah | 10:15 |
dholbach | ok.... what else? anything we should definitely take care of for the release? | 10:15 |
siretart | dholbach: I've asked Tollef about the idea we had regarding removing binary packages with broken deps. The idea got rejected, do you happen to know why? | 10:15 |
dholbach | no no idea | 10:16 |
sistpoty | let me check the logs... he stated a reason back when I asked him | 10:16 |
ajmitch | yay | 10:16 |
ScottK | The sneaky solution would be a new source package that you know will FTBFS. | 10:16 |
Lutin | ScottK: the former binary version would stay in the archive though | 10:17 |
ScottK | Oh. Nevermind then. | 10:17 |
sistpoty | hm... can't find it in my logs :(... iirc the reasons were the overhead for archive admins (it would result in binary new packages) and that it would be quite surprising to have a sru package in binary new | 10:19 |
=== ajmitch should have looked closer at texmacs awhile ago | ||
siretart | hm. fair enough | 10:20 |
ajmitch | the RC bug in debian was only in the version in experimental | 10:21 |
dholbach | ok | 10:23 |
dholbach | anything else? | 10:23 |
ajmitch | short meeting, I like it | 10:23 |
ajmitch | next meeting date? | 10:24 |
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sistpoty | two weeks from now? | 10:24 |
dholbach | 2 weeks? | 10:24 |
dholbach | sounds good to me | 10:24 |
sistpoty | :) | 10:24 |
ajmitch | rotate time or not? | 10:25 |
dholbach | next time :) | 10:25 |
=== ajmitch won't be able to make it if it's at 0800UTC on the 26th | ||
dholbach | it's not 8 utc atm | 10:25 |
ajmitch | no, but we talked about changing it by 12 hours each time to be fair to people like australians :) | 10:26 |
dholbach | next time then :) | 10:26 |
sistpoty | fine with me :) | 10:26 |
ajmitch | k | 10:26 |
ajmitch | which means 2 meetings from now, will be during UDS :) | 10:27 |
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ajmitch | but dholbach_ won't mind that :) | 10:27 |
sistpoty | hehe | 10:27 |
dholbach_ | but I can update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUMenuHeader again :) | 10:27 |
dholbach_ | looks like i missed some part of the conversation | 10:28 |
ajmitch | 08:26 < ajmitch> k | 10:28 |
ajmitch | 08:27 < ajmitch> which means 2 meetings from now, will be during UDS :) | 10:28 |
sistpoty | the menu header is cool btw :) | 10:28 |
dholbach | yeah | 10:28 |
dholbach | ok good | 10:28 |
dholbach | everybody happy? | 10:28 |
dholbach | who mails fridge-devel@ and others? | 10:28 |
=== ajmitch is overjoyed | ||
sistpoty | does that mean that you volunteer ajmitch? *g* | 10:29 |
dholbach | he's so happy, he can't stop himself :) | 10:29 |
sistpoty | hehe | 10:29 |
ajmitch | who do I have to contact? | 10:29 |
ajmitch | motu list, fridge-devel, devel-announce? | 10:30 |
dholbach | fridge-devel@ ubuntu-devel@ ubuntu-motu@ | 10:30 |
dholbach | yeah, or like that | 10:30 |
ajmitch | alright, will do | 10:31 |
ajmitch | thanks for showing up :) | 10:31 |
dholbach | super | 10:31 |
sistpoty | thanks everyone | 10:31 |
dholbach | adjourned :) | 10:31 |
=== ajmitch has his passport ready now | ||
ajmitch | since I had to find the number :) | 10:31 |
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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:ubotu] : Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 13 Apr 20:00 UTC: Forum Council | 17 Apr 15:00 UTC: Kernel Team | 17 Apr 20:00 UTC: Community Council | 18 Apr 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 19 Apr 15:00 UTC: Development Team | 24 Apr 20:00 UTC: Technical Board | ||
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