=== Watersevenub [n=Watersev@242-181.dial.nortenet.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel === superm1 [n=superm1@ubuntu/member/superm1] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Gman [i=gman@nat/sun/x-397c954ca4d90356] has joined #ubuntu-devel === highvoltage [n=highvolt@196.1.61.16] has joined #ubuntu-devel === AlessandroD [i=Alessand@c9115c41.rjo.virtua.com.br] has joined #ubuntu-devel === highvoltage [n=highvolt@196.1.61.16] has joined #ubuntu-devel === LetoTo [n=paul@bofh.xelerance.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === acacs [n=acacs@189.13.206.56] has joined #ubuntu-devel === koke [n=koke@adsl-76-197-62-161.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:43] woo, time to upgrade to gusty! [12:44] hah === jmg upgrades jdub's face with a rake [12:44] good call === mr_pouit [n=mrpouit@ubuntu/member/mrpouit] has joined #ubuntu-devel === sharms starts work on Gusty + 20 -- entirely xml based toolchain, no unix file system, and controlled via USS Enterprise like system, and a bikeshed === jdong [n=jdong@ubuntu/member/jdong] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:49] sharms: you mean LCARS [12:49] yeah :) [12:50] http://themes.freshmeat.net/projects/lcarsaccess441/ [12:53] (iii) make any copies of the PV Drivers or use the PV Drivers other than in conjunction with licensed Products. [12:53] oops [12:53] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwXBPjLdJnU [12:54] ha that looks bad ass === LetoTo [n=paul@bofh.xelerance.com] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === jk- [n=jk@ozlabs.org] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === stratus [n=stratus@201.53.55.52] has joined #ubuntu-devel === licio [n=licio@ubuntu/member/licio] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zul [n=chuck@CPE0006258ec6c1-CM000a73655d0e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === LetoTo [n=paul@bofh.xelerance.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === delire [n=delire@88.134.80.99] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jml [n=jml@59.167.203.115] has joined #ubuntu-devel === delire upgrades to jesting jdub === ahuman [n=oem@ool-43557e7c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === rsk [n=ruskie@c83-250-223-109.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #ubuntu-devel === cypherbios [n=cypher@ubuntu/member/cypherbios] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Gman is now known as gmanAKF === \x-it [n=xarquid@adsl-155-181-203.gsp.bellsouth.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:19] <\x-it> I know this is not a support channel but, basically, no one knows wtf to do in #linux/#ubuntu/#debian or anywhere and I am wondering if one if you would help me in a /msg? It is concerning wheel/su/chmod. Once I restart, I will not be able to login to root anymore (ever), basically. [02:19] <\x-it> And I don't feel like reinstalling >< [02:20] <\x-it> I can bribe? ;p === dthacker [n=dthacker@ip68-107-233-209.om.om.cox.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jack_wyt_ [n=jack@61.149.3.95] has joined #ubuntu-devel === asac_ [n=asac@debian/developer/asac] has joined #ubuntu-devel === freeflying [n=freeflyi@61.149.3.95] has joined #ubuntu-devel === moowiz2020 [n=steven@pool-71-117-95-15.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Monk-e [n=guido-fe@c529dd229.cable.wanadoo.nl] has joined #ubuntu-devel === gmanAKF is now known as Gman === bddebian [n=bdefrees@c-71-224-172-103.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mcgrof [n=mcgrof@ruslug.rutgers.edu] has joined #ubuntu-devel === gouki_ [n=gouki@ubuntu/member/gouki] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:08] \x-it: #1 it isn't really proper etiquette to PM, or ask in channels which are not for the chosen topic. Fortunately for you, I am the bad boy of ubuntu, so I will give you 120 seconds of my time [03:09] \x-it: there is no password for root by default [03:09] <\x-it> Hmm? [03:09] <\x-it> I know. [03:09] \x-it: with that stated, ask your question in a specific manner, and you have 92 seconds left [03:09] <\x-it> It's ok === \x-it is now known as xarquid [03:10] https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RootSudo -- that should really cover anything related to root === jugo23 [n=jugo23@pool-71-115-133-218.gdrpmi.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zul_ [n=chuck@CPE0006258ec6c1-CM000a73655d0e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zerbero_ [n=jga@p85.212.41.135.tisdip.tiscali.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === koke [n=koke@adsl-76-197-62-161.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mrsno [n=sno@unaffiliated/sn0] has joined #ubuntu-devel === alex-weej [n=alex@halls-129-31-82-59.hor.ic.ac.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel === j_ack [n=rudi@p508daa3d.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === TheMuso [n=luke@ubuntu/member/themuso] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jtt [n=jtholmes@72-12-50-39.wan.networktel.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-devel === johanbr [n=j@blk-224-156-151.eastlink.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel === koke [n=koke@adsl-76-197-62-161.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mcgrof [n=mcgrof@ruslug.rutgers.edu] has joined #ubuntu-devel === xq [n=xarquid@adsl-155-181-203.gsp.bellsouth.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mayday_jay [n=mayday_j@maydayjay.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:56] xq: Did you get it sorted out? === mayday_jay [n=mayday_j@maydayjay.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === LeeJunFan [n=junfan@76.204.9.149] has joined #ubuntu-devel === sid [n=unstable@tor/regular/sid] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:20] root@cookooland:~# apt-get install linux-restricted-modules-2.6.20-15-generic, E: Couldn't find package linux-restricted-modules-2.6.20-15-generic, When I started restricted-manager... it tells me it can't run without that program. But this program isn't installable... anyone have a link to the deb? or know how to install it? [04:20] I don't see it listed here: http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/l/ .. Is this a bug? [04:24] erm [04:24] that's really the wrong place to ask that and you're doing it wrongly === xq [n=xarquid@adsl-4-138-254.gsp.bellsouth.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:27] grayman: synaptic or aptitude don't show the package either.(my sources.list are here: http://rafb.net/p/hhRH1612.html ) .. I removed this package to mess with madwifi and openhal, but the module doesn't work with my chipset(yet), so I did make uninstall in my madwifi directory, and I am not able to get linux-restricted-modules-2.6.20-15-generic installed again. I'm running feisty with all default settings(except removing linux-restricted* for experim [04:27] I think it's a bug, I'm pretty sure. Can anyone confirm, try to purge linux-restricted-modules-2.6.20-15-generic and install it again? [04:28] ah you're under root. it is there in my mirror [04:28] might be missing in yours [04:29] grayman: So you were able to purge it and than install it? [04:29] i see it in the list and it's already installed [04:29] grayman: You have a link? [04:29] to what? [04:29] The deb? [04:33] hmm, it was in restricted. It's strange that a package comes on the maincd, but I'm not able to remove/install it, since the sources.list doesn't have restricted by default. [04:34] Should make it so you're able to remove/install any package that is installed via the disc when formatting with Ubuntu. [04:34] thanks a lot for the help grayman, I appreciate it. [04:34] yes well, next time it's really a question for @ubuntu === siti [n=siti@clix-jaquesmartin-nz.cpe.clix.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:34] s/@/# === sid [n=unstable@tor/regular/sid] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === koke [n=koke@adsl-76-197-62-161.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === BenC_ [n=bcollins@collinsap1.phunnypharm.org] has joined #ubuntu-devel === robertj_ [n=robertj@97.81.79.163] has joined #ubuntu-devel === robertj_ [n=robertj@97.81.79.163] has joined #ubuntu-devel === BenC [n=bcollins@debian/developer/bcollins] has joined #ubuntu-devel === cr3 [n=marc@pdpc/supporter/bronze/cr3] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jmg [n=cartel@shinobi.thoughtcrime.org.nz] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:08] How exactly can I become involved with helping develop ubuntu? [05:09] jugo23: start by filing/fixing bugs [05:09] jugo23: http://www.ubuntu.com/community/participate [05:12] Where do I find reported bugs that need fixing? === cr3 [n=marc@pdpc/supporter/bronze/cr3] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:13] jugo23: www.launchpad.net [05:13] Thank you. === andruk [n=chatzill@c-67-166-6-250.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:15] yw [05:16] Another question: What programming language do you think assists in the overall development of ubuntu? [05:16] Python [05:16] That's what I would have guessed. [05:17] or perl, c [05:17] equally valuable === grayman [n=grayman@89.0.138.10.dynamic.barak-online.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === imbecile [n=imbecile@adsl-75-31-34-27.dsl.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:20] I just had to come in here to say that fiesty is by far the most pleasant linux distro I have ever used.. thank you all very much for your hard work.. I LOVE IT!!!!! [05:20] johanbr: Yes, thank you very much [05:21] I didn't really do anything, but you're welcome. :) [05:21] Just asking and being polite is worth a thank you for asking :) === Hobbsee [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee] has joined #ubuntu-devel === macd [n=d@adsl-222-22-190.msy.bellsouth.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:38] jugo23: there's several projects hosted at launchpad.net; make sure to click on the 'ubuntu' first, then search on projects [05:38] Also be sure to join your local team if there is one :) [05:42] morning all [05:46] hi Hobbsee [05:46] :) [05:51] what are you upto at this early morning? :) === pygi hides :) [05:54] it's 2pm [05:56] or 5:55AM, depends on how you put it [06:00] true [06:18] Morning. === Surferboy [n=chatzill@c-71-228-114-226.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === tonyyarusso [n=anthony@ubuntu/member/tonyyarusso] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Surferboy is now known as surf3rb0y === surf3rb0y [n=chatzill@c-71-228-114-226.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === surf3rb0y [n=chatzill@c-71-228-114-226.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [07:11] Lutin: sure. [07:12] morning [07:12] morning fabbione, Mithrandir [07:13] morning ajmitch, fabbione === fabbione hugs everybody [07:19] hi Mithrandir, fabbione === Hobbsee hugs fabbione back === Mithrandir hugs Hobbsee back === Hobbsee hugs Mithrandir :) === milli [n=milli@famfrit.acmeps.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === stub [n=stub@58.181.239.218] has joined #ubuntu-devel === viviersf [n=cain@196.44.1.98] has joined #ubuntu-devel [07:30] morning Mithrandir, fabbione [07:31] hiya Burg === Monk-e [n=guido-fe@c529dd229.cable.wanadoo.nl] has joined #ubuntu-devel === pitti [n=pitti@ubuntu/member/pitti] has joined #ubuntu-devel [07:36] Good morning [07:37] hi pitti! [07:38] morning pitti [07:41] hey pitti === pitti hugs Hobbsee, Mithrandir, and fabbione === Hobbsee hugs pitti back :( [07:41] er, :) [07:42] Hi pitti [07:42] pitti: I finally got around to setting my jabberd back up; i also added your JID to my contact list. [07:43] ion_: ah, nice; I'm not on jabber ATM, I will be again when I'm back at my workstation (gf is still asleep :) ) [07:43] hey pitti [07:43] My JID is ion@heh.fi in case anyone else feels like adding it. :-) === pitti <- actually prefers IRC === Hobbsee suggests banning all IM clients except irc [07:45] yeh i like irc [07:45] jabber beats msn [07:45] pitti: Me too. But jabber is nice for talking with people for whom IRC is too complex, such as my parents. [07:45] ion_: right === ajmitch uses a phone for that [07:46] Lathiat: it's group chats are a bit weird though [07:47] ajmitch: Helping your dad configure stuff on his computer is a lot easier with a text-based system where you can write commands and he can paste their output. :-) [07:47] ion_: yeh thats what msn is for :) [07:47] most of my non 'geek' friends are on msn [07:47] I should set up a VPN from his computer to my network so i could just log in to his box, though. [07:48] MSN randomly drops messages. At least gaim shows an error (after a long delay), but the official Messenger doesnt even do that. :-) [07:48] i never have a problem with that [07:48] there was a "TCP-over-gaim" SoC project which looked kinda interesting. [07:48] gaim actually sends me *too many* errors [07:49] half the time i send a message in msn on gaim it sends an error back but they got the message [07:49] usually the first message i send [07:49] but yeh i have sen errors come back like 10 minutes later, like . once or twice. === LetoTo [n=paul@bofh.xelerance.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Fujitsu [n=william@ubuntu/member/fujitsu] has joined #ubuntu-devel === dholbach [n=daniel@chello080109078174.4.15.univie.teleweb.at] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:01] good morning [08:02] Hi [08:02] hey ion_ === ion_ [i=ion@heh.fi] has joined #ubuntu-devel === pitti is now known as pitti_ === pitti [n=pitti@ubuntu/member/pitti] has joined #ubuntu-devel === JussiP [n=jpakkane@vipunen.hut.fi] has joined #ubuntu-devel === cjwatson_ [n=cjwatson@82-69-40-219.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Lure [n=lure@external-7.hermes.si] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:33] I wrote a wiki page describing why Linux should support fully relocatable binaries. Read it here and tell me what you think: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RelocatableBinaries [08:34] JussiP: is that -fPIE? === phratman [n=phratman@adsl-68-126-184-193.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:34] No. [08:34] pitti: noe [08:34] nope [08:34] ah, no [08:34] Hello. === highvoltage [n=highvolt@196.1.61.16] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:34] Could someone else look into this as well to verify that some sort of bug in kickstart -> d-i translation is in effect? Step a) Make a simple kickstart setup (doesn't really matter what it looks like as long as it has a post installation script that untars a .tar file) Step b) Boot up an Ubuntu Feisty Alternate Installation CD with the ks= (Hit F6 and add ks=http://somewebserver [08:34] Relocatable as in "move it anywhere within your filesystem and it still works". [08:35] If a "bad number" error is displayed in /var/log/syslog on the installation CD, then the error has been successfully been reproduced. I've tried it on two different machines (albeit with the same make and model, but physically two different machines) and I have reproduced the error at least two or three times over. [08:35] JussiP: your claim that you can't run two apaches in parallell is false. [08:35] (on each) [08:35] It was an example. [08:35] JussiP: use examples which are true, then. [08:36] Also, I've noticed another bug with kickstart but I haven't filed it with Launchpad just yet. Is it faster to just talk to a developer about it here... ? [08:36] JussiP: two hald instances will fight each other badly, for example [08:36] or dbus [08:37] But you can stop one and start the other one. Just as with self-compiled versions. [08:37] of course [08:38] Which is pretty much the entire point. [08:38] Replaced apache with foobar on the page. [08:38] I'm not sure what problem you're trying to solve. For instance, by far most of the software I come across runs just fine out of the compilation directories. [08:38] Hello? === Hobbsee curses the wiki [08:39] Mithrandir: i presume the sysadmins know that the wiki is dog slow, and has been for days? [08:39] Ah, overlap noted. [08:39] yup [08:39] phratman: #ubuntu-installer might be a better channel to ask in. === highvoltage [n=highvolt@196.1.61.16] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:39] Jeez, you people are even better organizers than I presumed :) [08:39] The problem is that if you have a .so file and it has its own conf file, what should it pass to fopen to read it. [08:40] Hobbsee: I don't know. [08:40] Hobbsee: best thing is to ask them. I wouldn't assume they do [08:40] Mithrandir: really old laptop testing team results. Keep or nuke?? [08:40] JussiP: shared objects shouldn't have configuration files. [08:40] Burgundavia: really old as in breezy? [08:40] Mithrandir: and earllier [08:40] mdke: who are they? [08:40] Mithrandir: why not? [08:40] Burgundavia: nuke them, IMO. [08:41] JussiP: encoding the soname in the name of the configuration file is painful and makes migration hard when you upgrade, for a start. [08:41] Hobbsee: https://launchpad.net/~canonical-sysadmins / #canonical-sysadmin [08:41] anybody else got an opinion? [08:42] Hehe, I was told this channel isn't very active... apparently someone meant to say #ubuntu-installer isn't very active. [08:42] And that would be different from executable files how? [08:42] JussiP: do you know what a soname is and why we have them? [08:42] mdke: great, thanks. i'll take the duncecap for not picking the smart answer :P [08:42] np === Kmos [n=gothicx@unaffiliated/kmos] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:43] Sorry, I don't know linker magic all that much. [08:45] JussiP: so, each time you break backwards compatibility, you change the name of the library. Usually, that is done by incrementing a digit at the end of the name (libc6 is the sixth or seventh libc ABI for instance). This is done so you don't have to recompile all your applications in one go and libraries with different sonames can be installed in parallell. [08:45] we don't do anything like that for most applications, and when we do, we don't migrate settings, which is bad and leaves the user out in the cold. [08:45] like apache 1 => apache 2; they're coinstallable, but no attempt at migrating the settings from a1 to a2 is done. === doko [n=doko@dslb-088-074-001-196.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:48] doko: good morning. [08:48] doko: gcc-4.1 ftbfs on ppc and sparc. :-/ [08:49] I know that, but can't formulate something suitable for an answer. So let's stick to executables then. Same question as above but s/a .so file/an executable file/. [08:49] Mithrandir: seen, trying to track this down. was afk most of the weekend === highvoltage [n=highvolt@196.1.61.16] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:49] doko: thanks. === carlos [n=carlos@canonical/launchpad/carlos] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mvo [n=egon@p54a67eca.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:52] JussiP: I actually think those use cases are, for the most part, better solved by using solutions such as zeroinstall or klik. [08:55] Zeroinstall's faq says: "The main requirement is that the program doesn't use hard-coded paths." What I'm suggesting is a system-wide and standardised way to achieve this for any program. === highvoltage [n=highvolt@196.1.61.16] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Gman [i=gman@nat/sun/x-c697bbfc7e130548] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:56] that's slightly incorrect, it just needs to use relative paths. [08:58] JussiP: klik should not have this requirement [08:58] who said we're getting klik? === mpt [n=mpt@canonical/launchpad/mpt] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:01] It also says "a shell script would use `dirname $0`/mydata rather than /usr/share/myprog/mydata". The dirname part in shell code is exactly equivalent to having a function as I describe on the wiki page. [09:03] you want a function that is essentially dirname(argv[0] ), you're aware of that? [09:04] Except that argv[0] is almost always just 'foo'. [09:04] Not '/usr/bin/foo' or whatever. [09:04] dirname(/proc/self/exe), then? :) [09:05] well,l readlink() [09:05] Please read this: http://autopackage.org/docs/binreloc/ [09:05] Oh, I heard rumors that Ubuntu was going to get off Debian and get onto some sort of alternative (autopackage was a term that was thrown around). Is there any truth to that? [09:05] pitti: yes, exactly except that a) it is not portable (I think) and b) does not work for libraries (as mentioned on the link above). [09:05] phratman: no. [09:05] I thought Ubuntu and Debian had really close ties so I dispelled such rumors. [09:06] phratman: last time I checked today is not April 1st, [09:06] Burgundavia: Point taken. [09:07] phratman: if you read it off the forums, and not off ubuntu-devel ML or something, it's probably not true [09:07] JussiP: hm, I don't really understand why a library should behave differently when it is run from different paths [09:07] Hobbsee: It was by word of mouth. [09:08] pitti: Is the automatic apport retracer thing not running anymore? [09:08] JussiP: people often use LD_LIBRARY_PATH to use a locally built version for testing, or to install a needed lib on computers where they don't have root etc., but that should often not alter their behaviour [09:08] pitti: suppose it has to access some data files such as icons that get installed along with it. What file name should it pass to fopen? [09:08] shawarma: no, it isn't, we need to fix python-launchpad-bugs first; the latest LP rollout broke it [09:09] JussiP: right, I see such use cases [09:09] pitti: Ah, ok. Thanks. [09:09] JussiP: my point is, that this should not *always* be the case [09:10] JussiP: i. e. developers often start e. g. gnome-panel with a locally built libgnomevfs.so, but that doesn't mean that they want the library to use /home/foo/icons (which doesn't exist) [09:10] Fair enough, but it does have uses and is currently impossible (without hacking). [09:10] JussiP: or I want to install and use libfakeroot.so on a server where I'm not root, etc. [09:11] pitti: Hm... So the a local "apport-retrace " won't work either, I suppose? [09:11] JussiP: I'm not convinced that there is a central and nonintrusive solution TBH; this needs to be carefully implemented per-library [09:11] shawarma: I'm not sure whether it works with -o or -s; you can try [09:11] shawarma: I just disabled it quickly to not loose the bug tags until this is resolved === hoora_ [i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-721fcf0f20e3f280] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:12] JussiP: I fully agree to 'being useful sometimes' [09:12] Yes, but adding the *possibility* to do that to the system is a very small addition (since you can dig out the information if you really, really want to). [09:12] pitti: Oh, it's the upload-the-new-traces-to-launchpad bit that's broken in python-launchpad-bugs? [09:13] In other words: adding this function will break 0 applications and libraries. Having it available gives coders a lot more freedom and capabilities. [09:13] shawarma: I'm really not sure, I didn't have time to look into it yet; I hope that I can fix this today [09:14] pitti: Ok. Thanks. === Lure_ [n=lure@external-7.hermes.si] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:16] Even more simplified: having this makes OSX app bundle type stuff possible. And thus Mac users have to find a new thing to boast about. [09:17] JussiP: they don't have apt-get install :-P [09:21] Neither do we. There's a lot of stuff that's not packaged. In blue sky dreams having fully relocatable LSB binaries app devs could just create one of those and it would work on any distro, in any path. [add sufficient smileys here] === viviersf [n=cain@196.44.1.98] has joined #ubuntu-devel === puttputt [n=james@125-238-176-219.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-devel === puttputt [n=james@125-238-176-219.broadband-telecom.global-gateway.net.nz] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === thekorn_ [n=thekorn@vpn18.mip.uni-hannover.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === thekorn_ [n=thekorn@vpn18.mip.uni-hannover.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === seb128 [n=seb128@ubuntu/member/seb128] has joined #ubuntu-devel === delmorep [n=chris@71.15.124.230] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:34] http://digg.com/linux_unix/Compile_the_Audacity_1_3_2_Beta_with_Ubuntu_Feisty === delmorep [n=chris@71.15.124.230] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === luka74 [n=lure@external-1.hermes.si] has joined #ubuntu-devel === finalbeta [n=gggggggg@d54C6865D.access.telenet.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel === kwah [n=kwah@gate.wfw.wtb.tue.nl] has joined #ubuntu-devel === cassidy [n=cassidy@host-213-189-171-21.brutele.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel === sabdfl [n=sabdfl@ubuntu/member/pdpc.silver.sabdfl] has joined #ubuntu-devel === \sh [n=nsherman@server3.servereyes.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Arby [n=richard@shiny.york.ac.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel === \sh [n=nnnsherm@server3.servereyes.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === \sh [n=shermann@server3.servereyes.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === slomo [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:07] mvo: can I nag you about the apport and tzdata feisty-proposed verifications? [10:07] hi slomo! [10:08] hi pitti [10:08] pitti: sure, its on my list for today, let me check if its available in the archive now [10:08] slomo: I will write some MIRs for texlive today, so that we can do the tetex->texlive transition as early as possible [10:08] mvo: I just checked, it is [10:08] hi pitti and mvo [10:09] hi pygi [10:09] hey pygi! [10:10] pitti: sounds good :) i already planned that soon too and the versions currently in debian are working good for my stuff ;) [10:11] hi slomo [10:11] slomo: do you happen to know if they moved all the tetex-patches to texlive? === vciaglia [n=vciaglia@host128-84-dynamic.11-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:12] pitti: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/feisty-proposed/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz <- is empty for me [10:12] slomo: the thing we currently still carry is the 'patch for not crashing for 0.5 hour timezones' [10:12] mvo: urgh, they are on drescher [10:12] pitti: no idea... and your poppler patch is still not there as poppler 0.5 is still not in unstable... [10:12] mvo: that url is not empty for me, hm [10:12] hi seb128 [10:12] slomo: that's easy enough to carry ourselves for now === Keybuk [n=scott@quest.netsplit.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:13] pitti: i would assume that the timezone patch is upstream but shouldn't be hard to verify ;) [10:13] right [10:13] pitti: it is for me even with wget --no-cache, strange [10:13] not empty for me either [10:13] mvo: hm, you might have a different mirror which is out of date [10:14] mvo: try de.archive [10:14] pitti: I will try to reach the sysadmins [10:14] pitti,mvo : archive.u.c was being hammered over the weekend, so I suspect it's just not up-to-date. [10:15] Mithrandir: wget said it wasn't empty for me :-) [10:15] pitti: thanks, de.archive.u.c works [10:16] mvo: the two apport bugs have hints for testing, btw === jono [n=jono@ubuntu/member/jono] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:18] pitti: thats good, thanks [10:22] hi folks [10:23] debootstrap under edgy is not updated for gutsy ? [10:23] ./usr/lib/debootstrap/scripts/gutsy: Not found in archive === mdz [n=mdz@yttrium.canonical.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === elena_g [n=elena@host177-127-dynamic.2-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:26] saispo: It won't be... You always need the one from the development release. [10:27] can someone tell me if this 56k modem is supported by Feisty?: 01:07.0 Modem: ALi Corporation SmartLink SmartPCI563 56K Modem [10:27] opps hello all :) [10:27] Fujitsu: i must upgrade my edgy to feisty for having a debootstrap with gutsy ? [10:27] elena_g: Try #ubuntu [10:27] Fujitsu, ok :) [10:27] saispo: No, you must upgrade debootstrap to gutsy's version. [10:27] Come to think of it, I don't think it's even in gutsy yet. [10:28] hmmmm strange [10:28] Fujitsu: given that gutsy is frozen until we have a toolchain, yes. [10:28] How's it at all strange, saispo? [10:28] Mithrandir: ok, i understand know :) [10:28] Mithrandir: Well, tzdata got through. [10:28] Fujitsu: because before, i can use beootstrap for feisty under an edgy :) [10:28] But I guess that doesn't really need to build all that much. [10:28] Fujitsu: yes, tzdata was the first bit of the bootstrap. [10:28] i must wait for toolchain :) [10:28] Do we backport debootstrap or something? [10:29] Fujitsu: no [10:29] then binutils, then glibc, then gcc-4.1, but the gcc-4.1 build failed on powerpc and sparc so we need to fix that first. [10:29] ok [10:29] thanks Fujitsu and Mithrandir [10:29] i will move my edgy to feisty [10:29] How is tzdata particularly important for bootstrapping? Isn't it just a set of timezone files which can be updated arbitrarily? === Gman [i=gman@nat/sun/x-08d7a16655dee558] has joined #ubuntu-devel === kwah [n=kwah@gate.wfw.wtb.tue.nl] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"] === Monk-e [n=guido-fe@c529dd229.cable.wanadoo.nl] has joined #ubuntu-devel === pitti [n=pitti@195.227.105.180] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Sky_walkie [i=czzhrd02@xdsl-563.lodz.dialog.net.pl] has joined #ubuntu-devel === pitti [n=pitti@ubuntu/member/pitti] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:41] i see updates for feisty but not available on repository, it's "normal" ? === Zdra [n=zdra@24.238-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:41] saispo: what updates?where? [10:44] euh... works now :/ update for capplet, apport and some other things [10:44] maybe the mirror was not up2date :) === ssam [n=ssam@87.127.117.246] has joined #ubuntu-devel === finalbeta_ [n=gggggggg@d54C6865D.access.telenet.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Monk-e [n=guido-fe@c529dd229.cable.wanadoo.nl] has joined #ubuntu-devel === stub [n=stub@58.181.239.218] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mdz [n=mdz@yttrium.canonical.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:59] siretart: do you plan uploads for edgy, dapper for #104332 as well? === lucas [n=lucas@xanadu.blop.info] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Gman [i=gman@nat/sun/x-e3ec9b60a2a2d107] has joined #ubuntu-devel === sky_walkie [i=czzhrd02@xdsl-563.lodz.dialog.net.pl] has joined #ubuntu-devel === FordCortina [n=frank@ACCE186F.ipt.aol.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mc44 [n=mc44@unaffiliated/mc44] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Keybuk [n=scott@wing-commander.netsplit.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:23] bug 104332 was the rdesktop update, no? [11:23] Malone bug 104332 in rdesktop "Segmentation Fault (core dumped)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/104332 [11:23] right. === lukkett1 [n=lukketto@host30-193-dynamic.7-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:23] mvo: I can do it. However, it appeared as a consequence of an security upload [11:24] mvo: are machines with -security but not -updates common? [11:24] siretart: sometimes, but I guess not common (but I have no figures) [11:24] siretart: I'm just asking because it has a dapper and edgy tasks [11:25] mvo: honstely, I'm not exactly sure if dapper and edgy are affected at all [11:25] eh, edgy only [11:25] if they are affected, then it's because of a security related change in libx11-6 [11:26] ok, I leave it as it is then, I do not have anything to test rdesktop against === zerbero_ [n=jga@p85.212.41.135.tisdip.tiscali.de] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Konversation] === jsgotangco [i=42c684fd@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:34] dholbach: argh @ the multitude of branches without descriptions on https://code.launchpad.net/bughelper === Gman [i=gman@nat/sun/x-e3ec9b60a2a2d107] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"] === hunger [n=tobias@pd95b0676.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:35] dholbach: if I do the attachment upload fix on the bughelper.0.1 branch, will you merge it to trunk? [11:39] pitti: yes [11:39] pitti: will add descriptions === zerbero_1 [n=jga@p85.212.41.135.tisdip.tiscali.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === spacey [n=herman@ubuntu/member/spacey] has joined #ubuntu-devel === lukkett1 [n=lukketto@host30-193-dynamic.7-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has left #ubuntu-devel [] [11:44] ho dholbach [11:45] hi pygi [11:48] dholbach, seb128: ah, I have the python-launchpad-bugs fix [11:48] pitti: rock on === Gman [i=gman@nat/sun/x-39be9af0ee3f7c05] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:49] Hi pygi [11:49] pitti: super! let me know when you committed it === heno [n=henrik@ubuntu/member/heno] has joined #ubuntu-devel === didymo [n=ashley@61.9.197.223] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:56] dholbach: bug 109213 [11:56] Malone bug 109213 in bughelper "recent LP rollout broke Bug.add_comment()" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/109213 [11:56] dholbach: I added the branch, tasks, etc. [11:57] saw the bug - thanks pitti === Gman [i=gman@nat/sun/x-cf590ae711ae5f9b] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Watersevenub [n=Watersev@azevedo.astro.up.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel === shiyee [n=Shiyee@homer.cs.aau.dk] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:21] alright, retracers are happy and running again === seb128 hugs pitti [12:22] with a huge work pool ;) [12:23] oh, need to do ppc retracer as well === ogra pokes nfs4 [12:36] now that i have a working implementation in initramfs it appears immensely slower than v3 :/ === jjstwerff [n=jjstwerf@charon.betterbe.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === codingmaster [n=codingma@dslb-084-058-211-192.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jjstwerff [n=jjstwerf@charon.betterbe.com] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"] === jjstwerff [n=jjstwerf@charon.betterbe.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:55] Questions about UDS: 1. Does the Hotel provide breakfast? 2. What do people do for lunch? [12:58] racarr: 1. yes, like most hotels (it costs extra, no idea if it's included if you're sponsored); 2. no idea. === Gman [i=gman@nat/sun/x-9920a1d6ee97d0a9] has joined #ubuntu-devel === TeTeT [n=spindler@modemcable178.77-70-69.static.videotron.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel === cprov [n=cprov@canonical/launchpad/cprov] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:06] Treenaks: Mrgh. Ok. I guess I will send an email to find out if it is covered with sponsorship then... [01:06] Thanks. [01:06] racarr: they usually eat for lunch :P [01:06] pygi: Har har. [01:06] The only one I've been to had lunch from Google so... :) [01:07] I' [01:07] We went to the hotel restaurant in Montreal [01:07] and there was Death in a Bag in mataro (only for sponsored people) [01:08] lunch tends to be on-site, dinner is usually out in the city somewhere, most of the days you're on your own, but some days there are big group dinners. [01:08] Death in a Bag? [01:08] I'm not sure if this is how it'll be done this time around as well, but that's how it's usually been done. [01:08] Amaranth: I doubt we'll have those every again. [01:08] In Mountain View my dinner ended up being whatever came out of the hotel vending machine :P [01:09] What is this 'Death in a Bag'? [01:09] *giggle* [01:09] Amaranth: oskuro.net/blog/freesoftware/mataro-halfway-2004-12-10-12-29 [01:09] Amaranth: a cat [01:09] :P [01:09] Mithrandir: And do you know about Breakfast being included in sponsorship? [01:09] we had some unfortunate lunches in mataro which quickly got the nickname "death bags" [01:10] racarr: I would assume so, yes. [01:10] Treenaks: that makes me download an empty file [01:10] Hum. oskuro.net looks broken [01:10] Amaranth: google cache for it works [01:10] racarr: afaik, when people are sponsored their travel + hotel + food is sponsored, but I haven't been sponsored for years so I'm not sure if this has changed. [01:11] Mithrandir: Ok. Thanks. [01:12] Mithrandir: thanks for rejecting allegro and SRUing cinepaint :) [01:12] Food from the local jail sounded like a better alternative? Yikes. :) [01:12] Amaranth: that was Mataro :) The hotel in Montreal was much much better [01:13] dholbach: yay, message sent :P === pygi hides back [01:13] (also, there were lots of places where you could eat.. Subway, etc.) [01:14] Lutin: oh, my pleasure. Would you mind pushing cinepaint through the rest of the process so we could get it into -updates? (I did it mainly because we needed a test package for -proposed) [01:16] Mithrandir: sure, I'll do that :) [01:16] thanks [01:23] pitti: have you received my email (requestsync patch)? [01:23] Adri2000: I got it, yes, but we cannot upload to gutsy yet, so I didn't look at it yet [01:24] ok [01:24] Adri2000: looks reasonable so far, although invoking $EDITOR would be cool :) [01:25] reading from stdin should be good enough for smaller diffs, though [01:25] pitti: it should then just call sensible-editor === harrisony [n=Harrison@unaffiliated/harrisony] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Demon012 [n=alan@82-46-76-235.cable.ubr05.stav.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zyga [n=zyga@ubuntu/member/zyga] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:30] hi everyone I am wishing to join in with development (I am new to developing open source software. Is this channel the correct one for me or is it the #ubuntu-motu ?) [01:31] Demon012: #ubuntu-motu might be a better place [01:31] #ubuntu-motu is probably a better starting point. [01:31] Demon012: if you want to package the software (that is used in synaptic MOTU is for you) [01:31] Demon012: But that's mostly for packaging software for Ubuntu (which requires some knowledge about how the software works) [01:32] ok ty guys [01:32] I wish to help with the actual coding though. But do you think I should start with packaging? [01:33] Demon012: if you want to be a dev of ubuntu here is the right place === stu1 [n=stub@58.181.239.87] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:33] (i dont dev i just admire the devs and all the cool people hang out here) [01:34] Demon012: go to launchpad, look at bugs, write patches, and attach them to bugs === Spads [n=spacehob@unaffiliated/spads] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:35] ok pygi will start with trying to do that [01:35] is there a standards list I should look at or anything for ubuntu code? [01:35] Demon012: what are you using most? What are your interests? [01:36] like a standardised indentation style? [01:36] I am a programming student [01:36] have been programming properly for 4 years [01:36] Demon012: I mean what are your interests :) Music applications, education, ltsp, cd-recording apps, etc, etc? [01:36] oh right sorry =) [01:37] mmm music, education, communcation, user interface design [01:37] and general program design for that matter === ivoks [n=ivoks@89-172-1-74.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:38] ok, well, go to #edubuntu and ask what can you help with some of the educational applications :) === EtienneG [n=etienne@ubuntu/member/EtienneG] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:38] ok will do ty === zerbero_1 [n=jga@p85.212.41.135.tisdip.tiscali.de] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Konversation] === jsgotangco [n=jsg123@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:46] Demon012: All the upstream projects will have their own style. [01:47] pitti: Thanks for your deb<->ubuntu merge mail for gvm.. little nag: please use the pkg-utopia-maintainers list next time :) === zerbero_1 [n=jga@p85.212.41.135.tisdip.tiscali.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Monk-e [n=guido-fe@c529dd229.cable.wanadoo.nl] has joined #ubuntu-devel === vciaglia [n=vciaglia@host139-158-dynamic.17-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jsgotangco [n=jsg123@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:58] pitti, if i could manage to get hal to run on a thin client and manage to read the info for a blockdevice, mount it via ltspfs and then use set property to create a copy fr that device on the server but with the ltspfs mount as device node, do you think hal would survive and handle that ? === StevenK [n=stevenk@14.5.233.220.exetel.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jdong [n=jdong@SIMMONS-FOUR-FIFTY-SIX.MIT.EDU] has joined #ubuntu-devel === pochu [n=emilio@131.Red-83-57-165.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:09] re [02:10] sjoerd: oh, I will; is that free for anybody for posting? === mantiena-baltix [n=ubuntu@ctv-84-55-4-28.init.lt] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:10] Hi all [02:11] Not 100% sure, but your allowed to post (as the hal changes discussion was partly on it) [02:11] ogra: you'd need a network dbus connection between the two, or use some other means of communication [02:11] ogra: but yes, it sounds doable [02:11] tepsipakki: hi, do you have few minutes to talk about bug #89853 ? [02:11] Malone bug 89853 in xorg-server "[regression] 7.2 broke vesa: "No matching modes found"" [High,Needs info] https://launchpad.net/bugs/89853 === giskard [n=giskard@213-140-22-74.fastres.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:11] sjoerd: ah, great; I can forward it to the list if you want me to [02:12] please do [02:12] It's mostly me and mbiebl that worry about gvm, but it's good if the other guys can see it too [02:12] pitti, why is that ? if the device is there (in form of the device node) and all data is in the hal db i shoudlnt need direct communication, do i? [02:12] Which reminds me that i should make sure their on the list :) [02:12] mantiena-baltix: shoot [02:13] it seems this bug is solved only when I install both xserver-xorg-video-vesa_1.3.0-1ubuntu4.2_i386.deb and xserver-xorg-core_1.2.0-3ubuntu7.4_i386.deb packages from http://users.tkk.fi/~tjaalton/dpkg/ :) [02:14] mantiena-baltix: that's just plain weird :) [02:14] ;) === pkl_ [n=phillip@lougher.demon.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:14] I'll ask ajax if the backtrace is of any use [02:14] ogra: I mean, somehow the client has to tell the server hald about the new device? [02:15] I just tested on Fujistu Amillo laptop with ATI Technologies Inc ATI Radeon XPRESS 200M 5955 (PCIE) video card [02:15] tepsipakki: it boots fine on feisty final with ati driver, but doesn't boot if I change Driver "ati" to Driver "vesa" === jwendell [n=wendell@ubuntu/member/wendell] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:16] pitti, yes, thats done already through an ssh tunnel (and sbalneav is working on an X based comm layer atm) [02:16] But when I install xserver-xorg-video-vesa_1.3.0-1ubuntu4.2_i386.deb and xserver-xorg-core_1.2.0-3ubuntu7.4_i386.deb packages from http://users.tkk.fi/~tjaalton/dpkg/ then X starts fine even with vesa on that laptop ;) [02:17] indeed i need to get the data from the client to the server for hal-add-property :) [02:17] i just wanted to know if its possible to cheat hal in this way ;) [02:17] so we can move out all the ltspfs handling from gnomevfs to hal ... and Riddells users will be more happy in LTSP :) [02:17] tepsipakki: should I write this in launchpad bug comments ? [02:18] mantiena-baltix: you could do that, yes [02:19] ogra: I didn't look at it in detail yet, but it should be possible to encapsulate this as a hal addon, yes === cr3 [n=marc@pdpc/supporter/bronze/cr3] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:19] cool [02:20] tepsipakki: ok, btw, could you build xserver-xorg-core_1.2.0-3ubuntu7.4_i386.deb without dbg symbols ? I have very slow internet connection and getting build-deps for xserver-xorg-core would take a lot of time :( Please... [02:20] mantiena-baltix: no. [02:20] policy tells you to build with debug symbols. === acacs [n=acacs@189.13.174.189] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:21] Mithrandir: actually, it's stripped by default [02:21] that version isn't [02:21] erm, but they certainly should not appear in the debs by default [02:22] yes, which is done by dh_strip or similar. [02:22] I tried to backport the -dbg package stuff from debian, but thought that this was easier for testing (just skip dh_strip) [02:22] it should be _built_ with debug symbols. [02:22] ah :) [02:22] they're just stripped out before the package is assembled. [02:24] sjoerd: sent; and this time with an actual patch attachment (brown paperbag) [02:25] tepsipakki: I really need smaller xserver-xorg-core package and it seems you already have build-deps for this, so, maybe you could build stripped package (like standard ubuntu package) for me ? [02:25]