[12:16] <EnolaGay> pochu: Make a new bug report?
[12:16] <pochu> EnolaGay: yep
[12:16] <EnolaGay> :)
[12:22] <acm> Hi, I would like to know what is planned for enabling 3d effects in gutsy? many people in #ubuntu-de have problems to enable them especially ati user.
[12:23] <EnolaGay> pochu: I wonder why apport-gtk doesn't pop up because of this crash. Should I upload the report as an attachment?
[12:24] <EnolaGay> acm: I think it is a driver problem but at least Radeons have an working 3d open source driver afaik.
[12:25] <pochu> EnolaGay: it won't hurt :)
[12:29] <EnolaGay> pochu: finally https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apport/+bug/115681 :)
[12:29] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 115681 in apport "apport-retrace crashes after downloading dbgsyms for a xorg crash" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
[12:29] <acm> EnolaGay: Yes I agree with that driver problem. But for me the radeon driver doesnt work on my thinkpad. There should be an automated workaround for fglrx driver, because the driver works with xgl. the configuration is more complicated.
[12:30] <EnolaGay> acm: Ask AMD ;) I don't know, I am no dev.
[12:31] <lfittl> acm, automated workaround is not possible, as XGL is a completely different x server that is not supported in Ubuntu
[12:48] <EnolaGay> acm: Btw why a 3D Desktop. It looks not bad but is has no real advantages imho and at the moment some disadvantages like not working vnc and problems with playing movies.
[12:49] <sn0> EnolaGay why not ? :}
[12:49] <sn0> the option is there, you can disable certain functions if you deem them not useful
[12:49] <EnolaGay> And it crashes for me more often.
[12:49] <sn0> having everything rendered by the gpu has its advantages
[12:49] <EnolaGay> sn0: Do you know something about the energy consumption?
[12:49] <sn0> well crashes are common + it is early days yet
[12:50] <sn0> you can compare it to running a 3d game really EnolaGay 
[12:50] <pochu> EnolaGay, acm: it's planned: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/composite-by-default
[12:50] <sn0> but i find my card runs cooler with beryl/compiz running than at full peak in a 3d game
[12:50] <EnolaGay> Hm, that wouldn't be good for laptops.
[12:50] <sn0> obviously uses more than no acceleration
[12:51] <sn0> going by intels power tool they released it seems certain apps can cause more power drain/causing the cpu to wake up
[12:51] <sn0> so there is a lot to be done
[12:52] <EnolaGay> sn0: Do you know if the fixes are released in gutsy?
[12:52] <Hobbsee> probably not yet
[12:52] <sn0> the intel tool is a seperate download, not sure about plans for gutsy
[12:52] <Hobbsee> UDS was only a week ago, gutsy hasnt been open terribly long
[12:52] <EnolaGay> sn0: It sounds great but I doubt if it let the laptop run three hours longer.
[12:52] <pochu> EnolaGay: gutsy still have same compiz (0.3.6)
[12:53] <EnolaGay> sn0: I know I mean the fixes of intel and other devs.
[12:53] <sn0> EnolaGay fyi http://www.linuxpowertop.org/powertop.php
[12:53] <sn0> that has nothing to do with gpu / composite acceleration mind
[12:54] <EnolaGay> I know. I don't ask for composite it is just if the program and kernel patches of Intel are integrated in Gutsy?
[12:54] <sn0> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/powertop-support :)
[12:54] <EnolaGay> cool
[12:54] <pochu> EnolaGay: sudo apt-get install powertop ;)
[12:55] <Hobbsee> pochu: doesnt seem to be there at all, yet
[12:55] <Hobbsee> sn0: that's not written by a developer
[12:55] <pochu> Hobbsee: it's already been synced, though
[12:55] <Hobbsee> and has no developer input on it
[12:56] <Hobbsee> pochu: exactly.  i'm wondering where it is
[12:56] <EnolaGay> Funny is that one of the biggest energy consumer in Linux versus Windows are the Intel WLAN drivers. They consumes much more than under win. I know that they have a patch for ip2100 and a workaround for 3xxx but there are other cards and I think it is not as good until now.
[12:56] <pochu> Hobbsee: I've installed it from Debian :)
[12:56] <sn0> Hobbsee there is nothing official on it yea, its early days yet 
[12:56] <Hobbsee> pochu: what was the package name?  even my madison-lite isnt finding it.
[12:57] <sn0> ahd i see it is paying off, icedove2 for sid is almost here for i386 :] 
[12:58] <pochu> Hobbsee: powertop
[12:58] <Hobbsee> pochu: ahhh.  it's failed to build.
[12:58] <bhale> Hobbsee: your madison is busted :)
[12:58] <EnolaGay> Powertop doesn't help until Kernel 2.6.21 afaik
[12:58] <bhale>   powertop |      1.1-3 | http://archive.ubuntu.com gutsy/universe Sources
[12:58] <Hobbsee> or si under a different name
[12:59] <Hobbsee> bhale: yeah, found that much.  the binaries are good, though
[12:59] <EnolaGay> ok, gutsy has a 21 kernel
[12:59] <pochu> Hobbsee: it's built fine: http://librarian.launchpad.net/7703469/powertop_1.1-3_i386.deb
[12:59] <Hobbsee> bhale: ah, i'tll be in binary NEW
[12:59] <pochu> no, it's been approved :)
[12:59] <Hobbsee> whcih is why my apt-cache isnt finding it.
[12:59] <bhale> Hobbsee: yes ma'am
[12:59] <Hobbsee> :P
[12:59] <Hobbsee> pochu: approved when, and for what?
[01:00] <pochu> powertop. It's not in NEW. cjwatson processed it
[01:00] <Hobbsee> hmmm
[01:00] <pochu> Hobbsee: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/powertop/1.1-3
[01:00] <desrt> hello birdies
[01:00] <Hobbsee> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/p/powertop/
[01:01] <EnolaGay> Ok, thanks for help and good night.
[01:01] <Hobbsee> pochu: i realise that.  but the binaries are not in the archive yet, which makes me think that it's gone thru source NEW, but not binary NEW.  or that soyuz has eaten it.
[01:01] <Hobbsee> unless they've changed procedure
[01:02] <acm> EnolaGay: I think so too, but many other people like to have 3d desktop enabled. maybe only to show their friends that are using windows ;)
[01:02] <bhale> Hobbsee: fyi https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue
[01:02] <pochu> Hobbsee: bug 114417
[01:03] <pochu> I don't know why the binaries aren't in archive.u.c
[01:03] <Hobbsee> bhale: ah, thanks.
[01:03] <bhale> because they are in NEW
[01:03] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 114417 in Ubuntu "Please sync powertop from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114417
[01:03] <bhale> can we please move on or offtopic this?
[01:03] <pochu> bhale: Processed through NEW. For future reference, you don't need to file bugs for syncs of new packages from Debian before the Debian import freeze.
[01:04] <Hobbsee> pochu: there are 2 NEW's.  it's only gone thru the first one.
[01:04] <bhale> pochu: sorry?

[01:04] <desrt> Hobbsee; heh. you wish.

[01:04] <pochu> :)
[01:04] <Hobbsee> :P
[01:04] <Kmos> Hobbsee: can you upload from merges ?
[01:04] <bhale> pochu: the only sync bug i filed was for evo-sharp, which had local ubuntu changes and would not have synced.. i falsely believed that it work work, recently added EDS "too new" check and failed.
[01:04] <Hobbsee> Kmos: upload *from* merges?
[01:05] <bhale> pochu: not sure what else you are talking about
[01:05] <Kmos> Hobbsee: http://merges.ubuntu.com/k/k3b/
[01:05] <Kmos> k3b v1.0.1 is there
[01:05] <Hobbsee> Kmos: ie, do the merge
[01:05] <Hobbsee> yes i could.
[01:05] <Kmos> Hobbsee: plz do it :)
[01:05] <Kmos> for gutsy.. and it would be nice to see it on feisty backport soon
[01:05] <Hobbsee> however, if you look at the report, you'll see that it's not merged cleanly.
[01:06] <Hobbsee> Kmos: why dont you?
[01:06] <pochu> bhale: I was taking about powertop, which was already proccesed trough new. Sorry if you weren't talking about it, it seems I misunderstood you :)
[01:06] <Kmos> Hobbsee: i can't do that.. i'm not a ubuntu member
[01:06] <Hobbsee> you dont need to be
[01:06] <Hobbsee> you'd need to be in core dev to upload anyway
[01:06] <bhale> pochu: ok, maybe i can clear this up for you...
[01:06] <Hobbsee> that's why there are sponsorships
[01:06] <bhale> pochu: see https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=powertop
[01:06] <Kmos> Hobbsee: i'm not a core-dev too hehe
[01:06] <bhale> pochu: there is NEW for new sources, and NEW for new binary names
[01:07] <bhale> pochu: if you have a brand new source (powertop), it hits both, it is in the later state
[01:07] <bhale> pochu: it is not 'cleared' really
[01:08] <Hobbsee> Kmos: i havent done so, mainly because i didnt touch it last, and i'd need a sponsor - which is often hard to find on a weekend.
[01:08] <pochu> bhale: so it has been processed trough NEW source, but not from NEW binary?
[01:08] <pochu> That makes sense :)
[01:08] <Hobbsee> pochu: exactly
[01:08] <bhale> pochu: yes.
[01:08] <pochu> ok :)
[01:08] <Kmos> Hobbsee: ok.. yeah, weekend it's hard for that
[01:08] <bhale> pochu: for example, the name of evolution-sharp binary has changed, so it is stuck in binary new
[01:08] <pochu> Anyway, the binary is there at launchpad ;)
[01:08] <pochu> bhale: ok :) I think I understand the process now :)
[01:09] <pochu> thanks a lot :-)
[01:09] <bhale> np :)
[01:09] <pochu> Wakeups-from-idle per second :  331.6 
[01:10] <pochu> it should be under 3, so I'm 100x :/
[01:10] <pochu> luckily I'm plugged to the AC :)
[01:13] <bhale> weird, my #1 interupt is uhci_hcd (usb)
[01:14] <bhale> nothing usb is plugged in
[01:17] <lathiat_> nothing internally usb, liek bluetooth on laptops, etc?
[01:18] <bhale> hm, bluetooth
[01:18] <bhale> but nothing should be using it
[01:18] <lathiat_> be interesting to see if its that driver causing it
[01:30] <acm> where can I see current state of a blueprint? Do I have to mail the drafter?
[01:31] <pochu> acm: look at the status in the blueprint
[01:31] <pochu> e.g. started, beta available, blocked...
[01:36] <acm> pochu: drafting is the current state. I think there should be something to code, but I dont know which package etc. Btw. Iam new at doing some work to ubuntu and Iam looking for an project to contribute to.
[01:39] <acm> but drafting means there isnt any code yet right?
[01:52] <bhale> lathiat_: it was bluetooth. which is probably sucking its own power besides
[03:32] <bddebian> Heya
[07:51] <Hobbsee> hi all
[07:53] <jsgotangco> hey Hobbsee
[07:53] <Hobbsee> spam!!!
[07:53] <jsgotangco> gah!
[07:54] <fabbione> OMG she is around!
[07:54] <Hobbsee> indeed!
[08:02] <Hobbsee> fabbione: are you scared yet?
[08:03] <fabbione> Hobbsee: hmmm no
[08:03] <Hobbsee> fabbione: oh.  you should be, 'im sure.
[08:03] <fabbione> :)
[08:04] <fabbione> i am too tired to even be awake
[08:04] <fabbione> nevermind scared
[08:05] <Hobbsee> lol
[11:32] <ajmorris_> how close are we to getting ntlm_auth 3.0.25?
[11:38] <ajmitch> ajmorris_: if you mean the one from samba, real soon (in gutsy)
[11:39] <ajmorris_> ajmitch, kk, cool, i am using gutsy
[12:53] <nuu> morning
[01:02] <Hobbsee> hi all
[01:03] <pitti> hi Hobbsee 
[01:03] <Hobbsee> pitti!
[01:07] <nuu> hi Hobbsee, pitti
[01:07] <pitti> hey nuu
[01:07] <Hobbsee> heya nuu 
[01:07] <nuu> pitti, you're the hal developer, aren't you :)
[01:08] <pitti> nuu: well, I package it
[01:08] <nuu> ah, great, been looking for you
[01:08] <nuu> i've a doubt concerning hal and policy directories
[01:08] <nuu> do you have a minute ?
[01:10] <pitti> I think so, just ask
[01:11] <nuu> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hal/+question/6836
[01:12] <nuu> in two words, my kubuntu feisty ignores .fdi policies under /etc/hal/fdi/policy, while it picks that policy under /usr/share/hal/fdi/policy/10osvendor
[01:12] <nuu> and i'm trying to understand whether this is by design or not, since it works under /etc/hal/fdi/policy on debian
[01:13] <pitti> nuu: hm, it doesn't evaluate /etc/hal/fdi/policy/preferences.fdi ?
[01:13] <nuu> preferences.fdi is all commented out
[01:13] <pitti> nuu: it's certainly not by design, we don't touch the policy parser in Ubuntu compared to Debian
[01:14] <nuu> incidentally that commented out preferences.fdi is the only file under the whole /etc/hal dir tree
[01:14] <nuu> which made me wonder what the purpose of the dir is, but i know next to nothing about hal's directory structure in the first place
[01:14] <nuu> which in turn led me to confusion, posting that question on launchpad, and bothering you :)
[01:15] <pitti> nuu: it's not used at all in the distro, so noone else checked this so far, I figure
[01:15] <nuu> i see pitti, so theoretically one could merely symlink /etc/hal to /usr/share/hal and problem solved
[01:15] <nuu> because i figure that if ntfs-config uses /etc/hal, who knows who else uses it
[01:16] <ajmitch> hi pitti 
[01:16] <Hobbsee> hi ajmitch 
[01:16] <pitti> nuu: I closed the answer request with 'please file a bug'
[01:16] <pitti> hi ajmitch 
[01:16] <ajmitch> & hi Hobbsee 
[01:16] <nuu> alright pitti, thanks for your time
[01:16] <Fujitsu> pitti: Was my rationale for renaming sixpack good enough?
[01:16] <pitti> Fujitsu: yes, it was; thnaks
[01:16] <Fujitsu> Thanks.
[01:19] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: so, exactly what am i supposed to say on the ML?
[01:19] <nuu> pitti: bug filed, thanks for the responsiveness
[01:19] <pitti> nuu: thanks to you
[01:22] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: knowing that you actually mean to go for core dev would be a start
[01:22] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: right.
[01:23] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: which would of course be helpful if i knew what i had to do to get it.
[01:23] <ajmitch> it would, wouldn't it?
[01:23] <ajmitch> TB meeting is in a couple of days
[01:23] <ajmitch> we'll find out then
[01:23] <macneib> hello everyone.  I just read about Ubuntu on embedded systems.  Is there anywhere i can go to read up on this?
[01:24] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: right.
[01:26] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: 6am meetings.  dammit.
[01:26] <pochu> macneib: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded
[01:26] <ajmitch> caffeine is good
[01:26] <bhale> hi
[01:26] <macneib> thanks pochu
[01:26] <ajmitch> hello bhale 
[01:26] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: it's not that good
[01:26] <pochu> Hobbsee: with your jetlag that shouldn't be a problem ;)
[01:26] <pochu> macneib: np
[01:26] <Hobbsee> pochu: that's going away.  now i'm just plain exhausted all the time
[01:27] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: ah, into the fun part of jetlag
[01:27] <Hobbsee> yep
[01:29] <ajmitch> I wish some of these complaints on the forums could be filed as actual bugs
[01:29] <Hobbsee> fix bugs, dont waste time on the forums.
[01:30] <Hobbsee> far more useful
[01:30] <bhale> i wish i wasnt at the end of a ~600 package NEW queue
[01:30] <Hobbsee> at the end of?
[01:31] <bhale> most recent, not that it is fifo
[01:31] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: I was just doing some merging
[01:31] <Hobbsee> bhale: ohh, right. yes
[01:31] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: good man.
[01:32] <ajmitch> with a few tricks with debdiff & filterdiff, it's quite easy to patch things into the newer version without MoM
[01:32] <Hobbsee> likely, true
[01:32] <Hobbsee> but MOM makes it easier :P
[01:33] <ajmitch> in many cases, not all
[01:33] <ajmitch> besides, I wanted to review each change for samba separately
[01:33] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[01:35] <ajmitch> not sure if I should upload it yet, or grab the patches from the 3.0.25 svn branch that are needed
[01:39] <Kmos> ajmitch: http://merges.ubuntu.com/k/k3b/ -> you've time to take a look at k3b v1.0.1 and upload it ?
[01:39] <ajmitch> see the bit about sleeping now :)
[01:39] <Kmos> :(
[01:40] <ajmitch> you prepared a merged package?
[01:40] <Hobbsee> Kmos: and the fact that the merge is there in no way means that it's done
[01:40] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: no he hasnt, he's hoping someone will do the merge for him
[01:40] <ajmitch> ah, that's very different
[01:40] <Hobbsee> (we had this discussion this morning)
[01:40] <ajmitch> there are a large number of conflicts there
[01:41] <Kmos> persia has done the diff
[01:45] <ajmitch> night all
[01:45] <Hobbsee> night ajmitch 
[01:47] <Ng>  /win 160
[01:47] <Ng> gah
[01:47] <Spads> that's a *lot* of windows.
[01:48] <pochu> Ng: 160? :)
[01:48] <Hobbsee> Spads: i saw some 3**'s at UDS
[01:48] <Ng> I wait for screen to crash to clean them up ;)
[01:48] <Ng> and that hasn't happened since sometime last year ;)
[01:51] <Spads> huh
[01:51] <Spads> I tend to /wc rather agressively so I can Alt-# and Alt-[qwertyuio] 
[01:52] <Spads> but usually I alt-A 
[01:52] <Hobbsee> heh
[01:52] <thom> Spads: i have more _channels_ than that!
[01:52] <Hobbsee> the 3** users were using a lot of /win goto foo
[01:52] <Hobbsee> thom: yes, but you're crazy.
[01:52] <thom> Hobbsee: hrm, this is a definite possibility
[01:52] <thom> but bitlbee doesn't exactly help, either :-)
[01:52] <Hobbsee> heh
[01:53] <bhale> hi thom 
[01:53] <thom> hey dude!
[03:05] <Treenaks> so.. does anyone have working battery monitoring support for their bluetooth mice? :)
[03:06] <Treenaks> Apparently, my mouse does report battery state.. but I haven't found a way to retrieve it yet ;)
[04:16] <cy_`> hello
[04:19] <cy_`> which tool does modify the xorg.conf when booting ? :/ nobody in #ubuntu could help me.. sorry for asking in here..
[04:19] <Mithrandir> none
[04:19] <cy_`> thats wierd.
[04:20] <cy_`> because i copied an image of ubuntu installation to a disk, adjustet grub and everything.. and clearly the Driver in the xorg.conf was fglrx .. after a first boot of the system the Driver was changed to vesa :?
[04:22] <Mithrandir> well, there's nothing there which changes it, unless you're booting a live cd.
[04:22] <cy_`> nope.. booting a installed system i copied over using a tar file .. 
[04:23] <cy_`> now i changed it back manually, rebooted and it didnt change.
[04:23] <cy_`> ehw, this is strange :?
[04:35] <cy_`> it changes the Xkblayout, the Resolution and the Driver.. does that sound familiar anyhow :/
[04:35] <cy_`> ?
[05:47] <desrt> hello hackers.
[05:47] <bhale> hi desrt 
[05:47] <desrt> what's an easy way to find out if my stdout is the linux virtual console driver?
[05:48] <desrt> (and not, for example, a serial console)
[05:48] <Treenaks> desrt: uh.. _why_?
[05:48] <Treenaks> (why isn't isatty() enough? + termcap?)
[05:48] <desrt> i'm thinking about doing some sort of vc-only ioctl and checking if it fails :)
[05:48] <desrt> Treenaks; in the case of serial console we don't know TERM
[05:48] <desrt> (yet)
[05:49] <Treenaks> desrt: uh.. what are you writing?
[05:49] <desrt> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/friendly-recovery
[05:49] <Treenaks> desrt: can't you ask HAL?
[05:49] <desrt> from single user mode?  i suspect not.
[05:49] <Treenaks> desrt: if the device has capability: serial it's a serial port :)
[05:49] <Treenaks> desrt: and it's another dependency, which you don't want, I understand
[05:50] <desrt> let me be more specific: i have a fd.  what syscalls and/or libc functionality can i use to determine if it's the linux virtual console driver?
[05:51] <Treenaks> desrt: I think the ioctl thing is your best bet
[05:51] <desrt> how hacky :p
[06:42] <thesaltydog> which is the daemon name for apport?
[07:03] <dsas> thesaltydog: As far as I remember apport isn't a daemon, it's a program called by the kernel when an app crashes
[07:03] <thesaltydog> dsas, ok, so there is nothing running on background in the services list?
[07:04] <dsas> thesaltydog: Not as far as I remember.
[07:04] <thesaltydog> thanks
[07:40] <wereHamster> can I see the output when you folks build the wine package? Or even the config.log file?
[07:42] <wereHamster> I'd like to see how exactly you configure the wine package..
[07:43] <ThunderStruck> were grab the source with apt-get source wine and look in rules file for config options (unless there is a differnet file that holds them for wine
[07:43] <ThunderStruck> wereHamster, ^^^
[07:43] <geser> wereHamster: http://librarian.launchpad.net/7705044/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-i386.wine_0.9.37-0ubuntu2_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz is the log from the last i386 build
[07:43] <wereHamster> I don't run ubuntu, that's the problem ;)
[07:43] <ThunderStruck> unless ofcourse someone has it handy ;)
[07:59] <elpargo> hi I notice http://packages.ubuntu.com/ is down. anyone knows if this was scheduled?
[10:28] <tormod> #ubuntu-ch
[10:33] <phoenix24> tormod: what's the problem ?
[10:35] <tormod> phoenix24: just that it pops up windows and dialogs when I am typing in commands, therefore my little "message" came up as above in this channel!
[10:41] <Nafallo> hi everyone :-)
[10:44] <pochu> hey Nafallo!
[11:01] <calc> doko_: hello