[12:12] <nothlit> *groan*, ubuntu-title got uppercase
[12:16] <troy_s> that bloody font should be BANNED
[12:16] <troy_s> it is the worst bloody font in existence, and everyone uses it trying to buy some ephemeral consistency
[12:16] <troy_s> but it is soooooo hacky amateur looking it scares me.
[02:32] <darkmatter> troy_s, its sad that people actually use that font. the splash, usplash and gdm are the first thinks I give the boot to
[02:33] <darkmatter> its loathsome and more suited to web2.0 than a ui
[03:12] <troy_s> darkmatter: The font is uh... fine in U-b-u-n-t-u
[03:12] <troy_s> but it just hints at the absolute vacuum of aesthetic used in _anything_else.
[03:13] <troy_s> I find the ubuntu branding logo and text to be quite distinctive.  In the case of the actual logo, it is wonderful.
[03:17] <darkmatter> welll.. maybe.. but I dont like it in general.. true.. for branding its awesome.. but if I wanted ballons I'd use a mac :P
[03:19] <troy_s> Well... even then, it isn't like Mac has _always_ done it... that was their design pattern from about 5 years ago.  I believe it is called 'gel'
[03:19] <darkmatter> yup
[03:19] <troy_s> darkmatter: Mac tends to key on that 'elegant' factor by forwarding serifs.
[03:20] <troy_s> darkmatter: Their font selection is rather transparent in goal.
[03:20] <darkmatter> yes.. macs serifs are gorgeous
[03:20] <troy_s> darkmatter: Well again, they have educated designers and artists who _care_
[03:20] <troy_s> darkmatter: And moreso, the entire team is on the same page.
[03:20] <darkmatter> apple garamonde, lucidia grande
[03:20] <darkmatter> just yummy
[03:20] <troy_s> darkmatter: J. Ive is one part of an entire 'set' that clicks and has a very clear process.
[03:21] <darkmatter> yup
[03:21] <troy_s> darkmatter: I can't remember the exact quote, but J. Ive has publically stated that when his tenure with Apple is complete, above all of his accomplishments at Apple, he will remember the process more than anything.
[03:21] <troy_s> darkmatter: And it heralds back to the innovation achieved at Xerox's PARC.
[03:21] <troy_s> darkmatter: The beanbag chairs and whiteboards.
[03:22] <darkmatter> yup
[03:22] <troy_s> darkmatter: In the end, it is all about process.
[03:22] <troy_s> darkmatter: Something that our little clique could stand to learn a lot from.
[03:22] <darkmatter> yes... it is
[03:23] <darkmatter> speaking of process.. I need to get these evil troughs figured out
[03:23] <troy_s> darkmatter: Yeah alpha please.
[03:23] <troy_s> darkmatter: lol
[03:23] <darkmatter> tried an experiment in the wee hoours... not anything polished or actually measured... but still.. didn't work inmho
[03:24] <darkmatter> troy_s, alpha is so close I can smell it
[03:24] <troy_s> darkmatter: Fill it with a non generic pattern of sorts.
[03:24] <troy_s> darkmatter: Something stylized maybe?
[03:24] <troy_s> (no bloody hatch)
[03:25] <darkmatter> just in a wee little *stump*... not a real stump... just one of those lets try 15 different things and see what works
[03:26] <darkmatter> troy_s, there is a lesson in this... to avoid gimp and inkscape when tired  http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=500556710&size=o
[03:26] <darkmatter> ;)
[03:27] <darkmatter> uggh
[03:28] <troy_s> different.
[03:29] <troy_s> which is positive
[03:29] <troy_s> kind of cool for a studio setting... but i don't know how many 35ish year old women would appreciate it.
[03:29] <troy_s> actually _very_ cool for a studio package
[03:29] <darkmatter> yeah.. my point exactly
[03:30] <darkmatter> as in the general demographic may not like
[03:30] <darkmatter> but polished it would go nice for a studio
[03:31] <darkmatter> which is part of the influence anyway...
[03:39] <darkmatter> troy_s, its not that I dont like them... just not right for the "generic" version.. but at least it confirmed that I'm on generally the right track design-wise.. as in glory is not rigid
[03:40] <darkmatter> its actually somewhat flexible in regards to the impression it can give
[03:40] <darkmatter> which is a plus point that should be maintained
[03:41] <troy_s> darkmatter: Tis' soft.  About the biggest room for expression is in those scrollbars / progressbars.
[03:41] <troy_s> darkmatter: Which is why they really need to drop that stale sterile hospital grippers and move on in life to something else.
[03:47] <darkmatter> lol
[03:47] <darkmatter> yes
[05:27] <troy_s> darkmatter:  Best quote of the month:  "Historically I've had a love-hate relationship with Apple. They love themselves and I hate them."
[05:27] <darkmatter> lol
[05:29] <troy_s> darkmatter: Wow... what an article.  If you thought that Apple was a total bloody corrupt company:  http://www.tuxdeluxe.org/node/175
[05:29] <darkmatter> looking
[05:32] <darkmatter> good. gods.
[05:34] <troy_s> darkmatter: LOOOOL
[05:34] <troy_s> darkmatter: "During a screening interview, I was asked how I would design a bike fit for someone visually impaired. I responded something to the effect of, "What, like, for blind people?", and she answered yes."
[05:34] <troy_s> "I thought for a moment and then I responded, "Well.. a blind person riding a bike doesn't sound like a very safe idea, so I would make the bike stationary, maybe with a fan blowing in the person's face. He probably wouldn't even know the difference."
[05:34] <darkmatter> hehe
[05:39] <darkmatter> troy_s, I think I've created the ultimate tagline
[05:39] <darkmatter> OSX: FreeBSD for Stuckups
[05:42] <troy_s> lol
[05:42] <troy_s> OSX:  We Steal The House Again!
[05:44] <darkmatter> lol
[05:45] <darkmatter> troy_s, its amazing how an os manufacturer so dependant on free software can be such a b*tch about it
[06:03] <troy_s> darkmatter: And have the gaul to fucking close their source.
[06:03] <darkmatter> yes
[06:05] <darkmatter> troy_s, I may love the look n feel of osx... but I dont particularly like apple. I just keep saying I wannaa work for them to harass coz_ xD
[06:05] <Madpilot> gall, not gaul </pedant>
[06:06] <troy_s> Madpilot: Thanks.  That would be my head typing in irc mode.
[06:07] <troy_s> darkmatter: You know how keynote apparently got 'created'
[06:07] <darkmatter> its called typonese.
[06:07] <darkmatter> troy_s, how?
[06:08] <troy_s> S. Jobs caught one of his employees using powerpoint.
[06:08] <darkmatter> oi...
[06:12] <BHSPitMonkey> troy_s, lolling at that love-hate quote
[06:13] <BHSPitMonkey> Madpilot, can I take over your job when you're gone
[06:13] <Madpilot> BHSPitMonkey, which job, and where am I going?
[06:14] <BHSPitMonkey> Madpilot, being the house pedant, and somewhere else inevitably
[06:14] <BHSPitMonkey> (respectively)
[06:14] <Madpilot> there's room for more than one house pedant, I'm sure. Feel free to join in. :)
[06:14] <BHSPitMonkey> woot
[06:16] <troy_s> BHSPitMonkey: yeah its a hilarious quote
[06:17] <troy_s> BHSPitMonkey: Read that article if you want some insight into the bloody mind campaign that Apple flaunts to its zealots.
[07:13] <darkmatter> eep!! its the klepas!!! and he's luvin' his fonts! :O
[07:20] <klepas> ^_^
[07:20] <klepas> hi darkmatter :)
[07:20] <klepas> got a release yet of Glory?
[07:20] <klepas> i want to download it >_<
[09:22] <klepas> darkmatter: hey
[09:25] <darkmatter> klepas, not yet... trying to finish of an alpha now
[09:25] <klepas> no worries then :-)
[10:26] <darkmatter> klepas, ping
[10:26] <darkmatter> http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=501840554&size=o
[10:27] <darkmatter> I think I oversaturated
[10:27] <darkmatter> ;)
[10:28] <Madpilot> I kind of like it, but ya, that gradient is probably a bit too much
[10:29] <klepas> i'll get back to you later on that
[10:29] <klepas> heading home now :)
[10:30] <klepas> but from a quick look
[10:30] <darkmatter> it looks *ok* at the larger sizes... but kinda makes the smaler tips look plasticky
[10:30] <klepas> i'd agree--try using a lower saturation
[10:30] <klepas> *nod*
[10:30] <klepas> i love the gradient
[10:30] <klepas> is that a gtk thing?
[10:31] <klepas> gtg
[10:31] <darkmatter> kinda... gtk can do that in code... but thats just a 30x30 png being scaled
[10:31] <lapo> hi
[10:31] <darkmatter> hi lapo
[10:32] <lapo> ciao darkmatter
[11:56] <nothlit> darkmatter: avoid the stickynote look lol
[11:57] <darkmatter> lol
[11:57] <darkmatter> yesh...
[11:59] <darkmatter> notlith... just oversaturated is all... easy fix
[11:59] <darkmatter> *nothlit
[11:59] <darkmatter> damn... dyslexic this morn...
[12:18] <darkmatter> nothlit, http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=501946759&size=o <--- better?
[12:19] <nothlit> darkmatter: yeah--that slightly 3d aspect unifies the whole thing too :)
[12:20] <darkmatter> :)
[12:20] <nothlit> are you going to do something with hilighted menu items?
[12:22] <darkmatter> yeah.. was thinking of either a very subtle grad and a slight shadow or just a shadow
[12:35] <klepas> darkmatter: i'm really looking forward to a tarball now
[12:36] <klepas> with all these previews :)
[12:37] <darkmatter> :)
[12:38] <darkmatter> well.. Ineed sleep.. but now that the tricky parts of the alpha are done... it'll take next to nothing to get it finished
[12:39] <darkmatter> the tricky part was the fake 2pix corners on the tooltips
[12:39] <darkmatter> since it worked, I think I'll do the same with the menus
[01:33] <klepas> darkmatter: i don't understand what you mean by the 2px corners?
[01:35] <darkmatter> look closely at the tooltips. the corners are rounded
[02:30] <klepas> mhh
[02:30] <klepas> is there native support for that?
[02:30] <darkmatter> nope.. its an optical illusion
[02:31] <darkmatter> it has to do with how the borders are drawn
[02:31] <klepas> so how did you do it?
[02:32] <darkmatter> basically theres a 1pix indent on the corner... shadowed over (the tooltip bd color is a neutral gray)
[02:33] <darkmatter> and the border trick... its done wuth dark chocolate through a brown mustard shade basically.. did a 30x30 pixmap
[02:33] <darkmatter> the inner 14 pixels is the highlight... darkens towards the corners
[02:34] <darkmatter> so it basically fattens the tips in the middle
[02:34] <darkmatter> that combined with the 1 pixel indent tricks the eyes into perceiving a slightly rounded shape
[02:35] <klepas> whoa
[02:35] <klepas> that's impressive :)
[02:36] <darkmatter> its nt 100% perfect yet.. you can still pick up the grey squared edges on dark backgrouns... so I need to tweak the shadowing a bit
[02:36] <darkmatter> *backgrounds
[02:37] <darkmatter> since it works with tooltips I'm going to see if the same effect will work with the menus
[02:37] <klepas> would that add to the overall processing power needed for drawing the widgets?
[02:41] <darkmatter> no... its only a 1x whatever border
[02:41] <darkmatter> I havent hit any performance issues with it yet
[02:42] <darkmatter> partially its because I've kept the theme clean and uncomplicated
[02:42] <klepas> way to go
[02:43] <darkmatter> most pixmap themes get kinda baroque with the widgets themselves (kinda heavily drawn)
[07:26] <darkmatter> troy_s, f34r the tooltips! http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=501946759&size=o
[07:27] <darkmatter> :P
[07:27] <troy_s> the grad is nice
[07:28] <troy_s> try radial from top left too...
[07:28] <troy_s> (in svg of course ;) )
[07:35] <darkmatter> :)
[07:38] <andreasn> I wonder what's up with the openoffice icons
[07:40] <andreasn> hm, only appears in icons/hicolor/48x48/apps apparently
[07:54] <andreasn> darkmatter: very nice looking tooltips btw