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| Keybuk | heh | 05:56 |
|---|---|---|
| Keybuk | so I explained the c-e-c problem to a friend, and it broke him | 05:56 |
| AlexExtreme | :) | 05:56 |
| Keybuk | though he was a sufficient teddy bear for me to figure out two interesting things | 05:57 |
| Keybuk | 1) | 05:57 |
| Keybuk | states are more interesting than just discreet | 05:57 |
| Keybuk | e.g. if you define a state for tty-added...tty-removed for a common NAME, then there are several questions you can answer | 05:57 |
| Keybuk | a) does tty1 exist? | 05:57 |
| Keybuk | b) does any tty exist? | 05:57 |
| Keybuk | c) what is the list of ttys that exist? | 05:57 |
| Keybuk | it turns out that all of these are interesting | 05:58 |
| Keybuk | getty is run for each tty that exists | 05:58 |
| Keybuk | but something requiring a network is running if any non-lo network interface is up | 05:58 |
| ion_ | Perhaps upstart should grow a scheme interpreter after all. ;-) | 06:00 |
| Keybuk | and the fhs filesystem question can be answers with list-of-mounted-paths is a superset of list-of-required-paths | 06:01 |
| ion_ | make states scheme procedures, with a nice API for common things. :-) | 06:02 |
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| Keybuk | this really does make states first class again | 06:02 |
| Keybuk | so a job would end up having event predicates and state predicates | 06:03 |
| Keybuk | 2) | 06:03 |
| Keybuk | states don't need to behave like jobs | 06:03 |
| Keybuk | "pre-start"/"post-stop" scripts for states are all very well and pretty | 06:03 |
| Keybuk | but in reality, they're not needed | 06:03 |
| Keybuk | since you can just tie a job to the state, and define the scripts there | 06:03 |
| ion_ | True... | 06:04 |
| ion_ | But having them in the same file is nice. | 06:04 |
| ion_ | OTOH, you could make them separate, implicitly creating an anonymous job for each state, to which the scripts are added. | 06:05 |
| Keybuk | I think it makes it more difficult if they're conceptually the same thing | 06:07 |
| ion_ | Perhaps add an expr stanza for scheme expressions, which could be used by any job. State would be just a job with no process; there would be no distinction from the codes point of view. | 06:13 |
| Keybuk | the interesting thing about states is the operations on them | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | state-is-true state args... | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | any-state-is-true state | 06:20 |
| Keybuk | stats-that-are-true state is-subset-of other list | 06:21 |
| Keybuk | etc, | 06:21 |
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| Keybuk | ho-hum | 10:30 |
| kylem | ? | 10:31 |
| Keybuk | brain hurts | 10:31 |
| kylem | stop poking at it | 10:32 |
| Keybuk | heh | 10:32 |
| Keybuk | trying to define an elegant language (and internal combustion) for when jobs should be running | 10:33 |
| ion_ | How about this? /etc/event.d/tty on tty-added $TTY ... tty-removed $TTY; instance would define a job, which also functions as a state. Other jobs/states could query whether tty is running, but they could also query whether an instance (with a certain $TTY) is running. | 10:37 |
| ion_ | In the tty-added $TTY ... tty-removed $TTY expression, the first $TTY (before ...) would be an assignment and the second $TTY (after ...) would be a comparison. | 10:38 |
| Keybuk | a job with | 10:38 |
| Keybuk | instance | 10:38 |
| Keybuk | start on tty-added | 10:38 |
| Keybuk | stop on tty-removed $TTY | 10:39 |
| Keybuk | would be equivalent | 10:39 |
| ion_ | True. :-) | 10:39 |
| Keybuk | so you'd end up with two basic stanzas | 10:40 |
| Keybuk | start on/stop on, which define an event or combination of events that start or stop the job | 10:40 |
| Keybuk | start on tty-added or serial-port-added | 10:40 |
| Keybuk | etc. | 10:40 |
| ion_ | Anyway, that would answer to a) does tty1 exist? b) does any tty exist? c) what is the list of ttys that exist?, wouldnt it? | 10:40 |
| Keybuk | you'd also need a second "when" stanza, that defined the other states that must be true | 10:40 |
| Keybuk | (or maybe while) | 10:41 |
| Keybuk | e.g. | 10:41 |
| Keybuk | instance | 10:41 |
| Keybuk | start on tty-added tty[1-6] | 10:41 |
| Keybuk | stop on tty-removed $TTY | 10:42 |
| Keybuk | while user-can-login | 10:42 |
| Keybuk | where there's a seperate /etc/?/user-can-login | 10:42 |
| ion_ | /etc/job /etc/state? /etc/job.d /etc/state.d? | 10:43 |
| Keybuk | the reason this doesn't feel right to me is that you can't have different pairs of start/stop | 10:44 |
| Keybuk | like the tty or serial-port combo | 10:44 |
| Keybuk | you can't match the stops to the starts | 10:44 |
| Keybuk | :-/ | 10:54 |
| ion_ | on tty-added tty[1-6] until tty-removed \1 or serial-port-added * until serial-port-removed \1 | 10:56 |
| ion_ | Or $1 | 10:56 |
| Keybuk | the problem there is how do you stop them doing: | 10:59 |
| Keybuk | foo until bar until baz | 10:59 |
| ion_ | Change | 11:02 |
| ion_ | | cmplx_expr 'until' cmplx_expr | 11:02 |
| ion_ | to | 11:02 |
| ion_ | | event 'until' event | 11:02 |
| Keybuk | but then you can't do (event or event) until event | 11:05 |
| Keybuk | which might be useful | 11:05 |
| Keybuk | and how do you define: | 11:05 |
| Keybuk | any (tty-added until tty-removed $TTY) | 11:05 |
| ion_ | expr_no_until : event | expr_no_until 'and' expr_no_until | expr_no_until 'or' expr_no_until | '(' expr_no_until ')' ; expr : expr_no_until | expr_no_until 'until' expr_no_until ; | 11:09 |
| ion_ | Correction: | 11:10 |
| ion_ | expr_no_until : event | expr_no_until 'and' expr_no_until | expr_no_until 'or' expr_no_until | '(' expr_no_until ')' ; expr : event | expr 'and' expr | expr 'or' expr | '(' expr ')' | expr_no_until 'until' expr_no_until ; | 11:10 |
| ion_ | For any (tty-added * until tty-removed $1), create job (state) instance; on tty-added * until tty-removed $1 and check whether it is running. | 11:12 |
| Keybuk | whether any instance is running? | 11:14 |
| ion_ | Yes. | 11:14 |
| Keybuk | that gets quite expensive if used a lot, no? | 11:15 |
| ion_ | Disconnect state names from the filenames, and make it possible to assign a number of state expressions to variables in a single file? | 11:17 |
| ion_ | state tty-exists = any (tty-added tty[1-6] until tty-removed $1) | 11:19 |
| ion_ | state foo = tty-exists and writable-filesystem | 11:20 |
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