[05:32] <willvdl> nixternal, ping
[05:32] <nixternal> willvdl: pong
[05:32] <willvdl> hey there
[05:32] <nixternal> hola
[05:32] <nixternal> :)
[05:33] <willvdl> : trying to catch up on some doc team stuff
[05:33] <willvdl> and wondering about the discussions around docs going on wiki vs docbook
[05:34] <willvdl> is the plan to move TBH doc submission onto the wiki as we go forward?
[05:35] <nixternal> not that I know of, but that could always change
[05:36] <nixternal> mdke would be a better person to ask for that one though
[05:37] <willvdl> cool, thanks. got a BoF coming up for edubuntu docs
[05:37] <willvdl> and jsut want to make sure I'm not talking rubbish
[05:39] <nixternal> when is that?
[05:40] <nixternal> is it going to be in conference at all where I can join with voip?
[05:40] <willvdl> still needs to be scheduled
[05:40] <nixternal> ahh, OK, if possible let me know a day in advanced since there is a 7hr time difference. that way there if it is super early, I can set my alarm for it
[05:40] <willvdl> http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/uds-sevilla/  will have the scheduled (updated each day)
[05:41] <nixternal> I will have to start waking up early then, which means I might be able to catch the last 3 hours ever day
[05:41] <willvdl> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/edubuntu-doc-roadmap-review  is the spec page for UDS
[05:41] <willvdl> urk, ok. there is a voip thingy as well for audio
[05:41] <nixternal> I will be able to help out a little more this go round seeing as Kubuntu docs have a good foundation
[05:43] <willvdl> silly question, but help.u.c has got ubuntu centric TBH docs, where are the kubuntu ones?
[05:43] <nixternal> hopefully going to be at kubuntu.org eventually
[05:43] <nixternal> waiting until after UDS to speak with Riddell about it
[05:44] <willvdl> aha
[05:45] <willvdl> ok, that's important info
[08:42] <shirish> can somebody see this https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats/Flash
[08:43] <shirish> and tell me why swfdec hasn't been given space there also, there is just mention of swfdec
[10:00] <mdke> I think we need to change the team policy
[10:00] <mdke> it's obviously not clear that we ask people to contribute first
[10:00] <mdke> shirish: probably because no one has thought of writing it - you should feel free to contribute as you think is appropriate by editing the page
[10:02] <shirish> mdke: I'm editing it as we speak, don't know whether I'm doing the right thing or not
[10:02] <mdke> shirish: that's what wikis are about :)
[10:02] <mdke> hopefully someone will review your work
[10:02] <mdke> if you are in doubt, email our mailing list to ask
[10:08] <shirish> mdke: I just did it https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats/Flash
[10:08] <shirish> mdke: can u please check, its under free-alternatives, do u think I need to give the standalone versions also or just the plugins is enough ?
[10:09] <shirish> mdke: btw I'm shirishag75@gmail on the ubuntu-doc mailing list
[10:14] <nixternal_> mdke: how do you think we should go about with applicants and the policy?
[10:15] <mdke> nixternal_: I think we should add people to the team when we grant them svn access; i.e. move the team to "restricted"... in fact, I've just done that
[10:15] <mdke> do you think it's a bad idea?
[10:15] <nixternal_> nope, I always thought you did it that way
[10:15] <nixternal_> that is a good idea truthfully
[10:16] <nixternal_> do the accounts have the 2yr expiration as well?
[10:16] <mdke> shirish: I don't know anything about swfdec but it looks like you did a good job. There is some grammar work that could be done on the page in general though... also, we don't tend to promote aptitude over other package managers, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WikiGuide/Style
[10:16] <shirish> mdke: that reminds me, reject my application for ubuntu-doc, I don't want to be touching any svn stuff, not competant enough
[10:16] <nixternal_> shirish: that is easy to change though :)
[10:16] <mdke> nixternal_: no, I think the team doesn't have member expiry
[10:17] <nixternal_> once you see how easy DocBook/XML and SVN is, you will want to retract that statement :)
[10:17] <nixternal_> OK, I was just thinking that there are a lot of "stale" names
[10:17] <mdke> yeah, we should think about that
[10:17] <mdke> they probably still have svn access too actually
[10:18] <nixternal_> but I remember the same issue with ubuntu-marketing, and people pitched a fit when they were put in the expired one, which is easy to get renewed
[10:18] <nixternal_> they were upset they wre put in there when they weren't contributing at all, not even saying hi on the ml or irc
[10:19] <nixternal_> being on a team is like an ego thing, and people get easily offended when they are removed or put in expiry
[10:21] <mdke> teams have different dynamics though
[10:22] <mdke> membership in some teams means simply being interested, which is valuable; other teams though are more restrictive (such as ubuntu-doc) because membership involves privileges
[10:25] <nixternal_> very true
[10:25] <nixternal_> and there are names that I know haven't contributed since dapper at least
[10:26] <shirish> ok re-updated the wiki again https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats/Flash
[10:28] <shirish>  I'm trying just to get the free alternative plugins atm, playing .swf with the alternative players should have its own sub-page with perhaps some debugging tips to help the developers ?
[10:29] <mdke> nixternal_: I'll post to the list about it
[10:29] <mdke> shirish: probably having them on that page is ok, rather than subpages
[10:30] <shirish> oh ok, but then that would be a deal for another day
[10:32] <shirish> mdke: is there any good documentation about this docbook-xml by any chance?
[10:33] <shirish> are there any easy front-ends for this docbook-xml
[10:33] <mdke> shirish: have you tried our wiki pages? they are not brilliant but generally it's possible to get an idea of how it works
[10:33] <mdke> wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam
[10:39] <shirish> mdke: looked at them, while it does lists lot of stuff it doesn't list the tools that one can use
[10:39] <shirish> mdke: for e.g. look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Projects
[10:39] <shirish> while at the very end it talks about xml tags but doesn't mention which GUI editor or if any GUI editor is good for this purpose
[10:40] <mdke> there aren't really any good free gui editors
[10:40] <mdke> you want https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Contribute
[10:40] <shirish> aha, didn't know that
[10:41] <nixternal_> mdke: what do you use? I use Kate 95% of the time, and vi/emacs the rest
[10:41] <nixternal_> I heard gEdit was pretty good as well
[10:42] <nixternal_> the nice thing about Kate is it has XML validation built in, and it is extremely nice when working on KDE docs because it uses system entities when validating as well
[10:43] <mdke> gedit me
[10:44] <shirish> gedit as in Gnome Editor or something else?
[10:44] <nixternal_> yes
[10:52] <shirish> hmm... I'm betting there are quite a few settings in gedit which would make it a good docbook-xml editor
[10:54] <mdke> there might be some extensions for it
[10:55] <shirish> it has both docbook as well as xml syntax highlighting as well as quite a few plugins as well hmm.....
[10:56] <shirish> ok another query, how are screenies looked upon, is there a way to upload screenshots when explaining something or one just uses some free image-sharing site & link from there ?
[10:56] <shirish> or moinmoin doesn't have the ability for screenshots ?
[10:57] <shirish> or has been turned off?
[11:01] <mdke> you can attach screenshots, see HelpOnActions/AttachFile