/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2007/05/20/#ubuntu-devel.txt

EnolaGaypochu: Make a new bug report?12:16
pochuEnolaGay: yep12:16
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EnolaGay:)12:16
acmHi, I would like to know what is planned for enabling 3d effects in gutsy? many people in #ubuntu-de have problems to enable them especially ati user.12:22
EnolaGaypochu: I wonder why apport-gtk doesn't pop up because of this crash. Should I upload the report as an attachment?12:23
EnolaGayacm: I think it is a driver problem but at least Radeons have an working 3d open source driver afaik.12:24
pochuEnolaGay: it won't hurt :)12:25
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EnolaGaypochu: finally https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apport/+bug/115681 :)12:29
ubotuLaunchpad bug 115681 in apport "apport-retrace crashes after downloading dbgsyms for a xorg crash" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  12:29
acmEnolaGay: Yes I agree with that driver problem. But for me the radeon driver doesnt work on my thinkpad. There should be an automated workaround for fglrx driver, because the driver works with xgl. the configuration is more complicated.12:29
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EnolaGayacm: Ask AMD ;) I don't know, I am no dev.12:30
lfittlacm, automated workaround is not possible, as XGL is a completely different x server that is not supported in Ubuntu12:31
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EnolaGayacm: Btw why a 3D Desktop. It looks not bad but is has no real advantages imho and at the moment some disadvantages like not working vnc and problems with playing movies.12:48
sn0EnolaGay why not ? :}12:49
sn0the option is there, you can disable certain functions if you deem them not useful12:49
EnolaGayAnd it crashes for me more often.12:49
sn0having everything rendered by the gpu has its advantages12:49
EnolaGaysn0: Do you know something about the energy consumption?12:49
sn0well crashes are common + it is early days yet12:49
sn0you can compare it to running a 3d game really EnolaGay 12:50
pochuEnolaGay, acm: it's planned: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/composite-by-default12:50
sn0but i find my card runs cooler with beryl/compiz running than at full peak in a 3d game12:50
EnolaGayHm, that wouldn't be good for laptops.12:50
sn0obviously uses more than no acceleration12:50
sn0going by intels power tool they released it seems certain apps can cause more power drain/causing the cpu to wake up12:51
sn0so there is a lot to be done12:51
EnolaGaysn0: Do you know if the fixes are released in gutsy?12:52
Hobbseeprobably not yet12:52
sn0the intel tool is a seperate download, not sure about plans for gutsy12:52
HobbseeUDS was only a week ago, gutsy hasnt been open terribly long12:52
EnolaGaysn0: It sounds great but I doubt if it let the laptop run three hours longer.12:52
pochuEnolaGay: gutsy still have same compiz (0.3.6)12:52
EnolaGaysn0: I know I mean the fixes of intel and other devs.12:53
sn0EnolaGay fyi http://www.linuxpowertop.org/powertop.php12:53
sn0that has nothing to do with gpu / composite acceleration mind12:53
EnolaGayI know. I don't ask for composite it is just if the program and kernel patches of Intel are integrated in Gutsy?12:54
sn0https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/powertop-support :)12:54
EnolaGaycool12:54
pochuEnolaGay: sudo apt-get install powertop ;)12:54
Hobbseepochu: doesnt seem to be there at all, yet12:55
Hobbseesn0: that's not written by a developer12:55
pochuHobbsee: it's already been synced, though12:55
Hobbseeand has no developer input on it12:55
Hobbseepochu: exactly.  i'm wondering where it is12:56
EnolaGayFunny is that one of the biggest energy consumer in Linux versus Windows are the Intel WLAN drivers. They consumes much more than under win. I know that they have a patch for ip2100 and a workaround for 3xxx but there are other cards and I think it is not as good until now.12:56
pochuHobbsee: I've installed it from Debian :)12:56
sn0Hobbsee there is nothing official on it yea, its early days yet 12:56
=== Hobbsee wishes for more updates
=== sn0 has become patient in waiting
Hobbseepochu: what was the package name?  even my madison-lite isnt finding it.12:56
=== Hobbsee should break some more.
sn0ahd i see it is paying off, icedove2 for sid is almost here for i386 :] 12:57
pochuHobbsee: powertop12:58
Hobbseepochu: ahhh.  it's failed to build.12:58
bhaleHobbsee: your madison is busted :)12:58
EnolaGayPowertop doesn't help until Kernel 2.6.21 afaik12:58
bhale  powertop |      1.1-3 | http://archive.ubuntu.com gutsy/universe Sources12:58
Hobbseeor si under a different name12:58
Hobbseebhale: yeah, found that much.  the binaries are good, though12:59
EnolaGayok, gutsy has a 21 kernel12:59
pochuHobbsee: it's built fine: http://librarian.launchpad.net/7703469/powertop_1.1-3_i386.deb12:59
Hobbseebhale: ah, i'tll be in binary NEW12:59
pochuno, it's been approved :)12:59
Hobbseewhcih is why my apt-cache isnt finding it.12:59
bhaleHobbsee: yes ma'am12:59
=== bhale ducks
Hobbsee:P12:59
Hobbseepochu: approved when, and for what?12:59
pochupowertop. It's not in NEW. cjwatson processed it01:00
Hobbseehmmm01:00
pochuHobbsee: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/powertop/1.1-301:00
desrthello birdies01:00
Hobbseehttp://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/p/powertop/01:00
EnolaGayOk, thanks for help and good night.01:01
Hobbseepochu: i realise that.  but the binaries are not in the archive yet, which makes me think that it's gone thru source NEW, but not binary NEW.  or that soyuz has eaten it.01:01
Hobbseeunless they've changed procedure01:01
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acmEnolaGay: I think so too, but many other people like to have 3d desktop enabled. maybe only to show their friends that are using windows ;)01:02
bhaleHobbsee: fyi https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue01:02
pochuHobbsee: bug 11441701:02
pochuI don't know why the binaries aren't in archive.u.c01:03
Hobbseebhale: ah, thanks.01:03
bhalebecause they are in NEW01:03
ubotuLaunchpad bug 114417 in Ubuntu "Please sync powertop from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/11441701:03
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=== desrt installed feisty on his breezy-running quad-core powerpc G5 workstation at school yesterday
bhalecan we please move on or offtopic this?01:03
=== Hobbsee lost that bookmark
pochubhale: Processed through NEW. For future reference, you don't need to file bugs for syncs of new packages from Debian before the Debian import freeze.01:03
=== desrt was shocked at the difference
Hobbseepochu: there are 2 NEW's.  it's only gone thru the first one.01:04
bhalepochu: sorry?01:04
Hobbsee<end>01:04
desrtHobbsee; heh. you wish.01:04
pochu</end>01:04
pochu:)01:04
Hobbsee:P01:04
KmosHobbsee: can you upload from merges ?01:04
bhalepochu: the only sync bug i filed was for evo-sharp, which had local ubuntu changes and would not have synced.. i falsely believed that it work work, recently added EDS "too new" check and failed.01:04
HobbseeKmos: upload *from* merges?01:04
bhalepochu: not sure what else you are talking about01:05
KmosHobbsee: http://merges.ubuntu.com/k/k3b/01:05
Kmosk3b v1.0.1 is there01:05
HobbseeKmos: ie, do the merge01:05
Hobbseeyes i could.01:05
KmosHobbsee: plz do it :)01:05
Kmosfor gutsy.. and it would be nice to see it on feisty backport soon01:05
Hobbseehowever, if you look at the report, you'll see that it's not merged cleanly.01:05
HobbseeKmos: why dont you?01:06
=== Hobbsee has been merging other things.
pochubhale: I was taking about powertop, which was already proccesed trough new. Sorry if you weren't talking about it, it seems I misunderstood you :)01:06
KmosHobbsee: i can't do that.. i'm not a ubuntu member01:06
Hobbseeyou dont need to be01:06
Hobbseeyou'd need to be in core dev to upload anyway01:06
bhalepochu: ok, maybe i can clear this up for you...01:06
Hobbseethat's why there are sponsorships01:06
bhalepochu: see https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=powertop01:06
KmosHobbsee: i'm not a core-dev too hehe01:06
bhalepochu: there is NEW for new sources, and NEW for new binary names01:06
bhalepochu: if you have a brand new source (powertop), it hits both, it is in the later state01:07
bhalepochu: it is not 'cleared' really01:07
=== Kmos is installing Feisty on his laptop ACER 5633WLMi :)
HobbseeKmos: i havent done so, mainly because i didnt touch it last, and i'd need a sponsor - which is often hard to find on a weekend.01:08
pochubhale: so it has been processed trough NEW source, but not from NEW binary?01:08
pochuThat makes sense :)01:08
Hobbseepochu: exactly01:08
bhalepochu: yes.01:08
pochuok :)01:08
KmosHobbsee: ok.. yeah, weekend it's hard for that01:08
bhalepochu: for example, the name of evolution-sharp binary has changed, so it is stuck in binary new01:08
pochuAnyway, the binary is there at launchpad ;)01:08
pochubhale: ok :) I think I understand the process now :)01:08
pochuthanks a lot :-)01:09
bhalenp :)01:09
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pochuWakeups-from-idle per second :  331.6 01:09
pochuit should be under 3, so I'm 100x :/01:10
pochuluckily I'm plugged to the AC :)01:10
=== Hobbsee ponders....breakfast, or do a merge / fix breakage...
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bhaleweird, my #1 interupt is uhci_hcd (usb)01:13
bhalenothing usb is plugged in01:14
lathiat_nothing internally usb, liek bluetooth on laptops, etc?01:17
bhalehm, bluetooth01:18
bhalebut nothing should be using it01:18
lathiat_be interesting to see if its that driver causing it01:18
acmwhere can I see current state of a blueprint? Do I have to mail the drafter?01:30
pochuacm: look at the status in the blueprint01:31
pochue.g. started, beta available, blocked...01:31
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acmpochu: drafting is the current state. I think there should be something to code, but I dont know which package etc. Btw. Iam new at doing some work to ubuntu and Iam looking for an project to contribute to.01:36
acmbut drafting means there isnt any code yet right?01:39
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bhalelathiat_: it was bluetooth. which is probably sucking its own power besides01:52
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bddebianHeya03:32
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Hobbseehi all07:51
jsgotangcohey Hobbsee07:53
Hobbseespam!!!07:53
jsgotangcogah!07:53
fabbioneOMG she is around!07:54
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Hobbseeindeed!07:54
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Hobbseefabbione: are you scared yet?08:02
fabbioneHobbsee: hmmm no08:03
Hobbseefabbione: oh.  you should be, 'im sure.08:03
fabbione:)08:03
fabbionei am too tired to even be awake08:04
fabbionenevermind scared08:04
Hobbseelol08:05
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ajmorris_how close are we to getting ntlm_auth 3.0.25?11:32
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ajmitchajmorris_: if you mean the one from samba, real soon (in gutsy)11:38
ajmorris_ajmitch, kk, cool, i am using gutsy11:39
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nuumorning12:53
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Hobbseehi all01:02
pittihi Hobbsee 01:03
Hobbseepitti!01:03
nuuhi Hobbsee, pitti01:07
pittihey nuu01:07
Hobbseeheya nuu 01:07
nuupitti, you're the hal developer, aren't you :)01:07
pittinuu: well, I package it01:08
nuuah, great, been looking for you01:08
nuui've a doubt concerning hal and policy directories01:08
nuudo you have a minute ?01:08
pittiI think so, just ask01:10
nuuhttps://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hal/+question/683601:11
nuuin two words, my kubuntu feisty ignores .fdi policies under /etc/hal/fdi/policy, while it picks that policy under /usr/share/hal/fdi/policy/10osvendor01:12
nuuand i'm trying to understand whether this is by design or not, since it works under /etc/hal/fdi/policy on debian01:12
pittinuu: hm, it doesn't evaluate /etc/hal/fdi/policy/preferences.fdi ?01:13
nuupreferences.fdi is all commented out01:13
pittinuu: it's certainly not by design, we don't touch the policy parser in Ubuntu compared to Debian01:13
nuuincidentally that commented out preferences.fdi is the only file under the whole /etc/hal dir tree01:14
nuuwhich made me wonder what the purpose of the dir is, but i know next to nothing about hal's directory structure in the first place01:14
nuuwhich in turn led me to confusion, posting that question on launchpad, and bothering you :)01:14
pittinuu: it's not used at all in the distro, so noone else checked this so far, I figure01:15
nuui see pitti, so theoretically one could merely symlink /etc/hal to /usr/share/hal and problem solved01:15
nuubecause i figure that if ntfs-config uses /etc/hal, who knows who else uses it01:15
ajmitchhi pitti 01:16
Hobbseehi ajmitch 01:16
pittinuu: I closed the answer request with 'please file a bug'01:16
pittihi ajmitch 01:16
ajmitch& hi Hobbsee 01:16
nuualright pitti, thanks for your time01:16
Fujitsupitti: Was my rationale for renaming sixpack good enough?01:16
pittiFujitsu: yes, it was; thnaks01:16
FujitsuThanks.01:16
Hobbseeajmitch: so, exactly what am i supposed to say on the ML?01:19
nuupitti: bug filed, thanks for the responsiveness01:19
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pittinuu: thanks to you01:19
ajmitchHobbsee: knowing that you actually mean to go for core dev would be a start01:22
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Hobbseeajmitch: right.01:22
Hobbseeajmitch: which would of course be helpful if i knew what i had to do to get it.01:23
ajmitchit would, wouldn't it?01:23
ajmitchTB meeting is in a couple of days01:23
ajmitchwe'll find out then01:23
macneibhello everyone.  I just read about Ubuntu on embedded systems.  Is there anywhere i can go to read up on this?01:23
Hobbseeajmitch: right.01:24
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Hobbseeajmitch: 6am meetings.  dammit.01:26
pochumacneib: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded01:26
ajmitchcaffeine is good01:26
bhalehi01:26
macneibthanks pochu01:26
ajmitchhello bhale 01:26
Hobbseeajmitch: it's not that good01:26
pochuHobbsee: with your jetlag that shouldn't be a problem ;)01:26
pochumacneib: np01:26
Hobbseepochu: that's going away.  now i'm just plain exhausted all the time01:26
ajmitchHobbsee: ah, into the fun part of jetlag01:27
Hobbseeyep01:27
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ajmitchI wish some of these complaints on the forums could be filed as actual bugs01:29
Hobbseefix bugs, dont waste time on the forums.01:29
Hobbseefar more useful01:30
bhalei wish i wasnt at the end of a ~600 package NEW queue01:30
Hobbseeat the end of?01:30
bhalemost recent, not that it is fifo01:31
ajmitchHobbsee: I was just doing some merging01:31
Hobbseebhale: ohh, right. yes01:31
Hobbseeajmitch: good man.01:31
ajmitchwith a few tricks with debdiff & filterdiff, it's quite easy to patch things into the newer version without MoM01:32
Hobbseelikely, true01:32
Hobbseebut MOM makes it easier :P01:32
ajmitchin many cases, not all01:33
ajmitchbesides, I wanted to review each change for samba separately01:33
Hobbseeahhh01:33
ajmitchnot sure if I should upload it yet, or grab the patches from the 3.0.25 svn branch that are needed01:35
=== ajmitch should sleep now & upload the lot in the morning, when people are alive
=== Hobbsee plays dead
Kmosajmitch: http://merges.ubuntu.com/k/k3b/ -> you've time to take a look at k3b v1.0.1 and upload it ?01:39
ajmitchsee the bit about sleeping now :)01:39
Kmos:(01:39
ajmitchyou prepared a merged package?01:40
HobbseeKmos: and the fact that the merge is there in no way means that it's done01:40
Hobbseeajmitch: no he hasnt, he's hoping someone will do the merge for him01:40
ajmitchah, that's very different01:40
Hobbsee(we had this discussion this morning)01:40
ajmitchthere are a large number of conflicts there01:40
Kmospersia has done the diff01:41
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ajmitchnight all01:45
Hobbseenight ajmitch 01:45
Ng /win 16001:47
Nggah01:47
Spadsthat's a *lot* of windows.01:47
pochuNg: 160? :)01:48
HobbseeSpads: i saw some 3**'s at UDS01:48
NgI wait for screen to crash to clean them up ;)01:48
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Ngand that hasn't happened since sometime last year ;)01:48
Spadshuh01:51
SpadsI tend to /wc rather agressively so I can Alt-# and Alt-[qwertyuio] 01:51
Spadsbut usually I alt-A 01:52
Hobbseeheh01:52
thomSpads: i have more _channels_ than that!01:52
Hobbseethe 3** users were using a lot of /win goto foo01:52
Hobbseethom: yes, but you're crazy.01:52
thomHobbsee: hrm, this is a definite possibility01:52
thombut bitlbee doesn't exactly help, either :-)01:52
Hobbseeheh01:52
bhalehi thom 01:53
thomhey dude!01:53
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Treenaksso.. does anyone have working battery monitoring support for their bluetooth mice? :)03:05
TreenaksApparently, my mouse does report battery state.. but I haven't found a way to retrieve it yet ;)03:06
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cy_`hello04:16
cy_`which tool does modify the xorg.conf when booting ? :/ nobody in #ubuntu could help me.. sorry for asking in here..04:19
Mithrandirnone04:19
cy_`thats wierd.04:19
cy_`because i copied an image of ubuntu installation to a disk, adjustet grub and everything.. and clearly the Driver in the xorg.conf was fglrx .. after a first boot of the system the Driver was changed to vesa :?04:20
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Mithrandirwell, there's nothing there which changes it, unless you're booting a live cd.04:22
cy_`nope.. booting a installed system i copied over using a tar file .. 04:22
cy_`now i changed it back manually, rebooted and it didnt change.04:23
cy_`ehw, this is strange :?04:23
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cy_`it changes the Xkblayout, the Resolution and the Driver.. does that sound familiar anyhow :/04:35
cy_`?04:35
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desrthello hackers.05:47
bhalehi desrt 05:47
desrtwhat's an easy way to find out if my stdout is the linux virtual console driver?05:47
desrt(and not, for example, a serial console)05:48
Treenaksdesrt: uh.. _why_?05:48
Treenaks(why isn't isatty() enough? + termcap?)05:48
desrti'm thinking about doing some sort of vc-only ioctl and checking if it fails :)05:48
desrtTreenaks; in the case of serial console we don't know TERM05:48
desrt(yet)05:48
Treenaksdesrt: uh.. what are you writing?05:49
desrthttps://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/friendly-recovery05:49
Treenaksdesrt: can't you ask HAL?05:49
desrtfrom single user mode?  i suspect not.05:49
Treenaksdesrt: if the device has capability: serial it's a serial port :)05:49
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Treenaksdesrt: and it's another dependency, which you don't want, I understand05:49
desrtlet me be more specific: i have a fd.  what syscalls and/or libc functionality can i use to determine if it's the linux virtual console driver?05:50
Treenaksdesrt: I think the ioctl thing is your best bet05:51
desrthow hacky :p05:51
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thesaltydogwhich is the daemon name for apport?06:42
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dsasthesaltydog: As far as I remember apport isn't a daemon, it's a program called by the kernel when an app crashes07:03
thesaltydogdsas, ok, so there is nothing running on background in the services list?07:03
dsasthesaltydog: Not as far as I remember.07:04
thesaltydogthanks07:04
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wereHamstercan I see the output when you folks build the wine package? Or even the config.log file?07:40
wereHamsterI'd like to see how exactly you configure the wine package..07:42
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ThunderStruckwere grab the source with apt-get source wine and look in rules file for config options (unless there is a differnet file that holds them for wine07:43
ThunderStruckwereHamster, ^^^07:43
geserwereHamster: http://librarian.launchpad.net/7705044/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-i386.wine_0.9.37-0ubuntu2_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz is the log from the last i386 build07:43
wereHamsterI don't run ubuntu, that's the problem ;)07:43
ThunderStruckunless ofcourse someone has it handy ;)07:43
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elpargohi I notice http://packages.ubuntu.com/ is down. anyone knows if this was scheduled?07:59
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=== Topic for #ubuntu-devel: Development of Ubuntu (not support, even with gutsy; not application development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper/edgy/feisty | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Gutsy open, go ape!
=== Topic (#ubuntu-devel): set by pitti at Mon May 14 08:08:07 2007
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tormod#ubuntu-ch10:28
=== tormod has some issues with xchat-gnome not keeping up :)
phoenix24tormod: what's the problem ?10:33
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tormodphoenix24: just that it pops up windows and dialogs when I am typing in commands, therefore my little "message" came up as above in this channel!10:35
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Nafallohi everyone :-)10:41
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pochuhey Nafallo!10:44
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calcdoko_: hello11:01
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=== Topic for #ubuntu-devel: Development of Ubuntu (not support, even with gutsy; not application development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper/edgy/feisty | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Gutsy open, go ape!
=== Topic (#ubuntu-devel): set by pitti at Mon May 14 08:08:07 2007
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=== calc wonders why doko never called him
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