[12:13] <jovans> reiser4, which has the best performance in some tests
[12:13] <mjg59> ...
[12:13] <mjg59> The biggest gap there is 1.5MB
[12:13] <mjg59> Or less than 3%
[12:14] <mjg59> Note that most of those graphs don't start at 0
[12:14] <bhale> faster is nice if you dont care about integrity of your files
[12:14] <jovans> yes but for first impressions
[12:15] <jovans> i am using feisty with reiserfs i think it's v3
[12:15] <mjg59> jovans: The current recommendations for Linux filesystems are to use xfs if you need very large filesystems, and otherwise to use ext3
[12:16] <jovans> ok
[12:16] <jovans> and jfs not recommanded?
[12:16] <mjg59> I've discussed this with filesystem developers, and they agree that ext4 is not appropriate for use yet unless you're developing it
[12:17] <mjg59> jfs has some management tools that you may find useful, but otherwise I don't think there's an especially good reason to choose it
[12:17] <jovans> ok
[12:17] <jovans> than you
[12:17] <jovans> for ur comments
[12:17] <jovans> ;)
[02:04] <poningru> I had a question
[02:05] <poningru> when the ubuntu installed dells go out
[02:05] <poningru> are canonical's servers ready to handle the load/bandwidth?
[02:41] <psusi> BenC: ping
[02:41] <BenC> psusi: yo
[02:42] <psusi> BenC: hey... I was looking at our devmapper package today and it seems that we diverged from debian some time ago... I think you were the last one to modify it, so I was wondering if you could shed some light on the reasons for diverging
[02:42] <psusi> I'm wondering if we can't sync with the new debian version
[02:44] <psusi> and what the process for that is
[02:44] <BenC> err, I can't remember
[02:45] <BenC> psusi: merges.ubuntu.com is a good place to start
[02:46] <psusi> oh yea, another question I had was, why does the version of the package start with 2:?
[02:46] <Amaranth> someone messed up with versioning previously
[02:46] <psusi> don't think I've seen a version with a : in it before
[02:46] <Amaranth> or did a downgrade
[02:46] <psusi> ohh
[02:47] <Amaranth> lots of packages have that
[02:47] <Amaranth> can't remember the name of it now :P
[02:48] <psusi> so like... it was 1.2.3 and so to downgrade back to 1.2.1 you had to prefix it with a 2: to make it higher?
[02:50] <BenC> psusi: X: is an epoch version, the X: part doesn't show, but it gives it newer version than anything with > X, and no X
[02:51] <Amaranth> 1:1.2.1 is newer than 1.2.2
[02:51] <Amaranth> well, sorts higher
[02:52] <psusi> hrm... why would mom not be able to generate a diff3 merge of a file?  showing it as C*?
[03:00] <psusi> hrm... so our package lets udev create the devnode, but in debian they don't?
[03:11] <BenC> psusi: dm/lvm/mdadm/udev is scary stuff, run while you still can
[03:12] <ajmitch> scary stuff labelled with 'here be dragons'
[03:14] <psusi> lol
[03:14] <psusi> too late... I'm already involved with it because of dmraid
[03:14] <psusi> which is the most scary branch of that family
[03:15] <psusi> would also be nice if the mirror dm target were documented somewhere
[03:16] <psusi> I was trying to figure it out from the kernel sources today because it looks like dmraid passes it a sync or nosync option, but afaics the kernel supports no such options
[03:17] <psusi> I'm used to using tortoiseSVN on windows to do three way merges... how can you do a three way merge in linux?
[07:23] <tepsipakki> good morning
[07:23] <tepsipakki> who is wearing the archive admin hat today?
[08:32] <pitti> Good morning
[08:33] <Fujitsu> Hi pitti.
[08:33] <\sh> moins...
[08:33] <Mithrandir> hiya pitti
[08:34] <\sh> pitti, can you read https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/91636 and comment on it...now it's going into a "move between two packages" report, and I don't want to argue with the people...can you, as our security "officer", comment on the topic "why whine shouldn't deliver a .desktop"  
[08:34] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 91636 in wine "Mimetype error: *.exe => the filename indicates "executable", while the contents indicated "DOS/Windows executable"" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
[08:34] <\sh> s/whine/wine/
[08:35] <Treenaks> \sh: well, some .exes are mono executables, right?
[08:35] <pitti> \sh: "whine" was right :-P yes, will do
[08:35] <\sh> pitti, thx :)
[08:36] <\sh> Treenaks, tbh, I don't have any clue how mono apps are started...but reading /usr/bin/tomboy I can see, that those exes are started via "exec mono tomboy.exe" e.g.
[08:37] <pitti> \sh: hmm, this doesn't look at all related to our discussion yesterday?
[08:37] <pitti> \sh: mono has a binfmt-misc entry as well
[08:38] <\sh> pitti, the thing is, indeed, that +x .exe files can be started via cli, but not via nautilus...kees removed the .desktop file from whine in favour of binfmt...
[08:39] <\sh> and I think because of security...so re-adding the .desktop gives us the possibility to start .exe files via nautilus, but gives you the same pain as before
[08:39] <Fujitsu> Why won't Nautilus execute them now?
[08:39] <pitti> \sh: hm, it looks as if it only gives a confirmation question? the bug doesn't speak about not being able to run them?
[08:39] <pitti> (or does it?)
[08:39] <Treenaks> because nautilus is horribly broken atm (at least, for me :)
[08:39] <\sh> pitti, your "virus bug" is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wine/+bug/85338
[08:39] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 85338 in wine "Security - single click trojan risk" [High,Fix released]  
[08:39] <\sh> pitti, I can't run them...(feisty)
[08:40] <\sh> Cannot open /home/shermann/windows/wrar362d.exe: No application suitable for automatic installation is available for handling this kind of file.
[08:40] <Treenaks> Fujitsu: when I try to open a remote share, it dies, when I try to kill, it'll SIG11 all over itself until I kill -9 it... and restarting doesn't fix it
[08:40] <pitti> \sh: hm, so this is another bug in nautilus then, or the associated MIME types
[08:40] <ajmitch> hey pitti 
[08:41] <pitti> hi ajmitch 
[08:41] <slomo> should be a bug in shared-mime-info then
[08:41] <pitti> \sh: ah, that's not the message that is described in the bug
[08:41] <\sh> pitti, I think it's still dapper/edgy they are talking about
[08:42] <pitti> ah, I see
[08:43] <\sh> but regarding the talks from yesterday on #winehq, we have to protect the users from wine, just because it's in pre-alpha state (remembering the words of an upstream dev) ;)
[08:43] <Fujitsu> Is it ever likely to be in a non-prealpha state?
[08:44] <\sh> Fujitsu, they said, wine is nothing for "john user" 
[08:44] <Fujitsu> Which is why we should follow the advice of ubuntuforums' users and install it by default, don't you think?
[08:45] <\sh> Fujitsu, tbh, I don't read the webforums, just because I love my life as it is, and I don't want to bang my head on my desk, everytime I read "install wine by default" or "use automatix and your pain is going away"
[08:45] <Lathiat> we should preinstall windows programs
[08:45] <Lathiat> Ubuntu 7.04 bundled with Microsoft Office 2007
[08:45] <Lathiat> [ Buy now ] 
[08:45] <Fujitsu> Lathiat: Right.
[08:46] <\sh> but anyways...I'm right now totally confused what to do...I would prefer the "learning through pain" method...
[08:46] <Fujitsu> \sh: The automatix crap has fortunately almost vanished.
[08:46] <dholbach> good morning
[08:46] <\sh> moins dharrigan 
[08:46] <\sh> aeh dholbach 
[08:46] <dholbach> hey \sh
[08:47] <\sh> dholbach, do I see you at linuxtag? :)
[08:48] <Mithrandir> Fujitsu: and it'll become even less useful with the new update-manager fixes. :-)
[08:48] <dholbach> \sh: yep :)
[08:48] <Fujitsu> Mithrandir: What's happening now?
[08:49] <Mithrandir> Fujitsu: the plan is to tell the user "you have used software which we know are going to cause severe problems when upgrading, sorry, we can't upgrade this system, please reinstall".
[08:49] <Fujitsu> Oh, good.
[08:49] <\sh> dholbach, cool :) btw..congrats to your vote :)
[08:49] <dholbach> thanks \sh :)
[08:51] <Fujitsu> Wow, impressive Yes:No ratio that you have there, dholbach.
[08:51] <dholbach> I was very happy with it too
[08:52] <Mithrandir> hiya elkbuntu 
[08:53] <elkbuntu> hiya
[08:53] <elkbuntu> hadnt realised i was logged in under the alt nick :-/
[09:14] <dholbach> doko: ajmitch is also having trouble doing the pygojbect and pygtk merges - do you know of any changes that might have broken py-dbg?
[09:14] <dholbach> http://pastebin.ca/490767
[09:14] <ajmitch> the files appear to be there & in the right place, but I'm getting things like ^^
[09:17] <doko> dholbach, ajmitch: which package does have pyexpat? is the pyexpat-dbg package installed?
[09:18] <ajmitch> python2.5-dbg
[09:28] <bryyce> seb128: btw, found a quirky but irritating bug when switching workspaces - kde apps start flashing on the window list (bug 114923)
[09:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 114923 in gnome-panel "window list highlights kde apps when switching workspaces" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114923
[09:29] <seb128> bryyce: that's a duplicate ;)
[09:30] <seb128> bug #78511
[09:30] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 78511 in libwnck "Gnome-panel flashing for kde apps on workspace change" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/78511
[09:30] <bryyce> ahh, I hadn't spotted that one
[09:30] <seb128> not easy to know
[09:30] <bryyce> yup, that's definitely it.  cool
[09:30] <seb128> the workspaces, tasks list, etc are often libwnck
[09:30] <seb128> I've marked it duplicate
[09:30] <bryyce> yeah, wasn't really even sure what to search on
[09:30] <doko> ajmitch: python2.5-dbg doesn't install in site-packages
[09:33] <ajmitch> hm right
[09:33] <ajmitch> so I have /usr/lib/python2.5/lib-dynload/pyexpat.so and /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/_xmlplus/parsers/pyexpat.so
[09:33] <ajmitch> first is owned by python2.5, the other by python-xml
[09:34] <doko> so you should have a b-d on python-xml-dbg as well
[09:34] <doko> ?
[09:34] <doko> or build-conflict with python-xml?
[09:35] <ajmitch> this was built in pbuilder, so probably the former
[09:35] <ajmitch> though after installing p-x-dbg, I now get further interesting errors
[09:35] <ajmitch> like ImportError: /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/apt_pkg.so: undefined symbol: Py_InitModule4_64
[09:35] <ajmitch> why it'd even look at apt_pkg is beyond me
[09:36] <doko> is python-apt-dbg installed?
[09:37] <ajmitch> I just installed it, and I'm down to the single error
[09:37] <ajmitch> ImportError: /var/lib/python-support/python2.5/gtk-2.0/gobject/_gobject_d.so: undefined symbol: Py_InitModule4_64
[09:39] <bryyce> Mithrandir, would you mind bumping a post of mine in the moderation queue?  I posted a note about the xserver 1.3 upload but hadn't become a member of the list yet, so it's hung up.
[09:40] <Mithrandir> bryyce: the list = ubuntu-devel or some other list?
[09:40] <bryyce> yes right
[09:42] <Burgundavia> bryyce: -devel or -devel-discuss?
[09:42] <bryyce> ubuntu-devel
[09:42] <Burgundavia> I can clear the latter but the former is somebody else
[09:44] <Treenaks> bryyce: I'd like to see a (test) version of the xserver-xorg-video-ati with http://gitweb.freedesktop.org/?p=xorg/driver/xf86-video-ati.git;a=commit;h=3828237200fc16d4d32664fb8358950c213d4897 applied -- I think it might fix bug 20283 (finally..)
[09:44] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 20283 in xserver-xorg-video-ati "[X700]  Really bad sync on HP NW8240" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/20283
[09:44] <Mithrandir> hm, the password isn't what I've saved in my browser.
[09:44] <StevenK> doko: Do you mind if I borrow/steal some of your merges, like ntp or libidl?
[09:46] <Mithrandir> bryyce: sorry, I thought my password for the ubuntu-devel moderation queue was correct, but apparently it's not.
[09:47] <bryyce> Treenaks: unfortunately fglrx is horribly broken with xserver 1.3 presently
[09:47] <Treenaks> bryyce: that's why it's a patch for radeon/ati
[09:47] <bryyce> Treenaks: oh ok, I'll take a look at it
[09:48] <bryyce> is there a LP bug for this?
[09:48] <Treenaks> bryyce: yes, 20283 (as stated above)
[09:48] <bryyce> Mithrandir: ok no prob, guess I'll wait for mdz
[09:49] <bryyce> Treenaks, oh right, you did.  Okay my brain is mush, I'm going to bed.
[09:49] <Treenaks> bryyce: ok :)
[09:54] <Tonio_> hi :)
[09:55] <mneptok> Tonio_: 'lu!
[09:56] <doko> StevenK: please go ahead!
[09:56] <ajmitch> ok, no change on rebuild
[09:56] <ajmitch> hey mneptok 
[09:57] <mneptok> hey hey
[09:57] <mneptok> waznoo ajmitch?
[09:57] <StevenK> doko: Thanks!
[10:02] <dholbach> gpocentek: will we get the new goffice/gnumeric? :-)
[10:05] <ajmitch> mneptok: fighting packages :)
[10:07] <mneptok> ajmitch: i said "new" ;)
[10:07] <StevenK> Mithrandir: Got a sec so I bounce an idea off of you?
[10:08] <Mithrandir> StevenK: shoot
[10:11] <StevenK> Mithrandir: xbitmaps is listed as a manual merge - I've done it, considering the only benefit I can see makes the patch on patches.u.c fall to nearly nothing, do you think it's worth it?
[10:13] <Mithrandir> EPARSE; I'm not sure what you're asking.
[10:13] <StevenK> Mithrandir: Sorry, I ought to be clearer.
[10:15] <StevenK> Mithrandir: Okay, so xbitmaps is listed as a manual merge. I've done it, but the only benefit I can see is it makes the patch on patches.u.c to be very small. Do you think it's worthwhile to upload it?
[10:15] <tepsipakki> xbitmaps is one of 23 xorg packages of which we have a different tarball
[10:16] <Mithrandir> ah
[10:16] <StevenK> Yes. The tarball is different, but contains the same files.
[10:16] <Mithrandir> I don't see why it wouldn't be, if you've already spent the effort.
[10:39] <jdub> seb128: dude, i am so happy to hear that a whole trilogy of hollywood films will be made about your life!
[10:40] <dholbach> jdub: link? :)
[10:41] <seb128> jdub: what?
[10:41] <jdub> http://www.smh.com.au/news/film/ah-ah-ah/2007/05/15/1178995158803.html
[10:41] <seb128> ah ah ah ;)
[10:41] <dholbach> hahaha :-)
[10:42] <Chipzz> jdub: is there a way to see older entries that scrolled of planet (gnome)?
[10:42] <jdub> Chipzz: no, but you can search for them with the custom google search thingy
[10:42] <jdub> seb128: :-)
[10:43] <Chipzz> jdub?
[11:01] <gpocentek> dholbach: of course! ;)
[11:03] <dholbach> gpocentek: rock and roll
[11:03] <dholbach> gracias
[11:19] <dholbach> doko: do you know of any plans to have the pydbg changes in Debian too?
[11:19] <doko> dholbach: they already are
[11:20] <doko> still needs to be announced
[11:20] <dholbach> doko: oh? so it's "just a matter of bringing our changes into debian too"?
[11:20] <slomo> and waiting ages until all million NEW packages are processed ;)
[11:21] <doko> dholbach: exactly
[11:21] <dholbach> that's good news
[11:21] <dholbach> the merges are somewhat painful if we'd have to do them every now and then
[11:24] <fierycleric> hi, how can i build a package with different configure flags?
[11:43] <gnomefreak> fierycleric: #ubuntu-motu might be better place to ask but alot of packages (all ive ever dealt with) has the config options in the debian/rules file
[11:45] <fierycleric> thanks ive RTFM now and found what i was looking for :) .... whats #ubuntu-motu  for?
[11:45] <gnomefreak> the place to ask questions getting help with packaging
[11:46] <fierycleric> i am there... .:)
[12:14] <elmo> I thought like, any laptop in the world, ever - worked with vesa?
[12:15] <Mithrandir> there's a bug in the VESA driver in feisty which makes it fall over on some machines, like some ATI machines.
[12:15] <Mithrandir> iirc
[12:16] <elmo> Mithrandir: yeah, that's what I'm seeing
[12:18] <elmo> and for bonus points the wired network doesn't seem to work either - this is just wintastic
[12:19] <TheMuso> Mithrandir: Ok to do your ccid merge for universe?
[12:19] <Mithrandir> TheMuso: please.
[12:28] <tepsipakki> the bug is in the server
[12:34] <tepsipakki> how can I find out if other packages build-dep on a package? grep-dctrl seems cryptic, even the examples don't work
[12:35] <Mithrandir> checkrdepends can do it
[12:36] <Mithrandir> unsure if that's packaged
[12:36] <elmo> apt-rdepends works and is packaged
[12:37] <tepsipakki> thanks, I'll try that
[12:40] <Gman> hey jono
[12:40] <jono> hey
[12:40] <jono> hows things Gman?
[12:40] <jono> Gman: you over at GUADEC?
[12:41] <Gman> yeah
[12:41] <Gman> hopefully
[12:42] <jono> Gman: good stuff :)
[12:42] <Gman> should be a whole bunch of fun
[12:42] <tepsipakki> E: Reverse build-dependencies are not supported
[12:42] <tepsipakki> hmh
[12:43] <StevenK> Yes, you can't ask "What packages Build-Depend on this one"
[12:43] <pitti> tepsipakki: what do you need? I can look it up in the DC
[12:44] <tepsipakki> pitti: I need to find out what packages build-dep on xutils/xlibs-dev/xbase-clients
[12:44] <seb128> tepsipakki: use grep-dctrl
[12:44] <tepsipakki> seb128: I tried ;)
[12:44] <siretart> tepsipakki: alias revbuilddeb='grep-dctrl -F Build-Depends -s Package $1 -n /var/lib/apt/lists/*_Sources'
[12:45] <pitti> tepsipakki: I copied the script to http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/scripts/checkrdepends
[12:45] <tepsipakki> siretart: ah, that could work
[12:46] <tepsipakki> pitti: thanks
[12:46] <pitti> tepsipakki: see /query, but may be best to run that script yourself
[12:47] <seb128> tepsipakki: http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/gutsy/rdepends/xorg/xutils also
[12:47] <tepsipakki> seb128: whow
[12:47] <tepsipakki> -h
[12:54] <seb128> tepsipakki: "* Reverse Build-Depends:" is likely what you want
[12:54] <tepsipakki> seb128: that's right, bookmark added
[12:59] <tepsipakki> ok, all those that have reverse build-deps on xlibs-dev also depend on the correct package (like "libx11-dev | xlibs-dev"), so I think xlibs-dev can be dropped.
[01:01] <tepsipakki> same for reverse depends
[01:05] <pitti> tepsipakki: right, checkrdepends doesn't handle alternatives
[01:06] <pitti> tepsipakki: but not all
[01:06] <pitti> tepsipakki: I just ran melanie -n -R (from dak) which does respect alternatives
[01:06] <pitti> tepsipakki: http://paste.stgraber.org/906
[01:07] <pitti> tepsipakki: the hppa ones can be ignored, it's hopelessly out of date anyway
[01:07] <pitti> tepsipakki: this check was on feisty though, so the build deps might be fixed in gutsy
[01:08] <tepsipakki> ok, germinate only lists main, right?
[01:08] <pitti> I'm not sure, but probable
[01:08] <pitti> e. g. kmplayer still b-deps on xlibs-dev without alternative
[01:09] <tepsipakki> yeah.. there are a lot of them.. I'll check those
[01:10] <pitti> tepsipakki: only ~ 10, would be easy to fix them if you want to get rid of it
[01:11] <pitti> merging them with Debian might help, too
[01:11] <tepsipakki> I'll see what can be done
[01:16] <pygi> hi hi folks
[01:19] <tepsipakki> grrr
[01:20] <tepsipakki> bbdate merge was sloppy
[01:21] <tepsipakki> meaning that the changes to build-deps were dropped. I'll fix that
[02:02] <tepsipakki> ok, wmacpiload/wmbatteries/wmfortune/xqbiff/xreverse/squeak-vm have all been removed from debian, I guess
[02:02] <tepsipakki> so they should be removed from ubuntu too, right?
[02:03] <ogra> no !!!
[02:03] <StevenK> Heh
[02:03] <tepsipakki> :)
[02:03] <ogra> not squeak at least
[02:04] <ogra> we're maintaining our own package here
[02:04] <tepsipakki> ogra: ok, in that case I'll update it
[02:04] <StevenK> Oh yes, I can picture xqbiff having, ohhh, no users at all!
[02:04] <ogra> tepsipakki, the edubuntu team will take care of it ..
[02:05] <pygi> tepsipakki, debian folks sometimes (read: often) can do weird things
[02:06] <pygi> StevenK, yes? ^^
[02:06] <tepsipakki> ogra: ok, could you adjust the build-deps so it doesn't dep on xlibs-dev?
[02:06] <bintut> hello all..  anyone here from the ubuntu embedded team?
[02:06] <StevenK> pygi: I'm a DD, as are a bunch of people here. :-)
[02:07] <pygi> StevenK, my statement still stands :)
[02:07] <StevenK> I wasn't disagreeing. :-)
[02:07] <dholbach> bintut: ubuntu mobile team?
[02:07] <pygi> StevenK, good, good :)
[02:08] <bintut> dholbach: i don't know the right name of the team.. i just read the announcement of developing ubuntu for embedded/mobile edition
[02:08] <dholbach> bintut: try #ubuntu-mobile
[02:08] <bintut> dholbach: ok.. thanks..
[02:08] <dholbach> anytime
[02:10] <ogra> tepsipakki, nopted
[02:10] <tepsipakki> filed a bug about the removal of those (apart from dear squeak-vm ;)
[02:10] <ogra> *noteed
[02:10] <ogra> argh
[02:10] <ogra> *noted
[02:10] <tepsipakki> heh
[02:13] <pitti> tepsipakki: will take care of that on Friday
[02:13] <tepsipakki> pitti: good
[02:29] <pitti> doko: what do you think of cow-trading merges? I currently have zope3; can I leave that to you and do some of yours? (like belocs-locales-bin and coreutils)
[02:30] <doko> pitti: sure
[02:30] <pitti> ok, grabbing those then
[02:32] <farion> i have successfully have compiled the linux-source-2.6.22 package, but how can i add the sources of linux-ubuntu-modules-2.6.22?
[03:15] <robertj> what do you think of some kind of custom add-on for the wiki that provided some way for people to designate sections as being version specific and let people set a session variable to designate what version they wanted to see
[03:16] <robertj> "This page contains information about a specific version of Ubuntu. Please select which version of the page you wish to see. <select />"
[03:17] <doko> pitti: should / can we promote db4.5 to main?
[03:18] <doko> pitti: what was the rationale to drop libdb-dev as b-d in curl?
[03:18] <pitti> doko: certainly
[03:19] <pitti> doko: I'd just appreciate if we could drop an older version at some point
[03:19] <doko> pitti: lets get rid of all but db4.5
[03:19] <pitti> db4.2 is only used by cyrus-sasl2, libintl-perl, openldap2{,.3}
[03:20] <doko> cyrus could be problematic
[03:20] <pitti> 6 reverse build deps for db4.3
[03:20] <pitti> anything that uses on-disk transactions is problematic
[03:20] <pitti> I guess that should affect a few packages
[03:21] <pitti> and 12 r-build-deps for 4.4
[03:21] <pgquiles> I am trying to package a library using debhelper but I am doing something is wrong. dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot installs files fine in debian/tmp/usr/lib and debian/tmp/usr/share, but then they are not copied to mylib/usr/lib, mylib/usr/share, mylib-dev/usr/lib and mylib-dev/usr/share. I am following http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=51003
[03:22] <pitti> pgquiles: that's #ubuntu-motu stuff; however, you are probably missing debian/mylib-dev.install
[03:22] <pochu> pgquiles: #ubuntu-motu is a better place to ask about packaging :)
[03:22] <pitti> pgquiles: man dh_install(1)
[03:23] <pitti> keescook: do you still remember how to workaround the coreutils local FTBFS with '../../src/dircolors: no SHELL environment variable, and no shell type option given'?
[03:23] <pgquiles> thank you, joining #ubuntu-motu
[03:23] <keescook> pitti: agh, I don't sorry.
[03:23] <keescook> (how did you know I was awake?!)  :)
[03:24] <pitti> keescook: I didn't, it was just IRC-queueing :)
[03:24] <pitti> good mornign
[03:25] <keescook> mornin'.  dogs got me up early; thought I'd do some email and then catch breakfast.  :)
[03:25] <keescook> afair, building in chroot worked
[04:19] <Markus2> As https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pidgin/+bug/88901 is my first bug fixing for Ubuntu, please allow me to ask if I need to do something else: Inform a developer, provide additional information? I'm not sure if the patch is enough?
[04:19] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 88901 in pidgin "[apport]  gaim-url-handler crashed with Error in __call__()" [Medium,Fix committed]  
[04:20] <seb128> Markus2: it's too much change to be accepted
[04:21] <seb128> Markus2: your patch change most of the file
[04:21] <seb128> a fix for this bug should be like 1 line
[04:22] <Markus2> Seb128: So the bugs stays open? You can't change the problem with one line, as the whole file was buggy with gaim Beta6. I don't get it.
[04:31] <Markus2> Seb128: So the bugs stays open? You can't change the problem with one line, as the whole file was buggy with gaim Beta6. I don't get it. I would be happy if you provide additional information, so I can avoid wasting time when trying to fix the next bug.
[04:32] <pygi> seb128, tbh if bug affects a lot of users, we *should* fix it
[04:32] <seb128> Markus2: gutsy has pidgin 2.0.0 which fixes the bug if I understand correctly
[04:32] <pitti> seb128: hm, most of the patch is just removing the backup file, the rest doesn't actually look that scary?
[04:32] <Markus2> Gutsy of course. So Feisty won't see a fix?
[04:32] <seb128> pitti: that doesn't look like a high importance bug to me, if we start to fix such ones we will get 100 desktop SRU during the feisty cycle
[04:33] <seb128> Markus2: the bug is not too important, I don't think it's worth a SRU, no
[04:33] <Markus2> pitti: It's my first patch, sorry if I did something wrong. Hints are highly appreciated
[04:33] <pitti> ooh, we are talking about an SRU here? right, no way then
[04:33] <seb128> pitti: nothing wrong, that just doesn't look like a stable update candidate to me
[04:33] <Markus2> Sorry to be dumb, what's a SRU?
[04:33] <pitti> Markus2: I thought it was about fixing gutsy, since the bug is still marked open for it
[04:34] <pochu> !sru | Markus2 
[04:34] <ubotu> Markus2: Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates for main and restricted, while https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/SRU is for universe and multiverse.
[04:34] <pitti> seb128: 'stable release update'
[04:34] <seb128> pitti: gaim has been replaced by pidgin
[04:34] <seb128> pitti: that's for Markus2
[04:34] <seb128> pitti: I've not looked how to deal with the some hundred bugs yet
[04:34] <pitti> seb128: so the bug should just be close then, I figure?
[04:34] <seb128> pitti: yes, reassigned to pidgin and marked fixed
[04:35] <seb128> it's on pidgin
[04:35] <seb128> just need to be closed then
[04:35] <seb128> doing that
[04:35] <seb128> Markus2: nothing wrong, you just sent a patch for a bug already fixed to gutsy
[04:36] <seb128> Markus2: and we do backport fix to stable only when the bug is really important or annoying lot of users which is not the case of this one
[04:41] <Markus2> Well, thanks Sebastien for taking the time to look into it. I still don't understand the issue fully as I can't see any side-effects with fixing the totally useless gaim-url-handler now. But I respect that you for sure have good reasons to handle like you do. I'm still in the learning process. I'm just a bit disappointed when every single Wiki-Page encourages you to provide help and then the whole work was just useless. So I will concentrate
[04:41] <seb128> Markus2: it was not useless, but you worked on something already fixed
[04:42] <seb128> Markus2: we use pidgin instead of gaim now
[04:42] <seb128> Markus2: and it's fixed to pidgin
[04:43] <Markus2> I do understand that issue for gutsy. Still, the bug exists in Feisty. I did understand that part of your message. And: If I work on something without a chance to get into feisty and fixed in gutsy, then it *is* wasted time :-)
[04:43] <seb128> Markus2: we could discuss doing a feisty upload, but read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates for some background on stable updates (they require qa team work, regression testing, etc)
[04:44] <seb128> Markus2: next time maybe ask if the bug is a candidate for a stable update before starting on it, that one has no feisty task open
[04:44] <sharms> Markus2: if you find a bug like that, and want to help (we want you to help!) the best thing to do is hang out in #ubuntu-motu and ask before working on it
[04:44] <sharms> Markus2: generally someone there will know about it and if it still needs to be fixed
[04:44] <seb128> Markus2: we can't spend qa time to test regression for every bug
[04:47] <Markus2> Thanks everyone for taking the time to explain me some rules I wasn't aware off. SEE YOU.
[05:30] <bddebian> Heya
[05:49] <tkamppeter> I have a question about replacing an obsolete package by a new package:
[05:50] <tkamppeter> The obsolete package is gs-esp and its replacement is the already existing gs-gpl
[05:50] <tkamppeter> Is it correct when I let the gs-gpl have
[05:51] <tkamppeter> Confilcts: gs-esp (<< 8.60)
[05:51] <tkamppeter> Replaces: gs-esp (<< 8.60)
[05:51] <tkamppeter> Provides: gs-esp
[05:52] <tkamppeter> and I let the gs-gpl source package make a transitional package named gs-esp which depends on gs-gpl
[05:52] <tkamppeter> Is this correct?
[05:53] <bddebian> tkamppeter: Sounds right but I'm no expert on the matter
[06:01] <tkamppeter> Especially I also woul like to know how the upload will work, as gs-gpl will ship the (transitional) binary package gs-esp and the gs-esp which is still in the archives will also ship a binary package named gs-esp.
[06:07] <pitti> tkamppeter: that sounds fine
[06:07] <pitti> tkamppeter: right, there will be two gs-esp packages in the archive (built by different sources), the highest version will win
[06:08] <pitti> tkamppeter: so you need to make sure that the transitional gs-esp has a higher version than the current gs-esp
[06:08] <pitti> tkamppeter: with the versions in the archive that's already the case
[06:10] <bddebian> Is there any reason to keep gs-esp in the archive?
[06:10] <pitti> tkamppeter: ^ if gs-esp will disappear upstream and is not needed any more, I'd remove it
[06:14] <tkamppeter> pitti, gs-esp and gs-afpl can be removed. gs-esp is not provided upstream any more and gs-afpl is the same as gs-gpl now.
[06:16] <tkamppeter> pitti, I have added appropriate lines in the control file and transitional packages to automatically uninstall all packages of gs-esp, gs-afpl, gs-aladdin, gs wheninstalling gs-gpl.
[06:17] <tkamppeter> pitti, gs-gpl will be the only Ghostscript then, as it is the newest Ghostscript and it provides full functionality.
[06:19] <Burgundavia> is there any reason to have the license name in the package then?
[06:19] <Burgundavia> why not just call it gs?
[06:22] <tkamppeter> Burgundavia, perhaps we better wait for Debian what they do with the package names.
[06:22] <Burgundavia> that is probably sane
[06:27] <tkamppeter> pitti, so after my testing I will make the new gs-gpl available for you to upload. With this upload gs-esp and gs-afpl can be removed.
[07:04] <xst> Since upgrading to feisty I have no sound. How can I see if there is any progress in bug #108288?
[07:04] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 108288 in linux-source-2.6.20 "Audio is played in "slow motion"" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/108288
[07:17] <pitti> tkamppeter: great, thanks
[07:18] <Burgundavia> xst: by checking the bug
[07:29] <Hobbsee> morning all!
[07:32] <seb128> hey Hobbsee
[07:33] <Hobbsee> heya seb128!
[07:34] <Amaranth> hey Hobbsee (late)
[07:34] <Burgundavia> hey Hobbsee
[07:34] <Hobbsee> hiya Amaranth, Burgundavia :)
[07:35] <Amaranth> ooh, xchat-gnome does a little ding now
[07:35] <Amaranth> i ditched pulseaudio, it was causing too many wakeups
[07:36] <Burgundavia> playing with that powertop thingy?
[07:36] <Amaranth> yeah
[07:36] <Amaranth> it's sad though
[07:37] <Amaranth> Wakeups-from-idle per second :  839.8 
[07:37] <Burgundavia> not yet on gutsy, need the tickless kernel
[07:38] <Amaranth> things i hate:
[07:38] <Amaranth>   36.7% (161.6)       <interrupt> : uhci_hcd:usb4, nvidia 
[07:38] <Amaranth>   11.4% (50.2)       <interrupt> : uhci_hcd:usb3, yenta, ipw3945 
[07:38] <Amaranth>   10.6% (46.8)       <interrupt> : HDA Intel 
[07:39] <Burgundavia> interesting to see the numbers on a warty install
[07:40] <Ng> Amaranth: woah, that's a pretty good score
[07:41] <Ng> I thought my 300 or so were bad ;)
[07:41] <Amaranth> Ng: what do you get 300 from?
[07:41] <Amaranth> ipw3945 and nvidia kick me out of C3
[07:41] <Ng> Amaranth: thinkpad x40. feisty install I booted with a gutsy kernel to test powertop with
[07:42] <Amaranth> oh, you get 300 total?
[07:42] <Amaranth> while running X?
[07:42] <Amaranth> s/X/GNOME desktop/
[07:42] <Ng> yes, while running my regular setup
[07:42] <Ng> but that has wifi and stuff, so it's expected to wake up. also I didn't put in any of the patches
[07:42] <Amaranth> if i stop X and hit the kill switch on my wireless i get down to ~80
[07:43] <Ng> I didn't apply any patches, so I didn't get to keithp levels, but with init, bash and some kernel modules it was idling about 35 and spending >90% of the time in C4
[07:43] <Ng> interestingly though, that didn't drop the power usage more than a W or two
[07:43] <Amaranth> i don't even get power usage reports
[07:47] <Amaranth> i'm guessing things calling schedule_timeout (process_timeout) or do_nanosleep should be smacked about
[07:54] <er1> does someone knows how can I redefine my default g++ compiler?
[07:54] <er1> I want to change it from g++-4.0 to g++-3.3
[07:54] <er1> I have both compilers installed.
[07:55] <er1> right now in the /usr/bin directory I have: g++ -> g++4.0
[07:56] <Pici> er1: relink /usr/bin/g++ to whichever version you want to use
[08:30] <geser> mdz: the last log for xmms2 contains only "/bin/sh: Syntax error: "(" unexpected" as reason but no info about the called command (which it did in the last logs). Do you have an idea how to get this info back?
[08:32] <mdz> geser: no, I don't
[08:32] <mdz> sounds like changes to the shell on the buildds; I vaguely recall hearing something about that
[08:34] <Hobbsee> hiya mdz - you made it back OK then?
[08:37] <mdz> Hobbsee: I did, thank you.  and you as well?
[08:37] <Hobbsee> mdz: sort of
[08:37] <Hobbsee> :)
[08:37] <Hobbsee> mdz: took 36 hours, 4 and a bit planes, 3 trains, 1 car, and 1 taxi.
[08:38] <Hobbsee> mdz: now you can see why i was whining the last night when we started playing Mao :P
[08:38] <mdz> that's a long way, even for .au
[08:38] <mdz> that's about as long as it took rtg to get home
[08:38] <Hobbsee> it should have only been about 32
[08:39] <Hobbsee> rtg?
[08:39] <Hobbsee> elkbuntu and ajmitch's were slightly longer again
[08:39] <Hobbsee> mdz: you've got to remember though - au just *is* a long way away.
[08:39] <mdz> rtg is a kernel developers who lives in Montana
[08:39] <Hobbsee> ahh
[08:40] <Hobbsee> and i'm almost over the jetlag - woo!  :P
[08:40] <racarr> Didn't you just sleep from 3 PM to 3 AM?
[08:41] <Hobbsee> yes
[08:41] <Hobbsee> but that's better than the 6am to 6pm from the day before
[08:41] <racarr> Fair enough.
[08:44] <truz_`24> where is linux/config.h?
[08:44] <Hobbsee> hah.  now the horrible truth about the smokes comes out...
[10:42] <ajmitch> morning
[10:44] <sharms> hey
[10:44] <Hobbsee> hi ajmitch!
[10:54] <pata_sis_prob> good evening 
[10:55] <pata_sis_prob> i got a problem with the pata_sis module on a fresh ubuntu 7.04 installation
[10:55] <pata_sis_prob> could somebody please explain how i can solve this problem by chrooting the system from a live-cd and compiling the kernel with the necessary patch?
[11:10] <sharms> apokryphos: I don't believe ATI ever said they are releasing their drivers open source.  That enterprise linux blog was commenting about the same things Chris Blizzard was, and I think they just over eagerly paraphrased things
[11:13] <sharms> I believe they said "we are committed to fixing our problems with open source", not "we will open source our drivers"
[11:14] <sharms> and from my correspondence with AMD, they are developing another closed source rewrite of fglrx, which can only be obtained through NDA at this point
[11:14] <apokryphos> hm, still sounds hard for a huge room of people to misinterpret
[11:14] <sharms> I trust chris blizzard over enterprise linux blog though
[11:15] <bhale> I trust them to show us
[11:15] <bhale> throwing speculation all over the internet isnt helping anyone
[11:16] <sharms> bhale: no I just posted a possibly derogatory blog entry about AMD and how they should open source the drivers, so I was just clarifying that as far as I know they didn't commit to releasing any source
[11:16] <sharms> but if I am wrong, I would take the entry down, just checking to make sure I got my end straight
[11:18] <apokryphos> hm, Blizzard doesn't seem to explicitly state that they didn't say that
[11:18] <mjr> incidentally, it does seem to me too that people are reading too much into what ATI actually said
[11:18] <apokryphos> now, if only these talks were online 8)
[11:19] <mjr> so putting on pressure to do what people think they said is good :] 
[11:19] <sharms> ha, new blog entry: "Redhat open source your talks with the ATI guy!"
[11:22] <apokryphos> sharms: either way, especially with the hype about it atm, calling for a boycott of amd is definitely jumping the gun (at this point) ;-)
[11:23] <mjg59> Could we not have this discussion here, please?
[11:23] <apokryphos> sure
[11:24] <mjg59> Ta
[11:24] <mjg59> -offtopic might be a better choice
[11:26] <mjr> sharms, incidentally, url to the blog?
[11:40] <sharms> mjr: http://www.sharms.org/blog