=== Fujitsu wards off the impending xmms doom.
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[12:52] <luisbg> anyone around?
=== poningru hugs \sh_away 
[12:53] <poningru> wine just allowed me to have my work box be entirely ubuntu
[12:53] <poningru> and hence raided up the wazzooo
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[12:55] <joejaxx> LaserJock: hello :)
[12:55] <luisbg> hey LaserJock 
[12:55] <LaserJock> hi guys
[12:55] <ScottK> Heya LaserJock
[12:56] <luisbg> hey jordan, got a question, do you know why xmms isn't in universe?
[12:56] <crimsun> luisbg: keescook just sent an email to -devel about that.
[12:56] <LaserJock> hi crimsun 
[12:56] <LaserJock> hi ScottK 
[12:57] <crimsun> luisbg: essentially, there are two source packages that build-depend on a package provided by xmms source.
=== keescook nods
[12:57] <luisbg> crimsun, yeap, you replied just after me ;)
[12:57] <luisbg> crimsun, aha
[12:57] <crimsun> oh excellent, evolution now refuses to start after composing that reply.
[12:57] <keescook> the two items I sent in that email, "flac" and "kdeutils" are both in main, so their build-deps must be too
=== crimsun hugs gutsy
[12:58] <keescook> :)
[12:58] <luisbg> crimsun, lol
[12:58] <luisbg> keescook, wanna take charge of pushing xmms to universe?
[12:58] <crimsun> I don't know if even elmo is still using xmms.
[12:58] <keescook> luisbg: yeah, I've actually got the flac and kdeutils changes ready to upload, but I wanted to make sure I wasn't being dumb.  :)
[12:59] <keescook> hehe
[12:59] <crimsun> last I checked, he was basically the only person on staff using it, but I could have been smoking crack.
[01:00] <luisbg> crimsun, I use xmms
[01:00] <luisbg> and have a reason for it
[01:00] <LaserJock> man, I have a lot of email to catch up on :(
[01:00] <crimsun> luisbg: being?
[01:00] <luisbg> crimsun, rythmbox and exaile are great to listen to great databases of cd's, but xmms does a better trick to just listen to a few singles
[01:01] <crimsun> luisbg: you could use audacious
[01:01] <crimsun> luisbg: I use mplayer-nox for that, but YMMV.
[01:01] <luisbg> I usually listen to my singles in xmms, and test the downloaded music (yeah I know, but in spain is legal) to check if it sounds good there
[01:01] <crimsun> err, mplayer-nogui
[01:01] <keescook> luisbg: yeah, I still using xmms too.  I'm mostly worried about xmms users that listen to flac files, as my changes would break them.
[01:01] <LaserJock> I use totem for single songs :/
[01:02] <luisbg> LaserJock, you are an adventurous guy
[01:02] <LaserJock> it works
[01:02] <luisbg> it does work but it's kinda heavy for that task
[01:02] <crimsun> keescook: one could always split out xmms-flac into a separate source package.
[01:03] <LaserJock> luisbg:  well, it's installed by default
[01:03] <luisbg> LaserJock, true
[01:03] <crimsun> keescook: build-dep on flac source in it and build the plugin.  I think that's why xen stuff does.
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[01:03] <crimsun> s/why/what/
[01:03] <Amaranth> hrm
[01:03] <crimsun> well, at least  /did/  back in feisty.
[01:04] <Amaranth> is there a way in a .install file to say "every file from this dir except foo"?
[01:04] <keescook> crimsun: oh! what would that look like?  (er, rather, would that have to go through source NEW, and it would share the flac orig.tar.gz?)
[01:04] <Lamego> Amaranth, you could use dh_install -X
[01:05] <Lamego> dh_install -Xfile source dest
[01:05] <crimsun> keescook: yes, it'd have to go through source NEW, but you wouldn't have to bundle flac's orig.tar.gz in it.  You'd use something similar to what feisty's xen stuff in universe does with linux-*)
[01:05] <Amaranth> Lamego: I don't think that'll work
[01:05] <Lamego> why not ?
[01:06] <luisbg> gotta go guys!
[01:06] <luisbg> =)
[01:06] <luisbg> ttyl
[01:06] <Amaranth> Lamego: Well the package I'm poking only calls dh_install once...
[01:06] <Lamego> ah :(
[01:06] <Lamego> you could keep that particular dir out of the .install
[01:06] <Lamego> and call it on debian/rules
[01:06] <Amaranth> i was hoping glob would do some magic
[01:06] <Amaranth> but that works too
[01:07] <orion2012> I keep making a comment on REVU and then refreshing the page, forgetting to clear the GET data... Sorry for spamming the list.
[01:08] <Amaranth> Lamego: what i'm really trying to do is say "install everything but foo in -bar package and put foo in -foo package"
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[01:10] <crimsun> debian/-foo.install with dh_install -p-bar -Xfoo  in debian/rules ?
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[01:10] <nixternal> wo0t! just uploaded krename into Debian's kde-extras!!
[01:11] <nixternal> StevenK: on our way now. I will get the package updated in Debian, and then just request a synch :)
[01:23] <LaserJock> hi nixternal 
[01:23] <LaserJock> long time, no see
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[01:56] <joejaxx> hello keescook ! :)
[01:57] <keescook> hiya joejaxx !  You made it home okay, I see?  :)
[01:57] <joejaxx> yeap :)
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[02:03] <superm1> hey keescook 
[02:03] <superm1> i just got back in an hr or so ago
[02:03] <superm1> i heard you ponged
[02:05] <keescook> superm1: :)  yeah, I'm back in the right timezone again.  :)
[02:06] <superm1> ah vg. how did UDS go?
[02:09] <DarkSun88> When I make the debdiff bitween old.dsc and new.dsc of package, the entry debian/control and the the changes there aren't.
[02:09] <DarkSun88> Why?
[02:11] <DarkSun88> I just edited the changes in debian/control and I just compiled it, but there aren't the changes of debian/control in debdiff.
[02:12] <crimsun> DarkSun88: what source package?
[02:13] <DarkSun88> I just tried with Colorblind and Xgalag
[02:14] <DarkSun88> s/Xgalag/Xgalaga
[02:14] <crimsun> can you post your modified source package?
[02:15] <DarkSun88> diff.gz or debdiff?
[02:15] <crimsun> either
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[02:17] <DarkSun88> crimsun: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20894/
[02:17] <racarr>  /win goto 12
[02:17] <racarr> Mrgh.
[02:17] <DarkSun88> This is the debdiff of package
[02:18] <crimsun> that debdiff doesn't contain any changes to files other than debian/changelog
[02:19] <crimsun> did you actually change the merged source package?
[02:19] <DarkSun88> This is the problem :)
[02:20] <crimsun> if you ran debdiff, there are no changes, which means you either didn't debdiff the correct source packages, or you didn't actually apply the changes to the correct source dir.
[02:20] <DarkSun88> I just applied the changes to debian/control of Debian
[02:21] <crimsun> I'll just walk through the merge process with you.
[02:21] <crimsun> first, start with pristine source packages from gutsy and sid
[02:22] <DarkSun88> Right
[02:22] <crimsun> (using colorblind)
[02:23] <crimsun> now, are you using MoM or DaD or manual?
[02:23] <DarkSun88> Manual
[02:23] <crimsun> ok, so I presume you're going to fakesync then apply the changelog diff?
[02:24] <DarkSun88> Yes
[02:25] <DarkSun88> crimsun: I just compiled it and it's ok, all right.
[02:26] <crimsun> ok, so you straightened it out?
[02:27] <DarkSun88> I don't understand
[02:27] <crimsun> DarkSun88: I interpreted your statement above as "everything's ok"
[02:28] <DarkSun88> Yep.
[02:29] <DarkSun88> The merge it's ok, the problem is the mistake entries in debdiff of debian/control.
[02:29] <crimsun> you don't need them, because it's a fakesync.
[02:30] <crimsun> the only difference between the Ubuntu and Debian source packages will be debian/changelog entries.
[02:30] <crimsun> that doesn't require you to apply DebianMaintainerField
[02:31] <DarkSun88> So, it is not merge?
[02:31] <crimsun> no, it's not a merge.  It's called a fakesync.
[02:31] <ajmitch> hi
[02:31] <crimsun> technically you will be apply Debian's diff.gz directly to a pristine, extracted Ubuntu orig.tar.gz
[02:31] <crimsun> applying ^
[02:31] <crimsun> hi ajmitch 
[02:32] <DarkSun88> ajmitch: Hi
[02:32] <DarkSun88> crimsun: Ok, but Xgalaga package? It's a merge.
[02:32] <LaserJock> hi ajmitch 
[02:32] <DarkSun88> crimsun: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20899/
[02:33] <DarkSun88> This is debdiff of package.
[02:34] <crimsun> DarkSun88: correct, so you'll need to adhere to DebianMaintainerField, update debian/changelog, then respin the debdiff.
[02:36] <DarkSun88> The debian/changelog it's ok.
[02:36] <crimsun> no it's not.  You need to explicitly state that you changed debian/control to adhere to DebianMaintainerField.
[02:36] <DarkSun88> I have to remove "    - Update maintainer in field debian/control"
[02:36] <DarkSun88> Right?
[02:37] <crimsun> oh, you're talking about colorblind now?
[02:37] <DarkSun88> Xgalaga
[02:37] <crimsun> oh, no, that's fine.
[02:37] <crimsun> you can leave that alone.
[02:37] <crimsun> I scan for explicit filenames, so I overlooked it.  Sorry.
[02:38] <crimsun> you do need to fix debian/control, though.
[02:39] <DarkSun88> Do you see debian/control of Xgalaga?
[02:39] <DarkSun88> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20902/
[02:40] <crimsun> right, but note it's not in the Debian source package.
[02:40] <crimsun> thus, when you debdiff against sid's package, you must have that hunk in the debdiff
[02:42] <DarkSun88> Looking it
[02:42] <DarkSun88> The changes are in debian/control of Sid
[02:43] <crimsun> they absolutely are not.
[02:43] <crimsun> well, let me check -43
[02:43] <crimsun> -42 definitely doesn't
[02:44] <crimsun> nope, definitely not in -43
[02:44] <crimsun> +Maintainer: Joey Hess <joeyh@debian.org>
[02:44] <crimsun> http://incoming.debian.org/xgalaga_2.0.34-43.diff.gz
[02:46] <DarkSun88> I just used mdt to take source package of Xgalaga from Sid
[02:47] <crimsun> just look at the actual source package from Sid or incoming
[02:49] <DarkSun88> packages.debian.org has -42
[02:49] <azeem> packages.d.o is always outdated by a day or so
[02:50] <crimsun> use PTS to read the ACCEPT, then check the appropriate place.
[02:50] <crimsun> in this case, -43 was accepted after dinstall, so you need to look in incoming
[02:51] <DarkSun88> Ok
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[02:59] <DarkSun88> crimsun: I try to make the debdiff bitween -43 and 43ubuntu1.
[03:00] <crimsun> DarkSun88: ok.
[03:02] <DarkSun88> crimsun: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20910/
[03:02] <DarkSun88> crimsun: Please, check it
[03:02] <DarkSun88> Argh
[03:03] <DarkSun88> It's mistake.
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[03:07] <crimsun> right, missing the debian/rules hunk
[03:07] <DarkSun88> Right. :)
[03:07] <DarkSun88> Check it now
[03:07] <DarkSun88> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20911/
[03:08] <crimsun> yep, looks sane.
[03:08] <DarkSun88> Upload the debdiff in LP?
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[03:11] <crimsun> yes.
[03:11] <crimsun> do you have a bug #?
[03:11] <crimsun> I'll upload it now since I've already looked.
[03:12] <DarkSun88> No, I open it
[03:12] <crimsun> don't bother now :)
[03:12] <crimsun> but in the future, yes, please open an LP bug and attach the debdiff
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[03:13] <DarkSun88> Ok.
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[03:16] <crimsun> (you should have received the accept.)
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[03:31] <crimsun> so -
[03:31] <crimsun> anyone want to trawl through https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-sponsors/+subscribedbugs with me?
=== TheMuso is updating his chroots/pbuilders, and will join crimsun.
[03:32] <crimsun> thanks
[03:34] <TheMuso> crimsun: You starting anywhere in particular?
[03:34] <crimsun> I'll start from 76-150 (last page) and work backword, so I'm starting with the last one listed
[03:35] <crimsun> backward ^
[03:35] <TheMuso> righto
[03:36] <TheMuso> ooo lovely.
[03:36] <TheMuso> A diff embedded in a bug report.
[03:36] <TheMuso> this is going to be fun.
=== TheMuso thinks we shouldn't recommend the use of requestsponsor any more, until attachments can be done.
[03:37] <TheMuso> Luckily, I have the email. I'll scrape from that.
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[03:42] <leonel> crimsun: TheMuso ScottK ..  Accepted:
[03:42] <leonel>  OK: squirrelmail_1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1.dsc
[03:42] <leonel>      -> Component: universe Section: web
[03:42] <leonel>  OK: squirrelmail_1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1.diff.gz
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[03:42] <leonel>  \o/  Whooo hoo !!  
[03:42] <leonel> thanks ...
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[03:44] <VoX> just wondering if/when support for the Logitech G15 LCD keyboard is going to be included?
[03:45] <nixternal> LaserJock: wasabi homer!
[03:46] <LaserJock> watchin' the simpsons, trying to catch up on email
[03:47] <Lathiat> VoX: are there any open source tools for it?
[03:47] <VoX> yeah
[03:47] <Lathiat> url?
=== TheMuso does 114043
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[03:47] <Lathiat> (just curious I wasn't going  to buy one cus I didn't think itd work on linux)
[03:48] <VoX> Lathiat: http://g15daemon.sourceforge.net/
[03:48] <VoX> i've been using it for about a year or so
[03:48] <Lathiat> nifty
[03:48] <Lathiat> i want one now :P
[03:48] <VoX> the basic keyboard and volume control work natively
[03:48] <VoX> but the extra keys and lcd require g15daemon
[03:49] <VoX> just figured it's something that would be an awesome add-on for ubuntu
[03:49] <hendrixski> hey, another newbie question... do most MOTU package for a favorite language, or is it common for one to package apps in several languages? lke java AND python versus... just C++???
[03:49] <TheMuso> hendrixski: We package whatever needs packaging, regardless of language.
[03:50] <hendrixski> TheMuso, that's hardcore ... does packaging differ much between languages?
[03:50] <TheMuso> hendrixski: No.
[03:51] <VoX> Lathiat: if i was smart enough, i'd try to create a package for submission
[03:51] <jmg> VoX: you are smart enough
[03:53] <leonel> VoX: go for it 
[03:53] <VoX> hmm
[03:53] <VoX> im not sure how to work out dependancies
[03:53] <hendrixski> TheMuso, that's good news.  so if I just wrote my first hello world program in python, I'd be able to look to the C++ hello world example on the repo's?
[03:54] <TheMuso> hendrixski: Unfortunately, python is a special case. Depends on how big and advanced the python program is.
[03:56] <hendrixski> TheMuso, oh.  I was reading over the debian python policy earlier, and couldn't make heads or tails of it.. that may explain why...  What makes it a special case?
[03:56] <TheMuso> hendrixski: Exactly what you pointed out. The python policy.
[03:56] <TheMuso> As far as I understand things anyway.
[03:56] <hendrixski> oh.  lol
[03:58] <ScottK> leonel: No, Thank you for contributing.
[03:58] <hendrixski> TheMuso, I heard on lugradio that Ubuntu is really pushing for more development in python.  They didn't say why.
[03:59] <leonel> ScottK:  no ??
[03:59] <ScottK> leonel: How are the Dapper/Edgy updates coming?
[03:59] <TheMuso> Python has been a popular choice ever since Ubuntu'
[03:59] <TheMuso> Python has been a popular choice ever since Ubuntu's fir strelease.
[03:59] <ScottK> leonel: No, you don't have to thank me.  I thank you for contributing.
[03:59] <leonel> ScottK: the snowball is a little  big but  working 
[03:59] <ScottK> OK.
[03:59] <ScottK> leonel: Earlier today I warned keescook to expect bigger changes for Dapper/Edgy becase of the other open issues.
[04:00] <leonel> ScottK: yes  I need to thank all the help from all of you     really   thanks
[04:00] <persia> hendrixski: python is considered the preferred language for new components of Ubuntu, but contributions in any language are welcome, and there is no directive to port existing working applications to python.
[04:00] <leonel> ScottK:  yes  dapper  is  a little big  bug  the little time I had  to work this weekend  and today    was for edgy  
[04:00] <ScottK> leonel: You're welcome.  I lot of people helped me when I first showed up here.  I'm glad to pay it forward.
[04:00] <leonel> ScottK:   I'm  training   for  dapper  :)  
[04:00] <hendrixski> persia, ah.  So it's suggested for use prototyping?
[04:01] <leonel> but the first  step was done
[04:01] <ScottK> Yes.  Thanks to you.
[04:01] <leonel> now   the  bug report  who closes it ?
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[04:01] <leonel> i mean  for  feisty only 
[04:02] <ScottK> leonel: Once the Feisty package is built for all archs it needs to build for, you mark it fix released for the Feisty task.
[04:02] <kdub432_> hey guys, if i'm interested in helping out the repos, how do i get involved? 
[04:02] <ScottK> kdub432_: Show up here and start working.
[04:02] <leonel> ScottK:  ok  
[04:02] <ScottK> kdub432_: Bug fixing Universe packages is a great way to get involved.
[04:03] <TheMuso> kdub432_: You read the wiki pages? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
[04:03] <leonel> kdub432_: yes  here are  great  people  to help  you get the work done 
[04:03] <TheMuso> !packagingguide | kdub432_ 
[04:03] <ubotu> kdub432_: The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
[04:03] <kdub432_> not yet... i'm going to now....
[04:03] <kdub432_> alright thanks!
[04:03] <hendrixski> persia, TheMuso,  (if my questions aren't getting annoying yet).. is it because of preferred language status that it has it's own python policy?
[04:04] <TheMuso> hendrixski: No, its because there needs to be a way to handle several versions of python on one system.
[04:04] <TheMuso> One can have 2,4 and 2.5 on the same system, and the package needs to be installed/built to work with them both.
[04:04] <ScottK> The Python policy comes from Debian and it's not particularly preferred there.
[04:04] <TheMuso> s/24/2.4/
[04:05] <ScottK> leonel: It's built so you can mark it fix released: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/squirrelmail/2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1
[04:06] <hendrixski> TheMuso, ah.  OK, so the same sorts of things with versions don't happen in other languages, right?  like Java, it's always in the latest version
[04:06] <TheMuso> hendrixski: Can't comment on java.
[04:07] <ScottK> IIRC, Perl has a policy too, for similar reasons.
[04:08] <hendrixski> ScottK, I C
[04:08] <TheMuso> persia: Is there a reason why the hydrogen FTBFS bug is still open?
[04:08] <TheMuso> persia: Marked as in progress currently.
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[04:08] <hendrixski> ScottK, does a separate debian policy also imply separate packaging tools?  for example, I heard there used to be a dh_python, but it's depricated
[04:09] <TheMuso> I saw your comment about it being successfully built.
[04:09] <ScottK> hendrixski: The best way is to pick an example package and look at it.
[04:10] <ScottK> If you are packaging something that properly uses Python distutils, for example, making a Debian package is dead simple.  See the pyyaml source package for an example of that.
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[04:12] <hendrixski> ScottK, right, I saw the distutils when I was looking at democracyplayers debian/rules
[04:13] <ScottK> hendrixski: IME (which is not huge) every language has it's subtleties that impact how it's packaged to some degree, but I know no C at all, but do packaging related work on C/C++ packcages all the time.
[04:13] <ScottK> hendrixski: For Python, distutils is the standard way to package stuff and so the Debian specific tools naturally leverage off of that.
[04:14] <hendrixski> ScottK, cool.  That's very inspiring..... Here I was thinking I'd have to learn a lot of programming languages :)
[04:14] <ScottK> Knowing some shell scripting is very helpful.  If you don't now, you'll pick it up.
[04:16] <hendrixski> the shell scripting is for writing debian/rules files right?
[04:16] <ScottK> The good news is that here people are very open to people with no experience that want to learn and help out.
[04:16] <ScottK> hendrixski: Sometimes.  It comes up for me more with dealing with init scripts and such (but I do little GUI related packaging, most of my stuff is server related).
[04:17] <crimsun> We have sharp, pointy teeth, however.  And new blood tastes  /good/  .
=== hendrixski hides from crimsun 
[04:18] <crimsun> Don't worry, I'm new, too.
[04:18] <ScottK> He also lies.
[04:18] <hendrixski> lol
[04:18] <crimsun> Have I mentioned that people love blowing my cover?
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[04:19] <TheMuso> crimsun: WHere are you up to?
=== TheMuso is just eyeballing the dmraid bug.
[04:20] <hendrixski> ScottK, the init scripts what exactly, if it's not too dumb of a question?  (is coming from a java plugin developer on windows background)
[04:20] <hendrixski> oops, that came out wrong
=== hendrixski is coming from a java plugin developer on windows background
[04:20] <ScottK> hendrixski: For stuff that's automatically started by the system and runs all the time.
[04:21] <ScottK> hendrixski: Look in etc/init.d for examples on your system.
[04:21] <hendrixski> ScottK, like daemons?
[04:21] <ScottK> Yes
=== ajmitch wonders if he should go & get a decent amount of caffeine
[04:22] <hendrixski> ScottK, ooh.. so if I wanted my application on my system to start up automatically, I write a script for it in /etc/init.d ?
[04:22] <hendrixski> assuming I learn shell scripting
[04:22] <ScottK> It's that or a decent amount of alcohol (the plan I'm currently on) and assuming you're back in Australia, caffeine is probably a better plan.
[04:22] <TheMuso> hendrixski: Theres a little more to it than that.
[04:23] <hendrixski> TheMuso, :-( aaawwww   had my hopes up for a second
[04:23] <TheMuso> You have to then tell the system to run the script at startup
[04:23] <TheMuso> It helps to know how Ubuntu starts up.
[04:24] <jmg> and it changed with upstart right?
[04:24] <hendrixski> TheMuso, is there a good guide about how that works? 
[04:24] <hendrixski> how ubuntu starts up that is
[04:24] <TheMuso> hendrixski: Not that I know of.
[04:24] <hendrixski> oh
[04:24] <ScottK> jmg: Yes and no, you can still use sys v init's too.
[04:25] <hendrixski> it's not too late at night to ask for a 3 or 4 line crash course about it, is it?
=== hendrixski is in NY, but doesn't know if it's getting late for TheMuso as well
[04:25] <TheMuso> hendrixski: No. Its actually the middle of the day where I am.
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[04:26] <ranf> hi
[04:26] <TheMuso> hendrixski: Linux uses what are known as runlevels. Different runlevels start and stop different programs, according to what has been set.
[04:27] <TheMuso> Basically, there are directories in /etc that hold symbolic links to the /etc/init.d scripts to start/stop them, depending on what runleve is chosen.
[04:27] <TheMuso> hendrixski: Have a look in /etc/rc2.d for example. Thats runlevel 2, and the links in there, point to what needs to be started.
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[04:27] <crimsun> TheMuso: I'm on 114277
[04:27] <TheMuso> In the future, at least for Ubuntu, this is all likely to chance hwever.
[04:28] <crimsun> and this wifi connection is horrible
[04:28] <hendrixski> TheMuso, I see a few rc# folder in /etc/   so each of those is a run level?
[04:28] <ranf> bug #114277
[04:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 114277 in kamefu "[Sync Request]  sync kamefu 0.1.1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114277
[04:29] <ajmitch> crimsun: so are there any merges left for us slow people to look at? 
[04:29] <crimsun> ajmitch: tons
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[04:30] <crimsun> ajmitch: I'm working from 150 backward (the last page of u-u-s subscribed bugs)
=== TheMuso goes on an lsr package update break.
[04:30] <jmg> groan
[04:32] <hendrixski> TheMuso, oooh, and there's a readme in each rc# folder ...
[04:32] <hendrixski> oh.... but they're all the same readme :-(
[04:33] <ScottK> hendrixski: Run levels is a topic that Google has a lot to say about, FYI.
[04:33] <hendrixski> ScottK, good call
=== hendrixski jots down a note to look up run levels
[04:35] <hendrixski> ScottK, sorry, didn't mean to spam with questions.  Just it's all so new and interesting.  :-)
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[04:35] <ScottK> hendrixski: Not a problem at all.  It was just a point of information.
[04:35] <ScottK> Run levels is something that's pretty common across Linux distros.
[04:37] <ScottK> hendrixski: If you are a Java person, then a good way to get started is find bugs reported against programs written in Java, figure out how to fix them, and then ask help here on packaging the fix.
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[04:38] <ranf> What do I do with this: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5131  File a sync bug and archive?
[04:39] <hendrixski> ScottK, Ok.  I can find those bugs reported in launchpad. right?  
[04:39] <ScottK> hendrixski: Yes.
[04:40] <ScottK> ranf: Don't think you need the sync bug.  Doesn't it arrive automagically?
=== hendrixski jots down another thing onto the TODO list
[04:40] <TheMuso> ScottK: If it doesn't have ubuntu in the version, yes it should.
[04:41] <ScottK> TheMuso: Thanks.
[04:41] <ranf> ScottK, if I knew I hadn't asked :-)
=== ScottK goes back to writing actual code.
=== hendrixski is overwhelmed, and goes to bed 
[04:42] <hendrixski> thanks ScottK and TheMuso 
[04:42] <ScottK> hendrixski: Digest it and come back for more.
[04:43] <hendrixski> ScottK, you bet I will 
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=== ScottK is overwhelmed and goes for more Scotch...
[04:44] <TheMuso> lol
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[04:49] <TheMuso> crimsun: Oh ok. I'll remember to mark as wishlist in the future.
=== persia suggests unsubscribing U-U-S from bugs that are not yet ready for upload.
[04:50] <TheMuso> persia: The bug author may not now this however, unless we explicitly tell them.
[04:50] <TheMuso> I'm not sure thats a good idea.
[04:52] <ScottK> Unless you are a member of the team, you can't unsubscribe the team.
[04:52] <ajmitch> I wonder if we can unsubscribe all those uus bugs that are fixed in ubuntu but not in debian
[04:53] <persia> TheMuso: Perhaps, but I've had a few where the patch was rejected as needing more work, or where someone other than the author excitedly subscribed people before it was ready, and non-UUS (as most UUS bug authors are) cannot unsubscribe.  Perhaps also changing the status field to "Needs Info", and adding a comment such as "Unbsubscribing U-U-S because <reason>.  Please resubscribe when UUS action is again required" would work?
[04:53] <TheMuso> bbl, lunch.
[04:53] <TheMuso> persia: I'd suggest to put it on the agenda of the next MOTU meeting.
[04:53] <TheMuso> anyways, lunch.
[04:53] <ajmitch> once we manage to have another meeting
[04:54] <persia> ajmitch: I think that is a very good idea.  It makes the UUS workflow a little easier, and the Debian status will update automaticalls as the BTS processes the bug.
[04:54] <ajmitch> and they just get in the way at the moment
[04:54] <persia> TheMuso: That's a good idea.  When I believe I can attend an upcoming MOTU meeting, I'll add that to the agenda.
=== ScottK ponders Python boolean logic....
=== ajmitch wonders how long it'll be before persia is MOTU (and ScottK, also)
[04:58] <jmg> i imagine not very long
[04:59] <ScottK> ajmitch: Thanks.  
[04:59] <ajmitch> still waiting for ScottK to apply
[04:59] <LaserJock> me too
=== ScottK will apply if MOTUs think he's ready.  
[05:00] <ajmitch> yay, I can unsubscribe u-u-s from a bunch of these bugs
[05:00] <ajmitch> though there are a few that have open ubuntu tasks
[05:01] <leonel> good night motus  got to go
[05:04] <nixternal> anyone know how to get an updated tarball into Debian? i.e., krename? I have uploaded the debian/ directory to pkg-kde debian svn already
[05:04] <ajmitch> nixternal: get a willing sponsor, generally someone from that team
[05:04] <nixternal> k, need to wait for them all to wake up then
[05:05] <ScottK> nixternal: mentors has worked well for me (with the Python Modules Team)
[05:05] <ScottK> nixternal: IME it server a purpose roughly equivalent to REVU here.
[05:06] <nixternal> ahh, OK, I will take a look at that then
[05:06] <persia> Does anyone happen to have any anecdotal knowledge about how the wxwidgets2.6-2.6.3.2.1 original source tarball was created?  Upstream has asked me to test the unicode GECOS against 2.6.4, and I'm having great difficulty.
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[05:07] <ScottK> ajmitch: PM?
[05:07] <crimsun> persia: Ron rolls tarballs as the spirit moves him.
[05:07] <ajmitch> ScottK: yes?
[05:08] <persia> crimsun: Ah.  I've been working with Vadim.  Perhaps I need to expand my upstream contacts :)  Thanks.
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[05:23] <nixternal> ok ScottK, uploaded to mentors ;)
[05:24] <ScottK> nixternal: With Debian Python Modules Team, I then mention it on their IRC channel and usually get an upload pretty quickly (that or the DD's argue about if my package is right for a while first).
[05:25] <nixternal> roger #debian-qt-kde it is then
[05:25] <ScottK> Most recently today in fact.
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[05:33] <ScottK> nixternal: After I got my first Python package accepted into Debian via the Python Modules Team, I wrote: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian/PythonModulesTeam and linked it from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian.  You might want to consider something similar for hte qt-kde team after you are finished...
[05:33] <ScottK> hte/the
[05:34] <nixternal> oh rock on, most definitely
[05:34] <nixternal> except the 2nd wiki link is broke ;)
[05:37] <ScottK> hmmm
[05:38] <ScottK> nixternal: Check and see if your IRC client attached the period at the end of the sentence to the link.  It works here.
[05:38] <nixternal> it did
[05:38] <nixternal> I was just pokin' fun at ya
[05:38] <ScottK> OK
[05:39] <nixternal> gotta love irssi
[05:39] <ScottK> Or not.
[05:39] <nixternal> it will grab everything, mixed with yakuake
[05:39] <ajmitch> blame your terminal
[05:39] <crimsun> it's really because Rich is using Vista.
[05:39] <ajmitch> gnome-terminal sensibly stripped the . 
[05:39] <ajmitch> ah, a traitor
[05:40] <ScottK> Konversation strips it just fine too.
[05:41] <nixternal> damn you crimsun!
=== nixternal screenshots to prove you wrong!
[05:41] <nixternal> muhehehe
[05:41] <nixternal> Host 'heavymetal', running Linux 2.6.20-15-server - Cpu0: Pentium III 797 MHz; Up: 4d+10:11; Users: 1; Load: 0.00; Free: [Mem: 7/376 Mio]  [Swap: 831/831 Mio]  [/: 15300/18415 Mio] ; Vpenis: 27.2 cm;
[05:42] <nixternal> well, that doesn't mean anything seeing as I am ssh'd into my server, could be using putty on vista
[05:42] <ajmitch> with a hostname like that, he must be a jono fanboy
[05:42] <nixternal> hahaha
[05:42] <nixternal> that is a Sammy Hagar song
[05:42] <nixternal> all of my computers are named after a Sammy Hagar song
[05:42] <ajmitch> I'm surprised they let jono through airport security, being so metal
[05:43] <nixternal> CaboWabo, HeavyMetal, MasTequila, and ShakaDoobie
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[05:55] <ScottK> Good night all.
[05:56] <persia> good night ScottK
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[08:07] <persia> Blah!  A client called, and now I can't attend the CC to become a member :(
[08:08] <StevenK> persia: Reschedule the client. :-P
[08:10] <persia> StevenK: Unfortunately, I'm between engagements right now (which is why I have time here), and so should really take the meeting, given that it will result in 100-150 hours of work.
[08:12] <StevenK> persia: Wonderful. :-/
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[08:13] <persia> StevenK: Yeah.  I had hoped to have all of May free, and only needed one more day...
[08:13] <cjsoftuk_> Anyone here know much about debugging ncpfs' kernel module?
[08:13] <persia> Oh well, next council meeting is in two weeks :)
[08:14] <cjsoftuk_> Or am I in the wrong place.
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[08:31] <jmg> w00000t! my shipits arrived
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=== Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
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=== Topic for #ubuntu-motu: Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Universe/Multiverse Repository Maintainers | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | Add yourself to http://tinyurl.com/fgpgy to upload to REVU | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO | Let's merge! http://dad.dunnewind.net/universe.php | Want to join MOTU? Try helping out on these: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/+mentoring | Ubuntu Development Summit
=== Topic (#ubuntu-motu): set by Adri2000 at Tue May  8 18:09:35 2007
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[08:41] <ajmitch> jmg: congrats, send some down to me
[08:42] <jmg> ajmitch: i only have 3
[08:42] <ajmitch> no point me asking then
[08:43] <ajmitch> since I've got 2 
=== StevenK is waiting for his CDs.
=== ajmitch hasn't ordered from shipit yet
[08:46] <ranf> Is there some sort of "collectors box"? I only have 4.10 and 5.10. I'd like all ever released.
[08:47] <Flannel> ranf: http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/
[08:47] <Flannel> Oh, you mean the shipit ones
=== minghua would like to get a "collector's box" as well :-)
[08:48] <ranf> Flannel, yes
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[08:48] <StevenK> I have at least one CD from each release since 5.10. But I'm still waiting for 7.04
[08:48] <persia> Are the shipit CDs silkscreened?  If so, does anyone know where to find the images?
[08:49] <dholbach> good morning
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[08:49] <StevenK> persia: How do you tell? :-)
[08:50] <persia> StevenK: Is the CD a dull metallic color, or is there more variation, producing an apparent image?
[08:51] <StevenK> persia: It's a bright red with a white section.
[08:51] <ajmitch> dholbach!\
[08:51] <dholbach> hey ajmitch
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[08:51] <ajmitch> how's it going?
[08:51] <dholbach> good good - how are you?
[08:52] <ajmitch> alright, still slightly tired :)
[08:52] <StevenK> persia: http://www.flickr.com/photos/maciak/187634641/
[08:52] <dholbach> me too
[08:52] <persia> StevenK: Then either it's silkscreened, or printed using another system.  Is the image for the red and white pattern available somewhere?
[08:52] <persia> StevenK: Thanks.
=== ajmitch is just heading out to get some dinner now
[08:53] <StevenK> ajmitch: How were your flights?
[08:53] <ajmitch> long
[08:53] <ajmitch> boring
[08:53] <StevenK> Heh
=== ajmitch hungry, back in 30 min
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[09:04] <dholbach> persia: it will not be necessary for you to attend a CC meeting to become a member. I just informed the TB of the MC's decision - once you're in ubuntu-dev you'll be a ubuntumember as well
[09:04] <StevenK> I think I like this new process better.
=== StevenK had to become a member, contribute more, and then apply for -dev.
[09:05] <dholbach> can somebody explain me, what we had the motumergers team for and if it is still needed?
[09:06] <StevenK> dholbach: I can't even recall one.
[09:06] <dholbach> ok
[09:07] <crimsun> dholbach: obviated by ubuntu-universe-sponsors.
[09:07] <dholbach> I'll ask the launchpad-eros to get it removed
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[09:08] <persia> dholbach: Thanks!  That simplifies things :)
[09:08] <crimsun> luke and I have been squashing u-u-s tonight
[09:08] <dholbach> you guys are awesome
=== dholbach hugs crimsun and TheMuso
[09:08] <crimsun> nah, I just drink coffee and eat jelly beans
[09:08] <TheMuso> crimsun: Heh you've done mroe tha me. Got called away too many times.
[09:08] <TheMuso> Will probably do more later however.
[09:09] <dholbach> I think I'd pay a lot of beers at a conference of choice for somebody who cleans up the 'merging' documentation on the wiki
[09:09] <TheMuso> I am no doc writer, but I'll have a look.
[09:09] <dholbach> there's Merging, Merging-And-Syncing, there's MOTU/Merging and maybe some others I forgot
[09:10] <StevenK> But merging and syncing is not MOTU specific.
[09:11] <TheMuso> StevenK: Very true.
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[09:12] <dholbach> I removed myself from the MOTU/Mentors page
[09:12] <dholbach> I get new maily from hopefuls signing up for mentoring daily now
[09:13] <dholbach> mails
[09:13] <StevenK> dholbach: MOTU/Mentors should also be reorganized so that two or more people don't get swamped.
[09:13] <dholbach> yes
[09:13] <StevenK> I should probably attend the next MOTU meeting.
[09:13] <dholbach> we talked about that at UDS
[09:13] <StevenK> Yes, well. I wasn't there.
[09:13] <dholbach> I'll try to organize our thoughts and a write a process proposal
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[09:17] <StevenK> dholbach: Will you throw the proposal to the mailing list, or raise it at the next meeting?
[09:18] <dholbach> mailing list
[09:18] <dholbach> nobody replied on ma motu meeting post
[09:19] <persia> Just FYI, for anyone interested, the current plan is for Lenny to ship with wxwidgets2.8, but neither wxwindows2.4 nor wxwidgets2.6.
[09:20] <StevenK> Good.
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[09:24] <BugMaN> hi all
[09:24] <crimsun> persia: did anyone upload 111832?
=== persia looks
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[09:26] <persia> crimsun: Not the newest revision.
[09:26] <persia> s/est rev/est SRU rev/
[09:26] <crimsun> ok.
[09:28] <lionel> StevenK: thanks you rock :)
[09:28] <StevenK> lionel: No problem. :-)
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[09:33] <persia> crimsun: Thank you.
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[09:43] <jekil> hello
[09:44] <crimsun> persia: are there other issues with http://librarian.launchpad.net/7591902/M35375.wx26.debdiff ?
[09:46] <persia> crimsun: Aside from the fact that I should know better than to use vi to create patches :)  Not really.  I'm corresponding with Ron and Vadim about it, but it works for me, and definitely fixes the problem.  There's no ABI change, and roughtly the same patch has been in Ubuntu 2.8 for a few months (incuding the 7.04 release) without reports of significant breakage.
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=== persia creates a patch with patch and attaches it to the bug.
[09:48] <StevenK> persia: Hopefully, you create one with diff?
[09:48] <crimsun> nah, persia's hardcore.
[09:49] <crimsun> I think that's why MC said yay to the application.
[09:49] <crimsun> ;)
[09:49] <StevenK> Heh
[09:49] <persia> StevenK: Ah, right, but patch -r can be fun.  In this case, I think I7ll even use debdiff, just to save the effort.
[09:53] <StevenK> lionel: libapache-mod-jk has built on everything bar ia64.
[09:54] <lionel> hum... strange
[09:54] <StevenK> lionel: Where ia64 is pending, not failed. :-)
[09:54] <lionel> ah
[09:54] <lionel> it built last time on ia64
[09:54] <lionel> it is building now
[09:55] <StevenK> Ah, yes.
[09:55] <TheMuso> persia: It will be great to have you with us.
[09:56] <persia> TheMuso: Thanks.
=== StevenK is reminded of, "Join us" a'la zombies.
=== TheMuso also believes ScottK is more than ready for MOTU/
=== ajmitch isn't ready for MOTU at the moment
[09:56] <StevenK> TheMuso: What about me, am I ready? :-P
[09:56] <TheMuso> ajmitch: Lies!
[09:57] <ajmitch> TheMuso: I may make some interesting mistakes on packages today
[09:57] <crimsun> I don't think I'm ready either, and my membership expires in three days!
[09:57] <StevenK> Hah
[09:57] <TheMuso> Well since the two gods of MOTU aren't ready, I'm not ready. :p
[09:57] <TheMuso> Or should I say the three gods of MOTU.
[09:57] <ajmitch> crimsun: your core-dev membership doesn't though
[09:58] <ajmitch> so you'll be only uploading to main :)
[09:58] <StevenK> -core-dev is a member of -dev.
=== ajmitch knows that
[09:59] <persia> crimsun: Patch up.  By the way, this one doesn't apply cleanly either.  Something about it being a native package, I think.
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[10:01] <StevenK> Hurrah, it built everywhere.
[10:01] <lionel> \o/
[10:01] <TheMuso> bbl dinner
[10:01] <StevenK> Therefore, I win.
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=== persia congratulates StevenK on another successful game of buildd.
[10:03] <crimsun> neat.  I think we just bludgeoned through the u-u-s merge/sync queue.
[10:04] <ajmitch> crimsun: impressive
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[10:06] <persia> Wow!  Now it's just bugfixes, pending builds/syncs, and Debian.
[10:08] <ajmitch> only a few of the debian ones are fixed in ubuntu
=== ajmitch got rid of a couple of those earlier
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[10:09] <Hobbsee> congratulations, persia!
=== Treenaks wants a newerer kernel, so powertop does usefull things
[10:10] <Treenaks> -l
[10:11] <persia> Hobbsee: Thanks, but it's early yet.  I have to wait for TB to become drunk with power and upload everything to meet my selfish goals.
[10:12] <crimsun> Treenaks: well, Amit is aboard (kinda), which will be very useful for that.
[10:12] <Treenaks> crimsun: cool :)
[10:12] <Hobbsee> persia: hehe
[10:12] <crimsun> persia's taking over, since my membership is expiring  :)
[10:13] <Hobbsee> hah
[10:13] <Hobbsee> dream on, crimsun 
[10:13] <persia> crimsun: I can't do that.  I don't understand ALSA.
[10:13] <crimsun> that's ok, no one really does
[10:13] <crimsun> oh, right.  Need to send those upstream.
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[10:21] <geser> persia: I'd guess that the aqsis build failures are another incarnation of bug #87077 as it builds fine on a pbuilder (and xmms2 uses also scons)
[10:21] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 87077 in launchpad-buildd "The build of xmms2 fails because of HASH(0x82db558)="" in the environment" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/87077
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[10:23] <persia> geser: Thanks for the pointer.  I'll watch that too.  I've had no problems with aqsis locally, and upstream has been pestering me to move to 1.2.0, so I'd be glad to find a solution.
[10:24] <geser> persia: that's only a guess, you would need to upload a version which tells you why it fails (debugging on the buildds)
[10:25] <geser> I'm waiting on infinity to fix this bug
[10:26] <persia> geser: I'll wait until next week to upload the next version :)  I was thinking of just forcing TRUE for scons TIFF search, as the Build-Depends guarantees it, if all else fails.
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[10:28] <Tonio_> hey
[10:33] <crimsun> hullo.
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[10:33] <persia> Does anyone use eCos?  Any opinions on using a CVS snapshot vs. a three year old release?
[10:34] <crimsun> it's the beginning of the devel cycle.  Churn is expected.  Live dangerously!
[10:34] <ajmitch> the issues just come when you're using that same cvs snapshot at release time
[10:35] <crimsun> it would be wise, I think, to correspond with upstream about an ETA for the next stable release.
[10:35] <persia> crimsun: Right.  OK.  Somehow I have the feeling that my wx24 odyssey will end up with me maintaining CVS snapshots of several orphaned packages...
[10:37] <persia> ajmitch: Anything that still depends on wx2.4 is generally not very active upstream.  I don't anticipate any releases prior to gutsy, even if all my patches are accepted upstream.  freqtweak hasn't seen deevlopment activity for a couple years, eCos tracks moving embedded targets, and releases aren't really that useful, and survex has been aorking ont he next version for a while, with progress, but not dates or anything.
[10:37] <ajmitch> persia: wx2.4? ugh, get rid of it :)
[10:38] <persia> ajmitch: That's the idea.  nixternal and I have been working on it.  There are still two packages unclaimed.  Want one?
[10:38] <ajmitch> which ones?
=== ajmitch bets that one of them is already mine
[10:38] <persia> ajmitch: newpki-client and ctsim.
[10:38] <ajmitch> hm
[10:39] <ajmitch> I *know* there are other packages using wx2.4
[10:39] <persia> ajmitch: About which one were you thinking?  I may have already claimed it.
[10:39] <ajmitch> gnue-designer & gnue-forms
[10:39] <ajmitch> g-d has known problems with wx 2.6 still
[10:40] <persia> ajmitch: Ah.  I appear to have missed all the python-wxgtk2.4 dependencies when making my list.  Perhaps it's not as short as I thought.
[10:40] <ajmitch> there are few
[10:41] <ajmitch> I'm going to strip down & recreate the gnue-* packaging this week anyway
[10:42] <persia> ajmitch: Looks like three of them to me: if you take care of gnue-*, that only leaves openrpg (assuming that meta-ul-foo isn't really that relevant at this point).  I'll add them to my tracking page.
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[10:46] <geser> persia: meta-ul is only a meta-package which needs only the deps updated
[10:46] <persia> Now that three people are working on the wx2.4 elimination effort, could someone with wiki skills suggest how I could move the tracking page from my private namespace to the MOTU namespace cleanly?
[10:46] <ajmitch> rename the page?
=== ajmitch doesn't do much wiki magic
[10:47] <persia> geser: UnitedLinux hasn't released anything since 2003.  I don't think we can update the depends in good faith, as it will no longer represent UL properly.  I'm tempted to drop, although I'll probably wait until they reach unmetdeps.
[10:48] <ajmitch> unitedlinux is a bit of a joke, I think
[10:49] <geser> persia: the deps have been updated in the past already to resolve some unmet deps, one change more won't make a difference :)
[10:50] <persia> geser: I guess.  I'm more tempted to drop old packages than to keep them around, unless they are useful to someone.
[10:50] <persia> ajmitch: Renaming appears to have done the trick.  Thanks.
[10:51] <geser> I also thought about to request the removal of meta-ul
[10:51] <Hobbsee> geser: the more packages you remove, the less bugs.
[10:51] <Hobbsee> this is good.
[10:52] <Treenaks> Hobbsee: less is more ;_)
[10:52] <Hobbsee> heh
[10:52] <persia> geser: They appear to currently be your packages.  I'd concur if you wanted to drop, but I won't stop you from keeping them updated if you really want :)
[10:53] <dholbach> is DaD fixed now?
[10:53] <dholbach> are people still using it?
[10:53] <dholbach> does it still spit out 0 line diffs?
[10:55] <persia> I like DaD's comment feature - it's really good for encouraging / blocking MOTU-Hopefuls, but have never used the internals - they didn't seem right for the packages I merged.
[10:56] <dholbach> HRM
[10:56] <dholbach> I'm really unhappy about this
[10:56] <persia> Hobbsee: Whatever happened to MOTU/Transitions?
[10:56] <Hobbsee> persia: it got deleted.
[10:56] <Hobbsee> persia: were we still using it?
[10:56] <dholbach> I'll mail ubuntu-motu about it
[10:56] <persia> Hobbsee: Why?  Where are we supposed to track transitions?
[10:56] <Hobbsee> didnt know that we actually were.  come to think of it, there's another wiki page somewhere that does too.
[10:57] <Hobbsee> no idea where it is, though
[10:57] <Hobbsee> persia: based on the fact that it was out of date, and hadnt been modified in a while, i thought we werent using it
[10:57] <persia> I liked that page, as it 1) listed easy stuff to work on, and 2) helped keep track of initiatives.  There hasn't been as many transitions lately as there were in the past, but I'd like to link to MOTU/wx24.Transitin from there.
[10:58] <Hobbsee> you can probably resurrect it, and link to it from the main page, if you like
[10:58] <persia> s/wx2.4Transitin/wx2.4Migration/
[10:58] <ajmitch> or link to it from MOTU/TODO
[10:59] <persia> ajmitch: That's probably a better place, as it consolidates everything, not just transitions.  Thanks.
[10:59] <tepsipakki> has anyone seen Mez lately?
[10:59] <tepsipakki> hi, btw
[11:00] <ajmitch> hey tepsipakki 
[11:00] <tepsipakki> hey ajmitch 
[11:00] <ajmitch> tepsipakki: he was online a few days ago
[11:00] <tepsipakki> ok, I asked him aboud iFolder
[11:00] <tepsipakki> about
[11:00] <tepsipakki> by mail
[11:01] <tepsipakki> it needs packaging and he has done something about it (and owns ifolder-dev team)
[11:01] <ajmitch> yes, and popey has even started looking at it recently
[11:01] <tepsipakki> cool
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[11:03] <tepsipakki> novell released 3.6 some time ago, but so far no source available other than opensuse srpm's
[11:04] <ajmitch> not unusual
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[11:06] <popey> i noted a link pop up recently where someone else had packaged it
[11:07] <popey> but not for feisty
[11:07] <tepsipakki> popey: you mean the blog entry?
[11:07] <popey> I think it was on the planet
[11:07] <popey> yes
[11:07] <tepsipakki> yeah, it was for dapper
[11:07] <popey> ahh
[11:07] <popey> old
[11:07] <tepsipakki> and no source for it
[11:07] <popey> boo
[11:08] <ajmitch> aha, popey lives
[11:08] <Treenaks> ish
[11:08] <ajmitch> so we should expect packages from him Real Soon Now
[11:08] <Hobbsee> hehe, ish
=== TheMuso returns.
[11:12] <Hobbsee> yay, TheMuso!
[11:12] <TheMuso> Evening Hobbsee.
[11:12] <ajmitch> TheMuso lives also!
=== Hobbsee doesnt live
=== Hobbsee is just a ghost
[11:12] <popey> erk
=== TheMuso ponders... Work on Ubuntu stuff, or other projects...
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[11:13] <ajmitch> ubuntu
[11:13] <ajmitch> popey: we have faith in you
[11:13] <popey> fool
[11:13] <popey> mad fool
[11:13] <ajmitch> obviously
[11:13] <popey> :)
[11:13] <tepsipakki> popey: have you looked at packaging ifolder et al yet?
=== ajmitch was foolish enough to fly halfway round the world to spend time with people like you & jono
[11:14] <Hobbsee> same here
[11:14] <Hobbsee> that makes us major fools.
[11:14] <popey> a bit yes tepsipakki 
[11:14] <TheMuso> meh ubuntu it is.
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[11:14] <TheMuso> I need it to be first thing in the morning for one of my other projects.
[11:15] <Hobbsee> hehe
[11:15] <TheMuso> Now... Where to start... :p
[11:15] <Hobbsee> just dont sleep
[11:15] <Hobbsee> merges.
[11:15] <TheMuso> .c
[11:15] <TheMuso> Actually, I'd better take care of a new espeak package, before I do any univese.
[11:15] <TheMuso> universe
[11:18] <tepsipakki> popey: how about we join the ifolder-dev team, and you put the packaging work as a bzr branch there? I'll take a look at it once I have more time (in a week or so)
[11:21] <popey> sure, i will poke mez when i see him
[11:21] <tepsipakki> nice
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[11:39] <StevenK> TheMuso: Do you need a sponsor?
[11:39] <TheMuso> StevenK: Not ready yet. Still testing stuff, and consulting with upstream about some stuff.
[11:40] <TheMuso> StevenK: Thanks anyway. I'll just subscribe ums when I report the bug.
[11:41] <StevenK> Sounds good to me.
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[11:47] <Lutin> dholbach: we're currently tsting the fix for the 0ubuntuX thing :)
[11:48] <dholbach> Lutin: it'd be nice if you would have announced that somewhere
[11:48] <dholbach> Lutin: people were uploading broken packages or are asking syncs that are not appropriate
[11:48] <Lutin> dholbach: yeah :/. hopefully it should be fixed very soon
[11:49] <dholbach> please announce it widely, so people can get working on fixing their wrong uploads
[11:49] <dholbach> up until now I don't see an effort being made to fix them
[11:50] <Lutin> dholbach: are there many of those packages that have been sync-requested ?
[11:50] <dholbach> nobody knows
[11:50] <dholbach> but 6 of my packages were overwritten
[11:50] <dholbach> I can deal with that
[11:50] <dholbach> but nobody knows how many broken packages we now have in the archive
[11:52] <Lutin> ouch
[11:53] <tepsipakki> re: xmms, doesn't audacious cover all the cases where xmms is useful?
[11:54] <tepsipakki> it's a fork of bmp (which has changed completely since 0.9x)
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[12:07] <\sh> <Enverex> \sh, No, it's just the "shitstain" theme of Ubuntu is bad enough. Wine also shouldn't be altered before being distributed.
[12:07] <\sh> *rotfl*
[12:08] <Loic> hi
[12:08] <Loic> imbrandon, any news about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xvidcore/+bug/84705 ?
[12:08] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 84705 in xvidcore "[Feisty]  libxvidcore missing dependency for yasm for i386 arch : more than 3 times slower than in edgy" [Medium,Fix committed]  
[12:11] <Hobbsee> crimsun: you know, with persia being a MOTU, we can retire from u-u-s
[12:11] <Hobbsee> :P
[12:12] <StevenK> Sounds about right.
[12:13] <TheMuso> Slackers!!!
[12:13] <Hobbsee> yep, we are.
[12:13] <StevenK> TheMuso: The question is, what are you going to do about it? :-P
[12:13] <TheMuso> StevenK: Keep on working on the team.
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[12:30] <dothebart> raphink: i've uploaded citadel and libical packages to revu, but they didn't show up in the list so far...
[12:31] <raphink> let me see
[12:31] <dothebart> plus i wasn't able to do the lost pastword trick yet...
[12:32] <dothebart> it was around 23 o clock mesz yesterday.
[12:32] <raphink> did you add yourself to the ubuntu-universe-contributors gruop?
[12:33] <dothebart> i've added myself to the group described on the wiki last week..
[12:33] <raphink> hmm I don't see you there
[12:34] <raphink> oh yes you are here
[12:34] <raphink> your GPG key is not on LP though
[12:34] <raphink> you ahve to add it to your account
[12:34] <Adri2000> dholbach: I've just replied to your email, I understand that it caused troubles if packages have been overwritten, but IMO "people" who requested/acked theses syncs or uploaded broken merges should be more careful. as I wrote on the mail, DaD creates an empty ubuntu diff for the 0ubuntuX only packages, I guess a MOTU should understand that it's broken.
[12:35] <dothebart> hm, i thought i had...
[12:35] <dothebart> i did that gpg upload to the key server.
[12:35] <raphink> that's not enough
[12:35] <raphink> you have to add your key to your LP account
[12:35] <dothebart> hm, ok.
[12:36] <raphink> https://launchpad.net/~w-goesgens/+editpgpkeys
[12:36] <raphink> here
[12:37] <raphink> once you have done that, I'll have to resync the keyring
[12:37] <raphink> I'll do that when I'm back from lunch 
[12:37] <raphink> ;)
[12:37] <dothebart> hm, i don't have the data over here at work...
[12:38] <dothebart> i think i will do that this evening then.
[12:38] <dothebart> though i wasn't able to find any of you after work online ;)
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[12:42] <raphink> dothebart: ok
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[12:47] <Hobbsee> Adri2000: was it documented that it was broken?
[12:47] <Hobbsee> and do we have a list fo MOTU's who ack'd these syncs, to go and yell at?
[12:48] <StevenK> I can recall two, of the top of my head.
[12:48] <StevenK> One involved jokosher.
[12:48] <Hobbsee> i meant the people
[12:48] <StevenK> Yes, so I'm looking up the bug now.
[12:48] <Adri2000> Hobbsee: it's been mentioned here many times, and there is bug #113688
[12:48] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 113688 in dad "0ubuntuX only in the changelog -> broken" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113688
[12:49] <Hobbsee> Adri2000: whicih is no good unless you actually follow DAD development, of course
[12:49] <Hobbsee> Adri2000: would have expected the url of that bug to be posted to the motu ML, once you'd found it
[12:49] <ajmitch> there should be a big <blink> saying "don't use this"
=== StevenK concurs with ajmitch
[12:50] <ajmitch> http://jonobaconfanclub.co.uk/ <-- good use of <blink>
[12:50] <StevenK> Hobbsee: The person in question for jokosher is geser.
[12:50] <Fujitsu> There's no such thing as a good use of <blink>
[12:50] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: sure there is
[12:50] <Treenaks> Fujitsu: there is.
[12:50] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Bug 112574
[12:50] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 112574 in jokosher "Please sync jokosher 0.2-1.1 from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112574
[12:50] <Fujitsu> Nice photo, thought.
[12:50] <Treenaks> popey needs to update that page a bit though
[12:51] <ajmitch> Treenaks: agreed
[12:51] <popey> :)
[12:51] <Treenaks> install wordpress, upload loads of compromising jonopics
=== Fujitsu has personally always checked all of the diffs generated by MoM/DaD, but I guess others don't.
[12:52] <StevenK> I also do.
[12:52] <Hobbsee> maybe i'm missing something here, but if you discover a major bug in a tool that people are using, it's your responsibilty to fix it, and immediately notify the most suitable mailing lists, etc, that it's broken.
[12:52] <Hobbsee> (if you're the upstream author)
[12:52] <joejaxx> ajmitch: that was hilarious
[12:52] <Hobbsee> and saying "people should be more careful" doesnt cut it.
[12:52] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Sensible.
[12:53] <Hobbsee> also, only putting it on irc doesnt cut it either - many people arent watching, particularly if they're at UDS or whatever
[12:53] <Hobbsee> irc is *not* a good way to get announcements out to everyone.
[12:53] <joejaxx> mailling lists?
[12:53] <Hobbsee> joejaxx: motu mailing list would have been a good choice
[12:53] <Hobbsee> also ubuntu-devel, ubuntu-devel-discuss
[12:54] <Hobbsee> seeing as the original project had been announced on there.
[12:58] <Lutin> Fujitsu mentionned it on the list iirc
[12:59] <Fujitsu> Lutin: I'm not sure I actually ended up sending that to the list :(
[12:59] <joejaxx> does anyone know the color scheme on MoM?
[12:59] <Hobbsee> joejaxx: it's by importance
[12:59] <joejaxx> Hobbsee: ah ok thanks
[12:59] <Hobbsee> got no idea hwo they deduce that, though
[01:00] <Hobbsee> Fujitsu: i'm not sure i saw it, eitehr
[01:01] <Lutin> Fujitsu: eek right, that was a private mail. sigh
[01:01] <StevenK> I can't recall seeing anything about it.
[01:01] <Fujitsu> Lutin: Yeah, sorry.
[01:01] <Lutin> Fujitsu: np. I should have been more careful
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[01:20] <geser> Hobbsee: importance as in Section: field in control
[01:21] <StevenK> Hrm. I didn't think MoM was ordered by Section.
[01:22] <ajmitch> night all
[01:22] <Fujitsu> Night ajmitch.
[01:22] <pochu> good night
[01:26] <geser> Fujitsu: I check usually (especially now) the diffs generated by MoM/DaD before ACKing a sync, but I don't remember anymore if MoM was already uptodate when I ACKed the jokosher sync
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[01:27] <Hobbsee> geser: ahh
[01:28] <geser> Hobbsee, StevenK: got the wrong field: it's Priority
[01:28] <geser> not Section
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[01:30] <StevenK> geser: But why not check yourself? I check *every* sync or merge I rubber stamp because I want to be sure that we don't lose changes that have been made for a reason.
[01:33] <geser> I guess I got used to the useable patch files generated by MoM
[01:34] <geser> and only check the (broken) patch file generated by DaD which contained only changelog delta :(
[01:34] <StevenK> Enough that you only rely on it?
[01:34] <geser> not anymore
[01:34] <StevenK> Even spending two minutes reading interdiff output from Debian and Ubuntu would have shown you the sync request was a Bad Idea.
[01:35] <StevenK> gunzip the two diff.gz's, and interdiff them.
[01:35] <geser> I now check the debdiff between the Ubuntu package and the to by synced Debian package
[01:37] <geser> for syncs
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[01:38] <geser> are the patches from patches.ubuntu.com reliable?
[01:38] <StevenK> I daresay yes.
[01:38] <geser> I use them to compare debdiffs for merges (and also check the new changelog entry) if nothing got lost
[01:39] <StevenK> Sure, but unless you certain they are being updated, don't rely on them.
[01:39] <StevenK> s/you/you're/
[01:40] <geser> I use them only to see the current Ubuntu delta
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[01:41] <geser> or is there a better place to see what exactly was changed in the Ubuntu package?
[01:42] <Hobbsee> patches.ubuntu.com seems ogod
[01:42] <Hobbsee> *good
[01:42] <Hobbsee> as that's what's being sent to debian too
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[01:43] <geser> I use the Debian PTS to get the link for the delta
[01:47] <joejaxx> Good Morning motu
=== joejaxx forgot to say that
[01:48] <Hobbsee> hiya joejaxx :P
[01:48] <joejaxx> :P
[01:49] <joejaxx> i really need to stop naming directories in my home folder random things
[01:49] <joejaxx> example: asdfblah
[01:49] <lucas> joejaxx: use /tmp
[01:49] <Hobbsee> hehe
[01:49] <joejaxx> lucas: the sad thing is they are not tmp files 
=== Hobbsee uses /devel/current
[01:50] <joejaxx> they are actually files i need
=== Treenaks always has loads of 'blah.txt' files everywhere
[01:50] <joejaxx> Hobbsee: i should probably do something like that
[01:51] <Treenaks> sometimes with useful stuff in them :)
[01:51] <Hobbsee> joejaxx: which i automatically rm -rf * :P
[01:51] <joejaxx> Hobbsee: :P
[01:52] <joejaxx> the only thing i have on / that is not standard is cdibuildder
=== Hobbsee has /pbuilder and /devel
[01:53] <joejaxx> other than that everything is either is /usr/src or ~/randomlynameddirectorythatiknowwhatitius
[01:53] <joejaxx> s/ius/is/g
[01:53] <Hobbsee> hehe
[01:54] <geser> ah, you hash the real dir name?
[01:55] <joejaxx> well not in the sense of a algorithmic hash
[01:55] <joejaxx> but asdfblah is my svn stuff
[01:55] <joejaxx> blahblah1 is a chroot of edgy
[01:55] <joejaxx> things like that lol
[01:56] <joejaxx> i guess cryptic names
[01:57] <joejaxx> build is where xserver automatically downloads and builds itself
[01:57] <joejaxx> merges is surprisingly merges
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[01:59] <dholbach> Adri2000: of course they should be more careful
[01:59] <dholbach> Adri2000: I wasn't blaming you
[02:01] <Lutin> dholbach: we can't deny we have a responsability in all that crap though
[02:01] <dholbach> sure, that's why it would have been nice to have an announce about that
[02:01] <dholbach> so people can take care of reverting those changes
[02:02] <Fujitsu> Lutin: The point of having MoM not automagically uploading things is so that people check that everything is sane. Your responsibility is very limited.
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[02:04] <ScottK> Good morning all.
[02:04] <joejaxx> Good Morning ScottK 
[02:05] <Hobbsee> hi ScottK 
[02:06] <geser> Hi ScottK
[02:06] <Fujitsu> Hi ScottK.
[02:06] <pochu> heya ScottK 
[02:07] <Lutin> Fujitsu: yep, but as dholbach pointed out, we should have annouced that this particular point was buggy
[02:07] <ScottK> IIRC it was discussed here (I was certainly aware of the problem).
[02:07] <Fujitsu> Probably, but then that's partly my fault.
[02:08] <Lutin> Fujitsu: no
[02:10] <bluekuja> dholbach: I mean new upstream releases that needs packaging
[02:10] <dholbach> bluekuja: so if you want to start a torrent team that takes care of all the bittorrent related packages, I think that's cool
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[02:10] <dholbach> and I'm sure you'd find a bunch of testers and helpers
[02:10] <dholbach> bluekuja: ah... ok - I don't know
[02:11] <bluekuja> dholbach, I'll take a look around for them :)
[02:11] <dholbach> bluekuja: I didn't touch any bittorrent related packages in a while
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[02:11] <xxxxx1> morning!
[02:11] <bluekuja> dholbach, do you have some suggestions to start this project?
[02:12] <dholbach> bluekuja: start a team in LP, write a wiki page about your plans, make the team bug contact for the packages you want to take care of and announce it on the lists
[02:12] <dholbach> from there start to work closely with upstreams
[02:12] <dholbach> and all will be good :)
[02:13] <bluekuja> dholbach: great ! 
[02:13] <bluekuja> dholbach, gonna start it now :)
[02:13] <dholbach> excellent :)
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[02:14] <bluekuja> dholbach, thanks for your help, its really appreciated
[02:14] <dholbach> no problem
[02:14] <dholbach> :-)
[02:14] <bluekuja> ;)
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[02:21] <DarkSun88> Hi
[02:21] <joejaxx> hello
[02:22] <pochu> hi DarkSun88 
[02:23] <DarkSun88> pochu joejaxx : Hi :)
[02:23] <joejaxx> :)
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[02:29] <Lutin> dholbach: fix commited, the issue should be fixed on the next update, starting at 16:00 +0200
[02:29] <dholbach> Lutin: thanks for your work on that
[02:29] <pochu> Lutin: rock on :)
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[02:31] <Lutin> main will wait a bit longer, anyways no one uses it
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[02:43] <siretart> is one month an acceptable timeframe for waiting a submitter to report back from a question, or shall I wait longer?
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[02:46] <joejaxx> siretart: that sounds acceptable
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[02:49] <elkbuntu> w00t, photos flickr-ised
[02:49] <Treenaks> elkbuntu: link?
[02:50] <StevenK> elkbuntu: Share/Blog ?
[02:51] <gpocentek> siretart: did we find a agreement about REVU "mass removal"?
[02:51] <gpocentek> s/a /an /
[02:52] <Hobbsee> gpocentek: remove after 1 year or 6 months - dont remember which
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[02:53] <gpocentek> ok
[02:53] <geser> StevenK: have you some time to sponsor a gnupg2 merge?
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[02:54] <siretart> gpocentek: I didn't hear about it yet, currently I think I'll just 'auto archive' everything older than, let's say, 2 months?
[02:55] <Hobbsee> siretart: depends how long there is between new package freeze and release
[02:55] <Hobbsee> siretart: id' say auto archive anything not touched in 6 months, delete after 12
=== Hobbsee shrugs
[02:55] <StevenK> geser: Maybe. Do you feel lucky? :-P
[02:55] <siretart> Hobbsee: sounds good to me as well
[02:56] <StevenK> ScottK: Not confused any more?
[02:56] <geser> StevenK: I've a good feeling about it. bug #114794
[02:56] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 114794 in gnupg2 "[Merge]  Merge gnupg2 2.0.4-1ubuntu1" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114794
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[02:57] <StevenK> Ah. gnupg2's source being in main.
[02:57] <ScottK> StevenK: No, discovered my service provider switched my DNS servers without bothering to mention it to me...
[02:57] <StevenK> ScottK: Hah. Nice of them.
[02:57] <StevenK> geser: Shouldn't I just request and ack a sync?
=== StevenK smirks evilly.
[02:58] <gpocentek> siretart: I'm fine with 2 months for auto-archiving, and I'm really really in favour of nucking packages older than 6 months
[02:58] <gpocentek> REVU is currently a mess because uploaders don't update their packages IMO
[02:58] <geser> StevenK: I've learned my lesson with those bad syncs.
[02:59] <siretart> gpocentek: so do I, but as 'nukeing' means 'removing without any change to restore them', I'm hesitating a bit
[02:59] <elkbuntu> Treenaks, StevenK http://www.flickr.com/photos/8294638@N02/
[02:59] <StevenK> geser: That remains to be seen, but we'll see.
[02:59] <StevenK> elkbuntu: Thanks!
[03:00] <gpocentek> siretart: but what can we do? I've sent a mail a while ago to ask uploaders an update of their package for gutsy, only a few did it
[03:00] <gpocentek> (mail on the MOTU ml)
[03:01] <Hobbsee> gpocentek: siretart if we removed all packages older than 12 months, how many does that leave us with?
[03:01] <gpocentek> too many :p
[03:01] <siretart> gpocentek: could you please mail ubuntu-motu@ with your proposal (2 months auto-archive, 6 month autonuke), and let people discuss it, let's say, a week or so?
[03:01] <Hobbsee> well, yes, but i'm wondering how many
[03:02] <siretart> Hobbsee: still more than we can review :/
[03:02] <gpocentek> siretart: sure
[03:02] <Hobbsee> siretart: of course, yes, but hwo many?
[03:02] <Hobbsee> compared to hwo many we have now
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[03:02] <Hobbsee> i wonder how many people would be inactive for 6 months, for wahtever reason, then come back to doing what they're doing
[03:02] <siretart> Hobbsee: I would need to do some statistics about that. if you're interested and familar with SQL, you could just query the postgres on tiber
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[03:03] <Hobbsee> my concern is for people who decide to take a release off, due to overwork
[03:03] <Hobbsee> although that doesnt seem to happen as much for non motu's
[03:03] <siretart> Hobbsee: if they come back to live, I think they'll surely have a backup of their work and ready to just reupload them. REVU is meant as an reviewing aid, not as bazaar for unpublished packages
[03:03] <Hobbsee> siretart: that's true
[03:04] <siretart> we have the supermirror (launchpad) for that
[03:04] <siretart> gpocentek: thanks! (for writing the email)
[03:05] <Hobbsee> siretart: on that basis, 2 months autoarchive and 6 month delete sounds good to me
[03:05] <Hobbsee> if they want anything otu for hte next release, it'll need a new upload, for the new release, anyway.
[03:05] <siretart> right
[03:05] <StevenK> I agree, even if my opinion might not mean much.
[03:06] <ScottK> siretart: Is it feasible to archive comments and such for longer?
[03:06] <siretart> I don't expect serious objections on the mailing list, but I'd like to have everyone contributing and reviewing informed about this before we do that
[03:06] <siretart> ScottK: are you interested enough in this to contribute code? - then sure!
[03:06] <ScottK> Hmmm
[03:06] <siretart> (no, it isn't really hard, I promise ;)
[03:06] <ScottK> OK
[03:07] <ScottK> REVU is in Python, right?
[03:07] <siretart> look at the last commit to the revu1 trunk, and look how I deleted the last bunch of packages
[03:07] <ScottK> OK
[03:08] <ScottK> How long would I have to get the code done?
=== ScottK would also have to learn yet another revision control system ....
[03:08] <siretart> the removal doesn't go automatic because of paranoia. the script drops merely uploads (and all related comments) - you would need to provide an alternative to that
[03:08] <ScottK> OK
[03:08] <ScottK> If it's in Python, I should be able to manage that, just not sure exactly when I could get it done...
[03:09] <siretart> if a package gets nuked, the directory is added to a file called 'removals.txt'. I manually remove them after hand reviewing the file
[03:09] <siretart> ScottK: yes, REVU is all in python
[03:09] <ScottK> I guess as long as I procrastinate, it's just comments keep getting lost.
[03:09] <Hobbsee> elkbuntu: nice pictures
[03:09] <Hobbsee> apart from the pool throwing ones, of course
[03:10] <siretart> ScottK: I wonder why you care in old comments. Honestly, since I don't see a usecase for that, I find them rather annoying
[03:10] <siretart> old comments as in "comments older than 12 months"
[03:10] <ScottK> siretart: I was thinking to have them stored, but not displayed.
=== ScottK is mostly nervous about losing history.
[03:11] <siretart> ScottK: hm. you could perhaps write some exporter for the comments, which is run just before nuking the package. this way you had them stored somehow
[03:11] <ScottK> Something like that, yes.
[03:12] <siretart> well, great. Just branch from launchpad, and tell me where I can merge your changes from when you have something to share
[03:12] <elkbuntu> Hobbsee, hehehe
[03:12] <ScottK> OK.
=== Hobbsee thinks they should have thrown elkbuntu in the pool.
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=== ScottK will have to learn some new code management stuff...
[03:13] <elkbuntu> haha
=== joejaxx wonders how he always avoids the photos
[03:14] <StevenK> I managed to avoid them all by being in Sydney.
[03:14] <TheMuso> Night folks.
[03:14] <Hobbsee> hehe, effective
[03:14] <Hobbsee> hi TheMuso!
[03:14] <StevenK> Hah
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[03:16] <StevenK> geser: Your debdiff looks okay.
[03:17] <StevenK> elkbuntu: Opera on Ubuntu at Sydney Airport. Impressive.
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[03:17] <elkbuntu> StevenK, one of the terminals was in hard lock at some stupid javascript infested site though
[03:18] <StevenK> That's okay, we'll blame Opera.
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[03:20] <StevenK> geser: Have you considered taking some of the patch to Debian, such as the installdocs change, the debian/copyright change and the description change?
[03:20] <elkbuntu> StevenK, i like that mode of thinking
[03:20] <geser> not yet, but might file a bug about it
[03:20] <elkbuntu> since it's not open, we cant debug it ;)
[03:21] <StevenK> elkbuntu: Exactly!
[03:21] <elkbuntu> the terminals are pretty effectively locked down too... that window was the only way i could get a photo of the ubuntuness
[03:22] <StevenK> Couldn't type into the address bar?
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[03:22] <joejaxx> with the C marked files from MoM for a particular package
[03:22] <elkbuntu> yeah.. how would that have proved ubuntuness?
[03:22] <joejaxx> what is that =========?
[03:22] <StevenK> elkbuntu: file:///usr/share/ubuntu-artwork/
[03:23] <elkbuntu> ooh.. never thought to try
[03:23] <elkbuntu> this was the only 5 mins we actually got to touch a working terminal, after the flight was called and everyone else headed to the gate
[03:23] <joejaxx> does that separate the differences between the two files?
[03:23] <apachelogger> hm
[03:23] <StevenK> Ah
[03:23] <StevenK> joejaxx: It's a conflict seperator.
[03:24] <apachelogger> guys, what to do if tarball is heavily broken (though fixable) but upstream doesn't respond?
[03:24] <joejaxx> StevenK: so anything between the arrows and the === is the conflicting stuff i presume
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[03:24] <StevenK> joejaxx: Anything between <<<<< ===== >>>>> , and yes.
[03:25] <joejaxx> ok that is what i thought i just wanted to make sure
[03:25] <StevenK> joejaxx: Read the REPORT file
[03:25] <joejaxx> StevenK: yeap i did
[03:25] <joejaxx> i did not know the format though
[03:25] <StevenK> Those files marked with 'C ' contain diff3 conflict markers, which can
[03:25] <StevenK> be resolved using the text editor of your choice.
[03:26] <joejaxx> i rather ask now than ignorantly proceed
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[03:27] <StevenK> joejaxx: Smart man. :-)
[03:28] <ScottK> Does the changelog entry in LP reflect what will be in debian/changelog for the synched package (particularly the person making the entry)?  As an example, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+source/python-dns/2.3.0-6 and http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/p/python-dns/current/changelog show different people making the change...
[03:29] <geser> LP shows only the contents from the .changes file
[03:29] <ScottK> geser: Thanks.
[03:30] <StevenK> ScottK: Launchpad shows who requested the sync.
[03:30] <geser> the real changelog from the package is the same as in Debian
[03:30] <ScottK> Good.
[03:30] <StevenK> Which was me.
[03:30] <ScottK> Right.  Makes sense.
=== ScottK is Debian maintainer for that particular package, so I was a little confused seeing what was in LP.
[03:31] <StevenK> Ah.
[03:32] <ScottK> No problem now that I understand it.
[03:32] <StevenK> If you upload -7 before auto-import is turned off, it'll say katie.
[03:32] <ScottK> We'll see how much people break it now that it's been updated.
[03:32] <StevenK> For example, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libpoe-perl/2:0.9989-1
[03:35] <StevenK> geser: Sync request for gnupg2 filed.
[03:36] <StevenK> geser: Er, I mean, uploaded. :-)
[03:36] <geser> thanks
[03:36] <StevenK> I'm done poking fun, too, just so you know.
[03:36] <Hobbsee> StevenK: for tonight, of course.
[03:37] <StevenK> Well, that's implied.
[03:37] <StevenK> Besides it's a new day in 20 minutes here.
[03:37] <joejaxx> if a bug has a mentor what does that mean for someone who wants to fix it?
[03:37] <pochu> joejaxx: that he's willing to help you fixing it (i.e. answering your questions and that)
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[03:42] <Rossimo-work> could I ask a question or two about remastering a feisty ubuntu cd?
[03:42] <stani> If something is added to the Debian MOTU repository, does it automatically becomes available in the Ubuntu Universe?
[03:42] <stani> And vice versa (Ubuntu -> Debian)?
[03:43] <StevenK> Debian has a MOTU repository?
[03:44] <stani> Don't they have a universe repository?
[03:44] <Hobbsee> no
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[03:44] <siretart> stani: you must be confusing something here
[03:45] <siretart> lucas: around?
[03:45] <joejaxx> grr what is that line again? Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU ......
[03:45] <lucas> yes
=== joejaxx goes to look at one of his previous change logs
[03:45] <gpocentek> joejaxx: DebianMaintainerField wiki page ;)
[03:45] <lucas> siretart: yes
[03:46] <StevenK> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
[03:46] <siretart> query please
[03:46] <joejaxx> gpocentek: yes 
[03:47] <joejaxx> gpocentek: i seriously need to memorize that page
[03:47] <joejaxx> i keep forgetting the name of that wiki page
[03:47] <Hobbsee> joejaxx: or use the script.  *g*
[03:47] <joejaxx> what script?
[03:48] <Hobbsee> Lutin's.
[03:48] <stani> OK, I meant the unstable repository of Debian. I'll read the wiki page.
[03:48] <StevenK> Did anyone else find it confusing that there is now a piece of software called Lutin and it was discussed at the UDS?
[03:48] <Hobbsee> Lutin: see https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/ubuntu-dev-tools/trunk
[03:49] <Lutin> StevenK: really ?
[03:49] <StevenK> Oh, almost.
[03:50] <siretart> stani: there us no automated syncing from ubuntu to debian. there is automated syncing from debian to ubuntu for some packages. please read the UbuntuDevelopment wiki page for details
[03:50] <StevenK> Lu*p*in is the software
[03:50] <Lutin> StevenK: oh, ok
[03:52] <stani> thanks siretart
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[04:10] <joejaxx> will that stinks everyone has taken all the bitsized bugs :P
[04:11] <joejaxx> StevenK: care to review i patch i did ?
[04:12] <StevenK> joejaxx: Not really, but only because it's quarter past midnight.
[04:12] <joejaxx> oh ok
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[04:14] <joejaxx> anyone else? it is quite small
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[04:16] <ScottK> joejaxx: I can't upload it, but I'd take a quick look if you want.
[04:16] <joejaxx> http://fluxbuntu.org/bug114162.patch
=== ScottK looks
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[04:18] <ScottK> Bug #114162
[04:18] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 114162 in chuck "chuck doesn't suggest/recommend jackd, but seems to need it to work" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114162
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[04:23] <StevenK> joejaxx: gutsy, not fesity
[04:23] <StevenK> Er, feisty
[04:23] <joejaxx> whoops
[04:23] <ScottK> joejaxx: Did you check and make sure that jackd and check actually work together?
[04:24] <ScottK> Assuming that it actually works, I think it makes sense.
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[04:29] <dholbach> mruiz: thanks for considering helping out with the merges
[04:29] <mruiz> dholbach: my pleasure!
=== dholbach hugs mruiz
[04:30] <dholbach> mruiz: if you need any help - be sure to ask in here - I'm sure somebody can review your changes and help if needed
[04:31] <mruiz> dholbach: ok. First of all, what I need to have to start? (Ubuntu version, tools, etc)  
[04:33] <dholbach> if you don't have gutsy installed, it might make sense to have at least a gutsy chroot
[04:33] <dholbach> or a gutsy pbuilder
[04:33] <dholbach> so you can test your biuld
[04:33] <dholbach> build
[04:33] <mruiz> dholbach: what's about a gusty VMware image ?
[04:34] <dholbach> that's cool too
[04:34] <dholbach> sorry, if I don't reply quickly - I'm currently in a meeting
[04:34] <dholbach> but keep on asking :)
[04:34] <mruiz> no worries :)
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[05:05] <bmm> Hi MOTU poeple. Does anybody have time to take a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5125 while I have the time to fix any problems?
[05:07] <joejaxx> ryanakca: /win las
[05:07] <joejaxx> bah
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[05:25] <leonel> hello motus ..
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[06:00] <ScottK> leonel: Hello
[06:00] <leonel> ScottK: hello !
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[06:01] <leonel> ScottK: do you know  what's holding the release for the  squirrelmail update for  feisty    I see it  already on  feisty-security  
[06:02] <ScottK> leonel: That's where it goes.  The security repository is enabled by default.
[06:03] <ScottK> So it should be released now.
[06:03] <leonel> ScottK:  even the  edgy and  dapper  are not ready ?
[06:03] <ScottK> Yes
[06:03] <leonel> ScottK:  perfect
[06:04] <ScottK> Universe is not officially supported, security support is on a best effort basis.
[06:04] <leonel> ScottK: today I MUST have the edgy  done
[06:04] <ScottK> Great.
[06:04] <leonel> ScottK: do I upload the edgy debdiff   to the same bug report ?
[06:04] <ScottK> Yes
[06:04] <leonel> ok
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[06:06] <ScottK> leonel: In fact you can mark the Feisty task on the bug Fix Released since the new package has built.
[06:06] <ScottK> leonel: Have you been able to confirm that the same issues exist in Dapper/Edgy?
[06:06] <leonel> cottk : even if the  announce is not released  yet ?
[06:07] <leonel> Scottk : even if the  announce is not released  yet ?
[06:07] <leonel> ScottK:  yes they are
[06:07] <ScottK> leonel: Yes.  Ubuntu doesn't normally do announcements for Universe packages.
[06:08] <leonel> ScottK: since  the stable squirrelmail  I think only do new releases for security updates   
[06:08] <ScottK> OK
[06:09] <leonel> so  if the  dapper 1.4.6   the changes for  1.4.7  fixes some   1.4.8 someothers   1.4.9  1.4.9a  1.4.10  and 1.4.10a  fix security bugs
[06:09] <ScottK> leonel: Do you want to mark Feisty fix released or should I?
[06:09] <leonel> would be nice ...
[06:10] <ScottK> leonel: You need to check and only make the changes that related to security problems.  The squirrellmail changelog should tell you enough.
[06:10] <ScottK> leonel: Would be nice if I did it?
[06:10] <leonel> yes  be  my guest ...
[06:10] <leonel> jejeje
[06:11] <leonel> ScottK:  yes  I'm checking  the changelog  in the package  and  the security updates issued by squirrelmail
[06:11] <ScottK> Great.  Bug #113725 updated.
[06:11] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 113725 in squirrelmail "Cross site scripting in HTML filter" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113725
[06:12] <leonel> YES !
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[06:12] <leonel> thanks  ScottK  
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[06:12] <ScottK> NP.
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[06:17] <pochu> slomo: around? :)
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[06:25] <leonel> ScottK: so there's no way that the people that has  squirrelmail installed on feisty knows  that they need to upgrade ?
[06:26] <ScottK> leonel: Should just happen
[06:26] <leonel> ok
[06:27] <ScottK> Maybe keescook would be willing to publish a notice after all the releases are done.  I don't know.
[06:27] <leonel> ok
[06:30] <geser> as everybody should have -security enabled they get automatically a notify about an update
[06:30] <geser> but afaik there are no USN for universe packages
[06:30] <keescook> There really isn't a mechanism for doing universe announcements.  I did get the publisher fixed so that they would show up on RELEASE-changes mailing list at least
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[06:37] <leonel> thanks  geser keescook  
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[06:38] <keescook> leonel: thanks for getting the patches tested!  That's the hard part.  :)
[06:38] <leonel> for dapper  is  where my  knees  are shaking  :)
[06:41] <pochu> does anybody have a merge he doesn't want to do? :)
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[07:07] <persia> pochu: I'm not going to do k3b, but it's really not easy.
[07:08] <pochu> persia: I can try it :)
[07:08] <pochu> I'll learn something, I hope
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[07:08] <persia> pochu: Good luck.  Just FYI, it's in main, so you'll need some extra review getting it uploaded.
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[07:20] <nixternal> there is another new k3b?
[07:21] <persia> nixternal: Mom tells me to merge 1.0.1-1
[07:22] <nixternal> ahh
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[07:24] <persia> nixternal: How is plucker?  Will you be able to move to 1.9.0?  Did the patch work?
[07:25] <nixternal> I haven't had a chance to mess with it yet
[07:25] <nixternal> probably this weekend I will get a better chance, or maybe even this evening
[07:25] <nixternal> finals week
[07:26] <persia> nixternal: Sorry then.  I thought you had been.  Let me know if you want any help debugging the wx2.4 -> wx2.6 stuff.
[07:26] <micahcowan> Does anyone here use opie for OTP, or is familiar with it?
[07:26] <micahcowan> (Not a support request)
[07:27] <nixternal> will do persia, thanks!
[07:28] <nixternal> been a while since I messed with opie (familiar frontend correct?)
[07:28] <persia> micahcowan: I've used Opie, but currently have Sharp stock environments on both my devices.  What do you mean by OTP?
[07:29] <micahcowan> Opie is an implementation of OTP, formerly known as/modified version of S/KEY.
[07:29] <nixternal> I had Opie on my Zaurus, but whoever stole it now has it :)
[07:29] <micahcowan> :/
[07:29] <persia> micahcowan: Ah.  Sorry: I thought you meant Open Palmtop Integrated Environment.
[07:29] <nixternal> as did I
[07:30] <micahcowan> Aha. No, "One-Time Passwords".
=== micahcowan takes note of alternative meaning
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[07:30] <ScottK> One Tim Pad, actually.
[07:30] <ScottK> Tim/Time
[07:30] <micahcowan> ScottK, that's something else, actually.
[07:30] <ScottK> Oh.
[07:30] <micahcowan> And yes, it sucks that there are two OTPs, both related to security.
[07:30] <ScottK> Hmmm
[07:30] <micahcowan> rfc 2289
[07:32] <micahcowan> Of course, I'd be somewhat surprised to see a widespread, practical implementation of a one-time pad, considering its practical problems, especially wrt key distribution :/
[07:32] <persia> ScottK: "One Time Password"; The user carrys a list of 20 or so passwords, and only the user knows which is the next one.  The password changes for each login.  "One Time Pad": a cypher encryption scheme that is only used once, and so cannot eaily be broken by repeated interceptions.
[07:33] <micahcowan> s/cannot easily/can never be/. It is the only known form of encryption that can actually be mathematically proven impossible to decipher without the key. :)
[07:34] <persia> micahcowan: Isn't ssh's use of session keys similar in principle to one-time pads?  The key is used for the entire session, but a new key is generated for each session.  Short sessions "ssh -c foo" can be used to reduce the chance of interception.
[07:34] <micahcowan> persia, no. (explanation coming...)
[07:35] <persia> micahcowan: Unfortunately, not all "One Time Pad"s are only used one time.  There is a somewhat famous story of a rotating set of pads that was eventually cracked by British codebrakers in around 1943.
[07:36] <micahcowan> A one-time pad /must/ be at least as large in size as the /entire/ communication. Ssh uses a much smaller key, and uses feedback-based encryption to enhance security for that key (which is how all good block ciphers work)
[07:36] <micahcowan> persia, when that happens, it is by definition not a one-time pad.
[07:36] <micahcowan> one-time pads are literally 100% fool-proof when the key is kept secret and used only once. It loses almost /all/ reliability if you ever use it a second time.
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[07:37] <persia> micahcowan: Thanks for the explanation.  I've been misusing the term for years.  Also, as far as one-time pads, that's why I've been putting them in quotes :)
[07:38] <micahcowan> Because of its guaranteed security, though, there are literally hundreds to thousands of products that /claim/ to be OTPs, but absolutely are not. Never trust anything that claims to be, because actual implementation is completely impractical, given that the only way to transport the key safely is via "handcuffed briefcase" :)
[07:38] <dothebart> hm... i've uploaded a key to launchpad, but its in "pending validation" state...
[07:38] <dothebart> it's been that for about a week... 
[07:38] <dothebart> what else do i have to do?
[07:38] <micahcowan> Huh. Yeah, shoulda been synched by now... :)
[07:38] <Hobbsee> dothebart: is it trying to check yoru email, or something?
[07:39] <dothebart> dunno...
[07:39] <micahcowan> So, no one here uses opiepasswd and the like, then? :/  ...it may be hard for me to find someone to confirm my bug.
[07:40] <persia> micahcowan: If you can give me a testcase, I wouldn't mind trying to duplicate it.
[07:41] <dothebart> ah, i have to open the valitation email with tbird...
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[07:42] <micahcowan> persia, it's bug 61335. A rather minor issue, in which I assert that opieinfo ought to be setuid, so that the user can see his own information, that he had set using opiepasswd (and can in fact check using opiepasswd, in a cumbersome way).
[07:42] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 61335 in opie "opieinfo isn't setuid, whilst opiepasswd is" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/61335
[07:43] <micahcowan> The thing that one-time passwords/ (as opposed to pads) are very nice for, is when shelling in from a computer whose keyboard may be sniffed: the password will not work the next time someone tries to use it. Of course, you still have to trust that, while you're logged in via the untrusted machine, nobody is able to use a mechanism to issue hidden commands while you're logged in, or secretly keep your session open.
[07:44] <dothebart> ah, done.
[07:45] <leonel> is there a command  or how do  I know from the installed  packages  whichones  are from universe ?
[07:45] <micahcowan> dothebart, cool. :) Gonna become an official ubuntero, then?
[07:46] <dothebart> dunno, i wanted to upload citadel.org packages to revu
[07:46] <persia> leonel: The hard way is to do something with grep-dctrl, but there's probably an easier way.
[07:47] <dothebart> so far they're available at ubuntu.citadel.org/ubuntu
[07:47] <micahcowan> Hm, I was thinking that dpkg -s said that, but nope.
[07:47] <leonel> persia: what I did was to do a    wget packages.gz from universe  and then  check the  dpkg -l  against de packages.gz
[07:47] <micahcowan> Oh, of course it does: in the Filename field.
[07:47] <bmm> leonel: make a custom filter in synaptic
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[07:48] <bmm> won't allow you to script the result, but you will get a view of them.
[07:48] <micahcowan> leonel, you can use the Filename field from any of dpkg -s, dpkg -p, and apt-cache show.
[07:48] <leonel> micahcowan: that's what I'm using  the filename field 
[07:49] <leonel> but from packages.gz
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[07:50] <micahcowan> dothebart, as long as you have your key uploaded, then if you choose, you could cryptographically sign the CoC, which will mark you as an Ubuntero. It doesn't mean anything other than the fact that you have committed to abide by the CoC. OTOH, if you intend to apply for membership at some point, that's one step out of the way. :)
[07:51] <leonel> micahcowan: with the  Section  from  apt-cache show   
[07:51] <leonel> thanks
[07:51] <micahcowan> leonel, well, but does the Section necessarily indicate main vs universe? For instance, emacs21 gives "editors" as section.
[07:52] <ScottK> Section doesn't relate to Main/Universe
[07:52] <dothebart> micahcowan: what do i have to do?
[07:53] <micahcowan> dothebart, in your launchpad page, there is a "codes of conduct" link in the sidebar. That should lead you through the process.
[07:54] <leonel> micahcowan: right
[07:54] <micahcowan> For the most part, it will change the "Ubuntero:" field on your page from "No" to "Yes". :)
[07:54] <persia> micahcowan: I can certainly replicate it, but I very much don't agree that opieinfo should be setuid root, as this allows any user on the system to collect the current sequence and seed for any other user on the same system, and by using opiepasswd, the attacker could then determine the next password for the subject, and hijack the account.  When the attacker is done, the attacker can reset the account to the old sequence and se
[07:54] <micahcowan> persia, that's actually untrue: try it.
[07:55] <pochu> persia: there's a new wx2.8 release :) I think I'll do it first ;)
[07:55] <micahcowan> At least, I /believe/ opieinfo actually checks its calling user before allowing the info.
[07:55] <micahcowan> If I'm wrong, then you're right, it shouldn't be setuid.
[07:56] <micahcowan> But if I'm wrong, opieinfo is almost completely pointless, AFAICT.
[07:57] <persia> micahcowan: I can at least collect the session and seed from other users.  I haven't actually configured libpam-opie, and so haven't tried the attack described above.
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[07:59] <geser> dholbach: I've looked a merging/syncing kiwi. It had a comment on DaD, that it can be synced. What about the Replaces: kiwi in python-kiwi. Should it be kept until the next LTS? (the binary is named kiwi in dapper and since edgy it's named python-kiwi)
[07:59] <dholbach> geser: it should probably be kept :-(
[08:00] <geser> I've update the comment on DaD
[08:01] <persia> micahcowan: The only purpose I can see for opieinfo is for an administrator to easily create a list of starter passwords (opiekey -n 42 `opieinfo`).  It's too dangerous to be used by users (as currently implemented).
[08:01] <persia> Oops: opiekey -n 42 `opieinfo $username`
[08:01] <geser> dholbach: it's sort of blocked by the new python-support, it's doesn't depend on it but the egg renaming got removed in the last upload
[08:02] <micahcowan> persia, Yes, you're absolutely right: as nobody, I can get info for micah. So I'll reject, then. Thanks for your help. :)
[08:03] <stani> pochu: Which wx2.8 release? Do you mean 2.8.3? In that case, 2.8.4 will come out soon.
[08:03] <persia> micahcowan: Glad to help.  I'm interested in security, if not currently in practice.
[08:03] <dholbach> geser: what does that change? if the egg is removed?
=== micahcowan suddenly noticed he's ubuntu-qa now.
[08:04] <persia> pochu: Also, Debian is preparing 2.8 packages, which may well be rather different than ours.  wx2.8 might better be left for later (or may need to be done again).
[08:05] <pochu> stani: 2.8.3 is already in the archives, 2.8.4 is out
[08:05] <pochu> persia: are they finally going to move to 2.8? :)
[08:06] <pochu> Good news!
[08:06] <dothebart> micahcowan: done.
[08:06] <persia> pochu: The plan is for Lenny to only have 2.8, with 2.4 and 2.6 removed.  I don't know how that will work in practice.
[08:06] <pochu> persia: then I think I'll wait for them to package it
[08:06] <pochu> if they don't take too long :)
[08:07] <micahcowan> dothebart: "Ubuntero: Yes"  :)   Congratulations!
[08:08] <geser> dholbach: many python package do a "mv versioned_egg.info unversioned_egg.info" in debian/rules. python-support 0.6.4 does it now on its own and packages doing it in debian/rules need to be updated else the FTBFS with the new python-support
[08:09] <dholbach> ah ok
[08:09] <dholbach> thanks geser
[08:09] <dothebart> ;)
[08:10] <dothebart> anybody here able to resync the key over?
[08:12] <micahcowan> What do you mean, resync the key? Have you modified your key?
[08:12] <micahcowan> Last time I made a change (adding my @ubuntu.com id), I just needed to export it to the keyserver using gpg, and it was done.
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[08:17] <eolo999> Hi ScottK 
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[08:20] <zul> meh... http://www.xyzcomputing.com/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=1053
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[08:22] <micahcowan> Slow loading... but I love the isometric graphic at the top :)
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[08:24] <micahcowan> zul, your thoughts?
[08:24] <micahcowan> Does "meh" pretty much sum it up? :D
[08:24] <zul> ill take a wake and see view
[08:26] <zul> er...wait and see
[08:26] <micahcowan> zul, ditto.
[08:28] <persia> zul: micahcowan: Neither of you are going to get lots of links, hits, and attendant google adwords payout with that attitude.  You have to write early and often :)
[08:28] <micahcowan> :)
[08:29] <micahcowan> I don't keep an ubuntu-related blog. Nor do I use ad words; at the moment, they tend to consistently promote things that are the exact opposite of what I would desire to promote.
[08:29] <micahcowan> When I write about ubuntu on my blog, it tends to be "Yay me!" stuff like, "Look at me, I just made member!" :)
[08:30] <micahcowan> Which is why I keep it off of Planet Ubuntu. :
[08:31] <nixternal> he
[08:31] <nixternal> h
[08:31] <micahcowan> h
[08:31] <persia> 
[08:32] <nixternal> haha
[08:32] <nixternal> wth
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[08:33] <nixternal> I didn't know until someone flooded #ubuntu last week with it
[08:34] <persia> micahcowan: Depends on your client.  WIth most clients you need to send advanced unicode non-printing characters.  Pidgin is friendly (but perhaps shouldn't be).
[08:35] <micahcowan> XChat is, as well (tried it, over at ##micahcowan ;-) )
[08:36] <pochu> 
[08:36] <pochu> do you mean that? ^ :)
[08:37] <eolo999> 
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[08:57] <bddebian> Heya gang
[08:57] <xxxxx1> bddebian !
[08:57] <bddebian> Hello xxxxx1
[08:57] <joejaxx> hello bddebian 
[08:58] <bddebian> Heya joejaxx
[08:58] <eolo999> bddebian, i did it
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[09:00] <bddebian> eolo999: Did what?
[09:00] <eolo999> python-scientific bug
[09:01] <eolo999> you were joking... with ScottK about it
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[09:04] <bddebian> eolo999: I was?  I'm old and senile, I can't remember shit. :-)
[09:04] <eolo999> it doesn't matter, np.
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[09:24] <ScottK> eolo999: I'm here.
[09:24] <ScottK> Hello.
[09:24] <eolo999> Hi ScottK 
[09:24] <bddebian> Heya ScottK
[09:25] <ScottK> Hi bddebian
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[09:25] <ScottK> eolo999: Did you say you've got a fix ready?
[09:26] <eolo999> the py-scientific one...
[09:27] <racarr> Could I bug someone to upload some fixes for beryl-core? There is a security fix included so I guess it needs to go in to feisty (fix for: letting anyone read video memory due to SHM permissions)
[09:27] <racarr> http://people.freedesktop.org/~racarr/beryl-crack/beryl-core/ has the .changes .dsc .diff.tar.gz and .orig.tar.gz
[09:28] <Spec> what's the eta for BUG #90902
[09:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 90902 in linux-source-2.6.20 "prism54: eeprom failed" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90902
[09:29] <keescook> racarr: I'll take a look
[09:30] <ScottK> bddebian: Maybe you'd like to upload eolo999's fix: Bug #113803
[09:30] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 113803 in python-scientific "Python-netcdf crashes in Feisty" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113803
[09:30] <Spec> and is there anything i could do to speed it up? ie: repackage it myself and upload it to revu?
[09:31] <Hobbsee> Spec: ask in #ubuntu-kernel
[09:31] <racarr> keescook: Thanks.
[09:31] <bddebian> ScottK: Upload for gutsy?
[09:31] <ScottK> bddebian: Yes
[09:32] <ScottK> bddebian: Once it's fixed in Gutsy, we'll talk SRU...
[09:32] <keescook> racarr: I think the debian/rules needs the cdbs simple-patch-sys added otherwise I don't think this patch actually gets applied.
[09:34] <keescook> (also, the changelog needs "gutsy" rather than "feisty")
[09:34] <ScottK> eolo999: Want another to work on?
[09:34] <racarr> keescook: Mm. Ok.
[09:34] <eolo999> let's see it... even if i have very few free time..
[09:35] <ScottK> eolo999: Bug 114798 should be reasonably straightforward if you want.
[09:35] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 114798 in spambayes "sb_imapfilter fails to run under Python 2.5: SyntaxError: from __future__ imports" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114798
=== eolo999 is looking
[09:36] <ScottK> eolo999: I think it just needs a little try: except: magic to get the import right for both Python 2.4 and 2.5 (haven't studied it in depth though).
[09:37] <racarr> keescook: Ok. Fixed and reuploaded.
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[09:40] <geser> ScottK, eolo999: the fix is to move the "from __future__" line to begin of the file (of course after the #! line if one exists)
[09:40] <keescook> racarr: thanks!  I've sponsored it.
[09:40] <ScottK> geser: Thanks.
[09:41] <racarr> keescook: Thank you :).
[09:41] <eolo999> if the package is for ubuntu feisty/gutsy shouldn't be better to remove 'from __future__'
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[09:44] <bddebian> eolo999: And you test installed this right? :)
[09:44] <eolo999> Yes i tested it rebuilding the package and installing it
[09:45] <bddebian> OK, uploading
[09:45] <eolo999> with c code recompiled
[09:45] <ryanakca> joejaxx: ??
[09:45] <eolo999> perhaps if some other person test it...
[09:45] <bddebian> Well it builds and installs OK, I just don't know the app well so..
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[09:46] <eolo999> bddebian, to test it just: python /usr/share/doc/python-netcdf/examples/netcdf_demo.py
[09:46] <bddebian> OK
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=== eolo999 is waiting for response
[09:49] <bddebian> Seems to work fine, uploaded
[09:49] <racarr> Ok. Also have some copyright issues (missing copy of the LGPL, missiong reference to the fact that the build system is LGPLed), and error handling (set -e in preerm/postinst) fixed in Aquamarine (the kwin style window decorator for Beryl...)
[09:49] <racarr> http://people.freedesktop.org/~racarr/beryl-crack/aquamarine/
[09:49] <racarr> If anyone can look at / upload that.
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[09:51] <geser> ScottK: I added a comment how to fix it to the bug and marked it as bitesize.
[09:53] <ScottK> Great.
[09:53] <eolo999> bddebian, thx
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[09:56] <ScottK> eolo999: There is also Bug 114859, which I haven't looked at at all.
[09:56] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 114859 in psycopg "python-psycopg-dbg reports undefined symbol Py_InitModule4" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114859
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[09:57] <Lutin> racarr: you don't need to build-depend on pkg-config (required by libgtk2.0-dev at least, nor autotools-dev (required by automake1.9)
[09:57] <LaserJock> ScottK: yes
[09:57] <ScottK> LaserJock: Thanks.
[09:57] <eolo999> ScottK, i'll apt source this too and see if i can do something in the next days.
[09:57] <racarr> Lutin: Mm. I wonder why we didn't catch that when we originally did this
[09:58] <ScottK> eolo999: Great.  Keep up the good work.
[09:58] <racarr> then again. we had been working on them for 2 days straight when we got to Aquamarine...
[09:58] <racarr> Ok. I can fix that...just a second
[09:59] <Lutin> racarr: don't know either :)
[10:00] <bddebian> LaserJock: !!
[10:01] <LaserJock> bddebian: Barry!!
[10:02] <bddebian> LaserJock: You went to Sevilla?
[10:02] <LaserJock> yep
[10:02] <eolo999> ScottK, Bug #114798 can be fixed the way you said... move import at beginning of file
[10:02] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 114798 in spambayes "sb_imapfilter fails to run under Python 2.5: SyntaxError: from __future__ imports" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114798
[10:02] <bddebian> LaserJock: Better than France? :-)  (Spanish girls can be HOT) :-)
[10:02] <ScottK> eolo999: Fix it the way geser said.
[10:04] <racarr> Lutin: Ok. Fixed.
[10:05] <eolo999> the strange thing is that debian/patch folder contains a 'fix_import_future.dpatch' file
[10:05] <LaserJock> bddebian: it was definitely better than Paris. The food was great, the city was great
[10:05] <Lutin> racarr: the first changelog entry mentions a patch which is no longer there. has it been dropped ?
[10:05] <LaserJock> and I kept my laptop and wallet
[10:06] <ajmitch> LaserJock: that's a good improvement
[10:06] <ajmitch> LaserJock: you should have stayed for longer though
[10:06] <LaserJock> I know
[10:06] <ScottK> eolo999: Maybe the patch just isn't being applied for some reason then.
[10:06] <LaserJock> I was home for less than 24hrs though
[10:07] <LaserJock> and I was flying again
[10:07] <ajmitch> shame
[10:07] <LaserJock> had a 3hr rehearsal and got stuck in a tux for 8hrs
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[10:07] <LaserJock> then flew back
[10:07] <eolo999> i'm checking...
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[10:08] <Amaranth> bddebian: The scenery was better than, well, anywhere I've been :)
[10:10] <bddebian> Amaranth: Nice
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[10:11] <ajmitch> then go next time
[10:14] <racarr> Lutin: Looks like it. Because it's not there in the package currently in universe either.
[10:15] <racarr> Lutin: It never should have been in the changelog. because it got removed when I synced with GIT. and there was no upload inbetween.
[10:15] <Lutin> racarr: then, you don't need to builddep on automake1.9
[10:16] <bddebian> I hope to go to Boston if I am still around
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[10:17] <racarr> Lutin: Err. Why do you say that? I'm almost sure we do (it failed to build without it, I remember)
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[10:17] <Lutin> racarr: why would you need it ? there's no change/patch against the buildsystem
[10:18] <leonel> ScottK: ping
[10:18] <ScottK> leonel: Pong
[10:19] <leonel> ScottK:  patching  edgy's squirrelmail    after    apt-get source 
[10:19] <leonel> ScottK: cd squirrelmail
[10:19] <racarr> Lutin: Err. It's definitely running automake at some point while the package is being built. I can look in to why (It uses the KDE build system...which I am not really familiar with at all).
[10:19] <ScottK> leonel: If this is going to get long, you might want to pastebin it.
[10:19] <leonel> ScottK: then   when I do    dpatch-edit-patch   I got this error 
[10:20] <ScottK> OK
[10:20] <leonel> make: *** No rule to make target `unpatch'.  Stop.
[10:20] <Lutin> racarr: will check....sounds strange
[10:20] <ScottK> leonel: IIRC the package doesn't have the patching system installed.
[10:20] <racarr> Lutin: I don't see anything in the diff.gz...
[10:20] <leonel> ScottK: yes  
[10:20] <ScottK> leonel: Didn't crimsun tell you to edit the source directly and not worry about adding a patch system?
[10:21] <Lutin> racarr: can't see your point
[10:21] <leonel> yes
[10:21] <leonel> was by  dpatch-edit-patch  patch1
[10:21] <leonel> then edit the source  there 
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[10:21] <leonel> and exit 200 
[10:21] <leonel> I mean  exit 
[10:21] <ScottK> leonel: Don't use dpacth-edit-patch.  That is not necessary.
[10:21] <leonel> then ?
[10:21] <leonel> just 
[10:21] <leonel> cd source
[10:21] <ScottK> Just edit the source tree directly using $EDITOR of your choice.
[10:22] <leonel> ok
[10:22] <Lutin> racarr: hum...funny. actually sound like the buildsystem has been modified within the orig.tar.gz
[10:22] <Lutin> anyways, let's keep automake as it ftbfs otherwise
[10:22] <leonel> and when I finish  with dbuild -S  -uc  us
[10:22] <leonel> ?
[10:23] <racarr> Lutin: Ok. So the version I have uploaded now at http://people.freedesktop.org/~racarr/beryl-crack/aquamarine should be good
[10:23] <ScottK> leonel: Then debdiff.
[10:23] <leonel> ok
[10:24] <leonel> for the change log  what do I put as the package name ?
[10:24] <ScottK> Not sure what you mean?
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[10:24] <leonel> ScottK:  squirrelmail (2:1.4.8-1ubuntu0.1) edgy-security; urgency=low
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[10:25] <ScottK> leonel: Looks sane.
[10:25] <leonel> ok
[10:25] <leonel> working ...
[10:25] <ScottK> leonel: Look at the other versions and make sure you don't duplicate version numbers anywhere.
[10:25] <leonel> ok
[10:26] <leonel> ScottK:  squirrelmail (2:1.4.8-1) unstable; urgency=high
[10:26] <leonel> 
[10:26] <leonel> this is  what  edgy's squirrelmail  has
[10:26] <Lutin> racarr: aquamarine-dev seems to be empty
[10:27] <ScottK> just set urgency to low, we don't really use it.
[10:27] <racarr> Mrgh. I wonder if it always was...let me look.
[10:27] <leonel> ScottK:  so this  will be   squirrelmail (2:1.4.8-1ubuntu0.1) edgy-security; urgency=low
[10:27] <ScottK> leonel: Your version number looks good.  Yes
[10:28] <leonel> ok
[10:28] <leonel> patching ... 
=== ajmitch sighs
[10:29] <ajmitch> yay, back at work now
[10:29] <ajmitch> just what I always wanted
[10:29] <joejaxx> :)
[10:29] <joejaxx> :(
[10:29] <zul> liar!
[10:30] <racarr> Lutin: Err. yeah. It's empty. It's just there for the dependencies.
[10:31] <geser> leonel: what about dapper-backports? it has a backport of the edgy version
[10:31] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: you like work.
[10:32] <leonel> geser: the edgy has bugs too
[10:32] <leonel> geser: can we backport  feisty's squirrelmail to edgy and dapper ??   works fine   and  no other package gets  broke
[10:33] <Lutin> racarr: can't really get the point ... but assuming it's needed, you might want to change the description to explicitely say that it's a metapackage
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[10:34] <racarr> Lutin: I don't really see the point either ( I didn't do it originally ). Should we just remove it?
[10:34] <geser> leonel: it should be possible, but you still need to patch the released version as not everybody uses backports
[10:34] <Lutin> racarr: imho, it should just be nuked. maybe poke another MOTU around to make sure it's the right thing, but I'd remove it
[10:35] <leonel> geser: yes I was thinking that
[10:35] <racarr> Anyone else want to comment?
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[10:35] <leonel> geser: and many people  thinks that  if there's no  security announce  there are no security problems   in universe 
[10:36] <racarr> Updating aquamarine for some copyright issues, and it turns out the aquamarine-dev binary package is more or less useless (a metapackage of two packages). Should it just be nuked?
[10:36] <racarr> nothing depends on it...
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[10:42] <ScottK> leonel: Actually we should be able to backport the Gutsy version to both Dapper and Edgy, but we still need the *-security fixes as backports are not enabled by default.
[10:42] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: you shouldn't be awake
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[10:42] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: i know.
[10:43] <leonel> ScottK: yes  
[10:43] <ScottK> leonel: Once you get the *-security updates done, I'll walk you through the backport request process.
[10:45] <leonel> ScottK:  great !
[10:45] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: please try & get back to normal .au time
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[10:45] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: i wish.
[10:45] <leonel> ScottK: I need  python-psycopg2  in dapper ... :-P    but let's do  that  after squirrelmail ..
[10:46] <ScottK> leonel: OK
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[10:48] <bddebian> OK damnit, why does libglade-2.0 have a package config file but libglademm-2.4 doesn't? :-(
[10:49] <eolo999> ScottK, ciao, i have to go...
[10:49] <ScottK> eolo999: OK.  See you later.  Thanks again for your contributions.
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=== bddebian is truly an idiot :'-(
[11:00] <joejaxx> bddebian: what happened? :(
[11:01] <xxxxx1> bye all
[11:01] <joejaxx> bye xxxxx1 
[11:02] <bddebian> later xxxxx1
[11:03] <bddebian> joejaxx: I'm just stupid :)  I didn't have the package-config file because I didn't have the -dev package installed :)
[11:03] <joejaxx> :)
[11:07] <DarkSun88> Any universe sponsor?
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[11:11] <bddebian> Later gang
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[11:23] <DktrKranz> see you
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[11:31] <leonel> why do I have to eat  I'm  patching .... 
[11:32] <leonel> be back ..
[11:32] <leonel> :-P
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[11:41] <sacater> sorry to bother, but what package to I need to install to build packages etc
[11:41] <sacater> ive forgot what its called...
[11:42] <leonel> dpatch devscripts pbuilder 
[11:42] <leonel> ??
[11:42] <sacater> devscripts
[11:42] <sacater> thanks mate 
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[11:54] <pochu> Anybody knows how long takes an upload to feisty-proposed to build?
[11:54] <pochu> btw, I can't find it either at launchpad or at archives.ubuntu.com
[11:54] <crimsun> which?
[11:54] <pochu> crimsun: liferea
[11:54] <pochu> 1.2.10c-0ubuntu1.1
[11:54] <pochu> bug 103688
[11:54] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 103688 in liferea "liferea crashes - ** ERROR **: file itemlist.c: line 172 (itemlist_load): assertion failed: (NULL != itemSet)" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103688
[11:55] <crimsun> that's because it hasn't been accepted yet.
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[11:55] <pochu> crimsun: ok, thanks :)
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[12:00] <micahcowan> I'd like to get opinions on the suitability of bug 105294 for an SRU to edgy.
[12:00] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 105294 in highlight "highlight crashes by executing in a shell" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105294
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[12:02] <ajmitch> micahcowan: depends if there's an appropriate patch to fix it
[12:03] <micahcowan> ajmitch, works in both dapper and feisty; it would seem simple enough to backport feisty's.
[12:03] <micahcowan> Hm, that title needs to be fixed, I think.
[12:03] <ajmitch> micahcowan: SRU doesn't mean backporting, it's getting a patch that fixes the problem
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[12:08] <micahcowan> ajmitch, if true, that could be made /much/ more clear on the SRU page. Also, the backport page, in referring the reader to /SRU if it is a regression or security issue, gives the impression that an SRU could be a backport for regression purposes, rather than snazzy-feature purposes.
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[12:08] <micahcowan> Regardless, I wouldn't mind doing a patch for highlight, as it seems likely that the fix should be straightforward. However, I don't want to put the work into it if it wouldn't be an SRU candidate in the first place.
[12:09] <crimsun> it's a crash.  That's an SRU candidate if there's a trivial fix.
[12:09] <paran> Is it possible to tell pbuilder not to clean up the buildplace when a build fails? I don't find any option for this in the man page