[12:40] <grayman> anyone knows about any attempts to write a dpkg plugin for synaptic?
[12:41] <geser> what should that be?
[12:41] <grayman> so it will do what GDebi does
[12:42] <geser> what do you mean? installing of local deb files?
[12:42] <grayman> yes
[12:42] <Flannel> grayman: Just double click the deb, it'll install
[12:42] <grayman> i know how it installs
[12:42] <Flannel> grayman: And it'll show up in synaptic afterwards, under "local or obsolete"
[12:42] <grayman> meh that's not the point
[12:43] <geser> synaptic is a gui for apt and not dpkg
[12:43] <grayman> yes
[12:43] <Flannel> grayman: then what is your point?
[12:43] <grayman> to make synaptic to attempt and look for deps for local packages
[12:44] <Flannel> doesn't double clicking a deb automatically try and resolve dependencies?
[12:44] <grayman> no
[12:44] <grayman> it just says that you don't have that stuff
[12:44] <grayman> now go install it
[12:45] <ScottK> That's all dpkg does too 
[12:45] <grayman> yes
[12:45] <grayman> but why not allow it to look for dependencies in the repo?
[12:46] <geser> dpkg doesn't anything about repos
[12:46] <Flannel> of course that's what dpkg would do, it doesn't know about the repos
[12:46] <geser> that's apt job
[12:46] <grayman> i know that
[12:46] <grayman> just thought that a plugin that uses both could be nice
[12:47] <geser> grayman: so you are looking for an automatic "apt-get -f install" after installing a local deb?
[12:47] <Flannel> there's nothing saying that the GUI version for installing packages couldnt though
[12:47] <grayman> i'm looking for automatic dep installation before the local is installed
[12:48] <grayman> if the dependencies are available
[12:48] <grayman> otherwise just reports what's missing
[12:48] <geser> IMHO gdebi should warn or take care if deps are missing
[12:49] <grayman> well, it just tells you that they're missing as far as i remember
[12:52] <geser> could you open a bug against gdebi for it?
[12:53] <grayman> i'll recheck and do
[01:04] <Adri2000> grayman: gdebi's description says:
[01:04] <Adri2000>  gdebi lets you install local deb packages resolving and installing
[01:04] <Adri2000>  its dependencies.
[01:06] <grayman> didn't notice it doing that
[01:07] <grayman> i'm checking just in case
[01:23] <joejaxx> does launchpad have rss feeds?
[01:25] <grayman> ok it seems to do that. issue solved
[02:15] <Laser_away> joejaxx: I don't think so
[02:17] <joejaxx> that would be an interesting feature if it was
[02:19] <Laser_away> joejaxx: yes, it would be nice
[02:19] <Laser_away> although I find RSS annoying most of the time
[02:20] <joejaxx> i think it would be good for package changes etc
[02:20] <joejaxx> i think they already have it for the code browser
[02:20] <joejaxx> so it is somewhat implemented
[02:21] <Laser_away> how is it any better than subscribing to a package?
[02:21] <Laser_away> or do you want new upload notices too
[02:21] <joejaxx> well subscribing is just email
[02:21] <Laser_away> yes
[02:21] <Laser_away> but email > RSS ;-)
[02:22] <joejaxx> with rss you can use it wherever rss is parsable
[02:22] <joejaxx> :P
[02:22] <joejaxx> Laser_away: :)
[02:23] <Laser_away> joejaxx: you can parse email :-)
[02:23] <joejaxx> Laser_away: well that is true
[02:23] <joejaxx> ohh
[02:23] <joejaxx> i have to setup the gutsy change stats
[02:25] <joejaxx> i will be back later :)
[02:46] <bddebian> Heya gang
[02:50] <RAOF> Hey bddebian 
[02:51] <bddebian> Hello RAOF
[02:53] <defendguin> how come the monodevelop in feisty is way old?
[02:53] <defendguin> this is horrible
[03:00] <RAOF> Because it wasn't updated in Debian?
[03:00] <RAOF> Because no-one requested a sync/merge from the newer Debian version?
[03:00] <sharms> defendguin: 0.13.1 will probably be in gutsy, but exactly how were you involved with the process for you to have an opinion? I didn't see you on the mailing lists etc.
[03:00] <defendguin> thats disappointing 
[03:01] <sharms> its disappointing that you in no way contribute, but somehow feel that you are entitled to tell us what is horrible
[03:01] <defendguin> sharms: sorry i just decided to pick up using monodevelop today
[03:01] <defendguin> sharms: i apologize 
[03:01] <sharms> At any rate, it will probably get synced to atleast http://packages.debian.org/unstable/devel/monodevelop
[03:02] <RAOF> Also, if you care about it, come help package/update it :)
[03:02] <sharms> defendguin: not saying things to be mean, just saying them because everyone needs help here 
[03:03] <defendguin> i helped a lot with getting my laptop supported for this release.  now all the buttons work :-)
[03:05] <sharms> gutsy wont be frozen for MOTU until august 16th
[03:05] <sharms> so whatever the newest fun version is it should make it in 
[03:11] <defendguin> i found someone who in etch 
[03:11] <defendguin> you get what i mean
[03:40] <zakame> good day
[03:40] <bddebian> Heya zakame
[03:41] <zakame> hi bddebian
[03:44] <zakame> what to do today? :)
[03:46] <TheMuso> Greetings from Wentworth Falls, located in the Blue Mountains!
[03:46] <RAOF> Hey!  How is it?
[03:46] <RAOF> Apart from the lack of super fast internet
[03:47] <TheMuso> RAOF: Fine thanks. At least we are on 1500.
[03:47] <RAOF> Eh, that's not too bad.
[03:48] <RAOF> Although I'm liking my new 1Mb/sec rates :)
[03:49] <TheMuso> RAOF: You're making me jellous.
[03:49] <RAOF> 1500 is perfectly acceptable, though :)
[03:50] <TheMuso> Yep it is.
[03:50] <RAOF> Who wants to help me rewrite the TeXmacs gui in GTK2?
[03:50] <TheMuso> We're with Internode.
[03:51] <TheMuso> Wereas in no longer good?
[03:52] <zakame> hi TheMuso
[03:52] <RAOF> They didn't have ADSL2+.  At least, not in NSW.
[03:53] <TheMuso> Right.
[03:53] <TheMuso> zakame: Hey dude.
[03:53] <TheMuso> Its really nice to be back online again/.
[03:53] <TheMuso> RAOF: I would have been on sooner if Telstra hadn't screwed up at the exchange on Friday.
[03:54] <RAOF> Ah, yes.  Telstra :(
[03:54] <zakame> hehe
[03:55] <TheMuso> Went so far as to kill our line for the whole weekend.
[03:56] <LaserJock> TheMuso: hi!
[03:56] <TheMuso> Heya LaserJock.
[03:58] <ScottK> Welcome back TheMuso
[03:58] <TheMuso> Hey ScottK./
[03:58] <TheMuso> Glad to be back.
[04:01] <ScottK> Is there any kind of Ubuntu policy about whether or not to include software in the repositories that is designed for abusive uses (e.g. spam ware)?
[04:13] <LaserJock> ScottK: I don't know of any policy we have to exclude software
[04:14] <bddebian> Sounds like something that should be excluded though :-)
[04:15] <LaserJock> ScottK: but I think something that's obviously not good to put in our repos can be discussed and rejected
[04:15] <LaserJock> TheMuso: I've got a question for you
[04:16] <LaserJock> TheMuso: I'm working on a periodic table app doing various color schemes, but we're worried about accessibility
[04:19] <LaserJock> TheMuso: do you know of anybody that would be willing to look over some screenshots or something and give some advice?
[04:19] <ajmitch> fun discussion in #d-devel today
[04:19] <ajmitch> about ubuntu & giving back patches
[04:19] <ScottK> bddebian/Laserjock: The problem of course is one man's spamware is another man's useful mail tool.  Challenge/Response anti-spam solutions are one of my personal pet peeves and some entities (e.g. spamcop) consider them reportable spam.  It's actually in the archive already and broken.  If there's no clear policy, I just won't bother with fixing his bug and leave it at that.  Thanks.
[04:20] <ScottK> ajmitch: Is it a good or a bad thing?
[04:20] <LaserJock> ajmitch: yes, lots of that going around (planet.debian.org, etc.)
[04:20] <LaserJock> ajmitch: I thought we kind of took care of that
[04:21] <TheMuso> LaserJock: No, unfortunately I don't.
[04:21] <TheMuso> LaserJock: You might want to ask heno.
[04:21] <TheMuso> When he's around.
[04:21] <bddebian> ajmitch: Oh yeah, now what?
[04:21] <LaserJock> ScottK: if it's debatible then we can debate it on #ubuntu-motu
[04:21] <LaserJock> TheMuso: ok, np. I just thought I'd ask
[04:22] <bddebian> ScottK: Well I would say if it's already in we should fix it.  I freakin' hate broken packages :)
[04:24] <ScottK> It's bug #109083 if anyone really wants to look into it.
[04:24] <ubotu> Malone bug 109083 in tmda "No Python TMDA modules for python 2.5" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/109083
[04:25] <ScottK> The problem, of course, is that almost all spammers forge the address they mail from and so these challenges almost all go to innocent third parties.
[04:25] <ajmitch> LaserJock: not nearly enough
[04:25] <LaserJock> ajmitch: patches.ubuntu.com being down isn't a help
[04:25] <LaserJock> I thought all the patches went to PTS though
[04:25] <bddebian> What's the discussion???
[04:25] <ajmitch> patches!!!!
[04:26] <bddebian> I see that, what about?
[04:26] <bddebian> That we still aren't sending enough over?
[04:26] <ajmitch> LaserJock: no, and the complaints are also along the lines of automated patches not having nearly enough context to be useful
[04:26] <LaserJock> sure
[04:27] <LaserJock> but I really don't think other derivs are really doing better
[04:27] <ajmitch> no, but few derivatives change things to the extent we do
[04:27] <LaserJock> exactly
[04:27] <ajmitch> either way, I feel like writing up something to identify who changed what
[04:28] <LaserJock> what do you mean?
[04:28] <ScottK> I can understand that it's hard to make use of some of the patches.  I've seen patches in BTS that are just the entire Ubuntu debdiff.
[04:28] <LaserJock> sure
[04:28] <LaserJock> what else can we do with our scale?
[04:28] <LaserJock> we can encourage people to push things upstream
[04:29] <ajmitch> yes
[04:29] <LaserJock> we can provide automatic debdiffs
[04:29] <ajmitch> and we don't do that
[04:29] <LaserJock> but we're doing those things already
[04:29] <LaserJock> I just feel that certain people in Debian just want to give Ubuntu a hard time
[04:29] <LaserJock> sure we aren't perfect
[04:30] <LaserJock> nowhere close
[04:30] <LaserJock> but geeze, give us a break
[04:30] <LaserJock> ajmitch: well no, that's not what I meant
[04:30] <LaserJock> if people have solutions I'm all ears
[04:31] <LaserJock> we don't do great at pushing upstream
[04:31] <LaserJock> but we don't do great at reviewing
[04:31] <LaserJock> we don't do great at getting in RC fixes
[04:32] <LaserJock> we've got a lot of things to improve on
[04:32] <ScottK> LaserJock: Just because people complain doesn't mean things suck.
[04:32] <ScottK> (as an example)
[04:33] <LaserJock> no, but usually there is an element of truth when people do complain
[04:34] <ScottK> Sure, but nothing is perfect either.
[04:34] <bddebian> Debian is
[04:34] <bddebian> :-)
[04:35] <ScottK> Hey, it must be, you can get Automatix for it.
[04:35] <ScottK> ;-)
[04:40] <bddebian> Laser_away: Don't you know that Walmart is evil? :-)
[04:41] <ScottK> Yeah, but we distribute software with actual bugs in it, so we've got no grounds to complain about someone else being evil ;-)
[04:43] <Laser_away> bddebian: evil is in the sight of the wallet ;-)
[04:43] <bddebian> Heh, no shit :)
[04:46] <bddebian> Hrm, maybe I really should drop out.  I'm not even sure what the hell I bring to the table anymore.. :'-(
[04:47] <ScottK> bddebian: Knock that off.
[04:47] <ScottK> You were a big help to me.
[04:48] <bddebian> ScottK: Thanks but I'm old and codgy and stuff :_)
[04:48] <ScottK> Also, you've done a lot to keep revu up to date.  
[04:49] <ScottK> As bad as it is, it'd be WAY worse without your efforts.
[04:49] <ScottK> Plus, you don't get to whine to me that you're old.
[04:49] <bddebian> Damn, I forgot about that :-)
[04:51] <ScottK> My good news is that the REALLY hard new package I was planning on doing for Gutsy showed up in Debian NEW today!  Makes my life easier...
[04:52] <bddebian> Heh, nice
[04:52] <RAOF> Woot.
[04:52] <ScottK> No IPT either, so it's not like I forgot to check.
[04:53] <bddebian> ITP you mean? :)
[04:53] <ScottK> Yeah.  If I could type, that's what I would have typed.
[04:53] <Burgundavia> ScottK: which package?
[04:54] <ScottK> DKIM-milter
[04:54] <ScottK> DK-milter too, but I'm less interested in that.
[04:54] <grayman> usplash seems to be troublesome
[04:55] <RAOF> That reminds me...
[05:15] <TheMuso> When is the next UDS?
[05:16] <ajmitch> boston, november
[05:17] <bddebian> If I'm still around I could actually go to that one
[05:19] <RAOF> Wake me when there's one in .au :P
[05:19] <ajmitch> RAOF: already happened
[05:20] <ajmitch> may 2005, ubuntu down under
[05:22] <RAOF> I think that may have been a little too early for me.
[05:22] <ajmitch> probably
[05:22] <ajmitch> it was a fun trip though :)
[05:22] <RAOF> Yeah, we're cool in .au :P
[05:22] <ajmitch> it was my first time meeting many of the ubuntu developers
[05:23] <jml> too many jokes?
[05:24] <ajmitch> no, too much of it at the hotel
[05:25] <jml> oh
[05:25] <RAOF> Hey Hobbsee 
[05:27] <Hobbsee> boo
[05:27] <Hobbsee> hey RAOF!
[05:33] <ajmitch> hello Hobbsee 
[05:42] <Hobbsee> hi ajmitch 
[05:42] <Hobbsee> being trouble again?
[05:42] <ajmitch> of course
[05:43] <RAOF> Why do so many people want to use their Save dialog as a file manager?
[05:43] <crimsun> err, you mean it's not?
[05:44] <bddebian> heh
[05:44] <bddebian> Kinda like Deleted Items mailbox.. :-)
[05:45] <RAOF> Hm.  Someone said they kinda knew how to read Firefox backtraces a while back.
[05:46] <RAOF> Would anyone like to help me decipher democracyplayer's gtkembedmoz backtraces?
[05:56] <TheMuso> Heya Hobbsee, crimsun.
[05:57] <Hobbsee> hi TheMuso, how'd the move go?
[05:57] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: Very well, but for Telstra being their usual stupid self.
[05:57] <Hobbsee> heh.  that's normal
[05:57] <TheMuso> Indeed.
[06:00] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: send it to /dev/null
[06:00] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: I wish I could. :)
[06:00] <Hobbsee> :)
[06:20] <crimsun> TheMuso: 'lo. Glad to read that the move went tolerably.
[06:27] <phratman> I was running the Ubuntu Feisty Alternate Install CD again today with ks=<path to my configuration>. I have a post installation bash script that extracts a tar to /target. However, an error comes up as the last file scrolls past on the screen: "bad number."
[06:27] <phratman> I know it's not a tar error because I extracted the tar on another machine and echo $? returned 0.
[06:51] <LaserJock> ajmitch: ping
[06:54] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: consider yourself punged.
[06:55] <LaserJock> "punged"?
[06:55] <LaserJock> must be an AU term ;-)
[06:55] <Hobbsee> haha :P
[06:56] <LaserJock> and how are you this evening Ms. Hobbs?
[06:57] <bddebian> GNight folks
[06:58] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: been replying on the forums again
[06:58] <RAOF> Night bddebian 
[06:58] <TheMuso> When does uds in savilla happen?
[06:59] <LaserJock> starts the 6th I think
[06:59] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: so I see ;-)
[06:59] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: elky and i leave on the 3rd
[06:59] <Hobbsee> starts on the 6th
[06:59] <Hobbsee> iirc
[06:59] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: *grin*
[06:59] <TheMuso> cool.
[07:01] <LaserJock> I'm leaving on the 1st
[07:01] <LaserJock> to get to UES on the 3rd
[07:01] <crimsun> I expect Great Things out of this group going to UDS.
[07:01] <Hobbsee> like what?
[07:01] <crimsun> a pony, for starters.
[07:02] <RAOF> One Pony Per Child?
[07:02] <LaserJock> crimsun: we could expect more if you were coming along?
[07:02] <Hobbsee> haha
[07:02] <ajmitch> LaserJock: pong
[07:02] <LaserJock> RAOF: excellent
[07:02] <LaserJock> ajmitch: either way, I feel like writing up something to identify who changed what
[07:03] <ajmitch> LaserJock: yes?
[07:03] <LaserJock> I'm still waiting :-)
[07:03] <ajmitch> keep waiting
[07:03] <LaserJock> what do you mean by "identify who changed what"?
[07:03] <ajmitch> identify who made the last upload of one of the ~1500 packages in universe that have an *ubuntu* version
[07:04] <ajmitch> it was an idea, and a bad one
[07:06] <LaserJock> hmm, and we could group them by person
[07:07] <LaserJock> hmmm
[07:07] <LaserJock> or maybe more interesting
[07:07] <LaserJock> we could group them by Origina-Maintainer:
[07:07] <LaserJock> *Original
[07:07] <LaserJock> so a DD could find out who's been messing around with their package
[07:09] <ajmitch> if you wish
[07:11] <LaserJock> well, do you think that'd be interesting?
[07:11] <ajmitch> might be
[07:11] <ajmitch> it's more or less what I had in mind
[07:11] <ajmitch> it'll probably just get ignored like most lists
[07:18] <LaserJock> well, I'm starting to think that one of the biggest problems we have in MOTU (perhaps Ubuntu in general when it comes to packages) is information
[07:18] <LaserJock> or lack thereof
[07:19] <LaserJock> I think we need more of your lists
[07:19] <LaserJock> we should have a collection of pages
[07:19] <LaserJock> and make them pretty and nice
[07:19] <LaserJock> with comment fields ;-)
[07:20] <ajmitch> :P
[07:23] <LaserJock> I think your RC list was one of the best things we did for Feisty
[07:23] <ajmitch> didn't seem to have much effect
[07:23] <LaserJock> well
[07:23] <LaserJock> I think we need to work on them a little
[07:23] <LaserJock> make them a bit more Hopeful friendly perhaps
[07:24] <LaserJock> but I *think* more people will come if we have clear lists of things to do
[07:24] <crimsun> well, I should have done more with it, certainly
[07:24] <Hobbsee> meh.  forum crack
[07:24] <RAOF> Particularly if the lists of things to do come with instructions as to how to do them :)
[07:24] <crimsun> by the time I got to a breathing point, it was 2 weeks before release
[07:24] <LaserJock> RAOF: exactly
[07:24] <Hobbsee> we've got new people coming in at the moment, but dont have the documentation to really help
[07:24] <LaserJock> we need what to do as well as how to do
[07:26] <RAOF> I looked at some of those RC bugs (fuse and texmacs, particularly), and they didn't seem to be bugs in ubuntu.
[07:26] <ajmitch> crimsun: sure, I did the list, filed a few syncs & left it
[07:27] <ajmitch> RAOF: plenty of them were
[07:27] <LaserJock> we need to have a "done" checkmark
[07:27] <ajmitch> lots of things for me to do
[07:28] <LaserJock> well, we should all get behind it
[07:28] <LaserJock> bzr branch and then have stuff running on tiber, as much as we can
[07:28] <LaserJock> granted your RC list isn't great I guess because you have to have a local copy of BTS
[07:29] <LaserJock> s/great/great for that/
[07:29] <ajmitch> yeah
[07:30] <RAOF> Please share such hard won wisdom :)
[07:30] <Hobbsee> http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=2069967&postcount=32
[07:32] <imbrandon> moins all
[07:32] <Hobbsee> hi imbrandon 
[07:32] <imbrandon> heya Hobbsee 
[07:32] <LaserJock> hi imbrandon 
[07:32] <imbrandon> LaserJock!
[07:33] <superm1> hey imbrandon 
[07:33] <imbrandon> hey i have a question , i have a cupple of packages that FTBFS from BREEZY! on, and each release i get an email telling me so, they have been superceeded like j2se 1.4 , etc
[07:34] <imbrandon> wtf is up with that
[07:34] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: that is a perl of wisdom there
[07:34] <RAOF> Yeah, pretty good.
[07:35] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: indeed.
[07:36] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: hopefully it stops, as breezy is finished?
[07:36] <Hobbsee> RAOF: neither do i - that was a direct link
[07:41] <LaserJock> hmm, so in 2 days I've managed to get a 12 memeber ubuntu-tex team
[07:41] <Hobbsee> nice!
[07:42] <LaserJock> what remains to be seen is if it manages to do anything
[07:42] <jussi01> nice work LaserJock
[07:42] <ajmitch> ok, home
[07:43] <imbrandon> Hobbsee, well its trying to rebuild them each release
[07:43] <imbrandon> so breezy eol wont stop it
[07:44] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: ahh
[07:44] <Hobbsee> imbrandon: request a removal
[07:44] <Hobbsee> ?
[07:44] <imbrandon> yea thats probably what i'm gonna have to do
[07:54] <superm1> imbrandon, would you be able to take a look at doing two backports: bug 108129 and bug 108130.  jdong already acked 108129, but it doesnt appear he uploaded or anything (according to thebug)
[07:54] <ubotu> Malone bug 108129 in edgy-backports "backport newer mythtv to reflect mysql changes/fixes" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/108129
[07:54] <ubotu> Malone bug 108130 in dapper-backports "backport newer mythtv to reflect mysql changes/fixes" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/108130
[07:55] <imbrandon> superm1, wellt he one jdong ack's the archive admins will have to take from there, we dont upload them ( as the backport team , only test/ack them )
[07:55] <superm1> imbrandon, ah okay.
[07:55] <imbrandon> and then notify the archive admins, anyhow, yea the second one give me a sec
[07:56] <imbrandon> :)
[07:57] <imbrandon> superm1, i will have to test build this on dapper/dapper pbuilder first , but then i'll ack it
[07:58] <imbrandon> its a big jump to just "ok i trust you" thing :)
[07:58] <superm1> right.  i should have saved my log from my dapper build to upload :(
[07:58] <superm1> haha yea i know
[07:59] <superm1> my build was roughly two weeks ago anyhow.
[07:59] <Hobbsee> that REVU thread is interesting
[07:59] <Burgundavia> Hobbsee: linky?
[08:00] <Hobbsee> Burgundavia: ubuntu-motu ML
[08:00] <Hobbsee> dont have a link, per se
[08:01] <dholbach> good morning
[08:01] <poningru> Hobbsee: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archive/ubuntu-motu
[08:01] <poningru> ;p
[08:03] <ajmitch> hey daniel
[08:03] <Hobbsee> poningru: thanks
[08:04] <dholbach> hey andrew
[08:04] <dholbach> how's it going?
[08:04] <ajmitch> good :)
[08:04] <ajmitch> you?
[08:05] <superm1> imbrandon, with regard to setting up with mythbuntu.org, did you figure out what the situation was with the domain itself?
[08:05] <dholbach> ajmitch: quite good too :)
[08:11] <phratman> Could someone else look into this as well to verify that some sort of bug in kickstart -> d-i translation is in effect? Step a) Make a simple kickstart setup (doesn't really matter what it looks like as long as it has a post installation script that untars a .tar file) Step b) Boot up an Ubuntu Feisty Alternate Installation CD with the ks=<path to the kickstart configuration file> (Hit F6 and add ks=http://somewebserver.
[08:12] <phratman> Also, I'd much appreciate MOTU folks taking a look at both REVU and Launchpad more often than not. :)
[08:20] <Hobbsee> replied
[08:21] <Hobbsee> phratman: launchpad is very big.  REVU, not much can be done with at the moment as the merges havent been done
[08:21] <Hobbsee> !info kickstart
[08:21] <ubotu> Package kickstart does not exist in feisty
[08:22] <Hobbsee> phratman: kickstart?
[08:24] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: you're a science person.  when will you figure out how to clone MOTU's
[08:24] <Hobbsee> ?
[08:25] <Hobbsee> phratman: d-i isnt something MOTU does - you may want to send to ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com or file a bug
[08:25] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: just shutdown REVU for gutsy, we don't need any new packages now ;)
[08:25] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: i wish...i wish
[08:25] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: get them to talk to white about getting them into debian
[08:25] <ajmitch> they should be going into debian anyway
[08:25] <Hobbsee> yeah
[08:25] <Hobbsee> althogh then they're unmaintained in debian, depending on the maintainer...
[08:25] <ajmitch> why white? surely StevenK would be a willing volunteer :)
[08:26] <Hobbsee> you'd have to ask him that
[08:26] <Hobbsee> in fact, that's not a bad idea
[08:26] <Hobbsee> to get rid of REVU and shove everything into debian
[08:26] <ajmitch> unmaintained in debian vs ubuntu, what's the difference?
[08:27] <RAOF> Last time I looked at a debian-new-maintainer guide, I seem to remember it suggested throwing packages up onto REVU as a possible option for getting your prospective package "out there"?
[08:28] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: PPAs will solve everything
[08:29] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: true
[08:29] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: vaporware always does
[08:30] <phratman> Hobbsee: kickstart is as far as I know, something that originated with Redhat and was originally ported from Redhat to Ubuntu around the Hoary release.
[08:30] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[08:30] <phratman> Hobbsee: It's a *much* simpler approach to automating installs in my humble opinion.
[08:31] <Hobbsee> phratman: d-i isnt something MOTU does - you may want to send to ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com or file a bug
[08:31] <phratman> Hobbsee: Yeah... I got that..
[08:31] <Hobbsee> :)
[08:31] <phratman> Would #ubuntu-devel be right for this discussion instead then?
[08:32] <phratman> Hobbsee: If you're interested, kickstart basically allows you to modify an installer CD's behavior without remastering it.
[08:32] <Hobbsee> phratman: if anyone was there, yes
[08:32] <Hobbsee> maybe
[08:32] <Hobbsee> cjwatson's the one you're after, i guess
[08:32] <phratman> Ah, okay.
[08:32] <phratman> Is it better to not file a report and just talk to developer directly?
[08:33] <phratman> I found another bug which I haven't gotten around to filing just yet, but I figure if I talk to a developer things may go faster.
[08:34] <Hobbsee> bug reports are oftne better, as irc dosnt make a good todo list
[08:35] <Hobbsee> so you either get a response, then get forgotten about, or not seen for much longer, but not forgotten about
[08:35] <Hobbsee> take your pick
[08:36] <phratman> Ah.
[08:36] <phratman> So what's the difference between #ubuntu-motu and #ubuntu-devel?
[08:37] <phratman> Is #ubuntu-devel core stuff or something?
[08:37] <poningru> yes
[08:37] <Hobbsee> yes
[08:37] <phratman> Ah, gotcha.
[08:37] <phratman> I like the MOTU people though I guess most of my beef is with the devel folks :P
[08:37] <phratman> Anyway, I'm not of much relevance here. Thanks for all the help folks.
[08:37] <grayman> devel is for mean people
[08:37] <imbrandon> phratman, well there is much overlap :)
[08:38] <phratman> Ah.
[08:38] <phratman> I guarantee I will be back here in the future :)
[08:43] <Fujitsu> Um, do I get this right? We're going to have an entirely new CC?
[08:44] <LaserJock> no
[08:44] <LaserJock> I think only Colin left the CC
[08:44] <Burgundavia> nope
[08:44] <Hobbsee> and voting was supposed to start ages ago
[08:44] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: you get to bow down before some new overlords
[08:45] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: TB voting was meant to start last year
[08:45] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Wasn't it meant to be very soon after MTV?
[08:45] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: i stand corrected
[08:45] <imbrandon> hrm ajmitch you still hack mono a bit right ?
[08:45] <ajmitch> imbrandon: not particularly, why?
[08:45] <Fujitsu> ajmitch: I would have thought that it would have been like the MOTU council, with terms staggered.
[08:45] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: complain to the sabdfl
[08:45] <imbrandon> just wondering about a few things, trying to catch up on two years of not hacking on it
[08:45] <imbrandon> hehe
[08:46] <ajmitch> imbrandon: I probably can't help you with it then
[08:46] <wolfeon> :(
[08:46] <Hobbsee> ?
[08:47] <wolfeon> just frowning over ubuntu's pathetic x86 library support
[08:47] <wolfeon> genpoo has better support
[08:47] <wolfeon> which is what I converted this system from
[08:47] <Hobbsee> then fix it?
[08:47] <wolfeon> ubuntu needs this.. http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/base/amd64/emul/content.xml
[08:47] <wolfeon> all those specific lirbaries in a meta package
[08:48] <wolfeon> instead I'mn having to sit here extracting i386 libs
[08:48] <TheMuso> Heya Fujitsu, imbrandon.
[08:48] <Fujitsu> Yay, you're back!
[08:48] <Fujitsu> wolfeon: Fix it, then.
[08:48] <Fujitsu> TheMuso: How'd the move go?
[08:48] <wolfeon> Fujitsu: I can fix my systems, but it would've been nice to have the packages in teh first place
[08:48] <Fujitsu> wolfeon: Well, make the packages in the first place.
[08:49] <Hobbsee> wolfeon: then fix the packages....
[08:49] <wolfeon> Fujitsu: shouldn't need to..
[08:49] <TheMuso> Fujitsu: Overall very well. Not stressful at all. Telstra of course screwed the line up late last week, so would have probably been online sooner otherwise,
[08:49] <Fujitsu> wolfeon: Somebody has to.
[08:49] <Hobbsee> wolfeon: well, that's very nice of you.  we're volunteers, we shouldnt have to fix it either.
[08:49] <imbrandon> TheMuso!
[08:49] <Fujitsu> TheMuso: Duh, that's what Telstra does.
[08:49] <Hobbsee> so it goes on not being fixed
[08:49] <wolfeon> Fujitsu: its not gonna be me.. would take me a while to learn how to package 
[08:49] <TheMuso> Fujitsu: Damn right.
[08:49] <wolfeon> what.. you're not slaves? :)
[08:49] <Fujitsu> I shouldn't have to fix universe bugs. It's just pathetic that they exist in the first place. Not my problem.
[08:49] <TheMuso> lol
[08:49] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: bye
[08:50] <ajmitch> nice knowing you
[08:50] <wolfeon> I think there seems to be some slave labor going on. :)
[08:50] <Hobbsee> wolfeon: you mgiht think that.
[08:53] <wolfeon> :/
[08:53] <wolfeon> SL mailing list is filled with it
[08:53] <wolfeon> *forum
[08:53] <ajmitch> poor Hobbsee, slaving away & her only reward a trip to seville
[08:54] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: heh.  who says i'm doing work all the time?
[08:54] <wolfeon> Fujitsu: I'd have to beat the ubuntu devs senselessly until they would say yes :)
[08:54] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: true 
[08:54] <Hobbsee> wolfeon: no, that would be trolling.  which is kinda what you're doing now.  actually doing the work would get you further
[08:55] <wolfeon> Hobbsee: I'm doing the work.. just on my own system.
[08:55] <Hobbsee> it'd be more productive if you actually put ti into ubuntu...
[08:55] <Hobbsee> but you dont seem to be willing to do that, just coming to whinge here.
[08:56] <superm1> while on subject here, wasn't the holdup for introducing support for installing 32 bit apps in a 64 bit system going to be that we were waiting for etch to be released, since it was the first debian release that actually had support for amd64?  I recall reading this on a wiki spec at some point
[08:57] <Fujitsu> Not sure what Debian's plans are on that.
[08:57] <imbrandon> wolfeon, ever thought about just using the ia32-libs package :)
[08:57] <ajmitch> superm1: if you mean multiarch support, it's not as a simple problem as most people think
[08:57] <wolfeon> imbrandon: I did install ia32-libs
[08:57] <superm1> ajmitch, thats what i imagined.  if it was simple, it would have already been done (and introduced in etch)
[08:58] <superm1> ajmitch, but yes i was referring to multiarch support
[08:58] <ajmitch> superm1: there's the nasty hack way of doing things, and a sane way
[08:58] <wolfeon> ia32-libs is like.. the base of the genpoo packages
[08:58] <wolfeon> http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/base/amd64/emul/content.xml
[08:58] <imbrandon> and [..]  ?
[08:59] <wolfeon> this is what gentoo suports, and secondlife works with alsa.. right now it is using OSS. you can imagine the pain
[08:59] <Fujitsu> Hm, isn't SecondLife's source available, so amd64 builds are possible?
[09:00] <wolfeon> yuck
[09:00] <imbrandon> so fix it, or actualy help someone else fix it, not complain and say that so-and-so does this or that
[09:00] <wolfeon> Fujitsu: they do not distribute the binary blobs.. if you compiled the source, it would be slower in many ways
[09:00] <wolfeon> *binary blob libraries
[09:01] <imbrandon> wolfeon, why are you trying to run secondlife on a 64bit kernel anyhow is the better question, the only programs that will take advantage of larger memory addressing are server apps and second life isnt server 
[09:01] <imbrandon> anyhow this is all getting way way off topic
[09:01] <wolfeon> imbrandon: I have a desktop with 6 gigs of mem :)
[09:02] <imbrandon> 32bit with pae if great
[09:02] <imbrandon> is*
[09:02] <wolfeon> noo thank you
[09:02] <Fujitsu> imbrandon: That's what I would have thought PAE was for.
[09:02] <ajmitch> PAE isn't nice
[09:03] <Fujitsu> I know nothing about it except that it allows use of more than 4GiB of RAM.
[09:07] <wolfeon> :)
[09:08] <RAOF> Ah, I see the "make my amd64 work like i386" has made it onto #ubuntu-motu :)
[09:09] <wolfeon> don't care now.. just commented out OSS in the sl script and it used alsa..
[09:09] <wolfeon> why would someone want to try oss before alsa.. wth :/
[09:09] <wolfeon> ;)
[09:09] <ajmitch> RAOF: of course
[09:10] <RAOF> I'm all for 64bit support.  But proper multiarch seems like a *lot* of effort, for almost no gain.
[09:10] <wolfeon> RAOF: there really isn't anythign left but packaging up 32bit libraries
[09:10] <RAOF> (At least on x86, other archs have an actual performance reason for mixing 32& 64bit code)
[09:11] <ajmitch> wolfeon: that's the nasty hack I was talking about earlier
[09:11] <wolfeon> ajmitch: I know :)))
[09:11] <wolfeon> the hack is what I've done before in genpoo
[09:11] <ajmitch> so saying that there really isn't anything left, is a bit inaccurate
[09:11] <wolfeon> good riddens to it :)
[09:12] <wolfeon> ajmitch: a hack is better than nothing
[09:12] <imbrandon> wolfeon, thats a matter of opinion, but no imho a hack is not better than nothing
[09:12] <imbrandon> in this case
[09:12] <TheMuso> Finally got through email.
[09:12] <imbrandon> TheMuso!
[09:12] <imbrandon> your back
[09:13] <TheMuso> imbrandon: Indee.
[09:13] <TheMuso> indeed even
[09:13] <imbrandon> howd the move go ?
[09:13] <TheMuso> imbrandon: Just moved house.
[09:13] <imbrandon> cool
[09:13] <TheMuso> See my comment to Fujitsu earlier.
[09:13] <TheMuso> Overall well, but our monopoly telco screwed up our line, so we weren't able to get DSL going till today.
[09:14] <imbrandon> ahh
[09:14] <TheMuso> bbiaf
[09:16] <Fujitsu> Their monopoly is sort of being reduced a bit, but they still control every piece of telecommunications copper going into residential areas.
[09:16] <ajmitch> just like telecom on this side of the ditch
[09:17] <Burgundavia> we just got number portability here
[09:17] <ajmitch> at least the government is splitting up telecom this year
[09:18] <RAOF> Have you sold your monopoly telecom?
[09:18] <Fujitsu> Our government isn't splitting ours up... it's just selling it off.
[09:18] <ajmitch> oh telecom went private years ago
[09:18] <RAOF> Because that always seemed like a stupid idea to me "No, of *course* they won't abuse their monopoly.  We'll be watching them *really closely*"
[09:18] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: are you finding that any w.u.c page is taking forever to load?
[09:18] <Fujitsu> So we're going to have a fully privatised corporation controlling all the last-mile copper in the country, as well as being an ISP and content provider.
[09:19] <ajmitch> the government is finally at the stage of being fed up & forcing them to split
[09:19] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: wiki? I haven't tried it in an hour or so.
[09:19] <ajmitch> so we're a few years ahead of .au in that sense
[09:19] <Burgundavia> Hobbsee: nope
[09:19] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: can you?
[09:19] <Fujitsu> ajmitch: You sure they're not going to somehow succeed in an appeal, like MSFT?
[09:19] <Hobbsee> Burgundavia: yes, but you're not australian
[09:19] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: I'll try now.
[09:19] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: great
[09:19] <Burgundavia> Hobbsee: yes, I still have my sanity, thanks :)
[09:20] <Fujitsu> About 5 seconds, which is a little slower than normal
[09:20] <TheMuso> The area where I am now probably won't see DSL2+ available for another year at least, if not more.
[09:20] <TheMuso> Ok. Time to do a fresh reinstall on a box.
[09:21] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: no, telecom gets to submit an alternate plan, but that's about it
[09:21] <Fujitsu> Cable's good, except for only having two ISPs providing it, and the stupid capped upload speed.
[09:21] <ajmitch> TheMuso: don't worry, we've been promised ADSL2+ "this year" for 2 years now
[09:21] <Fujitsu> ajmitch: That's what everybody thought about Microsoft,..
[09:21] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: telecom nz doesn't have the same clout as microsoft
[09:22] <ajmitch> I don't think any company can be quite as arrogant & powerful as MS at times
[09:22] <Fujitsu> ajmitch: Even so. They'll manage.
[09:22] <Fujitsu> Telstra comes close.
[09:22] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: right
[09:22] <TheMuso> ajmitch: Any other companies there decided to install their own DSLAMS?
[09:22] <ajmitch> TheMuso: they can't yet
[09:22] <TheMuso> Oh ok.
[09:22] <ajmitch> TheMuso: still waiting on local loop unbundling to come through
[09:22] <TheMuso> Lovely.
[09:22] <ajmitch> which will end up being part of this split of telecom
[09:23] <ajmitch> a few companies have promised they will
[09:23] <Fujitsu> I loved it when Telstra tried to get permission to roll out some new broadband network that they weren't going to resell.
[09:23] <ajmitch> but that's a way off
[09:23] <Fujitsu> And when they started selling there own ADSL plans below the wholesale cost.
[09:23] <Fujitsu> *their
[09:24] <RAOF> "Of course they'll offer their *direct* competitors appropriate access to their infrastructure" :(
[09:25] <TheMuso> Fujitsu: Aren't Telstra trying to do some dirty deal which will allow their network to happen?
[09:25] <Fujitsu> TheMuso: I think so, yes.
[09:25] <Fujitsu> Having them entirely privatised is going to be really, really bad.
[09:26] <TheMuso> Oh yeah.
[09:26] <RAOF> I just don't get how the "free market" government thinks it's going to work
[09:26] <Fujitsu> Shouldn't the ACCC do something about it?
[09:26] <RAOF> But government regulation is bad, m'kay?
[09:27] <TheMuso> The ACCC are a toothless tiger as far as I understand it.
[09:27] <RAOF> Also, the ACCC doing something about it would hurt the Telstra stock price, and *think of the mum & dad investors*!!!!!!11111
[09:27] <jussi01> the ACCC do nothing...
[09:27] <Fujitsu> RAOF: True, true. We wouldn't want that, would we?
[09:28] <Fujitsu> jussi01: Sure they do. They let Telstra get away with a heap of stuff.
[09:28] <jussi01> lol
[09:35] <Fujitsu> Does anybody here know if LVM snapshotting has been fixed such that it doesn't randomly kill your VG? I presume so, but I'd like to get confirmation...
[09:36] <RAOF> Eeep, it was broken like that?
[09:37] <Fujitsu> It was.
[09:37] <RAOF> Good think I hadn't got around to looking at that pbuilder with lvm snapshots thingy
[09:39] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: I believe it was fixed
[09:39] <ajmitch> siretart will be able to confirm when he's around
[09:39] <Fujitsu> ajmitch: I thought so too.
[09:39] <Fujitsu> ajmitch: Thanks, I'll check with him.
[09:40] <Fujitsu> A nice short visit from delmorep in #ubuntu-devel... How useful.
[09:40] <Hobbsee> yep
[09:40] <Burgundavia> indeed
[09:40] <Hobbsee> he's spammed it twice in #ubuntu too
[09:41] <Fujitsu> A strange coincidence is that I started pbuilding it about 10 minutes ago.
[09:56] <imbrandon> startin early
[09:57] <imbrandon> hey can we upload yet?
[09:57] <Fujitsu> imbrandon: It's still frozen.
[09:57] <imbrandon> k
[09:59] <TheMuso> I'm sure we'll all be creating chroots as soon as things are stable enough to do so.
[09:59] <Fujitsu> \sh: Having fun there?
[09:59] <Fujitsu> Apparently so.
[10:00] <siretart> ajmitch: hi!
[10:00] <Fujitsu> TheMuso: What? You mean you haven't upgraded yet? Come on, all the forum users have, it HAS to be good.
[10:00] <siretart> I'm able to confirm what?
[10:00] <Fujitsu> Hi siretart. Is the LVM snapshotting bug fixed?
[10:00] <TheMuso> Fujitsu: lol.
[10:01] <siretart> Fujitsu: sort of, yes. I don't notice the symptoms anymore on my feisty desktop
[10:01] <siretart> Fujitsu: in debian, lvcreate (or more specifically, libdevmapper) was to create the device node
[10:01] <siretart> Fujitsu: in feisty, udev is to create it. this is causing a big confusion
[10:02] <siretart> Fujitsu: and many additional traps where to things can get racy
[10:02] <Fujitsu> Sounds like fun.
[10:02] <siretart> it is
[10:04] <\sh> moins
[10:06] <siretart> hi \sh 
[10:06] <Fujitsu> \sh: You've managed to stay in for more than a minute now! Great :)
[10:06] <siretart> Fujitsu: root on crypto-lv is pretty broken in feisty, according to cryptsetup's bug page
[10:06] <siretart> Fujitsu: I'd love to see some kind of cryto team in ubuntu which care's for this use case
[10:06] <Fujitsu> siretart: It looks that way :(
[10:07] <shawarma> Have any of you upgraded to gutsy yet?
[10:07] <Fujitsu> I use LUKS on an LV, but I'd like to have VG on LUKS.
[10:07] <Fujitsu> s/VG/PV/
[10:08] <siretart> Fujitsu: interesting idea. I'd like to discuss this in sevilla
[10:08] <dqdev> hello there!
[10:08] <Fujitsu> siretart: Want to write up a specish thing?
[10:08] <Fujitsu> dqdev: Hi.
[10:08] <dqdev> i have a question
[10:08] <shawarma> We have answers.
[10:08] <dqdev> i created a desktop file :)
[10:08] <Fujitsu> shawarma: Hopefully.
[10:08] <dqdev> for a 
[10:08] <siretart> Fujitsu: I plan to do so, if nobody is faster than me
[10:08] <dqdev> program (the desktop file was missing
[10:09] <shawarma> Fujitsu: Oh, but we do. Maybe not ones that match his question, though.
[10:09] <dqdev> I created the desktop file
[10:09] <dqdev> then saved it under prog/debian
[10:10] <dqdev> and now, as I understand, have to tell rules to install the desktop file into /usr/share/applications
[10:10] <shawarma> dqdev: Almost, but not quite.
[10:10] <dqdev> is that correct so far?
[10:10] <dqdev> hm... ok. i m all ears
[10:10] <shawarma> dqdev: You need to install it in (probably) debian/tmp/usr/share/applications
[10:11] <dqdev> and how do I do this installation?
[10:11] <\sh> Fujitsu, lol...had to updated my dircproxy ;)
[10:12] <shawarma> dqdev: When a .deb is being built, it's installed into a separate directory structure that matches your real dir structure. This is than put into a tar.gz and unpacked when you  install the .deb. It's i this alternative dir structure, you want to put you .desktop file.
[10:12] <shawarma> dqdev: So:
[10:13] <shawarma> dqdev: See where the rest of the package install things to. You can try "$(DESTDIR)/usr/share/applications" which is most likely correct.
[10:14] <dqdev> OK
[10:15] <shawarma> Makes sense?
[10:16] <dqdev> well... let's say that it's the /debian.tmp/usr/apps
[10:16] <dqdev> where I have to install the .desktop file
[10:18] <dqdev> even though I dont know where to find
[10:19] <dqdev> the folder where the prog. tries to install things
[10:20] <dqdev> how do I procceed?
[10:29] <dqdev> if I read the rules file
[10:29] <dqdev> i think that the installation dir is 
[10:30] <dqdev> debian/package_name/usr/share/games/package_name/
[10:34] <jussi01> hello motu's!
[10:35] <dqdev> hellp
[10:36] <jussi01> Im trying to qmake something, which option do i install?http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/17183/
[10:37] <DarkSun88> Hi all
[10:38] <shawarma> dqdev: You should install you desktop file in debian/package_name/usr/share/applications
[10:39] <dqdev> ok! 
[10:39] <dqdev> i dont know though howw to do the 'installation (complete newbie
[10:39] <dqdev> can you give me some directions
[10:39] <shawarma> dqdev: Ah, just copy the file in your rules.
[10:40] <shawarma> dqdev: Add a cp command to debian/rules that installs it.
[10:41] <dqdev> so, I edit the rules and at the end of the file i just write cp package/debian/package.desktop package/debian/package/usr/share/apps ?
[10:45] <dqdev> sorry for my pretty basic questions, but I need some push at the beginning
[10:45] <jussi01> dqdev: your all good, we've all been there (some of us still are)
[10:46] <jussi01> (including me)
[10:46] <dqdev> so, I edit the rules and at the end of the file i just write cp
[10:46] <dqdev> +package/debian/package.desktop package/debian/package/usr/share/apps ?
[10:51] <shawarma> dqde1: Not at the end, no.
[10:51] <shawarma> dqde1: Have you ever edited a Makefile before?
[10:51] <dqdev> yes
[10:51] <dqdev> not extensively though :$
[10:52] <imbrandon> ajmitch, ping!
[10:52] <shawarma> dqdev: Ok. debian/rules is a Makefile. There's probably an install target in it.
[10:53] <dqdev> yes, there is
[10:53] <shawarma> dqdev: Good. Add it there.
[10:53] <dqdev> there is the part install: build
[10:53] <shawarma> dqdev: Oh, and you can leave out the first "package" bit from the path in the cp line.
[10:53] <shawarma> dqdev: Yes. Below that.
[10:54] <dqdev> there there are commands such as  dh_testdir,  dh_testroot,  $(MAKE) install DESTDIR=$(CURDIR)/debian/ketm/
[10:54] <imbrandon> or StevenK, ping!
[10:55] <dqdev> ok... I ll try to play a little bit around with that. Then, I just build the debian package? Do I have to do anything else before that?
[11:00] <shawarma> dqdev: That should be it.
[11:00] <shawarma> dqdev: If it's a fairly standard package, of course.
[11:01] <dqdev> i think it is. thanks for the help shawarma. I ll try to do what you suggested and see what happens :$
[11:04] <shawarma> dqdev: Cool. Cheers.
[11:08] <kkubasik> anyone have a moment?
[11:08] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4874
[11:13] <StevenK> imbrandon: Hum?
[11:15] <shawarma> kkubasik: You need to put the proper preamble in debian/copyright as one of the previous comments mention.
[11:15] <kkubasik> my b, thought the preamble was something else, I'll upload again in a moment
[11:15] <imbrandon> StevenK, can you make a small unstable upload for me please 
[11:15] <imbrandon> less than a MB 
[11:16] <shawarma> kkubasik: It's the bit that you usually put at the top of source files.
[11:16] <kkubasik> yeah, I just found it in  another package, I thought it was just the debian file location
[11:16] <kkubasik> ok, uploaded
[11:16] <shawarma> kkubasik: Also, it seems to be GPL-2. You should update the reference to it, too.
[11:17] <imbrandon> StevenK, [..]  ?
[11:17] <StevenK> imbrandon: I suppose so.
[11:17] <StevenK> imbrandon: Give me a break, I am eating dinner at the same time.
[11:17] <imbrandon> hehe thanks , http://www.imbrandon.com/misc/apt-mirror/debian/apt-mirror_0.4.4-5.dsc
[11:19] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Not good enough.
[11:19] <Fujitsu> Taking a break to eat? Who needs to eat?
[11:20] <mvo> hello! I wonder if you are interessted in a special "feisty-uprade-motu" tag for universe packages that cause upgrade trouble ?
[11:20] <imbrandon> sure mvo, sounds good
[11:20] <StevenK> imbrandon: (Closes: #413795) and (Closes: #413796) => (Closes: #413795, #413796)  if you care
[11:20] <Fujitsu> mvo: Sounds useful.
[11:20] <Fujitsu> s/uprade/upgrade/, though.
[11:20] <imbrandon> StevenK, ahh i dident know, ok
[11:21] <Fujitsu> mvo: You left a digit out, surely?
[11:21] <Fujitsu> bug #10903
[11:21] <ubotu> Malone bug 10903 in postgresql "Postmaster won't start (after upgrade)" [High,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/10903
[11:21] <mvo> #109037,
[11:21] <mvo> *sigh* :)
[11:21] <StevenK> imbrandon: I don't care enough for -5, just so you know.
[11:21] <mvo> thanks Fujitsu
[11:21] <imbrandon> StevenK, huh ?
[11:22] <imbrandon> ohh ok
[11:22] <Fujitsu> bug #109037
[11:22] <ubotu> Malone bug 109037 in k3d "k3d" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/109037
[11:22] <imbrandon> cool yea
[11:22] <Fujitsu> Nice summary.
[11:22] <kkubasik> ok, new upload at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4875
[11:23] <Fujitsu> I'm sure I installed k3d yesterday to test something else.
[11:23] <StevenK> imbrandon: Does -5 encompass the Ubuntu changes? :-P
[11:23] <imbrandon> StevenK, yea, the ubuntu changes dont apply ( its to the mirror.list standing delta )
[11:24] <imbrandon> StevenK, since i'm upstream and debian and ubuntu maintainers i got lazy, i should make a new release and inclused both mirror.lists
[11:24] <imbrandon> but ahh well that will be 0.4.5
[11:25] <StevenK> imbrandon: Successfully uploaded packages.
[11:25] <imbrandon> thanks
[11:25] <StevenK> imbrandon: In future, could I suggest mentors.debian.net instead of bleating here?
[11:26] <imbrandon> StevenK, yea i normaly just poke anibal , but hehe
[11:28] <kkubasik> also, if anyone gets a moment, I redid the tangerine packaging
[11:28] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4876
[11:29] <kkubasik> and the updated moodbar upload
[11:29] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4877
[11:32] <imbrandon> kkubasik, your versioning looks a little funky in debian/changelog for moodbar
[11:32] <imbrandon> 0.1.2-1 > 0.1.2-0ubuntu2
[11:32] <imbrandon> and umm both entries shouldent be there 
[11:34] <kkubasik> imbrandon: how do you mean both shouldn't be there
[11:34] <kkubasik> shouldn't there be one?
[11:35] <imbrandon> there should be one, not both, they sare saying the same thing and conflicting
[11:35] <imbrandon> whats the upstream version of the package ? 0.1.2 ?
[11:35] <kkubasik> yeah
[11:35] <imbrandon> is it in debian ?
[11:35] <kkubasik> no
[11:36] <imbrandon> ok then both verisons are wrong, take out one of the entries, and change the other one to 0.1.2-0ubuntu1
-<debian revision>ubuntu<ubuntu revision>
[11:37] <kkubasik> ok, fixed and uploaded, give it a minute and it'll be there
[11:39] <kkubasik> imbrandon: did the same versioning fix for tangerine
[11:41] <dqdev> hello all
[11:42] <imbrandon> kkubasik, ok
[11:42] <kkubasik> ok, updates are in
[11:42] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4879
[11:42] <dqdev> i am trying to install a missing .desktop file into a package
[11:42] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4880
[11:42] <dqdev> and I edit the rules file
[11:42] <dqdev> by adding the line:
[11:42] <dqdev> cp debian/ketm.desktop debian/ketm/usr/share/applications/ketm.desktop
[11:43] <dqdev> under install
[11:43] <dqdev> and then I build the package with the commands
[11:43] <dqdev> sudo apt-get build-dep ketm 
[11:43] <dqdev> debuild -us -uc
[11:43] <dqdev> but irt still dosnt get installed
[11:44] <dqdev> Am I doing smthg wrong?
[11:44] <Fujitsu> Anybody know much about pycentral? It seems to be doing stupid things in bug #109037.
[11:44] <ubotu> Malone bug 109037 in k3d "Edgy's k3d fails to be removed in Feisty" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/109037
[11:45] <StevenK> I thought pycentral always required a X{B,S}-Python-Version field?
[11:45] <imbrandon> dqdev, you did install the .deb it produced right ? if so can you pastebin the output of dpkg -c <package>.deb
[11:46] <Fujitsu> StevenK: How would it have been installable in Edgy, then?
[11:46] <Fujitsu> Or is the Edgy postrm just deranged...
[11:47] <Fujitsu> Python-Versions: current
[11:47] <Fujitsu> That s shouldn't be there, should it?
[11:49] <StevenK> Is that the source or generated control?
[11:49] <Fujitsu> StevenK: generated
[11:49] <imbrandon> dqdev, do NOT paste that in a query window, i asked you to pastebin it please
[11:49] <imbrandon> your query has been closed
[11:49] <dqdev> sorry
[11:50] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Yeah, I think it ought to be Python-Version
[11:50] <Fujitsu> As do I.
[11:50] <imbrandon> food bbiab
[11:50] <Fujitsu> Currently trying to grab the source.
[11:50] <Fujitsu> Evil overloaded mirrors.
[11:52] <Fujitsu> StevenK: I haven't got source on mine yet, unfortunately.
[11:52] <Fujitsu> ...
[11:52] <Fujitsu> There's a package in edgy-proposed by Hobbsee to fix this issue.
[11:52] <StevenK> Heh
[11:52] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Yes, neither.
[11:53] <StevenK> I don't have a spare 11Gb for source.
[11:53] <dqdev> imbrandon: when I run dpkg -c <package>.deb, I don't see that the file <package>.desktop has been installed. SO appartently, my rules changes are not correct
[11:54] <imbrandon> dqdev, there ya go :)
[11:54] <Fujitsu> Oh, crap, that can't be fixed at all without some hackish stuff in postrm.
[11:54] <imbrandon> StevenK, 
[11:54] <imbrandon> brandon@voyager:~$ ping mirror.imbrandon.com
[11:54] <imbrandon> PING mirror.imbrandon.com (198.247.173.230) 56(84) bytes of data.
[11:54] <imbrandon> 64 bytes from mirror.imbrandon.com (198.247.173.230): icmp_seq=1 ttl=64 time=0.124 ms
[11:54] <imbrandon> :)
[11:54] <imbrandon> 0.124
[11:54] <Fujitsu> 1.23ms :(
[11:55] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Any ideas on how to fix this? It seems pretty irreversible screwed.
[11:55] <Fujitsu> *irreversibly
[11:55] <StevenK> Fujitsu: If the new post{rm,inst} work, it *should* sort itself out.
[11:56] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Hobbsee's fix was to rename the field, which of course won't work, because the old one has to be removed first...
[11:56] <Fujitsu> All I can think of is to cause the postrm to not run pycentral for that particular version, but that's really unnice.
[11:56] <StevenK> Have you tested that it won't?
[11:56] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Yes, and many others.
[11:56] <StevenK> Twitch
[11:56] <Nafallo> nafallo@silverfairy:~ $ ping6 ogre
[11:56] <Nafallo> PING ogre(ogre.local) 56 data bytes
[11:56] <Nafallo> 64 bytes from ogre.local: icmp_seq=1 ttl=64 time=0.165 ms
[11:56] <Fujitsu> It has to remove the old package first, and the postrm hasn't been changed.
[11:56] <StevenK> Naughty Hobbsee.
[11:57] <Fujitsu> The only change was in debian/control, s/Versions/Version/
[11:57] <StevenK> Can you pastebin an upgrade?
[11:57] <Fujitsu> StevenK: There's an example on the bug. It tries to use the new one, but that fails identically.
[11:58] <Nafallo> nice
[11:59] <Nafallo> us.archive. is still sweden :-)
[11:59] <StevenK> It's a horrible thought, but if the version is the busted one, exit 0 in the postrm?
[11:59] <Fujitsu> Oh joy.
[11:59] <Fujitsu> StevenK: How can I detect that? The call is pretty useless:
[11:59] <Fujitsu> #
[11:59] <Fujitsu> old-postrm upgrade new-version
[11:59] <Fujitsu> We don't get the old version.
[12:00] <StevenK> I told you it was horrible.
[12:00] <StevenK> We aren't the old-postrm
[12:00] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Sh.
[12:00] <Fujitsu> True, true.
[12:00] <StevenK> The currently installed package contains the old-postrm
[12:00] <Fujitsu> Noted, noted.
[12:00] <Fujitsu> Repeat, repeat.
[12:01] <Fujitsu> I must remember to attack Hobbsee when she gets back.
[12:01] <StevenK> Heh
[12:04] <Fujitsu> Arrgh, nooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.
[12:04] <Fujitsu> It's all auto-generated by pycentral.
[12:04] <StevenK> The package in question has no postrm?
[12:05] <Fujitsu> william@irranat:~/MOTUing/k3d-0.5.12.0$ ls debian/
[12:05] <Fujitsu> changelog  compat  control  copyright  docs  k3d-dev.dirs  k3d-dev.install  k3d.dirs  k3d.install  k3d.menu  pycompat  rules
[12:05] <Fujitsu> It's autogenerated, damn damn damn damn damn.
[12:05] <StevenK> We, and by we I mean you, lose.
[12:05] <imbrandon> dqdev, umm thats the point of the room here, and why i asked you to use pastbin , please dont paste/query me about things that you start in here ( unless it becomes unreleated to in here )
[12:06] <StevenK> Hrm. python-central is maintained by doko...
[12:06] <imbrandon> besides, more can help you that way other than just me dqdev 
[12:06] <imbrandon> brb dinner is done
[12:06] <Fujitsu> I suppose there must be something I can put in a postinst that is replaced with the autogenerated stuff, like is done with debhelper.
[12:06] <StevenK> A postrm, even?
[12:07] <slomo> siretart: ping?
[12:08] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Shh, I'm too annoyed with whoever misspelt it in the first place to type properly :P
[12:10] <StevenK> doko
[12:10] <StevenK> Which is the Maintainer of python-central, in a case of irony.
[12:10] <doko> ?
[12:11] <Fujitsu> doko: Hi. k3d in Edgy is stuffed... Is there a token that I can put in postrm that pycentral will replace with its... magic?
[12:13] <Fujitsu> Um, prerm, sorry.
[12:13] <StevenK> doko: bug 109037
[12:13] <ubotu> Malone bug 109037 in k3d "Edgy's k3d fails to be removed in Feisty (dup-of: 64848)" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/109037
[12:13] <ubotu> Malone bug 64848 in k3d "[SRU: EDGY]   packaging typo - k3d does not install" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/64848
[12:18] <Fujitsu> OK, it seems to actually work now, though I've just pasted the pycentral stuff in.
[12:19] <StevenK> The same thing that is autogenerated?
[12:21] <Fujitsu> Yes, but with a check for the dodgy version up the top.
[12:21] <StevenK> Can you pastebin it?
[12:22] <Fujitsu> Baaah, stupid packages that have to configure themselves to build the source package.
[12:22] <doko> Fujitsu, StevenK: so the problem is that k3d uses pycentral, but doesn't have a Python-Version attribute? strange, because k3d uses python-support ...
[12:22] <StevenK> Bwahaha
[12:22] <Fujitsu> doko: Does it?
[12:22] <Fujitsu> How strange.
[12:23] <StevenK> What does it Build-Depend on?
[12:23] <Fujitsu> bddebian made it use pycentral during Edgy or so...
[12:23] <StevenK> Oh, so bddebian is to blame?
[12:23] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Indeedily.
[12:23] <StevenK> Okay, let's kill him and not Hobbsee
[12:24] <Fujitsu> No, let's kill Hobbsee 'cause she didn't test her fix. That could never have worked.
[12:25] <StevenK> Hrm. How about both?
[12:25] <Fujitsu> Probably.
[12:25] <Fujitsu> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/17194/
[12:26] <StevenK> Fujitsu: Don't do "$2" = ""0.5.12.0-1ubuntu2"
[12:27] <Fujitsu> Why not?
[12:28] <Fujitsu> This is the first time I've worked with maintainer scripts, as far as I can recall :S
[12:32] <dqdev> hello all
[12:32] <Fujitsu> Hi dqdev.
[12:32] <jussi01> hi dqdev
[12:32] <dqdev> could you tell me, how can I check if the command 'cp ketm.desktop /home/dqdev/UBUNTU/ketm-0.0.6/debian/ketm/usr/share/applications' worked, after building my package?
[12:33] <StevenK> Fujitsu: dpkg --compare-versions "$2" eq "0.5.12.0-1ubuntu2"
[12:35] <Fujitsu> StevenK: Thanks, that's probably a better idea.
[12:35] <dqdev> when I try to install the built package 
[12:35] <dqdev> i get the error
[12:35] <dqdev>  trying to overwrite directory `/usr/share/applications' in package hal-device-manager with nondirectory
[12:36] <lifeless> you should use 'install' not cp
[12:36] <dqdev> the "cp" is under the install field of the RULES file
[12:38] <dqdev> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/17196/
[12:38] <dqdev> here is a pastebin
[12:39] <StevenK> dqdev: You aren't create the /home/dqdev/UBUNTU/ketm-0.0.6/debian/ketm/usr/share/applications directory.
[12:39] <jussi01> dqdev:  create debian/install and uncomment dh_install in the rules file. in debian/install put: filename.desktop /path/to/here ..... i think...
[12:40] <StevenK> No, that isn't it.
[12:40] <jussi01> ok...
[12:40] <jussi01> sorry
[12:40] <StevenK> Add usr/share/applications to debian/dirs or debian/<package>.dirs
[12:40] <jussi01> dqdev: ^^ listen to him
[12:41] <dqdev> ok, i found the <package>.dirs
[12:41] <dqdev> and added the directory
[12:41] <dqdev> is that all?
[12:42] <dqdev> is line 10 of my RULES file correct or wrong?
[12:42] <Fujitsu> dqdev: That should work, as long as you don't actually have the /home/dqdev/UBUNTU bit in there.
[12:42] <Fujitsu> I see that you don't so that should be OK.
[12:42] <dqdev> let me try once more
[12:43] <Fujitsu> dqdev: Probably safer to stick a / on the end of line 10, to ensure the package building explodes if you miss something like that again.
[12:43] <dharrigan> Hi. I'm stuck. I'm trying to build a new deb from a set of files. These files are binaries, so no source and they come from a self-extracting bin file.
[12:44] <dharrigan> Do I have to first create a tarball of the files that I want to eventually belong to the deb, so that debhelper (dh-make) can do it's work?
[12:45] <dqdev> grrrr....
[12:45] <dqdev> installation succeded but I still dont get anything 
[12:45] <dqdev> in the menu bar!!!
[12:46] <imbrandon> and you did refresh / start the gnome-session ?
[12:46] <dqdev> hmmm... no :$
[12:46] <Fujitsu> imbrandon: gnome-panel, you mean?
[12:46] <imbrandon> err yea
[12:47] <Fujitsu> dqdev: Try running update-desktop-database in terminal, and see if it appears.
[12:47] <siretart> slomo: pong
[12:47] <Fujitsu> dqdev: If it does, ensure that dh_desktop is being run in debian/rules.
[12:47] <slomo> siretart: can you give me the exact error string of seahorse when running together with gpg-agent? i'm trying to fix it myself now ;)
[12:48] <siretart> slomo: puuh, I'm sorry. we workarounded the problem now by disabling the scripts in /etc/X11/xsession.d
[12:48] <siretart> slomo: now I start seahorse myself via gnome-session
[12:49] <dqdev> I got it!!!
[12:49] <dqdev> i have the image in the menu bar!!!
[12:49] <dqdev> my FIRST BUG FIX!!! (actually you did it guys!!!)
[12:50] <dqdev> but you have to train the young-ones
[12:50] <jussi01> nice work dqdev!!
[12:50] <dqdev> it's a time investment... hopefully it will pay off in the future
[12:50] <dqdev> there is only  one more thing missing
[12:51] <jussi01> dqdev: ?
[12:51] <dqdev> one min.
[12:52] <dqdev> ok... i have to figure out if the .xpm figure is there or not
[12:52] <dqdev>  jussi01: yes?
[12:52] <slomo> siretart: hm ok, i'll search myself then... but can you try any fixes when i found something?
[12:53] <jussi01> dqdev: i was wondering what was missing...
[12:53] <dqdev> i have to figure out if the image works as well
[12:54] <siretart> slomo: sure
[12:54] <slomo> siretart: thanks
[12:55] <slomo> siretart: "A non-supported PGP passphrase caching agent is running."
[12:55] <slomo> this one?
[12:56] <siretart> sounds familiar, but I'm not 100% sure
[12:57] <slomo> ok, well... i have to go shopping first and then really take a look at it :)
[01:03] <dharrigan> Anyone perhaps can help?
[01:07] <Lutin> dharrigan: help to do what ?
[01:08] <dharrigan> I'm trying to build a dep from a sent of files that don't come as a tarball, but are extracted out from a bin file. Do I have to then, after extracting them, repackage as a tarball so that dh-make and do it's work?
[01:08] <dharrigan> I've never built a deb before.
[01:08] <dharrigan> .
[01:11] <Lutin> dharrigan: yes, you need to create an orig tarball so dh_make can work, or use it with the --createorig option
[01:12] <dharrigan> does the orig tarball contain the debiab directories etc? I'm just confused. If I have a set of files, can I use something to just say "here are a set of files (in a directory) please create a deb for me. " with template rules etc..
[01:22] <Adri2000> dharrigan: the orig tarball shouldn't contain the debian/ directory, but sometimes it does... dh_make will create for you all the files of the debian/ directory, some are not needed for your package (you can remove them) and the others need to be modified
[01:23] <dharrigan> ah okay, so, if I supply an original tarball (I make, from the files extracted from the bin file) then running dh-make will create a directory all setup for me with defaults etc.. that I can then customise?
[01:23] <dharrigan> .
[01:36] <gpocentek> hello
[01:36] <harrisony> g'day mate
[01:38] <imbrandon> ello gpocentek 
[01:47] <Fujitsu> k3d does take a little while to build.
[01:47] <harrisony> Fujitsu: im with you, im off to bed to wake up at 1am :D
[01:47] <jsgotangco> hehe
[01:47] <harrisony> and then go to school at 7am
[01:48] <Fujitsu> Why would you awaken at 1am?
[01:49] <harrisony> Fujitsu: Ubuntu open week
[01:49] <Fujitsu> Ah, which session?
[01:49] <harrisony> errr joining the community
[01:49] <harrisony> and then there are a few after
[01:50] <harrisony> packaging and then 2 launchpad ones then im off to school 
[01:53] <Demon012> anyone know the command that can tell me what package pygtk-codegen-2.0 is in?
[01:53] <Fujitsu> !find pygtk-codegen-2.0
[01:53] <Demon012> (forgotten how you do that with apt)
[01:53] <ubotu> File pygtk-codegen-2.0 found in python-gtk2-dev
[01:53] <Fujitsu> Demon012: dpkg -S blah, for installed packages.
[01:54] <Demon012> nice 
[01:54] <Demon012> what about packages not yet installed?
[01:54] <Demon012> and ty mr bot =)
[01:54] <Fujitsu> That's what ubotu is for... otherwise you can use apt-file.
[01:54] <siretart> Demon012: have a look at the package 'apt-file', or use http://packages.ubuntu.com
[01:55] <Demon012> perfect ty guys
[01:58] <\sh> uploads to gutsy are working? ,-)
[02:00] <shawarma> \sh: I wouldn't bet on it. They're still sorting out the toolchain.
[02:01] <jsgotangco> hmm
[02:05] <\sh> sharms, ah....I just wanted to upload wine ;)
[02:22] <Demon012> does anyone know which file in a source directory holds the maintainers name, license etc (I am following this guide: http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/ch-first.en.html) to make a package for exaile to replace the python2.4 dependency with python2.5
[02:22] <imbrandon> debian/*
[02:23] <imbrandon> debian/copyright , debian/control
[02:23] <imbrandon> etc
[02:23] <Demon012> aha ok so you edit that after you run dh_make?
[02:23] <imbrandon> yes
[02:23] <Demon012> ok that's good ty m8
[02:24] <pochu> Demon012: but you don't need to make a new package, just modify the one in the repos: "apt-get source exaile"
[02:26] <TheMuso> Hey pochu.
[02:27] <Demon012> oh cool didn't know you could edit them
[02:27] <Demon012> will look into that now ty
[02:27] <pochu> heya TheMuso :)
[02:27] <pochu> Demon012: welcome!
[02:28] <Demon012> ty pochu
[02:28] <Demon012> pochu: how do you edit a .deb file I have that isn't in a repository?
[02:28] <Demon012> how do I*
[02:29] <Fujitsu> Demon012: You can't really edit .debs directly. You need the source package (.dsc, .orig.tar.gz, .diff.gz)
[02:30] <Demon012> ok will go the apt-get source route then
[02:30] <StevenK> TheMuso: How did the move go?
[02:31] <TheMuso> StevenK: Overall very well thanks. Wasn't stressful at all. Telstra naturally screwed up the line, but that was to be expected.
[02:32] <StevenK> Heh
[02:33] <StevenK> TheMuso: And we released while you didn't see.
[02:34] <TheMuso> StevenK: har har har
[02:34] <StevenK> TheMuso: :-P
[02:34] <TheMuso> Anyways, going off again for a bit. Still finalizing my setup here.
[02:35] <Demon012> ah pochu I think I do need to make a package from scratch (the exaile in the repos's is only version 0.2.8 rather than 0.2.9)
[02:35] <Hobbsee> hm?
[02:36] <Demon012> however I do have a .deb (no .desc or anything though which works however it has python2.4 instead of python 2.5 as the dependency)
[02:36] <ubotu> Malone bug 106301 in exaile "[need-packaging]  Exaile 0.2.9" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  
[02:36] <StevenK> Demon012: Debian has 0.2.9
[02:37] <StevenK> When gutsy opens, you or someone else can do a merge
[02:37] <Demon012> StevenK: trying to do this for Fiesty for now
[02:37] <StevenK> Demon012: Why? It's released.
[02:38] <Demon012> bug reports states wrong dependency for the released package and repos' only have 0.2.8
[02:39] <StevenK> Which means you can't update it to 0.2.9, but you can fix the incorrect dependancy.
[02:39] <Hobbsee> and do a stable release update for it
[02:40] <Demon012> I am doing a release based on the current stable release from the exaile site
[02:41] <Hobbsee> Demon012: but do you plan to get it into ubuntu feisty?
[02:41] <Hobbsee> or only have ti locally?
[02:42] <Demon012> submit it to one of you guys for checking 
[02:42] <Demon012> and then upload
[02:42] <Hobbsee> but 0.2.9 wont be accepted into feisty...the archive admins will say no...
[02:42] <Demon012> or at least that is the impression I get from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers
[02:42] <Hobbsee> !sru
[02:42] <ubotu> Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates for main and restricted, while https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/SRU is for universe and multiverse.
[02:43] <Hobbsee> that's true, but that refers to getting things into the DEVELOPMENT release - not the stable one(s)
[02:43] <Demon012> oh right ok
[02:43] <Hobbsee> since feisty is released now, no new packages, or version updates go into it
[02:43] <Hobbsee> only bugfixes, which follow the above sru process
[02:43] <Demon012> so should I just ignore https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/exaile/+bug/106301
[02:43] <Hobbsee> (which are small)
[02:43] <ubotu> Malone bug 106301 in exaile "[need-packaging]  Exaile 0.2.9" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  
[02:43] <Demon012> or can we put it in universe?
[02:44] <StevenK> We can't put it anywhere in Feisty.
[02:44] <StevenK> At all.
[02:44] <Demon012> right ok
[02:44] <Hobbsee> it'll go into gutsy, assuming someone does that merge
[02:44] <Demon012> so what should I do? create it and we can put it in gutsy?
[02:44] <Demon012> or should I just stop and look for something else to do?
[02:44] <man-di> Demon012: its in debian already, just request a merge
[02:45] <Demon012> man-di: how do I go about doing that?
[02:45] <Hobbsee> man-di: you mean do the merge.  you request a sync.
[02:46] <dqdev> hello all (again)
[02:46] <Hobbsee> and i think he wants it in feisty, not caring about gutsy at this point in time :)
[02:46] <dqdev> i managed to fix a bug 
[02:46] <Hobbsee> Demon012: no problme
[02:46] <Hobbsee> dqdev: heya!
[02:46] <Hobbsee> dqdev: woo!
[02:46] <dqdev> but the fix
[02:46] <dqdev> needs 2 new files to be added
[02:46] <dqdev> in the <package>/
[02:46] <dqdev> so since this is my 1st bug
[02:46] <man-di> Hobbsee: I always mix up these two
[02:46] <dqdev> to fix EVER
[02:46] <dqdev> i want some directinos
[02:47] <Hobbsee> dqdev: which bug, and which two files?
[02:47] <dqdev> on what to do really
[02:47] <Demon012> welcome to the club dqdev I am trying to sort my first thing ever too =)
[02:47] <dqdev> the bug is #80474
[02:47] <Hobbsee> bug 80474
[02:47] <ubotu> Malone bug 80474 in ketm "ketm doesn't have a desktop-file" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/80474
[02:47] <dqdev> and i have a .desktop gil and a .xpm file
[02:48] <dqdev> so... how to report the fix
[02:48] <Hobbsee> so you put them into the debian/ dir of the source, and make sure they get installed?
[02:48] <dqdev> exactly
[02:48] <dqdev> not in the debian
[02:48] <siretart> man-di: we have been promised that at some point launchpad will offer some way to directly request syncs. until now this requires using some special shell commands on restricted hosts, so we proxy those requests via malone bugreports
[02:48] <dqdev> in the <package>/
[02:48] <dqdev> so 1 dir up from debian
[02:48] <Hobbsee> siretart: its' not a sync anyway.  debian changes
[02:48] <Hobbsee> yuo need to put it in debian/ as that's the only thing that we change
[02:48] <siretart> Hobbsee: right. 
[02:49] <dqdev> hmmm 
[02:49] <Hobbsee> !packagingguide
[02:49] <ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
[02:49] <dqdev> i see
[02:49] <man-di> siretart: yes, I read about that now
[02:49] <dqdev> and then? what steps do I have to follow?
[02:49] <man-di> Demon012: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/SyncRequestProcess hast instructions
[02:49] <Demon012> ty man-di
[02:49] <dqdev> what exactly do i give in llaunchpad?
[02:51] <Hobbsee> Demon012: dont worry about gutsy yet - the toolchain isnt built, most things wont build.  for feisty, follow the !sru about getting that bug fixed (the python2.4 to 2.5 change, or whatever it is)
[02:51] <siretart> Demon012: we have been doing such 'classrooms' lessons in #ubuntu-classroom in the past
[02:51] <dqdev> any help?
[02:52] <Demon012> siretart: any idea when the next class will be held?
[02:52] <Demon012> actually forget that just found out
[02:52] <Demon012>   Packaging 101 - Jordan Mantha   << 16:00 UTC today
[02:53] <Demon012> damn I am gonna be at college then
[02:53] <Hobbsee> Laser_away: going to cover .desktop files in your packaging 101, by any chance?
[02:53] <Hobbsee> Demon012: there will be logs
[02:53] <Demon012> any idea where they will be posted?
[02:53] <siretart> Demon012: sorry, no idea. I guess it will be announced on ubuntu-motu@ mailing list
[02:53] <siretart> Demon012: the problem is rather finding some teacher. asking for one on the mailing list might help
[02:55] <Hobbsee> all ubuntu members:  time to vote.  https://launchpad.net/~ubuntumembers/
[02:56] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: I did that many hours ago.
[02:56] <damko> hi all
[02:56] <Demon012> guys don't suppose there is an a centralised page I can go to that lists a series of how to's for for example: if there is no existing package go here: www.packaging.com, If there is already an existing package but it needs to be changed go here: www.repackage.com, if you have a package that needs to be sync'd go here: www.requestsync.com 
[02:56] <dqdev> ok... I moved all the non-existing files under debian and the files that i edited where anyway under debian/
[02:57] <dqdev> can you tell me, how to report the fix into launchpad?
[02:57] <Demon012> am feeling guilty for asking so many questions
[02:57] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: how many people will be on the CC?
[02:57] <Demon012> like to be able to go read and then ask questions after 
[02:57] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: I think it will be everyone, if they all get a majority.
[02:57] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: In this SRU, you wrote the patch.
[02:57] <Hobbsee> bug #?
[02:58] <dqdev> bug #80474
[02:58] <ubotu> Malone bug 80474 in ketm "ketm doesn't have a desktop-file" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/80474
[02:58] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: bug #64848
[02:58] <ubotu> Malone bug 64848 in k3d "[SRU: EDGY]   packaging typo - k3d does not install" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/64848
[02:58] <Hobbsee> no, for Fujitsu 
[02:58] <dqdev> oh...
[02:58] <Fujitsu> It did sort of fix it, but not usefully.
[03:02] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: i see.
[03:02] <dqdev> do I have to use REVU to upload the fix?
[03:02] <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Basically, if the old one was installed, it would still be broken. Thus, upgrades explode and the world ends.
[03:02] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: ahh.  fun
[03:07] <StevenK> Hrm. I think my amd64 has the sata HPA bug/problem.
[03:09] <Fujitsu> Goodnight all.
[03:10] <Demon012> nn Fujitsu
[03:10] <StevenK> Excellent. 2.6.17 still boots.
[03:15] <dqdev> sorry all... I need some directions here. I have the fix of bug #80474 but I don't know how to upload it. Is there some manual on how to do that?
[03:15] <ubotu> Malone bug 80474 in ketm "ketm doesn't have a desktop-file" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/80474
[03:18] <dqdev> should i use debdiff?
[03:18] <Hobbsee> dqdev: sorry, yes
[03:19] <dqdev> can you help me a liitle bit
[03:20] <dqdev> i have the newly created .deb file
[03:20] <dqdev> and then the original one
[03:21] <dqdev> but I dont have the original deb
[03:21] <StevenK> dqdev: debdiff is usually ran between two source packages.
[03:21] <dqdev> file
[03:21] <StevenK> dqdev: A debdiff between .debs for uploading a file is not helpful.
[03:21] <dqdev> I didnt make any changes in source
[03:22] <dqdev> everythig I did was to change some files under debian/
[03:22] <StevenK> Which is a change to the source package.
[03:22] <dqdev> and to add 2 files (also under /debian)
[03:23] <dqdev> so, I should do: debdiff <old_debian> <new_debian> ??
[03:23] <StevenK> dqdev: Yes, files under the debian directory get pulled into the .diff.gz, which is part of the source package.
[03:23] <StevenK> dqdev: You should do debdiff <old.dsc> <new.dsc>
[03:24] <dqdev> i only know how to create the new .deb file
[03:24] <dqdev> according to the manual https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToFix
[03:24] <StevenK> dqdev: You downloaded the source package already, right?
[03:24] <dqdev> yes
[03:25] <StevenK> dqdev: Did you also add a new version to the debian/changelog?
[03:25] <dqdev> no
[03:25] <StevenK> Okay, you should do that.
[03:26] <dqdev> just add my comments at the end of the file?
[03:26] <dqdev> okay, I will. And after that?
[03:26] <StevenK> Not the end.
[03:26] <StevenK> I'd suggest you use dch, actually.
[03:26] <dqdev> is the change log automatically generated?
[03:27] <StevenK> No, it isn't, and it follows a somewhat strict format.
[03:27] <dqdev> ok
[03:27] <dqdev> i ll check the dch command
[03:27] <dqdev> after that?
[03:28] <StevenK> After that, you need to build a source package.
[03:29] <StevenK> One directory up, dpkg-source -b <directory>
[03:29] <dqdev> cd <package> 
[03:29] <dqdev> sudo apt-get build-dep <package> 
[03:29] <dqdev> debuild -us -uc
[03:29] <StevenK> Then you will have two .dsc's to run debdiff over.
[03:29] <StevenK> Clear as mud?
[03:29] <dqdev> ok ok
[03:30] <dqdev> and the 2 new files (didnt exist before)? DO I simply upload them? 
[03:31] <StevenK> No, they should appear in the debdiff.
[03:32] <dqdev> ok... let me give it a try
[03:34] <Hobbsee> the debdiff will use the newly generated files, and the old ones, to create the debdiff
[03:34] <StevenK> And create a difference between the two source packages.
[03:39] <crimsun> I love how topics in -devel move so quickly ;)
[03:39] <Hobbsee> haha, yes
[03:39] <Hobbsee> it's taking after #ubuntu
[03:39] <StevenK> Heh
[03:41] <StevenK> It's only because the toolchain isn't up yet. :-P
[03:41] <Hobbsee> hehe
[03:52] <pochu> TheMuso: are you back from the move? ready to sponsor me again? :)
[03:53] <Hobbsee> pochu: he was here earlier, think he went to bed
[03:54] <TheMuso> pochu: Not quite. I need to get fresh chroots created. I still have my others, but I think now is as good a time as any to make a fresh start, and get a chroot snapshot system of sorts going.
[03:54] <jussi01> lol
[03:54] <Hobbsee> or not
[03:54] <pochu> TheMuso: yeah, I'm waiting for the debootstramp merge to create a gutsy chroot :)
[03:55] <crimsun> (you can dist-upgrade a feisty chroot.)
[03:55] <TheMuso> Same. I also need to create fresh sid/feisty chroots for i386 and powerpc.
[03:56] <pochu> :)
[03:56] <crimsun> ionte: that's because autosync stopped, and no one asked for a sync. 0.9-2 will automatically be synced once gutsy opens.
[03:56] <TheMuso> Anyway, I think I will really be off to bed now. Its been a busy day.
[03:56] <crimsun> bye luke
[03:57] <dqdev> do i have to change the changelog no matter what?
[03:57] <pochu> the repo is already open for upload, right? though the packages won't be built till the chaintools are finalized
[03:58] <pochu> TheMuso: good night!
[03:58] <StevenK> dqdev: You really ought to.
[03:58] <pochu> is that right? ^
[03:58] <crimsun> pochu: I'm using "opens" rather loosely (and vaguely), sorry
[03:58] <ionte> crimsun: ok! thanks!
[03:59] <dqdev> the debchange is damn complicated
[04:00] <TheMuso> What package do we use for inetd like functionality, i.e tcpd etc?
[04:01] <StevenK> rlinetd?
[04:01] <crimsun> xinetd is in main, but it's not installed by default AFAICS
[04:02] <TheMuso> ah ok
[04:04] <kkubasik> hey, does an MOTU have a sec to look over 2 new packages in revu?
[04:04] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4880
[04:04] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4879
[04:05] <dqdev> StevenK: Ok... changelog edited. Then you said that I have to build the source, by going one directory up from debian 
[04:06] <dqdev> StevenK: and use the command dpkg-source -b
[04:06] <dqdev> ?
[04:06] <pochu> TheMuso: go to sleep!! :)
[04:06] <StevenK> dqdev: Not one directory from debian, but the unpacked source.
[04:06] <Hobbsee> dqdev: yep
[04:06] <StevenK> dqdev: Sorry I wasn't clear.
[04:06] <dqdev> cd ..
[04:06] <dqdev> sorry
[04:07] <dqdev> so: dpkg-source -b ketm-0.0.6 ???
[04:07] <StevenK> Yup, exactly
[04:07] <ScottK> kkubasik: Who is doing tangerine, you or RAOF?
[04:08] <kkubasik> I uploaded one a while ago
[04:08] <dqdev> i got the warning: executable mode 0755 of `debian/ketm.desktop' will not be represented in diff
[04:08] <kkubasik> and didn't have the time to deal with it for a while, and it looks like he did some work on it
[04:08] <kkubasik> but was having a hard time
[04:08] <ScottK> OK.
[04:09] <Hobbsee> dqdev: that's fine, you dont need it to be executable - ie, you're not going to run the desktop file like a script
[04:09] <StevenK> dqdev: Yes. debian/ketm.desktop probably shouldn't be executable anyway.
[04:09] <dqdev> ok ok
[04:09] <Hobbsee> [00:08]  <Belutz> is Hobbsee is the famous "sexy lady" from australia?
[04:09] <Hobbsee> ooh scary...
[04:09] <ScottK> kkubasik: ^^
[04:09] <kkubasik> ScottK: most definatly
[04:09] <ScottK> OK
[04:09] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Oh geez
[04:09] <jussi01> lol
[04:09] <ScottK> kkubasik: Look in debian/copyright.  You'll see there is still boilerplate not filled in.
[04:09] <Hobbsee> StevenK: from -classroom :P
[04:10] <Hobbsee> ogra: who knows
[04:10] <jussi01> I wonder is hobbses picture anywhere?
[04:10] <dqdev> StevenK: asd then what exacttly do i do to create the debdiff file (sorry for such amateur q's but it's the 1st time)
[04:10] <jussi01> Hobbsee's*
[04:10] <Hobbsee> jussi01: various places.
[04:10] <Hobbsee> planet, the messed up one on LP
[04:10] <jussi01> where, may i ask??
[04:10] <ogra> Hobbsee, well, you said you'd bring it to sevilla :) we can check with and without ;)
[04:10] <Hobbsee> other places
[04:10] <Hobbsee> ogra: heh
[04:10] <Hobbsee> Sysinfo for 'LongPointyStick': Linux 2.6.20-15-generic running KDE 3.5.6, CPU: GenuineIntel(R)CPUT2250@1.73GHz at 800 MHz (3458 bogomips), HD: 27/71GB, RAM: 730/1510MB, 123 proc's, 1.42h up
[04:11] <ScottK> kkubasik: In debian/control Maintainer should be MOTU.  See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField for details.  Also package description should not have lines over 80 characters.
[04:12] <StevenK> dqdev: You should then have two distinct .dsc's in your cwd
[04:12] <ogra> Hobbsee, KDE ? the Kommon Doom Enhancement ? 
[04:12] <ScottK> kkubasik: Nevermind about the maintainer comment.  Read it wrong.
[04:12] <ScottK> Urgh.
[04:12] <Hobbsee> ogra: hah
[04:12] <kkubasik> okie, ;)
[04:13] <ogra> heh
[04:13] <dqdev> StevenK: the .deb just created and the one from the downloaded version?
[04:13] <kkubasik> ok, fixed the copyright, and the line in the description
[04:13] <StevenK> dqdev: Not the .deb, we're talking about source packages, not binary packages.
[04:13] <ScottK> kkubasik: I don't know anything about mono, so the technical specifics of the dependencies I have no idea on.
[04:13] <kkubasik> that's all been through the wringer
[04:14] <ScottK> kkubasik: Don't consider fixing my comments as "Your package is good", just that's stuff I could tell needed to be fixed.
[04:14] <kkubasik> oh, definatly, I know I still need man pages for the tangerine one
[04:14] <dqdev> StevenK: yes. i have a newly created .dsc
[04:15] <StevenK> dqdev: So now you can run debdiff <old.dsc> <new.dsc>
[04:15] <dqdev> ok
[04:15] <StevenK> That will spit out the debdiff to stdout
[04:15] <StevenK> So you probably want to redirect it.
[04:15] <ScottK> kkubasik: OK, I was gonna suggest a man page...
[04:16] <ScottK> kkubasik: I took a quick look at the moodbar package.  The diff seems pretty huge at a glance.
[04:16] <StevenK> Ah hah!
[04:16] <StevenK> I have found Hobbsee's story on the Internet
[04:16] <StevenK> http://www.ridiculopathy.com/projects/flash/stick2.jpg
[04:16] <jussi01> lo
[04:16] <jussi01> l
[04:18] <Hobbsee> lol
[04:18] <jsgotangco> haha
[04:19] <Hobbsee> hi spam
[04:19] <jsgotangco> lol
[04:19] <jussi01> you know its kind of funny to see in launchpad: "bugs related to Sarah Hobbs"
[04:19] <Hobbsee> jussi01: heh
[04:19] <StevenK> Heh
[04:24] <dqdev> StevenK: is there a way to write the results of the debdiff command to a file? cause the pic results to a pretty big message
[04:25] <Demon012> dqdev: just a guess but you could do > diff.txt (diff.txt is a file where you want the text to be stored)
[04:25] <Demon012> not used it before so it may or may not work
[04:26] <ScottK> dqdev: debdiff package.v1.dsc package.v2.dsc > pick-a-name.debiff (as Demon012 says).
[04:28] <dqdev> and that\s the file I am uploading in the launchpad???
[04:28] <ScottK> Yes, but look at it first to make sure it's sane.
[04:29] <ScottK> If you want someone else to check it, you can post it at pastebin.
[04:29] <dqdev> well it looks ok except 2 things
[04:29] <dqdev> yes... I ll do that
[04:29] <dqdev> so that you can take a look
[04:29] <dqdev> the 2 things are
[04:30] <dqdev> the picture which looks of course strange
[04:30] <dqdev> 2 lines at the end, that I never touched
[04:30] <dqdev> let me pastebin it
[04:31] <jekil> hello
[04:31] <dqdev> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/17218/
[04:31] <ScottK> hello jekil.
[04:32] <dqdev> ScottK: what do you think?
[04:33] <ScottK> By the last two lines, do you mean 525 & 526?
[04:33] <dqdev> yes
[04:33] <dqdev> i dont know what they really are
[04:33] <dqdev> but anyway... otherwise?
[04:34] <dqdev> do pics look like that?
[04:34] <ScottK> Those don't worry about.  It's normal for the diff to have a few lines of unmodified text on the end.
[04:35] <ScottK> Your updated package needs to have an Ubuntu version number.
[04:35] <dqdev> in the changelof
[04:35] <ScottK> When you went to modify debian/changelog, how did you do it.
[04:35] <dqdev> dch [no arguments] 
[04:35] <ScottK> dqdev: Yes.  Line 5 of your debdiff.
[04:35] <ScottK> Ah.
[04:36] <ScottK> If you do it dch -i it should set all that up for you.
[04:36] <dqdev> dch -i and that\s all?
[04:37] <ScottK> Yes.  Revert to the original debian/changelog (just copy it over from the original source package) and then to dch -i and add your entries.  Check to make sure your e-mail address is the one you want.
[04:38] <ScottK> Good morning bddebian.  Good to see the old man is still with us.
[04:38] <bddebian> heh
[04:38] <crimsun> you two fogeys ;p
[04:38] <bddebian> Hi ScottK, folk
[04:38] <bddebian> crimsun: Thx buddy
[04:38] <dqdev> ScottK: ok... I ll do that. Do i need to upload anything else in the launchpad, or that's just it?
[04:38] <ScottK> All you upload it the corrected debdiff.
[04:39] <dqdev> ok! THanks ScottK
[04:39] <ScottK> You might want to come back here and have someone look at it again once you've fixed it up.
[04:40] <dqdev> ScottK: come back "here". Here?
[04:40] <ScottK> Yes
[04:40] <ScottK> Pastebin it again and let someone look it over.
[04:41] <dqdev> ScottK: Ok... let me work it over a little bit, and I ll be right back
[04:56] <dqdev> ScottK: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/17221/ Can you take a look?
[04:58] <ScottK> dqdev: Please pastebin the entire debian/changes file for your update.
[04:58] <dqdev> ScottK: that's all the changelog
[04:59] <dqdev> doesnt containt anything else :$
[04:59] <geser> dqdev: first you debdiff'ed in the wrong order: debdiff old.dsc new.dsc
[04:59] <dqdev> you re right! 
[04:59] <dqdev> stupid of me! 
[05:00] <ScottK> dqdev: I don't want to see just your changelog changes, but the entire changelog.
[05:00] <ScottK> As you have it now.
[05:01] <dqdev> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/17226/
[05:01] <geser> and the debian changelog should have a summeray of your changes. Something like "Added .desktop file (LP: #80474)"
[05:02] <geser> and don't forget to set the distribution to gutsy (replace feisty with gutsy)
[05:02] <dqdev> geser: the last 2 that you wrote, do I do them manuyally>?
[05:03] <ScottK> dqdev: Yes.
[05:03] <ScottK> Manually.
[05:03] <geser> when you do dch -i you end in an editor where you can edit the changelog and add entries
[05:04] <geser> and the second is also manually (first line of your changelog)
[05:04] <ScottK> dqdev: Sorry if I confused you earlier.
[05:05] <ScottK> dch -i gets the formatting/versioning correct.  You stil have to manually indicate what you did and (for now) the target distro.
[05:06] <sharms> Laser_away: getting your presentation ready?
[05:09] <dqdev> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/17228/
[05:09] <dqdev> how doe this look like now?
[05:10] <ScottK> Don't change urgency.  Ubuntu doesn't use it.
[05:10] <dqdev> ok
[05:11] <ScottK> Closing the bug should be (LP: #80474) vice (bug: #80474) - IIRC.  
[05:12] <dqdev> (LP: #80474) vice (bug: #80474) - IIRC just like that?
[05:13] <ScottK>  (LP: #80474)
[05:13] <ScottK> The IIRC is If I Remember Correctly - I've gotten that wrong before.
[05:13] <ScottK> Also, you lines 5 and 6 need to be one line.
[05:13] <dqdev> hehehehe
[05:13] <dqdev> yes. I saw that
 everyone of those people needs to bought a beer for their incredible work
[05:14] <harrisony> RE: the MOTU crew
[05:14] <harrisony> :D good work people
[05:15] <geser> dqdev: urgency=low is already the lowest urgency and Ubuntu doesn't use it
[05:16] <geser> dqdev: "(LP: #<bugnumber>)" is the correct syntax for closing bugs through the changelog (though LP doesn't support it yet)
[05:17] <dqdev> ok I think I m done
[05:17] <dqdev> i ll paste bin the changelog
[05:18] <dqdev> and the diff so you can take a look guys
[05:18] <dqdev> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/17235/
[05:19] <dqdev> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/17236/
[05:20] <dqdev> and?
[05:20] <ScottK> dqdev: Your previous changelog description was better.  Why did you shorten it?
[05:22] <LaserJock> ok
[05:22] <LaserJock> I guess I should throw something together
[05:23] <sharms> LaserJock: I hear people are demanding talks on EnhancedBash
[05:23] <dqdev> cause it resulted in 2 lines
[05:23] <LaserJock> sharms: well, the might have to keep waiting
[05:23] <sharms> :)
[05:23] <geser> dqdev: it's ok to have entries split over serveral lines
[05:23] <LaserJock> sharms: what'll you give me if I slip a URL or it in my talk accidently?
[05:23] <dqdev> geser: it complained
[05:23] <geser> dqdev: you might want to validate the desktop file: $ desktop-file-validate ketm.desktop 
[05:23] <LaserJock> s/or/for/
[05:23] <geser> ketm.desktop: error: key "GenericName" is translated, but no untranslated version exists
[05:23] <geser> ketm.desktop: warning: the fields "Name" and "Comment" have the same value
[05:24] <sharms> oooooh, that would be slick (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Spec/EnhancedBash)
[05:24] <geser> dqdev: what complained?
[05:25] <dqdev> geser: the dch -i when my description went to 2 lines
[05:25] <geser> dqdev: didn't you forget to indent the second line?
[05:25] <dqdev> 'indent' means '\' ?
[05:25] <dqdev> or just enter
[05:25] <dqdev> ?
[05:26] <geser> the spaces in front of the line
[05:26] <geser> "  * first line"
[05:26] <sharms> LaserJock: hmmm I think I can give you nixternals car.  
[05:26] <geser> "   second line"
[05:26] <sharms> oh I already gave it away
[05:26] <nixternal> I have a truck, hillbilly like
[05:26] <LaserJock> I was going to say ...
[05:26] <dqdev> geser: ok.. now I get it! 
[05:26] <LaserJock> I don't know that I want anything of nixternal's
[05:26] <sharms> haha
[05:27] <nixternal> orly LaserJock, that's what you're on I see ;)
[05:27] <dqdev> geser: DO i really need the validation of the .desktop file? 
[05:27] <geser> it would be better if the file has no errors
[05:27] <dqdev> ok 
[05:27] <dqdev> i ll give it one more try
[05:28] <geser> but it should also work with the file as is
[05:28] <dqdev> it does!
[05:28] <dqdev> i installed it
[05:28] <dqdev> and it runs!
[05:28] <dqdev> but anyway, i ll try to create a clean .desktop file
[05:28] <nixternal> LaserJock: don't mess with me ;)
[05:28] <nixternal> muhehehe
[05:28] <dqdev> and add some more comments to the changelog
[05:29] <LaserJock> nixternal: oh yeah? you gonna ice me?
[05:29] <LaserJock> or have one of your goons do it?
[05:29] <nixternal> no, but you will see
[05:29] <nixternal> not goons, my gumbahs
[05:29] <LaserJock> oh yeah
[05:29] <nixternal> hehe
[05:30] <jsgotangco> wow you guys are alive
[05:33] <LaserJock> jsgotangco: alive? I just got up early cause I'm doing open week in ~ 30 mins and I should probably prepare something
[05:33] <jellyfish2002> hi everyone
[05:34] <jellyfish2002> sighz....
[05:34] <ScottK> Hi jellyfish2002
[05:35] <jellyfish2002> my wireless break after upgrading to feisty =(
[05:35] <zul> this isnt a support channel
[05:35] <ScottK> jellyfish2002: #ubuntu is for support.
[05:35] <jellyfish2002> i know...
[05:37] <dqdev> geser:  are you still herE?
[05:37] <geser> yes
[05:37] <dqdev> when i tried the dch -i , i get this ubuntu1 at the end
[05:37] <dqdev> 0.0.6-19ubuntu1 for example
[05:37] <geser> that's correct
[05:37] <kkubasik> if someone could take a look? 
[05:37] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4882
[05:38] <geser> it's the first ubuntu change to that debian package
[05:38] <dqdev> well... then, when i try to install the package
[05:38] <dqdev> ketm depends on ketm-data (= 0.0.6-19ubuntu1); however:
[05:38] <dqdev>   Version of ketm-data on system is 0.0.6-19.
[05:38] <dqdev> which I wasnt getting before
[05:38] <dqdev> !!!
[05:38] <dqdev> is it really necessary this -i argument?
[05:38] <kkubasik> and this id someone gets a chance
[05:38] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4881
[05:39] <dqdev> without it, things work
[05:40] <geser> yes, that -i (= increment version) is necessary
[05:40] <dqdev> and how do I treat the dependencies then?
[05:40] <geser> apt sees only a package as new if the version is greater as the installed one
[05:41] <geser> the package builds ketm and ketm-data
[05:41] <dqdev> just ketm
[05:42] <dqdev> ketm-data is another package
[05:42] <geser> build from the same source
[05:42] <geser> a source package can build multiple debs
[05:42] <dqdev> ok ok
[05:42] <dqdev> i also got ketm-data_0.0.6-19ubuntu1_all.deb
[05:43] <dqdev> i ll try to install that first
[05:44] <dqdev> ok
[05:44] <dqdev> it worked!
[05:45] <dqdev> geser: So, should I upload the debdiff?
[05:45] <sharms> LaserJock's presentation will be the only one with hecklers 
[05:45] <dqdev> is there something else missing? wanna see the debdiff or the changelog?
[05:46] <LaserJock> ah man
[05:46] <geser> dqdev: if you didn't change much to the last version, simply upload it to the bug
[05:48] <dqdev> ok... I just fixed the .desktop and added more comments to the changelog
[05:48] <geser> kkubasik: I gave a quick look at tangerine and there are some files with copyright from Novell
[05:48] <kkubasik> ooo, ok
[05:49] <dqdev> after I upload the bug-fix
[05:50] <dqdev> do I have to change the status to fix-commited
[05:50] <dqdev> and to Assigned to nobody???
[05:50] <geser> kkubasik: and deps/daap-sharp is LGPL licensed. you should mention it in copyright
[05:50] <kkubasik> ok
[05:50] <geser> dqdev: subscribe the ubuntu-universe-sponsors team to the bug
[05:51] <geser> dqdev: the sponsor will set it to "Fix committed" when he uploads it
[05:53] <LaserJock> hmm, do you think if I had the open week people create a feisty pbuilder they'd be able to get it done by the end?
[05:53] <LaserJock> has archive.u.c recovered?
[05:53] <sharms> my speeds have been fast
[05:54] <ScottK> LaserJock: Archive is normally responsive for me today.
[05:54] <LaserJock> ok
[05:54] <LaserJock> I think I'll give it a go
[05:54] <dqdev> and what about status
[05:54] <dqdev> ?
[05:54] <dqdev> do I leave it to In Progress?
[05:54] <dqdev> or do I swet it to fix commited
[05:54] <dqdev> ?
[05:54] <sharms> I pull about 450k/s 
[05:55] <ScottK> dqdev: The MOTU will set it to fix committed after they upload.
[05:55] <dqdev> ok
[05:55] <ScottK> Fix committed means in the archive, not to LP.
[05:55] <dqdev> Assigned to?
[05:55] <ScottK> Nobody.
[05:55] <sharms> I am hoping you get a good crowd laserjock, as in a skilled crowd that can jump into contributing
[05:56] <ScottK> subscribe UUS.
[05:56] <ScottK> Do NOT assign UUS.
[05:56] <dqdev> that's what I did
[05:56] <ScottK> Good.
[05:56] <dqdev> i subscribed to Ubuntu Sponsors for Uni
[05:56] <dqdev> and i left the label
[05:56] <dqdev> assigned to ME
[05:58] <geser> dqdev: the debdiff look good
[05:59] <geser> you can pick a new bug for fixing now :)
[05:59] <ScottK> Heh -  "Honest, Vistas not selling THAT badly" - http://www.realtechnews.com/posts/4336
[06:03] <dqdev> geser: he he! THanks! I will
[06:05] <dqdev> to everybody: I think a good idea is to document some of the bug-fixes since some of them appear often and there might be a pattern. I know it would be great help for newbies. I started documenting my first bug-fix. Here is a preview on the way:
[06:05] <dqdev> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Dqdev
[06:06] <ScottK> dqdev: This is a very good idea.  We need more documentation on how to get started.
[06:07] <dqdev> i know... and especially for the new guys like me it takes some time to figure out what;s going on
[06:07] <dqdev> I mean... this .desktop easy fix took me 2 days (ashamed)
[06:07] <dqdev> but beginnings are always slow
[06:08] <dqdev> i ll expand the tutorial and send a version in a while
[06:09] <ScottK> First one is always the hardest (by far).  Nothing to be ashamed about.
[06:09] <ScottK> You've now contributed more code than probably 95% of Ubuntu users.  Be proud of that.
[06:09] <ScottK> dqdev: ^^
[06:12] <dqdev> ou've now contributed more code than probably 95% of Ubuntu users > I liked this one!!!! THanks for the suuport!
[06:12] <danohuiginn> dqdev: thanks! This is something I wish I'd thought to do when I was first getting started, and being confused by everything
[06:12] <Lutin> hey Toma- ;)
[06:12] <Toma-> hiya
[06:12] <Toma-> youre an motu now?!
[06:13] <Lutin> indeed
[06:13] <Toma-> sweet!
[06:13] <xxxxx1> hi
[06:13] <Lutin> Toma-: hehe, yes :)
[06:13] <Toma-> Feel like maintaining librsvg2-2 ?
[06:13] <Toma-> :>
[06:14] <Lutin> hum...no :)
[06:14] <Toma-> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/librsvg/+bug/76435
[06:14] <ubotu> Malone bug 76435 in librsvg "Crashes e17, fixed with 2.16.1" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
[06:14] <Toma-> :P
[06:14] <xxxxx1> what are differences between dh_movefiles and dh_install?
[06:14] <Lutin> Toma-: hehe, I was sure this was e17-related
[06:14] <Toma-> huhu
[06:14] <Lutin> when one says librsvg is buggy ... can't be anything but E guys :] 
[06:15] <xxxxx1> can I use dh_install with the same parameters of dh_movefiles?
[06:15] <Toma-> haha. well, i read the fixes in the changelog on 2.16.1 and they fixed like 3 or 4 ubuntu+upstream bugs in it and even state "DONT USE 2.16.0" lol
[06:17] <Toma-> well its good to see you in motu Lutin. good luck and good work with it all :)
[06:17] <Lutin> Toma-: 2.16.1 is in debian unstable, it will be merged or synced in gutsy
[06:18] <Toma-> ahh good stuff
[06:18] <Lutin> Toma-: heh, thanks :)
[06:18] <kkubasik> anyone?
[06:18] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4883
[06:18] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4881
[06:18] <xxxxx1> what are differences between dh_movefiles and dh_install ?
[06:19] <Lutin> Toma-: you'll have to wait for gutsy though :)
[06:19] <Toma-> ill be running bleeding edge as soon as it comes out. ive got a lil 5gb partition waiting for gutsy :)
[06:20] <Lutin> xxxxx1: dh_movefiles moves fuiles in the right debian/ subdirectory so they can be installed by dh_install
[06:20] <kkubasik> or this one, I'm just starting to revive it
[06:20] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4884
[06:20] <Lutin> Toma-: :)
[06:31] <danohuiginn> dqdev: I just had a look at your patch. You might want to read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
[06:31] <danohuiginn> for an entirely non-obvious change you're supposed to make
[06:31] <dqdev> aha
[06:31] <ScottK> danohuiginn: Good point.  That is going to need to be changed...
[06:31] <ScottK> Sorry dqdev.  Should have mentioned that.
[06:31] <dqdev> and what is that?
[06:32] <dqdev> i hate entirely non-obvious'' things... heheehh
[06:32] <danohuiginn> if this is the first change you're
[06:32] <danohuiginn> making from debian, you need to update debian/control
[06:33] <danohuiginn> to say that the package is now being maintained in ubuntu
[06:33] <dqdev> ah...
[06:33] <dqdev> and how do i do that?
[06:33] <danohuiginn> you edit debian/control
[06:34] <dqdev> manually?
[06:34] <danohuiginn> change the existing maintainer field to XSBC-Original-Maintainer
[06:34] <danohuiginn> I believe so (there may be an easier way I'm not aware of)
[06:34] <danohuiginn> and set the maintainer field to UbuntuMOTUDevelopers<ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
[06:34] <danohuiginn> (assuming the package is in universe)
[06:34] <pochu> there's a tool in LP to change it, yeah
[06:35] <dqdev> and then? do i create a new debdiff and upload it again to the launch pad?
[06:36] <ScottK> Yes.
[06:36] <dqdev> is there a way to take down the old file
[06:36] <ScottK> You'll also need to update the changelog to mention you changed maintainer to MOTU.
[06:36] <dqdev> or I just upload the new one?
[06:36] <dqdev> ok
[06:36] <ScottK> Just upload the new one.  Mention in the comment why you put up the new one.
[06:37] <dqdev> the changelog and control were more frrustrating than fixing the real bug!
[06:38] <danohuiginn> dqdev: I feel your pain. It does get a bit easier once you're used to it, though
[06:38] <dqdev> i imagine
[06:38] <dqdev> ok... i ll fix this 2 things
[06:38] <dqdev> and upload the new debdiff
[06:39] <danohuiginn> dqdev: also, you might like to jump into #ubuntu-classroom. There's a tutorial on packaging going on right now in there
[06:39] <ScottK> dqdev: I had to upload my first patch 5 times before it was right.  Don't feel bad.
[06:42] <danohuiginn> pochu: what is that tool you mentioned for changing the maintainer?
[06:44] <pochu> I think it was written by Lutin
[06:44] <pochu> Lutin: you around?
[06:44] <Lutin> yep
[06:44] <pochu> :)
[06:46] <Lutin> any probleme with it ? (apart not being upstaded for gutsy ?)
[06:47] <danohuiginn> Lutin: where do I find it?
[06:48] <Lutin> danohuiginn: hum, I can't recall how to checkout the launchpad bzr :/
[06:50] <Lutin> danohuiginn: try bzr co sftp://user_name_in_launchpad@bazaar.launchpad.net/~motu/motutools/trunk
[06:51] <danohuiginn> thanks, Lutin
[06:53] <Demon012> anyone know what REVU stands for?
[06:54] <KalleDK> http://revu.tauware.de/
[06:55] <dqdev> OK... that concludes the fix-tutorial on my first bug
[06:55] <dqdev> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Dqdev
[06:56] <dqdev> it might be of some use for the newcomers
[06:56] <dqdev> if you find any mistakes, let me know
[07:00] <ScottK> dqdev: You also should install the build-essential package.  Things in build-essential aren't called out in build-dep because they are assumed ot be there.
[07:02] <dqdev> ScottK: I have it already
[07:02] <ScottK> OK.  Missed it.
[07:03] <ScottK> Good job LaserJock!!
[07:03] <LaserJock> blah
[07:03] <LaserJock> it was aweful :(
[07:03] <ScottK> You did fine.
[07:03] <bddebian> ??
[07:03] <ScottK> It's a tough situation to be in.
[07:03] <ScottK> openweek.
[07:04] <ScottK> bddebian: He just did a presentation/Q&A
[07:04] <bddebian> Ah nice
[07:06] <dqdev> in the debian/control
[07:06] <dqdev> do i HAVE to change that:
[07:06] <dqdev> Uploaders: Sam Hocevar (Debian packages) <sam+deb@zoy.org>
[07:06] <dqdev> as well?
[07:06] <ScottK> No.
[07:06] <dqdev> ok
[07:07] <nixternal> LaserJock: good job man on that presentation!
[07:07] <ScottK> Launchpad will credit you as uploader because it's your name in the changelog.
[07:07] <dqdev> ok
[07:07] <nixternal> LaserJock: it is kind of difficult to get everything MOTU in, in 1 hour
[07:08] <LaserJock> a bit
[07:10] <harrisony> LaserJock: it was brilliant!
[07:11] <LaserJock> harrisony: it was horrible, but thanks for the questions
[07:12] <harrisony> LaserJock: thank you for answering them, why was it so bad
[07:13] <bddebian> harrisony: Ignore LaserJock.  He's just modest, he's THE MAN! :)
[07:13] <harrisony> bddebian: he is
[07:13] <dqdev> dpkg-source: warning: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but there is no XSBC-Original-Maintainer field
[07:13] <dqdev> any ideas???
[07:14] <LaserJock> harrisony: because I didn't get to anything about packaging :-)
[07:14] <harrisony> LaserJock: haha
[07:14] <bddebian> dqdev: Move the existing maintainer field to XSBC-Original-Maintainer and add Ubuntu MOTU as Maintainer:
[07:15] <dqdev> is this correct:
[07:15] <dqdev> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
[07:17] <bddebian> For that part, yes
[07:17] <dqdev> what else do I have to change?
[07:17] <bddebian> XSBC-Original-Maintainer:  should be what was originally in the Maintainer: field
[07:18] <bddebian>  Maintainer: Joe Debian <joedeb@debian.org>  -->  XSBC-Original-Maintainer: Joe Debian <joedeb@debian.org>
[07:18] <dqdev> I get it
[07:22] <dqdev> dpkg-source: warning: missing information for output field Maintainer
[07:22] <dqdev> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/17257/
[07:23] <bddebian> Dude, you are killing me :-)
[07:23] <bddebian> What was in the Maintainer: field before?
[07:24] <dqdev> Maintainer: Debian Games Team <pkg-games-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org>
[07:24] <bddebian> Maintainer: Debian Games Team <pkg-games-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org>
[07:24] <bddebian> That should now be XSBC-Original-Maintainer: Debian Games Team <pkg-games-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org>
[07:25] <bddebian> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
[07:25] <dqdev> I understand it now
[07:25] <bddebian> :)
[07:25] <dqdev> thanks
[07:25] <bddebian> NP
[07:26] <sharms> dqdev: its good to see you getting involved, keep up the good work
[07:27] <dqdev> sharms: thanks sharms. You have to show patience though. I m not a linux expert and i shoot all the Qs that come in mind. SO...
[07:28] <sharms> I think that is a good thing, since asking questions shows what may be obvious to veterans and they might gloss over those topics on docs
[07:28] <sharms> but when those questions are asked, they might remember that, helping to further speed up the education process
[07:29] <Demon012> answering questions and teaching others also helps the person answering the questions to reinforce their knowledge
[07:29] <sharms> Demon012: incorrect, we already know everything
[07:29] <bddebian> dqdev: Hey, I don't know crap and I've been here a while now ;-)
[07:29] <Demon012> heh sharms
[07:31] <xxxxx1> lintian in REVU says gutsy distro is incorrect spec in changelog
[07:31] <xxxxx1> lintian in REVU said gutsy distro is incorrect spec in changelog
[07:32] <bddebian> Yeah
[07:32] <xxxxx1> some reviewers ask me to change to gutsy, but lintian...
[07:32] <xxxxx1> :)
[07:32] <ScottK> Lintian is not updated yet.
[07:33] <xxxxx1> ScottK: Hi Scott, so i can keep?
[07:33] <ScottK> Yes
[07:33] <xxxxx1> thx!
[07:36] <bddebian> No, it still needs to be changed in the ChangeLog
[07:36] <bddebian> Or did I mis-understand that statement?
[07:36] <Demon012> QUESTION: What should you do if there is a program in the repositories with a bug but the program is not listed on launchpad
[07:37] <harrisony> Demon012: lol
[07:37] <Q-FUNK> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/109329
[07:37] <ubotu> Malone bug 109329 in upgrade-system "nvidia upgrade failure" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[07:38] <Q-FUNK> lovely.  yet another use of "upgrade-system" as a virtual package name.  can someone please reassign?
[07:38] <bddebian> Demon012: What package?
[07:39] <Demon012> harrisony: reason I ask is soundconverter has a bug where it creates spaces as %20's instead of proper spaces yet it is not on launchpad
[07:39] <Demon012> and for that matter the site for that program appears to be down
[07:39] <harrisony> Demon012: try this link
[07:40] <Demon012> actually forget what I said about the site being down (it was the other day but it is up again now)
[07:40] <harrisony> !list sound-convertor
[07:40] <ScottK> bddebian: xxxxx1's question was he'd changed it to gutsy and lintian complained unknown release.
[07:40] <bddebian> I know and then he said leave it, and I understood that to mean leave it at Feisty?  Or did he mean leave the lintian warning? :-)
[07:41] <ScottK> Leave it at gutsy and ignore the Lintian warning.
[07:41] <bddebian> Ah. then yes sorry :-)
[07:41] <ScottK> At least as I understood it.
[07:41] <ScottK> Of course I'm old and slow, so I may be wrong.
[07:43] <xxxxx1> ScottK: hahaha
[07:43] <xxxxx1> Matusalem
[07:44] <xxxxx1> methuselah
[07:44] <bddebian> Demon012: You mean this: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/feisty/+source/soundconverter  
[07:44] <bddebian> ??
[07:44] <dqdev> ScottK: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ketm/+bug/80474
[07:44] <dqdev> ScottK: I added the control changes
[07:44] <dqdev> you might wanna take a look
[07:44] <Q-FUNK> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/upgrade-system/+bug/104829
[07:45] <ubotu> Malone bug 104829 in upgrade-system "deleted old kernal headers" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[07:45] <Q-FUNK> this one is a real challenge, though.  no idea what to reassign it to
[07:46] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4883
[07:46] <kkubasik> if anyone has a moment
[07:46] <kkubasik> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4881
[07:46] <ScottK> dqdev: Looks reasonable to me, but I'm not a MOTU.
[07:47] <dqdev> ok
[07:47] <dqdev> thanks
[07:47] <dqdev> i ll leave it like that 
[07:47] <dqdev> and see what they say from "Above"
[07:47] <ScottK> Q-FUNK: I'd reject the bug.  He upgraded straight from Dapper to Edgy and that's not supported.
[07:48] <ScottK> err Dapper to Feisty
[07:48] <Q-FUNK> ScottK: good point.
[07:49] <ScottK> Be nice though...
[07:50] <Q-FUNK> actualy, 2.6.10 is probably older than Dapper.  maybe Breezy or Hoary
[07:52] <Q-FUNK> IIRC 2.6.17 was Edgy, 2.6.15 Dapper
[07:56] <zul> Q-FUNK: 2.6.10 was hoary
[07:56] <zul> I should know I had the pleasure of backporting security patches to hoary
[07:57] <Q-FUNK> ScottK: as I realized, I'm still not -dev.  I agree with the reject verdict, but I probably cannot close it myself.
[07:57] <Q-FUNK> zul: :)
[07:59] <ScottK> Q-FUNK: Just mark is rejected.  Say why (nicely and politely) and it's done.  That's all the closing there is.
[07:59] <ScottK> Good point
[07:59] <ScottK> about 2.6.10 being really old.
[08:00] <zul> hoary is not supported anymore either
[08:00] <ScottK> 2.6.10 is Breezy.  Not supported.
[08:01] <ScottK> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kernel-source-2.6.10
[08:01] <zul> uh...no..
[08:01] <zul> linux-source-2.6.10
[08:02] <tepsipakki> 2.6.10 is hoary, 2.6.12 is breezy ;)
[08:03] <ScottK> OK.  Sorry for the confusion.  Not supported either way.
[08:03] <tepsipakki> right
[08:18] <Demon012> can someone confirm bug #109365 for me?
[08:18] <ubotu> Malone bug 109365 in soundconverter "soundconverter replaces spaces with %20's when set to output to the same location as input file" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/109365
[08:18] <Demon012> its my bug but want to make sure that it can be recreated on someone else's comptuer
[08:18] <Demon012> computer*
[08:22] <harrisony> Demon012: put more info like feisty or edgy or dapper and version info,etc..
[08:22] <harrisony> wait sorry
[08:22] <harrisony> didnt see it
[08:23] <Demon012> that's np
[08:24] <grayman> meh
[08:24] <grayman> that's probably the worst independence day ever
[08:24] <Demon012> also need to edit it really (it converts any special characters to hex not just spaces (I noticed it converted the & to %26 aswell after I posted it))
[08:24] <grayman> everyone is partying outside and me bashing bugs
[08:26] <Demon012> well atleast you got some useful stuff done grayman
[08:26] <harrisony> Independence day? whats that
[08:26] <Demon012> wb LaserJock
[08:26] <jussi01> is there a way to delete comments you made on a bug...
[08:26] <jussi01> ?
[08:26] <LaserJock> jussi01: nope
[08:26] <jussi01> grrr, i just commented on the wrong bug... had 2 open in different windows
[08:27] <harrisony> jussi01: happened to me as well
[08:27] <LaserJock> there is a plan to add a "Edit within 5min" feature
[08:27] <jussi01> bug 95018 and bug 96529
[08:27] <ubotu> Malone bug 95018 in ktorrent "[apport]  ktorrent crashed with SIGSEGV" [Medium,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/95018
[08:27] <ubotu> Malone bug 96529 in ktorrent "[apport]  ktorrent crashed with SIGSEGV in free()" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/96529
[08:27] <grayman> eh
[08:27] <grayman> independence of Israel
[08:27] <grayman> heh
[08:28] <harrisony> LaserJock: your back :) um...is working with motu and packages a "full time job"
[08:28] <LaserJock> grayman: well, it can be software independence day with you working on bugs ;-)
[08:28] <LaserJock> harrisony: me personally? or in generally
[08:28] <pochu> LaserJock: nice session :)
[08:29] <grayman> heh
[08:29] <harrisony> wll i was told that its not just turning packages into debs and its quite long and like a similar to a full time job
[08:30] <LaserJock> it really is what you make of it
[08:30] <LaserJock> some people have time and interest and spend waaaay too much time at it
[08:30] <LaserJock> some people just do it know and then
[08:31] <Demon012> LaserJock: what is the quickest way to make a package (I have seen checkinstall however is a checkinstall package suitable for upload?)
[08:31] <jussi01> dammit, how do I mark it confirmed? or can I? should I?
[08:31] <LaserJock> Demon012: checkinstall won't work for uploading because it doesn't produce a source package
[08:31] <LaserJock> Demon012: we upload only source packges
[08:31] <Demon012> ah yes I recall that now from earlier
[08:32] <LaserJock> Demon012: about the easiest way I can think of is to find a similar existing source package and base your's on that
[08:33] <jussi01> Demon012: this is a helpful document: http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-debhelper.html
[08:33] <Demon012> ty jussi01
[08:34] <Demon012> also just how active is #ubuntu-motu-school?
[08:34] <Demon012> found it through one of the pages posted earlier in the #ubuntu-classroom
[08:34] <LaserJock> ah
[08:35] <LaserJock> well right now it's pretty dead I think
[08:35] <Demon012> yeah atm only me and the bot
[08:35] <LaserJock> we haven't had a MOTU School session for a while
[08:35] <LaserJock> we need to kick that back into activity
[08:35] <LaserJock> in general this channel acts as motu-school
[08:36] <Demon012> ok that's good
[08:36] <LaserJock> we generally just used motu-school when we had a specific "session" so it didn't interfer with normal discussion here
[08:37] <Burgwork> LaserJock: ping
[08:37] <LaserJock> Burgwork: pongy pongy pongy
[08:37] <Burgwork> LaserJock: yur gots mail
[08:37] <Demon012> heh
[08:37] <LaserJock> oh no
[08:37] <LaserJock> not ...... mail!!!!!!
[08:37] <Demon012> run LaserJock run!
[08:38] <Demon012> =)
[08:39] <Burgwork> LaserJock: nah, it is jason's email
[08:39] <LaserJock> for gutsy?
[08:40] <bddebian> harrisony: hehe
[08:40] <harrisony> hehehe
[08:40] <Burgwork> LaserJock: well, going to see if I can get an UVF filed
[08:40] <Burgwork> sru, rather
[08:40] <LaserJock> SRU?
[08:40] <Demon012> anyone free to help me confirm a bug isn't just limited to my computer? bug #109365 (unless harrisony is doing it)
[08:40] <ubotu> Malone bug 109365 in soundconverter "soundconverter replaces spaces with %20's when set to output to the same location as input file" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/109365
[08:40] <Burgwork> bloody acronyms
[08:41] <LaserJock> :-)
[08:41] <bddebian> Burgwork: :-)
[08:41] <harrisony> Demon012: ill try poke at it'
[08:41] <Demon012> ok cool ty harrisony
[08:41] <Burgwork> i;m going to nmu your sru until the uvf come out your ears!
[08:42] <LaserJock> Burgwork: well, just make sure to file your SRU ASAP or it'll be DOA. For sure do it before UVF or it'll be MIA. ;-)
[08:42] <Demon012> rofl these abbriviations are too much for me atm (haven't a clue about 98% of them)
[08:42] <Demon012> lol LaserJock
[08:43] <harrisony> Demon012: gah, cant do now..ill do it when  get home, stupid computer wont be nice
[08:43] <Demon012> ? what's your computer doing =S
[08:44] <LaserJock> Burgwork: and it better not FTFBS ;-)
[08:45] <harrisony> Demon012 wait its workin\
[08:45] <Demon012> ok cool
[08:46] <Demon012> btw when testing this bug make sure you don't click the delete source file check box in the preferences
[08:46] <Demon012> I did the other day when I found it and deleted the folder with some of my music in it
[08:46] <Demon012> the output folder that is
[08:48] <ScottK> Hurray! The man is here to fix my air conditioning...
[08:48] <Demon012> =)
[08:49] <harrisony> Demon012: not doing it here
[08:50] <Demon012> mmm maybe it is fat32's fault then 
[08:50] <Demon012> gonna do some more testing on it then
[08:52] <Demon012> ty harrisony
[08:54] <Demon012> argh ok its not fat32
[08:55] <Demon012> mmm think I better go look at the debugging how to's to see if I can resolve this by myself then
[08:57] <Demon012> hi doko_
[08:57] <Demon012> hi xxxxx1
[08:58] <xxxxx1> hi
[09:02] <xxxxx1> can someone review my updated tpm-tools on revu?
[09:10] <gpocentek> LaserJock: tell me if you sucessfully import thunderbird 1.5 settings, mails, ...
[09:11] <gpocentek> it didn't work for me
[09:14] <deep> hi All
[09:14] <ivoks> deep: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributeToUbuntu :)
[09:15] <ivoks> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributeToUbuntu#head-04a0b0f238d699cf8e8e00b1928113ae08cb8813
[09:15] <ivoks> this part
[09:15] <LaserJock> gpocentek: seems to work fine in OS X :-)
[09:15] <deep> ivoks, I ll check
[09:21] <statik> hi there motus
[09:21] <somerville32> hiya
[09:21] <statik> there is a bug which is irritating me, so I thought I might take a stab at helping fix it
[09:21] <statik> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/subversion/+bug/91848
[09:21] <ubotu> Malone bug 91848 in subversion "segfault when importing libsvn.wc in python 2.4 on feisty/amd64" [Medium,Confirmed]  
[09:21] <statik> still quite newbie to packaging
[09:22] <statik> I think what I want to do is try backing out various patches from the ubuntu version of this package to find which one causes the crash. 
[09:22] <statik> anyone feel like holding my hand through the best way to do this?
[09:23] <statik> so far I have done 'apt-get build-dep python-subversion', and 'apt-get source -b python-subversion'. The second step got me the source but failed to build
[09:24] <ScottK> statik: How did you try to build it?
[09:24] <ScottK> Did you install build-essential?
[09:25] <statik> ScottK: yes, I've got build-essential. I tried 'apt-get source -b python-subversion', and the build phase failed with dh_testroot saying I needed to use fakeroot
[09:26] <statik> ScottK: I ran apt-get build-dep python-subversion first
[09:26] <ScottK> OK.  That doesn't get build-essential.  That's why I asked.  It's assumed.
[09:26] <statik> gotcha
[09:27] <ScottK> !pbuilder
[09:27] <ubotu> pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
[09:27] <ScottK> statik: I'd look into pbuilder to make sure you are building in a clean environment.
[09:27] <statik> ScottL: I'll set one of those up now
[09:27] <statik> ScottK: I'll set one of those up now
[09:27] <statik> also I will type more carefully
[09:27] <ScottK> K
[09:28] <psusi> is anyone familliar with imake?  I'm trying to build the dapper version of tightvncserver on edgy to see if going back to the dapper version fixes a regression from the upgrade, but the build fails
[09:29] <psusi> says Imakefile.c: error: Imake.tmpl: No such file or directory
[09:32] <xxxxx1> trousers updated.
[09:43] <ScottK> psusi: No imake in Feisty: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/imake
[09:45] <psusi> huh?  it's being used by the tightvnc package
[09:46] <ScottK> Maybe the package name is different now.
[09:47] <ScottK> psusi: Is it being used by the Feisty version?
[09:47] <psusi> yea
[09:50] <ajmitch> morning
[09:50] <bddebian> Heya ajmitch
[09:50] <ajmitch> poor poor siretart 
[09:50] <psusi> boy this is weird
[09:51] <psusi> the tightvnc source package from dapper fails to build under pbuilder on feisty... yet builds outside of pbuilder
[09:51] <psusi> err, sorry... on edgy
[09:53] <psusi> seems that imake is provided in the xutils-dev package
[09:53] <psusi> and tightvnc doesn't list that as a buid-dep... instead it lists xutils twice... I thik one of those was supposed to be -dev
[09:54] <ScottK> psusi: Try to change that in your local source and then see if pbuilder will build it.
[09:59] <psusi> it also says it build-depends on lynx, and it builds fine without it
[09:59] <psusi> that's just weird
[10:00] <psusi> nope, still fails to build under pbuilder after fixing the xutils-dev
[10:01] <ScottK> psusi: Same error?
[10:01] <psusi> yea
[10:07] <ScottK> psusi: According to Launchpad it's to be found somewhere in xorg https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+search?text=Imakefile.c
[10:24] <sacater> hmm, ive noticed people are treating ubunty as guarenteed software
[10:24] <soothsay> If I want to replace an existing package with my own patched version, what steps should I follow?
[10:25] <sacater> soothsay: talk to an motu ;D
[10:26] <shawarma> soothsay: Just install it?
[10:27] <soothsay> shawarma: And how does apt handle upgrades? Does it mask the package?
[10:27] <shawarma> soothsay: Depends on how you versioned it.
[10:28] <shawarma> soothsay: You can choose to keep it up-to-date and put your own suffix on the package version or you can just put your version on hold (echo packagename hold | sudo dpkg --set-selections).
[10:28] <soothsay> shawarma: Presumably I don't want to automatically upgrade said package (without applying the patches). What should I do?
[10:28] <shawarma> soothsay: Put it on hold.
[10:29] <soothsay> shawarma: Is that an appropriate long term solution?
[10:29] <shawarma> soothsay: No.
[10:29] <shawarma> soothsay: The appropriate long term solution is to get your patch into the package.
[10:29] <shawarma> soothsay: What's it about?
[10:31] <soothsay> shawarma: Nothing particular. I use several patches to some packages that are not useful upstream.  In gentoo I can handle this with an overlay and package masking. I thought there were similar mechanism in dpkg.
[10:32] <shawarma> soothsay: Not really. that sort of thing doesn't fit all that well into the binary package way of doing things.
[10:32] <shawarma> soothsay: Do you have an example of one of your patches?
[10:33] <sacater> SIGH, quick question on my dads behalf (wind*** user), would opening up SIP ports on the router present a risk to internet banking?
[10:33] <shawarma> soothsay: I'm just curious what is so important that you want to go through the trouble, but not important enough to be shared. :-)
[10:33] <sacater> he keeps them locked from paronoid fear
[10:33] <shawarma> sacater: Depends.
[10:33] <shawarma> sacater: What is he using for SIP?
[10:33] <ajmitch> hi shawarma 
[10:33] <shawarma> sacater: An ata?
[10:33] <shawarma> ajmitch: Ahoy there.
[10:34] <sacater> shawarma: no no, im using a sip client, he just wont unblock those FUDGING ports
[10:34] <shawarma> sacater: Software on his Windows machine?
[10:34] <sacater> i can call out
[10:34] <sacater> but people cant call me
[10:34] <shawarma> sacater: Ah, it's for *you*? 
[10:34] <sacater> moi
[10:34] <shawarma> sacater: So the ports will be forwarded to *your* machine, not his?
[10:34] <sacater> in theory yes
[10:34] <shawarma> sacater: :-) but?
[10:35] <sacater> hes worried that hackers will come in on those ports and f*** things up on his precious wind***
[10:35] <sacater> and is pi**** me off
[10:35] <shawarma> sacater: The ports will be forwarded to your machine?
[10:35] <shawarma> sacater: Not his?
[10:35] <soothsay> shawarma: It seems that the 'binary' package way of doing things would at least provide *some* mechanism for managing modified source packages (different compile options, patches, ... etc)
[10:35] <sacater> should be
[10:35] <shawarma> sacater: Then there's no problem.
[10:36] <shawarma> sacater: If you just configure the router to forward the connections to your machine, there's no problem.
[10:37] <soothsay> shawarma: Have you tried stun
[10:37] <shawarma> soothsay: Yes.
[10:37] <ajmitch> ScottK: wise choice
[10:38] <shawarma> soothsay: Well, since "we" (Ubuntu) compile all the packages before they even reach the user's computer, it's kind of hard for the user to change any compile flags.
[10:39] <sacater> shawarma: im back, he says there is, once hackers get into the router, they can try for my machine or his
[10:39] <sacater> :o
[10:40] <soothsay> shawarma: What about source packages?
[10:40] <shawarma> sacater: Well, the point is that they won't get any more "into the router" than they do already. What he'd be enabling is just forwarding for certain things to your machine. If the router is hackable, it's going to be so independently of those port forwardings.
[10:40] <shawarma> soothsay: What about them?
[10:41] <shawarma> sacater: Not sure you should tell him that, though.
[10:41] <soothsay> shawarma: Those aren't compiled before hand
[10:41] <shawarma> sacater: He sounds like the kind of guy who would suffer an aneurism if he realised that.
[10:41] <shawarma> soothsay: Right. Also, they're not automatically updated.
[10:42] <shawarma> soothsay: You are of course free to disable all the deb lines from your sources.list and fetch sources instead an compile them.
[10:42] <shawarma> soothsay: You're just going to be missing out on all the automatic update goodness.
[10:42] <dabaR> sacater: find some writing that explains what you guys are talking about, how forwarding ports to one machine does not jeopardize the other machines, and have your dad read it, and change his mind
[10:44] <soothsay> shawarma: Aha. So downloading the source package, building and installing the deb will install the package (and registered with dpkg) and not automatically update (for that single package)?
[10:44] <shawarma> soothsay: to be perfectly honest: If your patches are really so esoteric that noone else could benifit from them, it seems like your attacking your problem in the wrong way.
[10:44] <shawarma> soothsay: Yes.
[10:44] <shawarma> soothsay: Er... No.
[10:44] <shawarma> soothsay: Heh..
[10:44] <soothsay> shawarma: ?
[10:45] <shawarma> soothsay: If you still have the binary archives in your sources.list and a new version turns up, apt-get will install it on your first upgrade.
[10:45] <shawarma> soothsay: If you remove the binary repositories from your sources.list, nothing is going to be automagically updated.
[10:45] <soothsay> shawarma: Is that like shooting a fly with a cannon?
[10:46] <soothsay> s/shooting/killing
[10:46] <shawarma> soothsay: More like trying to screw in a screw with a hammer.
[10:46] <shawarma> soothsay: It works, but it's just not right.
[10:46] <bddebian> Isn't that how you are supposed to screw in screws?
[10:46] <shawarma> bddebian: If all you got is a hammer..
[10:46] <siretart> ajmitch: poor me?
[10:47] <ajmitch> siretart: you get to share a room with me at UDS for a week
[10:47] <bddebian> heh, theres a delayed response :)
[10:47] <ScottK> Screwing in screws with a hammer works better than screwing in a lightbulb with a hammer.
[10:47] <siretart> ajmitch: w00t! :)
[10:47] <bddebian> Heya siretart
[10:47] <bddebian> ScottK: Good point
[10:47] <shawarma> ScottK: Or screwing in screwdrivers with a lightbulb..
[10:47] <bddebian> hehe
[10:47] <LaserJock> lol
[10:48] <sacater> dabaR: shawarma: easier said than done, he has read to many web reviews
[10:48] <sacater> blame us innocent hackers :o
[10:48] <sacater> he emailed his mate at BT about it
[10:48] <siretart> ajmitch: probably we'll visit many BoFs together, so sharing one room seems a good idea to me! cool! :)
[10:49] <ajmitch> siretart: yeah, what time do you arrive in seville?
[10:49] <sacater> probably get a co-operate 'use our blah-blah' response
[10:49] <sacater> corperate*
[10:49] <shawarma> corporate, actually. :-)
[10:50] <shawarma> Not that it matters.
[10:50] <siretart> ajmitch: May 6, 1640 arrives the plane on sevilla
[10:50] <siretart> may 5, that is
[10:50] <ajmitch> siretart: may 6? I thought it should be the 5th?
[10:51] <siretart> mistyped
[10:51] <siretart> ssh is quite laggy here
[10:51] <ajmitch> ok :)
[10:51] <shawarma> siretart, ajmitch: We should exchange phone number so that we can hook up saturday night. I arrive at around 2100, I think.
[10:51] <siretart> wow, that's late
[10:51] <ajmitch> yeah
[10:51] <ajmitch> so I'll be getting in & sleeping
[10:52] <shawarma> Boring.
[10:52] <shawarma> :-p
[10:52] <ajmitch> shawarma: long flight
[10:52] <siretart> ajmitch: and I'd expect you to be quite jetlagged. what time is it for you right now?
[10:52] <shawarma> It's not like you've been doing much for the last 30 hours.
[10:52] <ajmitch> 8:52am
[10:52] <shawarma> That's mad.
[10:52] <ajmitch> on tuesday
[10:53] <shawarma> *THAT'S* mad.
[10:53] <ajmitch> shawarma: you're right, I'll just be sitting down most of the 30 hours :)
[10:53] <ajmitch> bddebian: sorry, I'm not flying via the US
[10:53] <bddebian> bastage
[10:54] <shawarma> It's weird. I consider myself a pretty smart person, but that I can sit here and chat with people who are already at Tuesday just fucks with my head.
[10:54] <bddebian> heh
[10:54] <siretart> ajmitch: wow. so you're just getting up at the time you'll arrive
[10:55] <ajmitch> shawarma: I'm used to everyone being behind
[10:55] <ajmitch> siretart: oh I can adjust my sleep schedule to match, that's ok ;)
[10:56] <shawarma> ajmitch: I'm just glad I'm not where you are. If I were in Kiwiland and I talked to someone in L.A. or similar $TZ, my head would blow up. 
[10:56] <shawarma> ajmitch: How can they always be at yesterday?
[10:56] <ajmitch> quite simple, really
[10:57] <shawarma> ajmitch: No way, man. The date line creeps me out.
[10:58] <shawarma> The date line at 180 degrees longitude, of course. Not the kind of date line you call when you're lonely.
[11:03] <LaserJock> wahooo!
[11:03] <shawarma> Totally!
[11:03] <LaserJock> my sparc is delievered
[11:03] <shawarma> <o/
[11:03] <shawarma> Er..
[11:03] <shawarma> \o/ !
[11:03] <siretart> LaserJock: so sparky is not good enough?
[11:03] <siretart> jk ;)
[11:04] <bddebian> Damn, LaserJock gets a Sparc and I lot my Feisty laptop :'-(
[11:04] <bddebian> Grr s/lot/lost/
[11:05] <geser> bddebian: what happened?
[11:05] <ajmitch> bddebian: lost?
[11:06] <LaserJock> siretart: well, my own personal sparking is a bit more fun
[11:06] <bddebian> Had to take it back to the office.  We've had a freakin' rash of stolen and broken laptops at work so I had to give my second one up :-(
[11:06] <ajmitch> aw
[11:07] <siretart> LaserJock: I can imagine :)
[11:16] <geser> bddebian: so a co-worker uses now your feisty installation?
[11:17] <bddebian> geser: No, even worse, it was re-imaged with Windows XP :)
[11:27] <tsmithe> bddebian, whyy?!!!!
[11:27] <tsmithe> you should not let this happen :P
[11:28] <tsmithe> :P
[11:28] <tsmithe> ajmitch, surely you can minimise the noise with lm-sensors and fancontrol?
[11:29] <ajmitch> only if you have a really quiet box anyway
[11:29] <tsmithe> well, my only noise on normal load now comes from the cpu :)
[11:29] <tsmithe> s/cpu/psu/
[11:30] <ajmitch> if you're willing to run hot, sure
[11:30] <bddebian> tsmithe: Because that's what pays my bills
[11:31] <ajmitch> but if you have several hard drives in a system, it pushes the heat & noise level up a little
[11:31] <tsmithe> bddebian, poor guy :)
[11:31] <tsmithe> yep. but it's not gonna get above 50 degrees C without a fan on
[11:32] <tsmithe> so it generally stays below that
[11:33] <ajmitch> and when you get several running at once, it starts to add up
[11:34] <tsmithe> hmm yea
[11:34] <tsmithe> ah well, i'm off to bed
[11:34] <tsmithe> night all :0
[11:34] <tsmithe> *:)
[11:56] <bddebian> Later gang